machesta Posted October 4, 2013 Share Posted October 4, 2013 I just got an idea. Why don't a bunch of expats get together and form a Thai Company, hire the requisite Thai employees, and give themselves Work Permits in the name of the company? Will this work? The expenses can be shared, making it a viable alternative to other Visa choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post jimmiejackson Posted October 4, 2013 Popular Post Share Posted October 4, 2013 No - for so many reasons! 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoorSucker Posted October 4, 2013 Share Posted October 4, 2013 Many do it already. You just need two million in capital / foreigner and four employees / foreigner. Off course you need an office as address for your work permit, pay minimum salary to four Thais and pay tax on 50.000 baht / month. "The expenses can be shared, making it a viable alternative to other Visa choices." Yes, you can share the cost for office rent and for annual auditing. If you are not planning to make any business the cost should only be 60.000 baht / month and foreigner, not including salary to you. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lopburi3 Posted October 4, 2013 Share Posted October 4, 2013 Flame removed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bangarang Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 Your better off marrying a Thai on paper or signing up at a school. or... you can hire an accountant that could put you on a books of a company for about 20k+ which will give you a work permit and business visa. Unless you marry a thai those other two options are about 20-30k thb annually... I would think thats cheaper than hiring 4 thais and having to worry about taxes and other paperwork. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Cuban Posted October 5, 2013 Popular Post Share Posted October 5, 2013 I recall a guy that was doing this ten years ago, it always fails apart when "circumstances" occur and someone fails to have the right money in the right place at the right time, or needs to move to another country for love or legal reasons. Also you need to make a profit after paying your x4 Thai plus tax on your own salary each month. Do the numbers before posting - you will not appear such a newbie. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tatsujin Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 (edited) I just got an idea. Why don't a bunch of expats get together and form a Thai Company, hire the requisite Thai employees, and give themselves Work Permits in the name of the company? Will this work? The expenses can be shared, making it a viable alternative to other Visa choices. Running a business legally here costs a fortune, far more than just a simple visa cost. There are numerous other downsides too. Great idea, but impractical unless you actually do want or need a business here.Edit: there are companies/businesses out there where you can "buy" your own visa and "work" for them. Don't think they will stand up to ANY scrutiny however. Edited October 5, 2013 by Tatsujin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stickylies Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 Many do it already. You just need two million in capital / foreigner and four employees / foreigner. Off course you need an office as address for your work permit, pay minimum salary to four Thais and pay tax on 50.000 baht / month. "The expenses can be shared, making it a viable alternative to other Visa choices." Yes, you can share the cost for office rent and for annual auditing. If you are not planning to make any business the cost should only be 60.000 baht / month and foreigner, not including salary to you. it's cheaper to come without visa then and fly out every 30 days ;-) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellodolly Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 Wouldn't it need 4 Thai employes for every owner? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubonjoe Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 Yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigeonjake Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 then some on here call the thais scamers,, kettle,,pot comes to mind 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoshowJones Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 Your better off marrying a Thai on paper or signing up at a school. or... you can hire an accountant that could put you on a books of a company for about 20k+ which will give you a work permit and business visa. Unless you marry a thai those other two options are about 20-30k thb annually... I would think thats cheaper than hiring 4 thais and having to worry about taxes and other paperwork. That sounds great, but I don't believe it is that simple. If it was, retirees would not have to keep 800.000 Baht in their bank account. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkady Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 There would be no point in trying to do this on a group basis because there is not much economy of scale. You need B2m paid-up capital and 4 Thai employees in the social security scheme for each WP. Small Thai companies can pass under the radar but a company with, say, B20m in paid-up capital and 50 employees, of whom 10 are farangs had better be doing some serious business and paying a decent amount of tax. The only saving you would have would be the admin costs of running the company but you would no doubt attract a lot of attention from the Revenue Dept and possibly from the Commerce Ministry too. So you would need some good answers. At any rate, please bear in mind that maintaining a Thai company is not something to be undertaken lightly. They are not like tax haven shelf companies. They need to have some operations and income and can be shut down by the Commerce Ministry, if they don't within 5 years. Also WP permit and Non-Imm B visa renewal can be denied, if the company is not profitable and paying tax. You will need to file for VAT to get a WP and then do the monthly VAT filings, as well as get audited annual accounts done. Registering fake employees in the Social Security scheme can be deemed a criminal offence by the SSO, since they have limited funding and want to prevent too many people getting access to their healthcare and pension schemes. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machesta Posted October 5, 2013 Author Share Posted October 5, 2013 Thank you everybody for your comments. Too bad it is so difficult to just live here in peace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawndoc Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 you can hire an accountant that could put you on a books of a company for about 20k+ which will give you a work permit and business visa. Unless you marry a thai those other two options are about 20-30k thb annually... Go on.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asiamaster Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 I made use of this company setup between 1998 and 2004 as I was not 50 yet so I could not apply for a retirement visa. The company was actually operational (consultancy) but the income hardly covered the cost. And you would not believe the paperwork involved and how difficult is was to close the company down after 5 years. Looking back I should have not done it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rct99q Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 Not talking about a business but if four or five retirees all gotbtogether they could put up 200,000 baht each and just shuffle the fund around every year. Takes a little plannng for dates and such but you could get 4 r 5 people on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericjt Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 Not talking about a business but if four or five retirees all gotbtogether they could put up 200,000 baht each and just shuffle the fund around every year. Takes a little plannng for dates and such but you could get 4 r 5 people on it. This has been done for a while, rct. It's the reason for the 90 day requirement that started around 5 years ago. Your bank has to certify that the funds have been on deposit for at least the preceding 90 days in order for you to use them as the basis for getting a retirement visa. And if the bank or Immigration gets the idea that your "arrangement" is being pursued, I'm not sure whether there will be problems with the visa renewal or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuban Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 (edited) Not talking about a business but if four or five retirees all gotbtogether they could put up 200,000 baht each and just shuffle the fund around every year. Takes a little plannng for dates and such but you could get 4 r 5 people on it. You honestly think that four or five people can synchronise to that degree and provide enough security of faith in the circulation of funds allowing for random health, travel or sudden death issues and that the Thai relatives would freely release funds should the member holding the account at that moment die with his wife in a car crash - nice idea but a pipe-dream in real life. For those that can not tie up the funds for the required time a "service fee" of about 20,000 Baht gets the necessary paperwork completed. I have one friend that I would consider loaning money to for three months for his visa, but the nature of his wife prevents me from even mentioning it to him. Compare that to money we do loan Thai family, and yes that is paid back within the time agreed. Edited October 5, 2013 by Cuban Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maestro Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 Off-topic post about "an heiress" removed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
belg Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 you can always start an ED visa school yourself seems to be popular and good money apparently Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bangarang Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 Your better off marrying a Thai on paper or signing up at a school. or... you can hire an accountant that could put you on a books of a company for about 20k+ which will give you a work permit and business visa. Unless you marry a thai those other two options are about 20-30k thb annually... I would think thats cheaper than hiring 4 thais and having to worry about taxes and other paperwork. That sounds great, but I don't believe it is that simple. If it was, retirees would not have to keep 800.000 Baht in their bank account. Well im 30 now and have been living here for 2+ years. It really can be that simple. But if your retired and dont have 800K in savings then maybe you need some government assistance in your own country. I dont know the rules about old people getting student visas, but im sure it wouldn't be a problem to sign up for full time thai language courses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bangarang Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 you can hire an accountant that could put you on a books of a company for about 20k+ which will give you a work permit and business visa. Unless you marry a thai those other two options are about 20-30k thb annually... Go on.... lol... what do you want to know? There is an accounting across from the go kart track in Phuket offers that service. There are some others on the island. You pay them money and they set you up with a work permit and business visa. You will have to take the visa run trip 2 times though. 1st is for the 90 day business visa this allows you to get the work permit, and the 2nd is for the Multi 1 year which you need to have a work permit in order to obtain. What they do is essentially put you on the books under a 'fake job' such as a diving instructor and claim that you make 40k baht a month i think. I know for a fact from a few sources that this did work a year ago. I assume its the same unless the requirements have become more strict. Not every accountant will do it but there are some out there that were doing it. The ones that I knew the accountant was driving a Mercedes... So im sure the business is quite lucrative. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuban Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 What they do is essentially put you on the books under a 'fake job' such as a diving instructor and claim that you make 40k baht a month i think. Your required salary will depend on your native country, you will have to show tax paid on that salary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoboLB Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 I had a 'legit' business in Thailand for over 10 years. Gave it up eventually due to all the bureaucracy. Stuff like: 4 Thais for every farang. Officials 'dropping in' to check that the farangs actually worked there. Detailed audits. Questioning expenses and salaries. Demands for tax payments even when they were not required. And this business was 'legit'! No way I would want to go through all that BS again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayned Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 Your better off marrying a Thai on paper or signing up at a school. or... you can hire an accountant that could put you on a books of a company for about 20k+ which will give you a work permit and business visa. Unless you marry a thai those other two options are about 20-30k thb annually... I would think thats cheaper than hiring 4 thais and having to worry about taxes and other paperwork. Just marry a Thai. Make a backboard and walk up and down Soi 4 near Nana Plaza. Backboard should say' 1, Want to marry beautiful young Thai! 2. Joint bank account with unlimited funds 3, New house in your name 4. New house for your family in your name 5. New car in your name 6. Beneficiary of my life insurance 30 million baht You will be able to get a long term visa very easy. You'll probably have to beat them off with a stick, but your "long term" might not be as long as you want especially. Number six generates a place looking for an accident to happen! I personally know someone that did 2, 3, 4, and 5 and everything was fine. When he did number 6 someone brockeinto his house one night soon after and shot and killed him, all arranged by his loving wife. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machesta Posted October 6, 2013 Author Share Posted October 6, 2013 Keep'em coming. Very interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wayned Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 (edited) Although you think that my above post was a joke, Yes, the signboard is, but numbers 2 through 6 are serious and I did have a friend killed as a result of number 6 all arranged by his Thai wife. I owned a bar in Samui and finally retired and came to stay full time in early 1998. I met Dale. A safety inspector on an oil rig off the coast of Africa, who spent his off time in Samui. He frequented my bar, we became friends and he often “played: with the girls that worked for me. He met a girl from another bar, Maneerat, nicknamed Nee, he fell in love and they were married in the early 2000’s. I got to know her quite well and thought that she was a fine girl. Her family lived in Ranong and they soon moved there. He built a house for her parents, a house for himself and bought vehicles for all. His bank account was joint and Nee had access to it all. I really thought that they were happy. He would come to Samui occasionally as I think that he missed the nightlife. But, I lost track of him when I sold my bar in 2004 and we only communicated by email, but not often. In the summer of 2007 he and his wife spent a night at my house in Nakhon Sawan Province on his way to a vacation in the north. I found out later that during his vacation he fell and seriously injured his leg. When he was finally released from the hospital he went back to Ranong but he was not able to go back to work and most likely his days on the “rig” were over. He added Nee as 90% beneficiary to his $1,000,000 life insurance policy in late 2007. He couldn’t go back to work and the large deposits to their bank account stopped with no possibility of them resuming anytime soon as he was not injured at work. Now he was home all of the time. In Feb 2008 someone broke into his home and shot him in the head while he was asleep. In the end the murder was tracked to his wife, her Thai boyfriend and another who actually shot him. They were all convicted of murder and sentenced to life, but I often wonder if or when they will become part of the King’s Birthday pardon program. So just be careful in how you go about getting what you want. I have a joint bank account with my wife, we have three houses which basically are all in her name, all of our vehicles are in her name and the small life insurance policy that I have lists her as the sole beneficiary as I have no living relatives. We celebrated our 14tth anniversary on 1 October and I’m still here but who knows! If you think that this is BS just google Dale Henry, Thailand and some of the story is there. He is now buried in his home country of Canada. May he RIP! Edited October 7, 2013 by wayned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLCrab Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 Very sorry Wayned to hear (again) of your friend from Canada. The problem with some few relationships is that -- even though the Thai girl herself is genuine -- she maybe talks too much of her circumstances and yields to the overwhelming pressure from others to cash-in sooner rather than later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robblok Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 you can hire an accountant that could put you on a books of a company for about 20k+ which will give you a work permit and business visa. Unless you marry a thai those other two options are about 20-30k thb annually... Go on.... lol... what do you want to know? There is an accounting across from the go kart track in Phuket offers that service. There are some others on the island. You pay them money and they set you up with a work permit and business visa. You will have to take the visa run trip 2 times though. 1st is for the 90 day business visa this allows you to get the work permit, and the 2nd is for the Multi 1 year which you need to have a work permit in order to obtain. What they do is essentially put you on the books under a 'fake job' such as a diving instructor and claim that you make 40k baht a month i think. I know for a fact from a few sources that this did work a year ago. I assume its the same unless the requirements have become more strict. Not every accountant will do it but there are some out there that were doing it. The ones that I knew the accountant was driving a Mercedes... So im sure the business is quite lucrative. Basically its fraud.. I would not like it but I understand the need. It keeps you open for abuse. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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