Will Chiang Mai get its Monorail? Project Moves Forward

[Dean1953]

How Far East does it go? My house is in Bosang and would like to know the nearest station. Maybe, by the time I and my wife move back in 10 years, the project may be near completion.

[beb]

I have my doubts about this actually happening and am not excited about a tram rumbling along the streets and the disruption to the local roads but a well planned tram could be a great addition, with the emphasis on "well planned". I've lived and traveled in eastern Europe a bit and the tram systems are very useful and easy to use, if a bit slow. As I understand it, the level of motorcycle injuries here is pretty sky high so the less of them on the road, probably the better.

[jaideeguy]

Worst idea that they have come up with so far but luckily they seldom follow thru with their grand schemes. It will NOT help with traffic, especially motorcycle drivers because there are so many and so cheap to run and get you exactly to where you want to go and when you want to go. Thais don't like to wait!!

And it seems that this country can't even keep a two tracked train on the track, how can they expect to keep a single track vehicle from falling off. Plus, the failed bus system should have taught them that lesson.................. but not.

We'll be stuck with songthews and tuk tuks for the next century!!

[dave2]

re

It will NOT help with traffic, especially motorcycle drivers

can you imagine the casualty rate ?

mom pop and baby on a dream against one of

these

an awful thought

dave2

[MESmith]

re

It will NOT help with traffic, especially motorcycle drivers

can you imagine the casualty rate ?

mom pop and baby on a dream against one of

these

an awful thought

dave2

Cow catchers all round will keep them from under the wheels.

[masuk]

re

It will NOT help with traffic, especially motorcycle drivers

can you imagine the casualty rate ?

mom pop and baby on a dream against one of

these

an awful thought

dave2

Isn't the idea to have an elevated monorail? Therefore the motor bikes will only collide with the concrete supports and not the monorail!

Bangkok folk have become used to the idea that they will have to actually walk to get up to the the monorail, but maybe CM folk will learn how. At present they just abandon their bikes on any empty space on a footpath.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Isn't the idea to have an elevated monorail? Therefore the motor bikes will only collide with the concrete supports and not the monorail!

Nope. Not according to the material released when this was news, about a month or so ago.

Also check the previous page of this topic.

[Sparkles]

I have my doubts about this actually happening and am not excited about a tram rumbling along the streets and the disruption to the local roads but a well planned tram could be a great addition, with the emphasis on "well planned". I've lived and traveled in eastern Europe a bit and the tram systems are very useful and easy to use, if a bit slow. As I understand it, the level of motorcycle injuries here is pretty sky high so the less of them on the road, probably the better.

Trams or any method of transportation at street level would just worsen the current situation.Comparing CM with eastern Europe is a bit rich.How can you have a "well planned tram" when the streets/sois are so narrow. Property resumption to widen corridors will never happen, surely its a mono rail or underground. Getting Thais off their bikes is mission impossible,it will never happen.

[hellodolly]

Will Promenada still be open by the time the tramline is built?

Probably. Though the existing route map (which dates back the previous grand mass transit plan that involved regular buses in dedicated bus lanes) doesn't include a stop at Promenada. Nor does it include stops for the big schools in the Aom muang area, Montfort and Varee, both major contributors to rush hour traffic.

Chiang Mai is growing faster than politicians and map-drawing consultants can keep up with.

The map in the first post shows it covers a lot of area. But even with in the area it covers you will still need a tuck tuck or red bus (songhtal)

[Mapguy]

It is NOT --- NOT --- a monorail. See the previous thread on this matter, as already suggested. It is NOT a tram as most have experienced or recall trams riding rails. It is more sophisticated, but It is still a naive solution (with an appalling price tag ) to urban transportation in a city like this. There are some very sensible posts above about the silliness of this plan. No need to quote them.

Once again I vote for re-equipped or new songtao, tuk tuk (for touristy-color), and normal taxis (for those who must not get wet or need travel beyond city "limits" --- all with nonpolluting fuel. Then, of course, some restricted travel areas (either by time of day, as with truck deliveries, and/or only permitting electric vehicles which could include cheap electric trams as already in use on the university campus and/or similar but less-capacity 10-12-seater electric "buses! Plenty of opportunity for people to get their investments back, too!

Commuters? Provide residents with "emission sensitive" permits. Charge non-residents with the same sort of "emission-sensitive" permits to enter the city! Want them to use alternative means of transportation at the "city limits?" Not easy to convince people of this! There are tens of thousands of daily commuters! You MUST built parking garages along main access routes at the edge of the city ! The price of a parking ticket could include free intra-urban transportation! Nail those ignoring the sensible alternatives with a meaningful fine. Monitor permits on access routes through surveillance cameras (not as hard technologically as you might think!). Et cetera, et cetera! Silly to see lack of effective ininitiative in solving an old problem.

The above suggestions certainly need to be refined to fit the specific urban situation, but you get the idea. Some know full well (although they don't post here) about the rather draconian law in Japan, for example, which does not permit a Tokyo resident a permit to own a car unless they prove they have a place to park it! Maybe we have one or two posters from Italy who can comment on the restrictions on vehicular traffic (even in Italy!!) in towns like Sienna which have an historical core that needs to be protected! (That's not dissimilar to Chiang Mai!) Or, certainly there are Brits who can comment knowledgeably about provisions to improve access in central London. Or Americans who can comment on the entry-exit fees for vehicular traffic in New York. These places haven't solved all of their problems either, but the "solutions offerred in Chiang Mai are astonishingly ill-informed.

And don't get me going on urban sprawl !

Why is it that the lessons learned from some of the worst of the more economically-developed urban planning solutions from Europe and America seem to be ignored. This has nothing to do with "20% off the top investors in maga-projects. There are lots of ways to make a living from the alternative solutions. The problem, in this case, is probably more to do with those of us who insist we must park our private automobiles within 10m of our destination!

[WinnieTheKhwai]

(songhtal)

...

..must..

..resist....

...............................

EDIT:

AAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Songthaew

Pronunciation:

http://thai-language.com/mp3/P196682.mp3

Edited October 14, 2013 by WinnieTheKhwai

[beb]

I have my doubts about this actually happening and am not excited about a tram rumbling along the streets and the disruption to the local roads but a well planned tram could be a great addition, with the emphasis on "well planned". I've lived and traveled in eastern Europe a bit and the tram systems are very useful and easy to use, if a bit slow. As I understand it, the level of motorcycle injuries here is pretty sky high so the less of them on the road, probably the better.

Trams or any method of transportation at street level would just worsen the current situation.Comparing CM with eastern Europe is a bit rich.How can you have a "well planned tram" when the streets/sois are so narrow. Property resumption to widen corridors will never happen, surely its a mono rail or underground. Getting Thais off their bikes is mission impossible,it will never happen.

Not comparing CM to Eastern Europe. Simply saying that trams can serve a valuable purpose if properly introduced. CM, like the rest of Thailand, is in the process of dramatic changes and it won't be the same place in 10 years. I'm sure there are many here that can remember a very different CM of 10 years ago. In the couple of years that I've been here there have been pretty dramatic changes. So change is a constant and the people will change their habits as needed. I can't count how many motorcycle accidents I've personally witnessed in my short time so I have to assume there are tens of thousands that of course happen when I'm not around. And as traffic gets more and more congested (and drivers become more aggressive), there is going to be a need to find a solution.

I don't know what that solution is and don't pretend to know either. Believe it or not, I'm not an expert in urban planning. But it seems to me that CM is quickly transforming and needs some sort of plan that is put into place.

We can all cling to the city that we want CM to remain but I think that's long past. Now the question is how to retain as much as possible while handling this massive growth.

[Morakot]

It will NOT help with traffic, especially motorcycle drivers

can you imagine the casualty rate ?

When trams were reintroduced in Manchester, the city council sent out "helpful" leaflets educating the people that trams are bound to tracks and therefore cannot bypass any obstacles in their way [sic.].

Edited October 14, 2013 by Morakot

[northernjohn]

(songhtal)

...

..must..

..resist....

...............................

EDIT:

AAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Songthaew

Pronunciation:

http://thai-language.com/mp3/P196682.mp3

Great reference point

Edited October 14, 2013 by northernjohn

[hellodolly]

(songhtal)

...

..must..

..resist....

...............................

EDIT:

AAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Songthaew

Pronunciation:

http://thai-language.com/mp3/P196682.mp3

Yes I know WTK I have it on a stickup post on my computer but must not disappoint the fan's. You do realize there are social responsibilities here on TV.

Bad spelling comes natural to me. So I feel it is my duty to give the spelling police a target.

I looked up songthaews in the dictionary and it didn't have it. If memory serves me rite which it "occasionally" does wikipedia is just a bunch of facts that are changeable.

In the mean time enjoy. Some day I will give you all a real treat and not use the spell check,

Did you know the spell check for songthaews is Mathewson

Give me a little credit I did put in red bus for those unable to understand my horrible spelling. It worked for you didn't it?

[alfieconn]

Any one notice the number of Bangkok number plates? seems a huge influx of either people or cars.

I would imagine an influx of both unless the cars were driving themselves

[ThaiHerbs]

Looks like it has been smart (connected) money that has been pouring into CM all along and not merely speculators. If CM is being held in such high regard as a central point ("economic hub") my thinking is we will get a state of the art public transit system. Time will tell tho.

Doug

China to aid Thailand high speed rail projects
October 13, 2013,

...Chiang Mai is poised to be the economic hub of an upcoming ASEAN Economic Community and could serve critical Chinese interests in the region by further economic integration of ASEAN nations with Beijing.

Five years since the opening of China’s high-speed rail system, the country has announced plans to extend the network from the current 9000 kilometers, which is presently the world’s longest, to16,000 kilometers by 2020.

http://thebricspost.com/china-to-aid-thailand-high-speed-rail-projects/#.Ult1IRB9lEY

[hellodolly]

Looks like it has been smart (connected) money that has been pouring into CM all along and not merely speculators. If CM is being held in such high regard as a central point ("economic hub") my thinking is we will get a state of the art public transit system. Time will tell tho.

Doug

China to aid Thailand high speed rail projects

October 13, 2013,

...Chiang Mai is poised to be the economic hub of an upcoming ASEAN Economic Community and could serve critical Chinese interests in the region by further economic integration of ASEAN nations with Beijing.

Five years since the opening of China’s high-speed rail system, the country has announced plans to extend the network from the current 9000 kilometers, which is presently the world’s longest, to16,000 kilometers by 2020.

http://thebricspost.com/china-to-aid-thailand-high-speed-rail-projects/#.Ult1IRB9lEY

A state of the art public transit system. would involve the destruction of many existing buildings and would never pay for itself.

The only way they could get a state of the art public transit system. Would be to install a bus system that will go every where in town and into the suburbs. It would have to be clearly marked and maintaine a regular time schedule that wwould be posted. Short of that we will have to stick to the present system. Any thing else would just be a fiasco and cause more traffic problems.

As for the quote what has it got to do with Chiang Mai. China has already proposed a high speed train through Thailand that does not even come close to Chiang Mai. It does how ever allow for the possibility of a spur line to Chiang Rai.

[ThaiHerbs]

As for the quote what has it got to do with Chiang Mai. China has already proposed a high speed train through Thailand that does not even come close to Chiang Mai.

I thought the article was pretty clear on that...

...Li said Chinese expertise in building efficient super-speed trains at competitive costs would aid the country. This would also give China access to Thailand’s large and growing consumer market.

Li was visiting a Chinese high-speed railway exhibition in Thailand featured Chinese blueprint plans for the 680-km Bangkok-Chiang Mai and 450-km Bangkok-Nong Khai rail lines.

Chiang Mai is poised to be the economic hub of an upcoming ASEAN Economic Community and could serve critical Chinese interests in the region by further economic integration of ASEAN nations with Beijing.

http://thebricspost.com/china-to-aid-thailand-high-speed-rail-projects/#.UluS8BB9lEY

[hellodolly]

As for the quote what has it got to do with Chiang Mai. China has already proposed a high speed train through Thailand that does not even come close to Chiang Mai.

48

I thought the article was pretty clear on that...

...Li said Chinese expertise in building efficient super-speed trains at competitive costs would aid the country. This would also give China access to Thailand’s large and growing consumer market.

Li was visiting a Chinese high-speed railway exhibition in Thailand featured Chinese blueprint plans for the 680-km Bangkok-Chiang Mai and 450-km Bangkok-Nong Khai rail lines.

Chiang Mai is poised to be the economic hub of an upcoming ASEAN Economic Community and could serve critical Chinese interests in the region by further economic integration of ASEAN nations with Beijing.

http://thebricspost.com/china-to-aid-thailand-high-speed-rail-projects/#.UluS8BB9lEY

Suggest you reread your post #48

China can propose any thing they want but what they proposed themselves was no where near Chiang Mai and made allowances for a connection to Chiang Rai.

I would not be a bit surprised if the current government did not ask them for a proposal on the route you mentioned but it was not of the Chinese plan for a rail road through Thailand. It is common practice to ask for proposals on a job of that magnitude.

[Sparkles]

Any one notice the number of Bangkok number plates? seems a huge influx of either people or cars.

I would imagine an influx of both unless the cars were driving themselves

Just for your info the second hand car market in Bangkok has has headed south due to the number of re possessions from people that bought vehicles with the 100,000 baht discount.Keeping up payments has proved to be a killer as many predicted.Have a friend down there now collecting a hardly used pick up 20% cheaper than he can buy in CM.Hope that enlightens you !

[Mapguy]

Looks like it has been smart (connected) money that has been pouring into CM all along and not merely speculators. If CM is being held in such high regard as a central point ("economic hub") my thinking is we will get a state of the art public transit system. Time will tell tho.

Doug

China to aid Thailand high speed rail projects

October 13, 2013,

...Chiang Mai is poised to be the economic hub of an upcoming ASEAN Economic Community and could serve critical Chinese interests in the region by further economic integration of ASEAN nations with Beijing.

Five years since the opening of China’s high-speed rail system, the country has announced plans to extend the network from the current 9000 kilometers, which is presently the world’s longest, to16,000 kilometers by 2020.

http://thebricspost.com/china-to-aid-thailand-high-speed-rail-projects/#.Ult1IRB9lEY

This "news' Is mostly hot air when it comes to Chiang Mai as an "economic hub." At best, the city will be hub cap. The province will remain an agricultural center. It will also be a tourist destination of note (if someone will stop the agricultural burning and deforestation), an administrative, medical and educational center.

Check out existing threads on ASEAN and AEC development including information from the Asian Development Bank.

Also check out the development of high speed rail. The significant trade route will be to Nong Khai. That connects China to the south through Laos. The Chiang Mai-Bangkok line is like a spur line north from Bangkok perhaps more politically important than anything.

Edited October 14, 2013 by Mapguy

[hellodolly]

Looks like it has been smart (connected) money that has been pouring into CM all along and not merely speculators. If CM is being held in such high regard as a central point ("economic hub") my thinking is we will get a state of the art public transit system. Time will tell tho.

Doug

China to aid Thailand high speed rail projects

October 13, 2013,

...Chiang Mai is poised to be the economic hub of an upcoming ASEAN Economic Community and could serve critical Chinese interests in the region by further economic integration of ASEAN nations with Beijing.

Five years since the opening of China’s high-speed rail system, the country has announced plans to extend the network from the current 9000 kilometers, which is presently the world’s longest, to16,000 kilometers by 2020.

http://thebricspost.com/china-to-aid-thailand-high-speed-rail-projects/#.Ult1IRB9lEY

This "news' Is mostly hot air when it comes to Chiang Mai as an "economic hub." At best, the city will be hub cap. The province will remain an agricultural center. It will also be a tourist destination of note (if someone will stop the agricultural burning and deforestation), an administrative, medical and educational center.

Check out existing threads on ASEAN and AEC development including information from the Asian Development Bank.

Also check out the development of high speed rail. The significant trade route will be to Nong Khai. That connects China to the south through Laos. The Chiang Mai-Bangkok line is like a spur line north from Bangkok perhaps more politically important than anything.

Not only a spur line according to the sketchy plans they drew up it was only going to go part way on the Government baht. The majority and the toughest part they figured private enterprise would do. China has no interest in a line to Chiang Mai. If asked and the money is rite they will build one.

[northernjohn]

Well there is no two ways about it there are areas in Chiang Mai that need some kind of traffic modification. Is there any money set aside for this project and is there any doable plans? I see where they have some routes drawn up that will most assuredly relieve a lot of the pressure if they can be installed with out becoming a part of the problem themselves.

They will still require Tuck Tuck's and Songthaew's in many areas. On the other hand If Tuck Tuck's and Songthaew's move out to the out laying areas a little more people might find it more convenient to grab one of them and have it take them to the nearest terminal and come into town on what ever they come up with.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

This "news' Is mostly hot air when it comes to Chiang Mai as an "economic hub." At best, the city will be hub cap. The province will remain an agricultural center. It will also be a tourist destination of note (if someone will stop the agricultural burning and deforestation), an administrative, medical and educational center.

Also check out the development of high speed rail. The significant trade route will be to Nong Khai. That connects China to the south through Laos. The Chiang Mai-Bangkok line is like a spur line north from Bangkok perhaps more politically important than anything.

I don't disagree that the lay of the land inevitably means that Chiang Mai will get passed by for things other than tourism (probably not a bad thing), but in terms of getting to China, you could make the case that the most obvious route is via Lampang, Chiang Rai, Chiang Khong, Luang Nam Tha and then cross at Boten into China. That seams easier and more direct than going straight through the whole of Northern Laos.

[davetrout]

yes