Thai Superstitions - Pregnancy, Birth and the Early Years

[David48]

Thai Superstitions - Pregnancy, Birth and the Early Years ...

My Thai girlfriend is pregnant ... TWINS in fact ...

Slowly, I'm being educated in the local Customs, Traditions and Superstitions

I've learnt, that pregnant woman don't go to Funerals.

You never give birth on a Wednesday ... never ... such bad luck

(actually, you also don't get a hair-cut on a Wednesday either ... )

A pin is inserted in the front of the dress to ... to do what exactly?

I'm sure there are lots ... please share

Thai Customs, Traditions and Superstitions - Pregnancy, Birth and the Early Years ...

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[Puyai]

If your baby is born with a slightly flat bridge of the nose you will be told to massage it every day to give the baby a more farrang type bridge.

Same with bowed legs, massage them and they'll straighten.

Shaving their head is another one.

Not really tradition but wait until your little one (s) gets a cold for the first time like mine did at the beginning of the week. My lady took him to the doctors while I was out and came back with a bag full of 4 different coloured medicines. One for the throat, one for the cough, one for the runny nose and one for his temperature. I was amazed that a doctor would prescribe antibiotics for a common cold! Unless my son is really sick I wouldn't let him take any sort of medication.

[krisb]

Not showing to themselves in a mirror. Something about teeth not growing or something.

Shaving their head or in your case heads! Once again dont know why.

Have you heard about them marrying twins? Brothers and sisters. Something to do with husband and wife in previous life.

The mother after giving birth goes into a steam room with fire under her to help cleanse bacteria etc etc. Mine was happy with the portable sauna off ebay, cost a hundred dollars, but it was important to her so I got it.

Herbal tablets mum takes after bubs is born. 50 baht of tablets cost me a hundred to get them sent here.

Something about born on wednesday is another. Born on kings or queens birthday is another and think the hospital gives money if born on kings bday.

[p_brownstone]

After the children are born and you show them off to Thai family and friends you may be shocked to hear how they all call the children ugly, instead of the usual Farang reaction which would be to say how cute they are.

Older Thais in particular believe that calling a young child cute or attractive will bring the child to the attention of jealous evil spirits who will do their best to damage or possess it. That's also the main reason all Thai have a nickname as well as a proper given name - the nickname is used much more than the given name, again to confuse the evil spirits so they don't know who you are talking about.

Patrick

[Puyai]

Not showing to themselves in a mirror. Something about teeth not growing or something.

Shaving their head or in your case heads! Once again dont know why.

Have you heard about them marrying twins? Brothers and sisters. Something to do with husband and wife in previous life.

The mother after giving birth goes into a steam room with fire under her to help cleanse bacteria etc etc. Mine was happy with the portable sauna off ebay, cost a hundred dollars, but it was important to her so I got it.

Herbal tablets mum takes after bubs is born. 50 baht of tablets cost me a hundred to get them sent here.

Something about born on wednesday is another. Born on kings or queens birthday is another and think the hospital gives money if born on kings bday.

When I got told to shave my sons hair off it was so it would grow back thicker and more beautiful.

[MobileContent]

When you carry your baby don't say it is heavy.

After my boy was born my Mrs had to go in a steaming room for 11 days to kill of the bacteria's and to make her stomach slim again. We bought for around 5,000 Baht herbs from a Chinese herbal shop which they said is good for her. Interesting that all visitors also had to drink those herbs but for me it was a fun experience.

[Puyai]

When you carry your baby don't say it is heavy.

After my boy was born my Mrs had to go in a steaming room for 11 days to kill of the bacteria's and to make her stomach slim again. We bought for around 5,000 Baht herbs from a Chinese herbal shop which they said is good for her. Interesting that all visitors also had to drink those herbs but for me it was a fun experience.

What did the baby do for 11 days?

[MobileContent]

When you carry your baby don't say it is heavy.

After my boy was born my Mrs had to go in a steaming room for 11 days to kill of the bacteria's and to make her stomach slim again. We bought for around 5,000 Baht herbs from a Chinese herbal shop which they said is good for her. Interesting that all visitors also had to drink those herbs but for me it was a fun experience.

What did the baby do for 11 days?

Getting steamed as well during feeding. The baby most of the time slept all the time in another room but it was very hot in the steaming room (kitchen from my in-laws).

[zeichen]

congratulations David.

Pregnant women cannot pick or eat banana blossoms.

If you have girls grow a beard, it will scare off the bad boyfriends in the future.

the most important thing to remember that your girlfriend is always right. Whatever she needs is your job to make her life more comfortable during pregnancy. Or you will hear about it for the next 20 years.

Good luck. Being a dad is the greatest gift in life.

[bina]

been discussed ad nauseum, search in te isssan forum for instance....

dont worry we have similar things here even among highly educated people. there is an element of 'not knowing ' and 'hedging bets' when it comes to pregancies and births.

the herbs probably either help the milk come in or cause the womb to get rid of all the stuff that is still in there; staying in a sauna is probably most likely just to give the mother a few days of rest before she goes back to being family caretaker. (in israel we have special hotels for after birthing mothers that have many kids at home,not a bad idea at all).

calling baby bad names is against the evil eye , we have that as do most middle eastern nations...

if it doesnt hurt, why worry.

[David48]

^^ Thanks for that suggestion bina.

So, just in case I missed, I used the Thai Visa Search Function in the Issan Forum and searched for

'Superstition'

'Superstitions'

'pregnancy'

'pregnant'

Sadly, the search function wasn't up to the mark ... no related topics.

Not deterred I did a google search and found many references.

I reading through them now and actually, you are one of the few contributors.

You made a post in a now archived thread (so I can't directly quote you) ...

among us: evil eye if u say someone's baby is pretty or cute (u have to say 'hamsa hamsa' the arabic for five, meaning 'hand' as in 'against the evil eye';; hang a blue glass eye bead and hand over cribs, or as necklace, or wristlet.... hang a hamsa on a wall by your front door or on the porch with or w/o blessings written in them

But I'm not sure if it was a Thai or Jewish thing?

Maybe you could explain more?

I'll add the other findings in a post below.

So, having read now a large number of threads and posts on the related subject, I'm yet to find one that mirrors the question I'm asking.

bina ... your input would be greatly appreciated ...
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[Jasun]

My wife was declined foot massages when pregnant in case they touched the wrong spot and the baby popped out.

[David48]

From Senia ... http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/441519-thai-superstitions-are-driving-me-nuts/?p=4226132

OK .............. pregnant woman( ME !!!! ) superstitions that I have encountered so far


1. feed her , again and again and again and again
2. good foods - raw cockles, sausages , liver .....................erm listeria ? salmonella??
bad food - sodas , chocolate..................... ????
3. stay in bed and just eat from 71/2 months onwards.
4. body lotion prevents skin browning and orange peels on tummy - DOES NOT !!!!
5. no buying anything for the baby until after he is born !!!!!!!!!!!! not even preparing baby room ( can you imagine that?? seriously !!!! i really dun think that i would be in the mood to shop after x hours of labor )
6. Carpal Tunnel Syndrome - too much time with the computer ! ( even after a google search told him that pregnancy is one of the causes )
7. Baby is named based on the day/ date that he is born by famous monk ( this doesn't really bother me much .......... maybe cos he has a thai name and a regular name so I won't be using his Thai name on him much , but still takes the fun out of choosing a name for him )

From Bina ... http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/441519-thai-superstitions-are-driving-me-nuts/?p=4227733

of course we dont buy anything until the birth. thats horrible luck

as for naming: some of the ethnic groups here only name after lving relatives, others of us, only after dead relatives and its horrible luck to name someone after a person who died not from old age.

phazey ... http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/22617-superstitions-and-oldyoung-wife-tales/?p=233756

can't use scissors whilst pregnant for fear of the baby having a hare lip (he did'nt, but i swear if he carries on like the little bratt he is he'll get a fat lip!)

Have to split them over a few posts because I exceed the number of quotes in a post ...

Many of these from older threads, one dating back to 2004

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[David48]

tuky ... http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/22617-superstitions-and-oldyoung-wife-tales/?p=235120

My father in law dreamt of fish one night, woke up and told my wife that she must be pregnant, so we went to the doc and sure enough 9 months later out popped our little girl.

spee ... http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/22617-superstitions-and-oldyoung-wife-tales/?p=235358

Reminds me of the superstition behind why Thai's will give nicknames to their babies, in an effort to keep the evil spirits from finding them and taking them away.

macb ... http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/101769-issan-superstitions/?p=1086380

Well when the wife became pregnant our house had to be protected against PEEBOB: Food was put out for the ancestors and each door that gives access to the house had a special wood hung on it also the bedroom door.

There image of PEEBOB I dont know if I am permitted to give a graphical description on here I will ask the Moderators about this, but the PEEBOB like pregnant women.

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[David48]

cuban ... http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/101769-issan-superstitions/?p=1087121

In the past I have seen new borns being protected from the full moon as if it were a midday sun.

RusT ... http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/101769-issan-superstitions/?p=1325476

They say it is bad luck to say a baby is cute so they said "Luk Mah" (dog baby) or just "Kirae" (ugly) when they really when they really want to say how adorable the baby is. This belief is spread right throughout Thailand not only Issan. Whether it has Chinese origins I don't know.

Following post ...

9. Leaving your pestle in the mortor will bring pain in child birth

Actually that thread ... issan-superstitions was a fun read ...

Do not make remarks that someone’s baby or toddler is cute. Lie, instead, that the child is ugly and unlovable. It was believed a long time ago that if you make a comment that your baby or someone’s baby is cute, evil spirits will snatch away the baby. This is why so many children have horrid nicknames like Moo (pig), Ouan (fat), Looknam (mosquito lavae)!

Here

This one is not Baby related ... but a classic, and I've never read it before.

RusT

10. After a bad dream when you take a dump you should ask your excretement to go peacefully before flushing so the poo spriit (pii kee) can take away any bad luck (I love this one!).

[bina]

the hamsa one /evil eye is not jewish but middle eastern collectively muslem and jewish and christian ethinics living in the middle east.... and here, the morrocan/yemen/iraq/iran/etctec jews brought that with htem to israel. among the european jews there are khana huras which is yiddish for evil eye (all this is against the halacha btw, but like most things, most religious people hedge their bets also.

what senia wrote is nonsense: listeria etc is from non cooked food, well cooked food does not present a problem to most pregnant women (most being the key word).

liver is great. cola is indeed bad (caffeine sugar etc).

staying in bed, well, if the doc orders it, then yes, if not, not.

certain lotions help against the skin strecching and scarring, the brown comes from the hormones and on dark skinned women its worse

foot massage indeed affects the birth and here many women do get reflexology to help turn breech babies or help with labour and it is apparently effective (it is affective for other things too).

there is nothing worse then coming back home w/o your baby to a room waiting for the baby for many reasons from jaundice to 'silent births i.e. still borns', hence here, most people dont prepare ahead of time, that is the job of the MIL or mother's mother or close relatives. or best friend.

even normally logical mothers become non logical previous to and after birth, some as symptoms of post partem and some is just anxiety due to hormones/

most important: its not you giving birth, and no wonder its called 'labour' because it is labour and she is the one doing it. so if she feels better hanging red threads with blue beads over the crib, then why not? in christian families crosses, and bibles and god knows what were put in baby rooms,

and yes, pregnancy can cause problems in tendons/ligaments but not in hands so much as in hips knees ankles where they soften up to stretch out, and with the additional wieght of the pregnancy then there are more aches and pains.

i cant tell you how many babies here on the kibbutz, totally nonreligious, supposedly secular and educated people, that have red threads tied around the baby's wrist after birth, or have a little card with a famous rabbi's blessing put under the mattress, and if the baby keeps getting sick then checking the mezuza to see if a letter has smeared causing the illness. even academics and professionals with high level education. when it comes to children and pregnancy suddenly we 'regress to primitive reactions'

[David48]

bina .. thanks for that ...

I appreciate the contribution and I know how much time it takes.

Just so there is a clear understanding, I'm just trying to gather

the information so I have the understanding.

I've never had kids before, and the extra dimension of having them

in Thailand adds colour to that.

[bifftastic]

My wife says that because she never did the whole 'steaming' thing after her three pregnancies (first child was still-born, second and third are now 10 and 11 years old), she now isn't strong enough to work in the fields.

I suspect that that has come from my sister-in-law, possibly explaining to everyone else why she's not as strong as they are. My wife hasn't worked in any fields since she was about 12 years old. I think that's more likely to be why she complains bitterly when she has to help out on the farm

So, it's likely that it is intended to restore the strength of someone who has just given birth.

Incidentally, she first explained that to me as 'sitting on a fire'! Eventually, I worked out that it was some kind of herbal sauna arrangement.

I have heard the nickname idea (warding off bad spirits) which seems to have carried on, although given the more modern nicknames (our neighbour's boy is called Beckham, or 'Aai Haem' for short!) I feel it's unlikely that the original reason still carries much weight. But I like the idea of people having nicknames.

Our nephew has just had a baby, she's been given the nickname 'Ice' so (with the lack of the 'S' sound at the end of the word) she has become 'Nong Eye'.

She recently had a couple of ceremonies. Firstly, there was a gathering where good luck for her life was wished upon her. Similarly to those events where people are setting off on a long journey, or part of a wedding ceremony, there were 'sai sin' tied around her wrists, some of which had money tied with them.

The other day, she was 1 month and 1 day old, so she had her hair shaved off by a monk in the 'kwhan' ceremony. Apparently, during her first month, she was vulnerable to influences of 'the bad spirits' (possibly why the custom of the 'inverted compliment' abounds during that time as well), but now she's made it past that point, she's over on our side, as it were and her spirit (something like the 'soul' that Christians refer to perhaps?) is welcomed along with her.

Interestingly enough, well, to me anyway, the word 'kwahn' is used in the Thai word for gift, or present 'kong kwahn' literally means 'spirit's thing' and so when someone gives you a gift, it's for your spirit, not you

Also, when children become distressed, you can also sometimes hear their mothers calling the 'kwahn' or spirit, back whilst holding them They're distressed because it's temporarily left them alone, and go back to being happy and contented when it comes back. That's also why babies sit happily laughing and playing by themselves. Their 'kwahn' is playing with them.

Now, I have to say that all this may seem quite odd to those of us who grew up in European influenced cultures, and I myself don't share their belief in spirits as separate entities, but I do find it enjoyable and very interesting.

It's also a nice way for the baby to be welcomed into society, and for everyone to express their desire for the new arrival to have a good and happy existence.

There are lots of ceremonies in Thai life. I enjoy them in that way, when everyone comes together to wish each other well. I've been involved in a few, and I find that it's not important that I don't share the beliefs that are behind them. I'm not even sure that a lot of the Thai people do either. What is important, is that it brings people together to express good feelings towards each other.

And, there's food and drink!

[cabanlit]

Seriously, you want to stamp your feet on some of these NOW!

It's a 'joint baby', and all this will get out of hand unless you bring some of your own traditions to the fore. Even make some up, if you're unhappy with some of the nonsense they might do.

[brd]

all over the world same same, Africa even more.

Forget its and be happy where ever you are otherwise that will bring you possibly bad luck to listen to all those witches ideas...

Do not leave a hat on a bed

do not open an umbrella in a house.

etc....etc....etc......

[onionluke]

Try going through all of the above in a high rise flat in Hong Kong . Yes it doesn't fit . We did have a "mooon yuet " for our infant and shaved his hair before the gathering of .......anyway it was a evening to remember.

[KuhnPaen]

Call them by their nickname only. Supposedly, the reason so many Thais have short nicknames is that when they are babies the parents avoid calling them by their real name so the ghosts/evil spirits don't hear the name and come a callin'.

[monkeyboots]

Arrived home from work recently to notice my 1 month-old twin girls' heads were blacked up on the top of their heads and eye brows (actually a deep blue). Mum-in-law had done it to promote good hair and eyebrow growth. Found out it was Butterfly Blue Pea flower (the flower with a clitoris like bit at the top) mashed up to a paste in water. Had always been done in their family and I would have objected, but mum-in-law and wife both have great hair with strong eyebrows...

[mad mary]

Anyone not born between the 12/11/02 and 12/11/02 is only unique to me .Thai superstions are or should be put on the 'I couldn't give a monkies arse' pile .

<deleted> em

[David48]

Arrived home from work recently to notice my 1 month-old twin girls' heads were blacked up on the top of their heads and eye brows (actually a deep blue). Mum-in-law had done it to promote good hair and eyebrow growth. Found out it was Butterfly Blue Pea flower (the flower with a clitoris like bit at the top) mashed up to a paste in water. Had always been done in their family and I would have objected, but mum-in-law and wife both have great hair with strong eyebrows...

Any chance you have a photo to share?

Would love to see that.

[David48]

Anyone not born between the 12/11/02 and 12/11/02 is only unique to me .Thai superstions are or should be put on the 'I couldn't give a monkies arse' pile .

I'm not saying I agree with one, some or all of them ... but I am trying to understand them.

In the same way we dress buys in blue and girls pink ... no logical reason, just tradition or superstition.

Actually, a logicial reason might be that the gender of a young baby is indeterminate sometimes and by dressing them in a 'colour', it saves the embarrassment that we might have when saying isn't she a pretty girl, when indeed a boy.

Plus some of it's just plain fun.

If the child is in Thailand then the level of expectations will be higher to follow the Thai Cultural and Social norms then say, the infant was born in your country of birth.

BTW, I declined to quote your disguised profanity, but kept your spelling mistakes ...

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[bifftastic]

Seriously, you want to stamp your feet on some of these NOW!

It's a 'joint baby', and all this will get out of hand unless you bring some of your own traditions to the fore. Even make some up, if you're unhappy with some of the nonsense they might do.

Please, explain how 'all this' will get 'out of hand' in any way shape or form.

[David48]

^^ biff, I appreciate the support, but lets leave all that for the General Forum ... we are in Families and Children Forum here.

The only reason for the last couple of negative posts (and maybe a few more to follow) was because this Topic was in the ThaiVisa email alert, so many eyes, who normally wouldn't be drawn here dropped by for a chat and a comment.

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[Goinghomesoon]

OP David congrats on expecting twins. What a learning curve.

Until now I never really took much notice of my pregnant sisters-in-law and any special cultural beliefs. I know most of them only because I lived in Cambodia for a few years and several of my Khmer girlfriends had babies and went through the herbs/special food/fire under the bed routine. And I was warned very early on to never-never-never say that a newborn was cute.

Actually I suspect my Thai hubby never took much notice either, because I'm currently expecting and he hasn't really expressed an interest in doing anything the Thai way. Except the need to massage the baby's nose to ensure it looks more farang, of course!

[bina]

hey. thats great.!!!!!!!!!!.... im glad for you...........