Is The Pattaya Property Market Going Tits Up?

[Lazy Sod]

Some estate Agent web sites are being updated almost daily with ever-growing lists of available 2nd hand properties. Any views? I'm thinking of buying something, but have a hunch it's best to wait a while.

[expatgaz]

I think the market is fine.The only "problems" as such at the minute is that its quite season so not as many people looking to buy and the Baht $$ Xchange is not so good hence estate agents maybe feeling the pinch.If your looking at a place I'd say go ahead.

EPG.

[barryofthailand]

realestate in Pattaya will remain stagnant until they stop building. I've been here for three years now and the building continues. The prices of used prop[erties are the same as new properties, so if your looking to buy might as well buy new. Remember though you cannot put realestate in your name excluding condominiums.

Barry

[Mobi]

Some estate Agent web sites are being updated almost daily with ever-growing lists of available 2nd hand properties. Any views? I'm thinking of buying something, but have a hunch it's best to wait a while.

Love the name.

There's a lot of houses being built, and I have felt for some time there is bound to be a glut until the market adjusts and stabilises.

Most of the over-supply is in the low to mid range price sector, where many are built on 'estates', crammed very close together. These type of houses are not my idea of a peaceful retirement home, but they may be good as holiday homes for those who worry about security.

I can't see the market going anywhere but up in the medium to long term. Deapite all the Pattaya Bashers efforts to ruin the town's reputation, it is still a very highly desirable place to live in or holiday in, with its proximity to BKK and even closer proximity to the new airport, its beaches, nightlife, expat community / infrastructure etc etc. (5 million visitors a year can't be wrong).

In the short term, I can see many readjustments to prices depending on the current supply and demand situation, and there is no doubt that at the moment its a buyers' market and probably will remain so for some time - but who knows for how long?.

Undoubtedly the expat estate agents amongst us will have some views on this - if you can believe them

[gharknes]

Some estate Agent web sites are being updated almost daily with ever-growing lists of available 2nd hand properties. Any views? I'm thinking of buying something, but have a hunch it's best to wait a while.

Love the name.

There's a lot of houses being built, and I have felt for some time there is bound to be a glut until the market adjusts and stabilises.

Most of the over-supply is in the low to mid range price sector, where many are built on 'estates', crammed very close together. These type of houses are not my idea of a peaceful retirement home, but they may be good as holiday homes for those who worry about security.

I can't see the market going anywhere but up in the medium to long term. Deapite all the Pattaya Bashers efforts to ruin the town's reputation, it is still a very highly desirable place to live in or holiday in, with its proximity to BKK and even closer proximity to the new airport, its beaches, nightlife, expat community / infrastructure etc etc. (5 million visitors a year can't be wrong).

In the short term, I can see many readjustments to prices depending on the current supply and demand situation, and there is no doubt that at the moment its a buyers' market and probably will remain so for some time - but who knows for how long?.

Undoubtedly the expat estate agents amongst us will have some views on this - if you can believe them

"""Pattaya Bashers efforts to ruin the town's reputation,"""

isn't that a laugh, I think Pattaya does very well all by itself and is getting worse, and BTW we only see maybe 60% of the shootings etc, the rest don't get to the media.

as for property, i said it months ago, supply and demand, too much to litlle of either will change the market landscape....simple economics, also greedy westerners with high profits and rediculous margins, look at a house at say 6 million baht, should be priced 3-4 million and cost 1-2 million to build, greedy people

also agree with this statement................many are built on 'estates', crammed very close together. These type of houses are not my idea of a peaceful retirement home, but they may be good as holiday homes...............

[Mobi]

[

"""Pattaya Bashers efforts to ruin the town's reputation,"""

isn't that a laugh, I think Pattaya does very well all by itself and is getting worse, and BTW we only see maybe 60% of the shootings etc, the rest don't get to the media.

Any opportunity to have another bash.

So you think 60 % of the shootings get reported in Bangkok or anywhere else in Thailand? If anything, more get reported here than most places.

In 2001 the Thai Police said there were over 5,000 murders in LOS. Someone the other day quoted a figure of 20,000 last year. Who knows? - but for sure its many thousands. Even one per week in Thailand's second largest city pales in comparison with the real number that are killed nationwide.

Personally I am very happy with what I paid for the Mobi mansion and I don't give a toss what happens to the housing market.

I am very happy here - and plan to stay till I die - and I'm sure it won't be at the end of a barrell.

[Rimmer]

[

"""Pattaya Bashers efforts to ruin the town's reputation,"""

isn't that a laugh, I think Pattaya does very well all by itself and is getting worse, and BTW we only see maybe 60% of the shootings etc, the rest don't get to the media.

Any opportunity to have another bash.

So you think 60 % of the shootings get reported in Bangkok or anywhere else in Thailand? If anything, more get reported here than most places.

In 2001 the Thai Police said there were over 5,000 murders in LOS. Someone the other day quoted a figure of 20,000 last year. Who knows? - but for sure its many thousands. Even one per week in Thailand's second largest city pales in comparison with the real number that are killed nationwide.

Personally I am very happy with what I paid for the Mobi mansion and I don't give a toss what happens to the housing market.

I am very happy here - and plan to stay till I die - and I'm sure it won't be at the end of a barrell.

Roger that! I am so happy here I am building another bigger house away from town.

Hate all the negative stuff all the time. if you are happy with the house and it's what you want then to my mind price is secondary.

Edited May 8, 2006 by Rimmer

[Noel]

as for property, i said it months ago, supply and demand, too much to litlle of either will change the market landscape....simple economics, also greedy westerners with high profits and rediculous margins, look at a house at say 6 million baht, should be priced 3-4 million and cost 1-2 million to build, greedy people

Sour grapes...?

[Sir Burr]

You have to remember that with regard to property in Thailand, the laws of supply and demand don't work.

If a house isn't sold/rented this year, the price will go up next year to compensate. This goes on until:-

Demand catches up with supply, or, the house falls down.

[devo]

"If a house isn't sold/rented this year, the price will go up next year to compensate. This goes on until:- Demand catches up with supply, or, the house falls down"

Sirr Burr, what does the above mean? if a house is not sold or rented then how can a seller put the price. and if price goes up how can deman increase. Basis economics will tell you the opposite is true. I assume you have a vested interest in the property market there

[Chopper]

The Pattaya property market is not typical of property markets that you may find else where. You may get a levelling off of prices now and again but sellers and those wishing to rent their properties are constantly testing the boundaries and pushing the envelope in as far as they can increase their sale price or rental yield. This in turn forces the herd to follow suit which is why you see some ridiculously high sale and rental prices quoted. All in all good news if you are already a property owner but unfortunate if you are trying to buy.

That said, if you look hard enough there are bargains every week for those that study the market and become familiar with the prices in each area. There is always some destitute person that needs to sell quick to realise the cash for one reason or another. Going back to their home country, run out of money, probate, trouble with the Police etc. We probably read about them on this forum from time to time. Though they are not actually selling their house or condo if you know what I mean at the time of reading.

BTW, I have absolutely no affiliation with any Estate Agent. I could insert the following adjectives here: ..... ...... ..... ..... ..... to give my opinion of them but would rather not take a holiday, thanks.

I agree with Mobi's sentiments above: ‘I can't see the market going anywhere but up in the medium to long term. Deapite (sic) all the Pattaya Bashers efforts to ruin the town's reputation, it is still a very highly desirable place to live in or holiday in, with its proximity to BKK and even closer proximity to the new airport, its beaches, nightlife, expat community / infrastructure etc etc. (5 million visitors a year can't be wrong)’.

The only proviso I would add is if there is another big economic crash such as in 1997, then that would perhaps see a major correction as everyone becomes jittery with the uncertain landscape (no pun intended). That is indeed not an unlikely scenario. When, though, is a more difficult prediction. If only I had crystal balls. Nah!, on reflection, the ones I have serve their purpose quite sufficiently.

In the final analysis and to answer the OP. Start studying the market and you will no doubt, given patience find what you are looking for at the right price. The right price of course is what you are willing and consider comfortable paying.

[jdinasia]

Hmmmm

OK ... look around ... see how many many MNAY listings there are for used properties (particularly condos) in the Pattaya area market.

Houses are a bit different but not much. The house market I honestly do not know ######all about in Pattaya ... but the condo market is just flooded and there are more and more properties going on the market every day!

Personally I would NOT buy at this time in the condo market in Patters ... I'd wait until the baht weakens and used properties come down a bit. <Exceptoion being ... you find a truly motivated seller and get something that EXACTLY meets your needs>

[Digger]

"If a house isn't sold/rented this year, the price will go up next year to compensate. This goes on until:- Demand catches up with supply, or, the house falls down"

Sirr Burr, what does the above mean? if a house is not sold or rented then how can a seller put the price. and if price goes up how can deman increase. Basis economics will tell you the opposite is true. I assume you have a vested interest in the property market there

This reminds me of a piece of land which I have had my eye on for the last couple of years. When I first looked, it was 9,000,000 baht but I found another piece that was more suitable. I still like the location and so checked again about 6 months ago. Still not sold, but the price now is 14,000,000 baht - The funniest thing is I chatted to the owner a month ago seeing if he had come to his senses and he said, well in July its going up to 18,000,000 baht

He has not sold it as you can see, but some idiot will come along and buy it but at 9,000,000 its a fair price - at 18,000,000 its a rip off. Meanwhile, he continues to grow tapioca on it, no rush to sell, he does not need the money for anything.

There is no logic in what land and property owners do here.

[jdinasia]

actually on land alone ... sitting on it makes sense!

developed property depreciates on the houses/buildings <while land prices go up> and that becomes a balancing act to maintain value ... but land ... well they just aint making any more of it! <except around Singapore! ... and that's not land I want!>

I am sitting on land back home for when I am actually old enough to retire <not that I have worked in the last 4 years ... but hey!>

[gharknes]

[

"""Pattaya Bashers efforts to ruin the town's reputation,"""

isn't that a laugh, I think Pattaya does very well all by itself and is getting worse, and BTW we only see maybe 60% of the shootings etc, the rest don't get to the media.

Any opportunity to have another bash.

So you think 60 % of the shootings get reported in Bangkok or anywhere else in Thailand? If anything, more get reported here than most places.

In 2001 the Thai Police said there were over 5,000 murders in LOS. Someone the other day quoted a figure of 20,000 last year. Who knows? - but for sure its many thousands. Even one per week in Thailand's second largest city pales in comparison with the real number that are killed nationwide.

Personally I am very happy with what I paid for the Mobi mansion and I don't give a toss what happens to the housing market.

I am very happy here - and plan to stay till I die - and I'm sure it won't be at the end of a barrell.

'Mobi D'Ark' tell me if I'm wrong on this one..........

you have a business interest in Pattaya...............nuff said

[gharknes]

The Pattaya property market is not typical of property markets that you may find else where. You may get a levelling off of prices now and again but sellers and those wishing to rent their properties are constantly testing the boundaries and pushing the envelope in as far as they can increase their sale price or rental yield. This in turn forces the herd to follow suit which is why you see some ridiculously high sale and rental prices quoted. All in all good news if you are already a property owner but unfortunate if you are trying to buy.

That said, if you look hard enough there are bargains every week for those that study the market and become familiar with the prices in each area. There is always some destitute person that needs to sell quick to realise the cash for one reason or another. Going back to their home country, run out of money, probate, trouble with the Police etc. We probably read about them on this forum from time to time. Though they are not actually selling their house or condo if you know what I mean at the time of reading.

BTW, I have absolutely no affiliation with any Estate Agent. I could insert the following adjectives here: ..... ...... ..... ..... ..... to give my opinion of them but would rather not take a holiday, thanks.

I agree with Mobi's sentiments above: ‘I can't see the market going anywhere but up in the medium to long term. Deapite (sic) all the Pattaya Bashers efforts to ruin the town's reputation, it is still a very highly desirable place to live in or holiday in, with its proximity to BKK and even closer proximity to the new airport, its beaches, nightlife, expat community / infrastructure etc etc. (5 million visitors a year can't be wrong)’.

The only proviso I would add is if there is another big economic crash such as in 1997, then that would perhaps see a major correction as everyone becomes jittery with the uncertain landscape (no pun intended). That is indeed not an unlikely scenario. When, though, is a more difficult prediction. If only I had crystal balls. Nah!, on reflection, the ones I have serve their purpose quite sufficiently.

In the final analysis and to answer the OP. Start studying the market and you will no doubt, given patience find what you are looking for at the right price. The right price of course is what you are willing and consider comfortable paying.

what is this "pattaya bashers crap" if I have an opinion about pattaya I will express it because I have every right too, I live here and intend to do so for a long time, if the crime rate for specific crime i.e. violent and gun crime is becoming more prevelent then I want to talk about it, I am no stranger to guns living in N.Ireland all my life - i don't want to see the place I chose to retire go down the toilet, if you think hiding the truth about happenings in pattaya is a good thing then it will just get worse and more people will get killed or injured, i would like to see tourism take a hit for a while then see what effort the mayor and authorities take to get the guns and the violence off the streets, a fundamental review of policing and law enforcement is way over due, foreigners need to feel 100% safe when they come here for a holiday.

[Phil Conners]

Our village with ~50 houses was completed in 2005 and all houses sold by the developer - but most apparently to speculators who immediately put the houses for sale jacked up about a million each. Not one has been sold so far so only about 10-15 houses are currently occupied lending the village a bit of ghost town status - which of course does not help the sales.

[Mobi]

what is this "pattaya bashers crap" if I have an opinion about pattaya I will express it because I have every right too, I live here and intend to do so for a long time, if the crime rate for specific crime i.e. violent and gun crime is becoming more prevelent then I want to talk about it, I am no stranger to guns living in N.Ireland all my life - i don't want to see the place I chose to retire go down the toilet, if you think hiding the truth about happenings in pattaya is a good thing then it will just get worse and more people will get killed or injured, i would like to see tourism take a hit for a while then see what effort the mayor and authorities take to get the guns and the violence off the streets, a fundamental review of policing and law enforcement is way over due, foreigners need to feel 100% safe when they come here for a holiday.

I will answer you post here, and also copy it to the bashers' thread, as it seems as though nearly every thread in the Pattaya Forum ends up this way.

I think I stated a fact. All this Pattaya bashing is probably having some sort of effect on the property prices. Why? Because a lot of farangs who are interested in buying property in Pattaya, will, at one pooint or another, look for information about the Pattaya property market on the net, and will inevitably find, or stumble across TV forum and read the high preponderance of posts with a propensity to bash Pattaya. Now thats bound to put some pontenial buyers off going ahead and must have some sort of short term effect on prices - probably not major - but a factor never the less.

There are also other factors - even without the bashing, the recent spate of bad news stories will also have a detrimental effect - but when we get the venonmous posts screaming how dirty and evil the place is, well then ...I rest my case.

Now, read carefully.

The above is, in my opinion, a fact. However, even though I have no real idea why people get such a kick out in rubbishing a town that so many people have happily made their home, I would defend to the end their right to say it. I have never said they shouldn't bash Pattaya - if you read my posts you will see that I have actually invited more bashing. The more you bash the more I will defend - that's what this forum is all about - isn't it?

I do however have a problem when we have serious threads, like the tragic death of Steven Parkinson, where it would seem that the bashers just revel in jumping on the band wagon with insulting remarks about the town, which have nothing whatever to do with the OP. In my view its Ok to discuss issues such as: crimes are more likely to happen in a place like Pattaya; farangs sometimes behave in such a manner as to invite violence - etc etc. In other words, as long as its relevant to the crime, then fair enough. But just to post 'one liners' saying 'Pattaya's a shit hole', or words to that effect, when we're discussing a murder, is, in my opinion, overstepping the line and showing disrespect to the friends and family of the victim. That is why I pleaded on four separate occasions for people to make their bashing remarks on other threads. I never said they shouldn't make them, at all.

[Lazy Sod]

I think Mobi is right, the negative news and reputation about Pattaya is a factor. I have a couple of very rich friends who already own a few properties in Thailand, and they will not consider buying anything in Pattaya due to both its reputation and their personal experiences. They prefer Hua Hin in particular (which is still booming from what I here). I think Pattaya could go either way, it could become one of the premier resorts in Asia, with the new airport and more hotels like the Sheraton opening, or it could become an embarrasment to say you live there. The fact today is that Pattaya is avoided by most foreign couples visiting Thailand because it has large numbers of whores, and large numbers of men who go there mainly for the whores. Don't jump on me for saying this, you know it's true. I'll admit I was also one of those men, so I'm not judging anyone.

In my opinion, if the authorities enforced zoning, with the naughty bars restricted to around walking street I think Pattaya could boom. Red light districts are fine but when a whole town is allowed to become one it gets a bit much for most people.

Back to topic, I think the property market has peaked and there may be some bargains on the horizon in the next few months or years, but I realise I could be wrong so feel free to contradict me.

[jdinasia]

I think Mobi is right, the negative news and reputation about Pattaya is a factor. I have a couple of very rich friends who already own a few properties in Thailand, and they will not consider buying anything in Pattaya due to both its reputation and their personal experiences. They prefer Hua Hin in particular (which is still booming from what I here) <HH is just starting to pick up .. over the next few years it MAY "boom">. I think Pattaya could go either way, it could become one of the premier resorts in Asia, with the new airport and more hotels like the Sheraton opening, or it could become an embarrasment to say you live there. The fact today is that Pattaya is avoided by most foreign couples visiting Thailand because it has large numbers of whores, and large numbers of men who go there mainly for the whores. Don't jump on me for saying this, you know it's true. I'll admit I was also one of those men, so I'm not judging anyone.

In my opinion, if the authorities enforced zoning, with the naughty bars restricted to around walking street I think Pattaya could boom. Red light districts are fine but when a whole town is allowed to become one it gets a bit much for most people.

Back to topic, I think the property market has peaked and there may be some bargains on the horizon in the next few months or years, but I realise I could be wrong so feel free to contradict me.

First .... Mobi thinks that TV "pattaya bashers" afftect the poperty market there?

Edited May 10, 2006 by jdinasia

[gharknes]

'Mobi D'Ark' tell me if I'm wrong on this one..........

you have a business interest in Pattaya...............nuff said

Well Mister gharknes, my initial reaction was not to demean myself by responding to your nasty little implication that I have some ulterior – business – motive in defending Pattaya.

But on second thoughts, just so that other members who may not be familiar with my regular posting and in consequence might be taken in by your insidious remarks, I will now state unequivocally, that I am a retired gentleman, and that I live here in Pattaya with my wife and step son, and I have absolutely no business interests whatsoever in Pattaya, or anywhere else in this fair land, for that matter.

If you are a gentleman, which seems unlikely, I trust you will have to good manners to apologise for making such an unsubstantiated slur on my character.

Is that ‘nuff said’ for you, Mister gharknes?

"slur on my character"

sorry that you see it thay way, i don't

your defence of pattaya is admirable but i think you need to remove the blinkers and start to pay attention to what is going on around you, how on earth can you defend it, sorry if i offended, just giving my opinion, something needs to be done now before we end up with no tourists and lots of dead people.

[suiging]

Gentlemen, first post so be nice. living in the East for over twenty years, I had visited the fair city on many occasions with the lads for golf and all the bits that go with it. I never dreamed for one second I would invest in the city for all the negative reasons which will take too long to repeat. Instead, being a contract worker, I chanced the arm and invested in the UK and did very nicely thank you out of what some on here would describe as " Shitholes ", not being in the enviable position of having the filthy luca for the London market. To my suprise, a couple of years ago having a beer, being extremely well looked after by the friendly staff of a bar in walking street, I changed my mind.

For the same reasons "The shitholes " in the UK had turned it around, I had another look at Pattaya. The new airport, hospitals, schools, golf, horseriding and the like, coupled with the growth of the port and Chon Buri, got me to look at the prices here and those in the other resorts in this fair country. The percentage difference was much the same as many areas in the UK used to be from the so called hotspots. The prices in these areas have never matched the lucky South East, nor will they, but in percentage terms the gap has narrowed ( Fhuket/Pattaya.......mmmmmm)

To my mind it will take some years ( not too many please) and a complete change in government attitude to turn the place around, however, it will happen. The fundementals remain and as the infra-structure develops, as it undoubtedly will to furnish the airport, Pattaya to my mind is not a bad punt.

In the coming year airline regulations accross Asia are to be revamped. In short, as with Singapore, Hong Kong and the like will soon have budget airlines offering cheap seats into BK at a fraction of today's cost. If any of you have ever seen the number of golfers who thrash their way over the border into Southern China to pay double or triple the price for a round on a regular basis, paying transport fees which often work out more expensive than the existing flights to BK, you will get an idea of what this could potentially mean. Yes, crime and &lt;deleted&gt; remain in the near term, thank goodness they do, else we would all be paying ######et prices as we speak. Crime in Southern China is horrific, yet still the chinese middle classes pour in for their weekly golf fix. In addition you only have to look at what these people spend in Macau to get an idea of the sort of money they could bring here if and hopefully when, the plunge into this market is taken in Pattaya

The market pressure from the well healed Asian golfer/traveller will eventually tell. J Bloggs from his two bedder in town, complaing to the authorities, sadly does not work here ( it should..................but it doesn't ), or for that matter anywhere in Asia. Money talks, the owners of the Shereton Group and the other major chains looking at the city are no mugs and plan for the future. In short be positive, remain calm and look forward to brighter days, which I for one believe are in the medium term a racing certainty, as long as a major political or financial breakdown can be avoided.

[Lazy Sod]

A great first post suiging, you highlight some interesting issues which I had not considered.

[Pattaya_Fox]

I think that his problem is that the bar that ` he is not associated with` is not doing very well.

gharknes it`s the location old chap......bad spot.......many bars and clubs failed down that soi.....and with all the building work going on and the possible closure again of the soi I would suggest you relocate, soften the name of the place......after all who wants to drink in a place where the name suggests that you will be attacked or be bitten or ripped off by a beast of the seas

[snoophound]

Its all about sexy women and exchange rates.

Its all good right now.

I think that his problem is that the bar that ` he is not associated with` is not doing very well.

gharknes it`s the location old chap......bad spot.......many bars and clubs failed down that soi.....and with all the building work going on and the possible closure again of the soi I would suggest you relocate, soften the name of the place......after all who wants to drink in a place where the name suggests that you will be attacked or be bitten or ripped off by a beast of the seas

[yarpy]

Is the Pattaya property market going tits up? YES. MASSIVE OVERBUILDING AND NO INVESTMENT IN INFRASTRUCTURE. Next question?

[meadish_sweetball]

Cut out the flaming. Make your points gentlemen, and stay on topic.

Read through your post twice. Delete the flames and whatever is unrelated to the topic.

[Lazy Sod]

I've been looking at available properties on the website of fairproperties.com for over a year. The list of properties for sale is growing fast, for example in the "Houses for Sale" section there are now 7 pages with 50 second hand houses on each page (that's 350 houses for sale . The site is updated every few days with more and more properties for sale. They seem to maintain the site well, and regularly remove sold properties. The "Condo" section is even bigger, with 400 for sale.

The sellers do not seem to be lowering their asking prices. . .yet , I think it's teetering on the brink and could be going tits up soon. I'm in no hurry to buy and so I think I'll wait a while.

[Pakboong]

I am not going to bash Pattaya for many reasons but mostly, because I have chosen to live here and have done so for 4 years. My first trip to the city was in 1973 so I have perspective on this apparent growth. Driving around Pattaya there are thousands of empty condos and many hundred empty houses. There are entire villages of new construction with hundreds of homes unoccupied. Somebody got some strange news that thousands of Farangs with big families would be landing at any moment. These developments are everywhere you look. The typical Farang does not arrive here with a family of 12 rather, by himself where he may pick up a family on the way. There is something quite strange about this building boom and I can't tell you what it is. I only know, there is no real demand for these houses. As infrastructures fail, and they have to fail, there will likely be a domino effect. I plan to buy a home here but I am trying to be patient. I fear mostly the multiple failures of the infrastructures of these villages. There is not enough water, electricity, telephone lines and management for these infrastructures not to fail let alone that there are no where near enough buyers.

[Mobi]

I've been looking at available properties on the website of fairproperties.com for over a year. The list of properties for sale is growing fast, for example in the "Houses for Sale" section there are now 7 pages with 50 second hand houses on each page (that's 350 houses for sale . The site is updated every few days with more and more properties for sale. They seem to maintain the site well, and regularly remove sold properties. The "Condo" section is even bigger, with 400 for sale.

The sellers do not seem to be lowering their asking prices. . .yet , I think it's teetering on the brink and could be going tits up soon. I'm in no hurry to buy and so I think I'll wait a while.

I sort of suspected something like this would happen for quite a while. I'm not looking to buy so I won't trawl through the ads, but as a matter of interest, what sort of price range are most of the houses in, and are they mainly on estates?

The amount of building I've seen around the other side of the lake is incredible, and they all seem to be crammed on estates - some small and some quite grand, but estates never the less. I suspect the upper end of the market (for which there is much less demand anyway) will be less affected by the present glut. There was a guy who was looking to buy earlier this year who trawled through almost every housing estate in Pattaya and finally bought a 'stand-alone' bungalow on a fair sized plot of land not too far from me. He didn't like the house much, but couldn't stand to be boxed in on the estates, and as he has as bit of cash - the house has 'potential'.

Back in the Asian financial crash, I bought a 4 bed house on a very large estate in Bang Saen, for a snip - not only did the owner sell at a rock bottom price, but I benefitted from very favourable exchange rate. The estate had some very nice houses on it (including mine), but for a number of years the place looked very sorry for itself, with a lot of empty properties, and people desperate to sell. These days, it's boom time again, and the place is full up with wealthy Thais, and quite a few farangs and the prices have doubled.

If that can happen in Bang Saen, it can certainly happen here, and I think its only a matter of time before the market stabilises, and surges ahead once more. Whether it will take one, two or three years, I wouldn't like to predict.

I would however predict that the Mabprachan area - particularly on the Pong side, will eventually become quite a desirable area to live, with its proximity to the lake, restaurants etc, and a number of delightful Thai viollages, where life goes on at a normal Thai pace, unaffected by the shenanikins in Pattaya proper, which is only 15 mins drive down the road.

I never thought I would say this, but thank you, Meadish, a clean up on this thread was way overdue.