Thai PM rejects protest demands in national address

[lemoncake]

How is that any different to what Thailand has now?

Look to some examples we have in the world of ultra nationalist government (dictatorship?).

Then think once applied to Thailand, how will make this country so nice towards us foreigners living and working here....

Here is the difference.

The perfect thing would be the intervention of someone loved by all Thai people, make a government with people who knows how to deal with the Country problems, not connected to the Elite, and ready to make the interest of every social layer.

Yep, I am dreaming... But sure Yingluck and Suthep are what is worst for Thailand now.

I had sympathy for Abhisit, but he is clearly a puppet as Yingluck is.

Singapore sometimes referred to as dictatorship and look how well they are doing.

Democracy and all that is our principals which we brought into Thailand.

Thailand may not be ready for it and may be should not be forced into something which not only its not ready for, but also does not even grasp the meaning of it.

Just look at what good its done for other "colonized" countries or nations.

Aboriginals, were taken out and thrown 100-500 years into the future, causing a huge social problem.

Africa, MIddle East another great example.

[newcomer71]

Singapore sometimes referred to as dictatorship and look how well they are doing.

Democracy and all that is our principals which we brought into Thailand.

Thailand may not be ready for it and may be should not be forced into something which not only its not ready for, but also does not even grasp the meaning of it.

Just look at what good its done for other "colonized" countries or nations.

Aboriginals, were taken out and thrown 100-500 years into the future, causing a huge social problem.

Africa, MIddle East another great example.

I am talking about ultra nationalists, not just plain dictatorship (that is anyway more than despicable).

[michaeljordan]

There is ONLY ONE real way to solve this without violence and that is by both sides agreeing to follow the mandate of the people that happens in elections.

What? The side that has say by and caused or at least enjoyed over 19 coups is not interested in Democracy?

We know that.

That is why I laugh when I see political propaganda from the one side saying it needs to overthrow the government for the people.

The reason the one side does not want elections is because they will lose.

No group has MORE money to buy votes than does the group crying for a new government now. They are not upset about vote buying. NO--they are simply angry that no amount of threats and vote buying on their side seems to quiet the poor from the countryside who vote against them time after time.

Someday in the future, the younger Thai people will change things but for now, the older Thai people simply play the same games over and over again with the same circular results.

The masses vote in a government of their choice. The ruling elite then attacks it and does a coup. The Coups have been simple since the ruling elite groups own the generals, the media, and the companies. It is all a joke.

ONLY when the people go Candi in the streets will this stupid sick cycle end. A few million Reds standing in the streets of Bangkok would likely change things forever.

The Yellows better be careful--a true radical could take over on the Red side and use other ways to put down the Yellow coup group/

But for you who are yelling and crying on the side saying Taksan has the money? Do you know what a joke that is? HUGE money on the other side makes Taksan and his group look like poor in comparison. They are poor.

BUT--they are the majority and if they were to go Ghandi as I say--they would crush the other group by shutting down the economy.

Good luck all.

Stay away from the violence and live to enjoy life my Thai friends.

The Yellows will not win in the end.

[bigbamboo]

Just accept the PM´s offer to dissolve the house and call for new elections. And let the new campaign be centered around will to stop corruption and abuse of power. Enforce the laws and jail everyone who can be proved to be corrupt.

The idea of an election centering on ending corruption and the abuse of power is a wonderful concept. Unfortunately the chances of that happening are practically zero as the opportunities for corruption and abuse of power are the two primary reason most Thais get into politics anyway. It's hardly the salary and I doubt most have even heard of altruism.

[Emptyset]

I keep hearing that Puea Thai bought votes during the last election. Where is the evidence of that? Or is that also just BS?

I realize you've only been a member of this forum since a little before 5 pm, but if you go back and search through TV you'll find all the evidence you need. Not to mention Youtube and BP--although you'll need BP's pay service to access their older articles.

I'm sure PT did buy votes, as did the Democrats. Not sure how going back through the Bangkok Post archives will tell you much about this, unless you have any specific articles in mind. And if there's videos of MPs or canvassers buying votes on youtube, then it should be send to the ECT and that candidate should be disqualified.

[khunsiam]

So why Madam Prime Minister are you still clinging to power like mistletoe to an oak tree?

To be honest you are nothing more than the proxy clinging to power for your objectionable brother. He like you has no concern for the damage caused to Thailand and its peoples physically in body counts and injuries and financially.

Regarding democracy, we all know what your brothers views are on that subject, he doesn't believe in it as his comments and actions have proved over the last decade or so.

You are a public servant, act like one. Face up to reality, the public have judged your puppet government and your puppet master brother and have indeed found you wanting .

The public are not here to serve you and your family's interests nor your brown nosing acolytes interests either.

So resign.

Using your logic every leader in the free world should step down as all are beholding to lobbyist etc.

You say as a public servant she should listen to a small fraction of the people instead of the greater

majority who elected her & step down?

Folks who believe the screaming of a relatively small mob ( compared to 70 million population)

May think as you do but,

#1 not our call

#2 Not the small mobs call either

If you read Thai go look at the major Thai sites & forums.

There you will see little to no support for this disrespectful mob & mainly

calls for a firmer hand dealing with this mob & returning the city to a place of order.

The majority speaking there feel when you attack the elected government & seize govt buildings

you are in fact attacking Thailand.

As a non Thai it is not my fight but I am amazed at so many so called

enlightened & advanced folks who come from so called democratic societies calling

for an overthrow of a democratically elected government. They also make snide remarks

about what a terribly run government this country has, how Thai's do not know what democracy is

& yet they call for an overthrow & this is where they choose to live?

Who more the fool?

I was today calling our office in Bangkok and also 80% of our staffs don't like PTP they said they no longer go on the streets as they no longer are associated to Suthep as they remember the red shirt rally several years back. My friend said that now it's the Southern people that battle the police on the streets and the Bangkok office staffs left long time ago. Our CEO also distributed an internal email tat nobody should get involved in the street protest during lunch. Our office near Police HQ now handles mainly the responses from tour companies overseas that want to cancel their trip to Thailand.

I asked him why don't you go to the streets and all my friend said was that he has to work and make money (work). The people's now on the streets have no permanent jobs and they are hired thugs from the South. This time its the hired thugs from the South so may be next year it's the hired thugs from the North.

True, the main language in front of Government house is the southern dialect.

[smedly]

with reference to the OP - IMO these directives are coming from Dubai, it's a very nice position to be in, giving orders and being completely disconnected from the fallout, the unfortunate thing is that it is very easy to just remain in denial and keep saying no which is exactly why Thailand gets itself into these situations

If what transpired the last few weeks had happened to any government in the west they would have done the honourable thing and stepped down - unfit for purpose, but in Thailand it takes huge demonstrations to force the government to do what they should have already done and step down, PTP have made such a mess that in all honesty how can they continue, it is quite unbelievable that they just bury their heads in the sand and continue as if there's nothing going on, it reminds me of a cartoon with the character holding a grenade 10 secs later - boooom, the choices were don't remove the pin but if you do drop it and run

Is it really going to take the military to step in here and make the right choice for them, is it any wonder there are so many coup's here, it's just a pity that you know who wasn't a bit younger and was able to step in and sort this crap out as has happened in the past, not going to mention who I'm referring too so you'll have to guess

[bander]

"

"Thai PM rejects protest demands in national address"

Correction: Thaksin rejects protest demands in national address !

[Thait Spot]

Gosh there are a huge amount of progovernment newbies on here

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[GeorgeO]

Too little, too late . . . they've lost all credibility and this won't end now until they are all out and the process of "building a democracy" starts all over again with more checks and balances and less legal grey areas.

You're right. Had she stepped down several weeks ago, she would have had greater legitimacy to call for new elections with a (slim) chance of victory. Now, beaten and battered, she has no right to call for anything except safe passage somewhere, probably Dubai I would think.

The Red Shirts (and particularly their hateful, vociferous leaders, such as Jatuporn, who has not been since Friday) saw the writing on the wall before she did, and have high-tailed it already. They were astute enough, finally, to realise that the cause that these people are fighting for is far stronger than the THB 1,000 note that their opponents were 'earning'.

There are still some "ifs" included in her "willingness" to step down, but they are going to be ignored. She will be told that what happens next is none of her concern, and that she must simply pack up and go. The ball with then be in Suthep's court, and it is incumbent upon him to show that he really is "poacher turned gamekeeper".

If he makes any attempt at simply taking over where Thaksin left off, without any real effort towards bringing this country back on track, then the people who helped him to victory will be exactly the same people who will also see him ousted. People power has the upper hand right now...!!

[GeorgeO]

Are you truly advocating cheque book democracy?

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Not at all but it's not about me but about the Thai people. If they want to get some extra income why not. They have to listen for hours what those political parties have to say and listen for weeks those loud speakers from the pickup trucks so if they want to make a few hundred Baht out of it who cares. On the end when they vote they vote for the party they believe can help them most but the Democrat Party just isn't on the list. Maybe PTP, Chat Thai, Bhumjaithai or even Chat Pattana but certainly not the party from Suthep as they didn't give shix for the last 50 years since they have been a party.

After all I am not voting in the Thai election but my Mrs is not taking money in the election as I would be offended, but then again she doesn't need that few hundred Baht. She actually told me she dont want to vote again as she is tired. When she saw that crazy guy from Surat Thani and all the battles with the police on the TV her first reaction was why nobody stops this guy. I say this is Thai politics

Let me get this straight, you believe that it is perfectly acceptable for Thais to accept payment for their votes, but if your Thai wife accepted payment you would be offended ...?! Is that an example of Thai logic that you have picked up over the years?

[jackrich]

Too little, too late . . . they've lost all credibility and this won't end now until they are all out and the process of "building a democracy" starts all over again with more checks and balances and less legal grey areas.

You're right. Had she stepped down several weeks ago, she would have had greater legitimacy to call for new elections with a (slim) chance of victory. Now, beaten and battered, she has no right to call for anything except safe passage somewhere, probably Dubai I would think.

The Red Shirts (and particularly their hateful, vociferous leaders, such as Jatuporn, who has not been since Friday) saw the writing on the wall before she did, and have high-tailed it already. They were astute enough, finally, to realise that the cause that these people are fighting for is far stronger than the THB 1,000 note that their opponents were 'earning'.

There are still some "ifs" included in her "willingness" to step down, but they are going to be ignored. She will be told that what happens next is none of her concern, and that she must simply pack up and go. The ball with then be in Suthep's court, and it is incumbent upon him to show that he really is "poacher turned gamekeeper".

If he makes any attempt at simply taking over where Thaksin left off, without any real effort towards bringing this country back on track, then the people who helped him to victory will be exactly the same people who will also see him ousted. People power has the upper hand right now...!!

What are you smoking?

Why does she have to go? She has been democratically elected my a great majority.

The anarchist mob is a small minority, with 50,000 people on a good Sunday, much less during the week and in the past days, as they have clearly lost support big time. Thailand has over 50,000,000 (yes, 50 million) people. If the real majority come out on the streets, it will look very differently.

You are brainwashed into thinking that Suthe's so called "people power" is democracy. And if Suthep tells you that he has the "upper hand" you are in for a big awakening very soon.

[tezzainoz]

"Anything I can do to make people happy, I am willing to do...."

Bless.

But she's leaving herself wide open with that line.

Why are so many people so blind

The only reason she says she will disolve parliment is because the protestors have made it clear that is not enought

Thaskin has called their bluff and the protestors are letting him get away with it

a smart person would say okay, and take the first step to achieve somethin

all or nothing is the best way to loose the peoples backing

If she goes back on her word and does not disolve parliment it will show Thailand what a lier she is

so reverse the tables and call her bluff

to win a war, you need to win 1 battle at a time

[jackrich]

She's not a liar. She's smart. She called Suthep's bluff and agreed to dissolve parliament. Suthep has not accepted it which shows that elections are not his goal, but in reality he wants to grab power under his "people's council" which are individuals that are appointed by him and will do as he says.

Yingluck knows that if new elections are called, she will win again, because the people of Thailand will vote for her again, as they have done before. Suthep is in a lose-lose situation and total anarchy is his only way out.

[GeorgeO]

Too little, too late . . . they've lost all credibility and this won't end now until they are all out and the process of "building a democracy" starts all over again with more checks and balances and less legal grey areas.

You're right. Had she stepped down several weeks ago, she would have had greater legitimacy to call for new elections with a (slim) chance of victory. Now, beaten and battered, she has no right to call for anything except safe passage somewhere, probably Dubai I would think.

The Red Shirts (and particularly their hateful, vociferous leaders, such as Jatuporn, who has not been since Friday) saw the writing on the wall before she did, and have high-tailed it already. They were astute enough, finally, to realise that the cause that these people are fighting for is far stronger than the THB 1,000 note that their opponents were 'earning'.

There are still some "ifs" included in her "willingness" to step down, but they are going to be ignored. She will be told that what happens next is none of her concern, and that she must simply pack up and go. The ball with then be in Suthep's court, and it is incumbent upon him to show that he really is "poacher turned gamekeeper".

If he makes any attempt at simply taking over where Thaksin left off, without any real effort towards bringing this country back on track, then the people who helped him to victory will be exactly the same people who will also see him ousted. People power has the upper hand right now...!!

What are you smoking?

Why does she have to go? She has been democratically elected my a great majority.

The anarchist mob is a small minority, with 50,000 people on a good Sunday, much less during the week and in the past days, as they have clearly lost support big time. Thailand has over 50,000,000 (yes, 50 million) people. If the real majority come out on the streets, it will look very differently.

You are brainwashed into thinking that Suthe's so called "people power" is democracy. And if Suthep tells you that he has the "upper hand" you are in for a big awakening very soon.

I don't smoke Jack...!

She was 'democratically elected', as you put it, through rampant vote-buying, and not by a great majority, but by 48% of the 'popular vote', so not even a simple majority. Thaksin even had the gall to exhibit himself on film handing money out to them, although he would, of course, have people believe that he was being magnanimous, as opposed to encouraging specific voting behaviour.

I wish all of you Red apologists would stop hiding behind this so called 'democratically elected' tag without taking into consideration what they have been up to during the past two years.

If any government in the world - even one which had been truly democratically elected, (i.e., under a clean, fair, one-person one-vote system, with no vote-buying) - had sought to rape and pillage the economy in the way that the Shin clan has, they would have been brought down within the first six months. Any attempt at remaining in power would have led to impeachment, suspension from political office and potential imprisonment.

Thailand's current population is actually 69.5 million (yes, 69.5 million) and a good Sunday saw 180,000 people on the streets protesting against this government, so you need to try to keep up a little. And what do you know about what constitutes the 'real majority' these days? Jatuporn has a better grasp of this than you do, because he decided it was time to cut and run and send the remnants of his Red Shirt mob back home.

Anyone seen or heard anything from Jatuporn since last Friday?

I consider myself very fortunate, in that I stand on the side of what's good, right and proper, and if someone has brainwashed me into that mode of thinking, then well done to them (I can only assume that it is attributable to my 22 years of strong discipline in the British Armed Forces).

For your information, I do not recognise Suthep's true credentials; however, as I posted earlier, I sincerely hope that he is 'poacher turned gamekeeper', but if he isn't, then he will be brought down by the people power that we are now witnessing in the same way that the current government will surely be.

Prepare to be awakened Jack....!!

[Tatsujin]

Really interesting to see all the "new" (ish) members chipping in with their all lowercase names and numbers on the end to support the Govt. Seemed to happen right after the Govt announced their new propaganda arm was active. Interesting.

[newcomer71]

Really interesting to see all the "new" (ish) members chipping in with their all lowercase names and numbers on the end to support the Govt. Seemed to happen right after the Govt announced their new propaganda arm was active. Interesting.

Having a nickname all lowercase and with a number at the end of it (71 is my year of birth, just to enlighten people around), I anyway don't support the government, despising equally the Shin clan, and the delirium of Suthep.

Hence I guess the post wasn't referred to me

Hope that I made my position clear, once for all

[Tatsujin]

Really interesting to see all the "new" (ish) members chipping in with their all lowercase names and numbers on the end to support the Govt. Seemed to happen right after the Govt announced their new propaganda arm was active. Interesting.

Having a nickname all lowercase and with a number at the end of it (71 is my year of birth, just to enlighten people around), I anyway don't support the government, despising equally the Shin clan, and the delirium of Suthep.

Hence I guess the post wasn't referred to me

Hope that I made my position clear, once for all

We all know who the pro and anti Govt supporters are on here, and those who are "neutral". I'm with you on the "despising equally" part, all crooks, all corrupt, all out to feather their own nests. I'm still on the lookout for supporters for my new "Thai Rak Farang" party however if there are any takers?

[jackrich]

Too little, too late . . . they've lost all credibility and this won't end now until they are all out and the process of "building a democracy" starts all over again with more checks and balances and less legal grey areas.

You're right. Had she stepped down several weeks ago, she would have had greater legitimacy to call for new elections with a (slim) chance of victory. Now, beaten and battered, she has no right to call for anything except safe passage somewhere, probably Dubai I would think.

The Red Shirts (and particularly their hateful, vociferous leaders, such as Jatuporn, who has not been since Friday) saw the writing on the wall before she did, and have high-tailed it already. They were astute enough, finally, to realise that the cause that these people are fighting for is far stronger than the THB 1,000 note that their opponents were 'earning'.

There are still some "ifs" included in her "willingness" to step down, but they are going to be ignored. She will be told that what happens next is none of her concern, and that she must simply pack up and go. The ball with then be in Suthep's court, and it is incumbent upon him to show that he really is "poacher turned gamekeeper".

If he makes any attempt at simply taking over where Thaksin left off, without any real effort towards bringing this country back on track, then the people who helped him to victory will be exactly the same people who will also see him ousted. People power has the upper hand right now...!!

What are you smoking?

Why does she have to go? She has been democratically elected my a great majority.

The anarchist mob is a small minority, with 50,000 people on a good Sunday, much less during the week and in the past days, as they have clearly lost support big time. Thailand has over 50,000,000 (yes, 50 million) people. If the real majority come out on the streets, it will look very differently.

You are brainwashed into thinking that Suthe's so called "people power" is democracy. And if Suthep tells you that he has the "upper hand" you are in for a big awakening very soon.

I don't smoke Jack...!

She was 'democratically elected', as you put it, through rampant vote-buying, and not by a great majority, but by 48% of the 'popular vote', so not even a simple majority. Thaksin even had the gall to exhibit himself on film handing money out to them, although he would, of course, have people believe that he was being magnanimous, as opposed to encouraging specific voting behaviour.

I wish all of you Red apologists would stop hiding behind this so called 'democratically elected' tag without taking into consideration what they have been up to during the past two years.

If any government in the world - even one which had been truly democratically elected, (i.e., under a clean, fair, one-person one-vote system, with no vote-buying) - had sought to rape and pillage the economy in the way that the Shin clan has, they would have been brought down within the first six months. Any attempt at remaining in power would have led to impeachment, suspension from political office and potential imprisonment.

Thailand's current population is actually 69.5 million (yes, 69.5 million) and a good Sunday saw 180,000 people on the streets protesting against this government, so you need to try to keep up a little. And what do you know about what constitutes the 'real majority' these days? Jatuporn has a better grasp of this than you do, because he decided it was time to cut and run and send the remnants of his Red Shirt mob back home.

Anyone seen or heard anything from Jatuporn since last Friday?

I consider myself very fortunate, in that I stand on the side of what's good, right and proper, and if someone has brainwashed me into that mode of thinking, then well done to them (I can only assume that it is attributable to my 22 years of strong discipline in the British Armed Forces).

For your information, I do not recognise Suthep's true credentials; however, as I posted earlier, I sincerely hope that he is 'poacher turned gamekeeper', but if he isn't, then he will be brought down by the people power that we are now witnessing in the same way that the current government will surely be.

Prepare to be awakened Jack....!!

Can you show me the proof of the vote buying that you keep mentioning? And remember, it's not proof if it's just in your head. Please, show me the proof. Make me a believer!

Edited December 3, 2013 by jackrich

[smedly]

Too little, too late . . . they've lost all credibility and this won't end now until they are all out and the process of "building a democracy" starts all over again with more checks and balances and less legal grey areas.

You're right. Had she stepped down several weeks ago, she would have had greater legitimacy to call for new elections with a (slim) chance of victory. Now, beaten and battered, she has no right to call for anything except safe passage somewhere, probably Dubai I would think.

The Red Shirts (and particularly their hateful, vociferous leaders, such as Jatuporn, who has not been since Friday) saw the writing on the wall before she did, and have high-tailed it already. They were astute enough, finally, to realise that the cause that these people are fighting for is far stronger than the THB 1,000 note that their opponents were 'earning'.

There are still some "ifs" included in her "willingness" to step down, but they are going to be ignored. She will be told that what happens next is none of her concern, and that she must simply pack up and go. The ball with then be in Suthep's court, and it is incumbent upon him to show that he really is "poacher turned gamekeeper".

If he makes any attempt at simply taking over where Thaksin left off, without any real effort towards bringing this country back on track, then the people who helped him to victory will be exactly the same people who will also see him ousted. People power has the upper hand right now...!!

extremely good post there George and you have it down to a "T"

[GeorgeO]

What are you smoking?

Why does she have to go? She has been democratically elected my a great majority.

The anarchist mob is a small minority, with 50,000 people on a good Sunday, much less during the week and in the past days, as they have clearly lost support big time. Thailand has over 50,000,000 (yes, 50 million) people. If the real majority come out on the streets, it will look very differently.

You are brainwashed into thinking that Suthe's so called "people power" is democracy. And if Suthep tells you that he has the "upper hand" you are in for a big awakening very soon.

I don't smoke Jack...!

She was 'democratically elected', as you put it, through rampant vote-buying, and not by a great majority, but by 48% of the 'popular vote', so not even a simple majority. Thaksin even had the gall to exhibit himself on film handing money out to them, although he would, of course, have people believe that he was being magnanimous, as opposed to encouraging specific voting behaviour.

I wish all of you Red apologists would stop hiding behind this so called 'democratically elected' tag without taking into consideration what they have been up to during the past two years.

If any government in the world - even one which had been truly democratically elected, (i.e., under a clean, fair, one-person one-vote system, with no vote-buying) - had sought to rape and pillage the economy in the way that the Shin clan has, they would have been brought down within the first six months. Any attempt at remaining in power would have led to impeachment, suspension from political office and potential imprisonment.

Thailand's current population is actually 69.5 million (yes, 69.5 million) and a good Sunday saw 180,000 people on the streets protesting against this government, so you need to try to keep up a little. And what do you know about what constitutes the 'real majority' these days? Jatuporn has a better grasp of this than you do, because he decided it was time to cut and run and send the remnants of his Red Shirt mob back home.

Anyone seen or heard anything from Jatuporn since last Friday?

I consider myself very fortunate, in that I stand on the side of what's good, right and proper, and if someone has brainwashed me into that mode of thinking, then well done to them (I can only assume that it is attributable to my 22 years of strong discipline in the British Armed Forces).

For your information, I do not recognise Suthep's true credentials; however, as I posted earlier, I sincerely hope that he is 'poacher turned gamekeeper', but if he isn't, then he will be brought down by the people power that we are now witnessing in the same way that the current government will surely be.

Prepare to be awakened Jack....!!

Can you show me the proof of the vote buying that you keep mentioning? And remember, it's not proof if it's just in your head. Please, show me the proof. Make me a believer!

Jack, it's been out there readily available for years .. do your own research ... but please do try to follow what I'm saying and get beyond this "democratically elected" tag that seems to be the shining light for all you Red apologists.

If you can force yourself to read past my second paragraph you can then try to get a focus on what it is that's really going on out there.

What happened two years ago to get these people into power is of little relevance now, given that they have used their position to enrich themselves, to the detriment of the nation and its people.

This government had to be brought down for the good of the nation...and Suthep will surely follow them if he proves to be nothing more than the next nose in the trough .... !!!

[smedly]

Hey Jackrich - if you read this forum the last few weeks you will see many accounts from Thais that they were offered money for their vote - but at this point that has nothing to do with were we're at

I can't wait to see a team of auditors go in and go through the government books and expose the level of thievery that has taken place the last 2 years - there will be a very large exit, I wonder if we are about to see birth of a new community in Dubai called "little Thailand" with TS as tribal leader.

[meechai]

She was 'democratically elected', as you put it, through rampant vote-buying, and not by a great majority, but by 48% of the 'popular vote', so not even a simple majority.

I notice folks often say things like this.

I am not saying it literally exists as I think it is a very weak excuse.

Millions of Thai's have more money than the expats here yet they are

accused of easily being bought for a few hundred baht??

Even if anyone did in fact take money.. who is looking over their shoulder when they actually vote?

But if you look at one of the major examples of so called Democracy ( USA )

How is it different? That vote is 100% bought by lobbyist & 2 parties

that control it all.

So they buy it thru massive campaign ad's & TV air time. They buy it by holding

debates on TV yet never invite those candidates that could really make a difference since they are

not affiliated with either of the two parties. Yet few of the 300 million actually recognize their name

on the ballot & those that actually do feel it would be a wasted vote since few know how good a president

this person would be.

Greater majority/Simple majority? Many think this seat of supposed democracy in the USA means one man one vote yet if

you look at the Electoral College & how the President of the USA is elected you see it is far from true.

So much for majority's.

Again it is not we the foreigners fight but when I see all these constant accusations by foreigners of democracy

bought & paid for & how it is not "true democracy" I smile. As one side of their mouth wants true democracy

while the other side encourages anarchy.

Because to top it off those making these "need true democracy" claims follow up by supporting an

overthrow by a handful compared to the total population of the current elected officials.

Even when the peoples representatives themselves have also soundly beaten the no confidence vote.

I think this is why folks rhetorically ask what one who makes such claims is smoking

Edited December 3, 2013 by meechai

[hawker9000]

What are you smoking?

Why does she have to go? She has been democratically elected my a great majority.

The anarchist mob is a small minority, with 50,000 people on a good Sunday, much less during the week and in the past days, as they have clearly lost support big time. Thailand has over 50,000,000 (yes, 50 million) people. If the real majority come out on the streets, it will look very differently.

You are brainwashed into thinking that Suthe's so called "people power" is democracy. And if Suthep tells you that he has the "upper hand" you are in for a big awakening very soon.

I don't smoke Jack...!

She was 'democratically elected', as you put it, through rampant vote-buying, and not by a great majority, but by 48% of the 'popular vote', so not even a simple majority. Thaksin even had the gall to exhibit himself on film handing money out to them, although he would, of course, have people believe that he was being magnanimous, as opposed to encouraging specific voting behaviour.

I wish all of you Red apologists would stop hiding behind this so called 'democratically elected' tag without taking into consideration what they have been up to during the past two years.

If any government in the world - even one which had been truly democratically elected, (i.e., under a clean, fair, one-person one-vote system, with no vote-buying) - had sought to rape and pillage the economy in the way that the Shin clan has, they would have been brought down within the first six months. Any attempt at remaining in power would have led to impeachment, suspension from political office and potential imprisonment.

Thailand's current population is actually 69.5 million (yes, 69.5 million) and a good Sunday saw 180,000 people on the streets protesting against this government, so you need to try to keep up a little. And what do you know about what constitutes the 'real majority' these days? Jatuporn has a better grasp of this than you do, because he decided it was time to cut and run and send the remnants of his Red Shirt mob back home.

Anyone seen or heard anything from Jatuporn since last Friday?

I consider myself very fortunate, in that I stand on the side of what's good, right and proper, and if someone has brainwashed me into that mode of thinking, then well done to them (I can only assume that it is attributable to my 22 years of strong discipline in the British Armed Forces).

For your information, I do not recognise Suthep's true credentials; however, as I posted earlier, I sincerely hope that he is 'poacher turned gamekeeper', but if he isn't, then he will be brought down by the people power that we are now witnessing in the same way that the current government will surely be.

Prepare to be awakened Jack....!!

Can you show me the proof of the vote buying that you keep mentioning? And remember, it's not proof if it's just in your head. Please, show me the proof. Make me a believer!

Jack, it's been out there readily available for years .. do your own research ... but please do try to follow what I'm saying and get beyond this "democratically elected" tag that seems to be the shining light for all you Red apologists.

If you can force yourself to read past my second paragraph you can then try to get a focus on what it is that's really going on out there.

What happened two years ago to get these people into power is of little relevance now, given that they have used their position to enrich themselves, to the detriment of the nation and its people.

This government had to be brought down for the good of the nation...and Suthep will surely follow them if he proves to be nothing more than the next nose in the trough .... !!!

'Might as well forget it. Jack expects you to "prove" the vote-buying to him... Like he's a commissioner and you're some sort of official investigator with subpoena-power. Lol. It's the tack voter-fraud defenders always take - they know no one's got such "proof" because voter anonymity totally precludes systematic collection of any such evidence. And then they simply reject out-of-hand even first-hand accounts & news videos such as the one you mention and those posted here and elsewhere. Yes, he could get off his butt and do his own internet research (like there are any shortage of reports & analyses out there on the net, including those actually submitted to the elections committee " to be investigated"), but he'd rather have others list something so he can then devolve the argument into individual he-said-she-saids that don't meet his standard of "proof", which of course can't be met, by definition. There's actually little question of the vote-buying and rent-a-mobs; the only question is to what extent both sides engage in it. I personally doubt ten democrat parties could amass vote-buying and crowd-buying funds sufficient to challenge the man from Dubai's warchest.

[philw]

This an interesting and, in my opinion accurate assessment of how vote buying works in Thailand.

http://asiancorrespondent.com/116697/vote-buying-thaksin-and-the-democrats/

Scroll down to the bottom, the last few sentences are illuminating.

The Thaksin haters on here probably won't be able to stomach it all, as it doesn't reinforce their hatreds and stereotypes, but please do try.

[hawker9000]

Alongkorn, though a party leader, has a reputation as something of a pot-stirrer and "outlier" within the democrat party, does he not? He actually proposed an amnesty bill of his own. I'm not sure his views on vote-buying are all that typical of democrats, as the BP article might lead some to believe. The article overall certainly is interesting and worth a read, but I'm always suspicious of the well-if-HE-thinks-so editorial approach, as I am most polls...

[GeorgeO]

She was 'democratically elected', as you put it, through rampant vote-buying, and not by a great majority, but by 48% of the 'popular vote', so not even a simple majority.

I notice folks often say things like this.

I am not saying it literally exists as I think it is a very weak excuse.

Millions of Thai's have more money than the expats here yet they are

accused of easily being bought for a few hundred baht??

Even if anyone did in fact take money.. who is looking over their shoulder when they actually vote?

But if you look at one of the major examples of so called Democracy ( USA )

How is it different? That vote is 100% bought by lobbyist & 2 parties

that control it all.

So they buy it thru massive campaign ad's & TV air time. They buy it by holding

debates on TV yet never invite those candidates that could really make a difference since they are

not affiliated with either of the two parties. Yet few of the 300 million actually recognize their name

on the ballot & those that actually do feel it would be a wasted vote since few know how good a president

this person would be.

Greater majority/Simple majority? Many think this seat of supposed democracy in the USA means one man one vote yet if

you look at the Electoral College & how the President of the USA is elected you see it is far from true.

So much for majority's.

Again it is not we the foreigners fight but when I see all these constant accusations by foreigners of democracy

bought & paid for & how it is not "true democracy" I smile. As one side of their mouth wants true democracy

while the other side encourages anarchy.

Because to top it off those making these "need true democracy" claims follow up by supporting an

overthrow by a handful compared to the total population of the current elected officials.

Even when the peoples representatives themselves have also soundly beaten the no confidence vote.

I think this is why folks rhetorically ask what one who makes such claims is smoking

I agree with you entirely, apart from the reference once again to smoking(?). I regard the US system as an absolute role model which we (the UK) must avoid at all costs.

I am an active member of 38 Degrees, a UK-based group which actively opposes questionable acts and policies on the part of the British government, the latest of which is the proposed "gagging law", which aims to limit the funds and activities that charitable organisations can use/engage in when opposing such questionable policies, whilst at the same time, placing no restrictions whatsoever on lobbyists and individual backers.

If the gagging bill goes through, we will be heading towards the US system, and soon after that, there is nothing to stop us degenerating into the same sort of shambles that we see here in Thailand.

So, as you see, my stance against corruption, curtailment of freedom of speech, and accountability for all people in positions of trust is not simply limited to the current situation in Thailand.

[jackrich]

'Might as well forget it. Jack expects you to "prove" the vote-buying to him... Like he's a commissioner and you're some sort of official investigator with subpoena-power. Lol. It's the tack voter-fraud defenders always take - they know no one's got such "proof" because voter anonymity totally precludes systematic collection of any such evidence. And then they simply reject out-of-hand even first-hand accounts & news videos such as the one you mention and those posted here and elsewhere. Yes, he could get off his butt and do his own internet research (like there are any shortage of reports & analyses out there on the net, including those actually submitted to the elections committee " to be investigated"), but he'd rather have others list something so he can then devolve the argument into individual he-said-she-saids that don't meet his standard of "proof", which of course can't be met, by definition. There's actually little question of the vote-buying and rent-a-mobs; the only question is to what extent both sides engage in it. I personally doubt ten democrat parties could amass vote-buying and crowd-buying funds sufficient to challenge the man from Dubai's warchest.

Lots of blah blah but again, no proof. Just say it, you have no proof for your allegations. There's nothing wrong with hallucinations, even the greatest madmen of our time have had them.

If I had a bone, I'd throw it for you to go fetch. But I don't have one, so you'll have to find something else to play with.

[rubl]

'Might as well forget it. Jack expects you to "prove" the vote-buying to him... Like he's a commissioner and you're some sort of official investigator with subpoena-power. Lol. It's the tack voter-fraud defenders always take - they know no one's got such "proof" because voter anonymity totally precludes systematic collection of any such evidence. And then they simply reject out-of-hand even first-hand accounts & news videos such as the one you mention and those posted here and elsewhere. Yes, he could get off his butt and do his own internet research (like there are any shortage of reports & analyses out there on the net, including those actually submitted to the elections committee " to be investigated"), but he'd rather have others list something so he can then devolve the argument into individual he-said-she-saids that don't meet his standard of "proof", which of course can't be met, by definition. There's actually little question of the vote-buying and rent-a-mobs; the only question is to what extent both sides engage in it. I personally doubt ten democrat parties could amass vote-buying and crowd-buying funds sufficient to challenge the man from Dubai's warchest.

Lots of blah blah but again, no proof. Just say it, you have no proof for your allegations. There's nothing wrong with hallucinations, even the greatest madmen of our time have had them.

If I had a bone, I'd throw it for you to go fetch. But I don't have one, so you'll have to find something else to play with.

[zydeco]

Gosh there are a huge amount of progovernment newbies on here

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

TS' money and some PR firm in Canada at work, I imagine.