Thailand lagging behind in English

[rumbo1]

There are very many very intelligent Thais , I think the problem is they don't want the majority to be well educated so the elite upper class can continue to be corrupt and control thus protecting their own wealth, you only have to look at some of the comments made about issan people during recent protests. I have a friend teaching English in a public school out here and the average class size is about 60 pupils , compare that to a private school class size.

[DGIE]

I did not see the top 10 in 2013 English Proficiency Index.

[Hecate]

When I was in Vietnam I used to eat breakfast at the same place every day. Some kids noticed this and began chatting me up. One day one of them brought her English book and asked me to help her with it. I did and soon there were eight or nine kids every day waiting for me at the restaurant. I had some materials so we had informal lessons every day. If I did this in Thailand, I would have been arrested and deported.

Only if some self-righteous fellow Farang decided to report you.

Why would I take the chance? If I'm going to go to jail, it'll be for something a lot more exciting than free English lessons. Self-righteous fellow Farang don't seem to be in short supply either.

[billd766]

#55 Thailand

#56 Panama

#57 Kazakhstan

#58 Algeria

#59 Saudi Arabia

#60 Iraq

http://www.ef.co.th/epi/

[Local Drunk]

Walking into a classroom does not make one a teacher and neither does a BA in English or any other study qualify one to teach ESL or any other discipline. Teaching is an art that paints the canvas of confusion with an image of understanding, inspiration, curiosity and individual thought...

Some of the worst teachers I've seen here have been those with the most formal education. They rest on their laurels and books, and preach their lessons rather than teach, so their students learn to fill in the blank correctly but they haven't a clue as to what the sentence means.

Some of the best I've seen are those who are self taught because they've learned to think for themselves and that's knowledge that no degree can share.

I'll rant about the system later...

They're not mutually exclusive, my friend. I have a BA in English, a couple of TESL certificates, and I'm a creative, popular, hard-working teacher who gets excellent results. Some of the worst, most arrogant teachers I have run into are the self-taught variety who think they care more about teaching than someone who has invested time and money in proper training. If you had a degree you would know that getting one involves plenty of independent thinking, and that teaching involves a lot more than filling in blanks.

I never said the two were mutually exclusive. I was making a simple observation based on many years of teaching experience. You however have made the erroneous assumption that I don't have a degree. Furthermore; a degree has little or nothing to do with independent thought. It means you passed a test that someone else has written. Whilst I tend to be a bit caustic in my posts I meant no offense. I don't know you or how you teach and I never mentioned you personally in my post, so don't be so sensitive. If you're a good teacher then you know it, and our job is to get the idea across to the students.

"teaching involves a lot more than filling in blanks" I like that!

Thanks for your response.

Cheers, LD

[Hecate]

When I was in Vietnam I used to eat breakfast at the same place every day. Some kids noticed this and began chatting me up. One day one of them brought her English book and asked me to help her with it. I did and soon there were eight or nine kids every day waiting for me at the restaurant. I had some materials so we had informal lessons every day. If I did this in Thailand, I would have been arrested and deported.

I think this is a big part of what Thailand is doing wrong. I taught English in classrooms in Bangkok for twelve years, but some of my best teaching experiences were in less formal settings, as you described above.

Now I'm too "old" to teach anymore, so I live in Thailand on a retirement visa, which forbids me from working, or even volunteering. I would be happy to do any kind of English teaching for a few hours a week, for money or not; but I dare not because I sure don't want to lose my visa.

There may be others like me who would like to help Thais improve their English, if only they were allowed to.

Sadly, these rules are a manifestation of one of the simple truths of human nature: If you try to control everything, you can't grow. That's harder to teach than English.

There should be a special visa category for English teachers allowing us to work independently, but that would deprive some businessman of his cut, I suppose. I think what will happen instead is that places like Cambodia and Viet Nam will surpass Thailand in terms of development within a few years, and then we will have a comfortable place to live and the opportunity to work part time during retirement.

[scotbeve]

Until the Gov't puts in a real sincere effort to educate the people of Thailand it will be same same. They need to overhaul the education system from the bottom up. Too bad the Gov't relies on uneducated people to vote for them ... so they prefer uneducated citizens. If all the people in Isaan and the northwest were properly educated they would then be too smart to vote for a convicted criminal on the run and his posse of thugs and thieves.

and you HAD to introduce your political view into a thread about language right? as if the opposition did any more for education than the current lot? why not give it a rest

Some people are just hi-so dweebs....but I think this hi-so turd above should really have an inward look at your (binjalin) question...... Correct, if it was up to the opposition, the education would most likely be in bigger decline than it is now. And yes, choff 56, needs a complete overhaul TOP downwards......

[Hecate]

Walking into a classroom does not make one a teacher and neither does a BA in English or any other study qualify one to teach ESL or any other discipline. Teaching is an art that paints the canvas of confusion with an image of understanding, inspiration, curiosity and individual thought...

Some of the worst teachers I've seen here have been those with the most formal education. They rest on their laurels and books, and preach their lessons rather than teach, so their students learn to fill in the blank correctly but they haven't a clue as to what the sentence means.

Some of the best I've seen are those who are self taught because they've learned to think for themselves and that's knowledge that no degree can share.

I'll rant about the system later...

They're not mutually exclusive, my friend. I have a BA in English, a couple of TESL certificates, and I'm a creative, popular, hard-working teacher who gets excellent results. Some of the worst, most arrogant teachers I have run into are the self-taught variety who think they care more about teaching than someone who has invested time and money in proper training. If you had a degree you would know that getting one involves plenty of independent thinking, and that teaching involves a lot more than filling in blanks.

I never said the two were mutually exclusive. I was making a simple observation based on many years of teaching experience. You however have made the erroneous assumption that I don't have a degree. Furthermore; a degree has little or nothing to do with independent thought. It means you passed a test that someone else has written. Whilst I tend to be a bit caustic in my posts I meant no offense. I don't know you or how you teach and I never mentioned you personally in my post, so don't be so sensitive. If you're a good teacher then you know it, and our job is to get the idea across to the students.

"teaching involves a lot more than filling in blanks" I like that!

Thanks for your response.

Cheers, LD

You suggested that you don't have a degree, so I used a conditional tense just in case. I don't know where you got your degree if you have one, but mine involved a lot more than tests. We wrote tons of term papers, our arguments had to be evidence-based and original, and our English had to be near perfect. Getting a proper education is not an indication that you can't think for yourself.

I'm not any more sensitive than you are, and I certainly don't take your words personally. I'm just tired of hearing unqualified "teachers" brag that they care more about their students than others do. Of course there are good and bad of all types, but teachers who disparage education are suspect in my books.

[clockman]

English skills: 55th in the world

Deaths on the road: 3rd in the world

Thailand, you're doing it wrong.

And do not forget, hand gun murders, higher than America!

[diehard60]

I have read 90% of the replies here and you all are correct. The village I live in have teachers that " Teach English" and cannot speak except to say Hi.

There are some good Thai English teachers out there BUT they are far and few.

[NoshowJones]

I think they speak dead good England so I do.

The problem with most English speaking Thais is that they will use 100 words when 20 are enough. It can be easy to understand what they are saying, but not what they mean.

[seajae]

my 14y/o step daughter goes to a private school, her teachers can barely speak english and my daughter cannot understand what I say nor can she answer me in english although she can at times say english words. She is very well educated(just been offered a fully paid scholarship) and goes to night classes 4 nights a week(wants to be a doctor) but she cannot speak english and she doesnt want to as well. I think a lot of it is laziness on their part and the fact that they think english is beneath them because they are taught that Thailand is the best country. Her list of english words sent home from school are not even in the dictionary nor are they close to any words used in english, they are simply made up and these students dont know any better.

[kerrysum]

But, they are 1st in Instagram use and 2nd globally for LINE chat use.

Not sure how some of the foreigners can pretend against the evidence that Thailand is even a reasonably developed country. We can excuse Thais who have been fed their nationalism since birth and most of whom haven't really lived abroad in a more developed country, but educated Westerners? No excuse.

It is a nation that appeals to our senses (sex, food, etc.), but there is not a great deal of things to speak of positively. It's poor in almost every important regard. I would say other than reasonably priced medical care (which is a great achievement for Thailand), it is very poorly developed.

I agree,

Have watched this happen for years in Thailand..... And also in America, with other nationalities... Personally it is a great idea, as I have sponsored some here in America, that they live an English only environment, it helps them so very much.... Takes time, because in all practicality, they speak backwards, as many foreign languages do from other countries, as compared to English mind you..... My own wife was doing great here in the U.S. ,

and then she started hanging around with some Thai's and ka-boosh.... I guess it is in their nature and I understand, they have some words that can not be defined in the English dialect.... so it just takes patience, a whole lot of patience...... Misunderstanding also happens so much.....

Just my opinions......

Merry Christmas to all, , and to all a good night...... Bummer no Christmas emoticons on chart........

[bangon04]

Until the Gov't puts in a real sincere effort to educate the people of Thailand it will be same same. They need to overhaul the education system from the bottom up. Too bad the Gov't relies on uneducated people to vote for them ... so they prefer uneducated citizens. If all the people in Isaan and the northwest were properly educated they would then be too smart to vote for a convicted criminal on the run and his posse of thugs and thieves.

and there is the crux of the matter....

The ones who have the money will continue to buy overseas education, while the buffaloes will keep saluting the flag twice a day.

in 2015 the Thais will still be bluffing it out, keeping their protectionist labour laws any way they can, and postponing whatever they can until they feel "ready" to compete within the AEC - any bets on when that will be?

Meanwhile the rest of ASEAN will overtake them in most things, including Chinese and Japanese investment, until Thailand is left with just the bits they are really good at. And we already know what Thailand is a Hub for....

[seajae]

There are very many very intelligent Thais , I think the problem is they don't want the majority to be well educated so the elite upper class can continue to be corrupt and control thus protecting their own wealth, you only have to look at some of the comments made about issan people during recent protests. I have a friend teaching English in a public school out here and the average class size is about 60 pupils , compare that to a private school class size.

you and your "its the elites fault" group are really pushing shit up hill with this crap. The ones that want the north kept uneducated are thaksin and his cronies so that they can control them, if they get eduction then they will realize they are being lied to and will no longer back the ptp/thaksin. The only way you can keep corruption going is by keeping the people dumb and that is exactly what the ptp are now doing. The elites have nothing to do with it, they are not in govt, the ptp/thaksin are, they are the ones that need to be ridiculed over this, using this for your personal bias and putting it before whats best for the people of Thailand is pretty pathetic really but typical of a thaksin lover.

[NeverSure]

Walking into a classroom does not make one a teacher and neither does a BA in English or any other study qualify one to teach ESL or any other discipline. Teaching is an art that paints the canvas of confusion with an image of understanding, inspiration, curiosity and individual thought...

Some of the worst teachers I've seen here have been those with the most formal education. They rest on their laurels and books, and preach their lessons rather than teach, so their students learn to fill in the blank correctly but they haven't a clue as to what the sentence means.

Some of the best I've seen are those who are self taught because they've learned to think for themselves and that's knowledge that no degree can share.

I'll rant about the system later...

They're not mutually exclusive, my friend. I have a BA in English, a couple of TESL certificates, and I'm a creative, popular, hard-working teacher who gets excellent results. Some of the worst, most arrogant teachers I have run into are the self-taught variety who think they care more about teaching than someone who has invested time and money in proper training. If you had a degree you would know that getting one involves plenty of independent thinking, and that teaching involves a lot more than filling in blanks.

I never said the two were mutually exclusive. I was making a simple observation based on many years of teaching experience. You however have made the erroneous assumption that I don't have a degree. Furthermore; a degree has little or nothing to do with independent thought. It means you passed a test that someone else has written. Whilst I tend to be a bit caustic in my posts I meant no offense. I don't know you or how you teach and I never mentioned you personally in my post, so don't be so sensitive. If you're a good teacher then you know it, and our job is to get the idea across to the students.

"teaching involves a lot more than filling in blanks" I like that!

Thanks for your response.

Cheers, LD

You suggested that you don't have a degree, so I used a conditional tense just in case. I don't know where you got your degree if you have one, but mine involved a lot more than tests. We wrote tons of term papers, our arguments had to be evidence-based and original, and our English had to be near perfect. Getting a proper education is not an indication that you can't think for yourself.

I'm not any more sensitive than you are, and I certainly don't take your words personally. I'm just tired of hearing unqualified "teachers" brag that they care more about their students than others do. Of course there are good and bad of all types, but teachers who disparage education are suspect in my books.

You guys with your teaching degrees drive me nuts. No, your attitudes about your degrees drive me nuts. You spent years studying teaching, but were you taught the latest but flawed methods? Why don't kids learn?

Why are schools in the US failing when they are full of teachers with advanced teaching degrees? Beliefs about teaching have changed radically in the past few decades and I say it's for the worse. Schools suck compared to when I went to school. So do the teachers. So do the teaching methods. Kids aren't learning. I can write circles around the average college student today.

I have a nephew who is very bright and is studying web design technology in college. When he finishes a web site assignment, he emails me the code and I correct his English writing on the web site before he turns it in for a grade. He's hopeless. He'll make a great web site developer and will be able to incorporate a database, cause it to accept credit cards, and many other things, but someone else is going to have to write his text.

School teachers today are far more interested in their unions and their retirement and their striking for higher wages and their "in service" days when they don't teach and traveling to seminars than they are in whether they are actually helping their students to learn. Heck, some of the teachers can't do what they are teaching.

Teaching is a gift just like water painting or playing the piano. You can train and train some people and they'll never get it. Others had very little training but a huge gift and they are pretty good.

There are way too many people running around with a piece of paper and no gift. Way too many. And the schools and the students suffer for it.

[siampolee]

Interesting to see that the English language content programmes on T.V. Lao, Vietnam T.V. AND Myanmar T..V. are all of an exceptionally high standard.A good level of spoken English, news programmes with cartoons for children, interviews and assorted other presentation formats are used to enhance and subtly promote the use of English.

Lao T.V.English presentation news could be better, however the English is far better than the Thai news English presentation.

Vietnam T. V. is first class and Myanmar T.V. has a very high level of English for the children's programmes along with some first rate assorted English and American T.V. programmes as well.

Perhaps if the Thai media groups looked at was being shown elsewhere the English language input and use in Thailand would indeed improve

[poohy]

If yo cor spayke proppa yo cor tek the exam

Yo cum from Dudley?......ar do

Black country boy and proud of it.

[Suffinator]

When will the Thai Government learn and appreciate that being able to say.... "Welcome handsome man", "Me love you long time", "I want go with you." and other such phrases is not a commendable standard of English nor is it useful outside of any bar.

Seriously they need to put off joining AEC for at least the next 100 years as they'll never be able to complete when most other AEC member countries have such an adequate command of the English language.

[kingstonkid]

again........................

[ratcatcher]

When will the Thai Government learn and appreciate that being able to say.... "Welcome handsome man", "Me love you long time", "I want go with you." and other such phrases is not a commendable standard of English nor is it useful outside of any bar.

Seriously they need to put off joining AEC for at least the next 100 years as they'll never be able to complete when most other AEC member countries have such an adequate command of the English language.

The irony is that far more ladies called to the bar are capable of carrying on a simple friendly conversation with a foreigner than most of those who have knelt before a member of the special family to receive a piece of paper. That's why hotel, restaurant and bar workers usually have better English skills because they get to hear and speak the language

Half the problem with Thai students and graduates is they never get a chance to sit down with an English speaking foreigner and just exchange a few pleasantries which helps to break the ice.

Most Thais who have learned some English are terrified of speaking English because they are afraid of making a grammatical or pronunciation error and being laughed at.

Most English speakers trying to converse with a Thai aren't really interested if what they say is grammatically correct or not, as long as it makes some sense and they understand it.

Rather sad really.

[DocN]

When will the Thai Government learn and appreciate that being able to say.... "Welcome handsome man", "Me love you long time", "I want go with you." and other such phrases is not a commendable standard of English nor is it useful outside of any bar.

Seriously they need to put off joining AEC for at least the next 100 years as they'll never be able to complete when most other AEC member countries have such an adequate command of the English language.

The irony is that far more ladies called to the bar are capable of carrying on a simple friendly conversation with a foreigner than most of those who have knelt before a member of the special family to receive a piece of paper. That's why hotel, restaurant and bar workers usually have better English skills because they get to hear and speak the language

Half the problem with Thai students and graduates is they never get a chance to sit down with an English speaking foreigner and just exchange a few pleasantries which helps to break the ice.

Most Thais who have learned some English are terrified of speaking English because they are afraid of making a grammatical or pronunciation error and being laughed at.

Most English speakers trying to converse with a Thai aren't really interested if what they say is grammatically correct or not, as long as it makes some sense and they understand it.

Rather sad really.

...and because there is an incentive fore them, to learn it!

If you are having a "normal" job, where everything is so protected and no farang may ever enter and you may never speak English...what use does it have!

The bar- girls, who learned this, because it is -more or less- essential to talk with your "customers" will be the winner of the ASEAN in Thailand!

...and good for them!

[mikebell]

In my wife's village, Surin. Headmaster hears I had been an English teacher for 38 years and invited me in to visit. Sat awkwardly in his office for ten minutes waiting for his Head of English to arrive. On arrival teacher's first words were: 'Me number one Engrit teach in saccoon.' He took me to his classroom, introduced me to a class of 44 fifteen year olds and buggered off!

[Nemesis7]

Unique country in deed

[farangbanok]

poohy

Black country boy and proud of it.

I used ter live in Brummagem - but I have worked in Woolaston and Gornal amongst other places.

Spent some good nights at JB's and some lecherous ones at the Hen and Chicks at Langley

Nice to see another Midlander on here. I'm in Khon Kaen

I keep telling Thai friends that 15 or 20 km from my home they speak a totally different language. No good morning how are you but How ham yau - which generally causes a lot of merriment - or howmyermamon which took me a week to understand

Still keep up the good work - and support Duddel-lye English

[oxo1947]

No Philippines on the list---------------------amazing, Their English is great.

[lostmebike]

Here we go again.

Dejavu anyone? Or is it just me

[sustento]

But they're not lagging behind in sanuk are they? Would you rather be fluent in a foreign language or be happy?

I think it is spelled 'sanook' .....

The Royal Thai General System which is the official method of rendering Thai language words in the Latin alphabet thinks it's spelled 'sanuk'

http://www.thai-language.com/id/131195

[sustento]

Here we go again.

Dejavu anyone? Or is it just me

No that was yesterday...

[tetleythedog]

English skills: 55th in the world

Deaths on the road: 3rd in the world

Thailand, you're doing it wrong.

We all know that, but it will NEVER change. So many Thai teachers who cannot understand even basic words. Pronunciation is abysmal. Standards non-existant. We have several 4th year interns at my school....their level..............low! The hierarchy remain aloof, directors want to be treated like God, all school directors should be fluent in English. This is why a lot of good native English speakers are told their contracts will not be renewed, because the Thais feel threatened, and are well awar that they are inferior. The "everyone passes" crap holds the country back and they are too childlike to cope with failure.