Grounds for prosecution over Thai charter-change bill: NACC

[webfact]

CONSTITUTION
Grounds for prosecution over charter-change bill: NACC
The Nation

BANGKOK: -- The National Anti-Corruption Commission announced yesterday there were grounds for pursuing charges against former Parliament president Somsak Kiatsuranont and his deputy Nikom Wiratpanij for their roles in attempts by the government to amend the composition of the Senate, thus violating the Constitution.

NACC member Wicha Mahakun said there was sufficient evidence that the two accused could be deemed to have performed their duties dishonestly, abusing their authority and violating the ethical code.

However, Nikom can still perform his duties as the NACC has yet to decide on whether the two will be indicted. They will be summoned by the commission

to acknowledge the charges on January 10.

The ruling, which was announced after the commission's meeting yesterday, involved six witnesses, documents from the Constitutional Court and Parliament, and evidence submitted by the parties who lodged the complaint, Wicha said.

The agency has not yet concluded whether it will file charges against the rest of 381 former MPs and senators, including caretaker Prime Minster Yingluck Shinawatra, who proposed the charter amendment draft on January 7.

Meanwhile the Constitutional Court, which earlier also ruled against the amendment, voted yesterday to reject petitions filed against the People's Democratic Reform Commission (PDRC) and the Democrat Party on whether they had violated Article 68 of the Constitution.

The court ruled that under the Constitution, the PDRC's protest rallies were an exercise in freedom of assembly and there were no grounds to suggest they were organised with the intention to overthrow a democratically elected government.

The petitions were filed by former senator Ruangkrai Leekijwattana and Pheu Thai Party members.

The court also plans to rule on a petition filed by former Democrat MP Wiratana Kalayasiri, which states that the amendment to Article 190 passed by Parliament on January 8 violated Article 68 of the charter.


-- The Nation 2013-12-27

[Bluespunk]

Courts really not following the PT party line at present. Bet the DL is unhappy about that.

[jackrich]

The court ruled that under the Constitution, the PDRC's protest rallies were an exercise in freedom of assembly and there were no grounds to suggest they were organised with the intention to overthrow a democratically elected government.

Right, because Suthep has never stated that Yingluck should leave and be replaced with his "People's Council", right?

What are they smoking? I want some!!!

[Tatsujin]

Starting to see the wind shifting now . . .

[oneday]

What a joke. Bringing charges against a government body for trying to change their own laws, rules or constitution. That is their right and duty. It's up to the courts to decide if it is constitutional, not to file criminal charges against them. How utterly absurd the whole Thai government and courts are.

What a novel idea...let's have all of the senate elected. From Wiki:

"...composed of 150 members. 76 Senators are directly elected from the 75 Provinces of Thailand and Bangkok, while the other 74 are appointed from various sectors by the Senate Selection Committee.

...

The selection committee is made up of...

• President of the Constitutional Court
• Chairman of the Election Commission
• Chairman of the State Audit Commission
• A Judge in the Supreme Court of Justice holding office not lower in rank than Judge of the Supreme Court of Justice as entrusted by the general assembly of the Supreme Court of Justice.
• A Judge of the Supreme Administrative Court as entrusted by the general assembly of judges of the Supreme Administrative Court.

Humm...three of the five have something to do with courts. Now isn't that interesting. I wonder how much money comes their way for appointing senators? That's a lot to lose.

[Pikeybkk]

What a load of complete and utter trollop.....these guys are obviously towing the line for someone

[atsiii]

So... to propose a bill that calls for the entire senate to be elected by poll instead of selected by cronies--that must be debated and voted before becoming law, is unconstitutional. But to protest for the overthrow of an elected government and its replacement by selected (un-elected) technocrats, is okay.

The rich and elite control the courts and the officer corps of the military, but they cannot win an election because there are many more poor people than rich people. So, right when the world is worried about the health of the King, they protest to get rid of democracy in Thailand all together.

IMO, none of this has anything to do with Thaksin or the past; and everything to do with controlling the country lock, stock and barrel in the future.

[wprime]

What a joke. Bringing charges against a government body for trying to change their own laws, rules or constitution. That is their right and duty. It's up to the courts to decide if it is constitutional, not to file criminal charges against them. How utterly absurd the whole Thai government and courts are.

What a novel idea...let's have all of the senate elected. From Wiki:

"...composed of 150 members. 76 Senators are directly elected from the 75 Provinces of Thailand and Bangkok, while the other 74 are appointed from various sectors by the Senate Selection Committee.

...

The selection committee is made up of...

• President of the Constitutional Court
• Chairman of the Election Commission
• Chairman of the State Audit Commission
• A Judge in the Supreme Court of Justice holding office not lower in rank than Judge of the Supreme Court of Justice as entrusted by the general assembly of the Supreme Court of Justice.
• A Judge of the Supreme Administrative Court as entrusted by the general assembly of judges of the Supreme Administrative Court.

Humm...three of the five have something to do with courts. Now isn't that interesting. I wonder how much money comes their way for appointing senators? That's a lot to lose.

The constitutional court already ruled it illegal and they still proceeded with it.

[Cobra9er]

Looks like if the army are not willing to step in, the constitutional court will instead.

This would be a better outcome, especially if they ban all the politicians and senators with this huge and lets face it schoolboy error of trying to scam their way through parliament on several occasions in a small amount of time in the most unconstitutional way possible. Then threaten to have the members of the constitutional court indicted just because someone had the balls to stand up to them.

I can see mass political bannings coming, and I can see the election consisting of just a few minnows for the people to choose from and that means Thaksin is going to need to dig deep into his pockets to buy out a new set of politicians.

[Roadman]

What a joke. Bringing charges against a government body for trying to change their own laws, rules or constitution. That is their right and duty. It's up to the courts to decide if it is constitutional, not to file criminal charges against them. How utterly absurd the whole Thai government and courts are.

What a novel idea...let's have all of the senate elected. From Wiki:

"...composed of 150 members. 76 Senators are directly elected from the 75 Provinces of Thailand and Bangkok, while the other 74 are appointed from various sectors by the Senate Selection Committee.

...

The selection committee is made up of...

• President of the Constitutional Court
• Chairman of the Election Commission
• Chairman of the State Audit Commission
• A Judge in the Supreme Court of Justice holding office not lower in rank than Judge of the Supreme Court of Justice as entrusted by the general assembly of the Supreme Court of Justice.
• A Judge of the Supreme Administrative Court as entrusted by the general assembly of judges of the Supreme Administrative Court.

Humm...three of the five have something to do with courts. Now isn't that interesting. I wonder how much money comes their way for appointing senators? That's a lot to lose.

The constitutional court already ruled it illegal and they still proceeded with it.

Now why did you have to go and spoil a good judiciary corruption theory (fairy) tale with legal logic and truth...

It should file against the lot of them including the ring leader the puppet PM.

[TallPalm]

So... to propose a bill that calls for the entire senate to be elected by poll instead of selected by cronies--that must be debated and voted before becoming law, is unconstitutional. But to protest for the overthrow of an elected government and its replacement by selected (un-elected) technocrats, is okay.

The rich and elite control the courts and the officer corps of the military, but they cannot win an election because there are many more poor people than rich people. So, right when the world is worried about the health of the King, they protest to get rid of democracy in Thailand all together.

IMO, none of this has anything to do with Thaksin or the past; and everything to do with controlling the country lock, stock and barrel in the future.

Hear, hear.

[zydeco]

The court ruled that under the Constitution, the PDRC's protest rallies were an exercise in freedom of assembly and there were no grounds to suggest they were organised with the intention to overthrow a democratically elected government.

Right, because Suthep has never stated that Yingluck should leave and be replaced with his "People's Council", right?

What are they smoking? I want some!!!

From your picture, it looks like you've got plenty already.

[tezzainoz]

What a joke. Bringing charges against a government body for trying to change their own laws, rules or constitution. That is their right and duty. It's up to the courts to decide if it is constitutional, not to file criminal charges against them. How utterly absurd the whole Thai government and courts are.

What a novel idea...let's have all of the senate elected. From Wiki:

"...composed of 150 members. 76 Senators are directly elected from the 75 Provinces of Thailand and Bangkok, while the other 74 are appointed from various sectors by the Senate Selection Committee.

...

The selection committee is made up of...

• President of the Constitutional Court
• Chairman of the Election Commission
• Chairman of the State Audit Commission
• A Judge in the Supreme Court of Justice holding office not lower in rank than Judge of the Supreme Court of Justice as entrusted by the general assembly of the Supreme Court of Justice.
• A Judge of the Supreme Administrative Court as entrusted by the general assembly of judges of the Supreme Administrative Court.

Humm...three of the five have something to do with courts. Now isn't that interesting. I wonder how much money comes their way for appointing senators? That's a lot to lose.

you seem to forget you are only a guest here in Thailand

If you not like the heat in the kitchen

GET OUT

[Baerboxer]

The court ruled that under the Constitution, the PDRC's protest rallies were an exercise in freedom of assembly and there were no grounds to suggest they were organised with the intention to overthrow a democratically elected government.

Right, because Suthep has never stated that Yingluck should leave and be replaced with his "People's Council", right?

What are they smoking? I want some!!!

You obviously think you are better educated in Thai law than the judges.

Or is it simply that anything that goes against the party you support must be wrong??

Look at how these 2 guys cheated the parliamentary process and therefore cheat democracy. You don't need to be a genius to decide on that one.

How would you define the difference between a mass protest, mass parliamentary resignations that have led to the dissolving of parliament and an "overthrow" ?

Maybe you can help the judges et al understand where they went wrong.

[Baerboxer]

Looks like if the army are not willing to step in, the constitutional court will instead.

This would be a better outcome, especially if they ban all the politicians and senators with this huge and lets face it schoolboy error of trying to scam their way through parliament on several occasions in a small amount of time in the most unconstitutional way possible. Then threaten to have the members of the constitutional court indicted just because someone had the balls to stand up to them.

I can see mass political bannings coming, and I can see the election consisting of just a few minnows for the people to choose from and that means Thaksin is going to need to dig deep into his pockets to buy out a new set of politicians.

Spot on! PTP brought all this on themselves. Inept, arrogant, inpatient, sloppy, lazy - whatever the mixture. They had a lower house majority, and enough "influenced" senators to have got all the bills they wanted through parliament following correct procedure. But, that would require some open debate - and they don't like accountability and doing their dirty washing in public do they? It would have also meant perhaps, having a PM/DM that occasionally graced parliament with her presence.

It mus be very frustrating for Thaksin, when the strings keep getting tangled.

[shiok]

So... to propose a bill that calls for the entire senate to be elected by poll instead of selected by cronies--that must be debated and voted before becoming law, is unconstitutional. But to protest for the overthrow of an elected government and its replacement by selected (un-elected) technocrats, is okay.

The rich and elite control the courts and the officer corps of the military, but they cannot win an election because there are many more poor people than rich people. So, right when the world is worried about the health of the King, they protest to get rid of democracy in Thailand all together.

IMO, none of this has anything to do with Thaksin or the past; and everything to do with controlling the country lock, stock and barrel in the future.

http://www.youtube.com/embed/bQR640FSXvk

[shiok]

pls watch this clip of police brutality

http://www.youtube.com/embed/bQR640FSXvk

[fab4]

What a joke. Bringing charges against a government body for trying to change their own laws, rules or constitution. That is their right and duty. It's up to the courts to decide if it is constitutional, not to file criminal charges against them. How utterly absurd the whole Thai government and courts are.

What a novel idea...let's have all of the senate elected. From Wiki:

"...composed of 150 members. 76 Senators are directly elected from the 75 Provinces of Thailand and Bangkok, while the other 74 are appointed from various sectors by the Senate Selection Committee.

...

The selection committee is made up of...

• President of the Constitutional Court
• Chairman of the Election Commission
• Chairman of the State Audit Commission
• A Judge in the Supreme Court of Justice holding office not lower in rank than Judge of the Supreme Court of Justice as entrusted by the general assembly of the Supreme Court of Justice.
• A Judge of the Supreme Administrative Court as entrusted by the general assembly of judges of the Supreme Administrative Court.

Humm...three of the five have something to do with courts. Now isn't that interesting. I wonder how much money comes their way for appointing senators? That's a lot to lose.

The constitutional court already ruled it illegal and they still proceeded with it.

Now why did you have to go and spoil a good judiciary corruption theory (fairy) tale with legal logic and truth...

It should file against the lot of them including the ring leader the puppet PM.

Whilst you're on the subject of logic, why was a fully elected Senate constitutional in 1997 (which enabled this for the first time, previously they were Royal appointments) but a suggestion for the same arrangement in 2013 is deemed unconstitutional?

Or do you regard that as a suitable excuse to dissolve the PTP (another judicial coup albeit too late).

Anyway, hasn't Thaksin bought everybody?

[shiok]

What a joke. Bringing charges against a government body for trying to change their own laws, rules or constitution. That is their right and duty. It's up to the courts to decide if it is constitutional, not to file criminal charges against them. How utterly absurd the whole Thai government and courts are.

What a novel idea...let's have all of the senate elected. From Wiki:

"...composed of 150 members. 76 Senators are directly elected from the 75 Provinces of Thailand and Bangkok, while the other 74 are appointed from various sectors by the Senate Selection Committee.

...

The selection committee is made up of...

• President of the Constitutional Court
• Chairman of the Election Commission
• Chairman of the State Audit Commission
• A Judge in the Supreme Court of Justice holding office not lower in rank than Judge of the Supreme Court of Justice as entrusted by the general assembly of the Supreme Court of Justice.
• A Judge of the Supreme Administrative Court as entrusted by the general assembly of judges of the Supreme Administrative Court.

Humm...three of the five have something to do with courts. Now isn't that interesting. I wonder how much money comes their way for appointing senators? That's a lot to lose.

you seem to forget you are only a guest here in Thailand

If you not like the heat in the kitchen

GET OUT

Video clip on POLICE BRUTALITY!

[shiok]

What a joke. Bringing charges against a government body for trying to change their own laws, rules or constitution. That is their right and duty. It's up to the courts to decide if it is constitutional, not to file criminal charges against them. How utterly absurd the whole Thai government and courts are.

What a novel idea...let's have all of the senate elected. From Wiki:

"...composed of 150 members. 76 Senators are directly elected from the 75 Provinces of Thailand and Bangkok, while the other 74 are appointed from various sectors by the Senate Selection Committee.

...

The selection committee is made up of...

• President of the Constitutional Court
• Chairman of the Election Commission
• Chairman of the State Audit Commission
• A Judge in the Supreme Court of Justice holding office not lower in rank than Judge of the Supreme Court of Justice as entrusted by the general assembly of the Supreme Court of Justice.
• A Judge of the Supreme Administrative Court as entrusted by the general assembly of judges of the Supreme Administrative Court.

Humm...three of the five have something to do with courts. Now isn't that interesting. I wonder how much money comes their way for appointing senators? That's a lot to lose.

you seem to forget you are only a guest here in Thailand

If you not like the heat in the kitchen

GET OUT

Video clip on POLICE BRUTALITY!http://www.youtube.com/embed/bQR640FSXvk

[Toscano]

Thailand is digging itself deeper and deeper into the mire .

Thailand and all her people are the losers here and there will be NO winners .

They are trying to find a way to elliminate Peu Thai party as they did TRT .

Thailand is beginning to show itself in its true light .

[pedro01]

The court ruled that under the Constitution, the PDRC's protest rallies were an exercise in freedom of assembly and there were no grounds to suggest they were organised with the intention to overthrow a democratically elected government.

Right, because Suthep has never stated that Yingluck should leave and be replaced with his "People's Council", right?

What are they smoking? I want some!!!

You obviously think you are better educated in Thai law than the judges.

Or is it simply that anything that goes against the party you support must be wrong??

Look at how these 2 guys cheated the parliamentary process and therefore cheat democracy. You don't need to be a genius to decide on that one.

How would you define the difference between a mass protest, mass parliamentary resignations that have led to the dissolving of parliament and an "overthrow" ?

Maybe you can help the judges et al understand where they went wrong.

It's gotten to the point now where any judgement against = courts are biased.

Any judgement for = courts are fair.

This sort of thinking started with the protest leaders on the red side.

Along with the constant spewing of hatred for "the other side", this sort of talk is more fuel to the prospect of a civil war in Thailand.

[Scamper]

Interestingly, this may very well be the arena where the current conflict is resolved. In a promising move, the NACC is moving a bit more quickly on this than was apparent last week. Indeed, the attempt to alter the constitution by such unilateral and sweeping means, are definitely grounds here. The Democratic party was wise not to take part in the vote on the initiative. Another item frequently ignored is that the Pheu Thai government openly said they would not recognize the Constitution Court's ruling earlier this year. That alone is grounds for impeachment.

[tragickingdom]

NACC the National Human Rights Commission, they are all made up of undemocratic Democrats. No surprise here.

[renaissanc]

What still amazes me is the Thaksin has so much money and maybe only 15 years left to live. He's spending his days every day, for the last xx years in fact, trying to amass more money and power. Every day he must wake up stressed, and it must affect his health. He has no time to enjoy his money, help people with it, and be happy. He truly is a man living in poverty.

[dukebowling]

This is really sad. Even in the face of logic, corruption in the Comstitutional court still prevails. Amendment proposals to the constitution can't be unconstitutional. A law can be unconstitutional. Representatives cannot be charged for a proposal. The vote decides the outcome. Once voted in, it becomes constitutional.

Thailand is becoming the laughing stock of the world. I heard a public news reporter state, "the protest leaders propose an unelected peoples council...whatever that means..."

[zydeco]

What still amazes me is the Thaksin has so much money and maybe only 15 years left to live. He's spending his days every day, for the last xx years in fact, trying to amass more money and power. Every day he must wake up stressed, and it must affect his health. He has no time to enjoy his money, help people with it, and be happy. He truly is a man living in poverty.

If you've ever watched the second season of the reboot of the TV series, Dallas, you'll see that Thaksin is the Cliff Barnes of Thailand.

[Roadman]

What a joke. Bringing charges against a government body for trying to change their own laws, rules or constitution. That is their right and duty. It's up to the courts to decide if it is constitutional, not to file criminal charges against them. How utterly absurd the whole Thai government and courts are.

What a novel idea...let's have all of the senate elected. From Wiki:

"...composed of 150 members. 76 Senators are directly elected from the 75 Provinces of Thailand and Bangkok, while the other 74 are appointed from various sectors by the Senate Selection Committee.

...

The selection committee is made up of...

• President of the Constitutional Court
• Chairman of the Election Commission
• Chairman of the State Audit Commission
• A Judge in the Supreme Court of Justice holding office not lower in rank than Judge of the Supreme Court of Justice as entrusted by the general assembly of the Supreme Court of Justice.
• A Judge of the Supreme Administrative Court as entrusted by the general assembly of judges of the Supreme Administrative Court.

Humm...three of the five have something to do with courts. Now isn't that interesting. I wonder how much money comes their way for appointing senators? That's a lot to lose.

The constitutional court already ruled it illegal and they still proceeded with it.

Now why did you have to go and spoil a good judiciary corruption theory (fairy) tale with legal logic and truth...

It should file against the lot of them including the ring leader the puppet PM.

Whilst you're on the subject of logic, why was a fully elected Senate constitutional in 1997 (which enabled this for the first time, previously they were Royal appointments) but a suggestion for the same arrangement in 2013 is deemed unconstitutional?

Or do you regard that as a suitable excuse to dissolve the PTP (another judicial coup albeit too late).

Anyway, hasn't Thaksin bought everybody?

Because the 2007 constitution is what these judges are ruling on not the 1997 version. You can debate the rights and wrongs of the Military induced version but the courts are not there for that task in this case. Further to it being a proposal the court had already ruled it unconstitutional yet Pheu Thai chose to pursue anyhow. The simplest way to avoid the whole mess was suggested by the courts early on for constitution change was for PTP to go to referendum. But no they did not want too.

I do not see it as an excuse, as it is a court ruling by judges without bias to rule. And I think the judges are putting themselves in an awkward position by filing against two of the MP's when all including the PM were in on it and it was also the PM who proposed it. But in all honesty putting the legal implications aside and looking at it for the benefit of Thailand the country is heading into a bloody and economically crippling impasse. There are very few options left and if one of the few remaining removes non constitutional governance legally then in one legal stroke Suthep is also depowered. You can call it a judicial coup and I have no problem with that as it would not be happening if Pheau Thai were not screwing over the Constitution, and it is certainly a better option than allowing the lunatic Suthep to carry on further, is a better option than allowing the Army to directly coup and is better option than the endless merry go round of violent politicial protest from all sides that is gradually destroying Thailand.

And I have never considered the courts Thaksin lackeys. The DSI or more obviously Tarit, the Attorney General, upper Police ranks certainly are his stooges.

[oneday]

... IMO, none of this has anything to do with Thaksin or the past; and everything to do with controlling the country lock, stock and barrel in the future...

Absolutely 100% correct. Throwing up Thaksin is nothing more than a ruse; a smokescreen to get the people enraged when people like Suthep and his cronies have other reasons for overthrowing the current government, primarily because they can't win a fair election.

[Siripon]

... IMO, none of this has anything to do with Thaksin or the past; and everything to do with controlling the country lock, stock and barrel in the future...

Absolutely 100% correct. Throwing up Thaksin is nothing more than a ruse; a smokescreen to get the people enraged when people like Suthep and his cronies have other reasons for overthrowing the current government, primarily because they can't win a fair election.

555555 - Thaksin owns Pheua Thai 'lock, stock and barrel' , in his own words Yingluck is his clone.

Their election slogan- Thaksin thinks, Pheau Thai does

Willing servants, prepared to risk everything in the amnesty bill to benefit Thaksin.