Red shirts harass PDRC protesters in Chiang Mai

[wolf5370]

entering a red shirt strong hold and trying to stir up a hornets nest

by "handing out leaflets"

Seems some forum members share the red shirts' intolerance of anyone else.

If you were a "Red shirt" and you went to bangkok to hand out leaflets what do you think would happen to you? Just saying.

Following from your scenario and alluded outcome, do you think that would be right?

[khunken]

Looking more and more like a cult following with each passing day. Any resistance or doubt cast on dear leader is met with a barrage of violence. Shameful, and just where is the Thai version of Ryan Hardy to fight against this evil?

Being blind and blame just one side will not depict the truth.

Both sides are lead by a wannabe dictator, that will only bring Thailand to ruins.

Time will tell us...

Defiantly a lot in what you say.

But what sort of proof have you that Suthep wants to be a dictator. Calling for a government reform under Democracy principals seems far from it to me. I have yet to read where/when/if the council is picked or the election had that he wants to run it. Indeed he has not even entered the elections. It is to late for that.

I was interested in what you meant by time will tell us

Time will tell a lot given enough it will tell us the time of are death.

I agree with you that the one who has years of experience in trying to be a dictator some of them using his sister would definatly bring a lot of misery to Thailand.

The other one who is at the moment and no known record of trying to be a dictator is just trying to bring some much needed reforms to the country.

Dolly, please tell us exactly reforms Suthep has specified.

I'm not claiming to answer for hellydolly but in case he has left the thread, let me help.

We know that he has proposed a forum or council to tackle corruption and the power of the Shin clan. But I'm sure you wouldn't accept that.

Additionally he has proposed:

* elected provincial governors

* an elected police chief

* decentralisation of power - for example police under local control

Red shirt & PTP supporters tend to throw their hatred at Suthep without bothering to see what he is suggesting. I don't like him personally but I do support most of what he advocates.

[Sparkles]

Yingluck talked recently about if all Thai's follow the "rule of law" they will be happy and the country will be at peace. Is that some sort of sick joke?

How many convicted, or people wanted on serious charges, are either living in luxury overseas or in Cambodia. And lets not forget Tai Bak, War on Drugs, missing lawyers.

In Thailand money = power = free to so what you please you are well above any law or conviction.

The lady should go back to being a mother,a thought probably endorsed by Mr Yingluck.

[newcomer71]

Despising any form of violence, I would like anyway remember how many Suthep's supporters here told the Red Shirts going to Rajamangala Stadium tried their luck knowing they were near Ramkhamhaeng University.

Public space there too, but everyone criticized them telling they wanted to provoke violence, choosing the wrong place.

So following that reasoning, the anti-govt did the same going to protest in CM...

My thinking is: everyone should be able to protest in civil way, without fire up the opposite side violence, but this seems impossible in Thailand.

I understand your logical thread, but I feel it is somewhat off mark. The reason is that it is not a geographical issue so much as a time issue. The Red Shirts that descended to Bangkok, bussed in from far afield, where there because there was a peaceful protest going on that they did not agree with - it was a purely confrontational move. I don't know if the Anti-Gov protestors are locals or all the way from Bangkok, but goal is obviously non confrontational, otherwise they would not have changed their route and method of locomotion so much. Again it has been the Red Shirts that have been confrontational. In a democracy people should be allowed to protest peacefully and to be able to hand out leaflets without fear of attack.

We are on the same page, I guess, at least on what we stand for: right to protest (pacifically).

I blamed so much in the past toward yellow mobs back in 2008 and red army in 2010. They both disrupted critical daily activities, and the second bringing extreme violence to rise.

I would instead said that this time Redshirts haven't been that much confrontational till the moment NSPRT leaders decided to bring their protest venue to Ram Uni... I would say that move sounded more confrontational.

Aside that, anyway, is clear that atmosphere is too much tense and hot to expect events to be pacific and relaxing. Unluckily.

[metisdead]

An inflammatory troll post with false information has been removed as well as the replies.

[Mackie]

entering a red shirt strong hold and trying to stir up a hornets nest

by "handing out leaflets"

Seems some forum members share the red shirts' intolerance of anyone else.

If you were a "Red shirt" and you went to bangkok to hand out leaflets what do you think would happen to you? Just saying.

You're just being dishonest. Take a walk around Bangkok. You are allowed as a red shirt supporter to promote your political party and continue political campaigning undisturbed in Bangkok. Just walk though Charoenkrung Road or Chan Road and see how much taxpayer money has already been wasted in promoting PTP candidates and Yingluck personally. Completely undisturbed and unopposed. So there is a difference between sides.

When will I see something like that in Chiang Mai? Udon Thani? Pitsunalok? Even Patumthani? . Most likely political campaigners would not be allowed to get on with their job and if somehow they managed to erect all those massive placards by the road, red shirt stormtoopers would probably burn them down by next day.

The red shirt side introduced political intimidation, terrorism and violence to Thai political scene. As long as they are allowed to get away with it there is not going to be a democratic and fair election in Thailand.

[Gonzo the Face]

It is strange indeed, how a number of people read a news story and come away with different interpretations .

A couple of people referred to the Sek concert in Phuket that was cancelled because the man was blocked from the concert.

It seems to me that it was more his decision not to appear rather than not being allowed to appear.

As I read, he made a comment leaning one way and was taking flak on the social network regarding his comment, and replied to those making statements about his comments, using bad language and swearing at them.

Some were waiting for him at the concert, at which he then chose not to appear. Now thats the interpretation I took, not that he was blocked.

If anyone else read the story, I would be interested in your interpretation.

But moreover, the point I am making is people form their opinions on what they heard, or read, which is someone elses interpretation on what was said or done, This is surely applied to many instances in cases of Suthep said or the red shirts said, and people start riots over inuendo and rumor,

[hellodolly]

Looking more and more like a cult following with each passing day. Any resistance or doubt cast on dear leader is met with a barrage of violence. Shameful, and just where is the Thai version of Ryan Hardy to fight against this evil?

Being blind and blame just one side will not depict the truth.

Both sides are lead by a wannabe dictator, that will only bring Thailand to ruins.

Time will tell us...

Defiantly a lot in what you say.

But what sort of proof have you that Suthep wants to be a dictator. Calling for a government reform under Democracy principals seems far from it to me. I have yet to read where/when/if the council is picked or the election had that he wants to run it. Indeed he has not even entered the elections. It is to late for that.

I was interested in what you meant by time will tell us

Time will tell a lot given enough it will tell us the time of are death.

I agree with you that the one who has years of experience in trying to be a dictator some of them using his sister would definatly bring a lot of misery to Thailand.

The other one who is at the moment and no known record of trying to be a dictator is just trying to bring some much needed reforms to the country.

I don't want to begin again with hijacking a topic explaining why I think Suthep wants to be a dictator but:

- given the fact he did not consider at all election as a way to try to get preference of people

- given the fact he did not give any detail about his "council", and did not give any idea of how he wants to make any reform.

- given the fact of how he speak and fire up people every day

- given the fact he got the liberty to occupy government offices

- given the fact he is doing anything preventing elections to take place

- given many facts more (that I will be not writing to not annoy other users).

it gives me enough hints of what he would like to do with the back up of very influential people.

But this is only my humble opinion. I wish I will be proven wrong.

Well I have to agree with much of what you say, How ever As you would put it

Given the fact what he is doing is calling for a reform in the government

As for him being a leader he definatly has the ability to keep the issue in the eye of the public. If the situation was reversed Yingluck would have folded up her tents long ago and slinked off home.

But I agree with you that Suthep is definatly not the one to lead the council or the government. He is indeed more qualified than Yingluck but like her he is not open minded. she only listens to one person.

Who would make up the councils they are both talking about neither one is willing to say. One how ever says openly that she wants to be in charge when it is made up. We all know where she gets her information. If people are happy with Thaksin let them step forward instead of hiding behind Yingluck.

[Maha Sarakham Marty]

Certainly an interesting development that the P.R.D.C. members felt confident enough to venture into what had been a ''no go area'' for anyone who opposed Thaksin in his home foxhole Chang Mai.

Perhaps the general feeling concerning the Thaksin clan is indeed more widespread and stronger than the Thaksin clan would like to think or even admit to.

Seems as if the violence came from the home turf crowd as opposed to the visitors who it would seem responded in like kind to their somewhat hostile treatment.

Certainly it would seem as if the actions of the Chang Mai Red Shirts seem to reinforce their somewhat distorted view on the democratic process as espoused by their absent ''amply rich'' Dubai based sponsor.'' '' Democracy is not my aim.''

Same same as Sek LoSo not welcomed in Phuket.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/694513-phuket-loses-seks-appeal/

BS.

There's a huge difference between "holding placards" in Phuket and "hurled stones and bottles" in Chiang Mai.

[hellodolly]

Yes, whenever anyone disliked by the red shirts in CM decides to protest - they are set upon. Yes, the red shirts in the stadium at Ramkamheng were set upon by a mob (although some reports state the reds started the fighting). Yes - Sek Loso's concert was prevented in Phuket because of his apparent PTP support.

One thing is clear, even putting vote buying aside for a moment, there are areas of Thailand where prospective politicians are afraid to canvass (Udon Thani probably the worst) because of intimidation. Not how the hell can an election be called free and fair with that going on?

When one adds the local godfathers (having been paid by their master(s) handing out cash to their 'constituents' and ensuring that they vote the 'right' way, no election comes even close to being free & fair.

But I forgot - the 'deep' thinkers on TV say that it doesn't matter - democracy is all about elections and too bad if they are seriously flawed.

What you say is true about the intimidation the red shirts use. I live here in Chiang Mai and my wife is anti Thaksin as am I. She how ever does not speak about it because of fear some one would over hear her.

The red shirts are not all that bright. any thing intelligent and they resort to violence rather than proof of their position. Burning public buildings down and burning up fire engines is the limit of there reasoning abilities.

[Maha Sarakham Marty]

Indeed it is, as has been demonstrated time and again by diverse groups, be they gays or yellow shirts.

such attitudes are not particular to this group, which only amounts to about 100 - 200 red shirts out of what must be thousands in the CM.

Let's condemn all violent incidents

It's only a minority, for the moment anyway, that seek violence

Keeping on-topic in regards to this thread regarding violence in CM, I await condemnation of the red shirts involved in the violence in CM by the red shirts in CM who were not violent.

it'd be great to hear some condemnation of violence from fellow supportersn of the various movements, but I suspect we'll be waiting a long time...

I agree.

I don't recall any instance where the alleged non-violent red shirts condemned the violent red shirts, in Chiang Mai or elsewhere.

One could easily surmise by their inaction that they condone the actions of their violent brethren.

[newcomer71]

it'd be great to hear some condemnation of violence from fellow supportersn of the various movements, but I suspect we'll be waiting a long time...

I agree.

I don't recall any instance where the alleged non-violent red shirts condemned the violent red shirts, in Chiang Mai or elsewhere.

One could easily surmise by their inaction that they condone the actions of their violent brethren.

Yes, both sides never condemned violence from their violent followers, nor reds, neither yellow. Nor pro-government, neither anti-government.

It seems all of them thinks of opposite faction as "expendable"... And it's so easy just to blame on the other side, hiding the rotten apple well in their baskets. So tragically sad.

[Rob8891]

In fairness, there is not a lot of blame being heaped on any violent groups by their own side. The main protagonists are so entrenched in their own little worlds that their supporters can do no wrong (at least publicly).

I don't see this situation getting any better, unfortunately. Even in Thaivisa, when someone comes out with some sensible posts, the toothless armchair warriors are bumping their gums and spitting venom. If such boorish behaviour prevails in TV (as potent as an online version of Narnia), what hope is their in the real world. Anyone who tries to speak out is either ignored, howled down by hyped-up lunatics of whatever hue, or worse, in danger of real harm.

[Maha Sarakham Marty]

What did they expect? Free food and drinks like at Suthep's Bangkok rally?

If you take a dump in my backyard, don't expect to be treated nicely.

They didn't take a dump.

They "handed out leaflets"....and for that they received "hurled stones and bottles."

Edited January 6, 2014 by Maha Sarakham Marty

[newcomer71]

In fairness, there is not a lot of blame being heaped on any violent groups by their own side. The main protagonists are so entrenched in their own little worlds that their supporters can do no wrong (at least publicly).

I don't see this situation getting any better, unfortunately. Even in Thaivisa, when someone comes out with some sensible posts, the toothless armchair warriors are bumping their gums and spitting venom. If such boorish behaviour prevails in TV (as potent as an online version of Narnia), what hope is their in the real world. Anyone who tries to speak out is either ignored, howled down by hyped-up lunatics of whatever hue, or worse, in danger of real harm.

I would love to quote and agree on every single word of this post. Spot on. Kudos for you... +10!

[Maha Sarakham Marty]

How many arrests were made? Or is violence an acceptable political tool to the police of Redland?

It's called Chiang Mai, the finest city in Thailand. It's not "Redland."

Then perhaps the fine citizens of CM should come to grips with the violent red shirts in their midst and tell them off.

Edited January 6, 2014 by Maha Sarakham Marty

[Maha Sarakham Marty]

entering a red shirt strong hold and trying to stir up a hornets nest

by "handing out leaflets"

Seems some forum members share the red shirts' intolerance of anyone else.

I have it official the yellow shirts where listening to classical opera, drinking water and singing Buddha songs.

Thanks for the on the ground corroboration of the OP.

[Maha Sarakham Marty]

24 hours after the event a local media wakes up..

Red Shirts Attack Anti-Government Protesters in Chiang Mai Jan 6, 2014

http://www.chiangmaicitynews.com/news.php?id=2932

Thanks for the additional information on the red shirts' actions :

"Red shirts threw bottles and sprayed water at cars, trucks and bikes involved with the protests. Some protestors were also knocked to the ground and beaten."

[Maha Sarakham Marty]

Looking more and more like a cult following with each passing day. Any resistance or doubt cast on dear leader is met with a barrage of violence. Shameful, and just where is the Thai version of Ryan Hardy to fight against this evil?

Yes, a shameful post ! The violence is started by nobody else as your idol Suthep .

Please look back into history before you support Suthep, you might find a very close model in Hitler and maybe you will open your eyes, just maybe !

The inevitable and always asinine invocation of Hitler makes the thread.

[Rob8891]

24 hours after the event a local media wakes up..

Red Shirts Attack Anti-Government Protesters in Chiang Mai Jan 6, 2014

http://www.chiangmaicitynews.com/news.php?id=2932

Thanks for the additional information on the red shirts' actions :

"Red shirts threw bottles and sprayed water at cars, trucks and bikes involved with the protests. Some protestors were also knocked to the ground and beaten."

Now I understand.

You were reading a report about Songkran......

[Maha Sarakham Marty]

24 hours after the event a local media wakes up..

Red Shirts Attack Anti-Government Protesters in Chiang Mai Jan 6, 2014

http://www.chiangmaicitynews.com/news.php?id=2932

Thanks for the additional information on the red shirts' actions :

"Red shirts threw bottles and sprayed water at cars, trucks and bikes involved with the protests. Some protestors were also knocked to the ground and beaten."

Now I understand.

You were reading a report about Songkran......

For me, reading about being knocked to the ground and beaten removes any humor.

[wolfmanjack]

entering a red shirt strong hold and trying to stir up a hornets nest, seems to me that it is the yellow shirts who are harassing the reds. They have guts tho about 100 against a few million.

Almost sounds like you condone the despicable acts of Thaksin's brainwashed cult members....? Sadlyt this is the PT / Thaksin / Reds way, oppression. Hiow dare anyone disagree with their dear leader, he is a god sent from heaven just like the North Korean Kim's....Thaksin will only lead the country further down that road towards his cult's total domination. VERY scary.

No I wasn't condoning it at all. If you see my post I wasn't taking any side but actually said that the yellows had guts (slang term mean brave)

Here is where it looks like you are pro red.

"seems to me that it is the yellow shirts who are harassing the reds"

[bkksteviejai]

What did they expect? Free food and drinks like at Suthep's Bangkok rally?

If you take a dump in my backyard, don't expect to be treated nicely.

In a democracy, they might expect to be able to express a political viewpoint without being assaulted, they might expect the police to arrest those assaulting them rather than joining in (1 BIB at least), they might expect support from people coming from democratic countries. Instead of respect for those rights, they have them compared to defecation by some moron, who then goes into "What about..." mode, complete with a lie.

Your absolutely right. But also, in a democracy, they might expect an elected government to see out it's term. You see, It's all wrong. Until both sides of the argument are considered it's pointless infantile bickering back and forth.

FUBAR.

[catmac]

What did they expect? Free food and drinks like at Suthep's Bangkok rally?

If you take a dump in my backyard, don't expect to be treated nicely.

In a democracy, they might expect to be able to express a political viewpoint without being assaulted, they might expect the police to arrest those assaulting them rather than joining in (1 BIB at least), they might expect support from people coming from democratic countries. Instead of respect for those rights, they have them compared to defecation by some moron, who then goes into "What about..." mode, complete with a lie.

And "in a democracy, they might expect to be able to express a political wiewpoint" through the ballot box without a mob of thugs preventing candidates from registering and in otherways preventing an election taking place.