I think it will take time and education.

EXACTLY!

We all do.... but is there really enough time?

The education is only part of the job. There has to be a cultural change where respect does not mean subservience to ones alleged betters in Hi-So's/

Asking questions is also treated as a punishable offence in schools here so often the kids don't learn why or explore for deteals other than what the teacher has to hand. It embarrasses teacher if the kids ask, so they are discouraged with a beating... still.

So, teacher is explaining about thrust and how rockets sustain momentum in space with no gravity... ok Kids ask, "what if it wants to stop" WHACK... teacher is not prepared for question. Kids learn not to ask again.

This lesson follows them into adulthood and applies irrespecive of how well educated they are or not. Even a lot of the well educateds are the same and have glaring gaps in their knowledge that are rarely exposed due to cultural issues.

You therefore get people who are supposed to be educated following Suthep in the same blind unasking manner that ,they accuse the Issan farmers of following Thaksin. They are as slavish in there devotion... with no good need.

spot on .independent thought is discouraged from a young age,education is failing by any standard and therefore the country is unable or unwilling to make progess.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

tezzainoz, you might be correct in what you write, but some westerners with verbal diarrhea on the internet ain't gong to be making a difference like your good woman is, so relax, and try not to let emotions get the better of yourself.

correct? far from it.

the fact is that nobody should be protesting under the current situation, it is not safe.

if people want to still protest for some misguided beliefs and a lunatic leader and put their lives at risk ? no thanks.

I totally agree with you

If you are not Thai

then stop whinging and go home

I'm not Thai but Thailand has been my home for a very long time, and I have paid enough in taxes to keep many politicians up to date with their luxury items, so feel a bit of a right to whinge now and then. Although I am unopinionated to the general Thai population, if they are my friends I will speak my mind, and they theirs. We may agree or disagree, but we have a good debate and can still remain friends when all is said and done.

Your demand for people on this forum to stop their criticism of what is going on in Thailand is quite ridiculous. I like hearing both sides, even if I lean about 85% towards the protestors.

I would dare say if you don't want to hear debate, then YOU should leave the forum, and walk around stating nothing but empty platitudes about Thailand that never actually express your opinion about anything.

Then in your own words when you make an opinion, write this s your opinion and you understand that you have no right of say as you not thai

I have never said you not have the right to an opinion

Its just the overbearing way you say it

I know the BKK protesters have a legitimate complaint, and I know the farmers have a legitimate complaint..but lobbing grenades at people is not going to help anyone. The hell with agendas, this is wrong, by any measure, by any observation, and by the assessment of any any sane human being. Isaac Asimov said something I have never forgotten: "Violence is the last resort of the incompetent." There seems to be more incompetent people here than any Thai basher ever imagined.

If it is the militant wing of either side does not matter at all. No one knows who is doing this. Here in Thailand, we might never know. I can live with that. I don't like it, but I don't like the Soi dogs either, or the water being cut off every eleventh week, or the farang pricing system...but none of that is important. This is important. This is human lives.

I have great compassion for people, my enemies included, and hold that line very strongly. I hold to it as a lifeline. I will not drown in another man's ugly sea. I might drown in my own, but that is my business.

Nonetheless; those responsible should be dealt with very harshly. Their supporters, and financiers, and helping hands, should all be likewise held accountable.

I do not like feeling this way. I do not like it at all. Forget my avatar. That is not how I feel today.

Thai people deserve better than this.

Dark eyes, and darker grasping hands,

Gaze over their clutched mounds of money,

Hoping for more.

Cold, calculating, in their lifelong night.

They are unaware the sun is rising behind them...

Thai people deserve better than this.

Edited January 19, 201412 yr by FangFerang

How you come to the conclusion she is not part of the majority must be based on the facts that last time PTP has been winning with corruption

You accuse PTP for being corrupt even though Suthep and the people he takes orders from are even worse. Then you have the audacity to accuse us of being hypocrites.

I have now found some one who believe the PTP are not corrupt

My god my friend what time did you plane land

please read some of the past postings

you have a godd educations right here in Thai Visa

And Suthep isnt ??

What time did your plane land ?? Were you here when he was caught pilfering the sor por kor land ??

The corruption is endemic.. One side shouting the other is bad doesnt solve it.. If they want to reform, they were in power a couple of years ago, but at that time ?? No reforms needed !!

How you come to the conclusion she is not part of the majority must be based on the facts that last time PTP has been winning with corruption

You accuse PTP for being corrupt even though Suthep and the people he takes orders from are even worse. Then you have the audacity to accuse us of being hypocrites.

I have now found some one who believe the PTP are not corrupt

My god my friend what time did you plane land

please read some of the past postings

you have a godd educations right here in Thai Visa

Chill my freind, the man was just stating that there is corruption everywhere and like many of us dosn't believe for one second Suthep wants a fair reform with his peoples council of China.

Remember not one name has been put forward not any plan of solutions just rhetoric. To many of us it is just another elite ploy to gain control.

Worry about your wife of course we all would, it is not for me to say but mine would already be on the way home now its gotten dangerous, id have put my foot down at that point its not worth the risk and shes already done her part.Trust me your wife will respect you just as much

End of the day the corruption is only about money and power and itll always be here, you wont be able to replace a gem like you obviously consider your wife to be.

Let people view their opinions without calling for them to go home.

I view this country purely not my own simply because they wont let us become a citizen unlike my own where my Thai family are accepted and do have. I do not however let it stop me taking a strong interest in my home.

Many of us pay far more towards this country then probably you or your wife, we have the right to express opinions.

Take care of your own and be the man of the house that is the Thai way, if you intend staying do not talk like a guest or assume others view themselves as such due to the lack of a little piece of paper saying otherwise,

keep her safe and yourself too.

Remind me where I heard a political party address a crowd of it's followers from a stage and order an attack on a hospital(Siriraj IIRC), as well as the actual storming of another hospital. It fits a pattern although I am at a loss as to why team rouge feel the need to attack hospitals, don't suppose many of their members took the hippocratic oath?

As one with no sympathy with any side in this confliict, I can see that there is ample evidence from the video below that the first grenade attack was very fishy. The PDRC are claiming that this was thrown into the street, but from the video you can see that the man in the cap quickly disappears behind the telegraph pole (though you have to play it through again a few times to locate him and trace his movements). His identity is one question, but his behaviour is very suspicious to say the least. Remember, too, that the protest route was changed late in the day and it adds up not to evidence of WHO is guilty, but at least evidence that the official PDRC explanation does not hold much water, and points to a conspiracy of some sort.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIKQhqmukN4

Having said that, the film is too grainy to come to any firm conclusions other than that this was not a thrown grenade but a dropped one. Whoever is guilty, though, cowardice runs through their veins instead of blood so they truly are yellow, whatever political colours they wear.

Not to mention ex Democrat MP Kowit Tharana has admitted it is his subordinates truck in the video which the men get out of to.

"men get out of to". Sorry. You lost me.

Bloody cowardly reds.

Sent from my GT-I9152 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

The answer is easy

My wife is Thai

She is in her own country

I have opinions but no right of say

How you come to the conclusion she is not part of the majority must be based on the facts that last time PTP has been winning with corruption

Now me I have no say in what they do

so please tell us who has give you the right to tell Thai people what they must do

ever heard of the saying

if you can not stand the heat in the kitchen

Get Out

You might want to actually read some of the posts you're replying to, as you've completely misunderstood mine.

I have no desire to get tell anyone what to think, I was just pointing out to you (or maybe your wife) that not everyone in Bangkok sympathises with the protestors and a good number are holding vigils for peace, like the one in the photo I posted.

The arrogance of those who assume that they represent the majority of Thais is very sad.

Lets not forget the things the Yellow shirts have done in the last 2.5 months of protests....

Destroying government property

Brutally Assaulting Law Enforcement Personel

Attack RED shirt protesters near the University

Cutting water and power to hospitals and police stations

Threatening the lives of the PM and her Cabinet

Disrupting business in Bangkok

Damaging Thailand's reputation in the world

They are acting like Terrorists .....

They should be treated as such (not all of them but the worst need to be punished)

Yingluck has used the utmost restraint and not allowed police to carry weapons...

Now lets see who is the most rational in this predicament.

This grenade attack STINKS of FALSE FLAG ...

I was in the Military for 20 years ...... I know what Military guys look like.

That was a military guy working for someone involved

.....we already know SEALS have been working as Yellow Shirt Security.

Edited January 19, 201412 yr by kuka

Bloody cowardly reds.

Sent from my GT-I9152 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

I think you need to go back and look at the photos carefully in last post. That's CCTV footage of the guy throwing the grenade today, and other photos of him standing close to Suthep on several occasions. Draw your own conclusions as to how "Red" he is.

Lets not forget the things the Yellow shirts have done in the last 2.5 months of protests....

Destroying government property

Brutally Assaulting Law Enforcement Personel

Attack RED shirt protesters near the University

Cutting water and power to hospitals and police stations

Threatening the lives of the PM and her Cabinet

Disrupting business in Bangkok

Damaging Thailand's reputation in the world

They are acting like Terrorists .....

They should be treated as such (not all of them but the worst need to be punished)

Yingluck has used the utmost restraint and not allowed police to carry weapons...

Now lets see who is the most rational in this predicament.

And the red thugs in 2010?

Not sure if this has been posted before but lots of speculation (just speculation, I might add, hope there's not going to be a witch-hunt for the wrong person) that the culprit is one of the Navy SEALs previously arrested by police. The grenade is of the same rare type used in the attack on Friday, so bomber was likely the same guy or team for both attacks.




Juxtaposed with the arrested SEAL:

Suspected bomber throwing a hand grenede at Victory Monument!!! On CCTV

Lets not forget the things the Yellow shirts have done in the last 2.5 months of protests....

Destroying government property

Brutally Assaulting Law Enforcement Personel

Attack RED shirt protesters near the University

Cutting water and power to hospitals and police stations

Threatening the lives of the PM and her Cabinet

Disrupting business in Bangkok

Damaging Thailand's reputation in the world

They are acting like Terrorists .....

They should be treated as such (not all of them but the worst need to be punished)

Yingluck has used the utmost restraint and not allowed police to carry weapons...

Now lets see who is the most rational in this predicament.

And the red thugs in 2010?

Different time and different problem ...its 2014 now and this PM was elected by the people.

In 2010, I was living in BKK .....the REDS DID get nasty when the government (headed by an UN-ELECTED PM) starting shooting the peaceful demonstrators.

Apples and Oranges.

Bloody cowardly reds.

Sent from my GT-I9152 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

I think you need to go back and look at the photos carefully in last post. That's CCTV footage of the guy throwing the grenade today, and other photos of him standing close to Suthep on several occasions. Draw your own conclusions as to how "Red" he is.

Thai News and many tweets pointing to Navy Seals. same as caught the other night in the pick up.

Their Commander is alleged and we must be careful as the internet contains many things. to be Sutheps Nephew!!! Hmm... Back to the tweeting.

Not sure if this has been posted before but lots of speculation (just speculation, I might add, hope there's not going to be a witch-hunt for the wrong person) that the culprit is one of the Navy SEALs previously arrested by police. The grenade is of the same rare type used in the attack on Friday, so bomber was likely the same guy or team for both attacks.

Juxtaposed with the arrested SEAL:

If this is Real .... Suthep is DONE.

Its all over if media can put this guy in his security detail .....

I am crossing my fingers.

BeWD9owCQAAjSbp.jpg

923052_10200461793386920_515104341_n.jpg

1546434_566003696808756_2130671054_n.jpg

Are they same person?

Don't think so..

There are two types of Thaivisa posters.. Those who see Thailand for what it is, and those whose wife tells them how it is..

Okay you a dead correct

Finally some one with the nerve to tell the truth

so if your in the 1st group

Go back to your own country and put up with what you have

and those in the 2nd group

Do what your told, like I do, and have a good life

We left the West because we are sick of do gooder telling how it really is

when my wife return from the protest, I will have happy times for many night and the families will all be over telling me what a good farlang I am for letting my wife protest for her country.

at least you have a computer to keep you company

A few small points you may have missed out on, Tezzainoz: -

1. Free speech is the most important human right, and should apply to all, including those with whom you disagree. Slagging them off on a public forum is not the way to go.

2. The internet allows people to communicate their thoughts on a myriad of subjects to complete strangers in a manner deemed impossible until the last few decades. As such, its contributed to free speech in a way never before seen. Lets keep in that way.

3. If I remember, Thai Visa Forum is basically a forum for EXPATs to do exactly what Ive described in point 2, and Thais are also welcome to comment. However, free speech is best when combined with logic rather than insults and anger.

4. The majority of posters, however controversial the subject, post and reply without resorting to direct insults.

5. The present deplorable situation is not being made any better, nor any easier to understand by the use of rants of any kind.

The reasons for your repeated calls for those who do not agree with you to get out are yours alone. Perhaps its better to keep them that way. Its just possible that all of us, yourself included, may be forced to leave in the near future, and handing our Thai critics ammunition via aggressive personal attacks isnt a great idea right now or at any other time.

Well. Police on to this like a shot were they not. Think they know its one of Sutheps men. CCTV pics 4 at least look clear as a bell and in colour.

Names appearing already but only speculation..... But if you follow twitter and follow the FB links, they have the name of a Navy seal one of Sutheps Bodyguards.... lots of pics and lots of speculation.

Proves nothing, but there is a debate raging.

Suthep accuses the government of being behind the blasts, ... Ridiculous.

The police is seeking a former Democrat MP's aide who acted suspiciously... Believable.

Now there are clear pictures of the man (in white with a black cap) who dropped the grenade today...

Some indeed already put a name on the man... Soon we will know the truth...

And the truth may be very disturbing for Suthep... He will have to drop a few more tears to make the people believe he is not seeking violence...

What is certain is that Suthep, the Dems and all those irrational people who support this madness, should be held responsible for all the deaths which occured and will occur during his insane protests. From the very beginning it was very clear that the mob rule is not a solution to anything. It can only make the things worse.

These protests and their ridiculous demands aren't going anywhere. These naive protesters should better go home and give the country a break.

Yingluck will hopefully save the country from these thugs

Not sure if this has been posted before but lots of speculation (just speculation, I might add, hope there's not going to be a witch-hunt for the wrong person) that the culprit is one of the Navy SEALs previously arrested by police. The grenade is of the same rare type used in the attack on Friday, so bomber was likely the same guy or team for both attacks.

Juxtaposed with the arrested SEAL:

That ID is a very long leap of faith, and I find it very hard to believe that "they" would use the same compromised individual to carry out attacks.

That has already been debunked, it is not the same man and authorities already accepted and stated its not

Edited January 19, 201412 yr by englishoak

Not sure if this has been posted before but lots of speculation (just speculation, I might add, hope there's not going to be a witch-hunt for the wrong person) that the culprit is one of the Navy SEALs previously arrested by police. The grenade is of the same rare type used in the attack on Friday, so bomber was likely the same guy or team for both attacks.

Juxtaposed with the arrested SEAL:

That ID is a very long leap of faith, and I find it very hard to believe that "they" would use the same compromised individual to carry out attacks.

Latest report from one of the protesters' speech given live half an hour ago (FMTV website) said that the head shot photo of the service man in the photo ID is NOT the same man who bomb attacked behind the stage. He wanted to notify to the protesters not to get mixed up with the pictures.

Not sure if this has been posted before but lots of speculation (just speculation, I might add, hope there's not going to be a witch-hunt for the wrong person) that the culprit is one of the Navy SEALs previously arrested by police. The grenade is of the same rare type used in the attack on Friday, so bomber was likely the same guy or team for both attacks.

Juxtaposed with the arrested SEAL:

That ID is a very long leap of faith, and I find it very hard to believe that "they" would use the same compromised individual to carry out attacks.

Latest report from one of the protesters' speech given live half an hour ago (FMTV website) said that the head shot photo of the service man in the photo ID is NOT the same man who bomb attacked behind the stage. He wanted to notify to the protesters not to get mixed up with the pictures.

Really? How can they be so sure? I don't know whether it is or not, like AleG says they probably wouldn't be so stupid to use the same people, I just posted it because that's what many people are suggesting.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RGD-5

same flat spoon as in a couple of pics - only $5 usd if you know where to buy one... even bt700 as someone says for a chinese one is still pretty cheap... amazing nobody was killed outright today or even a bunch of poeple... but some critical - same as friday's grenade i think... watchout around the protesters - it's only going to get worse before Feb 2... and people are bringing their kids? and if 6 motorcikes took off today after this and shooting and nobody was able to knock over a motorcike (personally I would have trouble if the guy had a gun) but with all those people around and they got away clean... oh yah - where are the 20,000 cops and army guys that are supposed to be watching this mess anyway? didn't read anything about a chasedown in the english websites... come on...can't even chase some motorcikes that just lobbed 2 greanades into a crowd?

That has already been debunked, it is not the same man and authorities already accepted and stated its not

Where/when did you see this? It seems they've concluded this pretty quickly.

What amazes me is how many know-alls there are minutes after an incident, when there are still unsolved mysteries from the 2010 chaos waiting for your genius to clear up ! Who the hell knows who is really behind any attack ?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RGD-5

same flat spoon as in a couple of pics - only $5 usd if you know where to buy one... even bt700 as someone says for a chinese one is still pretty cheap... amazing nobody was killed outright today or even a bunch of poeple... but some critical - same as friday's grenade i think... watchout around the protesters - it's only going to get worse before Feb 2... and people are bringing their kids? and if 6 motorcikes took off today after this and shooting and nobody was able to knock over a motorcike (personally I would have trouble if the guy had a gun) but with all those people around and they got away clean... oh yah - where are the 20,000 cops and army guys that are supposed to be watching this mess anyway? didn't read anything about a chasedown in the english websites... come on...can't even chase some motorcikes that just lobbed 2 greanades into a crowd?

that is another part of the PDRC story that stinks.

They were saying there were 6 of them and they chased them but were shot at.

Now the story is that the guy calmly got on a mototaxi and went off. The taxi bike has confirmed where he dropped the guy.

So... Its an outright lie. The PDRC ran around making a noise at another part of the site whilst the grenade thrower calmly walks off. If there was no chase, and no gunshots... What was there original story all about?

Edited January 19, 201412 yr by pipkins

Lets not forget the things the Yellow shirts have done in the last 2.5 months of protests....

Destroying government property

Brutally Assaulting Law Enforcement Personel

Attack RED shirt protesters near the University

Cutting water and power to hospitals and police stations

Threatening the lives of the PM and her Cabinet

Disrupting business in Bangkok

Damaging Thailand's reputation in the world

They are acting like Terrorists .....

They should be treated as such (not all of them but the worst need to be punished)

Yingluck has used the utmost restraint and not allowed police to carry weapons...

Now lets see who is the most rational in this predicament.

They're not yellow shirts.

They're rockin' and rollin' at Victory Monument, one of the most dense human population gathering points in Bangkok. Shameful that fellow Thais would be targeted.