Safety in Thailand

[dunque]

I can understand that an incident like this is very unpleasant and makes you question all sorts of things. The security of your Moo Ban is certainly one that is worth questioning by the sounds of it.

But I would also say keep a bit of perspective. I was assaulted on a busy London street for no apparent reason and with no warning. Another guy I went to school with was "glassed" in a quiet country pub in rural England over a trivial perceived slight.

These sort of events are rare and unpredictable and the best advice as always and everywhere is to keep your wits about you and try and avoid putting yourself in harm's way.

Indeed, severe measures being considered in Sydney after deaths of two teenagers in apparently unprovoked alcohol-related attacks.

[sirchai]

I have to wonder if there was a perceived cause. Robbery? Insult? Jealousy?

Thais react as badly as rednecks from my part of the world to these but are often too lazy to just attack someone for fun. That's more a Brit thing.

Agreed. I see my 15 year old Thai stepson growing up, he's 15 now and much different to others of his age.

We met when he just turned four and he loves me as I love him.

He had some fights at school, as some older guys at school had said something bad about his mom and me.

It's pretty much obvious that most teenagers here do believe that ALL foreigners have met their "wives/gfs in bars.......

To get to the point. It's not usual that they follow somebody with a broken bottle to attack them without a reason. Such a reason could be easily created by a jealous Thai guy, when your son "just flirted" with a guy's girl friend.

Please don't get me wrong, but when I see a 70 year old foreigner with a 20 year old bar girl, wearing almost nothing, I understand that some Thais get angry.

What would young English guys think, if all Asian guys in the UK would have a good looking wife/gf and they wouldn't even have a chance to get laid?

Or in any other European/ American, or Australian cities.......

That would be a reason for a war, I'd assume. A young Thai bloke ( only 15, or so,) got killed just because his Ex girl friend at a boarding school in Sisaket, a few years ago.

The Ex gf and the new guy with some friends, of course, went to the boarding school, they'd climbed over the wall and the bitchy gf called his name. They bet him to death with a baseball racket and other "weapons", when he came down.

I wish your son a fast recovery and I'd reckon to have a word with him. Forget this nonsense of carrying a gun, John Wayne's dead.

Just think about your son's chances to get a good looking Thai girl in his, or another bed. Then look at the Majority of Thai teenagers' chances. A little "flirt" and you'll see their reaction, especially when drunk. .

Sorry, but the police box "advice" made me laugh, as I know a lot of cops here.

Good luck in the future without such bullshit.Greetings from lower northeast.-

Edited January 20, 2014 by sirchai

[CIHUAHUA]

I would recommend relying on Smith and Wesson for your security. If only for perceptions sake. If indeed they are called upon to protect you, any problems that may arise as a result, imo, are worth the bargain, considering the alternative. Bail is cheap here, regardless of the offense.

It sounds good to have a pistol at hand however usually the gun is not available, empty of rounds. It could make a small problem a big one. When a person takes out the steel so does the other person and theirs may be loaded. It really is not a good option here in Thailand or any other place. When you have a gun, you want to use a gun. Preventive measures are always the best form of defense. Be aware of your surroundings and if you are 17 run like heck or don't be out late when the danger is at its highest.

[larsjohnsson]

Sorry about your soon. And hope for a speedy revovery. But IMO it's safer to walk home at night time here in Thailand. Than in nearly any western country

[lucjoker]

tip: walk around acting drunk with a broken beer bottle in each hand ,

you will not be disturbed !

(don't cut yourself on the bottle!)

[Suradit69]

From what I've experienced most of these so called guards are only there to make the impression of being safe. Just look at the ones in the shopping malls and their great metal detectors that always go off when a person walks through them. The "guards" couldn't care less, I've never been checked by them. The only thing they care about is their uniform and their thousand patches that make them look like pilots. Appearance is all in Thailand.

Sorry about the O/P's son, but if the drunk on the motorbike was a resident or visiting a resident, what should the guard have done before the incident? I doubt guards can be expected to detain people who are inebriated as long as they have an excuse for being in the compound.

Did it take place where they would have seen it happening and been able to prevent it happening? Usually in this sort of thing the attacker makes sure it's where he won't be seen.

Again I am sorry that anyone, especially a youngster, should have something like this happen to him, but it's probably unrealistic to expect poorly trained, poorly paid guards to be able to maintain peace and harmony or to anticipate a criminal act before it happens. Even with the best trained and experienced police forces, they almost always deal with crime after it happens and are able to do very little before the fact.

Appearance is all in Thailand.

And where is that not true? And when has it not been true? In many places in the US security guards are senior citizens that offer about as much protection or security as you would expect. Crime happens everywhere regardless of what image the police have managed to sell to those it "serves and protects." And quite often these exemplary police are quite content to ignore what's going on.

Edited January 20, 2014 by Suradit69

[dotpoom]

Myself and some friends used to talk along similar lines about the shootings (mostly between Thai gangs though) knife attacks and robberies etc.,here in Pattaya... until one of them one day asked... "Have you forgotten what crime was like at home". Since he reminded us of that (amazing how quickly one forgets) I consider Thailand to be one of the safest countries i have lived in.

[FiftyTwo]

It happened at Eastern Star golf course in Ban Chang, Rayong

I'm surprised that Eastern Star doesn't have at least half decent security, certainly one of the better Moo Bans in the area, or was he just passing the golf course?

Security at Eastern Star is completely worthless! If there is a guard at a guardhouse they open the gate for everybody. You can drive in with an empty pickup and drive out with a full one, friendly greeting!

I think you will find a foreigner can, but a Thai or Burmese can't.

[Dellie]

It happened at Eastern Star golf course in Ban Chang, Rayong

I'm surprised that Eastern Star doesn't have at least half decent security, certainly one of the better Moo Bans in the area, or was he just passing the golf course?

Security at Eastern Star is completely worthless! If there is a guard at a guardhouse they open the gate for everybody. You can drive in with an empty pickup and drive out with a full one, friendly greeting!

I think you will find a foreigner can, but a Thai or Burmese can't.

Completely false. When I lived there several of my thai friends came to visit and were never even questioned on who they were there to see. Just gate opened and passed through. No interaction with the guard whatsoever.

[Bigfarang1948]

Sorry to hear this. But TH is not always as safe as it appears. I was coming home around the same time last night and passed a young caucasian female walking alone in Phayathai. I made a comment to my friend that she probably shouldn't be doing that. And that Thai girls would never walk alone at night.

So to answer your question about how to protect your family, just be smart. Educate your son. Sounds like he was with a friend. Just too bad this happened.

Glad your son is going to be OK but you can't blame the guard. What are the chances he would be there when the attack happened even if he ever did leave his guard shack?

[thailandbeachisland]

Your son is Thai ? Let him kill anyone who could attack him and he won't have any problem !

[thailandbeachisland]

Right! With a German car I could even pass embassies security without opening my window, so imagine any village security...

[alex8912]

"You know when teenagers lie? When they open their mouth" quote by Judge Judy.

[Horton Jones]

Thank God he had a friend with him, and one who could help a bit, kudos to that young man! The main concern I have for you is the psychological paranoia this attack may generate for your son, especially if it was truly random and surprising. Is he now going to worry about every motorbike overtaking him while he rides a bike or walks? (Perhaps only at night.) As one post pointed out, IF this were somehow provoked, either by "party talk", or perhaps by some inane gesture or look, then the lad may actually be better off psychologically, because it wasn't "random from behind", and there was actually a triggering action, albeit inadvertent. Don't know if you'll get the real truth out of a 17 year old with his teenage buddy, but it's an important question about truly random or not. Fortunately, he probably knows the answer in his heart. I just hope that he's not emotionally scarred from this, raising up pain whenever he looks at his facial scars or rides a bike at night. It's a tough, tough situation and my prayers are with you.

[Curt1591]

As pointed out, drunken attacks are often true "random acts of violence" and can happen anywhere, for any reason, or no reason.

Unfortunately, foreigners stand out, and can quickly become a target.

[jacko45k]

By the way, we should meet, maybe we can pool on bringing the kids, they might visit the same friends!

Great idea......dropping off and picking them up might be best.

[monkey4u]

I found the best way to keep drunken thugs away from where I live

Is to NOT invite family or friends over

On a more serious note, a lot of so called security gaurds are people recently released from prison

So much for security

[rct99q]

I sincerely hope your son makes a speedy recovery. Incidents like this can have a lasting affect so would recommend having a discussion with him and maybe a medical professional.

[dighambara]

From what I've experienced most of these so called guards are only there to make the impression of being safe. Just look at the ones in the shopping malls and their great metal detectors that always go off when a person walks through them. The "guards" couldn't care less, I've never been checked by them. The only thing they care about is their uniform and their thousand patches that make them look like pilots. Appearance is all in Thailand.

They get what they pay for, at $10 per day.

Minimum wage laws are rarely enforced. Workers can be hired for $1.50 a day and are happy to have a job.

No need to comment on the many ways a minimum wage law destroys an economy.

[cloghead]

I would recommend relying on Smith and Wesson for your security. If only for perceptions sake. If indeed they are called upon to protect you, any problems that may arise as a result, imo, are worth the bargain, considering the alternative. Bail is cheap here, regardless of the offense.

That's a terrible suggestion. Any Glock, Sig Sauer or Walther are much better alternatives...

[connda]

Regarding your dependence on security guards and police, we have a saying in my country: "When seconds count, the police are just minutes away."

Edited January 21, 2014 by connda

[wym]

They get what they pay for, at $10 per day.

Minimum wage laws are rarely enforced. Workers can be hired for $1.50 a day and are happy to have a job.

No need to comment on the many ways a minimum wage law destroys an economy.

Not sure where you live, but I personally know many Thais working that job, two in my extended family, and none are paid less than 300 a day.

And my in-laws pay a lot more than 50, I think 200 last time I checked for their dirt-poor neighbors to work their rice fields, and they also get fed + a share of the rice when the harvest comes in.

I'd be very curious to hear the specifics of your experience of under 50 baht per day, even for illegals.

[tim armstrong]

Yes, the Smith and Wesson suggestion is not clever. 1. guns are illegal for westerners to own or carry. 2. threatening anyone with one will generate an immediate crowd and certainly increase your own safety risk, and 3. cost you a lot of money to make it all go away.

As shocking as this story sounds, you do have to wonder about possible comments made by the victims, and of course jealousy. But more perturbing to me is the rapid rise in this age group in Thailand of the practise of drinking buckets, with just about anything in them. In Oz it has produced a whole culture of 'glassing' with broken bottles etc and 'king hits' on totally innocent people, particularly on weekends.

There is also the other problem here of Yabba being mixed with caffeine and other stimulants. Its cheap for Thais to buy 70-200 baht . The effect is to keep them awake for longer, but it also increases aggression in many.

But hope your son is Ok.

[In Search of Space]

I would recommend relying on Smith and Wesson for your security. If only for perceptions sake. If indeed they are called upon to protect you, any problems that may arise as a result, imo, are worth the bargain, considering the alternative. Bail is cheap here, regardless of the offense.

It sounds good to have a pistol at hand however usually the gun is not available, empty of rounds. It could make a small problem a big one. When a person takes out the steel so does the other person and theirs may be loaded. It really is not a good option here in Thailand or any other place. When you have a gun, you want to use a gun. Preventive measures are always the best form of defense. Be aware of your surroundings and if you are 17 run like heck or don't be out late when the danger is at its highest.

Never touched a gun in my life, not a real one any way. If you are going to point a gun at some body you have to be prepared to use it, so I guess it is the first question you will ask yourself. I tend to rely on my 100 metre sprinting skills - in flip-flops & 20 kg overweight giving added momentum !!

Edited January 21, 2014 by In Search of Space

[Showbags]

I would recommend relying on Smith and Wesson for your security. If only for perceptions sake. If indeed they are called upon to protect you, any problems that may arise as a result, imo, are worth the bargain, considering the alternative. Bail is cheap here, regardless of the offense.

Tell that to Garry Halpin...sheesh

[recycler]

Some update, the cover up by Eastern Star security has started.

Initial information given by a guard is now denied, contradicting stories come from different people, video footage that was promised is now no longer available.

The site is cleaned of all glass and other traces and now they ask why there is nothing left of the bottle.

And we are advised not to go to the police as they were informed by Eastern Star already....

There happened to be a new year party for Eastern Star staff on the same evening and there were quite a few drunks leaving that party ......

[dotpoom]

Just listened to a radio program about the "King Punch" or some such name (the media now trying to rename it "the cowards punch") that has been occurring in Australia (also seen a TV documentary on it happening in America.

The idea is that a lone individual is picked out at random and is given an unmerciful punch from behind to the back of the head or at the side of the head. The victim could be a man or a woman, old or young.

90 people have died this way in the past 10 years in Australia (God only knows how many injured.

You can find it on You Tube....not sure exactly what to key in.

Never heard of such like happening on these shores.Thank God.

[chrisinth]

Quote

Quote

I have to wonder if there was a perceived cause. Robbery? Insult? Jealousy?

Thais react as badly as rednecks from my part of the world to these but are often too lazy to just attack someone for fun. That's more a Brit thing.

Not likely, they have no interaction with locals, the group of friends he meets with is from the international school, also no Thai girls involved. Like I wrote, he is very well told to stay clear by my wife and he has seen enough examples of how drunk and or jealous Thais behave.

Looks like plain aggression, maybe targeted at foreigners in particular.

It actually sounds like wrong place, wrong time, but obviously could be something more targeted.

Reading your reply (s) earlier reference the keycard system. These automated systems only work to stop entry & exit of motor vehicles, which, granted, could save someone's house from being stripped bare. For personal security they are useless, in fact worse than useless. In the case of your son being chased to the gate, your son would have had his entry barred (even if he had a card) until he swiped it, with no human resources available to assist.

If your security falls under a committee, it should be stressed that security of property as well as personal security have equal priorities.

NB: Sorry for the late reply, been travelling and have just arrived in Ban Chang from Phitsanulok...............

[wym]

Just listened to a radio program about the "King Punch" or some such name (the media now trying to rename it "the cowards punch") that has been occurring in Australia (also seen a TV documentary on it happening in America.

The idea is that a lone individual is picked out at random and is given an unmerciful punch from behind to the back of the head or at the side of the head. The victim could be a man or a woman, old or young.

90 people have died this way in the past 10 years in Australia (God only knows how many injured.

You can find it on You Tube....not sure exactly what to key in.

Never heard of such like happening on these shores.Thank God.

Media hype BS

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/mon-december-16-2013/meet-the-knockers

[atyclb]

Although I sympathize with the op,

when i saw the title of this thread

" how to protect you and your family from drunken thugs in thailand"

my gut thought was "distance yourself from "tiraks" extended family and friends. (not applicable to all cases of course)