Thai govt warned bond floating to pay rice farmers may break the law

[JRSoul]

Thaksin made the assessment during an interview and it was his personal opinion not the Government. It was his opinion based on his prediction on global food production of the time. If I am contradicting Thaksin, who cares?

It was his personal opinion but not the op

<deleted>! You don't know that Thaksin OWNS the government?

[icommunity]

Thaksin made the assessment during an interview and it was his personal opinion not the Government. It was his opinion based on his prediction on global food production of the time. If I am contradicting Thaksin, who cares?

It was his personal opinion but not the op

<deleted>! You don't know that Thaksin OWNS the government?

You think so??? How??? I don't he OWNS.

[icommunity]

Can you tell why most rice farmers in Thailand were at poverty level before TRT/Thaksin stepped in?

That's what happens when you are inefficiently employed in an uneconomic industry. Small holdings farmed labour-intensively to produce a low value crop will always result in poverty, especially when competing with broad-acre mechanised farming, unless somebody gives you a huge subsidy of other tax-payers money (stuff them, they vote for someone else).

The problem is, rather than encouraging more efficient production or a switch to higher value crops/industry, it actually encourages more people to join the uneconomic industry (but with their vote, so that's OK).

And, Thaksin came along and made some MPs and businessmen in the South blowing their top when he suggested some areas in the North to go into oil palm and rubber plantations. Oil palm and rubber farmers in the South be given land titles. Education reform, universal health care etc etc. You don't seem to be aware or choose to be on the steps taken to upgrade skills and land reform.

Are you also suggesting Thailand becomes a rice importing nation? Philippines falls prey to that and now regret.

[CraigSchuler]

Can you eat bonds?

[icommunity]

IMO the only problem I see with this article is the fact that the Gov't bought the rice at a price higher than the market is right now. So no matter how much they sell, there's no way to fund all the payouts.

Any which way they try to spin this they're screwed

The Government did not at any time said it is a profit making scheme. It is a scheme to raise the quality of life of rice farmers. This will encourage the younger general into rice farming to support the national food security plan. Rice farming has been supporting the growth and expansion of related industries.

If everyone got paid 40% over the price their goods are worth of course they are raised out of poverty temporarily - however now the whole country is being plunged into a spiral of debt and it has a huge excess of an overpriced commodity nobody will buy because they can get the same elsewhere 40% cheaper. Alright, forget about business and profit, how does it help the country when there is no money left to pay for hospitals, education etc etc. because it has all been pissed away paying the farmers to create the rice mountain, how does this benefit the country in general ? It benefits PT because it keeps their voter base happy. And screw the rest of you. Fiscal stupidity of the worst kind...

You don't seems to know what is rice pledging scheme judging from the way you talk about prices. Your focus is only one dot of the whole picture of Thailand's vision. The country has no money??? You meant a government should keep voters unhappy - stupid thinking. The economic fundamental of Thailand is strong. Disruptive politics of the oppositions has cause the country to lost at least 200 billions baht.

[GentlemanJim]

IMO the only problem I see with this article is the fact that the Gov't bought the rice at a price higher than the market is right now. So no matter how much they sell, there's no way to fund all the payouts.

Any which way they try to spin this they're screwed

The Government did not at any time said it is a profit making scheme. It is a scheme to raise the quality of life of rice farmers. This will encourage the younger general into rice farming to support the national food security plan. Rice farming has been supporting the growth and expansion of related industries.

If everyone got paid 40% over the price their goods are worth of course they are raised out of poverty temporarily - however now the whole country is being plunged into a spiral of debt and it has a huge excess of an overpriced commodity nobody will buy because they can get the same elsewhere 40% cheaper. Alright, forget about business and profit, how does it help the country when there is no money left to pay for hospitals, education etc etc. because it has all been pissed away paying the farmers to create the rice mountain, how does this benefit the country in general ? It benefits PT because it keeps their voter base happy. And screw the rest of you. Fiscal stupidity of the worst kind...

You don't seems to know what is rice pledging scheme judging from the way you talk about prices. Your focus is only one dot of the whole picture of Thailand's vision. The country has no money??? You meant a government should keep voters unhappy - stupid thinking. The economic fundamental of Thailand is strong. Disruptive politics of the oppositions has cause the country to lost at least 200 billions baht.

As of this moment 228 posts of that standard in only 10 days as a member. Must be a record and a full time job! I don't know whether to file this one under garbage or ludicrous.

[casualbiker]

Thaksin made the assessment during an interview and it was his personal opinion not the Government. It was his opinion based on his prediction on global food production of the time. If I am contradicting Thaksin, who cares?

It was his personal opinion but not the op

<deleted>! You don't know that Thaksin OWNS the government?

You think so??? How??? I don't he OWNS.

You really, really should read the Thaksin Shinawatra wiki : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thaksin_Shinawatra

and the Phua Thai wiki : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pheu_Thai_Party

last but not least :

[GentlemanJim]

I admit to have been avoiding Thai Visa in recent weeks because I can't keep up with all of the constantly changing stupid news inputs initiated by a collection of the most ridiculous political personalities on the planet. BUT one thing I really never picked up on was the story that broke relating to this mention in the OP

Dr Warong Dejkitvikrom who was responsible for exposing the nonexistent government-to-government rice deals between Thailand and China

I really never saw much mention of this. Was there a thread dedicated to this? Was it made public on TV/newspapers etc and if so why have millions of people not been calling for the heads of the liars responsible. Although many of us suspected such shenanigans has the Dr actually found positive proof and if so what was the reaction of the international community. Wasn't this particular gov to gov claim something that Surapong the odious was involved in?

[icommunity]

This is a response to the posting of

GentlemanJim, on 24 Jan 2014 - 09:03, said:

As of this moment 228 posts of that standard in only 10 days as a member. Must be a record and a full time job! I don't know whether to file this one under garbage or ludicrous.

My reply

Wow, didn't know that. Sound threateningly dictatorial unless I just post one a day. I must change my holiday plan now and may be have some fun joining the bunnies showing their baht welcoming Suthep. Anything else better that can come out from your brain?

Almost forgot, don't know to file under "online Thug" or "Online Intimidator"

Edited January 24, 2014 by icommunity

[icommunity]

Thaksin made the assessment during an interview and it was his personal opinion not the Government. It was his opinion based on his prediction on global food production of the time. If I am contradicting Thaksin, who cares?

It was his personal opinion but not the op

<deleted>! You don't know that Thaksin OWNS the government?

You think so??? How??? I don't he OWNS.

You really, really should read the Thaksin Shinawatra wiki : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thaksin_Shinawatra

and the Phua Thai wiki : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pheu_Thai_Party

last but not least :

ts thinks.jpg

Still cannot convinced me with these wiki things. No proof that Thaksin OWNS the government.

[Old Man River]

IMO the only problem I see with this article is the fact that the Gov't bought the rice at a price higher than the market is right now. So no matter how much they sell, there's no way to fund all the payouts.

Any which way they try to spin this they're screwed

The Rice Scheme is a clear Pyramid Scheme, the farmers input x amount of wealth (in rice) expecting to get 2x in return while the money generated by the scheme is actually

In other countries the scheme itself, let alone any corruption, would be the subject of a criminal investigation.

Almost every country has some way to support their agricultural sector. The issue here is once the buy high sell high plan showed to be buy high, sell low, they should have stopped and tried something else. They kept going with it.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[casualbiker]

<deleted>! You don't know that Thaksin OWNS the government?

You think so??? How??? I don't he OWNS.

You really, really should read the Thaksin Shinawatra wiki : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thaksin_Shinawatra

and the Phua Thai wiki : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pheu_Thai_Party

last but not least :

ts thinks.jpg

Still cannot convinced me with these wiki things. No proof that Thaksin OWNS the government.

LOL. ok then.. if that and the fact that his 2 sisters, brother inlaw and several other family members are in the top echelon and the fact that THEY Phua Thai have never made it a secret that Thaksin set up and bankrolled the government..eg the poster from the last election.. then i suppose nothing less than a signed deposition from the man himself would be the only thing YOU would call proof.... So funny

[icommunity]

My response to positing of

casualbiker, on 24 Jan 2014 - 09:09, said:

LOL. ok then.. if that and the fact that his 2 sisters, brother inlaw and several other family members are in the top echelon and the fact that THEY Phua Thai have never made it a secret that Thaksin set up and bankrolled the government..eg the poster from the last election.. then i suppose nothing less than a signed deposition from the man himself would be the only thing YOU would call proof.... So funny

Repy

Still not proving Thaksin OWNS the government. Only distortion, twist, untruth and from smear.

[dutchisaan]

Are these bonds just as good as the vouchers they give to the rice farmers?

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[RobthaiIre]

Finally after reading endless bull that people are posting about this issue i have found somebody i agree with.

My understanding of Thailand is the EVERYBODY is corrupt from the very top to the very bottom so why should this government or the rice pledging scheme be any different. So if it boils dow to corruption as being the central issue for Suthep and his cronies. (Anyway Suthep is just a pawn for bigger people, he gets told what to do by bigger people!!!!) So if corruption is the issue everybody should be in jail except the farmers, labours and servants.

The biggest problems facing this country is of greed and jealousy and then you put the 2 together bang you get Thai society!!!! 2 of the 7 deadly sins (Gluteny & Envy!!!) The people not in power are not happy that with current government using the countrys money to try and bring up the standard of living of the poorest in society which obviously has been diverated away from them. The undying need for more money, bigger house, bigger car, bigger gold is too much for most people because the people next door have. So this government has used/wasted/corrupted hugh somes of money that would have otherwise gone into the pockets of Suthep/the bigger players/and sutheps loyal band of foot soldiers / rent a crowd from the south which have long benifitted from the Thai Corruption System (TCS) before Taiksin came along and upset the apple cart by trying to divert some of the money to the other 40 million peopl that live in Thailand not just in BKK or the south. Whether you like Taiksin somebody tell my his 30baht Healthcare for ALL THAI PEOPLE is not a good idea.

Anyway i'm starting to ramble now!!!! Suthep/bigger players are wrong wrong wrong to do what they are doing. This is supposed to be a democratic country and the people should decided who runs the country. Everybody is corrupt (TCS) at every level so its a level playing field. The rice scheme is was a good idea but it went horribly wrong. The farmers will still grow rice this year but maybe only enough to feed themselves then the wealthy can buy low quality but very expensive imported rice and who is society will get hit the poorest again who have no farm to grow rice or no money to buy it.

Also there is no Social Welfare system to help the people that need it...... now how much would that cost and then treble when you factor in the TCS!!!!

The elite in BKK have to accept that they are out numbered and will never win an election especially if they keep pulling these stunts.

Also as an aside, you don't here about the previous PM. Obviously mortified by what is happening to democracy in this country as he has seen how it should work being educated in London!!!! This guy and the previous finance minister have a lot to offer this country the rest should reeducate themselves going back to when the greeks invented democracy in the 5th century BC (or roughly the thai year 0!!!)

Karl Popper defined democracy in contrast to dictatorship or tyranny, thus focusing on opportunities for the people to control their leaders and to oust them without the need for a revolution.

Suthep / bigger players/ rent a crowd and all the other cronies should do some reading!!!!

The government's show it is willing to risk for the sack of the well being of rice farmers. While the oppositions focuses on their continuous suppression of rice farmers.

Quite obvious that with the Coup stuttering and the Judicial Coup mired due to the exposure of the EC and CC members and their affiliations.

So, all focus is on the rice and trying to get the farmers to boost Sutheps flagging numbers.

Bond issued and the bond holder not the tax payer stands the risk? Illegal? Crazy and smacks of desperation from the anti dems and media here continually hang on the word of the very people (judges) who want the coup to work.

All the evidence is of the Courts and Suthep and EC holding up the rice payments. The farmers will see that, and if not, up to them. Just more Elite posturing from the Suthep side.

More they speak out the more they appear to be colluding. Let em speak and let the media disgrace itself even more by giving these nuts airtime and news inches. Discredits the media more than the Government.

[RobthaiIre]

Finally after reading endless bull that people are posting about this issue i have found somebody i agree with. PIPKINS

My understanding of Thailand is the EVERYBODY is corrupt from the very top to the very bottom so why should this government or the rice pledging scheme be any different. So if it boils dow to corruption as being the central issue for Suthep and his cronies. (Anyway Suthep is just a pawn for bigger people, he gets told what to do by bigger people!!!!) So if corruption is the issue everybody should be in jail except the farmers, labours and servants.

The biggest problems facing this country is of greed and jealousy and then you put the 2 together bang you get Thai society!!!! 2 of the 7 deadly sins (Gluteny & Envy!!!) The people not in power are not happy that with current government using the countrys money to try and bring up the standard of living of the poorest in society which obviously has been diverated away from them. The undying need for more money, bigger house, bigger car, bigger gold is too much for most people because the people next door have. So this government has used/wasted/corrupted hugh somes of money that would have otherwise gone into the pockets of Suthep/the bigger players/and sutheps loyal band of foot soldiers / rent a crowd from the south which have long benifitted from the Thai Corruption System (TCS) before Taiksin came along and upset the apple cart by trying to divert some of the money to the other 40 million peopl that live in Thailand not just in BKK or the south. Whether you like Taiksin somebody tell my his 30baht Healthcare for ALL THAI PEOPLE is not a good idea.

Anyway i'm starting to ramble now!!!! Suthep/bigger players are wrong wrong wrong to do what they are doing. This is supposed to be a democratic country and the people should decided who runs the country. Everybody is corrupt (TCS) at every level so its a level playing field. The rice scheme is was a good idea but it went horribly wrong. The farmers will still grow rice this year but maybe only enough to feed themselves then the wealthy can buy low quality but very expensive imported rice and who is society will get hit the poorest again who have no farm to grow rice or no money to buy it.

Also there is no Social Welfare system to help the people that need it...... now how much would that cost and then treble when you factor in the TCS!!!!

The elite in BKK have to accept that they are out numbered and will never win an election especially if they keep pulling these stunts.

Also as an aside, you don't here about the previous PM. Obviously mortified by what is happening to democracy in this country as he has seen how it should work being educated in London!!!! This guy and the previous finance minister have a lot to offer this country the rest should reeducate themselves going back to when the greeks invented democracy in the 5th century BC (or roughly the thai year 0!!!)

Karl Popper defined democracy in contrast to dictatorship or tyranny, thus focusing on opportunities for the people to control their leaders and to oust them without the need for a revolution.

Suthep / bigger players/ rent a crowd and all the other cronies should do some reading!!!!

[oldthaihand99]

Where there is Thaksin, there is a way. Thaksin thinks, Pheu Thai acts ... taxpayers are screwed anyways...

Robin Hood takes from the rich (tax payers) to give to the poor (rice farmers).

The poor have been screwed for too long by the old elite.

[casualbiker]

Where there is Thaksin, there is a way. Thaksin thinks, Pheu Thai acts ... taxpayers are screwed anyways...

Robin Hood takes from the rich (tax payers) to give to the poor (rice farmers).

The poor have been screwed for too long by the old elite.

Tax payers are now the rich. Really!!

So if you earn more than 150,000baht ($4500) a year you are RICH.

OK then!

PS: under the current rice pledging. Truly poor rice farmers ie non land owners are left out... so yer Robbing Shinawatra does it again.

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[RobthaiIre]

Where there is Thaksin, there is a way. Thaksin thinks, Pheu Thai acts ... taxpayers are screwed anyways...

Robin Hood takes from the rich (tax payers) to give to the poor (rice farmers).

The poor have been screwed for too long by the old elite.

Tax payers are now the rich. Really!!

So if you earn more than 150,000baht ($4500) a year you are RICH.

OK then!

PS: under the current rice pledging. Truly poor rice farmers ie non land owners are left out... so yer Robbing Shinawatra does it again.

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

What has shinawatra go to do with owning land to be a farmer. if you want to be a farmer and you don't own land you lease it.

[casualbiker]

Where there is Thaksin, there is a way. Thaksin thinks, Pheu Thai acts ... taxpayers are screwed anyways...

Robin Hood takes from the rich (tax payers) to give to the poor (rice farmers).

The poor have been screwed for too long by the old elite.

Tax payers are now the rich. Really!!

So if you earn more than 150,000baht ($4500) a year you are RICH.

OK then!

PS: under the current rice pledging. Truly poor rice farmers ie non land owners are left out... so yer Robbing Shinawatra does it again.

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

What has shinawatra go to do with owning land to be a farmer. if you want to be a farmer and you don't own land you lease it.

But the pledging scheme was for landholding farmers. No land. No money.

But being Thailand there were ways out. The landowners would do the paperwork for the tenants.

but still not exactly a scheme aimed at alleviating poverty for the poorest farmers. Ie non land owners.

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[oldthaihand99]

Where there is Thaksin, there is a way. Thaksin thinks, Pheu Thai acts ... taxpayers are screwed anyways...

Robin Hood takes from the rich (tax payers) to give to the poor (rice farmers).

The poor have been screwed for too long by the old elite.

Tax payers are now the rich. Really!!

Relative to the poor (non tax payers)? Yes.

But they are monkeys, so their vote shouldn't count.

[casualbiker]

Where there is Thaksin, there is a way. Thaksin thinks, Pheu Thai acts ... taxpayers are screwed anyways...

Robin Hood takes from the rich (tax payers) to give to the poor (rice farmers).

The poor have been screwed for too long by the old elite.

Tax payers are now the rich. Really!!

Relative to the poor (non tax payers)? Yes.

But they are monkeys, so their vote shouldn't count.

This is Thailand there are millions of non tax payers. The food shop you eat in. The market stall you buy your fruit from. Most if not all have a house. Car etc.

They aren't poor. They just don't pay tax.

Good Init!!

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[oldthaihand99]

Robin Hood takes from the rich (tax payers) to give to the poor (rice farmers).

The poor have been screwed for too long by the old elite.

Tax payers are now the rich. Really!!

Relative to the poor (non tax payers)? Yes.

But they are monkeys, so their vote shouldn't count.

This is Thailand there are millions of non tax payers. The food shop you eat in. The market stall you buy your fruit from. Most if not all have a house. Car etc.

They aren't poor. They just don't pay tax.

Good Init!!

Sent from my XT1032 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Sure, most of the non tax paying poverty stricken rice laborers in Thailand own their own fully paid for mansions & rolls royces. They also climb trees in their spare time & live on a diet of 100% bananas. Thanks be to G_d, er Tax_in.

[GentlemanJim]

Where there is Thaksin, there is a way. Thaksin thinks, Pheu Thai acts ... taxpayers are screwed anyways...

Robin Hood takes from the rich (tax payers) to give to the poor (rice farmers).

The poor have been screwed for too long by the old elite.

Yeah but I never remember reading the bit in the story where your Robin Hood steals from the rich, says he is going to give it to the poor but keeps it himself anyway, and then steals some more from the poor who willingly part with money they can't afford to because they all anticipate they are going to be rich in 6 months because Robin Hood promised them so.

It seems the poor will continue to be screwed by the new elite (that's your man, Robin Hood)

Edited January 24, 2014 by GentlemanJim

[JRSoul]

Robin Hood takes from the rich (tax payers) to give to the poor (rice farmers).

The poor have been screwed for too long by the old elite.

I know you aren't interested in the facts behind the Robin Hood myth, but I still haven't come across the Hollywood version where Robin becomes a multi-billionaire, installs his thieves as government, and gives them orders from abroad.

[wprime]

Where there is Thaksin, there is a way. Thaksin thinks, Pheu Thai acts ... taxpayers are screwed anyways...

Robin Hood takes from the rich (tax payers) to give to the poor (rice farmers).

The poor have been screwed for too long by the old elite.

and now they're getting screwed over by the rich elite. The only difference is that the new elites take a much larger cut.

[Soutpeel]

Thaksin made the assessment during an interview and it was his personal opinion not the Government. It was his opinion based on his prediction on global food production of the time. If I am contradicting Thaksin, who cares?

It was his personal opinion but not the op

<deleted>! You don't know that Thaksin OWNS the government?

You think so??? How??? I don't he OWNS.

You really, really should read the Thaksin Shinawatra wiki : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thaksin_Shinawatra

and the Phua Thai wiki : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pheu_Thai_Party

last but not least :

ts thinks.jpg

Still cannot convinced me with these wiki things. No proof that Thaksin OWNS the government.

Conclusive proof ladies and gentlemen that immigration should require an IQ test before issuing a visa to come to Thailand

[rogerdee123]

Where there is Thaksin, there is a way. Thaksin thinks, Pheu Thai acts ... taxpayers are screwed anyways...

Robin Hood takes from the rich (tax payers) to give to the poor (rice farmers).

The poor have been screwed for too long by the old elite.

hmmmm .... the poor being screwed by the old elite .... hmmm .... Nana and cowboy keep coming to mind .... need to get my mind out of the gutter .....

[Thai at Heart]

IMO the only problem I see with this article is the fact that the Gov't bought the rice at a price higher than the market is right now. So no matter how much they sell, there's no way to fund all the payouts.

Any which way they try to spin this they're screwed

The Government did not at any time said it is a profit making scheme. It is a scheme to raise the quality of life of rice farmers. This will encourage the younger general into rice farming to support the national food security plan. Rice farming has been supporting the growth and expansion of related industries.

If everyone got paid 40% over the price their goods are worth of course they are raised out of poverty temporarily - however now the whole country is being plunged into a spiral of debt and it has a huge excess of an overpriced commodity nobody will buy because they can get the same elsewhere 40% cheaper. Alright, forget about business and profit, how does it help the country when there is no money left to pay for hospitals, education etc etc. because it has all been pissed away paying the farmers to create the rice mountain, how does this benefit the country in general ? It benefits PT because it keeps their voter base happy. And screw the rest of you. Fiscal stupidity of the worst kind...

The government is not in some perilous spiral of debt. Calm down.

45%,of GDP is still manageable. Doesn't mean that the rice thing is a good policy though.

[icommunity]

IMO the only problem I see with this article is the fact that the Gov't bought the rice at a price higher than the market is right now. So no matter how much they sell, there's no way to fund all the payouts.

Any which way they try to spin this they're screwed

The Government did not at any time said it is a profit making scheme. It is a scheme to raise the quality of life of rice farmers. This will encourage the younger general into rice farming to support the national food security plan. Rice farming has been supporting the growth and expansion of related industries.

If everyone got paid 40% over the price their goods are worth of course they are raised out of poverty temporarily - however now the whole country is being plunged into a spiral of debt and it has a huge excess of an overpriced commodity nobody will buy because they can get the same elsewhere 40% cheaper. Alright, forget about business and profit, how does it help the country when there is no money left to pay for hospitals, education etc etc. because it has all been pissed away paying the farmers to create the rice mountain, how does this benefit the country in general ? It benefits PT because it keeps their voter base happy. And screw the rest of you. Fiscal stupidity of the worst kind...

The government is not in some perilous spiral of debt. Calm down.

45%,of GDP is still manageable. Doesn't mean that the rice thing is a good policy though.

Oppositions of the government kept talking about spiral of debt. AV, when warned by BOT that his populist policies - subsidies and handouts, might cause public debt to surge past the legal debt ceiling of no more than 50% of GDP,countered the BoT's warning by claiming it was just expression of opinion in a technical manner. Is he still using the same argument?