Another one bites the dust...

[Showbags]

But people can change, even things that seemed fundamental to their nature before, happens all the time.

Agree that it's only a very small percentage of the total, and very rarely in any one person's life.

But it is possible, better to get taken once in a while than go through life as a cynic not trusting anyone.

Correct that people can change. 1st though they need to feel the need themselves to change. Introspection a.o. Being open for critizism from others, maybe repeatedly, can help to. As some other posters have indicated, the thai culture of face, lack of critical thinking and expressing it and lack of confrontation, will complicate the possible change of a person. With devastating consequences for many. Just my opinion though.

If you're narsicistic or borderline, and I dislike those 'labels', you will have built up your own reality where you are the victim and someone else is always at fault. Anyone who has known a real narcissist know the truth of this. These people don't just change unless they have some event happen to them which overpowers their fake reality, like the loss of a family member. For a narcissist to truly change would mean facing the fact that they not the world are the problem and that is essentially to change their entire understanding of the world.

A LOT of therapy would be needed. Therefore, best to learn how to recognize people like that before they bring their suffering on you too, because very, very few are going to fundamentally change.

Where would they find that therapy here....l know someone that needs it....not easy to find l believe

i am looking to invest in a business in thailand. maybe i can help you. if you need a partner, let me know.

are you ssking him or his wife ?

[thailiketoo]

My first rule with girlfriends/ wives is that everything should be based on an equal basis.

i.e. we both contribute 50% each and we are equal type people.

Agree with you but the reality is the overwhelming majority of non thai male - thai female relationships would not exist if it weren't for financial disparity and assistance.

Ancient ancestor once say, “Even wise man cannot fathom depth of woman’s smile.” (The Shanghai Cobra)

[DGIE]

My first rule with girlfriends/ wives is that everything should be based on an equal basis.

i.e. we both contribute 50% each and we are equal type people.

Agree with you but the reality is the overwhelming majority of non thai male - thai female relationships would not exist if it weren't for financial disparity and assistance.

Ancient ancestor once say, “Even wise man cannot fathom depth of woman’s smile.” (The Shanghai Cobra)

But how about if the OP is not wise man?

But ancestors had long been gone. We are now Hi-tech.

So we can now fathom the woman's smile

Edited January 28, 2014 by DGIE

[harryfrompattaya]

Sorry to hear if it to you anyone it can happen to anyone. You were so positive so happy with your wife the opposite of me and so stupid but they just are con artists Just pay them the account you can afford and realize that it all any Farang has with a Thai Wife

[thailiketoo]

Agree with you but the reality is the overwhelming majority of non thai male - thai female relationships would not exist if it weren't for financial disparity and assistance.

Ancient ancestor once say, “Even wise man cannot fathom depth of woman’s smile.” (The Shanghai Cobra)

But how about if the OP is not wise man?

But ancestors had long been gone. We are now Hi-tech.

So we can now fathom the woman's smile

I think Hi Tech relative to women means we find out how stupid we (men) are quicker.

[DGIE]

i am looking to invest in a business in thailand. maybe i can help you. if you need a partner, let me know.

are you ssking him or his wife ?

maybe offering to be a partner in life. OP already got a lesson

[harryfrompattaya]

really out of curiosity, i notice that you did have more than 3000 messages on tv, so here my question: Are you one of those members

who spent their times claiming how much their gf/wife is different, that she come from a good family, she is so honest, you can trust her with you life, she will never harm you, she is the best thing that did happen in your life, and she love you maak????!

(Well inspite of warning, the cultural gap, language barriere, difference of wealth, her family, etc etc)

Because if you are one of them, who spent his times to spread myths and <deleted> on tv, well in fact you might have fooled some other members, but the biggest victims is...you!

Now its time for some weeks holidays, and after to start to build back yourself, and dont run again in the same problems as it seems that some never learn.......

You could be right

Edited January 28, 2014 by harryfrompattaya

[harryfrompattaya]

Sorty to read about your situation. Am rocking myself the same boat. NPD might come in question 2. You have been suckered for money.....i will probably loose my kids because of it. Evilness has no meaning for people like that. Big issue, as you deal with 2, is that the circle of your wife does not understand the disease of your wife and the fact that you are a foreigner does not help 2.

Be happy its only money...and not kids....the feeling of deceit and being played with is similar ofcourse. Devastating.

Good luck for u.

I wouldn't care so much if it was my money - the sad thing is that it's also other people's money - although I will find a way to repay and all will be ok in the end.

Sorry to hear your story. I am confident of keeping the kids but nothing is certain. I hope you can find a way to maintain access to your kids. If you think NPD might be involved, try to research it to help in your battle.

Maybe you conned the investors.

Likely for you I was not a investor or I will be visiting you with Le Roy.

[transam]

Many here forget that the OP is not alone with his problem. Am sure that in the future many will find out they have a similar problem. Guaranteed, maybe not on the same financial scale but similar stuff.........

[DGIE]

Agree with you but the reality is the overwhelming majority of non thai male - thai female relationships would not exist if it weren't for financial disparity and assistance.

Ancient ancestor once say, “Even wise man cannot fathom depth of woman’s smile.” (The Shanghai Cobra)

But how about if the OP is not wise man?

But ancestors had long been gone. We are now Hi-tech.

So we can now fathom the woman's smile

I think Hi Tech relative to women means we find out how stupid we (men) are quicker.

But there is always exemption to something. Maybe some men are not that hi-tech when it comes to women Cannot fathom woman/s smile

[harryfrompattaya]

Strange that you can, as the business owner and manager, let debts become so large, without knowing about it.

Anyway, by the sounds of it you have a good business, so work around it and trade out if you can...think how good the future will be without her and her hands in the till........head down, arse up and make it happen.....for the kids if nothing else.

Thanks for the positive advice/outlook...

I was of course very stupid and there are about 20 other people who were stupid - but my wife was very clever to control information flow between people so although we all knew something, none of us knew the full story.

The business was growing so fast that it made sense (on paper) we had debt, and I knew about a lot of it, but I didn't know interest or repayments had not been made and that follow on loans had been made (so the total debt is more than double what we knew about and with many people expecting repayment much sooner than we can pay).

Luckily most lenders have been very understanding and the senior managers have agreed to stick around and basically work for free until we repay suppliers/landlords/lenders, etc. There will be a tough couple of years but I'm confident and quite excited about the future thereafter with the leakage now blocked...

This story doesn't sound right,

You seem to come out of it being some poor old victim. Fishy!!!

excited about the future? sure sounds like you fell on your feet IM he may be conning the creditors

Not saying this about op but this trick was used by me 20 times 50 to 60 years to con investors in my pig farm

[harryfrompattaya]

really out of curiosity, i notice that you did have more than 3000 messages on tv, so here my question: Are you one of those members

who spent their times claiming how much their gf/wife is different, that she come from a good family, she is so honest, you can trust her with you life, she will never harm you, she is the best thing that did happen in your life, and she love you maak????!

(Well inspite of warning, the cultural gap, language barriere, difference of wealth, her family, etc etc)

Because if you are one of them, who spent his times to spread myths and <deleted> on tv, well in fact you might have fooled some other members, but the biggest victims is...you!

Now its time for some weeks holidays, and after to start to build back yourself, and dont run again in the same problems as it seems that some never learn.......

That is a very interesting post.

I'm one of the guys who didn't discover Thaivisa (or really know anything about Thailand) until AFTER I married my wife.

Now I would actually say my wife is very DIFFERENT because most Thai people are not evil monsters with NPD.

I am surprised that in the 2 years you have been a member of TV and bearing in mind how busy you have been with growing the business, that you've found time to write over 9 posts every day, on average. How's that? However, I can only assume that an audit has not been done, nor annual accounts, very strange!

Maybe looking for investors

[leosuntime]

Strange that you can, as the business owner and manager, let debts become so large, without knowing about it.

Anyway, by the sounds of it you have a good business, so work around it and trade out if you can...think how good the future will be without her and her hands in the till........head down, arse up and make it happen.....for the kids if nothing else.

Thanks for the positive advice/outlook...

I was of course very stupid and there are about 20 other people who were stupid - but my wife was very clever to control information flow between people so although we all knew something, none of us knew the full story.

The business was growing so fast that it made sense (on paper) we had debt, and I knew about a lot of it, but I didn't know interest or repayments had not been made and that follow on loans had been made (so the total debt is more than double what we knew about and with many people expecting repayment much sooner than we can pay).

Luckily most lenders have been very understanding and the senior managers have agreed to stick around and basically work for free until we repay suppliers/landlords/lenders, etc. There will be a tough couple of years but I'm confident and quite excited about the future thereafter with the leakage now blocked...

This story doesn't sound right,

You seem to come out of it being some poor old victim. Fishy!!!

excited about the future? sure sounds like you fell on your feet IM he may be conning the creditors

Not saying this about op but this trick was used by me 20 times 50 to 60 years to con investors in my pig farm

I agree very suspicious because this guy way too calm, its like he is explaining some one else's story, with no emotion

[mmh8]

Just to make it clear for all the info going out there about seeing signs. The sign of the true what ever abbreviation you use is to do so without getting caught. If you get caught you are not very succesful. Yes there are people out there like this, at least this one is not violent.

Also remember that the in laws are only interested in the kids and losing access to them. They will side with the daughter who has been promising to imporve and blaming things on you from day one.

Understand the mind you are dealing with and the cultrual gap , the parents will side with the daughter, so needs sorting out asoon as.

fair dos on the business, if you've done it the once you can do it again

[leosuntime]

I dont know if this is significant to tvf ppl but I worked in a casino for a long time

and all the staff used to complain about the customers...

when a punter loses, it does not matter who it is, your mum ur dad ur sister your brother a black a white a yellow a cripple..... they always instantly turn so selfish... ugly selfish when they lose

the punter will blame the bj machine, the cards, the room, the person sitting next to them, the dealer, EVERYTHING except them selves for coming in and putting the money on the table

a person who wasnt like this was sooooo rare it was gob smacking

ppl r extremely mystically geared, not logically

I kind of cant look at a person the same way again after working there ;_;

I know these women r biatches but there is no doubt in my mind that the other half was partly to blame in some way

[leosuntime]

I don't know if this strikes a chord with thai visa people but I used to work in a casio for a long time.

the staff there especially new staff who were not used to it would constantly complain about the customers.

it didnt matter who the punter was a mum, a dad, a grand pa or a grand ma, and son a daughter, a rich snob or poor trash, regular punters or first time punters!!

All of them, when they lose they would turn into the most ugly ppl. they would blame the Black Jack machine, they would blame the cards, they would blame

the TABLE!! they would blame the guy next to them, they would blame the dealer the inspector EVERY THING BUT NEVER THEMSELVES.

I dont look down on gamlers they work hard for their money and they deserve to spend it how they like.

I would always think to myself are these the ppl who followed hitler or stalin?? I dont have a clue if thats true but it would always pop in my head when people would get really bad.

my POINT is this, I know that women/thai women stole all your money anf your youth, but there is no doubt in my my the man is also to blame in some way, its in human nature to be narcissistic when you dont get your own way.

before I can to thailand I met a hot thai girl and her older husband and u can see that he always spoke at her, not with her, I could just see there relationship blowing up...

[brit1984]

i am looking to invest in a business in thailand. maybe i can help you. if you need a partner, let me know.

Please be careful.. if you invest on the back of every sob story you hear in Thailand you are going to be broke very quickly.

If you are really planning to invest in a business in Thailand, I recommend you speak to as many people with experience of doing business in Thailand and (most importantly) go to see the business (and observe it closely over a period of time), and don't invest anything until you really understand how the business makes money, why it will continue to make money and find a way to check that money will you go to you (that is not as simple as it sounds).... good luck!

[DGIE]

I don't know if this strikes a chord with thai visa people but I used to work in a casio for a long time.

the staff there especially new staff who were not used to it would constantly complain about the customers.

it didnt matter who the punter was a mum, a dad, a grand pa or a grand ma, and son a daughter, a rich snob or poor trash, regular punters or first time punters!!

All of them, when they lose they would turn into the most ugly ppl. they would blame the Black Jack machine, they would blame the cards, they would blame

the TABLE!! they would blame the guy next to them, they would blame the dealer the inspector EVERY THING BUT NEVER THEMSELVES.

I dont look down on gamlers they work hard for their money and they deserve to spend it how they like.

I would always think to myself are these the ppl who followed hitler or stalin?? I dont have a clue if thats true but it would always pop in my head when people would get really bad.

my POINT is this, I know that women/thai women stole all your money anf your youth, but there is no doubt in my my the man is also to blame in some way, its in human nature to be narcissistic when you dont get your own way.

before I can to thailand I met a hot thai girl and her older husband and u can see that he always spoke at her, not with her, I could just see there relationship blowing up...

NOT significant

like my posts

[brit1984]

I don't know if this strikes a chord with thai visa people but I used to work in a casio for a long time.

the staff there especially new staff who were not used to it would constantly complain about the customers.

it didnt matter who the punter was a mum, a dad, a grand pa or a grand ma, and son a daughter, a rich snob or poor trash, regular punters or first time punters!!

All of them, when they lose they would turn into the most ugly ppl. they would blame the Black Jack machine, they would blame the cards, they would blame

the TABLE!! they would blame the guy next to them, they would blame the dealer the inspector EVERY THING BUT NEVER THEMSELVES.

I dont look down on gamlers they work hard for their money and they deserve to spend it how they like.

I would always think to myself are these the ppl who followed hitler or stalin?? I dont have a clue if thats true but it would always pop in my head when people would get really bad.

my POINT is this, I know that women/thai women stole all your money anf your youth, but there is no doubt in my my the man is also to blame in some way, its in human nature to be narcissistic when you dont get your own way.

before I can to thailand I met a hot thai girl and her older husband and u can see that he always spoke at her, not with her, I could just see there relationship blowing up...

Thanks for your interesting insights into the psychology of casino clientele.

Of course, I am to blame for my situation - as a free man who has had the benefit of a decent education and many opportunities in life, I am responsible for my own destiny.

Not quite sure about your last point about an old man speaking at his wife - I'm the same age as my wife and she wore the trousers in our relationship.

[brit1984]

This story doesn't sound right,

You seem to come out of it being some poor old victim. Fishy!!!

excited about the future? sure sounds like you fell on your feet IM he may be conning the creditors

Not saying this about op but this trick was used by me 20 times 50 to 60 years to con investors in my pig farm

I agree very suspicious because this guy way too calm, its like he is explaining some one else's story, with no emotion

I'm sure your suspicious tendencies will serve you well in life - good for you.

[cosmont]

really out of curiosity, i notice that you did have more than 3000 messages on tv, so here my question: Are you one of those members

who spent their times claiming how much their gf/wife is different, that she come from a good family, she is so honest, you can trust her with you life, she will never harm you, she is the best thing that did happen in your life, and she love you maak????!

(Well inspite of warning, the cultural gap, language barriere, difference of wealth, her family, etc etc)

Because if you are one of them, who spent his times to spread myths and <deleted> on tv, well in fact you might have fooled some other members, but the biggest victims is...you!

Now its time for some weeks holidays, and after to start to build back yourself, and dont run again in the same problems as it seems that some never learn.......

That is a very interesting post.

I'm one of the guys who didn't discover Thaivisa (or really know anything about Thailand) until AFTER I married my wife.

Now I would actually say my wife is very DIFFERENT because most Thai people are not evil monsters with NPD.

I have also met a similar Thai devil. Within a few years, it end in a divorce when I discovered her same bad side.

After the divorce who cost me lot of money to compensate her, she used the kid to blackmail and get more and more money and Thai justice doesn't care about it, I wasted 3 years in court, she is the mother and Thai, she can't even be blame !

Now she give me a break as she found another poor folk to treat in the same way. It will take some years to him to discover what monster he married... love make people blind...

Seems lot farangs don't learn about other farang stories. Luckily, I was aware and never involved her in my business and got prenuptial aggreement, so I saved my AS/SET even she tried to get half.

I wish you good luck for the future, you did not mention if she ran away with the kids or not... more than the money and wife Relationship, it might be the next painful point...

Luckily mine is not really interested in the kids, other than her dream (which in her mind is reality) that they will become celebrities and share their fame and fortune with her.

With regards to her trying to taking money from me, the situation now (partly through design) is such that I will have no significant money until lenders/creditors have been made good (which will be a couple of years at least) and my wife will soon realize the only way for her to continue the lifestyle she feels accustomed to is to remarry (at which point I can trade divorce for custody of the kids) so by the time I have income/wealth again, she will have most likely forgotten I have existed (or been replaced in her mind by her dreamed up evil ex-husband who was too slow to make her as rich as she deserves).

Well, exactly the same dream of TV superstar...

Yeah correct about she need to remarry and find a new guy to support her as my ex wife did but until it's happen, you still her source of wealth and she might never realise that you could be short of cash (that kind of woman live in a dream world).

And if she get strong advice from a lawyer/friends/family, she might bargain the divorce and child custody, beware that as the mom, she will get the custody for sure until you can prove that she is bad for the kids, except if she was drug addict, etc

I still remember my ex wife counting the few hundred thousand bath notes per notes in front the officer at the ampur before to sign, won't married again brit1984, believe me.

Yeah in Thailand, some guys pay for marry (sinsod), some guys pay for divorce (as I did), and some guys pay 2 times I guess, this is the amazing Thailand isn't it ?

Edited January 28, 2014 by cosmont

[DGIE]

i am looking to invest in a business in thailand. maybe i can help you. if you need a partner, let me know.

Were you the one who wanted to transfer millions to my account and come here for a profitable business?

[DGIE]

That is a very interesting post.

I'm one of the guys who didn't discover Thaivisa (or really know anything about Thailand) until AFTER I married my wife.

Now I would actually say my wife is very DIFFERENT because most Thai people are not evil monsters with NPD.

I have also met a similar Thai devil. Within a few years, it end in a divorce when I discovered her same bad side.

After the divorce who cost me lot of money to compensate her, she used the kid to blackmail and get more and more money and Thai justice doesn't care about it, I wasted 3 years in court, she is the mother and Thai, she can't even be blame !

Now she give me a break as she found another poor folk to treat in the same way. It will take some years to him to discover what monster he married... love make people blind...

Seems lot farangs don't learn about other farang stories. Luckily, I was aware and never involved her in my business and got prenuptial aggreement, so I saved my AS/SET even she tried to get half.

I wish you good luck for the future, you did not mention if she ran away with the kids or not... more than the money and wife Relationship, it might be the next painful point...

With regards to her trying to taking money from me, the situation now (partly through design) is such that I will have no significant money until lenders/creditors have been made good (which will be a couple of years at least) and my wife will soon realize the only way for her to continue the lifestyle she feels accustomed to is to remarry (at which point I can trade divorce for custody of the kids) so by the time I have income/wealth again, she will have most likely forgotten I have existed (or been replaced in her mind by her dreamed up evil ex-husband who was too slow to make her as rich as she deserves).

Yeah correct about she need to remarry and find a new guy to support her as my ex wife did but until it's happen, you still her source of wealth and she might never realise that you could be short of cash (that kind of woman live in a dream world).

And if she get strong advice from a lawyer/friends/family, she might bargain the divorce and child custody, beware that as the mom, she will get the custody for sure until you can prove that she is bad for the kids, except if she was drug addict, etc

I still remember my ex wife counting the few hundred thousand bath notes per notes in front the officer at the ampur before to sign, won't married again brit1984, believe me.

Yeah in Thailand, some guys pay for marry (sinsod), some guys pay for divorce (as I did), and some guys pay 2 times I guess, this is the amazing Thailand isn't it ?

I am started thinking if I am going to pay the first payment or not because what I am reading from your post, mates.

hmmnn. But my girlfriend is so beautiful?

[wym]

People here are talking as if it's the money that's important.

Or FEELINGS fucrissakes!

No - it's the KIDS. OP, please do make a plan and start to execute ASAP to get 100% full custody of the kids, and if you think it necessary a back-home TPR as I outlined earlier.

Yes you may need to go further into hock.

If you can build a case for prosecuting her for embezzlement - I'm not advising actually getting her jailed, just use it as a bargaining chip to get her to sign.

The other posters are right in that it is very likely she will be able to get custody, and even if she doesn't give a hoot about the kids themselves as people, she'll realize that's a way to guarantee an income stream for life from you.

Easiest is to just pay her off, in effect buy the kids from her.

Be prepared too that you may need to build a case for her being unfit, dealing drugs etc - do whatever it takes given what's at stake the ends justify the means.

Once you have 100% legal control anywhere in the world, only THEN can you relax and focus on the less important stuff like rebuilding the business and a new life. Keep your priorities straight. . .

[FiftyTwo]

People here are talking as if it's the money that's important.

Or FEELINGS fucrissakes!

No - it's the KIDS. OP, please do make a plan and start to execute ASAP to get 100% full custody of the kids, and if you think it necessary a back-home TPR as I outlined earlier.

Kids seem to do pretty well on their own in Thailand.

Many people claim to care about "kids", very few go out of their way for them (me included).

[thailiketoo]

People here are talking as if it's the money that's important.

Or FEELINGS fucrissakes!

No - it's the KIDS. OP, please do make a plan and start to execute ASAP to get 100% full custody of the kids, and if you think it necessary a back-home TPR as I outlined earlier.

Kids seem to do pretty well on their own in Thailand.

Many people claim to care about "kids", very few go out of their way for them (me included).

Maybe it is just a coincidence but three of my neighbors during the past 5 years have been raising a child not their own as part of their family. That is quite a high percent if you figure I have lived in 3 different locations.

I have seen a far greater incidence of children raised by non parents in Thailand rather than institutionalize the child as done in the West. You know like Oliver Twist.

[wym]

Kids seem to do pretty well on their own in Thailand.

Many people claim to care about "kids", very few go out of their way for them (me included).

Your definition of "pretty well" I'm sure doesn't accord with what I want for the spawn of my own loins.

A parent that isn't willing to make serious sacrifices to give their kids the best possible shot for a solid and happy future IMO, well hard to put into words the contempt I feel for them, and you're right there are many.

And obviously love attention stability consistency and good role-models are all infinitely more important than what money can buy - food/housing/clothing/schooling, but the latter are important too IMO.

And when you're doing it right as a parent, what you get back from them is worth many many times more than any sacrifice made, absolutely priceless, I sincerely pity those that miss out on that from doing it wrong. Obviously choosing not to spawn is perfectly valid, and much better from an ecological ethics POV, but if you do end up bringing more souls into the world, planned or not, IMO you should do the right thing by them.

[brit1984]

People here are talking as if it's the money that's important.

Or FEELINGS fucrissakes!

No - it's the KIDS. OP, please do make a plan and start to execute ASAP to get 100% full custody of the kids, and if you think it necessary a back-home TPR as I outlined earlier.

Yes you may need to go further into hock.

If you can build a case for prosecuting her for embezzlement - I'm not advising actually getting her jailed, just use it as a bargaining chip to get her to sign.

The other posters are right in that it is very likely she will be able to get custody, and even if she doesn't give a hoot about the kids themselves as people, she'll realize that's a way to guarantee an income stream for life from you.

Easiest is to just pay her off, in effect buy the kids from her.

Be prepared too that you may need to build a case for her being unfit, dealing drugs etc - do whatever it takes given what's at stake the ends justify the means.

Once you have 100% legal control anywhere in the world, only THEN can you relax and focus on the less important stuff like rebuilding the business and a new life. Keep your priorities straight. . .

Thank you very much for this post and for really forcing the point - you are of course absolutely right that what is important here is the kids and I have to keep that in mind as I'm surrounded by people who (given their positioning in this story) are more focused on the business side of things.

The business is of course super important, not only from the perspective of my moral obligation to repay the creditors but also as my main chance of creating the kind of income/wealth later that will be needed to give my kids a good upbringing as their financial requirements (especially education) develop.

Offering my wife a pay-off for custody is something I am thinking about, but she hasn't asked me for a divorce yet and I am not in a position to offer her much anyway so that might need to wait, especially as it could compromise another option, which is just to take them back to the UK.

I am now considering the logic of such a move - I need to think about the strategy/logistics/legalities of how I would get them out of Thailand and (more importantly) how I would properly take care of them (and continue to oversee the restructuring of the business) from back home.

[wym]

Offering my wife a pay-off for custody is something I am thinking about, but she hasn't asked me for a divorce yet and I am not in a position to offer her much anyway so that might need to wait, especially as it could compromise another option, which is just to take them back to the UK.

I am now considering the logic of such a move - I need to think about the strategy/logistics/legalities of how I would get them out of Thailand and (more importantly) how I would properly take care of them (and continue to oversee the restructuring of the business) from back home.

You will not be allowed to leave for the UK with your kids without her permission, which of course you will have to pay for one way or the other.

If you do find a way to do so, it is very likely the UK authorities would consider it a case of parental kidnapping which would VERY much count against you in any custody proceedings in a western jurisdiction.

No such thing as parental kidnapping here within Asia BTW, which of course cuts both ways.

You need to do the simple Amphur/Khaet style divorce as I outlined earlier, that is technically enough if it states even handwritten by the registrar there that she agrees the kids are in your care, but for belt-and-suspenders get her to sign an explicit permission to take them out of the country before you head for the airport.

Many TG in this position will accept what you would think is a relatively small sum for this, as most mothers want what's best for the kids and she's most likely not interested in taking responsibility for them anyway.

You might also offer her an additional payout over time, even if she doesn't trust your word you can make an official contract enforceable with penalties etc.

Don't set foot in a western jurisdiction until you have this resolved, since her "natural rights as the birth mother" will give her enormous power to make your life miserable, to the point where you have to get permission from a court to move to a different location.

Realise if she's motivated she can get another sponsor to bring her over and pay for lawyers.

I speak from experience here.

[brit1984]

Offering my wife a pay-off for custody is something I am thinking about, but she hasn't asked me for a divorce yet and I am not in a position to offer her much anyway so that might need to wait, especially as it could compromise another option, which is just to take them back to the UK.

I am now considering the logic of such a move - I need to think about the strategy/logistics/legalities of how I would get them out of Thailand and (more importantly) how I would properly take care of them (and continue to oversee the restructuring of the business) from back home.

You will not be allowed to leave for the UK with your kids without her permission, which of course you will have to pay for one way or the other.

If you do find a way to do so, it is very likely the UK authorities would consider it a case of parental kidnapping which would VERY much count against you in any custody proceedings in a western jurisdiction.

No such thing as parental kidnapping here within Asia BTW, which of course cuts both ways.

You need to do the simple Amphur/Khaet style divorce as I outlined earlier, that is technically enough if it states even handwritten by the registrar there that she agrees the kids are in your care, but for belt-and-suspenders get her to sign an explicit permission to take them out of the country before you head for the airport.

Many TG in this position will accept what you would think is a relatively small sum for this, as most mothers want what's best for the kids and she's most likely not interested in taking responsibility for them anyway.

You might also offer her an additional payout over time, even if she doesn't trust your word you can make an official contract enforceable with penalties etc.

Don't set foot in a western jurisdiction until you have this resolved, since her "natural rights as the birth mother" will give her enormous power to make your life miserable, to the point where you have to get permission from a court to move to a different location.

Realise if she's motivated she can get another sponsor to bring her over and pay for lawyers.

I speak from experience here.

Another great (and super useful) post thanks!