Thai govt's legal woes intensify

[djjamie]

If Thaksin became the leader of the DEMS then the DEMS would be dissolved within 4 years too. He is a criminal leader. It is to be expected. He abused his power and was corrupt. You cannot expect the govt he runs now to be any different.

If Thaksin is a leader of dem, he would be supported by the courts, independence agencies, military and the darling of the 'old elites'. Unfortunately, he was the leader of the people who elected him for fulfilling all election promises.

When you used an illegal means such as coup to get a person convicted, the judges of the courts, independence agencies lost all credibility, legitimacy, transparency, efficacy. This is what we are facing now. Who do you think you are - a result of coup.

Send from my Mobile

If he was the leader of a Sunday School, the sunday school would be closed down for embezzling money.

Of course Thaksin would them blame God for that and would say he is no longer independent and God has no credibility and legitimacy.

Sent from my shoe phone

[icommunity]

If Thaksin became the leader of the DEMS then the DEMS would be dissolved within 4 years too. He is a criminal leader. It is to be expected. He abused his power and was corrupt. You cannot expect the govt he runs now to be any different.

If Thaksin is a leader of dem, he would be supported by the courts, independence agencies, military and the darling of the 'old elites'. Unfortunately, he was the leader of the people who elected him for fulfilling all election promises.

When you used an illegal means such as coup to get a person convicted, the judges of the courts, independence agencies lost all credibility, legitimacy, transparency, efficacy. This is what we are facing now. Who do you think you are - a result of coup.

Send from my Mobile

If he was the leader of a Sunday School, the sunday school would be closed down for embezzling money.

Of course Thaksin would them blame God for that and would say he is no longer independent and God has no credibility and legitimacy.

Sent from my shoe phone

Do not bear false witness. Speak the truth and the truth shall set you free. Do not judge or you you will be judged with same measure.

You have no conclusive evidence that Thaksin runs the Government. It was baseless, not substantiated, purely speculative and politically motivated. He is a politically persecuted person.

"....Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God. Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the Kingdom of heaven. Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you...... "

TRT/Thaksin is the first politically party that fulfilled all its election promises within its term. His reform initiatives that benefited the Oppressed were accused as populist policies. The Oppressed were released and awakened of their political, social and judicial rights, duties and responsibilities.

If Thaksin was the leader of a Sunday School, the oppressed will be released.

[Thaddeus]

If Thaksin became the leader of the DEMS then the DEMS would be dissolved within 4 years too. He is a criminal leader. It is to be expected. He abused his power and was corrupt. You cannot expect the govt he runs now to be any different.

If Thaksin is a leader of dem, he would be supported by the courts, independence agencies, military and the darling of the 'old elites'. Unfortunately, he was the leader of the people who elected him for fulfilling all election promises.

When you used an illegal means such as coup to get a person convicted, the judges of the courts, independence agencies lost all credibility, legitimacy, transparency, efficacy. This is what we are facing now. Who do you think you are - a result of coup.

Send from my Mobile

You have mentioned about "he was the leader of the people who elected him for fulfilling all election promises" before.

Can you remember them?

Here is the list of promises.

• national minimum daily wage of Bt300 ($10) nationally
• Universal medical care with patients making a co-payment of Bt30 ($1) per consultation
• Credit cards for farmers and a guaranteed price of Bt15,000 – Bt20,000 ($488 – $651) per ton for unmilled rice
• A moratorium for household debt up to Bt500,000 ($16,285) per household, with emphasis on debt reduction for teachers, farmers and civil servants
• A minimum monthly salary of Bt15,000 ($500) for university graduates and a “One Tablet-PC per Child” project for school children
• A 23.3 per cent reduction in corporate tax rates in the first year (from 30 to 20 percent) with a further 13 percent reduction in its second year to a flat 20 percent.
• Reduced taxes for first home and first car buyers
• A standard Bt20 (65 cent) fare for all Bangkok’s mass transit rail lines (MRT)
• High-speed rail lines linking major provincial cities in the north, northeast, east and upper south regions
• Rural village development funds of between Bt300,000 and Bt1 million ($9,770 – $32,573) per year
• A welfare allowance of Bt600 ($19.55) per month for citizens over 60, increasing by Bt100 ($3.20) at 70, and 80, and rising by a further Bt200 ($6.40) at 90.
• Free Wi-Fi and Internet access in public places
• 30km (18.8 mile) of levees to protect Bangkok and satellite towns from Gulf of Thailand tidal surges.
• Special administrative status for Muslim provinces in the violence-plagued southern provinces
• A war on drugs
• Amnesty for political offenses committed since 2006

The list of completed promises is much shorter, only really includes making rich people richer and thousands of innocents being murdered.

[RubbaJohnny]

Democrat leader Abhisit Vejjajiva said the party would today lodge a petition with the Constitu-tional Court against the government for holding the poll unconstitutionally. The government violated Article 68, he said. This article prohibits people from exercising a right with the aim of overthrowing the democratic system, or of acquiring power to rule the country by any means not in accordance with the Constitution.

That sounds an awful lot like what Suthep is doing (with Abhisit playing a supporting role). Of course, it's up to the EC to hold the election according to the constitution. It would've actually been unconstitutional to delay it - but that makes no difference to the Democrats and the 'independent agencies'. The CC said the election *could* be delayed if the govt and EC agreed, yet they did not cite the constitution in making their decision, but rather a precedent (which isn't actually a precedent) from 2006.

Abhisit knows this, of course, but for all his talk about the rule of law, he's actually just another entirely cynical politician who's willing to do whatever it takes. No different to Thaksin and Suthep really. A shame because a few years ago I actually believed he was relatively honest and high minded. It's just ironic that those who continually accuse the govt of violating the constitution have such clear disregard for what it actually says.

Are you serious thinking this is all about Suthep being the head man and Abhisit is only playing a supporting role

You have no idea do you

Suthep is just playing a small role in a much larger chess game

The real players a behind in the shadows

Spot on the fair in the air conditioning sent the brown chaps out in the blazing sun as pawns,there is justice free of corruption and nepotism and the thai way.

[tingtongteesood]

Here we go with the attempt at de-legitimizing the whole thing and playing with the interpretation of the democratic system and its constitution.. Not surprising in the slightest this is what Mark and co were always going to do and has been expected by many...

And is there even a millisecond of doubt that had the Dems been in power and committed such malfeasance as PT have that they would not do the exact same thing ? So quit your whining, this is politics in action.

Hope this results in all the Shins being banned. I want a reform to life bans before they get banned...

[Scamper]

" Yingluck wants new voting to be held in constituencies and provinces where the election was disrupted on Sunday, a source said. The goal was to meet the minimum number of seats in the House required to elect a new premier and function as soon as possible. "

Why should the goal be only meeting the " minimum number of seats required " ? If Yingluck is implying leaving out some areas of the country that are not necessary to the mathematical equation, then she risks stoking not only further regional resentment, but another constitutional crisis. Elections should be held in 100 % of the country. These areas may not be supporters of the Pheu Thai party, but they are part of the country. Yingluck should be more precise in her statements if she wants to avoid ambiguity.

[tingtongteesood]

To those who refused to see it coming... here's a judicial coup!

However, Article 68 should really be used against the inappropriately named Democrats. If PTP don't counter-attack, they will be bundled out of office.

Many may not grieve to see the back of this gaggle of incompetents, but if the proposed 'reformation' goes through how long will it be before Thais see a democratically elected government again? The Suthepistas are essentially proposing a return to 1932 when the People's Party installed a limited form of democracy so that the rich and powerful could elect a Senate. Universal suffrage followed fairly quickly - perhaps too quickly for some people.

Judicial coup my ass ! The courts are just doing their job, investigating crimes and passing judgements on criminals. The Dems waited for PT to give enough rope to hang themselves, they have done that and then some. This is the courts job and what they are supposed to IN A DEMOCRACY.,

[tingtongteesood]

I foresee great violence if election cannot solve problems and allowed to be blocked and considered as unconstitutional. This is my opinion and anyone can disagree. I will not reply any rebuttal unless you come up with a suggestion of a solution.

Reform before election is not a suggestion since 50 parties wanted reform to run parallel with election. Demanding PM YS to step down is also not a solution because it violate law related to Royal Decree.

Actually, only 1 party really wanted to run an election. There are smaller parties loyal to Taksin who just obeyed orders. The rest were just scared they may miss out on their best chance ever to get anywhere since the Dems were out having the morality, foresight and standards to boycott a bullshit waste of time and money.

[tingtongteesood]

This mob needs to regroup, rethink, renew, and come up with better ideas. Their reliance on the courts will get them nowhere. They need to work with what they have and make themselves relevant to the voters. That should have been their focus in the first place after the defeat of the amnesty bill. They made a huge mistake by threatening, intimidating, cajoling, attacking. Poor strategies, rejected by the people. Now Thailand needs a strong opposition but not street marches and endless court cases

I agree with what you say here, but the current court cases are necessary. there have been mistakes and some things should never have happened. I still believe their initial intentions of removing the Shin's and reforms are the right way to go. There does need to be new blood in politics and they need to have real platforms and real ideas. Difficult. Politics is an expensive game to play so ipso facto only the so called 'elites' are able to play the game and most of them have personal agendas. This is one of the big problems.

[billd766]

Amazing how so many people can leap to a decision based on the quoted section of the Constitution without hearing the legal argument. If the case has no merit it will be thrown out.

Much like the PTP government.

Yes, because you are well known on TVF for logical, reason and well thought out debate! and never ever jumping to a conclusion!

Unlike you of course. You could never be accused of anything like that.

[Thait Spot]

Legal woes followed by spritual woes......

Caretaker PM working at Defence Permanent Secretary's Office; CMPO chief advisor Surapong to seek arrest warrant for Phra Bhudda Issara /MCOT

That will look good when he's arrested under the gleaming eye of a camera.

[Bkkbound]

Nothing in the least bit surprising in this story, it could have been written weeks ago, I find the red supporters reactions on this site remarkably niave or just plain stupid. The story line is quite straight forward, the shins time is over. Whatever means are required to remove them from the political scene will be taken. The daily wailing about the tidal wave against Taksin is just drivel.

The election was a complete waste of time and money and a distraction from the issues facing the country, it may have got a few headlines but internationally its not given much credibility.

[djjamie]

If Thaksin became the leader of the DEMS then the DEMS would be dissolved within 4 years too. He is a criminal leader. It is to be expected. He abused his power and was corrupt. You cannot expect the govt he runs now to be any different.

If Thaksin is a leader of dem, he would be supported by the courts, independence agencies, military and the darling of the 'old elites'. Unfortunately, he was the leader of the people who elected him for fulfilling all election promises.

When you used an illegal means such as coup to get a person convicted, the judges of the courts, independence agencies lost all credibility, legitimacy, transparency, efficacy. This is what we are facing now. Who do you think you are - a result of coup.

Send from my Mobile

If he was the leader of a Sunday School, the sunday school would be closed down for embezzling money.

Of course Thaksin would them blame God for that and would say he is no longer independent and God has no credibility and legitimacy.

Sent from my shoe phone

Do not bear false witness. Speak the truth and the truth shall set you free. Do not judge or you you will be judged with same measure.

You have no conclusive evidence that Thaksin runs the Government. It was baseless, not substantiated, purely speculative and politically motivated. He is a politically persecuted person.

"....Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God. Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the Kingdom of heaven. Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you...... "

TRT/Thaksin is the first politically party that fulfilled all its election promises within its term. His reform initiatives that benefited the Oppressed were accused as populist policies. The Oppressed were released and awakened of their political, social and judicial rights, duties and responsibilities.

If Thaksin was the leader of a Sunday School, the oppressed will be released.

Ahhhhh, the ministry of propaganda is strong in this one.

True enlightenment, he has found. Searched for the truth, he has. Not corrupt, Thaksin is.

Thaksins return to clear his guilt, I look forward to. Biggest conspiracy in history, this must be.

You really are the poster boy that shows how criminals get into positions of power. Frightening actually. Sure your not from Zimbabwe?

[spirit47]

If Thaksin became the leader of the DEMS then the DEMS would be dissolved within 4 years too. He is a criminal leader. It is to be expected. He abused his power and was corrupt. You cannot expect the govt he runs now to be any different.

If Thaksin is a leader of dem, he would be supported by the courts, independence agencies, military and the darling of the 'old elites'. Unfortunately, he was the leader of the people who elected him for fulfilling all election promises.

When you used an illegal means such as coup to get a person convicted, the judges of the courts, independence agencies lost all credibility, legitimacy, transparency, efficacy. This is what we are facing now. Who do you think you are - a result of coup.

Send from my Mobile

If he was the leader of a Sunday School, the sunday school would be closed down for embezzling money.

Of course Thaksin would them blame God for that and would say he is no longer independent and God has no credibility and legitimacy.

Sent from my shoe phone

Do not bear false witness. Speak the truth and the truth shall set you free. Do not judge or you you will be judged with same measure.

You have no conclusive evidence that Thaksin runs the Government. It was baseless, not substantiated, purely speculative and politically motivated. He is a politically persecuted person.

"....Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God. Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the Kingdom of heaven. Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you...... "

TRT/Thaksin is the first politically party that fulfilled all its election promises within its term. His reform initiatives that benefited the Oppressed were accused as populist policies. The Oppressed were released and awakened of their political, social and judicial rights, duties and responsibilities.

If Thaksin was the leader of a Sunday School, the oppressed will be released.

And now hes a gang leader...

[djjamie]

Funny you say that. There was a DEM rally in Khon Kaen in 2013 and the innocent citizens went to hear what Abhisit had to say. The terrorist wing of the PTP were at the entrance intimidating them with threats of violence. Of course no police in site (principle of democracy - equal protection under the law)

Know what the reply I got from the UDD supporters were? The DEMS shouldn't have been there. (principle of democracy - freedom of movement) (principle of democracy - minority rights) (principle of democracy - freedom of speech) LA street gangs use that justification for murdering other gang members when they step on their "turf" as well.

Now without even thinking they opposed 4 principles of democracy in their dictatorial argument. They will kill for elections though. I see why now. So they can abuse every other principle of democracy. My pity for them is only surpassed by my fear of them.

[icommunity]

If Thaksin became the leader of the DEMS then the DEMS would be dissolved within 4 years too. He is a criminal leader. It is to be expected. He abused his power and was corrupt. You cannot expect the govt he runs now to be any different.

If Thaksin is a leader of dem, he would be supported by the courts, independence agencies, military and the darling of the 'old elites'. Unfortunately, he was the leader of the people who elected him for fulfilling all election promises.

When you used an illegal means such as coup to get a person convicted, the judges of the courts, independence agencies lost all credibility, legitimacy, transparency, efficacy. This is what we are facing now. Who do you think you are - a result of coup.

Send from my Mobile

If he was the leader of a Sunday School, the sunday school would be closed down for embezzling money.

Of course Thaksin would them blame God for that and would say he is no longer independent and God has no credibility and legitimacy.

Sent from my shoe phone

Do not bear false witness. Speak the truth and the truth shall set you free. Do not judge or you you will be judged with same measure.

You have no conclusive evidence that Thaksin runs the Government. It was baseless, not substantiated, purely speculative and politically motivated. He is a politically persecuted person.

"....Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God. Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the Kingdom of heaven. Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you...... "

TRT/Thaksin is the first politically party that fulfilled all its election promises within its term. His reform initiatives that benefited the Oppressed were accused as populist policies. The Oppressed were released and awakened of their political, social and judicial rights, duties and responsibilities.

If Thaksin was the leader of a Sunday School, the oppressed will be released.

Your reprly

#djjamie, on 04 Feb 2014 - 14:08, said: Posting #43

Ahhhhh, the ministry of propaganda is strong in this one.

True enlightenment, he has found. Searched for the truth, he has. Not corrupt, Thaksin is.

Thaksins return to clear his guilt, I look forward to. Biggest conspiracy in history, this must be.

You really are the poster boy that shows how criminals get into positions of power. Frightening actually. Sure your not from Zimbabwe?

My Response

Ahhhhhh, your self-righteous ugly head is surfacing. You can't reason any more and instead using insult.

Thaksins return to clear his guilt??? which one??? Is it the case on the prison term sentence? There is no appeal allowed, how you want him to return. Why was he guilty of obeying a law required of him? He signed to give permission for his ex-wife to buy property as required by law.

[icommunity]

Ahhhhh, the ministry of propaganda is strong in this one.

True enlightenment, he has found. Searched for the truth, he has. Not corrupt, Thaksin is.

Thaksins return to clear his guilt, I look forward to. Biggest conspiracy in history, this must be.

You really are the poster boy that shows how criminals get into positions of power. Frightening actually. Sure your not from Zimbabwe?

Ahhhhhh, your self-righteous ugly head is surfacing. You can't reason any more and instead using insult.

Thaksins return to clear his guilt??? which one??? Is it the case on the prison term sentence? There is no appeal allowed, how you want him to return. Why was he guilty of obeying a law required of him? He signed to give permission for his ex-wife to buy property as required by law.

[djjamie]

Thaksins evil started taking off when he became friends with the below coup leader. Thaksin didn't denounce THAT coup. He didn't say THAT coup was undemocratic. He did accept the coup leaders as a brother and even said "if not for you I would have nothing" So much for democracy. Only when it suits him.

Forgive me for not entertaining you with reasons why Thaksin is guilty. The courts have already done that. I have also had this argument more times than I care to remember so I do not like to keep bringing it up.

Suffice to say, Thaksin is in Dubai and that brings a warm glow to my heart (I hope that warm glow is not a UDD supporter burning it)

PS - Just because I have a head for radio you don't have to make fun of it.

Now take 10 deep breaths and say "I don't respect the law" 20 times.

[KimoMax]

Look at the Big Picture.

The Political maneuvering is a "Game of Wits" between the two opposing Ideals to win within the current Thai Constitution.

Thailand is not unlike the Laws and Courts around the World.

How many times have people been "Suprised" by a Court Verdict or Opinion in their own or other Countries.

In the end, it is all up to a Court's Interpretation and their "Opinion". Nothing else matters.

So the political wrangling will continue untlil one side or the other wins in Court, or a very unfortunate military coup which neither side (even the Military) seems to want.

The current government and Mr T is reported to not be on the malitia's fovorite list, altho there is said to have been some friend making of some of the malitia by Mr T.

Edited February 4, 2014 by KimoMax

[Bkkbound]

You have sat too long for any good you have been doing lately ... Depart, I say; and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go!

Thomas Cromwell 1653...

[dwcrist]

"Democrat leader Abhisit Vejjajiva said the party would today lodge a petition with the Constitu-tional Court against the government for holding the poll unconstitutionally. The government violated Article 68, he said. This article prohibits people from exercising a right with the aim of overthrowing the democratic system, or of acquiring power to rule the country by any means not in accordance with the Constitution."

Ok, so how did the government violate this article? I understand that they kept to what the Constitution prescribed for an election following a dissolution of the House. I seem to remember that it was the Democrat party that did not want to abide by the constitutional law and not hold elections at all in order to form an undefined, unelected (and therefore undemocratic) council. I am no law expert so please tell me, is that a way of "acquiring power to rule the country" that is "in accordance with the Constitution"?

This this seems like somebody purposely shooting at someone on live television for all to see and then immediately accusing them of murder. I cannot fathom the level of stupidity needed to understand much less make this accusation.

[gabruce]

The Nation continues to sink to a new low.

How so?

[Muhendis]

It now seems an even deeper morass into which the caretaker government is sinking.

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[millwall_fan]

If the judiciary were to take up these politically motivated claims by the Democrats it would amount to a judicial coup d'etat. They have done this once too often.

[whybother]

If PTP were disbanded and it's executives banned Yingluck would continue as PM (or care-taker PM) as she is not a party executive. The Democrats couldn't come to power as they are no longer MPs. Life in Thailand would continue as it is now ... paddling up sh!t creek.

[JRSoul]

If the judiciary were to take up these politically motivated claims by the Democrats it would amount to a judicial coup d'etat. They have done this once too often.

If a crime has been committed, what importance is the motivation of those reporting it? This is just a cop out, coupled with a pathetic catch-cry which attempts to avoid the recognition of law.

[Thait Spot]

If PTP were disbanded and it's executives banned Yingluck would continue as PM (or care-taker PM) as she is not a party executive. The Democrats couldn't come to power as they are no longer MPs. Life in Thailand would continue as it is now ... paddling up sh!t creek.

I'm sure the Dems throw some dollies in for the courts to rule in PTP's favour

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Thaddeus]

If the judiciary were to take up these politically motivated claims by the Democrats it would amount to a judicial coup d'etat. They have done this once too often.

But, but..... this accusation is politically motivated.

Well, they are politicians.

It's a piss poor defence, actually it's no defence....... the accusations are legally motivated, end of.

[millwall_fan]

If the judiciary were to take up these politically motivated claims by the Democrats it would amount to a judicial coup d'etat. They have done this once too often.

If a crime has been committed, what importance is the motivation of those reporting it? This is just a cop out, coupled with a pathetic catch-cry which attempts to avoid the recognition of law.

So why have the courts not demanded the enforcement of the arrest warrant for Suthep for murder in insurrection? why did the court allow him not to appear in person in December because he was 'busy' - mounting the very insurrection he had been charged with. The Dems get awaty scot free whilst PT are in the dock constantly.

[whybother]

If the judiciary were to take up these politically motivated claims by the Democrats it would amount to a judicial coup d'etat. They have done this once too often.

If a crime has been committed, what importance is the motivation of those reporting it? This is just a cop out, coupled with a pathetic catch-cry which attempts to avoid the recognition of law.

So why have the courts not demanded the enforcement of the arrest warrant for Suthep for murder in insurrection? why did the court allow him not to appear in person in December because he was 'busy' - mounting the very insurrection he had been charged with. The Dems get awaty scot free whilst PT are in the dock constantly.

It's not the courts job "to demand". That's the job of the police. And I don't believe the courts allowed him not to appear. He just didn't.

The courts have issued arrest warrants. Do you want them to go out and arrest him too?