Prayuth reaffirms Thai army not remaining idle

[englishoak]

I gotta say, I am in Prayuth's corner..... he has remained relatively calm... his "boss" has put him in an awful position.

What would you do?

Everyone has good and bad in them.... but given the situation and all the crap hurling around.... I give Prayuth high marks for staying calm and not acting like a horse's ass like you know who!!!!!!

What's the good thing about the army?The whole situation is because of the army.Since 2006 Thailand is in trouble.And now instead of helping or supporting the government they just sit there and do nothing.Suthep is not done yet because Army supports him.Who needs an army like that?

The army is to protect the people, not the corrupt government. And they know how corrupt the caretakers are so they don't want to help them. Right on ! This is not about 'red' and 'yellow', it is about right and wrong and the rule of law. The army must uphold the law - NOT Taksin's or any of his cronies whims.

stupid post of the day, all hail the army <deleted> ?

[Cnxforever]

Prayuth still holds the trump card. If the police overplay their hand, the army is there to protect the people. The army has not disappeared from the equation. They are a safety valve. But ultimately, the courts will be the deciders of this administration - on so many grounds that it is easy at this point to lose track.

This not 2006. There is much going on that is being hidden from publicity. It would appear that the army is divided over those events and their outcome is something that Gen. Prayuth is watching closely. He would not want to be seen to backing the losing side in that power struggle!

yes in a way this is 2006 because the same people are behind all this who where then!

but this time with a difference - yes for the first time the armed forces are divided - and we all know why - future positions have to be secured and favors will be rewarded - there are many signs - it's all in front of us one just needs to see them!

"Decorations" at cabinet meetings...... the air force headquarters cabinet meetings.......the 2 puppet masters behind Suthep who used to wear uniform and their boss - they have a lot too loose and they will not give up easily without putting up a fight - for the moment it looks like they are loosing though because people like Prayuth have not taken sides yet.

He wants to be loyal to his ex-bosses but also does not want to back the "wrong side" and spend the rest of his life regretting it.

[VegasVic]

Prayuth still holds the trump card. If the police overplay their hand, the army is there to protect the people. The army has not disappeared from the equation. They are a safety valve. But ultimately, the courts will be the deciders of this administration - on so many grounds that it is easy at this point to lose track.

This not 2006. There is much going on that is being hidden from publicity. It would appear that the army is divided over those events and their outcome is something that Gen. Prayuth is watching closely. He would not want to be seen to backing the losing side in that power struggle!

Whether he backs it or not, would his soldiers back it? Armies are soldiers and soldiers are people.

Did you see all those farmers come out and support Suthep today? Nope! Or all the government workers go on strike when he asked for a general strike? Nope. Or the army come and help when he asked? Nope. Or the businesses closing when he asked them to? Nope.

See, he might have a few cronies in a few offices, but ultimately none of those cronies would like to be hated by ordinary Thai people. That's no life to live and they won't sacrifice their life for him. So they'll gently drop back into the shadows and lead their happy lives sans Suthep.

He's done.

Spot on there blue nose, like I said in another thread yesterday sutheps days are numbered

[Gweiloman]

What's the good thing about the army?The whole situation is because of the army.Since 2006 Thailand is in trouble.And now instead of helping or supporting the government they just sit there and do nothing.Suthep is not done yet because Army supports him.Who needs an army like that?

The army is to protect the people, not the corrupt government. And they know how corrupt the caretakers are so they don't want to help them. Right on ! This is not about 'red' and 'yellow', it is about right and wrong and the rule of law. The army must uphold the law - NOT Taksin's or any of his cronies whims.

Yes correct and u r wrong,I just imagine the USA or German army or UK army would act like that.Hard to believe the army is telling Mr.Obama or Mrs Merkel what to do.In most western countries the army listen to the government,and not oppsite.But this is one of the problems why Thailand can't find inner peace.

Yes - in an ideal world you are absolutely correct. But, its a feature of many new democracies that the military act as the check and balance to elected governments that don't obey the law or govern as they should,

I don't suggest that's right or the way forward. You may be right, that this is one of the reasons Thailand can't find inner peace. Another could be that law and order needs to be enforced fairly and without favor, equally, to all members of society. Justice should not favor the wealthy nor allow them to escape punishment. Investigations should be carried out against any law breaker, not just those opposing whichever party happens to be in government,

Except that Thailand is not a new democracy. Thailand has been (or supposed to have been) democratic since 1932. According to my calculator, that's a good 82 years.

Yet, you are right in that Thailand is a new democracy. One of the reasons being the continuous "influence" of the army. The fact is that the army had and will continue to have a strong influence over the political situation. This in itself will deny Thailand the chance of developing strong democratic values and practices.

Your comment that the military acts as a check and balance to elected governments that don't obey the law or govern as they should is the very essence why Thailand can never be fully democratic.

[Gweiloman]

What's the good thing about the army?The whole situation is because of the army.Since 2006 Thailand is in trouble.And now instead of helping or supporting the government they just sit there and do nothing.Suthep is not done yet because Army supports him.Who needs an army like that?

Why would the army support a government forced to dissolve parliament through being caught repeatedly telling lies and cheating? A regime being probed and about to be charged with corruption at the highest levels?

The courts have ruled that the protests are constitutional. We know PTP don't respect the courts or laws unless they favor them, and don't like any questions or comments against them. But, that's just part of the reason why they are unfit to govern.

Where protesters have broken criminal law, then it's the police's job to arrest them.

Please don't start the bleat that the courts and army are all in with the elites. Or that PTP are innocent and a party of the people.

In most countries the army listen to government,not the government to the army,but here the army is a state in a state,they do what they want to do.The courts are biased.The protesters broke the law by storming government offices,by disturbing people who want to go work,by beating up policemen etc..By the way the term "regime" applies to any government that is most of the time not democratically elected and imposes strict and often arbitrary rules and laws.Hmm I remember The abisit government was not democraticly elected.The police in Thailand is the "Royal Thai police" Most thais know who also supports suthep,but can't talk about it,and the police can't do anything without getting in trouble

I did suggest, that as in most countries the job of law enforcement rests with the police. The Royal Thai Police are indeed charged with the duty of enforcing the law in Thailand, not the Royal Thai Army, Royal Thai Air Force or Royal Thai Navy.

By the way, the word regime can be applied to organizations that chose to operate outside the law, such as criminal regimes or organizations such as prison regimes which are part of law enforcement and the establishment. The word is not derogatory if that was your suggestion.

Do you have proof the courts are biased? Or do you only believe that if they rule against your particular view?

A government that is democratically elected must continue to respect the laws appropriate parliamentary procedures. There are mechanisms which have to be followed in any country in order for the government of the day to amend existing laws or introduce new ones. The people's mandate, especially when based on the largest minority vote, is not a mandate to do as you like without accountability.

The job of law enforcement (should) rest with the police. But in Thailand, the army exerts too much influence and they have the military power to ensure that other security personnel toes their line insofar as army policy is concerned.

A whole generation of Thais has been brought up in the knowledge that the army can and will get involved if they (the army) deems it necessary. Progress will never be made until this changes.

[Thai at Heart]

I gotta say, I am in Prayuth's corner..... he has remained relatively calm... his "boss" has put him in an awful position.

What would you do?

Everyone has good and bad in them.... but given the situation and all the crap hurling around.... I give Prayuth high marks for staying calm and not acting like a horse's ass like you know who!!!!!!

What's the good thing about the army?The whole situation is because of the army.Since 2006 Thailand is in trouble.And now instead of helping or supporting the government they just sit there and do nothing.Suthep is not done yet because Army supports him.Who needs an army like that?

Why would the army support a government forced to dissolve parliament through being caught repeatedly telling lies and cheating? A regime being probed and about to be charged with corruption at the highest levels?

The courts have ruled that the protests are constitutional. We know PTP don't respect the courts or laws unless they favor them, and don't like any questions or comments against them. But, that's just part of the reason why they are unfit to govern.

Where protesters have broken criminal law, then it's the police's job to arrest them.

Please don't start the bleat that the courts and army are all in with the elites. Or that PTP are innocent and a party of the people.

In most countries the army listen to government,not the government to the army,but here the army is a state in a state,they do what they want to do.The courts are biased.The protesters broke the law by storming government offices,by disturbing people who want to go work,by beating up policemen etc..By the way the term "regime" applies to any government that is most of the time not democratically elected and imposes strict and often arbitrary rules and laws.Hmm I remember The abisit government was not democraticly elected.The police in Thailand is the "Royal Thai police" Most thais know who also supports suthep,but can't talk about it,and the police can't do anything without getting in trouble

The army doesn't protect the country it protects itself and the system. The system is Thai democracy.

A version of democracy that is a long way from the pure form.

[noitom]

Who was asking him if he was sitting around waiting for his retirement?

[Publicus]

What's the good thing about the army?The whole situation is because of the army.Since 2006 Thailand is in trouble.And now instead of helping or supporting the government they just sit there and do nothing.Suthep is not done yet because Army supports him.Who needs an army like that?

Why would the army support a government forced to dissolve parliament through being caught repeatedly telling lies and cheating? A regime being probed and about to be charged with corruption at the highest levels?

The courts have ruled that the protests are constitutional. We know PTP don't respect the courts or laws unless they favor them, and don't like any questions or comments against them. But, that's just part of the reason why they are unfit to govern.

Where protesters have broken criminal law, then it's the police's job to arrest them.

Please don't start the bleat that the courts and army are all in with the elites. Or that PTP are innocent and a party of the people.

In most countries the army listen to government,not the government to the army,but here the army is a state in a state,they do what they want to do.The courts are biased.The protesters broke the law by storming government offices,by disturbing people who want to go work,by beating up policemen etc..By the way the term "regime" applies to any government that is most of the time not democratically elected and imposes strict and often arbitrary rules and laws.Hmm I remember The abisit government was not democraticly elected.The police in Thailand is the "Royal Thai police" Most thais know who also supports suthep,but can't talk about it,and the police can't do anything without getting in trouble

<<<snip>>>

Do you have proof the courts are biased? Or do you only believe that if they rule against your particular view?

A government that is democratically elected must continue to respect the laws appropriate parliamentary procedures. There are mechanisms which have to be followed in any country in order for the government of the day to amend existing laws or introduce new ones. The people's mandate, especially when based on the largest minority vote, is not a mandate to do as you like without accountability.

Yer on a roll today, pal

Your posts to this thread are a laff riot Along with your themes in general.

Thailand's unbiased courts.

The DP & Abhisit are the "loyal" opposition

Smash up the polling stations and choke the voters.

The army is the protector and the defender of - the people

Written with a straight face.

Only in Thailand.

[wave]

I'm sure the Army is not remaining idle, there must be endless discussions by the Generals about how they can find an entry point in to the current protests.

The oft repeated myth of protecting Thai people has increasingly unraveled due to the disastrous choices the Army made in 2006 (coup), 2008 (judicial coup) and 2010 (killing civilians).

No longer can they comfortably step in and rejig country to align it with their own interests.

They rightly fear a popular uprising that would potentially lead to their unique position forever being compromised.

There has never been a clearer demonstration that the Army act solely in their own interests than these current protests.

They cannot come out to openly support Suthep and neither can they support the elected Government.

They obviously realize that this is a "damned if they do damned if they don't" moment for them.

If they are to avoid any restructuring of their unique position in the future they have probably decided to do everything they can to sit this one out.

[edwinchester]

I gotta say, I am in Prayuth's corner..... he has remained relatively calm... his "boss" has put him in an awful position.

What would you do?

Everyone has good and bad in them.... but given the situation and all the crap hurling around.... I give Prayuth high marks for staying calm and not acting like a horse's ass like you know who!!!!!!

What's the good thing about the army?The whole situation is because of the army.Since 2006 Thailand is in trouble.And now instead of helping or supporting the government they just sit there and do nothing.Suthep is not done yet because Army supports him.Who needs an army like that?

The army is to protect the people, not the corrupt government. And they know how corrupt the caretakers are so they don't want to help them. Right on ! This is not about 'red' and 'yellow', it is about right and wrong and the rule of law. The army must uphold the law - NOT Taksin's or any of his cronies whims.

Like the Royal Thai Police the armed forces are a corrupt mafia within Thailand. Just look at all the procurement scandals and the rakeoffs that go with them. Then look at all the high ranking officers with their own gangs of foot soldiers to maintain their estates.

The military gets away with it because they can play the guarding the institution card and nothing else.

Like the police there should be a root and branch cleaning of house, a halt to conscription and the setting up of a much smaller but vastly more professional armed services that would protect Thailand and not just their masters.

[BlueNoseCodger]

Well we can argue numbers all we like, I think yours are low and you think mine are high, but there are protesters in more than just the rally sites. The fact is there are large numbers of people out on the streets and even the farmers are looking likely to mobiles themselves.

The fact is that large numbers of people against a regime is not the norm and therefore something is very wrong with the regime in place because it should be in place working for the benefit of the whole country regardless of the political affiliation of the area.

The Democrats ignored the poor to a large extent for years and the PTP have been ignoring everywhere except its voter base pretty much. Both parties are now seeing their support undermined.

It is easy to promise shiny trinkets to the very poor to get their vote which is a hinderance to young democracies where education of the people is so poor. That is the policy of the PTP and it is neither sustainable nor does it benefit the country in the long run as the Labour Party in the U K demonstrates. You can only dine so many times with someone else paying before the party paying no longer wants to invite you.

I do agree to some extent with your comments about the media as this is the case in many places in the world but perhaps the less so here because of restrictions on the press generally and the current laws of defamation and to a lesser degree lese majeste which make muting the press an easier job.

Personally I think the PTP have failed Thailand in a huge way and been horribly corrupt with no thought to the future of the country and hugely self interested. The sad thing is that I fear the Democrats are only marginally different though the country does benefit from a thriving business model. Neither is the way forward as they are both devisive and self interested. Thailand needs something better than this.

The fact is that large numbers of people against a regime is not the norm

In America we call that large number 'Republicans', in Britain we call them 'Unions'. It's very normal! More than that, if you don't have dissent, you don't have choice and you don't have democracy!

It is easy to promise shiny trinkets to the very poor to get their vote which is a hinderance to young democracies where education of the people is so poor. That is the policy of the PTP and it is neither sustainable nor does it benefit the country

Shiny trickets? You mean jobs, OTOP, infrastructure, social medicine and many other projects. Every elected government has been PTP or one of its predecessors, and since 1997 the GDP has grown four fold. So you say its not sustainable, yet it works.

"young democracies where education of the people is so poor."

I think that's the problem. Far more Isaan girls have been abroad, speak more languages and have a bigger world view than the Bangkok elite. Also far more poor people run businesses, small shops, farms, buy and sell goods than the Bangkok elite. Yet the Bangkok elite thinks they know more because they have the bit of University paper! They work in an office and think knowledge of Microsoft Excel cash flow projection trumps experience of actual cash flows.

I believe the Bangkok elite always thinks they know best, because they've been told they know best (the propaganda problem), yet when they grab power, it ends in a massacre and a war with our neighbours and an incompetent do-nothing leader!

I don't blame Les Majeste or the court problems for the propaganda problem. It's because money buys media, and there are only a limited number of Thai language media outlets. The Bangkok elite lap this Thai media up, whereas the Isaan girls also see BBC or Der Speigel or New York Times. So society fractures.

Personally I think the PTP have failed Thailand in a huge way and been horribly corrupt with no thought to the future of the country and hugely self interested.

Whereas I think they've delivered 4 fold growth, new airports, new infrastructre, near 100% employment, a debt of 45% of GDP far lower than developed countries, the highest level SET ever reached, massive inward investment and made Thailand the kick off for ASEAN investment. They've increase their voter share too, uniting more Thai people.

In contrast I think the Democrats and Suthep and the Bangkok elite, have set us back a decade, just with this latest tantrum of theirs. Can you imagine Suthep speaking to foreign governments? Abhisit speaks abroad but mostly to deny the 2010 massacre! They can't even offer a viable candidate for leader, they're so inept!

I await the NACC's corruption claims, currently they are "we can't prove all the rice was exported" and "we can't prove the Chinese company qualitied under the G2G scheme", and "Yingluk was in charge so we blame her for not stopping these things we are not claiming". Which is a comic because I can't prove the NACC is not a corrupt front for the elite, and I can't prove they didn't start this in coordination with the Democrats and I can't prove their claims do not have substance and were chosen for their political soundbite nature. Lots of negatives things I can't prove.

[added oh and thank you for putting your case rather than a soundbite tagline or whistle blow]

Edited February 15, 2014 by BlueNoseCodger

[Publicus]

I'm sure the Army is not remaining idle, there must be endless discussions by the Generals about how they can find an entry point in to the current protests.

The oft repeated myth of protecting Thai people has increasingly unraveled due to the disastrous choices the Army made in 2006 (coup), 2008 (judicial coup) and 2010 (killing civilians).

No longer can they comfortably step in and rejig country to align it with their own interests.

They rightly fear a popular uprising that would potentially lead to their unique position forever being compromised.

There has never been a clearer demonstration that the Army act solely in their own interests than these current protests.

They cannot come out to openly support Suthep and neither can they support the elected Government.

They obviously realize that this is a "damned if they do damned if they don't" moment for them.

If they are to avoid any restructuring of their unique position in the future they have probably decided to do everything they can to sit this one out.

Quite.

Extend the time period back to the coup government of 1991-2 which ended in bloodshed and the two top generals banished from Thailand (later one reentered to a monastery) and the army knows very well it's had a terrible run at the prize.

In 1991-92 Gen Prayuth was a very junior officer along with his generation of the officer corps across the armed forces. What back then looked like an aberration began post 2006 to look like a double header, albeit minus the blood. After 2010 the army completely lost its starch among the Thai people. Prayuth has appeared publicly with Abhisit recently but I get the definite feeling he's not holding hands with AV, all of course because of 2010.

The army can't come out now in any big way, not in any large scale serious way, and Prayuth and his generation of generals and admirals, ACMarshals. recognize the fact, clearly and powerfully. Prayuth and Co know if the army simply and straight out makes a big move big time the army will have pressed the start button and the civil war is on.

Unfortunately the army continues to think about its own hold on its money and power instead of to think of the country. However, the army and the old guard elites know if they loose the country in to a Beirut type of debacle, they will loose the country too, so the restraint is there of personal self-interest.

I'd said previously, I wouldn't be surprised if the armed forces were lobbying the judiciary, the counter corruption commission and the like not to execute a judicial coup because that obviously too would press the start button to the same effect, forcing the army into a conflagration of Thais shooting Thais.

The army also is constrained by operational concerns, which is to say by the question of the cohesion and effectiveness of the armed forces if they must engage armed elements of the general population. There are watermelon commanders, generals and the like, in the armed forces, and among the soldiers too. Prayuth and his generation of top commanders are the first generation to divide so sharply, so radically, irrevocably, irretrievably. Engagement would cause open schism of the armed forces, to the extent watermelon senior commanders, soldiers, a number of middle level officers and NCOs would take sides with armed elements of the population, reds, yellows and the like, to fight against "loyalist" elements of the armed forces.

I haven't any doubt Prayuth and his whole generation of the armed forces senior command can't see October and retirement come soon or fast enough.

However, if PTP can reestablish itself as the government for the next few years, it will finally have the power it's long been seeking to take charge of the change over of top military commanders across the board. The next in line at the top of the armed forces will very likely find themselves under civilian control and command, which of course would be a radical departure for Thailand.

AV and the DP in power come October 1st, or an appointed council, would leave the military systems and protocols the way they've always been, meaning the old boys would continue to choose themselves.

[VegasVic]

Why would the army support a government forced to dissolve parliament through being caught repeatedly telling lies and cheating? A regime being probed and about to be charged with corruption at the highest levels?

The courts have ruled that the protests are constitutional. We know PTP don't respect the courts or laws unless they favor them, and don't like any questions or comments against them. But, that's just part of the reason why they are unfit to govern.

Where protesters have broken criminal law, then it's the police's job to arrest them.

Please don't start the bleat that the courts and army are all in with the elites. Or that PTP are innocent and a party of the people.

In most countries the army listen to government,not the government to the army,but here the army is a state in a state,they do what they want to do.The courts are biased.The protesters broke the law by storming government offices,by disturbing people who want to go work,by beating up policemen etc..By the way the term "regime" applies to any government that is most of the time not democratically elected and imposes strict and often arbitrary rules and laws.Hmm I remember The abisit government was not democraticly elected.The police in Thailand is the "Royal Thai police" Most thais know who also supports suthep,but can't talk about it,and the police can't do anything without getting in trouble

<<<snip>>>

Do you have proof the courts are biased? Or do you only believe that if they rule against your particular view?

A government that is democratically elected must continue to respect the laws appropriate parliamentary procedures. There are mechanisms which have to be followed in any country in order for the government of the day to amend existing laws or introduce new ones. The people's mandate, especially when based on the largest minority vote, is not a mandate to do as you like without accountability.

alt=laugh.png width=20 height=20> alt=cheesy.gif width=32 height=20> alt=laugh.png width=20 height=20> alt=cheesy.gif width=32 height=20> alt=giggle.gif width=20 height=25> alt=cheesy.gif width=32 height=20> alt=laugh.png width=20 height=20>

Yer on a roll today, pal alt=clap2.gif width=31 height=25>

Your posts to this thread are a laff riot Along with your themes in general.

Thailand's unbiased courts. alt=cheesy.gif width=32 height=20>

The DP & Abhisit are the "loyal" opposition alt=giggle.gif width=20 height=25>

Smash up the polling stations and choke the voters.

The army is the protector and the defender of - the people

Written with a straight face.

Only in Thailand.

You get 5 stars for this one Publicus I am continually amazed at the naivete of some of these farangs!

[Boxclever]

Not standing by idle...what's that mean...getting ready to kill some unarmed demonstrators?

I hope so

[Boxclever]

In any society there are millions who disagree with the government in power but they do not go out on the streets in their millions or even hundreds of thousands unless something is very wrong.

Thais are a fairly lazy race, common in warmer countries, and to motivate them to demonstrate like they are now seems to me to indicate that they think there is something very wrong with the government to the extent that it should not be allowed to continue.

In 3rd world political style the government is grimly hanging on and continuing to abuts the processes of democracy time and again, meanwhile Suthep is blocking democratic elections on the basis that they would not really be democratic. Both sides are of course intensely self interested and neither is a solution to Thailand's problems.

The country probably does need a people's council to effect some reform but perhaps it would be impossible to find people sufficiently distanced from one side or other to manage impartial reform for the benefit of the country rather than some group interest.

Oh dear Thailand, if only there were a few more selfless politicians around, in fact a product of their society, then perhaps there would be some alternatives at this crossroads.

It is truly sad to watch the infighting, not because of those involved getting hurt but because of the pain being inflicted on the poorest here like the farmers. It is shameful

Millions? No. If they could have got millions, they could have won elections*.

It comes down to the usual problem. The language barrier. So a few elite control the major Thai language media, and very few people get to see outside press. So we get bands of propagandized people at the extremes.

The Bangkok elite, genuinely believe Thailand is close to financial disaster, and never run the numbers themselves. The farmers genuinely believe the Bangkok elite thinks their votes are worthless because the few people who say that garbage are the topic of conversation!

People don't talk about the boring moderate reality, because it isn't a good news story. News flash, borrowing will be a little up this year because the rice price is down and the government rice subsidy has overrun.... Boring! News flash, most people like one man one vote..... Boring! See? The media is at extremes so the people who watch that media are at extremes.

*Security agencies put it at 300k (not Suthep's PDRC mob, the mob before Suthep created the PDRC and announced he wanted his peoples council). I crunched the numbers and thought it was 70-90k.

Well we can argue numbers all we like, I think yours are low and you think mine are high, but there are protesters in more than just the rally sites. The fact is there are large numbers of people out on the streets and even the farmers are looking likely to mobiles themselves.

The fact is that large numbers of people against a regime is not the norm and therefore something is very wrong with the regime in place because it should be in place working for the benefit of the whole country regardless of the political affiliation of the area.

The Democrats ignored the poor to a large extent for years and the PTP have been ignoring everywhere except its voter base pretty much. Both parties are now seeing their support undermined.

It is easy to promise shiny trinkets to the very poor to get their vote which is a hinderance to young democracies where education of the people is so poor. That is the policy of the PTP and it is neither sustainable nor does it benefit the country in the long run as the Labour Party in the U K demonstrates. You can only dine so many times with someone else paying before the party paying no longer wants to invite you.

I do agree to some extent with your comments about the media as this is the case in many places in the world but perhaps the less so here because of restrictions on the press generally and the current laws of defamation and to a lesser degree lese majeste which make muting the press an easier job.

Personally I think the PTP have failed Thailand in a huge way and been horribly corrupt with no thought to the future of the country and hugely self interested. The sad thing is that I fear the Democrats are only marginally different though the country does benefit from a thriving business model. Neither is the way forward as they are both devisive and self interested. Thailand needs something better than this.

Large numbers of people

You mean the 3 or 4 thousand?

What happened to the "great mass of the people"? What happened to the 6 million demonstrators?

What a joke...these fascist pigs are dead.

Viva la Thia...Land

Edited February 15, 2014 by Boxclever

[geriatrickid]

the General is sitting on a powder keg. On one side is the old guard that think nothing of sending out killing squads to silence/intimidate those it sees as the "enemy". Where else would there be "negotiations" with suspect military gunmen who attempted to assassinate a civilian? On the other side are military personnel recruited/conscripted from government loyal regions who resent the stranglehold of the old guard on the military. For the typical mid rank officer from Surin or Issan, who won't move up as the senior ranks are reserved for the friends of the old guard, there is a seething resentment. . The NCO's usual differences with the officer corps are magnified because the NCOs are predominately from loyalist regions, while the officer corps are predominately old guard. And in the middle is a growing cadre of professionals who have been exposed to and benefited from foreign education and training in he USA and elsewhere. These are the people who want the military to evolve into a professional organization frustrated by the current structure, and the political overtones that colour the military. And on top of the heap is the General. Criticized by everyone, walking a delicate line. So far, so good. He's been able to keep a lid on his military. The big question is how much longer can he do it? It's taking all his political skills, his charm, his strength and his energy. He's aged more in the past 3 months than in the past 3 years.

[fasteddie]

In any society there are millions who disagree with the government in power but they do not go out on the streets in their millions or even hundreds of thousands unless something is very wrong.

Thais are a fairly lazy race, common in warmer countries, and to motivate them to demonstrate like they are now seems to me to indicate that they think there is something very wrong with the government to the extent that it should not be allowed to continue.

In 3rd world political style the government is grimly hanging on and continuing to abuts the processes of democracy time and again, meanwhile Suthep is blocking democratic elections on the basis that they would not really be democratic. Both sides are of course intensely self interested and neither is a solution to Thailand's problems.

The country probably does need a people's council to effect some reform but perhaps it would be impossible to find people sufficiently distanced from one side or other to manage impartial reform for the benefit of the country rather than some group interest.

Oh dear Thailand, if only there were a few more selfless politicians around, in fact a product of their society, then perhaps there would be some alternatives at this crossroads.

It is truly sad to watch the infighting, not because of those involved getting hurt but because of the pain being inflicted on the poorest here like the farmers. It is shameful

Millions? No. If they could have got millions, they could have won elections*.

It comes down to the usual problem. The language barrier. So a few elite control the major Thai language media, and very few people get to see outside press. So we get bands of propagandized people at the extremes.

The Bangkok elite, genuinely believe Thailand is close to financial disaster, and never run the numbers themselves. The farmers genuinely believe the Bangkok elite thinks their votes are worthless because the few people who say that garbage are the topic of conversation!

People don't talk about the boring moderate reality, because it isn't a good news story. News flash, borrowing will be a little up this year because the rice price is down and the government rice subsidy has overrun.... Boring! News flash, most people like one man one vote..... Boring! See? The media is at extremes so the people who watch that media are at extremes.

*Security agencies put it at 300k (not Suthep's PDRC mob, the mob before Suthep created the PDRC and announced he wanted his peoples council). I crunched the numbers and thought it was 70-90k.

Well we can argue numbers all we like, I think yours are low and you think mine are high, but there are protesters in more than just the rally sites. The fact is there are large numbers of people out on the streets and even the farmers are looking likely to mobiles themselves.

The fact is that large numbers of people against a regime is not the norm and therefore something is very wrong with the regime in place because it should be in place working for the benefit of the whole country regardless of the political affiliation of the area.

The Democrats ignored the poor to a large extent for years and the PTP have been ignoring everywhere except its voter base pretty much. Both parties are now seeing their support undermined.

It is easy to promise shiny trinkets to the very poor to get their vote which is a hinderance to young democracies where education of the people is so poor. That is the policy of the PTP and it is neither sustainable nor does it benefit the country in the long run as the Labour Party in the U K demonstrates. You can only dine so many times with someone else paying before the party paying no longer wants to invite you.

I do agree to some extent with your comments about the media as this is the case in many places in the world but perhaps the less so here because of restrictions on the press generally and the current laws of defamation and to a lesser degree lese majeste which make muting the press an easier job.

Personally I think the PTP have failed Thailand in a huge way and been horribly corrupt with no thought to the future of the country and hugely self interested. The sad thing is that I fear the Democrats are only marginally different though the country does benefit from a thriving business model. Neither is the way forward as they are both devisive and self interested. Thailand needs something better than this.

"The fact is that large numbers of people against a regime is not the norm"

Of course it is! Look at the US and the UK for instance, the difference being, in the rest of democracies (except the Ukraine maybe), we don't stamp about like children, threatening to bring down democracy, kidnap the PM and other MP's, occupy government buildings and beat up and even shoot people trying to vote.