Thai Police begins firing tear gas at Phan Fah Lilat Bridge

[RedNIvar]

Actually, two civilians have also been killed today.

PTP, who you apparently support by all means, has lost. YL and PTP could have exited the stage gracefully, but they have decided to launch a wave of violence and mayhem instead. Everything is collapsing around PTP's ears, and I guess they just decided to take as much down with them as possible.

Why would you say that PTP has lost. When this started,they took the middle ground and called for fresh elections. Its the opposition that has taken this course of action for fear of losing again and again and again. Historically every cause that is championed by the majority of the people have always ended with victory. Same would be the case for the PTP. Suthep and his band of idiots, will lose sooner or later. You can call the Shin clan whatever you want, but as long as they have the backing of the majority, they will always be around. This is a fact. The sooner you face this and get on with life the better.

I am just glad that Chalerm did not resort to tactics employed by the "Butchers of Ratchaprasong" (Bloodbath Vejjajiva and MadDog Thaugsuban), or else Mr. Suthep would have already been given the Seh Daeng treatment and many more protesters would have lost their lives. All this shows is the restraint being shown by the current government.

I hope for this to end with dialogue and no more loss of life, but given the unreasonable attitude shown by the MadDog I fear this will not happen.

At this moment PTP doesn't have a majority in Thailand. There are so many furious people even in the North! Right now it is so obvious that they raped Thailand financially in a big way. Are you following the news? Do you understand what is happening? I bet the PM will exit the country same as her brother!

If that is the case, would the opposition not want fresh new elections. Ask yourself who is still running from having elections, the last I saw from following the news, its not PTP. What are the opposition afraid off. Have brand new elections, stop this unnecessary loss of life. What are they waiting for?

[chooka]

READ THIS

Chalerm reiterated that the CMPO would abide by Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra’s demand that it refrain from using force in its mission. He also expressed his confidence that the continued operation would be successful and without violent incident

BUT

At Pan Fah Bridge, police from the Second Region Provincial Police were seen firing at protesters with shotguns. Many protesters were injured and several ambulances were seen moving into the area to take the injured to hospitals.

CONCLUSION

The caretaker Prime ministers words have no value or power in the existing government, which means that there is no control in this government.

Suthep also said his supporters are peaceful and would never be violent but police are dead and seriously injured. Suthep's words have no value either. He actually said if Yingluk dissolved parliarment he would hand himself in to authorities. Yingluk did that months ago and then Suthep went against his word and stepped up the anti. Suthep said there will be no violence in his protest, which means that there is no control in his movement.

What is your point?

I hate both sides.

Farangs grabbing onto and supporting a side is just a circus of lunatics

[ableguy]

Good good

Make the society a big favor.

Arrest the criminal monk and all the violent yellow thugs !

Sent from my HTC One using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

What an idiotic, out of touch comment.

[bkk75]

Very, very sad scenes again on Bangkok battered streets.

A sad but unfortunately predictable outcome when:

Two intransigent sides refuse to speak, co-operate, and work together as intelligent humans to overcome their differences;

Each side seeks total victory and domination over the other, as opposed to reconciliation and development;

The leaders of each side are as myopic and dysfunctional as each other.

Thailand you deserve better, your people deserve better.

Wrong Thailand is reaping what it sows. Vote in a puppet govt with corrupt incompetent leadership..som naam na.

Edited February 18, 2014 by bkk75

[Publicus]

" At Chaengwattana site, the police moved in with teargas firing, protesters sat down and prayed with no resistance. At Pan Fah bridge, police form the Second Region Provincial Police were seen firing at protesters with shotguns. Many protesters were injured and several ambulances were seen moving into the area to take the injured to hospitals. "

This ugly, ugly administration is now showing it and Thakin's true colours. Protesters that were sitting and praying have had canisters of tear-gas thrown at them, and other protesters have been shot at by police, as reporters are now witnessing.

Chalerm was obviously very upset yesterday. He was humiliated. What we are seeing now is the true face of Chalerm in action - pitting Thai people against Thai people. He is a coward, and a bully. And he has perpetrated a great sin today. These images are being broadcast all around the world. They are not subject to the Yingluck administration's spin. They show a savage, savage administration, that has over-reached in their response alarmingly. The army is watching, and one's guess is that they will not be able to tolerate this much longer. This administration is out of control, and is at war with its own people.

You've added to your already massive body of guesswork with this post as you continue to salavate over a coup d'etat military mutiny that few people see occurring as the police you habitually try to denegrate and dismiss are showing you that they are in fact police - trained, disciplined, more than capable.

Police are sacrificing their lives in the line of duty yet you continue to cheer for the army.

Sad sad, pathetic, pathetic.

[animatic]

@Animatic - Really an absurd post, even for you.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Sadly in this day an age I wish it was absurd, but it's not.

It is a truly sad day that so many are manipulated by demagogues on both sides,

and then manipulated by ringers in their midst into scenes of horror to fit a narrative.

It has been done before and will happen again,

as long as the amoral quest to control their fellow man.

Edited February 18, 2014 by animatic

[thaiguzzi]

Not all coppers are red. Most in Isaan yes, but when the shit hits the fan, all coppers posted into BKK will stick together.

[animatic]

Not all coppers are red. Most in Isaan yes, but when the shit hits the fan, all coppers posted into BKK will stick together.

Which is why Border Patrol Police have usually been brought in to go after the anti-Shinwatra protesters.

Edited February 18, 2014 by animatic

[whybother]

This smells like 2010 just with the tables turned.

With Abhisit and Suthep facing murder charges, I wish to know when Chalerm and Yingluck get an invitation to hear their charges...

No comparison. In this situation, the PM and her cabinet are still in control. There is no military involvement in respect to the enforcement of civil order. In this case, it is still a civilian operation. In 2010, Abhisit was basically pushed aside as he was dithering, and the military and its key allies in the Democrat dominated cabinet took over. The low number of casualties arising from the current operation is due to a civilian agency dealing with a civil disorder. The large number of casualties and collateral damage in 2010 was attributable to the royal guard units operating as if they were in a war zone.

Whatever one thinks of the police or the current government, the patience and low casualty count demonstrates that civilian public security agencies are better able to respond to civilian based disorder. The Thai military has repeatedly shown that it is incapable of handling civilian related issues, whether it is the Rohingya refugees, the smugglers on the borders and even the southern insurrection.

Don't you think that being blown up by a grenade and being fired at by army types with military guns indicate that it WAS a war zone??

[kingstonkid]

The only people that the police approached were praying protesters.

I was at Muang thong today for the student show and saw all the police and vehicles. I also say the weapons.

The bottom Line to all this forgetting the BS from the right and the left is simple

YING LUCK SAID IT WAS TO BE DONE WITH NO VIOLENCE. THEREFORE AT THE FIRST SIGN OF VIOLENCE THE POLICE SHOULD HAVE WITHDRAWN.

CHALERM has been threatening that there would be blood for weeks so it should not be a surprise.

The feeling is that the present government has lost the backing of most of the people and is unable to do anything to correct itself.

Suthep and his people are not gong to back down and neither at this stage want to talk truthfully with the other.

As much as the outside world does not want a coup in Thailand it is in fact time for the military to request (adamantly) that Yingluck step down as prime minister and let a caretaker government take over so that the reforms can be started and the country can have peace.

As soon as that is done Suthep should be requested (adamantly ) to shut down the restart and devote his time to putting together proposals for the reformation of Thailand.

[DGIE]

No force will be used? Said Yingluck....

Killing protestors won't get rid of all the shit you've committed young lady.. You, my dear, are going down. (or across, to Dubai, as an additional outcast who also raped the finances of this country.

Personally, I hope you rot in the hot sun out there, if you manage to get out alive.

You are cursing!

But is it OK for the policemen to just leave the protesters doing violent acts? If you were in the shoes of policemen and are not respected in keeping peace, can you just leave the protesters and go home?

[samuidave]

pkspeaker, on 18 Feb 2014 - 14:17, said:

I'm from the US, Long Beach ca.. when i was in high school there was kid that lived down the street from us, he had some mental issues or something, one time the police were called because he was abusing his mother, 2 cops showed up, he attacked them with num-ckuks (2 sticks attached with a chain) they shot him dead.. i was shocked and upset.. but i fully understand any cop will kill you if you shoot at him or even if you point a gun at him, a rioters life is not worth more than the police officer who has to do this job everyday.. the crook or rioter can quit, reform himself and get on with his life, if your a cop and you wanna live to see your retirement package fuc_kK "minimum necessary force than a shoot to kill policy."

chrisinth, on 18 Feb 2014 - 13:02, said:

pkspeaker, on 18 Feb 2014 - 12:40, said:

I'm not bloodthirsty, I'm being realiastic, when you shoot at the police they kill you, their rules are to kill people that shoot at them, you think its ok for 'protesters' to shoot at the police from behind unarmed protesters-thats what i call cowardly and bloodthirsty.

Could you please clarify the source you have for the police's rules of engagement?

I would imagine, only guessing here, that it would be more along the lines of minimum necessary force than a shoot to kill policy.

As an aside, I would also like to know what ammunition was in the shotguns that were discharged by the police, whether anyone has been admitted to the medical centres with shotgun wounds or were they firing plastic/rubber rounds or beanbag/sandbags.

I do not support any side in this mess, but the warnings have been in the air for the past week or so, and if the protesters have been warned to clear the area and haven't done so, then they have themselves to blame. The police and caretaker government have left them relatively alone until now, we shouldn't call foul when they eventually get round to ending the disruption.

Sir, with the greatest respect, you have ascertained from one incident involving police officers in America when you were a child, that if attacked, all police will kill you?

My father, until his murder in 1981 (by terrorists) was a member of the Royal Ulster Constabulary serving in Belfast. The RUC were at a higher level of reaction than any other police force in UK, but were restrained by rules of engagement and answerable to civil prosecution if they were deemed to step out of these boundaries. I spent 23 years in the British armed forces, again, when carrying personal weapons or in uniform, confined by the same (or very similar) rules of engagement.

Similar applies to police forces throughout the world, Thailand included.

You sir, again with respect, need to grow up and put to rest the memories of what happened to you as a child..

MY CONDOLENCES to you and your robotic family, where animating a costume and thinking you have a moral right to kill others ON ORDERS from above, well, it's just a sad testimony of how un enlightened we still are as a species.

[kikoman]

I'm not bloodthirsty, I'm being realiastic, when you shoot at the police they kill you, their rules are to kill people that shoot at them, you think its ok for 'protesters' to shoot at the police from behind unarmed protesters-thats what i call cowardly and bloodthirsty.

1. The police must kill the protesters that fire weapons at them, they are justified in shooting back with live Ammo.

2. Once they arrest these 'protesters' most of whom are PAID to protest, and many of whom are armed with weapons, they must keep them in detention so they don't come back and cause more mayham. It's an outrage that they are then released on 'bail' the state of emergency is supposed to allow the police to restore order and detain mercenaries.

You're a bloodthirsty little animal aren't you? Not happy till you see dead people on the ground eh?

I'm not in favour of anyone shooting at all but all the reports I've read to date say the police opened fire first. Was there a reason for this, in that, were they fired on earlier?

You seem to be saying the police responded to being fired upon. Is there a link to this?

That why you question my BBC post, I read a lot of those bias reports, Nation and most of the news media are nothing more than propaganda machines for the rich elite establishment, Their accounts are not factual , only good to use of the newspaper is for toilets tissue, I put more faith in the international news take, I know you saw that grenade explode in the middle of the police line on bbc, I will wait and get a more believable version from the international press, you seem to forget the police invited the news media, their will be more film clips surfacing!

cheers

Cheers

[SOTIRIOS]

...he could have been struck by 'friendly fire'....

...the worst part of it all is the apparently illegal declaration of the state of emergency...

...people dying in the streets so that those accused...with ample proof....of wrongdoing...can remain out of harms way...

...and continue to scam, scheme and slander....

...now casting blame on others for the hundreds of millions that have 'disappeared'...in this 'rice scheme'....all this long while...

[chrisinth]

pkspeaker, on 18 Feb 2014 - 14:17, said:

I'm from the US, Long Beach ca.. when i was in high school there was kid that lived down the street from us, he had some mental issues or something, one time the police were called because he was abusing his mother, 2 cops showed up, he attacked them with num-ckuks (2 sticks attached with a chain) they shot him dead.. i was shocked and upset.. but i fully understand any cop will kill you if you shoot at him or even if you point a gun at him, a rioters life is not worth more than the police officer who has to do this job everyday.. the crook or rioter can quit, reform himself and get on with his life, if your a cop and you wanna live to see your retirement package fuc_kK "minimum necessary force than a shoot to kill policy."

Sir, with the greatest respect, you have ascertained from one incident involving police officers in America when you were a child, that if attacked, all police will kill you?

My father, until his murder in 1981 (by terrorists) was a member of the Royal Ulster Constabulary serving in Belfast. The RUC were at a higher level of reaction than any other police force in UK, but were restrained by rules of engagement and answerable to civil prosecution if they were deemed to step out of these boundaries. I spent 23 years in the British armed forces, again, when carrying personal weapons or in uniform, confined by the same (or very similar) rules of engagement.

Similar applies to police forces throughout the world, Thailand included.

You sir, again with respect, need to grow up and put to rest the memories of what happened to you as a child..

MY CONDOLENCES to you and your robotic family, where animating a costume and thinking you have a moral right to kill others ON ORDERS from above, well, it's just a sad testimony of how un enlightened we still are as a species.

I really shouldn't be replying to this but, how do you read that rules of engagement can give someone a moral right to kill others? If that 'sad testimony' of a post was there to bait, congratulations!

Job done, now you can crawl back under your rock and think of something else clever to say..................

[casualbiker]

READ THIS

Chalerm reiterated that the CMPO would abide by Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra’s demand that it refrain from using force in its mission. He also expressed his confidence that the continued operation would be successful and without violent incident

BUT

At Pan Fah Bridge, police from the Second Region Provincial Police were seen firing at protesters with shotguns. Many protesters were injured and several ambulances were seen moving into the area to take the injured to hospitals.

CONCLUSION

The caretaker Prime ministers words have no value or power in the existing government, which means that there is no control in this government.

The shotguns were tear gas delivery devices. When police officers were assaulted, reasonable measures were used to defend themselves.

There is no inconsistency. The policy approached the squatter camp in the same manner as they did the other squatter camps. The squatters launched a barrage of deadly objects such as bottles and rocks. Then some squatters discharged firearms at the law enforcement personnel. The police did not go in with guns blazing. Nor did they use APC or tanks to roll over barricades or fire hoses to flatten the squatters as the army did on 2010.

GK.. Shot guns are NOT teargas delivery devices. In Thailand it is generally the M79 grenade launcher.

CNN said that police fired rubber bullets (shotguns) and live ammunition

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/02/17/world/asia/thailand-protests/index.html?iid=article_sidebar

[JohnThailandJohn]

:-(

Grenade Attack Video ... http://vimeo.com/86981734

[jcisco]

Oops, this is a fight the government or the police can not win!

Unlike the farmers, the protesters are on their home turf, giving them a big advantage.

And you can only arrest so many people, before the jails are full.

And then there are still other protesters, they keep coming and coming. The more you gas them or clobber them, the more you will be hated by the Bangkok people.

Sorry who are the police fighting again, the situation is not so much a political protest anymore. The reason for most people to go to these sites seems to of evaporated shortly after the election. So it may not turn into a pitched battle of the sort I believe you have in mind.

As for your Jail comment, now to actually get people into a Jail, due process and a court conviction then jail. If you are just holding people in large number, razor wire, cyclone wire fencing and an open field in which to construct the facility is not difficult. You are over thinking detainment by thinking bricks, bars, walls and permanency.

Your argument is flawed, it is indeed a battle police and or the army an crush. Remember 2010 by any chance?

[JohnThailandJohn]

Another angle from CNN

[shaurene]

Some of you guys should be carefull with what you say, the authorities will be looking at this visa site and reading the stuff some of you say, it could back fire on you and the knock on the door will come and your gone man.

[tilac2]

I'd think that all this is going to get a lot worse before it gets better.

I'd suggest that the basic problem in Thailand/Siam is that it was never colonised (people often say that being uncolonised is an advantage, but they're wrong). If Siam had been colonised, the colonisers might well have got rid of the feudal sakdina system. As it is, the sakdina system persists in part, and many Siamese have it ingrained in their psyche, with the grovelling, subservient attitudes to 'the superior ones' that we see so often. Can a modern society survive with these outdated attitudes? Unlikely.

Thanks to Thaksin, a new entrepreneural, all-men-are-equal attitude started to arrive, but the old feudalist sakdina people wouldn't have that. So they kicked him out.

Sadly I think that Suthep and his old, outdated, corrupt ways can only be destroyed by armed conflict. History does seem to show that major change comes through 'blood and iron', as Bismarck put it. I hope I am wrong, but Suthep and his thugs seem utterly unwilling to compromise and negociate. They are part of the old, unchanged corrupt sakdina system of the past. Several other 'leaders' in Thailand/Siam conform to that pattern: Phibun, Sarit, etc.

But if Thailand/Siam is to come into the 21st century a new agenda needs to be instituted: based on equality, one-man-one-vote, the discouraging of feudalist class-based thinking. In the future I put my faith in the United Front for Democracy Against Dictatorship (UDD), red shirts, because they are the ones who have consistently advocated one-man-one-vote - no matter who is elected: PTT, the so-called 'Democrats', whoever. I know that other farangs don't agree with me about UDD. We'll see who is proved right.

Edited February 18, 2014 by tilac2

[flyingdoc]

In total agreement with djjamie! A sad day for Thailand.

[Tommo13]

I am there right now. It was hectic earlier but it is now very quiet. There are old ladies and children walking around the smashed up police cars. Which there are a lot of. There's also a smashed up flatbed truck and two bulldozers. There are abandoned riot shields. Apparently it will be huge tomorrow. Going to stay well clear.

[oldsailor35]

No force will be used? Said Yingluck....

Killing protestors won't get rid of all the shit you've committed young lady.. You, my dear, are going down. (or across, to Dubai, as an additional outcast who also raped the finances of this country.

Personally, I hope you rot in the hot sun out there, if you manage to get out alive.

You are one <deleted> sick Suthep supporter

[oldsailor35]

I pray that all the injured are able to recover swiftly and comfortably in hospital, especially the policeman who was only in that location to do his job and support his family, who must be very proud of him for working a difficult job to protect Thailand's law and order. They must be very worried about him. My thoughts are also with the families of the injured protestors.

Mostly I pray that this situation will somehow simmer down before anyone else is injured or killed. It is deeply saddening and tragic, not to mention pointless.

Sorry Yunla, nothing will "simmer down" Not whilst the gutless Suthep can sit back somewhere in a luxury hotel watching it all on Television, just issueing commands here and there. When he has the guts to come out from his rathole and personally face the police, then things might change. Its a bit like WW1 where all the generals sat back in safety sipping gin and directing the troops to death. He really does not give a rats ass for his paid trouble makers.

In fact, he really wants a few deaths to help his cause along.

Edited February 18, 2014 by oldsailor35

[oldsailor35]

1. The police must kill the protesters that fire weapons at them, they are justified in shooting back with live Ammo.

2. Once they arrest these 'protesters' most of whom are PAID to protest, and most of whom are armed with weapons, they must keep them in detention so they don't come back and cause more mayham.

Based on 2010, the authorities aren't justified in using guns regardless of what the protesters are using.

Every hear of friendly fire?? Many Americans know it well.

Forget that ! Its just an American armed forces habit, i experienced it back in the Korean war, and they have been doing it ever since !

[wolfmanjack]

Now wasn't it Abhisit who said the protesters did not have weapons? Was he lying or just not up to date on what really going on.

This gentle protesters obviously has ammunition ...

But Abhisit (and all the irrational farangs supporting Suthep on here)(and some courts) will certainly say that... "On this particular picture, there is no proof supporting the fact that this despicable individual owns any gun matching this particular type of ammunition, and so, is to be considered a peaceful member of the Bangkok middle class only trying to share his opinion about the current problems of his beloved country"...

Obviously, and luckily, the very vast majority of the people have no difficulty in seeing the truth about these yellow criminals and their insane masters >_>

Sent from my HTC One using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

If they were shotgun shells that had not been already discharged then i would agree you have a point but if you look closely at the pic you will see dimples in the primers indicating that these have already been discharged. It is more likely that he picked these up off of the ground after the police moved to a new location.

[Mr Yim]

I have just watched a brave policeman lose half his leg kicking a grenade thrown at him and his colleagues by a peaceful demonstrator. Those idiots who think the police are cowards have the intellect of a lobotomized chimpanzee. Condolences to the policemant and protestor killed and I hope all the injured make full recoveries insofar as you can with missing limbs.

Edited February 19, 2014 by Mr Yim

[Publicus]

This smells like 2010 just with the tables turned.

With Abhisit and Suthep facing murder charges, I wish to know when Chalerm and Yingluck get an invitation to hear their charges...

No comparison. In this situation, the PM and her cabinet are still in control. There is no military involvement in respect to the enforcement of civil order. In this case, it is still a civilian operation. In 2010, Abhisit was basically pushed aside as he was dithering, and the military and its key allies in the Democrat dominated cabinet took over. The low number of casualties arising from the current operation is due to a civilian agency dealing with a civil disorder. The large number of casualties and collateral damage in 2010 was attributable to the royal guard units operating as if they were in a war zone.

Whatever one thinks of the police or the current government, the patience and low casualty count demonstrates that civilian public security agencies are better able to respond to civilian based disorder. The Thai military has repeatedly shown that it is incapable of handling civilian related issues, whether it is the Rohingya refugees, the smugglers on the borders and even the southern insurrection.

I have just watched a brave policeman lose half his leg kicking a grenade thrown at him and his colleagues by a peaceful demonstrator. Those idiots who think the police are cowards have the intellect of a lobotomized chimpanzee. Condolences to the policemant and protestor killed and I hope all the injured make full recoveries insofar as you can with missing limbs.

Yes, the legitimate civilian authority is the interim government, and the legitimate civilian law enforcement agency, the police, are in charge. Both are conducting and managing the civil disorder effectively and wisely, to include this well thought out and timed campaign to terminate the civil insurrectionist disorder according to international standards.

This is a sharp and stark contrast to 2010 when the installed government of Abhisit and Suthep were required by the army to use the army for everything and did so with only lip service to the principles of international standards.

In the present trying circumstance, the police the other side habitually tries to dismiss as wholly incompetent and incapable are on the front lines conducting a well organized,and coordinated campaign of restrained law enforcement, exercising skill, strong competence, and a self-discipline derived from excellent training and a strong leadership..

The police are losing life and limb in the line of duty, showing courage, professionalism, and a respect of law and human rights.

In respect of human rights, the military has little time to bother with such inconveniences, as we saw at the temple in 2010 where unarmed medical workers and unarmed others were shot dead in an unprovoked army shooting gallery. In this action, the police are meeting armed paramilitary force with restraint and good judgement. Civilians who might be sitting and praying in civil disobedience, and in actual civil disobedience the practitioners expect to be dragged off under arrest, the police given 'em a taste of some tear gas.

Yes, the 2010 government and the present government are night and day. This government is in fact utilizing the police in daylight hours almost exclusively and broadcasting it to the country - and the world - on live television. It just couldn't be more radically different, then and now.

[fab4]

RT @RichardBarrow: 11:40am Reports that a policeman has been shot during clash at Pan Fah Bridge #Bangkok (Pic @phattanantv9) http://t.co/pSxuF9Ph7m

Not a red shirt in sight. Who are the "peaceful protester" forum apologists going to blame now?

T..! Not a red shirt in sight ... what about the pollice? ... they are red to the core, and they are the ones who have kicked this off.

All the reports are saying that masses of the supporters have been sitting on the ground offering no opposition. When Chalerm decides to give the order, after conveniently telling us all that he is not going to be in the thick of it, then this is what we can expect...!

He, and her ladyship, shall reap what they sow...!

Sorry, with comments like those above, it is beyond pointless even trying to discuss this with you.

Perhaps one day you will reflect on your comments but I don't hold out much hope for that happening.