SOTIRIOS Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 ....all the way to the educational system...... (...see the 'conservative figures' on illiteracy rates posted...) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCauto Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 In the past it was mostly petty corruption. You could compare the span of corruption nowadays to a lake as opposed to a few drops before. Most people are NOT AWARE of high level corruption because as in its name, its high level, you don't come into direct contact with it nor can you understand the complexity as corruption has been fine tuned so much to avoid the radar and the law at times. You're not very well informed in this case. Do you recall why the Chatchai government was known as the "Buffet Government"? Do you remember why it took so many years to fill up Swampy and how those contracts would be re-tendered each time a new government formed? Do you not remember any of the previous agricultural subsidy scams? I too could go on and on. How is it that everyone is so sure about how much corruption occurred at this time or that time such that they feel so confident in comparing their scales? Even the poster acknowledges this in his post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halion Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Corruption is a human condition and not exclusive to this nation. The problem lies in the fact that the majority of countries strive to minimize the occurrence and acceptance of corruption whilst in Thailand they have accepted corruption into their very culture and national identity. In Thailand the manifestations of corruption and it;s acceptance are rampant in every aspect of daily life . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thai at Heart Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 In the past it was mostly petty corruption. You could compare the span of corruption nowadays to a lake as opposed to a few drops before. Most people are NOT AWARE of high level corruption because as in its name, its high level, you don't come into direct contact with it nor can you understand the complexity as corruption has been fine tuned so much to avoid the radar and the law at times. You're not very well informed in this case. Do you recall why the Chatchai government was known as the "Buffet Government"? Do you remember why it took so many years to fill up Swampy and how those contracts would be re-tendered each time a new government formed? Do you not remember any of the previous agricultural subsidy scams? I too could go on and on. How is it that everyone is so sure about how much corruption occurred at this time or that time such that they feel so confident in comparing their scales? Even the poster acknowledges this in his post. No apparently thaksin invented corruption. All that lending in the thai military bank pre 97 was his fault to, land scandals, logging scandals and all the rest was here. He also kidnapped shergar and knows where lord Lucan is...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
socksy01 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 <deleted> - you don't have to be Einstein to realise this. No Shit Sherlock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Borzandy Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Corruption is a part of people's mindset here in Thailand and it is taught in schools from primary school to university 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttthailand Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 The problem is that Thais think that the only way to get ahead is to be corrupt, which maybe it is here. Why do you think people pay to become a police man or get into some government jobs.... Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thai at Heart Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 The problem is that Thais think that the only way to get ahead is to be corrupt, which maybe it is here. Why do you think people pay to become a police man or get into some government jobs.... Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app Think. They know..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h90 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 What a load of rubbish. Corruption is the mindset of business, not this or that nationality. Some nations have managed to pretty much root it out of the business mindset, but i assume that is through decent political governence and exemplary leadership. In general, the more business there is the more corruption there is. The big difference between say a thailand and an america is that here it is more obvious, but in america corruption is still rife in the business and political world. As for students 'cheating' on assignments, hardly corruption is it! In fact if teachers continue to teach in a top-down structure while giving out utterly boring assignments which are too difficult, then copying will naturally continue. Don't blame the student, blame the appalling system and education. And just 3% said they'd not repay their student loans? Not bad at all, but again, hardly corruption. The most disappointing thing in this news is that this is being spouted by the president of a university. They should be the first ones to look for real causes of student (or citizen) behaviour, rather than just coming out with tired cliches that offer no solutions. The whole eductional structure is a top-down structure, everybogy higher 'telling' everybody lower, with the students at the bottom. When it's boring and difficult, why not copy?? Get creative and set assigments that can't be copied. You see the business expats, within just a few years they are the same or even worse corrupt than the Thais, if they have no pressure from the legal system. So it is not Thai/German/American mindset. It is just human mindset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimHuaHin Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Corruption exists in every country, to varying degrees ... and it certainly exists in present day Australia and the US of A, for example. Student cheating also exists in every country ... when I was teaching at university in Australia (up until 2013) any student caught cheating or plagarising material automatially failed. However, the degree of cheating and corruption in Thailand is certainly a matter of concern. Student cheating brings the whole country down ... why do Thai students perform so poorly on international standard tests, and I do not mean just English language tests .... in maths and the natural sciences, they perform very poorly compared to students in most other ASEAN countries, and most other Asian countries. If Thailand does not make real efforts of reduce the level of corruption, then international businesses will move to countries where there is less corruption and they can make bigger profits, retirees will choose to retire to countries where life is more agreeable and bureaucracies are more accommodating, and young educated Thais will increasingly seek to migrate to "better" countries which offer more equality and opportunity (as they are increasingly doing now). Time for Thailand's law makers and leaders to wake up ... this is the 21st Century ... and unless Thailand moves with the times, Thailand will be left behind .... the poorest country in ASEAN?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
techboy Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 <deleted>? "Corruption Index" Dumb concept and any algorithm would have almost infinite and subjective variables. This guy offered nothing useful. My experience with countries is that the higher the poverty, the more the corruption. Certainly the Thai bashers in their aggressive ignorance and characteristic propensity for citing whimsical assumptions and expounding on them as though they were fact are having a field day with this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupatria Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 If it "has become", this presumes a time when it wasn't. How many decades ago was this wonderful time in thailand? According to a government official, the "culture" of tea money only came to Thailand with the Chinese immigrants... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ggt Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Corruption! What Corruption??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan7444 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 I don't think anyone could possibly begin to imagine the level of utter shock and surprise that washed over me as I read this headline. I was mistakenly under the belief that corruption in Thailand began with Thaksin and will cease to exist once he is gone. How silly of me to have listened to the fairytales. My eyes are now open Wow! And I thought the same thing as well. Must have been all of those very convincing protestors talking for weeks about getting rid of Thaksin and you get rid of corruption. How dumb is that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soalbundy Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 What a load of rubbish. Corruption is the mindset of business, not this or that nationality. Some nations have managed to pretty much root it out of the business mindset, but i assume that is through decent political governence and exemplary leadership. In general, the more business there is the more corruption there is. The big difference between say a thailand and an america is that here it is more obvious, but in america corruption is still rife in the business and political world. As for students 'cheating' on assignments, hardly corruption is it! In fact if teachers continue to teach in a top-down structure while giving out utterly boring assignments which are too difficult, then copying will naturally continue. Don't blame the student, blame the appalling system and education. And just 3% said they'd not repay their student loans? Not bad at all, but again, hardly corruption. The most disappointing thing in this news is that this is being spouted by the president of a university. They should be the first ones to look for real causes of student (or citizen) behaviour, rather than just coming out with tired cliches that offer no solutions. The whole eductional structure is a top-down structure, everybogy higher 'telling' everybody lower, with the students at the bottom. When it's boring and difficult, why not copy?? Get creative and set assigments that can't be copied. Probably you are from the US, and believing that is not corruption in your country..... English is difficult for you to understand isn't it. Read it again,slowly, especially the last sentence in the first paragraph ( use a dictionary ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTiger Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 If ever you did not know how to define "thainess", now you do!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeorgeO Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 "Chalermchai calculated that if one teacher wasted 20 per cent of their working hours over the course of their career, it would cost the public Bt1.7 million". ...how do people realistically make such claims?What's a teacher's annual salary right now, and what do they suppose it will be forty years from now? I honestly cannot believe that people throw these figures around as if they are facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmo88 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 (edited) It is indeed problematic if school children cheat during exams, assignments, etc., sometimes even right in plain view of the teacher, and neither the children nor the teacher see anything particularly wrong with that. Edited March 7, 2014 by Cosmo88 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soalbundy Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 What a load of rubbish. Corruption is the mindset of business, not this or that nationality. Some nations have managed to pretty much root it out of the business mindset, but i assume that is through decent political governence and exemplary leadership. In general, the more business there is the more corruption there is. The big difference between say a thailand and an america is that here it is more obvious, but in america corruption is still rife in the business and political world. As for students 'cheating' on assignments, hardly corruption is it! In fact if teachers continue to teach in a top-down structure while giving out utterly boring assignments which are too difficult, then copying will naturally continue. Don't blame the student, blame the appalling system and education. And just 3% said they'd not repay their student loans? Not bad at all, but again, hardly corruption. The most disappointing thing in this news is that this is being spouted by the president of a university. They should be the first ones to look for real causes of student (or citizen) behaviour, rather than just coming out with tired cliches that offer no solutions. The whole eductional structure is a top-down structure, everybogy higher 'telling' everybody lower, with the students at the bottom. When it's boring and difficult, why not copy?? Get creative and set assigments that can't be copied. You see the business expats, within just a few years they are the same or even worse corrupt than the Thais, if they have no pressure from the legal system. So it is not Thai/German/American mindset. It is just human mindset. or a necessity to do business here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingalfred Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 What a load of rubbish. Corruption is the mindset of business, not this or that nationality. Some nations have managed to pretty much root it out of the business mindset, but i assume that is through decent political governence and exemplary leadership. In general, the more business there is the more corruption there is. The big difference between say a thailand and an america is that here it is more obvious, but in america corruption is still rife in the business and political world. As for students 'cheating' on assignments, hardly corruption is it! In fact if teachers continue to teach in a top-down structure while giving out utterly boring assignments which are too difficult, then copying will naturally continue. Don't blame the student, blame the appalling system and education. And just 3% said they'd not repay their student loans? Not bad at all, but again, hardly corruption. The most disappointing thing in this news is that this is being spouted by the president of a university. They should be the first ones to look for real causes of student (or citizen) behaviour, rather than just coming out with tired cliches that offer no solutions. The whole eductional structure is a top-down structure, everybogy higher 'telling' everybody lower, with the students at the bottom. When it's boring and difficult, why not copy?? Get creative and set assigments that can't be copied. with views like this.Thailand is well on the " same path" No ChangeSent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingalfred Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 If it "has become", this presumes a time when it wasn't. How many decades ago was this wonderful time in thailand? According to a government official, the "culture" of tea money only came to Thailand with the Chinese immigrants...ah blame someone else.One way of never dealing with a problem.Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpeg Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 (edited) Corruption is 'part of Thai mindset' I'm not entirely sure this is actually true. The people I've had speak to me about this are vociferously against it. And they've all been Thai. My belief is that this is simply an urban myth to nullify it's effects on it's ongoing promulgation by those who would seek to benefit the most from it. Edited March 7, 2014 by jpeg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indyuk Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 (edited) Hey Smileydude you state that this is a list of corrupt projects Rice pledging schemeOne tablet per studentMedical supply purchasing scandalSteyr fire truck purchase My information is that at least the first two items have not been shown to be corrupted so far. If you are a higher source of information then I have to assume that you are corrupt yourself. This is because you claim to know what the outcome of the investigation of the 'Rice Pledging Scheme' and the 'One Tablet per Student' respectively will be, This is must be because such has already been decided by yourself before before their respective investigations are concluded. , Edited March 7, 2014 by indyuk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smileydude Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 (edited) In the past it was mostly petty corruption. You could compare the span of corruption nowadays to a lake as opposed to a few drops before. Most people are NOT AWARE of high level corruption because as in its name, its high level, you don't come into direct contact with it nor can you understand the complexity as corruption has been fine tuned so much to avoid the radar and the law at times. You're not very well informed in this case. Do you recall why the Chatchai government was known as the "Buffet Government"? Do you remember why it took so many years to fill up Swampy and how those contracts would be re-tendered each time a new government formed? Do you not remember any of the previous agricultural subsidy scams? I too could go on and on. How is it that everyone is so sure about how much corruption occurred at this time or that time such that they feel so confident in comparing their scales? Even the poster acknowledges this in his post. Your point is taken. My point is not comprehensive. Of course high level corruption existed since the formation of constitutional monarchy type governments BUT Thaksin has taken SYSTEMATIC corruption to a whole new level. Edited March 7, 2014 by smileydude Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smileydude Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Hey Smileydude you state that this is a list of corrupt projects Rice pledging scheme One tablet per student Medical supply purchasing scandal Steyr fire truck purchase My information is that at least the first two items have not been shown to be corrupted so far. If you are a higher source of information then I have to assume that you are corrupt yourself. This is because you claim to know what the outcome of the investigation of the Rice Pledging Scheme will be because such has already been decided by yourself before before the investigation has concluded. You sound like a lawyer wearing red shades. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttthailand Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Corruption is 'part of Thai mindset' I'm not entirely sure this is actually true. The people I've had speak to me about this are vociferously against it. And they've all been Thai. My belief is that this is simply an urban myth to nullify it's effects on it's ongoing promulgation by those who would seek to benefit the most from it. This is what they want you to believe. The truth is much different I assure you..... Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff2258 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Corruption is in all mindset and not only Thai. Once a child was born they are thought to be corrupted, because parents will offer to their child a gift if they obey or do something when told. Company will reward their staff if they can achieve something better out of their job requirement. Civil servant have more opportunity to corruption because of many things required approval, license or registration from the government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breezer Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Corruption is rife here and it makes me sick that people can live like this. The Phuket police took 20,000 from me last week. My car suffered a flat tyre in the process they stole all the contents made a story about a collision with another car. Continued to take my insurance and took my passport and said I would be arrested and charged with leaving the scene of a accident. Took a day to get my passport back and then they went on to get a friend too try fix my flat and try take more money for looking at it. I protested but got me nowhere. Even the locals In the hospital I was working with we're disgraced. Will this ever end! The cop even had the cheek too say "I don't show you photos you have too prove innocence". So the fact this is written above doesn't surprise me at all!! Believe nothing of what you hear and only half of what you see!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
user82374298374 Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 What a load of rubbish. Corruption is the mindset of business, not this or that nationality. No, corruption is the mindset of a culture - and it's an accepted and integral part of all Asian cultures, not just Thai culture. What's viewed as 'corruption' in the West has been the operative mode of governance and business in Asia for the last several millennia. It is an ingrained part of Asian culture, and is never going to change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArfurMaggot Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 (edited) As for students 'cheating' on assignments, hardly corruption is it! In fact if teachers continue to teach in a top-down structure while giving out utterly boring assignments which are too difficult, then copying will naturally continue. Don't blame the student, blame the appalling system and education. Would you happily go to a doctor or surgeon knowing that they had cheated on their exams? Corruption is an element of all societies and can only be prevented from becoming endemic by the vigilance of the honest. Unfortunately, in some cultures it is so well established that the "honest" are out-numbered, ridiculed or shouted down. Edited March 7, 2014 by ArfurMaggot 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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