Rice prices dropped to 8,000 - 8,200 baht per ton

[Robby nz]

The BAAC has been buying for years, many small farmers do indeed benefit, I have witnessed this first hand, these farmers do not go sell to the millers, the rice is cleaned, dried and stored, when the rice is collected the agreed price is paid, usually months later after the glut is over, this is in the one crop per year area.

I see other farmers who will take their rice from the field direct to the mill, they get the lowest price, I see farmers who clean and dry the rice, then take it to the mill, they gain a better price for obvious reasons, I see those who clean dry and store the rice and sell to the BAAC, they obtain a better price still for reasons that are obvious.

So there are variations in price, but I do not believe even the small farmer would not benefit from the garaunteed rice price for the simple reason he could possibly sell to his neighbour who is in the scheme for a baht below....I have not witnessed this as all the small farmers I know are in the scheme and have dealt with the BAAC for years....maybe there is a reason others have not.

What a load of <deleted>, For a start the BAAC has not been buying anything it is only an agent for the Govt which is supposed to pay into the bank which then pays the farmers.

Harvest is in full swing here now on the central plains and every day I watch the harvesters working and truck loads of rice being taken away, how the hell can any farmer clean, store or anything else that quantity of rice ?

They don't have warehouses or gear to do these jobs. The farmers job is to grow the rice not to process it, once it is harvested it is then passed on to the next person up the chain.

The ignorant trying to influence the gullible, unfortunately for you we are not all that thick.

[Thai at Heart]

The BAAC has been buying for years, many small farmers do indeed benefit, I have witnessed this first hand, these farmers do not go sell to the millers, the rice is cleaned, dried and stored, when the rice is collected the agreed price is paid, usually months later after the glut is over, this is in the one crop per year area.

I see other farmers who will take their rice from the field direct to the mill, they get the lowest price, I see farmers who clean and dry the rice, then take it to the mill, they gain a better price for obvious reasons, I see those who clean dry and store the rice and sell to the BAAC, they obtain a better price still for reasons that are obvious.

So there are variations in price, but I do not believe even the small farmer would not benefit from the garaunteed rice price for the simple reason he could possibly sell to his neighbour who is in the scheme for a baht below....I have not witnessed this as all the small farmers I know are in the scheme and have dealt with the BAAC for years....maybe there is a reason others have not.

What a load of <deleted>, For a start the BAAC has not been buying anything it is only an agent for the Govt which is supposed to pay into the bank which then pays the farmers.

Harvest is in full swing here now on the central plains and every day I watch the harvesters working and truck loads of rice being taken away, how the hell can any farmer clean, store or anything else that quantity of rice ?

They don't have warehouses or gear to do these jobs. The farmers job is to grow the rice not to process it, once it is harvested it is then passed on to the next person up the chain.

The ignorant trying to influence the gullible, unfortunately for you we are not all that thick.

Farmers often have small storage bins of rice. It needs to be basically threshed and sorted before it is delivered doesn't it? They can't just deliver it straight from the field stalk and all can they.

This used to be done by putting it on the road. They are supposed to do a basic cleaning and keep it and try to get the moisture down a bit. If the weather is good, this can be quite quick, but often they deliver rice at 20%+ moisture.

They get penalised for this. They get penalised for the "cleanliness" of the product.

[SICHONSTEVE]

Well we have posters here who cannot understand the poor price offered by merchants for rice straight from the harvester, along with all the chaff and moisture, some harvested at night when the dew is on bagged and taken to the miller the following day!

We have others who do not appear to understand that there is not a government sponsored welfare system in Thailand! The family farm and ability to feed themselves is the last refuge for many if difficult financial circumstances arise. The advocation of foreign 'investment' is short sighted and surely signifies limited vision regarding the future of rural communities.

I have already pointed out farmers are diversifying, and have in my time in Thailand seen encouragment to do so by successive governments, there is now no shortage of banana growth, papaya, chillies, tomatoes, and mango, eucalyptus trees surround the exterior divides of many a rice paddy, many rear a pig or two on the homestead, many have chickens, and cows, not major crop changes, but accessories to the rice crop

It is rather difficult to accept the more bizzare attitudes that are aired on this thread from the less informed

Farmers will survive, they have had decades of experience........but just for a while the sun shone through the gloom for many.....you think they will forget.....even if they are cast into the dark days again they will be a little easier to endure with the advances in recent years

There is also some that don't understand that 2.59 million of the poorest farmers don't benefit from this scheme. Do you understand that? Do you not a see that the poorest are not benefiting from this scheme?

There are also those that don't understand that trying to manipulate gamble with market prices is not beneficial to a sustainable scheme while manipulating a narrow cross section of society.

How is it that I have a bizarre attitude when the poorest farmers are not benefitting?

Please tell me?

Fat Haggis

I find it amusing that you have given this posting a 'like' and you are one of the biggest apologists for this government.

I just don't get it!!!

Do you sit on the fence every morning and support whatever side of the argument, depending on which garden you fall into??

[kikoman]

Why would I want to read the untruths you write, if you stated facts I would gladly read anything you posted but you can not do anything but attempt to insults those who disagree with you! You post did not address the question I asked about why the price of rice has fallen in Thailand.

Or why the Millers and Exporters are trying to manipulate the price paid to the rice farmer, not due to the supply and demand of the international market, can not be justified in any way,

I will respond to your off topic statements which will be the last one I respond to!

One member of your active yellow posters has been to my house, knows where and how I live, one thing for sure I do not spread untruths, as I can see the tractors parked across the street, have ridden on them when the family helps us work on the farm land my wife owns, not farms owns! I do not know what your concept of a Thai rice farming village is, our has one street entering and leaving it, everything that passes through the village passes in front of my house.

Khon Kean must have 1 million 632 thousand more residents then the maybe a thousand residents our village has, I would venture to say no where near the country, not a rice farming village anymore than Pattaya is.

I would not allow my wife's family to live in the state you state your in laws live in, but not indicative of the salt of the earth conditions you seen to think all rice farmer live in, most of the wooden houses have been replaced in our village by new modern structure , as the people team up and help each other improve their living conditions.

Life is great in a rural village far away from the Farang infested Ghettos!

Cheers

[JRSoul]

Life is great in a rural village far away from the Farang infested Ghettos!

Cheers

And yet, they have you.

[harryfrompattaya]

The farms are too small and disjointed, the production methods unchanged for decades, still using water buffaloes and manual planting and harvesting.

The farms should be modernised and formed into cooperatives to take advantage of machinery costs.

Farmers should be educated via the coop's to change their farming methods, but that is unlikely as the government cannot even stop them from the seasonal burn off threatening the environment.

Lastly, the real problem is greed from the man in Dubai and PTP, they have all gotten rich at the expense of the poor farmer, by attempting to manipulate market forces. Then they buried their heads in the sand and hoped the mess would go away while still pocketing their ill gotten gains.

Until Thailand recognises and deals with entrenched corruption, nothing will change, it will be the rubber farmers or another group next in line.

Sent from my GT-P7500 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

You have not been any where close to Thai rice farming have you, Still using water buffalo, give me a break!

Most farming famiiies in our area own a new tractor i million baht per tractor, when the farmers came to Bangkok, those are the tractor used in the field, that is why they are hurting for money, to make on lump sum payment per year on the payments for the tractors.at harvest time.

The only problem is the greed of the middle man, there is a market for that rice now! at great prices!

Cheers

You may be right but tell how many times you eat rice. People today all over the world eat less rice than before.

Rich Asians and Rich people of my color will not be caught dead eating rice that is the problem

[harryfrompattaya]

Please all you authorities on rice how many times a week to you eat rice

Maybe you have to get al law pass that we all eat rice 3 times a day everyday

That will cause the price to rise

Someone has to eat the suff.

[GuestHouse]

Plough 100 baht per rai

Disc 100 baht per rai

Plant - broadcast - 100 baht per rai - seed rice supplied from previous years crop

Fertiliser - 1500 baht per rai (x 2 broadcasts)

Reaping 650 baht per rai

Cartage 500 baht

Total 2950 baht per rai

Now I admit these are 'family' rates Jamie, and I admit they do not include a cost for scraping if required, usually every alternate year, also I have not included refreshments, but I would be interested to know where you get your 7000 baht a rai production costs? as you claim in post 104

You stated:

"PS - They would be great prices if it didn't cost the Thai farmer 7000 baht per rai to produce compared to 4 900 baht per rai for the vietnamese to produce."

You have not included the inflation in these costs brought about but the Failed PTP Rice Pledging scheme, nor the increase in costs to tenant farmers of renting land due to the promises of easy cash from the Failed PTP Rice Pledging Scheme, and you have certainly missed the cost of borrowing money for those who have not yet been paid by the Failed PTP Rice Pledging Scheme.

As I recall, the PTP spokesperson stated, on the eve of disgruntled farmers heading to Bangkok, that there were just 3000 farmers who have not been paid - We knew then and we know now for sure that that was just another bare faced PTP lie.

But I also recall the imaginative ideas coming from some PTP supporters - Kilkoman had his own idea of paying off the farmers who supported the PTP and not paying those protesting farmers whom Kilkoman accused of having a 'Political Agenda'.

And then missing from your idyllic view of the PTP world in your description of the diversification and hardiness of Thailand's farmers (no arguments from me on that) other than those farmers who have been forced to sell their land because of the debts they have incurred due to the Failed PTP Rice Pledging Scheme, are now out in the world, landless and as you rightly point in a world with no welfare.

The Failed PTP Rice Pledging Scheme is going to be weighing on the backs of Thailands small holding farmers for years to come.

It has from the outset been an utter disaster - no other proof of which is required than the PTP's own shame faced lies regarding every aspect of the program.

[Fat Haggis]

Well we have posters here who cannot understand the poor price offered by merchants for rice straight from the harvester, along with all the chaff and moisture, some harvested at night when the dew is on bagged and taken to the miller the following day!

We have others who do not appear to understand that there is not a government sponsored welfare system in Thailand! The family farm and ability to feed themselves is the last refuge for many if difficult financial circumstances arise. The advocation of foreign 'investment' is short sighted and surely signifies limited vision regarding the future of rural communities.

I have already pointed out farmers are diversifying, and have in my time in Thailand seen encouragment to do so by successive governments, there is now no shortage of banana growth, papaya, chillies, tomatoes, and mango, eucalyptus trees surround the exterior divides of many a rice paddy, many rear a pig or two on the homestead, many have chickens, and cows, not major crop changes, but accessories to the rice crop

It is rather difficult to accept the more bizzare attitudes that are aired on this thread from the less informed

Farmers will survive, they have had decades of experience........but just for a while the sun shone through the gloom for many.....you think they will forget.....even if they are cast into the dark days again they will be a little easier to endure with the advances in recent years

There is also some that don't understand that 2.59 million of the poorest farmers don't benefit from this scheme. Do you understand that? Do you not a see that the poorest are not benefiting from this scheme?

There are also those that don't understand that trying to manipulate gamble with market prices is not beneficial to a sustainable scheme while manipulating a narrow cross section of society.

How is it that I have a bizarre attitude when the poorest farmers are not benefitting?

Please tell me?

Fat Haggis

I find it amusing that you have given this posting a 'like' and you are one of the biggest apologists for this government.

I just don't get it!!!

Do you sit on the fence every morning and support whatever side of the argument, depending on which garden you fall into??

I liked the post as it highlights that not every rice farmer can join the ill conceieved Rice scheme, because my girlfriends family have rice farms, and they dold their rice to the local millers..

I sit on the fence as it's easier to see both sides points of view, you ASS u ME I'm a government supporter I'm not, I'm just not blinkered enough nor convinced enough that either side is worthy of a mere Farang Opinion, I'll leave the Thai Politics to them to sort out, not really that hard to get old chap.

Now perhaps you'll answer me this question then, how does any "peoples party" propose to sell the rice in storage without making significant loses?

I also found it amusing that Jamie, painted a very tearful image of his In Laws, I'm just wondering why he's not dipped his hand in his pockets and bought them a bigger telly, or even fixed their roof for them, or even bought them a run down old car.

There I hope you feel a little more amused

[edwinchester]

The BAAC has been buying for years, many small farmers do indeed benefit, I have witnessed this first hand, these farmers do not go sell to the millers, the rice is cleaned, dried and stored, when the rice is collected the agreed price is paid, usually months later after the glut is over, this is in the one crop per year area.

I see other farmers who will take their rice from the field direct to the mill, they get the lowest price, I see farmers who clean and dry the rice, then take it to the mill, they gain a better price for obvious reasons, I see those who clean dry and store the rice and sell to the BAAC, they obtain a better price still for reasons that are obvious.

So there are variations in price, but I do not believe even the small farmer would not benefit from the garaunteed rice price for the simple reason he could possibly sell to his neighbour who is in the scheme for a baht below....I have not witnessed this as all the small farmers I know are in the scheme and have dealt with the BAAC for years....maybe there is a reason others have not.

What a load of <deleted>, For a start the BAAC has not been buying anything it is only an agent for the Govt which is supposed to pay into the bank which then pays the farmers.

Harvest is in full swing here now on the central plains and every day I watch the harvesters working and truck loads of rice being taken away, how the hell can any farmer clean, store or anything else that quantity of rice ?

They don't have warehouses or gear to do these jobs. The farmers job is to grow the rice not to process it, once it is harvested it is then passed on to the next person up the chain.

The ignorant trying to influence the gullible, unfortunately for you we are not all that thick.

Farmers often have small storage bins of rice. It needs to be basically threshed and sorted before it is delivered doesn't it? They can't just deliver it straight from the field stalk and all can they.

This used to be done by putting it on the road. They are supposed to do a basic cleaning and keep it and try to get the moisture down a bit. If the weather is good, this can be quite quick, but often they deliver rice at 20%+ moisture.

They get penalised for this. They get penalised for the "cleanliness" of the product.

Watch a rice cutter/combine sometime. It cuts the rice and seperates the grain from the stalk there and then. The grain is then dumped into a hopper on the back of the combine then pumped into a waiting truck when cutting is finished and usually delivered straight to a rice mill.

[Fat Haggis]

Please all you authorities on rice how many times a week to you eat rice

Maybe you have to get al law pass that we all eat rice 3 times a day everyday

That will cause the price to rise

Someone has to eat the suff.

I'm not a rice expert, but when I'm at home, I eat rice with the family 3 times a day, which I really shouldn't due to the high amount of calories/Carbs rice contains, and I keep telling my girlfriend the same thing. When I'm at home there's 4 of us eating daily, sometimes more if we have family over, typically there's a pot that looks like it holds 10Kg's of cooked rice, that's normally eaten by the end of the day.

I seem to remember paying around 800-900 baht for a 50KG bag of it as well about about 3 weeks ago, can't be certain as to how much is consumed in dry weight in a month, but I have a feeling that the 50KG's lasts around 4-6 weeks.

Hope this helps in a small way??

[djjamie]

Khon Kean must have 1 million 632 thousand more residents then the maybe a thousand residents our village has,

You know the tractor population, cost and status of tractors in your area back to front yet you have no idea when Korn or Ahbisit visits the area of 1000 people.

[JRSoul]

I liked the post as it highlights that not every rice farmer can join the ill conceieved Rice scheme, because my girlfriends family have rice farms, and they dold their rice to the local millers..

I sit on the fence as it's easier to see both sides points of view, you ASS u ME I'm a government supporter I'm not, I'm just not blinkered enough nor convinced enough that either side is worthy of a mere Farang Opinion, I'll leave the Thai Politics to them to sort out, not really that hard to get old chap.

Now perhaps you'll answer me this question then, how does any "peoples party" propose to sell the rice in storage without making significant loses?

I also found it amusing that Jamie, painted a very tearful image of his In Laws, I'm just wondering why he's not dipped his hand in his pockets and bought them a bigger telly, or even fixed their roof for them, or even bought them a run down old car.

There I hope you feel a little more amused

".... how does any "peoples party" propose to sell the rice in storage without making significant loses?" sic

When was there ever a claim that they could do that? Do you then blame those who sold the rice at market prices, or those who paid far too much for it?

Edited March 9, 2014 by JRSoul

[djjamie]

The world over it is the farmers who take the risk and get shafted by the bulk selling middle people.

Not under Abhisit's rice mortgage scheme it wasn't!!!!!

Nonsense. If anything it was more prone to millers robbing the ordinary farmers.

Under the previous insurance scheme of of Abhisit , farmers sold to millers and were reimbursed for the difference if the rice was bought below 11,000 baht. With the PTP rice mortgage scheme, farmers will sell rice directly to the government for 15,000 baht.

By all means complain and mock this joke of a policy that is literally ruining the economy, but don`t let your yellow specks convince you the Dem version was corruption free or ideal. The only reason it was slightly more sustainable was because it didnt pay them as much.

Still find this forum amazing in the way so many guys mock a corrupt and inefficient government and crave an equally corrupt and inefficient one to return in its place. The fact they are both useless is beyond their comprehension.

Our families in Central Thailand received 11,000 Baht per ton of rice for last Octobers harvest which is around $340.per ton, a few in the village sold rice at 12,000 baht per ton. Farmers say that the 15000 baht per ton is paid for Jasmine rice which seems to low considering Jasmine high price on the international market.

I have not run across one farmer in our area that has been paid more than 12000 baht per ton for his rice!

Cheers

That is not surprising. Korn and Ahbisit visit your area and you are unaware. So you're not really the "information desk" for your village.

[SICHONSTEVE]

Well we have posters here who cannot understand the poor price offered by merchants for rice straight from the harvester, along with all the chaff and moisture, some harvested at night when the dew is on bagged and taken to the miller the following day!

We have others who do not appear to understand that there is not a government sponsored welfare system in Thailand! The family farm and ability to feed themselves is the last refuge for many if difficult financial circumstances arise. The advocation of foreign 'investment' is short sighted and surely signifies limited vision regarding the future of rural communities.

I have already pointed out farmers are diversifying, and have in my time in Thailand seen encouragment to do so by successive governments, there is now no shortage of banana growth, papaya, chillies, tomatoes, and mango, eucalyptus trees surround the exterior divides of many a rice paddy, many rear a pig or two on the homestead, many have chickens, and cows, not major crop changes, but accessories to the rice crop

It is rather difficult to accept the more bizzare attitudes that are aired on this thread from the less informed

Farmers will survive, they have had decades of experience........but just for a while the sun shone through the gloom for many.....you think they will forget.....even if they are cast into the dark days again they will be a little easier to endure with the advances in recent years

There is also some that don't understand that 2.59 million of the poorest farmers don't benefit from this scheme. Do you understand that? Do you not a see that the poorest are not benefiting from this scheme?

There are also those that don't understand that trying to manipulate gamble with market prices is not beneficial to a sustainable scheme while manipulating a narrow cross section of society.

How is it that I have a bizarre attitude when the poorest farmers are not benefitting?

Please tell me?

Fat Haggis

I find it amusing that you have given this posting a 'like' and you are one of the biggest apologists for this government.

I just don't get it!!!

Do you sit on the fence every morning and support whatever side of the argument, depending on which garden you fall into??

I liked the post as it highlights that not every rice farmer can join the ill conceieved Rice scheme, because my girlfriends family have rice farms, and they dold their rice to the local millers..

I sit on the fence as it's easier to see both sides points of view, you ASS u ME I'm a government supporter I'm not, I'm just not blinkered enough nor convinced enough that either side is worthy of a mere Farang Opinion, I'll leave the Thai Politics to them to sort out, not really that hard to get old chap.

Now perhaps you'll answer me this question then, how does any "peoples party" propose to sell the rice in storage without making significant loses?

I also found it amusing that Jamie, painted a very tearful image of his In Laws, I'm just wondering why he's not dipped his hand in his pockets and bought them a bigger telly, or even fixed their roof for them, or even bought them a run down old car.

There I hope you feel a little more amused

"Now perhaps you'll answer me this question then, how does any "peoples party" propose to sell the rice in storage without making significant loses"

They (the people's party) are not going to be able to do this as the government has so cocked it up it will take years to remedy the situation.

The pertinent point of your argument should not be "what they are going to do about it"?, but why the PTP was allowed to get away with implementing Thaksin's stupid and irresponsible scheme in the first place. You should be questioning this aspect and not what will be done about it regards damage limitation by any incoming government.

They were warned by so many experts, Abhisit and academics that it would end in tears, but OH!! NO!! my brother knows best (how to profit from it whilst purposefully abusing the farmers trust with impossible promises). Even when the cracks were appearing that it was going seriously wrong and has to be the most costly mistake and flawed policy in Thailand's history, they couldn't lose face and abandon it as it would make it look like Thaksin doesn't know what he is doing (which is precisely the case).

How on earth people of normal intelligence can still support and defend this government is beyond me - I have left-wing Labour/Union tendencies back in England but common sense stretches way beyond my ideology and conscience when such blatant exploitation, nepotism, fraud and corruption are being committed on the poor and vulnerable to support this bunch of abject thieves who abuse democracy to the full in order to enrich themselves!!!!

[Fat Haggis]

I liked the post as it highlights that not every rice farmer can join the ill conceieved Rice scheme, because my girlfriends family have rice farms, and they dold their rice to the local millers..

I sit on the fence as it's easier to see both sides points of view, you ASS u ME I'm a government supporter I'm not, I'm just not blinkered enough nor convinced enough that either side is worthy of a mere Farang Opinion, I'll leave the Thai Politics to them to sort out, not really that hard to get old chap.

Now perhaps you'll answer me this question then, how does any "peoples party" propose to sell the rice in storage without making significant loses?

I also found it amusing that Jamie, painted a very tearful image of his In Laws, I'm just wondering why he's not dipped his hand in his pockets and bought them a bigger telly, or even fixed their roof for them, or even bought them a run down old car.

There I hope you feel a little more amused

".... how does any "peoples party" propose to sell the rice in storage without making significant loses?" sic

When was there ever a claim that they could do that? Do you then blame those who sold the rice at market prices, or those who paid far too much for it?

Who was making a claim? Sure was't me, I simply asked you how does a" peoples council" propose to sell a stockpile of rice without making a loss?? Given the market is saturated?

I also agree that he scheme was rank rotten, but that doesn't help now in having to try and shift it now, tomorrow and the next day and then the days after that and in the years to come..

Who's to blame, the people who invented the scheme in the first place!! even Stevie Wonder can see that There you go, is that less of a fence sitting statement for you SichonSteve ??

[SICHONSTEVE]

Please all you authorities on rice how many times a week to you eat rice

Maybe you have to get al law pass that we all eat rice 3 times a day everyday

That will cause the price to rise

Someone has to eat the suff.

I'm not a rice expert, but when I'm at home, I eat rice with the family 3 times a day, which I really shouldn't due to the high amount of calories/Carbs rice contains, and I keep telling my girlfriend the same thing. When I'm at home there's 4 of us eating daily, sometimes more if we have family over, typically there's a pot that looks like it holds 10Kg's of cooked rice, that's normally eaten by the end of the day.

I seem to remember paying around 800-900 baht for a 50KG bag of it as well about about 3 weeks ago, can't be certain as to how much is consumed in dry weight in a month, but I have a feeling that the 50KG's lasts around 4-6 weeks.

Hope this helps in a small way??

Try eating brown rice as it is far better for your health than 'pure simple carbohydrate' white rice which turns to sugar as soon as you eat it!!! White rice is simply rice with all of the goodness and minerals stripped off and out of it, to make it look nice and appetising.

[SICHONSTEVE]

I liked the post as it highlights that not every rice farmer can join the ill conceieved Rice scheme, because my girlfriends family have rice farms, and they dold their rice to the local millers..

I sit on the fence as it's easier to see both sides points of view, you ASS u ME I'm a government supporter I'm not, I'm just not blinkered enough nor convinced enough that either side is worthy of a mere Farang Opinion, I'll leave the Thai Politics to them to sort out, not really that hard to get old chap.

Now perhaps you'll answer me this question then, how does any "peoples party" propose to sell the rice in storage without making significant loses?

I also found it amusing that Jamie, painted a very tearful image of his In Laws, I'm just wondering why he's not dipped his hand in his pockets and bought them a bigger telly, or even fixed their roof for them, or even bought them a run down old car.

There I hope you feel a little more amused

".... how does any "peoples party" propose to sell the rice in storage without making significant loses?" sic

When was there ever a claim that they could do that? Do you then blame those who sold the rice at market prices, or those who paid far too much for it?

Who was making a claim? Sure was't me, I simply asked you how does a" peoples council" propose to sell a stockpile of rice without making a loss?? Given the market is saturated?

I also agree that he scheme was rank rotten, but that doesn't help now in having to try and shift it now, tomorrow and the next day and then the days after that and in the years to come..

Who's to blame, the people who invented the scheme in the first place!! even Stevie Wonder can see that There you go, is that less of a fence sitting statement for you SichonSteve ??

OK, you have planted your feet in the (non-red) garden on this aspect - are you now still going to be writing posts defending this government??

Also, look at my other recent post about you posing the wrong question and looking for the wrong answer regarding the rice scam and future implications of it!!

[Fat Haggis]

Of course I'll write posts defending on certain actions and finger pointing, and I'll remain or try to remain as neutral as I can in my own opinions and observations, that's why I don't get all emotional about reds or yellows, neither of them float my boat mate, there's nothing wrong with having opinions that are different from the run of the mill, even a Salmon swims upstream at some point in his life

[SICHONSTEVE]

Of course I'll write posts defending on certain actions and finger pointing, and I'll remain or try to remain as neutral as I can in my own opinions and observations, that's why I don't get all emotional about reds or yellows, neither of them float my boat mate, there's nothing wrong with having opinions that are different from the run of the mill, even a Salmon swims upstream at some point in his life

Not sure about your analogy Fat Haggis. Salmon swim upstream to breed (and then die) not because their views run counter to those of the main stream - which is what I deem you to mean by this expression.

[harryfrompattaya]

Please all you authorities on rice how many times a week to you eat rice

Maybe you have to get al law pass that we all eat rice 3 times a day everyday

That will cause the price to rise

Someone has to eat the suff.

I'm not a rice expert, but when I'm at home, I eat rice with the family 3 times a day, which I really shouldn't due to the high amount of calories/Carbs rice contains, and I keep telling my girlfriend the same thing. When I'm at home there's 4 of us eating daily, sometimes more if we have family over, typically there's a pot that looks like it holds 10Kg's of cooked rice, that's normally eaten by the end of the day.

I seem to remember paying around 800-900 baht for a 50KG bag of it as well about about 3 weeks ago, can't be certain as to how much is consumed in dry weight in a month, but I have a feeling that the 50KG's lasts around 4-6 weeks.

Hope this helps in a small way??

Try eating brown rice as it is far better for your health than 'pure simple carbohydrate' white rice which turns to sugar as soon as you eat it!!! White rice is simply rice with all of the goodness and minerals stripped off and out of it, to make it look nice and appetising.

I agree the problem most do eat rice because it no good Rice tend to be poor themselves as people have more money they eat less rice so the price will come down

It is call supply and demand

Once again most rice brought for Africa is pay for by America's aid and America has no money . Maybe someone else pay for their rice so Thai farms can get paid

[harryfrompattaya]

Please all you authorities on rice how many times a week to you eat rice

Maybe you have to get al law pass that we all eat rice 3 times a day everyday

That will cause the price to rise

Someone has to eat the suff.

I'm not a rice expert, but when I'm at home, I eat rice with the family 3 times a day, which I really shouldn't due to the high amount of calories/Carbs rice contains, and I keep telling my girlfriend the same thing. When I'm at home there's 4 of us eating daily, sometimes more if we have family over, typically there's a pot that looks like it holds 10Kg's of cooked rice, that's normally eaten by the end of the day.

I seem to remember paying around 800-900 baht for a 50KG bag of it as well about about 3 weeks ago, can't be certain as to how much is consumed in dry weight in a month, but I have a feeling that the 50KG's lasts around 4-6 weeks.

Hope this helps in a small way??

Try eating brown rice as it is far better for your health than 'pure simple carbohydrate' white rice which turns to sugar as soon as you eat it!!! White rice is simply rice with all of the goodness and minerals stripped off and out of it, to make it look nice and appetising.

I agree the problem most do eat rice because it no good Rice tend to be poor themselves as people have more money they eat less rice so the price will come down

It is call supply and demand

Once again most rice brought for Africa is pay for by America's aid and America has no money . Maybe someone else pay for their rice so Thai farms can get paid

[monkeycountry]

This really is not good news for the poor, embattled farmers.

This is what happens when free markets are interfered with. Pheu Thai believed they could rig the market by withholding rice and came undone when other countries increased production.

Now Thai rice farmers will suffer because of this market manipulation.

The farmers are not innocent in this disaster. They, through their local leaders, were told numerous times by hundreds of prominent financial experts the world over, including leading thai scholars etc., that this would eventually collapse, yet each time the government even hinted at scaling down the rice scam, the farmers and their leaders went berserk and forced the government to continue like there was no tomorrow.

Unfortunately I do not think any lessons have been learned here, not by the government and not by the farmers, so it will happen again.

Edited March 9, 2014 by monkeycountry

[Fat Haggis]

Steve, I wish I had an answer to how to solve the rice mountain, it's a tough one, and a pledging scheme needs to be shelved so deep that it's never likely to see the light of day again. They say the road to hell was paved with good intentions, but look at the state of what that road turned out to be.. Yingluck should, as well as all her cabinet be held accountable for the rice fiasco, don't have a problem with that at all, but the damage has been done, it still doesn't fix what's broken.

I'm certainly no economist, nor rice lord either, and as I said, it didn't effect my extended family due to their low yields, and unable to join the scheme, the only thing I can really thing of here, is to treat it like a National Disastor (which is pretty much is) and write the rice off, and start all over again, what else can they do? Perhaps there will be a compensation scheme to help them, I don't know.

Yeah the Salmon thing was perhaps not the best anology I'll give you an example of how agriculture and aquaculture can be very ruthless when it comes t dealing with Governments..

During the 90's I was in the aquaculture Industry in Scotland, and in one year the entire Scottish Salmon Industry had to destroy it's entire stock due to a disease called ISA, the Goverment ordered the destruction of 10's of millions of stock, worth the same in revenue, even if there was no presence of the disease, as they couldn't take the risk, there was no compensation I believe ever given to the Salmon Farming community , they bascally had to start from scratch all over again.

Then there was the Mad cow thing, where bovine stocks were destroyed as well a few years later, again, farmers had to rid their farms of entire stocks, that cost millions to do, and although I'm not sure if they were compensated, they had to start all over again, some farms and business's folded thorugh the actions of the Governemnt.

Thai Rice farmers are more than likely looking at the very same bleak forecast, they're going to lose everything, and possibly receive very little in the way back.

[djjamie]

Fat Haggis

I find it amusing that you have given this posting a 'like' and you are one of the biggest apologists for this government.

I just don't get it!!!

Do you sit on the fence every morning and support whatever side of the argument, depending on which garden you fall into??

I liked the post as it highlights that not every rice farmer can join the ill conceieved Rice scheme, because my girlfriends family have rice farms, and they dold their rice to the local millers..

I sit on the fence as it's easier to see both sides points of view, you ASS u ME I'm a government supporter I'm not, I'm just not blinkered enough nor convinced enough that either side is worthy of a mere Farang Opinion, I'll leave the Thai Politics to them to sort out, not really that hard to get old chap.

Now perhaps you'll answer me this question then, how does any "peoples party" propose to sell the rice in storage without making significant loses?

I also found it amusing that Jamie, painted a very tearful image of his In Laws, I'm just wondering why he's not dipped his hand in his pockets and bought them a bigger telly, or even fixed their roof for them, or even bought them a run down old car.

There I hope you feel a little more amused

"Now perhaps you'll answer me this question then, how does any "peoples party" propose to sell the rice in storage without making significant loses"

They (the people's party) are not going to be able to do this as the government has so cocked it up it will take years to remedy the situation.

The pertinent point of your argument should not be "what they are going to do about it"?, but why the PTP was allowed to get away with implementing Thaksin's stupid and irresponsible scheme in the first place. You should be questioning this aspect and not what will be done about it regards damage limitation by any incoming government.

They were warned by so many experts, Abhisit and academics that it would end in tears, but OH!! NO!! my brother knows best (how to profit from it whilst purposefully abusing the farmers trust with impossible promises). Even when the cracks were appearing that it was going seriously wrong and has to be the most costly mistake and flawed policy in Thailand's history, they couldn't lose face and abandon it as it would make it look like Thaksin doesn't know what he is doing (which is precisely the case).

How on earth people of normal intelligence can still support and defend this government is beyond me - I have left-wing Labour/Union tendencies back in England but common sense stretches way beyond my ideology and conscience when such blatant exploitation, nepotism, fraud and corruption are being committed on the poor and vulnerable to support this bunch of abject thieves who abuse democracy to the full in order to enrich themselves!!!!

I'm just wondering why he's not dipped his hand in his pockets and bought them a bigger telly, or even fixed their roof for them, or even bought them a run down old car.

Because that will be unsustainable and when that money runs out or that car breaks down or when that TV breaks or the roof starts leaking again I will have to fork out further money. It does not help them. It does not empower them. If I was the local leader that relied on their votes to hold onto power and make myself rich behind my wildest dreams I would however give them handouts occasionally and ensure they stayed in a perpetual state of poverty relying on my money to survive.

​But alas I am not the local leader so what I did do was buy them a book on sustainable and efficient rice farming techniques. That will allow them to not rely on perpetual hand outs and allow them to be self sufficient.

Edited March 9, 2014 by djjamie

[Jay Sata]

I was looking around a car auction today attracted by the large number of Kubota tractors for sale.

Just a couple of years ago these new four wheel machines were appearing everywhere and now it seems the farmers can't pay the finance so they are being snatched back.

Edited March 9, 2014 by Jay Sata

[Fat Haggis]

Give a man a fish and he will feed his family for a day, give the man a means to fish and he will feed his family for a lifetime

I hear what you're saying Jamie, still think you're a tight wad though

If you fixed that leaking roof the telly wouldn't get wet and breakdown, and the book wouldn't get wet

[SICHONSTEVE]

Fat Haggis

I find it amusing that you have given this posting a 'like' and you are one of the biggest apologists for this government.

I just don't get it!!!

Do you sit on the fence every morning and support whatever side of the argument, depending on which garden you fall into??

I liked the post as it highlights that not every rice farmer can join the ill conceieved Rice scheme, because my girlfriends family have rice farms, and they dold their rice to the local millers..

I sit on the fence as it's easier to see both sides points of view, you ASS u ME I'm a government supporter I'm not, I'm just not blinkered enough nor convinced enough that either side is worthy of a mere Farang Opinion, I'll leave the Thai Politics to them to sort out, not really that hard to get old chap.

Now perhaps you'll answer me this question then, how does any "peoples party" propose to sell the rice in storage without making significant loses?

I also found it amusing that Jamie, painted a very tearful image of his In Laws, I'm just wondering why he's not dipped his hand in his pockets and bought them a bigger telly, or even fixed their roof for them, or even bought them a run down old car.

There I hope you feel a little more amused

"Now perhaps you'll answer me this question then, how does any "peoples party" propose to sell the rice in storage without making significant loses"

They (the people's party) are not going to be able to do this as the government has so cocked it up it will take years to remedy the situation.

The pertinent point of your argument should not be "what they are going to do about it"?, but why the PTP was allowed to get away with implementing Thaksin's stupid and irresponsible scheme in the first place. You should be questioning this aspect and not what will be done about it regards damage limitation by any incoming government.

They were warned by so many experts, Abhisit and academics that it would end in tears, but OH!! NO!! my brother knows best (how to profit from it whilst purposefully abusing the farmers trust with impossible promises). Even when the cracks were appearing that it was going seriously wrong and has to be the most costly mistake and flawed policy in Thailand's history, they couldn't lose face and abandon it as it would make it look like Thaksin doesn't know what he is doing (which is precisely the case).

How on earth people of normal intelligence can still support and defend this government is beyond me - I have left-wing Labour/Union tendencies back in England but common sense stretches way beyond my ideology and conscience when such blatant exploitation, nepotism, fraud and corruption are being committed on the poor and vulnerable to support this bunch of abject thieves who abuse democracy to the full in order to enrich themselves!!!!

I'm just wondering why he's not dipped his hand in his pockets and bought them a bigger telly, or even fixed their roof for them, or even bought them a run down old car.

Because that will be unsustainable and when that money runs out or that car breaks down or when that TV breaks or the roof starts leaking again I will have to fork out further money. It does not help them. It does not empower them. If I was the local leader that relied on their votes to hold onto power and make myself rich behind my wildest dreams I would however give them handouts occasionally and ensure they stayed in a perpetual state of poverty relying on my money to survive.

​But alas I am not the local leader so what I did do was buy them a book on sustainable and efficient rice farming techniques. That will allow them to not rely on perpetual hand outs and allow them to be self sufficient.

Owning this book will not help them if they don't read and learn from it so you should stress it's importance to their future livelihoods!!

Something that I have noticed, is that virtually every other rice producing country generates more rice per rai than Thailand - sometimes approaching double.

They have simply got to change their farming practices and adapt their ways - the poorer farmers MUST NOT aim to get rich as this is unrealistic (as Thaksin has proven) - this is the crux of the matter, as Thaksin promised riches that they had never even dreamed of let alone experienced, to garner their votes in order to push his twisted agenda.

This next piece explains a bit about Abhisit's scheme - it will help (even those farmers who don't qualify for the PTP scheme) to improve their lives as it benefits them directly and takes the form of an insurance guarantee. Not only that, but the subsidy is affordable at 60 Billion baht/year. The only reason that Yingluck changed it is for the reasons I have already given plus the fact that it wasn't Thaksin's baby!! In a similar vein, the 30 baht health scheme became free under Abhisit's administration and when the PTP got back in it was reversed back to Thaksin's 30 baht scheme as it had his stamp on it!!! Say's it all really!!!

Rice Price Guarantee Scheme

Rice mortgage is one of many methods the government uses to assist farmers by manipulating rice prices. However, there are problems found in the government rice mortgage scheme, including produce adulteration and price arbitrage. The government by Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva therefore initiated the idea to use a rice price guarantee scheme instead of the existing rice mortgage scheme.

Under the rice price guarantee scheme, farmers are required to register and sign a lowest-price guarantee contract with a branch of the Bank for Agriculture and Agricultural Cooperatives in their area. During the price guarantee period, if the market prices of rice are lower than the guaranteed prices, farmers participating in the scheme will receive the price differentials. On the contrary, if the market prices are higher than the guaranteed prices, the farmers will be allowed to sell their produce in the market as usual. In other words, the rice price guarantee scheme is similar to typical insurances—an insurance buyer will be compensated if problems arise. But if there are no problems, the insurance buyer’s premium will be considered as hedging costs. Such costs can in a way prevent the farmers from dishonestly reporting their rice stocks to the government.

The rice price guarantee scheme is also less complicated than the rice mortgage scheme and it gives fixed rice prices the farmers will sell their produce at. The rice price guarantee scheme also rids the government of the necessity to use warehouses to store rice or to process the produce as common in the mortgage scheme. It can therefore be concluded that the rice price guarantee is an effective method to prevent corruption and distortion of the market mechanism and at the same time assure the farmers that they will sell their produce at reasonable prices.

However, the rice price guarantee scheme may cost the government dearly if the market prices are much lower than the guaranteed prices. The scheme also requires clear and easy methods to inspect farmer registration and the government needs to be able to clarify details of the scheme to farmers to prevent misunderstandings.

President of the Horticulture Association of Thailand Dr. Anant Dalodom warned that flaws of the rice price guarantee scheme might cause damages to the agricultural sector although it seemingly had more pros than the rice mortgage scheme. He suggested that the government should clearly set the guaranteed prices and premiums paid by the farmers with the government subsidizing the premiums at the early stage of the scheme.

The rice price guarantee scheme can effectively assist farmers and indirectly expand the nation’s rice plantations as it was designed to increase farmers’ profits from rice sales.

[473geo]

Plough 100 baht per rai

Disc 100 baht per rai

Plant - broadcast - 100 baht per rai - seed rice supplied from previous years crop

Fertiliser - 1500 baht per rai (x 2 broadcasts)

Reaping 650 baht per rai

Cartage 500 baht

Total 2950 baht per rai

Now I admit these are 'family' rates Jamie, and I admit they do not include a cost for scraping if required, usually every alternate year, also I have not included refreshments, but I would be interested to know where you get your 7000 baht a rai production costs? as you claim in post 104

You stated:

"PS - They would be great prices if it didn't cost the Thai farmer 7000 baht per rai to produce compared to 4 900 baht per rai for the vietnamese to produce."

You have not included the inflation in these costs brought about but the Failed PTP Rice Pledging scheme, nor the increase in costs to tenant farmers of renting land due to the promises of easy cash from the Failed PTP Rice Pledging Scheme, and you have certainly missed the cost of borrowing money for those who have not yet been paid by the Failed PTP Rice Pledging Scheme.

As I recall, the PTP spokesperson stated, on the eve of disgruntled farmers heading to Bangkok, that there were just 3000 farmers who have not been paid - We knew then and we know now for sure that that was just another bare faced PTP lie.

But I also recall the imaginative ideas coming from some PTP supporters - Kilkoman had his own idea of paying off the farmers who supported the PTP and not paying those protesting farmers whom Kilkoman accused of having a 'Political Agenda'.

And then missing from your idyllic view of the PTP world in your description of the diversification and hardiness of Thailand's farmers (no arguments from me on that) other than those farmers who have been forced to sell their land because of the debts they have incurred due to the Failed PTP Rice Pledging Scheme, are now out in the world, landless and as you rightly point in a world with no welfare.

The Failed PTP Rice Pledging Scheme is going to be weighing on the backs of Thailands small holding farmers for years to come.

It has from the outset been an utter disaster - no other proof of which is required than the PTP's own shame faced lies regarding every aspect of the program.

I'm reporting what I see Guesthouse, perhaps the farmers in my area are part of the 4.5 million customers of the BAAC who have been paid

I can easily ignore those that do not understand how the financial side of the rice farming industry works in my area, and carry no knowledge of the dealings of the BAAC

As for the scheme I have seen associated benefits for the one crop small farmers in my area, I report those benefits, more disposable income, more new business, more building work, more opportunity to diversify

I will leave it to the Tvisa seers to anticipate disaster, they do it so well...

I will say one thing, if the triple crop farmers got their fingers burnt due to their haste to take full advantage of the scheme, I have little sympathy, but cannot condemn them for accepting the additional cash, which of course did not find its way back into the economy as they have it all under the mattress!

Let me ask a question to those who would participate in these rice scheme discussions, who do you actually know who has been receiving payment for rice, ask them how much a kg they were paid over the last 5 years, when you come back with answers on the annual revenue per kg then perhaps I will begin to take you seriously

[GuestHouse]

Let me ask a question to those who would participate in these rice scheme discussions, who do you actually know who has been receiving payment for rice, ask them how much a kg they were paid over the last 5 years, when you come back with answers on the annual revenue per kg then perhaps I will begin to take you seriously

I have to admit, I don't know anyone, the two families I know participating in the scheme have not been paid for last year's crop and are facing serious financial hardship.

Both families are in what we are told is the idyllic province of Nakhon Sawan, it looks very much like they will join their neighbors selling land to cover the debts they have incurred due only to the failure of the government to pay them for their rice.

Would you like to discuss the impact that the PTP Government's failure to pay farmers for rice they have produced is having?