Bt2tn bill ruled unconstitutional

[PepperMe]

Question now is the Constitutional Court has found this unconstitutional so now criminal charges can be laid against all of Pheu Thai and the puppet ex PM?

They can be impeached without charges, all of them and the PTP party dissolved.

This is the ruling that has been released to the media, it has not yet real out the sentence that can possibly come with it.

Maybe that will come after the judges have released their statements. The fact that the ruling especially drew attention to the way the bill was actually unconstitutionally 'enacted'. I think we can assume that the 'enactment' part is going to play some key role in the fallout from this ruling.

It is little wonder that Yingluck was in tears at the ruling, she now has been hit with a 'reality sledgehammer' blow, that all this corruption that has existed throughout her administration has no way of ever being covered up now and I think she is seriously looking at the possibility of prison or life in exile for her and her son.

I await with baited breath to see what sort of punishment the judges are going to hand down and to who.

We may actually see Chalerm's head roll from this.

Come on judges, do the decent thing, you have a great opportunity to end all this right here and now, and it is probably going to be a very popular decision, as the huge majority (even most red shirts) will agree this loan was totally inappropriate.

[scorecard]

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for all you yellows gloating at this very "expected" result PTP will win any democratic election alt=rolleyes.gif width=20 height=20>

Only 4% of the MP's will fit into one jail cell though and they need 95% to reach a quorum!!!!!! alt=cheesy.gif width=32 height=20> alt=cheesy.gif width=32 height=20>

Apoligies binjalin. I could rebut your post (that goes against reality and facts) with my characteristic long, serious, factual, evidence based statements.

BUT I won't today. I am celebrating the PTP breaking the law AGAIN!!

Agree, but from another perspective, one would expect politicians with some brains and some capability and with some basic morals and values would never have developed and proposed this unbelievably immoral bill in the first place.

Sort of aligns with the fact that this government if full of ministers / people convicted for various crimes, and many with at least one / some several outstanding cases still in process.

Reform before the next elections!!!

[Roadman]

for all you yellows gloating at this very "expected" result PTP will win any democratic election

Dont be so sure on that...

.. their election funds just got cut, no money to bribe anyone left, the grass-roots farmers are protesting...

PTP would be lucky to get enough votes to offer a coalition government to the smaller parties, and i think with all the legal wrangling and lawsuits about to drop on them, the smaller parties will be looking elsewhere.

Now just to get the election re-run, *with* the democrats taking part and we can put this one to bed... once and for all.

well let's see? enough nonsense about unelected 'people's councils' ok? I agree with your last statement and if you are right I certainly would accept the result - NOW let's hear all posters say the same - whatever the result we accept it

fair enough? Thailand has had enough of this infighting

I think you will find that most who are calling for this pathetic bunch of undemocratic 'above the law in their own minds' Thaksin cronies to be removed legally by the courts as they should be would have no problem with a Pheu Thai party minus the Shinawtra's and more importantly minus any of Thakin's influence back in governance playing by the rules of a democracy.

Likewise most of the same people who you mistakenly call 'Yellow' do not care a crap for Suthep's unelected council. Most of us are wise enough to realise apart from the Amnesty Bill call that Suthep and his group's only good has not been to get to a point of his nonsensical council existing (the Army would have booted his arse into the gutter if he tried) but to keep Thaksin, his puppet pathetic excuse for an PM and their bunch of lackies hounded and bloodied nose with no breathing space while the courts rightfully deal to them.

Its a pity the courts did not have the balls or perhaps more importantly the protection from Thaksins thugs to convict Thaksin back in 2001 when he should have been found guilty and buried from politics then. But then one could also believe the hand had to be eventually played out to where it is today for a lot more to see the damage that Thaksin has done and is doing to Thailand. As these scum are buried by the courts over the next few months hopefully more Thai's will realise the need and participate in rebuilding their constitution and fledgling democracy to protect it from future scum like Thaksin.

And almost unnoticed in this article in the last paragraph was 'with eyes brimming with tears'...stiff sh!t Yingluck. Perhaps one genuine tear for the thousands who have paid with their lives for your family's greed. The courts rightfully await you. Watch the door does not boot you in the arse on the way out.

What is even more pleasing is Thaksin is having the door to Thailand shut in his face for life even with his illegal passport. Good riddance.

Edited March 12, 2014 by Roadman

[StealthEnergiser]

Question now is the Constitutional Court has found this unconstitutional so now criminal charges can be laid against all of Pheu Thai and the puppet ex PM?

They can be impeached without charges, all of them and the PTP party dissolved.

This is the ruling that has been released to the media, it has not yet real out the sentence that can possibly come with it.

Maybe that will come after the judges have released their statements. The fact that the ruling especially drew attention to the way the bill was actually unconstitutionally 'enacted'. I think we can assume that the 'enactment' part is going to play some key role in the fallout from this ruling.

It is little wonder that Yingluck was in tears at the ruling, she now has been hit with a 'reality sledgehammer' blow, that all this corruption that has existed throughout her administration has no way of ever being covered up now and I think she is seriously looking at the possibility of prison or life in exile for her and her son.

I await with baited breath to see what sort of punishment the judges are going to hand down and to who.

We may actually see Chalerm's head roll from this.

Come on judges, do the decent thing, you have a great opportunity to end all this right here and now, and it is probably going to be a very popular decision, as the huge majority (even most red shirts) will agree this loan was totally inappropriate.

when will the judges statements be released ?

[PepperMe]

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for all you yellows gloating at this very "expected" result PTP will win any democratic election alt=rolleyes.gif width=20 height=20>

Just so long as they don't try circumventing any rules or inventing new rice pledging schemes, obey the word of law , you can win as many bloody elections as you like, an old political saying , the more you win in politics, the more you dig your own grave. enjoy.

if the law was 'unbiased' and 'clean' serving NO side then all would say YES obey the law

BTW where did you get that saying or are you making it up?

enjoy while you can not over by a loooong long way

We are now 3 pages of replies in and the first one has dared to come out.

Do you realize how isolated you are in this particular thread, even you own crew are not coming out to denounce this latest move. They know it is futile and by large almost certainly agree with the ruling.

Just goes to show how wrong you must be.... feeling lonely?

I see you couldn't resist ending with a comment to the illusion this is not over by a long way. This could actually be over by tonight.... Then what will you say?

Or are you once again alluding to an uprising of the UDD reds who you love so much?.... If I wasn't mistaken, after reading a few of your deluded posts, it would not be unusual for people to start thinking that a bloody war is what you are thirsting after.

Or is it just me?

[PepperMe]

Question now is the Constitutional Court has found this unconstitutional so now criminal charges can be laid against all of Pheu Thai and the puppet ex PM?

They can be impeached without charges, all of them and the PTP party dissolved.

This is the ruling that has been released to the media, it has not yet real out the sentence that can possibly come with it.

Maybe that will come after the judges have released their statements. The fact that the ruling especially drew attention to the way the bill was actually unconstitutionally 'enacted'. I think we can assume that the 'enactment' part is going to play some key role in the fallout from this ruling.

It is little wonder that Yingluck was in tears at the ruling, she now has been hit with a 'reality sledgehammer' blow, that all this corruption that has existed throughout her administration has no way of ever being covered up now and I think she is seriously looking at the possibility of prison or life in exile for her and her son.

I await with baited breath to see what sort of punishment the judges are going to hand down and to who.

We may actually see Chalerm's head roll from this.

Come on judges, do the decent thing, you have a great opportunity to end all this right here and now, and it is probably going to be a very popular decision, as the huge majority (even most red shirts) will agree this loan was totally inappropriate.

when will the judges statements be released ?

This afternoon.

[webfact]

Constitution Court: 2 trillion baht bill to be dropped



BANGKOK, 12 March 2014 (NNT) - The Constitution Court has ruled that the government’s 2-trillion-baht loan bill earmarked for infrastructure projects is unconstitutional.

The court unanimously agreed 9-0 that the content of the bill violated Section 169 and 170 of the constitution, causing the bill to be dropped.

Democrat Party members and supporters filed a petition under Section 154 of the constitution for the Constitution Court to rule whether the 2.2 trillion baht loan bill contravenes these sections.

Section 169, in particular, dictates that government expenditure must be allocated under the Budget Act to ensure transparency and accountability.

On Wednesday the court formally accepted the petition by the Election Commission asking the body to rule who has the authority to announce poll reruns in 28 constituencies in the South. The Office of the Ombudsman’s request for the court to review the validity of the February 2 election has also been accepted.


-- NNT 2014-03-12

[pmugghc]

Good call by the court. Now let's hope the decision is respected by all sides.

Sadly not a chance I think. The appeal will be slapped in by the end of the day if not within hours. Yingluck will want lawyers to check the 'legality' of the ruling.

I am grateful to the court for saving my great grandchildren from paying off this monstrous unnecessary loan designed to secure the Shinclan dynasty.

Let them slap an appeal on it. They have been busing the courts with so much nonsense in their bid to take the spot light off their malfeasance that they will be long gone before it comes up.

Trouble with an appeal, in this Country is, that this was a split decision and Thaksin and his cronies, who invested heavily to buy all the land, where these infrastructure improvements were supposed to be made, will certainly not stop short of offering a judge 20 or 30 million Baht, to reverse his decision in an appeal. After all, they get to skim probably another 1.5 Trillion right off the top, with only 1/4 of it, if we are lucky, actually getting used on the contruction.

It was not a split decision regarding its constitutionality.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[MunterHunter]

Trouble with an appeal, in this Country is, that this was a split decision and Thaksin and his cronies, who invested heavily to buy all the land, where these infrastructure improvements were supposed to be made, will certainly not stop short of offering a judge 20 or 30 million Baht, to reverse his decision in an appeal. After all, they get to skim probably another 1.5 Trillion right off the top, with only 1/4 of it, if we are lucky, actually getting used on the contruction.

It was not a split decision regarding its constitutionality.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

The court unanimously agreed 9-0 that the content of the bill violated Section 169 and 170 of the constitution, causing the bill to be dropped.

Yeah, cos 9-0 is a split decision in the eyes of the PTP and Reds.

[SOTIRIOS]

......40+ years of fake crying......a real pro...

[PepperMe]

RT@tulsathit: RT @Aim_NT: On the bill's content, judges unanimously deem it unconstitutional. On procedures, majority said unlawful. Via @Chanikarn_nna

This is my favourite.... 'On procedures, majority said unlawful'.

Fingers are crossed that they will find this lawless set of procedures to be serious enough to impeach and dissolve those responsible.

'Unlawful' = 'illegal'

Under the 'rule of law' appropriate punishment should be handed down.

This case is split into 2

1. The constitutionality of the bill.

2. The manner in which the bill was unlawfully pushed through.

1. requires those responsible to accept responsibility and are 'expected' to at least resign (as per international standards).

2. Requires those responsible to be appropriately punished.

So if the rule of law is to be followed, then it should be a clear case of impeachment, and not left to the discretion of the perpetrators.

[trogers]

Recap:

Water management funds NOT according to Thai Law

Amnesty bill NOT according to Thai Law

Infrastructure 2 Trillion NOT according to Thai Law

Rice scheme NO money to pay farmers

First car NO money to pay buyers

Tables, firm bankrupt NO tables and the ones delivered broken down already

Sure I'm forgetting some other "good for the people" stuff.

Not according to Thai Law because the the real reason for these bills is not for the benefit of the country, but for some other purpose(s).

And the real reason requires speed in rushing bills through, coupled with the belief that they control the majority in the House, that check and balances have been sidestepped. A good example is the Water Management Bill that was rushed forward without any comprehensive studies and enviroment impact considerations so much so that the Administrative court had to halt it.

In these cases, their actions speak louder than words, pointing to the dark desires residing in hearts of these power holders.

[Crushdepth]

BOOM.

That's what happens when you try to sidestep normal budgetary procedures.

Sent from somewhere in the Pacific

[gabruce]

for all you yellows gloating at this very "expected" result PTP will win any democratic election

Dont be so sure on that...

.. their election funds just got cut, no money to bribe anyone left, the grass-roots farmers are protesting...

PTP would be lucky to get enough votes to offer a coalition government to the smaller parties, and i think with all the legal wrangling and lawsuits about to drop on them, the smaller parties will be looking elsewhere.

Now just to get the election re-run, *with* the democrats taking part and we can put this one to bed... once and for all.

well let's see? enough nonsense about unelected 'people's councils' ok? I agree with your last statement and if you are right I certainly would accept the result - NOW let's hear all posters say the same - whatever the result we accept it

fair enough? Thailand has had enough of this infighting

a new election - with the Democrats running and the PDRC etc agreeing to not block polls - or setting up an effective plan so registration, polling can go ahead everywhere - is probably the best way forward now.

[Crushdepth]

for all you yellows gloating at this very "expected" result PTP will win any democratic election

But they won't be sucking off in advance from the next 50 years of the country's productivity. Thailand just dodged a very large bullet.

BTW cheering the demise of this very dubious loan does not make one 'yellow'. The fact that the government was trying to circumvent standard procedures should set off alarm bells.

Edited March 12, 2014 by Crushdepth

[Arkady]

Nothing much else the judges could have done IMHO. The Constitution clearly stipulates that appropriations of this nature must go through the budgetary process and be subject to Parliamentary scrutiny. PT must have been relying on the attorney-general to block any petitions to the Constitutional Court but the court surprised them by deeming it unnecessary for petitions to go through the A-G.

Pity they didn't opt for the budgetary process because there are some good projects in there (not the hi-speed train) that could have broken ground by now.

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[In Town]

Well, as a good tea party member I agree with you that the policy is bad. While infrastructure is essential for development, government should live within its means. And I also understand that all these subsidies will come out of your pocket, not the pockets of rural farmers, who pay little in taxes. Nevertheless, I worry that the establishment is criminalising the legislative process. I've, of course, heard of the principle of judicial review, but have never heard of any country criminalising the drafting of a law ruled unconstitutional.

[Huk]

for all you yellows gloating at this very "expected" result PTP will win any democratic election

Dont be so sure on that...

.. their election funds just got cut, no money to bribe anyone left, the grass-roots farmers are protesting...

PTP would be lucky to get enough votes to offer a coalition government to the smaller parties, and i think with all the legal wrangling and lawsuits about to drop on them, the smaller parties will be looking elsewhere.

Now just to get the election re-run, *with* the democrats taking part and we can put this one to bed... once and for all.

well let's see? enough nonsense about unelected 'people's councils' ok? I agree with your last statement and if you are right I certainly would accept the result - NOW let's hear all posters say the same - whatever the result we accept it

fair enough? Thailand has had enough of this infighting

a new election - with the Democrats running and the PDRC etc agreeing to not block polls - or setting up an effective plan so registration, polling can go ahead everywhere - is probably the best way forward now.

I'm not sure a new election now would actually resolve the problem, rather than stringing it out. With the court having declared the bill unconstitutional (illegal) there is now a punishment phase for those who pushed it through. IF that punishment involves the guilty MP's being forced out of office en masse then we have the potential for a parliament run by a party with no sitting members, pending new elections. That assumes the PTP get back in of course.

It's mind boggling

[Scamper]

A major, major ruling in the life of Pheu Thai. The stage is now set on this alone for impeachment charges to be filed.

" She insisted that it would require a special law to obtain loans for the project. "

Yingluck and Pheu Thai's need for a " special law " to bypass parliamentary follow-up oversight will be a pipe dream for those who believe in unfettered corruption. But it also signals that she doesn't grasp the consequence of what the Constitutional Court has done. If there is any reason for tears to be shed, it is that.

[lungmi]

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for all you yellows gloating at this very "expected" result PTP will win any democratic election alt=rolleyes.gif width=20 height=20>

Yes, PTP will win the next elections: Marcos, Mugabe, Belusconi and Tkasin's style. But Thailand is changing, slowly but step for step.

You have a flight for Dubai? Chiang Mai Airport is open 24 Hours for you.

[soalbundy]

Tock,tock,tock, "Whats that noise" asked the man outside the coffin makers shop

[Thai at Heart]

Amazing. The senate passes something but a court can rescind it.

Isn't this in itself somehow unconstitutional. Might as well submit everything to a court for approval. I think the.spending is maybe unnecessary in scale. But what is the point of parliament and the senate.

[phantomfiddler]

In the nick of time - that would have been spirited away sharp-ish! Probably towards the Middle East ...

Or possibly Hong Kong

[phantomfiddler]

Heck, I,d be bawling my eyes out if someone had just placed 2 Billion of MY money just out of reach

[soalbundy]

Amazing. The senate passes something but a court can rescind it.

Isn't this in itself somehow unconstitutional. Might as well submit everything to a court for approval. I think the.spending is maybe unnecessary in scale. But what is the point of parliament and the senate.

Whats the matter with you? All laws passed by parliament must conform to the constitution (which this wasteful borrowing spree didn't) That stops a government with an overall majority from passing any law it pleases ( like,staying in power for ever,no more voting, every member of government gets a 100% wage rise a month etc.)

[binjalin]

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for all you yellows gloating at this very "expected" result PTP will win any democratic election alt=rolleyes.gif width=20 height=20>

Just so long as they don't try circumventing any rules or inventing new rice pledging schemes, obey the word of law , you can win as many bloody elections as you like, an old political saying , the more you win in politics, the more you dig your own grave. enjoy.

if the law was 'unbiased' and 'clean' serving NO side then all would say YES obey the law

BTW where did you get that saying or are you making it up?

enjoy while you can not over by a loooong long way

We are now 3 pages of replies in and the first one has dared to come out.

Do you realize how isolated you are in this particular thread, even you own crew are not coming out to denounce this latest move. They know it is futile and by large almost certainly agree with the ruling.

Just goes to show how wrong you must be.... feeling lonely?

I see you couldn't resist ending with a comment to the illusion this is not over by a long way. This could actually be over by tonight.... Then what will you say?

Or are you once again alluding to an uprising of the UDD reds who you love so much?.... If I wasn't mistaken, after reading a few of your deluded posts, it would not be unusual for people to start thinking that a bloody war is what you are thirsting after.

Or is it just me?

not at all - I stand by my principals even if decried by a few of you fellow posters. I posted as I saw many of you gloating that no one was coming out against this. I hope you respect that.

you are making many, many assumptions - I say again... not over by a LONG, LONG way

relax and respect someones right to post an alternative view to the Dear Leader Suthep's which, BTW, the majority of Thais agree with

Don't believe me? hold an ELECTION

[soalbundy]

Heck, I,d be bawling my eyes out if someone had just placed 2 Billion of MY money just out of reach

Trillion,baby,TRILLION, there is a slight difference,especially when you have to pay interest on the loan.

[binjalin]

Amazing. The senate passes something but a court can rescind it.

Isn't this in itself somehow unconstitutional. Might as well submit everything to a court for approval. I think the.spending is maybe unnecessary in scale. But what is the point of parliament and the senate.

agreed it is BIZARRE

don't like a party - ban it

don't like an ELECTED governments economics - rule it unconstitutional

don't like a politician - 5 year ban

probably next:

don't like an election result - overturn it

all 'unbiased' rulings of course

[Muhendis]

Well well well.

Good to see a bit of common sense surfacing.

"With eyes brimming with tears, Yingluck said she hoped that the next government would continue with the project to develop the country's transport infrastructure. She insisted that it would require a special law to obtain loans for the project."

If her comments were accurately reported then I read it as saying she is not expecting to be part of the next government. If she knows "it will require a special law" then why didn't she do something about it when the bill was passed?

I think we are seeing a whole new definition of the word incompetent.

She should have hired herself a few experts like her brother told her to.

[Thai at Heart]

Amazing. The senate passes something but a court can rescind it.

Isn't this in itself somehow unconstitutional. Might as well submit everything to a court for approval. I think the.spending is maybe unnecessary in scale. But what is the point of parliament and the senate.

Whats the matter with you? All laws passed by parliament must conform to the constitution (which this wasteful borrowing spree didn't) That stops a government with an overall majority from passing any law it pleases ( like,staying in power for ever,no more voting, every member of government gets a 100% wage rise a month etc.)

So how come the senate didn't do its job? This is the senates job to request a judicial verdict on the thing, not pass it and then rescind it.

Of course, the system got thaiified from the british system where by the house of lords is the highest court.

Even that is a little bit democratic. No I the thai way, we must have a court outside the parliament and the senate that can second guess everything.

Edited March 12, 2014 by Thai at Heart