Amanda Knox argued with UK student Meredith Kercher before murder in Italy, court says

[wolf5370]

It should also be noted that usually for an extradition to occur, the crime has to be a crime in both countries (I believe there are some exceptions). In the case of Ms. Knox, she was found not guilty and a retrial would be considered double jeopardy. Under US law she cannot be tried for the same crime twice.

Every country has different legal systems and precedents. The fact that the USA has double jeopardy, doesn't mean that other countries do. The grounds to refuse extradition do not include, "you have a different legal system than us", but that the crime of murder exists in both countries, and the system is fair (i.e. not corrupt - that doesn't mean that no corrupt judge exists, but the system itself is not corrupt, such as a kangaroo court) and that sentencing is not deemed extreme, cruel or unusual (such as stoning/whipping/etc - or even the death sentence - for example UK needs US signoff that death penalty will not be sought before extradition on capital cases to the USA) . It will be hard for the USA to deny extradition.

[wolf5370]

If anyone thinks that the US will hand her over in an extradition, they are very much mistaken.... The US has the worst extradition record in the world between treaty countries.

They have the lowest ratio of extraditing US citizens versus other country citizens extradited into the US and that is not even counting their Guantanamo Bay extraditions... I believe that between the US and UK alone it is something like 12 to 1.

The US never plays ball over extraditions yet expects every extradition to be honoured when it is for their benefit.... double standards.

Could you supply some sort of substantiation of this claim.

And do remember that the US does not subject itself to the International Court.

An example perhaps. Back in the first Gulf War. US pilots launched an attack against a British convoy, correctly marked, on a pre-booked route and timetable (not off course), with working transponders, and amidst radio calls to stop the attack from the Brits. Deaths caused by the friendly fire attack, (of which there were several) was a clear case of negligence. USA not only refused extradition, they refused to name the pilots nor provide any testimony or questioning. Cover up and play the schoolyard bully. Yet, bully like h3ll to get a British autistic kid extradited for hacking, without damage, into their insecure computer system.

The fact that the USA lauds it and considers itself above international law (simply because it can bully economically and militarily) is not a boasting point - it is a sign of a nation that considers it has unlimited right to do whatever it wants to anyone anytime simply because it can, and regardless of international law and agreement - akin to North Korea then.

[Jingthing]

Now this is getting predictably absurd. Suggesting the USA is like North Korea. Give it a break. The truth is this is ONE SPECIFIC case and one that has become very politicized. She's not going to Italy again. Deal with it. That doesn't mean the USA won't generally cooperate with nations they have mutual agreements with. Cheers.

[wolf5370]

Now this is getting predictably absurd. Suggesting the USA is like North Korea. Give it a break. The truth is this is ONE SPECIFIC case and one that has become very politicized. She's not going to Italy again. Deal with it. That doesn't mean the USA won't generally cooperate with nations they have mutual agreements with. Cheers.

The "North Korea" quip (and it was a quip - evident by the style I thought) was in relation to the comment that "And do remember that the US does not subject itself to the International Court.", not this case per se.

[Credo]

Why would the US extradite somebody that has already been tried and acquitted of a crime?

[Jingthing]

Why would the US extradite somebody that has already been tried and acquitted of a crime?

They won't. People acting like this is a normal situation are deluding themselves. They declared her innocent, they let her travel. As far as the U.S. is concerned, the matter is CLOSED.

[personchester]

Why would the US extradite somebody that has already been tried and acquitted of a crime?

Because due to new discovery the case entered the court for the third time due to the fact that additional details of the murder case were discovered and presented in court which the court found guilty.

The (third) guilty court case decision was thus similar to the first guilty court case decision, the 2nd.court case decision however found her not guilty and she was released from prison and allowed to return home.

The US will no doubt ask for details of the three court cases ..."1st.guilty, 2nd.not guilty, 3rd.guilty " and following the outcome will then decide whether an Italian extradition request will be allowed.

Edited May 5, 2014 by personchester

[Credo]

The difficulty is that it is either looking like the Italian police are completely incompetent or they are on a witch hunt.

[neverdie]

Tough cannolli. The chances that the USA will extradite this young woman are basically BUPKIS.

You are most likely right JT. The USA pursues people to just about every rabbit warren on the earth and expects every other country to respects it's extradition requests but most like

it won't return the same, in this case.

We will probably never know the truth about the matter, which is extremely sad for the victims family, as it would appear from western media reports (for what it's worth) the police investigation and subsequent court cases were a bit of a circus really. Who knows where the truth lies?

Your cynicism has been noted. This girl was tried by the Courts of Italy. She was released and she returned home. Now they want her back. The Italians had their chance.

The case will be reviewed carefully by the relevant departments.

If the Italians make a good case, it could happen, but I doubt it. As a general rule, the US is a country that is not too tolerant of murderers.

The problem is, how many times do they want to try her?

Hi Credo,

I really should chose my words more carefully when speaking with educated gentleman such as you and JT.

Both of you of course raise very valid points.

There is no denying that the eyetalians really cocked this one up. I move into my previous detective days and feel great sympathy for the victims family. My interest is purely where the truth lies. If a killer has walked free, indeed the system has let the victim, her family and friends down. UNACCEPTABLE.

Interesting adult discussion, well done !

[LomSak27]

I would be highly surprised if Italy made an extradition request. This last trial was a face saving gesture by the Italian Judicial System and Police. No new evidence was put forward, all that was done was insert a new theory on why and new explanations about the knife wounds.

Reading some of these posts above about extradition I wonder if we are talking about the same thing

An extradition treaty is only an accepted set of protocols in place between countries. It does not mean a request for extradition is immediately granted and expedited. The person being extradited has the right to question and legally challenge the request. The county (not state or city) where I have residence, has outstanding requests for extradition from countries around the globe, a number right here in Thailand, that will never be honored. So much for that cliché posters are happy to trot out about big bad Amerika twisting the arms and bullying the other countries.

some examples ….

Last year France denied my county’s extradition request for a confidence scammer, embezzler, ponzi scheme investment charlatan. One that preyed on the elderly. In appealing the extradition request (which is allowed) Mr. Mastro was successful in having that EU country deny it. France, citing the severe punishment for this old man if imprisoned in the notorious US prison system refused to extradite. To allow would be beneath French dignity. Michael R Mastro is now is living in France. According to the French he is “refurbishing a mansion” bless him.

People in my local were understandably outraged, this being a classic case of an American greedhead swindling the the elderly, wiping out their retirement, pauperizing them, then making off with millions. Euros are supposed to care about this stuff. Obviously not and as it was within the protocol of the extradition treaty; what can you do ?

Another case, this request was granted, but only after 4 years, many appeals and close to a million pounds of Brit tax payer money spent. You can read about some of it here in Thai Visa. The infamous poison Jagermiester case. This Thai national was arrested in the UK and extradition request made by King County. The accused filed appeal after appeal against this request, all indeed allowed under the extradition treaty between the U.K and USA. Pretty nice too, that the UK provided such legal assistance for what in essence was an illegal alien (visa fraud). It should be noted the US tosses the death penalty in these cases as a matter of course to comply with EU extradition protocol. However she played upon this and other Brit fears to drag out the extradition process and almost get off. She is now serving 20 years.

This is reality. The extradition process is anything but the airy ethereal concepts of “truth” and “justice” promulgated by the above posters.

If the Italians made an extradition request it would allow Amanda’s legal team to appeal, then rebut every bit of evidence they have, in English, likely cable channels would pick it up. It would expose just how frail or nonexistent the Italian case is. Bet the Italians would love that …. Not.