Retirement Funds - 800,000 Baht

[Expattaff1308]

Gross income is what is owed to a person, net income is what is paid and received, how the recipient spends that money once it is received is discretionary, taxation unfortunately is not. Were the gross and net applicable solely to Thailand I could understand the argument, but since they relate to unconnected overseas countries, it's a preposterous scenario.

It's immaterial what you think, it's what actually happens is what counts and the British Embassy use Gross!

[chiang mai]

Oh, I see I've hit a ball into somebody's back yard, sorry, this is not a personal thing!

So, the US embassy uses what, and the Canadian, Australian, Nigerian, Comos Islands etc...?

[Expattaff1308]

Oh, I see I've hit a ball into somebody's back yard, sorry, this is not a personal thing!

So, the US embassy uses what, and the Canadian, Australian, Nigerian, Comos Islands etc...?

US and Aus Embassy dont even require evidence you just swear an oath to what your pension is, unlike the British Embassy who require evidence.

Its nothing personal but why are you harping on about something which you have been told the facts about in numerous posts.

What you think is irrelevant, what actually occurs is what the poster is enquiring about!

[bangkoklasse]

Gross income is what is owed to a person, net income is what is paid and received, how the recipient spends that money once it is received is discretionary, taxation unfortunately is not. Were the gross and net applicable solely to Thailand I could understand the argument, but since they relate to unconnected overseas countries, it's a preposterous scenario.

Net income would never work (at least where I come from) Only once a year when you do you tax statement you will know how much the tax will be. When you get the pension in January or any other month it's just a standard sum they will take away for tax. I can even ask them to charge me 2-5 or 10% less in tax if I like that.

Edited May 24, 2014 by bangkoklasse

[kingstonkid]

The Canadian version of this is as follows.

1. I print out my last 3 months bank account statement. highlight my pension income.

2. take those papers my passport and my go to embassy.

3. sign a stat dec that the info is true and get my letter.

4. next day go with gf to Pathum thani at 830 give them all the copies they need including original letters. gf gives them her book and copies of the pages they need.

5. pay my money get my multi if needed

6. walk next door and get my 90 day extended

7 waiting at the door of Futurepark to get a coffee at 1015

If you are making the money on a monthly basis then they do not care about bank accounts and it is much easier and less painful.

[Mousehound]

I understand that a couple require 800 000 each to retire in Thailand. However, if we were to use say half ie 800 000 (400 000 each) and our pension as a top up - how does it work as our pension can only paid to a joint account and we get a joint pension?

[CroBiker]

What if funds are deposited in bank in Singapore? Does it have to be in Thailand?

[ubonjoe]

I understand that a couple require 800 000 each to retire in Thailand. However, if we were to use say half ie 800 000 (400 000 each) and our pension as a top up - how does it work as our pension can only paid to a joint account and we get a joint pension?

There is no requirement for both to have 800k baht in the bank unless both apply for the extension fo stay.

If one applies the other can have a dependent extension with only 800k in the bank in the name of only the one who has the extension.

If you have a joint account 1.6 million is needed in the bank.

You can have a joint account and then have one in the persons name that is applying for the extension that you top up to 800k 90 days before you apply for the extension.

[maprao]

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Oh, I see I've hit a ball into somebody's back yard, sorry, this is not a personal thing! alt=laugh.png>

So, the US embassy uses what, and the Canadian, Australian, Nigerian, Comos Islands etc...?

US and Aus Embassy dont even require evidence you just swear an oath to what your pension is, unlike the British Embassy who require evidence.

Its nothing personal but why are you harping on about something which you have been told the facts about in numerous posts.

What you think is irrelevant, what actually occurs is what the poster is enquiring about!

Yes but remember if you lie at the US embassy you are committing a "felony" . It is just not worth it! (i.e. jail time in the USA) I can't think of anyone taking that risk. If they do not have that monthly income then the money in the bank is the way to go.

[Just1Voice]

Ok, don't know how relevant this is, but here's my story.

I started off with a Marriage Visa, but after my 2nd renewal, a CNX Immigration Officer asked me why I didn't change to a Retirement Visa, as it was less paperwork and overall hassle. So, the following year, I arrived and said I wanted to change to a Retirement Visa, and asked what I needed. NO mention of 800k in the bank was ever made. They told me to simply verify my income with statement from US Consulate, which I had to do anyway. I also took along official documents from the US government showing the verified monthly amounts of my SS and my VA Disability. The officer doing the paperwork took the two figures, added them together, converted them to Thai baht, looked at me, smiled and said "No problem". That was it. 10 minutes later I had my Retirement Visa. In the 4 annual renewals since then, a simple Income Verification from the US Consulate has been the only thing I've needed. Last year I asked them why, and they said the law had changed and that now I only needed to show a minimum income of 40k a month being deposited into a Thai Bank. That's it. Yet I still hear people talking about the 800k "in the bank". I would suggest you contact your local Imm Office and find out EXACTLY what they require, and not rely on what may or may not be hearsay on TVF, although TVF is generally an excellent source of information.

[chiang mai]

EDIT: Removed post due my misread of the subject post, apologies.

Edited May 24, 2014 by chiang mai

[bangkoklasse]

Joe can tell us later. But I belive it's 65k a month for extension of stay based on retirement. And 40k if you are married to a Thai.

[phuketrichard]

I just sent an email to the US Embassy BKK asking what do they have to see, documents, to certify my monthly income. Hope they or someone answers.

they dont ask for anything other than to see ur passport.

all ur getting notorized by the US emabssy is its ur signature ( you fill out what amount your getting)

[JLCrab]

The US Embassy in Bangkok does not have the forensic capabilities to determine that the documents you might present to them originating in the USA are authentic or have not been altered and therefore will not authenticate them. Same policy anywhere in the world.

[ubonjoe]

Joe can tell us later. But I belive it's 65k a month for extension of stay based on retirement. And 40k if you are married to a Thai.

That is the amount you have to show in order to apply for the extensions.

It seems the immigration officer may of been implying that 40k was the minimum they expect to see coming into the country if they ask for proof of bringing money into the country.

[Toscano]

The rules vary from one Immigration office to another , the immigration police are always right .

There are three options for retirees . 1 , 800'000 in a Thai Bank 3 months before visiting an immigration office . 2 , 400'000 deposited 3 months before , plus monthly income to make up the total of 800,000 . 3 , Monthly income of not less than 65,000 bht per month . I estimate that you would qualify for the 3rd option . Unless you can well afford it , I would advise against bringing too much money into the country in case things don't work out . I think I'm right in saying that once you are no longer resident in Britain you will not be liable for British taxation . The current currency rate is 54.6bt to the pound , so even your £12,500 would be sufficient . The money must be in place every year at the same time , three months prior to extending visa .

If you can afford , have you ever considered Malaysia , which for very fair terms offers residency , which Thailand never does not , except for very few by quota , mostly people who have worked in Thailand . Visiting Immigration for retirees in Thailand is no great bother , but it must be done every year . I believe there is a multi entry retirement visa , which is handy for those who want to travel or visit family back home from time to time .

[ubonjoe]

The rules vary from one Immigration office to another , the immigration police are always right .

There are three options for retirees . 1 , 800'000 in a Thai Bank 3 months before visiting an immigration office . 2 , 400'000 deposited 3 months before , plus monthly income to make up the total of 800,000 . 3 , Monthly income of not less than 65,000 bht per month . I estimate that you would qualify for the 3rd option . Unless you can well afford it , I would advise against bringing too much money into the country in case things don't work out . I think I'm right in saying that once you are no longer resident in Britain you will not be liable for British taxation . The current currency rate is 54.6bt to the pound , so even your £12,500 would be sufficient . The money must be in place every year at the same time , three months prior to extending visa .

If you can afford , have you ever considered Malaysia , which for very fair terms offers residency , which Thailand never does not , except for very few by quota , mostly people who have worked in Thailand . Visiting Immigration for retirees in Thailand is no great bother , but it must be done every year . I believe there is a multi entry retirement visa , which is handy for those who want to travel or visit family back home from time to time .

Two is wrong. It can be any amount in the bank plus any total amount of income to total 800k baht. According to the written rules there is no requirement for the money to be in the bank for 3 months for the combination method. Most office follow the written rules but there are few that insist upon the 3 months.

[billrose]

Regarding the OP, he's obviously British, and has a NET income of £12,500 per year (I think - if it's per month then he's got a very good pension!), which at today's rate is approx 56,250 per month, i.e. less than 65,000 per month.

I have had several income letters from the British Embassy, and they all state NET income because the Immigration Bureau need to know how much you have to live on. His gross pension is irrelevant as far as Immigration are concerned, because that is not "income".

If he is able to put 800,000 baht in a Thai bank, that is the way to go, if not then he will have to show both money in the bank and income up to equivalent of 800,000 per year.

To answer his question regarding where to go to get proof of income, he needs to go or write to the British Embassy. Details are on their website.

The British Embassy will accept monthly pay slips, annual pension increase statements, or P60's as evidence of income.

Additionally, there is no need to show that the money is transferred to or held in Thailand, well certainly not at Korat Immigration anyway .

Edited May 24, 2014 by billrose

[joshstiles]

The THB 800k must be on deposit for two months in the first year of the visa and three months for every year thereafter.

If you use the income route, the net figure is the one that is used, pre tax funds don't count.

You can use a 50/50 combination of deposit and income rather just exclusively one or the other.

Income funds can be proved by taking your bank statements and pension documentation to the Embassy who will certify the source.

Funds on deposit for two or three months each year are certified by the bank who will provide a letter confirming that fact.

At Immigration in Samutprakan....you must also bring an ATM receipt showing the balance in your thai bank account(s) for the day that you make your appearance at immigration to renew or apply for your retirement visa

[Brian Johnson]

I am puzzled as to why you are paying so much UK tax on £15,000. After your personal allowance of £10,000 you need pay 20% on the remaining £5,000 which is £1,000 giving you £14,000 net income not £12,500

[chiang mai]

The US Embassy in Bangkok does not have the forensic capabilities to determine that the documents you might present to them originating in the USA are authentic or have not been altered and therefore will not authenticate them. Same policy anywhere in the world.

I'll keep that point in mind should I decide to apply for a paaposrt from another country, I rather fancy a US passport, just for a change of pace!!!

[Toscano]

You will have to get confirmation of you income from the British consulate in Bangkok to which you send or show copies of your British bank statements showing your income .

The whole income is what counts unless tax is deducted at source , so that only the net amount reaches your bank account .

I left in 1998 to go to Italy and later to Thailand . I have not paid any tax since I left Britain , one can transfer to an off shore account in Jersey or the Isle of Man . Off shore accounts require maintainance of not less than about £2500 in the bank , or charge £20 a month for the account fee , but transfer to Thailand costs nothing .

[rayw]

Just to clarify it for you £15K per year income is taken as gross income and at the current conservative rate of about 54 Baht/£ then that is enough on its own ... just. So you will not need any Baht in a Thai Bank account although you really should open such an account anyway and put the odd 1000 Baht in it as you may need this account in future especially if the rate drops again and you need it together with income. .

The actual rules with using income only, say it should be at least 65,000 Thai Bant a month at the current rate of exchange when you renew your annual retirement OA visa. So you have about 67,500 Baht/month currently so no problem unless the rate drops below 52 Baht/£ No guarantees on this but I always find they tend to use the middle rate not the bank notes buying or selling rates which are quite a bit different. Just use the banks TT rate as a good guide if you cannot find the middle rate easily. Today's middle rate is 54.76 BTW

If you use income and bank balance then they use the annual figure of at least 800,000 Baht

[JLCrab]

The US Embassy in Bangkok does not have the forensic capabilities to determine that the documents you might present to them originating in the USA are authentic or have not been altered and therefore will not authenticate them. Same policy anywhere in the world.

I'll keep that point in mind should I decide to apply for a paaposrt from another country, I rather fancy a US passport, just for a change of pace!!!

No problem --- Start here:

http://travel.state.gov/content/passports/english/passports/new.html#step3

[mercman24]

hi a brit guy here, i aim to be permanent at end of the year, Brit question ,i hear embassy. which one ? Thai or Brit with the details,i hear there is one in Birmingham (but which one is that) how do go about it,and also i think it is a non o visa yes i need. so if say i go next november, but apply now i will have lost 5 months or wait until near november and then apply might sound silly questions, but got me stumped thanks kc

[chiang mai]

"The whole income is what counts, unless tax is deducted at source , so that only the net amount reaches your bank account".

We could doubtless get huge amounts of anecdotal evidence to confirm that one way or the other is the right way, hopefully the OP can see however the potential problems and decide accordingly.

[tanamnon]

The comments here are very informative, but can someone help me out? My 30-day fly-in stamp expires in a few days and I'm fed up with not having a proper visa, so I'm in the process of transferring 800K to my Thai bank - but it will take a few days.

To buy time, I'm booking a train to Nong Kai for another double-entry tourist visa. (The last time I went to Vientiane for a tourist visa went well.)

My main question is this: Does the 800K have to be seasoned when I first apply for the Non-O? Or just when I apply for the extension based on retirement? It would be great if I could get the Non-O on this trip to Lao - but I fear this is wishful thinking. Sorry if I've missed some main points, but I've searched and searched and still not clear on all of the aspects.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[chiang mai]

The US Embassy in Bangkok does not have the forensic capabilities to determine that the documents you might present to them originating in the USA are authentic or have not been altered and therefore will not authenticate them. Same policy anywhere in the world.

I'll keep that point in mind should I decide to apply for a paaposrt from another country, I rather fancy a US passport, just for a change of pace!!!

No problem --- Start here:

http://travel.state.gov/content/passports/english/passports/new.html#step3

I've long known Crab that you don't do humour! My jocular remarks were in response to your, ah forget it, you wouldn't get that either!

[ubonjoe]

The comments here are very informative, but can someone help me out? My 30-day fly-in stamp expires in a few days and I'm fed up with not having a proper visa, so I'm in the process of transferring 800K to my Thai bank - but it will take a few days.

To buy time, I'm booking a train to Nong Kai for another double-entry tourist visa. (The last time I went to Vientiane for a tourist visa went well.)

My main question is this: Does the 800K have to be seasoned when I first apply for the Non-O? Or just when I apply for the extension based on retirement? It would be great if I could get the Non-O on this trip to Lao - but I fear this is wishful thinking. Sorry if I've missed some main points, but I've searched and searched and still not clear on all of the aspects.

Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

I suggest you apply for a single entry non-o in Vientiane that will give you a 90 entry.. All you will need is your passport to prove you are over 50.

Then you can apply for your extension when your money has been in the bank for 60 days.

[JLCrab]

The US Embassy in Bangkok does not have the forensic capabilities to determine that the documents you might present to them originating in the USA are authentic or have not been altered and therefore will not authenticate them. Same policy anywhere in the world.

I'll keep that point in mind should I decide to apply for a paaposrt from another country, I rather fancy a US passport, just for a change of pace!!!

No problem --- Start here:

http://travel.state.gov/content/passports/english/passports/new.html#step3

I've long known Crab that you don't do humour! My jocular remarks were in response to your, ah forget it, you wouldn't get that either!

The UK Embassy doesn't have the forensic capabilities either but that doesn't seem to stop them.