Thai coup leader disbands Senate, assumes law-making power

[NoshowJones]

Good luck to Him. He is the Abe Lincoln of Thailand.

That's an outrageously stupid remark.

No! He's the Jefferson Davis of Thailand. Joke.

[Publicus]

Below is an excerpt of an article in a Washington DC newspaper which is the dramatic account of two who were present when Gen Prayuth informed the participants of the meeting he forced last Thursday that he was declaring the meeting ended and a military mutiny coup d'état suddenly underway.

All else aside, it's a fascinating eyewitness account that features Suthep and Jatuporn in a 45 minute discussion off in a corner of the room to try to hash matters through. The link to the full article is below.

The faces of democracy?

The Washington Times

Courtesy of the Associated Press

Witnesses give account of how Thai coup unfolded

An hour later, there was, predictably, no agreement, the lawmaker said. The talks kept returning to a single point: how would the government go?

Anti-government protester leader Suthep Thaugsuban, whose movement claims the government used its electoral majority to subvert democratic institutions, then held a private meeting with rival pro-Thaksin leader Jatuporn Prompan. They spoke, accompanied by aides, for 45 minutes.

Afterward, both leaders whispered with Prayuth in a corner for a brief minute.

When the meeting resumed, Prayuth asked Justice Minister Chaikasem Nitisiri if the government was still insisting it would not step down.

“We will not,” Chaikasem replied, according to the lawmaker.

Prayuth then told a representative from the Election Commission not to bother planning a vote anytime soon because it would be a “long time” before a ballot could take place. He told representatives of the Senate not to bother with trying to invoke a constitutional clause they had been pressing to appoint an interim prime minister.

And then, Prayuth stood up and addressed the room.

“Sorry. I’m taking power”, he said calmly, according to Sirichoke.

“Stay here … Don’t leave this room,” before walking out and climbing inside the back of a black Mercedes Benz.

Almost immediately, soldiers poured into the room and sealed off the exits. Outside, olive-green military trucks swiftly blocked the building’s entrance, trapping everyone inside. Troops with automatic weapons drawn fanned out and took positions, waving journalists away.

Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/may/24/witnesses-give-account-of-how-thai-coup-unfolded/#ixzz32gCdhTvn

• 

Thai soldiers patrol near the Army Club before former Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra arrives to report to Thailand's ruling military in Bangkok, Thailand, Friday, May 23, 2014. The military on Friday summoned the entire ousted government and members of the politically influential family at the heart of the country's long-running conflict, a day after it seized control of this volatile Southeast Asian nation in a non-violent coup. It was unclear why more than 100 people, including the ousted prime minister and several members of the influential Shinawatra family, were ordered to report to the military, which said it was summoning the high-profile figures "to keep peace and order and solve the country's problems." (AP Photo/Sakchai Lalit)

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/may/24/witnesses-give-account-of-how-thai-coup-unfolded/

Edited May 25, 2014 by Publicus

[garrya]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

This could get very ugly.

I hope you are wrong, however my hunch is that you are correct. The longer this military dictatorial state goes on the larger the popular uprising against it will be. The first thing to look for will be splinter groups of the military breaking off and challenging Heir Prayuths control For those out there in thaivisa land who think this is just another military coup and all will be well in a few months, think again, the dynamic is much different this time around

The significant mistake the army has made is that they didn't take the easy communication into account. During the last coups it was not easy to communicate, but now with the help of facebook, line, whatever, protests are easier to organize. I am pretty sure this is going to get ugly and the coup mongers will fall rather quickly. In 2014, in the age of modern communication, it's impossible to oppress a nation. Thai people are not going to swallow the bitter pill this time.

[craigt3365]

Before more members get permanent suspensions, right now there is:

NO DISCUSSION OF THE MONARCHY

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/479383-no-discussion-of-the-monarchy-in-political-context/

Even in bold letters, a pinned topic in this forum, and many public warnings...we still see posts violating this request. And several members on permanent posting holidays.

Please abide by this rule.

[pb1936]

He's cutting out the cancer piece by piece.

Yes......no good doing half the job. Thorough root and branch pruning of the canker is the only way.......as long as the replacements are not self - serving puppets.

[craigt3365]

And please, no more bickering and no more post after post about the principles of democracy.

If you want to do this at length, please do so in PMs, not in the general forum. We're getting tired of cleaning up these threads.

[ABCer]

Hmmm. Not many on here defending the coup now are there?

Well, I'm one who does.

1) He didn't seize the power from civilians - he actually picked it up from the gutter where it was for months.

2) He did give them a choice - talk to each other, find a solution, compromise... The stupid Leaders of all kinds of colour failed.

3) Any country needs Law, Order and some kind of Procedural process to function. This country didn't have it and was going down the drain.

4) He is giving this country Law, Order and Procedure. Nobody likes what he is giving - it is un-Democratic! And what did you expect from the Army General - Liberalism?

5) I have said it before - This Country Is Not Fit For Democracy! Period. It never had it. At 300 bt per voice this country is for grab to whoever has the purchase money.

IMHO if he does not take sides and acts heavy-handed evenly - good luck to him.

IMHO USA once again said too much too early. Obama may be not a bad human being but for a President he must choose his 'Kerry's' more wisely.

IMHO Thailand can afford to miss on American petty cash of $10 M per annum.

Sorry to piss off so many people here, but this is how I think.

[Strangebrew]

First of alot here are putting forth there spin on things Most on this site myself included are expats, The rest don't have a clue, anyway it is The Thai's country we are either guests here or just visiting trying to say how democracy is where your from is like trying to explain color to a blind man.I can't tell Thai's how to go about it, as much as you can't we can sit and laugh at them running shouting solgans carrying signs but that about all we can do so just sit on your bar stool drink a few beers maybe grab a chick or two, or a guy depending on your tastes and let the Thai's work this out. If you own condo, or condo's well sorry bud should have known better. If your Russian or black might be wise to slip to the exit. That include's those running scams there is a new sheriff in town and thing's might go bad for you real quick. Other than that enjoy the show and curfew Bars will be back to regular times in a few weeks. But don't bring attention to yourself spouting your views of Thai policy or government just might be touchy subject at this time.

[FangFerang]

Exactly who are you referring to captspectre? I hope it isn't me. I ain't afraid and I ain't running anywhere. I am trying to be objective and see good things come out of all this. I defended my own country's interest by serving HM Forces for 22 years and now receive a disabled war pension because of injuries sustained during service. Definitely no coward and not scared to hide behind "not saying" in my TV profile! I now live in Thailand with my TGF and as long as the rules allow, it is where I will stay thankyou.

Hi. You fight for what you believe in! I am a bit odd among my kind, and support anyone who fights for what they believe in -- even if I hate what they fight for. That is way too neutral for most people, nonetheless; if what you say is true about your service then you have my respect. Always. And maybe people should listen to you, even if they disagree. In the vernacular of your people:

Good on you mate!

[NoshowJones]

BREAKING:

General Prayuth replaces police chief, DSI chief, and defence permanent secretary, dissolves the Senate and takes over parliamentary authority.

Goodbye Tarit and good ridence to another of Thaksin's lap dogs

This General has done more good for Thailand than I thought possible and even grabbed one of Thaksin's sons as he was trying to flee

Keep up the great work

Yes, as long as he doesn't forget about Suthep, he should be jailed as he was responsible for loss of people livelihoods among other things.

[american12bthai]

Hmmm. Not many on here defending the coup now are there?

i do. for generations now, thailand has been taking naughty/corrupt officials and moving them to inactive posts...

thats like taking a rotting branch from a tree and grafting it onto a good branch. before long, the whole tree looks like "yo mama!"

next, who do you think has better surveillance equipment... the police? or the military? (actually i think the navy has it but they got monkeys operating it.)

thais have very hot heads. if youre a falang you may have noticed they get aggressive very easily... but strangely... if you put them in "timeout time" chances of getting shot or stabbed decrease dramatically.

THaksin has promised all of them an icecream cone... and the military has taken away the icecream shop. ouch. does this mean there are no other icecream shops? democracy is about equality. democracy is about the small guy having a voice, democracy is about free pizza for the nation every monday. (worth a shot)

[northernjohn]

Thailand actually now has a wonderful opportunity to design a political system from scratch. The style and form of "democracy" which countries like the US, UK etc are peddling to the rest of the world was created in a time when the vast majority of the population had no interest or ability to influence the policies of the country the lived in. In fact, up until early last century, if the president of America, the Prime Minister of England or the ruler of any country had walked up and knocked on your door, most people would not have even known them and some may have even shot them as trespassers. Actually the current King of Thailand was one of the first rulers to have extensive personal contact with great numbers of his subjects. Now we have technology which allows us to instantly comment on and criticise our leaders for their actions, their words and even their choice of clothes, we hear their speeches in real time and have more leisure time to form our own opinions, yet very little opportunity to have thos opinions heard between elections.

We have the technology (but not the willingness) to inform the citizenry of the actions which the government is proposing, and to allow the citizens to voice opinions and preferences quickly and anonymously (Even Estonia can vote on certain issues by SMS)- avoiding the problem of politicians who campaign on a limited range of issues, are elected, then see that as a mandate to push their own agendas on everything else (yes Tony Abbott of Australia - I am also talking to you!)

There is also the possibility of examining the true purpose of government - what should best be handled at a national level, what should be handled at a state or province level and what is best addressed locally, with clear delineation of rights and responsibilities. I have even seen proposals that different political parties may have the best expertise in particular portfolios, perhaps a meritocracy would be a workable possibility.

Perhaps democracy truly is the worst form of government - except for all the others that have been tried, but that doesn't mean that all possible forms of government have been tried yet.

Of course the General will not read this, and it will be buried in this rapidly moving thread, so most TV members won't even see it and it will lie gathering dust in cyberspace.

Meh!

Perhaps democracy truly is the worst form of government

Is it really?

I think peoples habit of perceiving democracy as good or bad is incorrect. Ruling governments don't see such systems as good or bad, but merely tools. It is time for people to look at how these tools are used, and whose hands they are actually in, instead of fixating on the tool itself as being inherently "good" or "bad."

When the "tool" is in thaksins hands democracy looks different than when it is in Ahbisits hands.

yhe big problem with Democracy is it allows people who are absulutly clueless as to what it does be led down the garden Path.

Thai rule of law and the list of convictions of both men highlights the differences though...

<EDIT> Nice read BTW.

The problem with democracy is it allows people who are completely clueless as to what the Government's function is to be led down the garden path. In many countries they vote for the man that pays them the most or they are told to by Their bosses such as the village head man or the existing government such as is the case in Korea.

Here in Thailand we have a party that has an army of hired thugs to intimidate the people. In most cases the people do not really know what they are getting when they vote for a party. But in a democracy they have a vote that is equal in validity to an informed vote.

Unless Thailand ever improves there education system it will never have a meaningful Democracy.

[american12bthai]

BREAKING:

General Prayuth replaces police chief, DSI chief, and defence permanent secretary, dissolves the Senate and takes over parliamentary authority.

Goodbye Tarit and good ridence to another of Thaksin's lap dogs

This General has done more good for Thailand than I thought possible and even grabbed one of Thaksin's sons as he was trying to flee

Keep up the great work

Yes, as long as he doesn't forget about Suthep, he should be jailed as he was responsible for loss of people livelihoods among other things.

i agree, he made a promise. he should keep it. if he kept his promise, maybe Chalerm will keep his.

[metisdead]

A post containing Thai language as well as a reply. This is an English language forum, English language is the only acceptable language, except for the Thai language forum where Thai language is allowed.

[Gutterboy]

So many of you cannot accept whats going on here in Thailand. If you feel it's so bad, why not move back to you home country or to Zimbabwe as someone proposed. I'm a farrang work and live in this Kingdom and I do accept if strong measures are taken to root out corruption and any other issues.

We are guests in this country and not citizens. If some cannot accept that fact, they always have the freedom to leave Thailand and settle down in another "paradise".

Brilliant! Never read that before on TV! The old "if you don't like it then leave". Indeed it's so original that you felt the need to say it twice. Thank you for enlightening us all.

[boomerangutang]

Thanks to monitors (I don't mean lizards). It must be a busy time for them.

[Mr Yim]

Please guys understand that the moderators have a full time job in the current climate and we need to respect forum rules as well as the current martial law.

Please respect that for TVF's sake as well as your own.

Good to see hypocracy is alive and well in your household. Your thumbnail of the red buffalo's is perhaps the most offensive and disrespectful of all the postings I have seen on TV. You are truly arrogant but dont even know the reason for the protests or coup. You are going to look very foolish when it is revealed.

[sturdyd]

Honest question (as I'm too lazy to research it myself): Please name some successful military juntas. My gut -- and the remnants of my brain -- suggest that there were few, if any. And by successful, I mean that the quality of life, GDP, and international respect all improved.

Oh my. I suspect that despite my sincerity I'm in for a bashing.

[FangFerang]

So many of you cannot accept whats going on here in Thailand. If you feel it's so bad, why not move back to you home country or to Zimbabwe as someone proposed. I'm a farrang work and live in this Kingdom and I do accept if strong measures are taken to root out corruption and any other issues.

We are guests in this country and not citizens. If some cannot accept that fact, they always have the freedom to leave Thailand and settle down in another "paradise".

Brilliant! Never read that before on TV! The old "if you don't like it then leave". Indeed it's so original that you felt the need to say it twice. Thank you for enlightening us all.

" Brilliant! Never read that before on TV! The old "if you don't like it then leave". Indeed it's so original that you felt the need to say it twice. Thank you for enlightening us all. "

Uh, ther ehave been posts like that on TVF since 2010..where were you?

[bobmac10]

Franco governed for 36 years in Spain.

Ending when he died in 1975

Meanwhile the opposing team became educated.

It wont matter what this General does.

It doesn't matter how long it takes.

History shows us, that one day in the future the ''people '' always win!

'' Power concedes nothing without a demand.

It never did and it never will.''

''Nobody in the world, nobody in history, has ever gotten their freedom by appealing to the moral sense of the people who were oppressing them.''

When Hugo Shavez was the 'dictator' of Venezuela, the people were happy. The CIA was not amused. After Chavez died now see what that country has come to. Sometimes a soft dictator (army) is better for Thailand than a dictator government.

What rubbish, the people of Venezuela had no choice, Chavez controlled all media, doled out favours to supporters, a one party state.

There is no alternative to democracy, no matter how painful the learning process might be.

These royalist elites who have run Thailand for the past hundred years don't get it.

Times have changed, the Thai people have woken up and they want to vote for their own candidates.

It doesn't matter what the army do, sooner or later they'll have to have elections and the PTP or similar will be elected.

The old power structure is so cynical, they believe they can force a government on the people through the barrel of a gun.

[watso63]

Exactly who are you referring to captspectre? I hope it isn't me. I ain't afraid and I ain't running anywhere. I am trying to be objective and see good things come out of all this. I defended my own country's interest by serving HM Forces for 22 years and now receive a disabled war pension because of injuries sustained during service. Definitely no coward and not scared to hide behind "not saying" in my TV profile! I now live in Thailand with my TGF and as long as the rules allow, it is where I will stay thankyou.

Hi. You fight for what you believe in! I am a bit odd among my kind, and support anyone who fights for what they believe in -- even if I hate what they fight for. That is way too neutral for most people, nonetheless; if what you say is true about your service then you have my respect. Always. And maybe people should listen to you, even if they disagree. In the vernacular of your people:

Good on you mate!

Thanks, I have always been stubborn and stood up against bullies all my life.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but I feel meaningless and pathetic posters add nothing to this forum, even though there are some occasional witty and very funny posts. All those that thought they had seen it "all before" it seems, have seen nothing. History doesn't always repeat itself.

For what it's worth, I think the General has done his homework and is very effective. What his "master plan" is, who knows? wait and see, but what I do know is that there will be a sentiment of extremely aggrieved government supporters that have yet to show their hand. If they have the fight and spirit within themselves and the longer the coup lasts, then these people will show resistance. He is targetting the leaders wisely, but can he keep a lid on the followers?

[lvr181]

Not everyone would agree that the way the USA interprets and practices democracy, to be the best or only way.

[bobmac10]

Hmmm. Not many on here defending the coup now are there?

Well, I'm one who does.

1) He didn't seize the power from civilians - he actually picked it up from the gutter where it was for months.

2) He did give them a choice - talk to each other, find a solution, compromise... The stupid Leaders of all kinds of colour failed.

3) Any country needs Law, Order and some kind of Procedural process to function. This country didn't have it and was going down the drain.

4) He is giving this country Law, Order and Procedure. Nobody likes what he is giving - it is un-Democratic! And what did you expect from the Army General - Liberalism?

5) I have said it before - This Country Is Not Fit For Democracy! Period. It never had it. At 300 bt per voice this country is for grab to whoever has the purchase money.

IMHO if he does not take sides and acts heavy-handed evenly - good luck to him.

IMHO USA once again said too much too early. Obama may be not a bad human being but for a President he must choose his 'Kerry's' more wisely.

IMHO Thailand can afford to miss on American petty cash of $10 M per annum.

Sorry to piss off so many people here, but this is how I think.

Yeah, well things are just dandy now, but if this Junta continues to stamp on opposition, and delay free and fair elections, there will be heavy repercussions for Thailand and maybe it won't be such a nice place to retire to after all.

[wave]

The disbanding of the Senate has obviously come as a surprise to many.

A possible reason being that a majority of the Senate would not fall in to line with the Juntas vision for the country.

Easier to get rid of the lot of them!

Since starting this Putsch the Army have been very keen to muzzle all dissenting voices.

As the days go by increasing numbers of organisations and individuals are being brought in for questioning.

We are seeing threats made to tv, radio, press and social media not to broadcast anything critical and to specifically not give airtime to any political discussion by intellectuals or academics.

I find it particularly hypocritical that many posting here were claiming that the ousted government were limiting free speech but now bizarrely fully support the Juntas complete suppression of it.

Dark days indeed.

Under the PTP the suppression of freedom of speech was to ensure a regime extended their dictatorial powers and allowed the regime to manipulate the gullible populous.

Under the DRT (Democracy Restoration Team) the suppression is to ensure the guys above don't attack, kill and maim anyone and looking at the weapons finds, the cache finds and the red shirt militia arrests I thank god for the military.

Remember it is illegal to disrespect the military and as I respect all TVF members, please be careful when replying. For you sake as well as TVF's sake.

You could equally say

Under the PTP PDRC/Junta the suppression of freedom of speech is to ensure a regime extends their dictatorial powers and allow the regime to manipulate a gullible populous.

Under the DRT (Democracy Restoration Team) PTP the suppression was to ensure the guys above don't attack, kill and maim anyone......

Although we did continue to hear from Suthep everyday and whatever suppression may have been attempted was not enforced at the barrel of a gun.

The disbanding of the Senate creates a totalitarian structure akin to what defenders of this Coup claimed the "Thaksin Regime" was.....Oh the irony...

Allowing free and open debate is a basic human right and a right that we are able to exercise here on this forum (for the most part)

Sadly this right is being removed from the very same people we are able to discuss.

[lvr181]

Hmmm. Not many on here defending the coup now are there?

Well, I'm one who does.

1) He didn't seize the power from civilians - he actually picked it up from the gutter where it was for months.

2) He did give them a choice - talk to each other, find a solution, compromise... The stupid Leaders of all kinds of colour failed.

3) Any country needs Law, Order and some kind of Procedural process to function. This country didn't have it and was going down the drain.

4) He is giving this country Law, Order and Procedure. Nobody likes what he is giving - it is un-Democratic! And what did you expect from the Army General - Liberalism?

5) I have said it before - This Country Is Not Fit For Democracy! Period. It never had it. At 300 bt per voice this country is for grab to whoever has the purchase money.

IMHO if he does not take sides and acts heavy-handed evenly - good luck to him.

IMHO USA once again said too much too early. Obama may be not a bad human being but for a President he must choose his 'Kerry's' more wisely.

IMHO Thailand can afford to miss on American petty cash of $10 M per annum.

Sorry to piss off so many people here, but this is how I think.

A brave (or foolish) man who can stick the knife in AND twist it a little! Good on you.

I may not agree with all you say but then I think that "purist" democracy supporters cannot see the forrest for the trees either.

Let the Thai people sort out this problem and as for the rest of us we can only hope it will finally resolve that in the future, Thailand will have decent Government, transparent, accountable and free of corruption.

[ATF]

Before an election can be called there needs to be a re-organization of the House Registration Laws. Most Thai people do not live at their registered address thus entitling them to vote in an Umphur were they do not live of have any input. For example most Thai's are registered at the house where they were born while they are actually living in a rented home somewhere else. It's not their fault because unless they have a very understanding landlord they will not be allowed to put their name on the House Registration where they are actually staying as this also indicates a connection to ownership of the property.

Thailand needs to get this changed. The right to vote must be completely divorced from the House Registration System and strictly enforced. Maybe a Thai would not be allowed to rent a property unless they register to vote in that area. The House Registration System will still have it's use as a family domicile so criminals can always be tracked to their family address.

This will help to ease tensions because a large number of rural Thais will then be legal Bangkok citizens and maybe actually take notice of what is going on instead of always feeling they don't belong or are not fully accepted in Bangkok.

[bra]

Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely - Lord Acton

Power comes from the barrel of a gun - Mao Zedong

An army takes power simply because it has the guns.

[wave]

Before an election can be called there needs to be a re-organization of the House Registration Laws. Most Thai people do not live at their registered address thus entitling them to vote in an Umphur were they do not live of have any input. For example most Thai's are registered at the house where they were born while they are actually living in a rented home somewhere else. It's not their fault because unless they have a very understanding landlord they will not be allowed to put their name on the House Registration where they are actually staying as this also indicates a connection to ownership of the property.

Thailand needs to get this changed. The right to vote must be completely divorced from the House Registration System and strictly enforced. Maybe a Thai would not be allowed to rent a property unless they register to vote in that area. The House Registration System will still have it's use as a family domicile so criminals can always be tracked to their family address.

This will help to ease tensions because a large number of rural Thais will then be legal Bangkok citizens and maybe actually take notice of what is going on instead of always feeling they don't belong or are not fully accepted in Bangkok.

I agree that people should not be forced back to their hometowns to cast their vote. I

You do realize though, that if this had been the case for the 2011 poll, the likelihood would be that all Bangkok Districts would have been under PTP control.

[SanSaiExPat]

He's cutting out the cancer piece by piece.

He is the most malignant part of the cancer himself. You can see the lust of power and the insane evil in his countenance. Every new photograph I see of him his eye's look more distant and wild with self delusion.

[ATF]

Before an election can be called there needs to be a re-organization of the House Registration Laws. Most Thai people do not live at their registered address thus entitling them to vote in an Umphur were they do not live of have any input. For example most Thai's are registered at the house where they were born while they are actually living in a rented home somewhere else. It's not their fault because unless they have a very understanding landlord they will not be allowed to put their name on the House Registration where they are actually staying as this also indicates a connection to ownership of the property.

Thailand needs to get this changed. The right to vote must be completely divorced from the House Registration System and strictly enforced. Maybe a Thai would not be allowed to rent a property unless they register to vote in that area. The House Registration System will still have it's use as a family domicile so criminals can always be tracked to their family address.

This will help to ease tensions because a large number of rural Thais will then be legal Bangkok citizens and maybe actually take notice of what is going on instead of always feeling they don't belong or are not fully accepted in Bangkok.

I agree that people should not be forced back to their hometowns to cast their vote. I

You do realize though, that if this had been the case for the 2011 poll, the likelihood would be that all Bangkok Districts would have been under PTP control.

I agree that is a possibility but tracking individual voters throughout all the individual Bangkok Districts would be very time consuming and it would not be possible to hand a bag of cash to a Village Headman to share out. I have never heard of vote buying in BKK and I've been here a very long time. At the very minimum it would start the process of people voting with their heads and if the majority decide what is right for BKK without incentives or bribes we have to accept it.