Visitor Visa (UK) for Thai girlfriend while sponsor is unemployed?

[jojo90]

Hi,

I would like some advice, particularly if someone has been in my position before.

I finished work a little over a year ago to travel Asia with my TGF. We have been together 4 years and our first and only Visitor Visa for the UK was accepted first time. Needless to say she stayed within the conditions of her Visa, however initially we planned a 4-5 month itinerary but she chose to stay the full 6 months.

Naturally at present I'm based in Thailand and still unemployed. We would like to apply for another Visa so she can return to the UK with me for 5-6 months, during which time I'm confident I will have a job earning 50-80k+ within 2 months. We wouldn't actually plan to look for work for the first month or two as there are some things we genuinely wish to do as vacation activities first.

My current financial position is around £15,000 in the bank (we had a lot more but it's been a no holds barred year out ). If we choose to stay in Thailand until my Visa expires we'd have around £8k left in the bank (4 months).

I'm confident in all aspects of the application, including reason to return, however I'm less confident on the financials as a sponsor given employment status. Previously I was in a well paid position so this wasn't an issue.

My thoughts are:

1) Apply now when I have the money in the bank and just go home.

2) Wait for 4 months (there are things we would both like to do before we head back) and apply with £7-8k in the bank but provide evidence of things like potential interviews set up, my CV showing employability, copied of my BSc & MSc degree certificates.

3) Include a letter from my parents as secondary sponsors (they love my TGF and want us to stay with them for the 6 months) saying all accommodation and food will be funded by them (this is true until I find work, after that they just want £200-250 a month). Naturally would include photographs of the room and copies of the land deeds. Have PDFs from my previous application.

4) Borrow say £10,000 from my family, put it in my account today, wait 4 months then demonstrate £18,000 in funds. Again my family would be happy to do this for me as they'd get it back very quickly.

5) Don't even try and apply in my position, go back, get a job quickly, wait for 2-4 months of pay checks (I'll likely be a contractor) then re-apply.

To fit this into the bigger picture the overall plan at present is to return to the UK for 6 months, pick up a contracting role @ £300-£450 p/day, save everything, return to Thailand, marry, then start down the long and winding road to a British Passport. Setting the groundwork now with things like A1 test passes etc. We actually wouldn't need a lot of money to stay for 6 months, I've got free car use, food, accommodation, all her clothes etc from previous visit stored up. All we'd need is a budget to do small things. £1k a month for 2 people would be plenty of play money in the UK if everything else is provided.

Does anyone have advice here? I want to provide as much as possible but also not give the assessor enough ammunition for a refusal.

Joe.

[theoldgit]

Your girlfriends biggest hurdle is going to be convincing the Entry Clearance Officers of her reasons to return, remember it's her application and it's her that needs to convince the ECO that she is genuinely going to the UK for a holiday.

Your job prospects and qualifications are largely irrelevant.

Your girlfriend has already spent six months in the UK after saying she was going to stay for a shorter time, how long ago was that? the ECO could be excused for thinking that she is using a visit visa to circumnavigate the settlement route.

What are her ties to her home country, does she work, if so how can she get six months off?

I'm not saying it cannot be done, but you are going to really pull all the stops out.

[jojo90]

Your girlfriends biggest hurdle is going to be convincing the Entry Clearance Officers of her reasons to return, remember it's her application and it's her that needs to convince the ECO that she is genuinely going to the UK for a holiday.

Your job prospects and qualifications are largely irrelevant.

Your girlfriend has already spent six months in the UK after saying she was going to stay for a shorter time, how long ago was that? the ECO could be excused for thinking that she is using a visit visa to circumnavigate the settlement route.

What are her ties to her home country, does she work, if so how can she get six months off?

I'm not saying it cannot be done, but you are going to really pull all the stops out.

Hi,

Thanks for the reply. I agree on the reason to return, previously it was based on ample evidence of our relationship and a kind of 'sabbatical' from a course she was undertaking in Thailand. This time it will again be based on the strength of relationship and future plans (I actually wrote in the 1st application our long term plan was to travel together for a year, we have all the corresponding passport stamps, photographs, etc).

She is employed however this is in a family business and paid in cash. She has recently started her own business however everything is in her auntie's name (it's an add-on to her Auntie's restaurant business). Basically I'm just going to have to get some payslips together for her and letters from the family business owners saying they will look after her business stake while she's gone, and that they agree she will have a position to return to.

Basically it will be strength of relationship, plan for us to marry in 6-8 months, a stake in a business in Thailand, and a job to return to.

The actual dates of her stay were 08/04/12 > 22/09/12, so this would be over a 2 year gap since she returned should we apply in 4 months.

Where we may have screwed up royally is the initial application was for a 9 week visit, however she chose to stay for close to the full 6 months. At the time I did a little research and the general consensus was 'the visa is for 6 months, so even if you stated a shorter time, it's OK to extend the stay'.

I really hope this isn't going to be a black mark against us, after all she did stay within the rules of her Visa.

As for the course she decided it wasn't for her, and a few months later we got her onto a different course in Thailand that she has all the certificates from.

The other thing that changed (that may or may not help if I mention in the application) is after 8 weeks we moved from my parents house to a rented place for the two of us. Her name was on the rental agreement however don't know if this helps or hinders things.

Joe.

Edited June 17, 2014 by jojo90

[7by7]

<snip>

I agree on the reason to return, previously it was based on ample evidence of our relationship and a kind of 'sabbatical' from a course she was undertaking in Thailand......Where we may have screwed up royally is the initial application was for a 9 week visit, however she chose to stay for close to the full 6 months. At the time I did a little research and the general consensus was 'the visa is for 6 months, so even if you stated a shorter time, it's OK to extend the stay'.

I really hope this isn't going to be a black mark against us, after all she did stay within the rules of her Visa.

A standard visit visa is valid for 6 months and, even though she stayed for longer than originally stated in her application, as she left the UK before her visa expired she broke no rule.

However, from what you say, in that application she said she was only going to stay for 9 weeks as she was on sabbatical from her course, a sabbatical which presumably was only for the 9 weeks she said she'd be away for.

Therefore, her credibility has, in my opinion, been damaged.

She will have to explain in this application why she decided to stay in the UK for so much longer than originally stated and, more importantly, how she was able to do so.

You say

As for the course she decided it wasn't for her, and a few months later we got her onto a different course in Thailand that she has all the certificates from.

Which she should certainly mention in this application as it supports her ability to stay so much longer than originally intended on her previous visit.

The other thing that changed (that may or may not help if I mention in the application) is after 8 weeks we moved from my parents house to a rented place for the two of us. Her name was on the rental agreement however don't know if this helps or hinders things.

I don't think it will help; but it may hinder as it could be seen by the ECO as evidence of an intention to remain in the UK after her visa expired.

No need to mention it, so I wouldn't.

[wooloomooloo]

We wouldn't actually plan to look for work for the first month or two as there are some things we genuinely wish to do as vacation activities first.

What do you mean by 'we' wouldn't actually plan to look for work for the first month or two?

[wooloomooloo]

4) Borrow say £10,000 from my family, put it in my account today, wait 4 months then demonstrate £18,000 in funds. Again my family would be happy to do this for me as they'd get it back very quickly.

In what regard are you borrowing £10k to demonstrate £18k account balance in four months time?

[bobrussell]

A visitors name on a rental agreement for a property would seem pretty disastrous to admit to IMO. A general visitor cannot work in the UK on a visit visa and why would it be necessary to have a bank balance of £18K?

Sort out if it is a visit or settlement, look at the pinned 'basics' guides and follow those guides.

Any deception or attempt to bypass the settlement rules could result in a long ban from the UK!

[jojo90]

I'm having real trouble replying with multi quote... sorry if this is difficult to follow.. seems I'm using too many multi quotes...

7by7's post:

Thanks for the advice 7by7. Agree on the credibility point and taking from your post it's probably wise for me to demonstrate my continued funding of her stay in the UK over and above the initial 9 weeks. I need to think how this is possible to evidence this without showing the move to a rental property (as naturally payments went out for said property).

I guess how I could counteract the possible view of the ECO that she intended to stay is the fact that she left before her visa expired? Probably best not to mention her name on the agreement.

The (true and very abridged) story is she came in the summertime loved the place, so wanted to stay longer, wanted to do a different course in Thailand, and we both wanted to see how well we would get along living under the same roof as husband and wife. There were also a bunch of unplanned additional tourist things that came along like festivals we went to, saw a liverpool game, I got some free tickets to the olympics, friend's weddings, etc.

Wooloo's Post:

Error, naturally she wouldn't work in the UK under a Visitor's Visa.

As Tesco says 'every little helps'. I'm worried the ECO will think 8k, even if I show zero monthly overheads while unemployed, will think this insufficient to fund a 6 month stay and will not take into account my (perceived) ability to pick up work within 2 months.

A visitors name on a rental agreement for a property would seem pretty disastrous to admit to IMO. A general visitor cannot work in the UK on a visit visa and why would it be necessary to have a bank balance of £18K?

Sort out if it is a visit or settlement, look at the pinned 'basics' guides and follow those guides.

Any deception or attempt to bypass the settlement rules could result in a long ban from the UK!

Thanks Bob,

The bank balance for me would be to show that I, as a sponsor, had sufficient funds to cover her for the duration of the stay without recourse to public funding. I've read the stickies and (please tell me if I've got the wrong end of the stick) a Settlement Visa is out of reach at present given I'm unemployed and hence not able to show the £18k+ income. I do take onboard the point about bypassing the Settlement Visa rules and will address this in my cover letter. Will need to think carefully about how I address (or don't mention) the move to a rental property. Will give this some thought.

Our plan at present is for her to come to the UK for 6 months, I find work, we return to Thailand and marry (when the weather is better and I have income of £18k+), then we go down the Spouse Visa route to an eventual British Passport.

Fundamentally we have no desire to be apart...

Edited June 17, 2014 by jojo90

[7by7]

<snip>

The (true and very abridged) story is she came in the summertime loved the place, so wanted to stay longer, wanted to do a different course in Thailand, and we both wanted to see how well we would get along living under the same roof as husband and wife. There were also a bunch of unplanned additional tourist things that came along like festivals we went to, saw a liverpool game, I got some free tickets to the olympics, friend's weddings, etc.

Either she in the application or you in your sponsor's letter should explain all this in the new application.

I'd include evidence that she did, indeed, start a new course on her return as well.

Our plan at present is for her to come to the UK for 6 months, I find work, we return to Thailand and marry (when the weather is better and I have income of £18k+), then we go down the Spouse Visa route to an eventual British Passport.

Then explain this in the application. It's a situation many couples have found themselves in since the new financial requirement was introduced.

Make sure that you do say in the application that you and she are aware she cannot convert a visit visa to settlement whilst in the UK but will have to return to Thailand and apply there.

I'd leave out the bit about the ultimate aim being her obtaining a British passport; to the cynical it could seem that this is her main reason for marrying you! Simply say that you want to be together while you find work in the UK with an income high enough to meet the financial requirement so that she can then return to Thailand and apply for settlement so you can live together as man and wife in the UK.

[jojo90]

<snip>

Thank you again 7by7, some great advice there. I'm starting to realise it's all about 'framing' the application in the correct way. Even though it's 4 months away I've already incorporated the suggestions here into the draft sponsor's letter.