TheRascal Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Firstly you say this is an issue which hasn't been covered on this forum... It has, it's been done to death over the past 2 months with 2 or 3 weeklt posts. Clarified to some extend but still the question remains ???What category does working online in Thailand for foreigners come under. If the Immigratio says it is not legal to work like this on your stay in Thailand, then what would make it legal is the real Question ??If a foreigner working online while in Thailand and making money thru his work, then he has to fall under some visa category according to Thai immigration rules or else he has to get some kind of paperwork done under the Thai laws like a work permit or otherwise. Why does he have to? Why is it so hard to understand it's just against the law. Well guys the question is sill going in circles round and round.What category or criteria do u come under if you wanted to work online in Thailand. Surely this angle of working online has to be covered under some thai regulation in a country that has made laws for all kinds of things.AN ANSWER STILL AWAITED !!!---------------------------------------------- Are you being deliberately obtuse? Why does this angle have to be covered? What other countries cover it? Sure it would make things a lot easier but there is not an angle to do this other than the ways outlined already. People have contacted lawyers about it and it's not possible. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vic666 Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 I have been "working online" in Thailand for 10 years. There are 2 kinds of working online: selling stuff, which require offline work too (source goods, visit manufacturers, package and ship), and selling digital products/services (ebooks, SEO services, affiliate marketing, build websites) which only require a good internet connection. Either way, you can make money without paying any taxes, without bothering about a work permit. You will be breaking the law but who will ever find out? It's not a crime to ship parcel from post office and to buy stuff at shops, Chatuchak etc. When you start shipping containers things change, but there are ways around everything. The manufacturers will help you sort things out if you don't have a company. Your only concern will be the visa, that' why many people opted for ED or repeated Tourist visas. Now to answer your final question: to set up a company to do what is called work-from-home is IMHO plain stupid, but if you really have to do it, it can be an export company, as I assume you will be selling stuff made in Thailand. You'll need an office or at least a sign outside your house, accounting, fake employees, deposited capital, pay taxes etc etc and a good lawyer to set up everything. here on thaivisa all these info are available for free. If you sell IM services, like SEO, then you could register your company as a consultancy firm and you'd be an adviser on everything about IT. Or something like that. I hope this helps. Like I said, I've been doing this for 10 years and at the beginning I wanted to open a company, get a work permit, do the right thing. Then money started pouring in, so I concentrated on online marketing to get customers and forgot about the all open-a-company thing, enjoying my tourist visa. Now, with the new regulations, the easiest/best thing to do is to leave Thailand and start all over in Cambodia, Philippines or Indonesia. I hope this helps... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 I have been "working online" in Thailand for 10 years. There are 2 kinds of working online: selling stuff, which require offline work too (source goods, visit manufacturers, package and ship), and selling digital products/services (ebooks, SEO services, affiliate marketing, build websites) which only require a good internet connection. Either way, you can make money without paying any taxes, without bothering about a work permit. You will be breaking the law but who will ever find out? It's not a crime to ship parcel from post office and to buy stuff at shops, Chatuchak etc. When you start shipping containers things change, but there are ways around everything. The manufacturers will help you sort things out if you don't have a company. Your only concern will be the visa, that' why many people opted for ED or repeated Tourist visas. Now to answer your final question: to set up a company to do what is called work-from-home is IMHO plain stupid, but if you really have to do it, it can be an export company, as I assume you will be selling stuff made in Thailand. You'll need an office or at least a sign outside your house, accounting, fake employees, deposited capital, pay taxes etc etc and a good lawyer to set up everything. here on thaivisa all these info are available for free. If you sell IM services, like SEO, then you could register your company as a consultancy firm and you'd be an adviser on everything about IT. Or something like that. I hope this helps. Like I said, I've been doing this for 10 years and at the beginning I wanted to open a company, get a work permit, do the right thing. Then money started pouring in, so I concentrated on online marketing to get customers and forgot about the all open-a-company thing, enjoying my tourist visa. Now, with the new regulations, the easiest/best thing to do is to leave Thailand and start all over in Cambodia, Philippines or Indonesia. I hope this helps... What new regulations ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRascal Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 I have been "working online" in Thailand for 10 years. There are 2 kinds of working online: selling stuff, which require offline work too (source goods, visit manufacturers, package and ship), and selling digital products/services (ebooks, SEO services, affiliate marketing, build websites) which only require a good internet connection. Either way, you can make money without paying any taxes, without bothering about a work permit. You will be breaking the law but who will ever find out? It's not a crime to ship parcel from post office and to buy stuff at shops, Chatuchak etc. When you start shipping containers things change, but there are ways around everything. The manufacturers will help you sort things out if you don't have a company. Your only concern will be the visa, that' why many people opted for ED or repeated Tourist visas. Now to answer your final question: to set up a company to do what is called work-from-home is IMHO plain stupid, but if you really have to do it, it can be an export company, as I assume you will be selling stuff made in Thailand. You'll need an office or at least a sign outside your house, accounting, fake employees, deposited capital, pay taxes etc etc and a good lawyer to set up everything. here on thaivisa all these info are available for free. If you sell IM services, like SEO, then you could register your company as a consultancy firm and you'd be an adviser on everything about IT. Or something like that. I hope this helps. Like I said, I've been doing this for 10 years and at the beginning I wanted to open a company, get a work permit, do the right thing. Then money started pouring in, so I concentrated on online marketing to get customers and forgot about the all open-a-company thing, enjoying my tourist visa. Now, with the new regulations, the easiest/best thing to do is to leave Thailand and start all over in Cambodia, Philippines or Indonesia. I hope this helps... What new regulations ? I'm guessing he means the new way existing regulations are being enforced in a stricter way. The stuff that's starting with cracking down on the visa exempt stamp abuse and that will likely extend to tourist visas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
belg Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 is the SEARCH button dead? why not make a sticky same question everyday and in NEWSFLASH section Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisinth Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 <script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script> Well guys the question is sill going in circles round and round.What category or criteria do u come under if you wanted to work online in Thailand. Surely this angle of working online has to be covered under some thai regulation in a country that has made laws for all kinds of things.AN ANSWER STILL AWAITED !!!---------------------------------------------- It appears that it is you who is spinning your question around. Several people have alerted you to the fact that to work in Thailand you need a work permit. The work permit is not issued by immigration, they deal with visas, the department of labor deal with work permits. You also seem to be misguided as to "entitlement" as you have mentioned in quite a few of your posts; because you may have a job, this does not entitle you to a visa. If the intention is to work online in Thailand, don't advertise it on an open forum. That's about the best advice you will get............... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikecat Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Yes you can work online in Thailand. You need a work Permit and a Non B visa. You need to be working for a Thai company or have your own company with a minimum of four Thais working for you. You can also obtain these by working for a multi national company that has an outlet in Thailand that employs Thais. You cannot just set up for yourself in Thailand and get a work permit. Some jobs are restricted to Thais only, online work may well be one of those jobs thus rendering it impossible to get a Work Permit. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitalchromakey Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 I have been "working online" in Thailand for 10 years. There are 2 kinds of working online: selling stuff, which require offline work too (source goods, visit manufacturers, package and ship), and selling digital products/services (ebooks, SEO services, affiliate marketing, build websites) which only require a good internet connection. Either way, you can make money without paying any taxes, without bothering about a work permit. You will be breaking the law but who will ever find out? It's not a crime to ship parcel from post office and to buy stuff at shops, Chatuchak etc. When you start shipping containers things change, but there are ways around everything. The manufacturers will help you sort things out if you don't have a company. Your only concern will be the visa, that' why many people opted for ED or repeated Tourist visas. Now to answer your final question: to set up a company to do what is called work-from-home is IMHO plain stupid, but if you really have to do it, it can be an export company, as I assume you will be selling stuff made in Thailand. You'll need an office or at least a sign outside your house, accounting, fake employees, deposited capital, pay taxes etc etc and a good lawyer to set up everything. here on thaivisa all these info are available for free. If you sell IM services, like SEO, then you could register your company as a consultancy firm and you'd be an adviser on everything about IT. Or something like that. I hope this helps. Like I said, I've been doing this for 10 years and at the beginning I wanted to open a company, get a work permit, do the right thing. Then money started pouring in, so I concentrated on online marketing to get customers and forgot about the all open-a-company thing, enjoying my tourist visa. Now, with the new regulations, the easiest/best thing to do is to leave Thailand and start all over in Cambodia, Philippines or Indonesia. I hope this helps... So you have been living here for 10 years working online, by your own admission making bucket loads of money working, plus you have never paid a single satang in tax whilst living in Thailand on Tourist (maybe Visa Exempt) Visas and what's more you seem to be proud of it. People 'working under the radar' (not just answering a few emails whilst on holiday) who have been cheating the system (and the Thai People) for years have now made it more difficult for a lot of expats who want to stay and don't want to break the law here but don't for various reasons meet the current visa criteriae. The current crack down is aimed primarily at flushing out a certain category of ex pats who are cheating Thailand by working 'under the radar'; I note that you recognize that this particular party may be over. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twizzler3b Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Well JLCrab like you said that there is no visa designated for working online, then why would Thai immigration deter your from working online while your stay in Thailand,if this kind of visa provision is not there. This leaves us with a big Q ???? Mark ???? If this is illegal according to Thai immigration I.e. working online while staying in Thailand, the if has to fall under some Thai immigration rule and regulation thus making it legal. Casual browsing on the Internet or some kind of correspondence while staying in Thailand for your working organization anywhere outside or inside Thailand is kind of understandable but if this kind of online work is enabling you to make money during your stay in Thailand then it has to covered under some section of the Thailand rules. Thai immigration categorizes online working while in Thailand is also a way of making money during your working hours. They deter you in this respect, so to make it official in their eyes some kind of Rule or Regulation in their Thai Rule Book has to be there definately. A country such as Thailand that is having so many rules because of so many tourists and foreigners coming here regularly, I'm sure would not have overlooked this angle of online working as they are very particular in all their policies. So some angle to this kind of work from the Thai Authorities definately has to be there. Kindly delve in a little more depth to clarify this issue for the benefit of all those who want to work online while in Thailand. U-turns are illegal too. Bottom line is nobody cares. Your friend can get an education visa or tourist visas and be just fine. It would be great to see some sort of extended visa for people with online businesses in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Well JLCrab like you said that there is no visa designated for working online, then why would Thai immigration deter your from working online while your stay in Thailand,if this kind of visa provision is not there. This leaves us with a big Q ???? Mark ???? If this is illegal according to Thai immigration I.e. working online while staying in Thailand, the if has to fall under some Thai immigration rule and regulation thus making it legal. Casual browsing on the Internet or some kind of correspondence while staying in Thailand for your working organization anywhere outside or inside Thailand is kind of understandable but if this kind of online work is enabling you to make money during your stay in Thailand then it has to covered under some section of the Thailand rules. Thai immigration categorizes online working while in Thailand is also a way of making money during your working hours. They deter you in this respect, so to make it official in their eyes some kind of Rule or Regulation in their Thai Rule Book has to be there definately. A country such as Thailand that is having so many rules because of so many tourists and foreigners coming here regularly, I'm sure would not have overlooked this angle of online working as they are very particular in all their policies. So some angle to this kind of work from the Thai Authorities definately has to be there. Kindly delve in a little more depth to clarify this issue for the benefit of all those who want to work online while in Thailand. U-turns are illegal too. Bottom line is nobody cares. Your friend can get an education visa or tourist visas and be just fine. It would be great to see some sort of extended visa for people with online businesses in the future. If you go look in the general section, you will a thread which may infer they do care Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cypress Hill Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 (edited) If you're working online trading forex/stocks, palying online poker or writing articles or whatever, don't bother with company formations. Waste of time. Just make sure your money goes to your bank account at home and then transfer it to Thailand or withdraw it from the ATM here. Keep records and ATM receipts and you're laughin'. As long as it comes in from abroad, the Thais don't give a monkey's and nobody's gonna sweat you. The authorities plainly don't think it's important enough to create a means by which people can work online legally and make an honest contribution in tax so to hell with 'em. You gotta eat, right and it's not as if you're taking food off Somchai's table, is it? I've yet to hear of ANYONE being pulled and deported for doing any of the afore-mentioned jobs or anything similar simply because the authorites aren't LOOKING for people who do them. Even if they were, they wouldn't be able to tell. Edited June 20, 2014 by Cypress Hill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashireman Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 I think all answers are sidestepping the main point. If it is illegal to work online while staying in Thailand as a foreigner, then how does one get the legal angle to This working point in Thailand. Of someone commits a crime in Thailand the he has to face the consequences, then how does the working online issue get absorbed in the Thai laws as a legal issue. It is not a question of investment, visas or work permits. A very simple question that has never been maybe thought about by anyone for that matter and always getting sidestepped. UNDER WHAT THAI LAW DOES WORKING ONLINE WHILE YOUR STAY IN THAILAND COME UNDER when the Thai immigration depp which is comprised from the ROYAL THAI POLICE terms it as illegal, so how does this issue get the legal angle to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashireman Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 (edited) Dear ucomservices As far as I have read, your question has been adequately dealt with and answered. Now, unless you are running an 'argument management' company...(5 minutes or full half hour), then perhaps Thailand is probably not best suited? I wish you well in your venture of course... Regards Edited June 20, 2014 by Lancashireman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 (edited) If you're working online trading forex/stocks, palying online poker or writing articles or whatever, don't bother with company formations. Waste of time. Just make sure your money goes to your bank account at home and then transfer it to Thailand or withdraw it from the ATM here. Keep records and ATM receipts and you're laughin'. As long as it comes in from abroad, the Thais don't give a monkey's and nobody's gonna sweat you. The authorities plainly don't think it's important enough to create a means by which people can work online legally and make an honest contribution in tax so to hell with 'em. You gotta eat, right and it's not as if you're taking food off Somchai's table, is it? I've yet to hear of ANYONE being pulled and deported for doing any of the afore-mentioned jobs or anything similar simply because the authorites aren't LOOKING for people who do them. Even if they were, they wouldn't be able to tell. Go and look on "general" there is a thread on there about a crackdown on on liners, and if this is correct 7 people have been pulled by the cops in the last week or so Edited June 20, 2014 by Soutpeel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NanLaew Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 I have been "working online" in Thailand for 10 years. There are 2 kinds of working online: selling stuff, which require offline work too (source goods, visit manufacturers, package and ship), and selling digital products/services (ebooks, SEO services, affiliate marketing, build websites) which only require a good internet connection. Either way, you can make money without paying any taxes, without bothering about a work permit. You will be breaking the law but who will ever find out? It's not a crime to ship parcel from post office and to buy stuff at shops, Chatuchak etc. When you start shipping containers things change, but there are ways around everything. The manufacturers will help you sort things out if you don't have a company. Your only concern will be the visa, that' why many people opted for ED or repeated Tourist visas. Now to answer your final question: to set up a company to do what is called work-from-home is IMHO plain stupid, but if you really have to do it, it can be an export company, as I assume you will be selling stuff made in Thailand. You'll need an office or at least a sign outside your house, accounting, fake employees, deposited capital, pay taxes etc etc and a good lawyer to set up everything. here on thaivisa all these info are available for free. If you sell IM services, like SEO, then you could register your company as a consultancy firm and you'd be an adviser on everything about IT. Or something like that. I hope this helps. Like I said, I've been doing this for 10 years and at the beginning I wanted to open a company, get a work permit, do the right thing. Then money started pouring in, so I concentrated on online marketing to get customers and forgot about the all open-a-company thing, enjoying my tourist visa. Now, with the new regulations, the easiest/best thing to do is to leave Thailand and start all over in Cambodia, Philippines or Indonesia. I hope this helps... So you have been living here for 10 years working online, by your own admission making bucket loads of money working, plus you have never paid a single satang in tax whilst living in Thailand on Tourist (maybe Visa Exempt) Visas and what's more you seem to be proud of it. People 'working under the radar' (not just answering a few emails whilst on holiday) who have been cheating the system (and the Thai People) for years have now made it more difficult for a lot of expats who want to stay and don't want to break the law here but don't for various reasons meet the current visa criteriae. The current crack down is aimed primarily at flushing out a certain category of ex pats who are cheating Thailand by working 'under the radar'; I note that you recognize that this particular party may be over. Wow, who woke up and made you Tax Inspector General for "the Thai People"... who mostly don't pay their taxes anyway. Kudos for vic666 for simply stating what hundreds or thousands of others have been doing for years and are probably still doing. The claim that him and "a certain category of ex pats" are responsible for the recent tightening on who qualifies for a visa-run is total BS. There's a lot more 'local' people (think Vietnamese, Burmese and Cambodian) that have been flipping in and out and working 'under the radar' on things that have bugger al to do with the internet than all the farang information technology architects online tax dodgers put together. It's just we are more visible (they all look the same) and we have online fora like TV to piss and moan about it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitalchromakey Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 I have been "working online" in Thailand for 10 years. There are 2 kinds of working online: selling stuff, which require offline work too (source goods, visit manufacturers, package and ship), and selling digital products/services (ebooks, SEO services, affiliate marketing, build websites) which only require a good internet connection. Either way, you can make money without paying any taxes, without bothering about a work permit. You will be breaking the law but who will ever find out? It's not a crime to ship parcel from post office and to buy stuff at shops, Chatuchak etc. When you start shipping containers things change, but there are ways around everything. The manufacturers will help you sort things out if you don't have a company. Your only concern will be the visa, that' why many people opted for ED or repeated Tourist visas. Now to answer your final question: to set up a company to do what is called work-from-home is IMHO plain stupid, but if you really have to do it, it can be an export company, as I assume you will be selling stuff made in Thailand. You'll need an office or at least a sign outside your house, accounting, fake employees, deposited capital, pay taxes etc etc and a good lawyer to set up everything. here on thaivisa all these info are available for free. If you sell IM services, like SEO, then you could register your company as a consultancy firm and you'd be an adviser on everything about IT. Or something like that. I hope this helps. Like I said, I've been doing this for 10 years and at the beginning I wanted to open a company, get a work permit, do the right thing. Then money started pouring in, so I concentrated on online marketing to get customers and forgot about the all open-a-company thing, enjoying my tourist visa. Now, with the new regulations, the easiest/best thing to do is to leave Thailand and start all over in Cambodia, Philippines or Indonesia. I hope this helps... So you have been living here for 10 years working online, by your own admission making bucket loads of money working, plus you have never paid a single satang in tax whilst living in Thailand on Tourist (maybe Visa Exempt) Visas and what's more you seem to be proud of it. People 'working under the radar' (not just answering a few emails whilst on holiday) who have been cheating the system (and the Thai People) for years have now made it more difficult for a lot of expats who want to stay and don't want to break the law here but don't for various reasons meet the current visa criteriae. The current crack down is aimed primarily at flushing out a certain category of ex pats who are cheating Thailand by working 'under the radar'; I note that you recognize that this particular party may be over. Wow, who woke up and made you Tax Inspector General for "the Thai People"... who mostly don't pay their taxes anyway. Kudos for vic666 for simply stating what hundreds or thousands of others have been doing for years and are probably still doing. The claim that him and "a certain category of ex pats" are responsible for the recent tightening on who qualifies for a visa-run is total BS. There's a lot more 'local' people (think Vietnamese, Burmese and Cambodian) that have been flipping in and out and working 'under the radar' on things that have bugger al to do with the internet than all the farang information technology architects online tax dodgers put together. It's just we are more visible (they all look the same) and we have online fora like TV to piss and moan about it. Touched a nerve? So, just to clarify, if I read you correctly - it's ok as a foreigner to work in Thailand and dodge paying any tax because the 'Thai People' mostly don't pay tax anyway. Also you state that it's 'total BS' that a certain category of ex pats 'working under the radar' are cited as being responsible for the recent crack down on visa exempt border runs, despite there being numerous press reports, at the time, that immigration were targeting certain nationalities who were working illegally in Thailand (this does not include Burmese and Cambodians, none of whom have been using visa exempt entries to work illegally here - most labour working here illegally never could/did do visa exempt border runs). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ucomservices Posted June 21, 2014 Author Share Posted June 21, 2014 Well, I think the issue has been beautifully handled and answered by all the good folks on the forum. The main idea was to bring all the options for this kind of working in front of all folks and make them aware as there are many who are doing this kind of think here, so now all those folks know all the options for them. This has been quite a lengthy and informative topic and I'm sure that people doing this kind of thing are more aware of the rules and regulations attached to this kind of work. Once again, yanks to all you good folks out there for all your informative posts !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexDorneles Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 The matter of working online is simply not covered specifically in any law because at the time the law was written there was probably no internet. That should answer your question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitalchromakey Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) The matter of working online is simply not covered specifically in any law because at the time the law was written there was probably no internet. That should answer your question. No internet six years ago? Latest revision of the Working of Aliens Act was in BE 2551 Edited June 21, 2014 by digitalchromakey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexDorneles Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 Well, than they just didn't think about it when they wrote the law. Every law has loopholes and it is open to interpretation. Selling goods online from Thailand to another country is probably covered under the law because it is considered exporting and that is a business. Chances are he will never get caught. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanBBK Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 OK back to the question. You could Form a consultancy company. Say xvz consulting. Then you employ 4 Thai. one to clean, one to drive, one IT (switches your computer on) and maybe one office manager (making coffee). That should enable you to get a work permit to do your online stuff. Sent from my GT-I9500 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisinth Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) <script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script> I have been "working online" in Thailand for 10 years. There are 2 kinds of working online: selling stuff, which require offline work too (source goods, visit manufacturers, package and ship), and selling digital products/services (ebooks, SEO services, affiliate marketing, build websites) which only require a good internet connection. Either way, you can make money without paying any taxes, without bothering about a work permit. You will be breaking the law but who will ever find out? It's not a crime to ship parcel from post office and to buy stuff at shops, Chatuchak etc. When you start shipping containers things change, but there are ways around everything. The manufacturers will help you sort things out if you don't have a company. Your only concern will be the visa, that' why many people opted for ED or repeated Tourist visas. Now to answer your final question: to set up a company to do what is called work-from-home is IMHO plain stupid, but if you really have to do it, it can be an export company, as I assume you will be selling stuff made in Thailand. You'll need an office or at least a sign outside your house, accounting, fake employees, deposited capital, pay taxes etc etc and a good lawyer to set up everything. here on thaivisa all these info are available for free. If you sell IM services, like SEO, then you could register your company as a consultancy firm and you'd be an adviser on everything about IT. Or something like that. I hope this helps. Like I said, I've been doing this for 10 years and at the beginning I wanted to open a company, get a work permit, do the right thing. Then money started pouring in, so I concentrated on online marketing to get customers and forgot about the all open-a-company thing, enjoying my tourist visa. Now, with the new regulations, the easiest/best thing to do is to leave Thailand and start all over in Cambodia, Philippines or Indonesia. I hope this helps... So you have been living here for 10 years working online, by your own admission making bucket loads of money working, plus you have never paid a single satang in tax whilst living in Thailand on Tourist (maybe Visa Exempt) Visas and what's more you seem to be proud of it. People 'working under the radar' (not just answering a few emails whilst on holiday) who have been cheating the system (and the Thai People) for years have now made it more difficult for a lot of expats who want to stay and don't want to break the law here but don't for various reasons meet the current visa criteriae. The current crack down is aimed primarily at flushing out a certain category of ex pats who are cheating Thailand by working 'under the radar'; I note that you recognize that this particular party may be over. . Whereas I do agree with you in principle, as any work done in Thailand requires a work permit by law, the entire issue with online business does fall through the cracks and will continue to do so until global regulations are placed on internet usage for business which I don't think is going to happen anytime soon. The problem with the argument of people working under the radar, cheating the system (and the Thai people) is that this needs to be expanded upon. If an individual's online activities concern buying from or selling to, people living in Thailand, then yes, they should be contributing to the Thai tax system. If however the individual's business is concerning say, online trade between the UK and Europe/US/South America/Australia, etc, without involvement with Thailand (with the exception of the use of the ISP which they are paying for anyway) then, IMHO, that presents another argument entirely. The other matter would be regulating online trading. Unless an individual has gone to the lengths of getting a static IP address, then they will appear invisible in the system unless they have been specifically targeted (important line). The normal internet connection here in Thailand is based on dynamic IP address allocation, which means the IP address will be changed every time the computer is switched off, or changed at the end of the IP lease period which is normally 96 hours. Very difficult to follow a target under these circumstances. Compromise this with the use of proxy servers, then it becomes near impossible unless the individual has been a very naughty boy or girl and have been specifically targeted. It is, and remains a contentious issue, and again IMHO, has more to do with internet regulation than it does to working. Edited June 21, 2014 by chrisinth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NanLaew Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 Touched a nerve? So, just to clarify, if I read you correctly - it's ok as a foreigner to work in Thailand and dodge paying any tax because the 'Thai People' mostly don't pay tax anyway. Also you state that it's 'total BS' that a certain category of ex pats 'working under the radar' are cited as being responsible for the recent crack down on visa exempt border runs, despite there being numerous press reports, at the time, that immigration were targeting certain nationalities who were working illegally in Thailand (this does not include Burmese and Cambodians, none of whom have been using visa exempt entries to work illegally here - most labour working here illegally never could/did do visa exempt border runs). Touched nothing so far. The Thai revenue department is a sham. When they announce the annual 'top 25 tax payers' it is invariably full of the likes if the FARANG CEO of Coca Cola Thailand or the FARANG Country Manager of CAT or the FARANG MD of DTAC. There's certainly not a lot of representation from the Thai families that own and operate the likes of Bangkok Bank, Siam Cement or CP beyond the rare father or oldest sibling figurehead. Similarly, the 'retired' ACM's, Pol Maj's and Gen's that pad the boards of these huge Thai enterprises, both government and privately owned, are also flying well 'below the radar.' The foreigner is an easy target and just another whipping boy for the sake of keeping Thailand for the Thai's. That doesn't bother me as it is their country and their laws. Since I don't work here, legally or otherwise, I have absolutely no dog in this fight. You are correct. All the illegals working in construction and fishing never do border runs. Because they are imported en masse by agents of very powerful and protected people (see para. 1 above). But we are veering off topic here. The OP appears satisfied that he has made anyone who wasn't aware that the only option for a young, online entrepreneur to make an easy living in Thailand is to do it illegally. As if we didn't know that already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NanLaew Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) OK back to the question. You could Form a consultancy company. Say xvz consulting. Then you employ 4 Thai. one to clean, one to drive, one IT (switches your computer on) and maybe one office manager (making coffee). That should enable you to get a work permit to do your online stuff. Sent from my GT-I9500 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app There are a couple of dodgy constructs in LOS these days. 1) The 49% foreign/51% Thai 'company' that allows a foreigner to 'own' his home here. and 2) The Thai 'company' that has a lone farang selling hockey pucks on the 'net with the Thai wife as Office Manager, the 'brother' as the Transport Manager, the sister-in-law as Marketing Manager and mother-in-law as CEO. I reckon #1 is probably a fast way to lose money whereas #2, despite being (more) legal, is a slow way to make money. The concept that the one-man company can make a fortune is rather tempered by the realities of working legally in Thailand. Edited June 21, 2014 by NanLaew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vic666 Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 I have been "working online" in Thailand for 10 years. There are 2 kinds of working online: selling stuff, which require offline work too (source goods, visit manufacturers, package and ship), and selling digital products/services (ebooks, SEO services, affiliate marketing, build websites) which only require a good internet connection. Either way, you can make money without paying any taxes, without bothering about a work permit. You will be breaking the law but who will ever find out? It's not a crime to ship parcel from post office and to buy stuff at shops, Chatuchak etc. When you start shipping containers things change, but there are ways around everything. The manufacturers will help you sort things out if you don't have a company. Your only concern will be the visa, that' why many people opted for ED or repeated Tourist visas. Now to answer your final question: to set up a company to do what is called work-from-home is IMHO plain stupid, but if you really have to do it, it can be an export company, as I assume you will be selling stuff made in Thailand. You'll need an office or at least a sign outside your house, accounting, fake employees, deposited capital, pay taxes etc etc and a good lawyer to set up everything. here on thaivisa all these info are available for free. If you sell IM services, like SEO, then you could register your company as a consultancy firm and you'd be an adviser on everything about IT. Or something like that. I hope this helps. Like I said, I've been doing this for 10 years and at the beginning I wanted to open a company, get a work permit, do the right thing. Then money started pouring in, so I concentrated on online marketing to get customers and forgot about the all open-a-company thing, enjoying my tourist visa. Now, with the new regulations, the easiest/best thing to do is to leave Thailand and start all over in Cambodia, Philippines or Indonesia. I hope this helps... So you have been living here for 10 years working online, by your own admission making bucket loads of money working, plus you have never paid a single satang in tax whilst living in Thailand on Tourist (maybe Visa Exempt) Visas and what's more you seem to be proud of it. People 'working under the radar' (not just answering a few emails whilst on holiday) who have been cheating the system (and the Thai People) for years have now made it more difficult for a lot of expats who want to stay and don't want to break the law here but don't for various reasons meet the current visa criteriae. The current crack down is aimed primarily at flushing out a certain category of ex pats who are cheating Thailand by working 'under the radar'; I note that you recognize that this particular party may be over. . this crackdown, like many other in the past, will come and go. the party is not over, there are always ways around everything if you have creativity and cash. regarding working under the radar, please picture this scenario before talking nonsense: you go to chatuchak on sundays, buy a few things and package them nicely. monday morning you go to the post office to shipe them to the customers you got from your online time at home or at the internet cafe. your money has helped local sellers and thai postal service. many tourists buy many things and ship them home for themselves, friends or to resell. many people come here 4 times/year to buy 200 kg of clothes at pratunam to resell back home in summer. is this called working illegally in thailand? yes, it is, technically. does it negatively affect the lives of thais? no, rather it helps the economy. does it affects the lives of righteous expats like you? hardly. you enjoy your privileges of having a work permit, of working for an company on an expat contract with full benefits, and dislike all the dodgy farang who live under the radar. just because they don't give 40% or more of their income to the tax and revenue department, like you are forced to do. this is what you really don't like, the fact that you pay taxes and I don't. a final thought for you: there is a huge difference between people who buy items at chatuchak and sell on ebay, and people who live here scamming other expats, working as middlemen, hacking ATMs and so on. this crackdown is aimed at cleaning thailand's image as a safe haven for criminals. look how many have been caught in pattaya or phuket on arrest warrants issued years ago. these are the bad apples. the only thing you and I have in common with them is we're all farang. don't generalize. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
German Viking Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 <script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script> Well guys the question is sill going in circles round and round. What category or criteria do u come under if you wanted to work online in Thailand. Surely this angle of working online has to be covered under some thai regulation in a country that has made laws for all kinds of things. AN ANSWER STILL AWAITED !!! ---------------------------------------------- It appears that it is you who is spinning your question around. Several people have alerted you to the fact that to work in Thailand you need a work permit. The work permit is not issued by immigration, they deal with visas, the department of labor deal with work permits. You also seem to be misguided as to "entitlement" as you have mentioned in quite a few of your posts; because you may have a job, this does not entitle you to a visa. If the intention is to work online in Thailand, don't advertise it on an open forum. That's about the best advice you will get............... Hi chrisinth, In my opinion you hit the nail on the head I would also never discuss a subject like this in a forum anyway. Back to the subject in case I would be in the a situation like "ucomservices" I would give myself several questions. Do I have business with any Thai Firm? If no, then I give a damn about a work permit in Thailand does'nt matter I do my work from over there. If yes, then I have to think, do I meet ppl in person or only online contact. If yes, then Houston there is a problem. My recommandation avoid any personally contact, then is there hardly an evidence from where you did the work. In germany we having a simple phrase "wache keine schlafenden Hunde auf"(never awake sleeping dogs"), caused they could bite you . For me in the case I would do any businesses, there is only 1 main question, how can I reduce me taxes legally in any country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FritsSikkink Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 THANKS FOLKS FOR REPLYING TO MY QUERY BUT HONESTLY IT IS STILL NOT CLARIFIED. THE QUESTION STILL REMAINS. "DOES WORKING ONLINE IN THAILAND ENTITLE YOU TO GETTING A THAI VISA UNDER ANY CATEGORY ACCORDING TO THAI IMMIGRATION RULES OR NOT" ???? No. You are allowed to do it however. as long as your work doesn't involve thailand, thai companies or people in any way it's agreed by thai officials that you can do your work in peace, mai pen rai. i think you still owe the thai government taxes... You are not allowed to do it, you give false information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JepSoDii Posted June 22, 2014 Share Posted June 22, 2014 Just want to be clear that your presumptions are flat wrong: "Surely this angle of working online has to be covered under some thai regulation . . ." No, it doesn't have to be covered and in fact it is not covered; there is no legal provision for online working, despite the fact that it probably affects many thousands of expats and probably thousands of traveling non-expat foreigners. So your claim that the "question is going around in circles" and waiting an answer is untrue. You have been answered multiple times, both directly and indirectly with all the information you could possibly use. Not getting the answer you want to hear does not mean you haven't been answered with all the detail that exists. You have been. So it seems that since you have an online business, you'll have to decide if you want to work legally by opening a company and hiring local employees as many presumably do, or working under the radar as very many surely do. Those are your choices. Well guys the question is sill going in circles round and round.What category or criteria do u come under if you wanted to work online in Thailand. Surely this angle of working online has to be covered under some thai regulation in a country that has made laws for all kinds of things.AN ANSWER STILL AWAITED !!!---------------------------------------------- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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