Rice missing, rotten or 'replaced by inferior stock'

[rubl]

so of the almost 1 trillion baht the government has put into this scheme - based on the rotting - swapped out - missing - bogus sales etc .....how much are they actually going to recover, estimates in the 800 billion range seem quite plausible now - there is no way that cannot be criminal

and these ex PTP and reds are in France claiming human rights violations to the UN - what about the hardship on the farming community driving some of them to commit suicide - and the cheers on a red stage when kids were blown up in Trat and the numerous grenade and gun attacks on innocent protestors in Bangkok - I hope they come clean and confess to their own misdeeds and abuse - and for the record - Thailand has never been better the last 5 weeks

I said this before and I'll say it again - I wish Prayuth would slow down and do this right instead of trying to rush things - Thailand needs to get out of this cycle of political failure and intervention once and for all

"how much are they actually going to recover, estimates in the 800 billion range seem quite plausible now"

You probably meant "800++ billion Baht left unrecovered, but luckily guaranteed by the Yingluck government" ?

Edited July 6, 2014 by rubl

[Trembly]

...Badly stacked warehouse? Hahahaha. Most are in some way...

And you find that funny?

I have been in 100s of warehoused in thailand and all over the world. If you look at the pictures in the papers. Actually the warehouses look immaculate.

What would this bloke know about a badly stacked warehouse anyway. Please bear in mind they brought down a government over this issue, so if a badly kept warehouse is justification, my lord.

Have you seen the pictures. They are moaning about mould. What pray tell is anyone supposed to do about that in a country with 80% humidity and 40c heat? Seal it from the outside world?,

What with? Duct tape?

They are moaning about weevils. Do they know anything about the flight radius and reproductive cycles in the tropics?

They would need to fumigate maybe 7 times per year!

Doeehe know how much that costs. They are moaning about things that are completely and utterly beyond the power of any warehouse guy to control in thaikand.

Ooooh. Irregular stack of rice. Boohoo. Let's stick to finding the apparently as yet unmissing 3,000,000,000 kilograms.

One would presume that the rice scheme committee would be fully aware of the factors you point out before implementing the scheme.

[Trembly]

how much of these wrongs are scams and how much is pure incompetence. i would guess a fair mix of both

I think that there is a strong weighting towards the scam side.

Thailand didn't just learn the rice trade yesterday. The country has been one of the world's top rice exporters for 50 years; they know how to properly sort and store large quantities of rice.

That's 90% of the point they don't.

They have run this stockpile for 3 years now.

Rice is normally out of the country in 1 season. Why?

Because you can't story millions of tonnes of rice in the Thai climate without infestation and quality deterioration or mould. The private sector wouldn't be able to store 19mn Mt of product perfectly, let alone the govt.

I have seen old rice warehouses near Khon Kaen you wouldn't put pigs in let alone rice.

I was referring to the manner in which it was stored rather than the length of time. No one disagrees that you can't store perishables in tropical heat for very long.

Edited July 6, 2014 by Trembly

[rubl]

how much of these wrongs are scams and how much is pure incompetence. i would guess a fair mix of both

I think that there is a strong weighting towards the scam side.

Thailand didn't just learn the rice trade yesterday. The country has been one of the world's top rice exporters for 50 years; they know how to properly sort and store large quantities of rice.

That's 90% of the point they don't.

They have run this stockpile for 3 years now.

Rice is normally out of the country in 1 season. Why?

Because you can't story millions of tonnes of rice in the Thai climate without infestation and quality deterioration or mould. The private sector wouldn't be able to store 19mn Mt of product perfectly, let alone the govt.

I have seen old rice warehouses near Khon Kaen you wouldn't put pigs in let alone rice.

Goh, does that mean the Yingluck government was totally ignorant or acted even more criminally than I thought with their RPPS?

Possible answer: the Yingluck government was aware of problems with internationally prices of rice dropping. By not selling any rice bought via the RPPS but just storing it their tried to hide the growing losses expected.

[Credo]

Perhaps the military when it took control should have posted guards at all the rice warehouses. It's getting a little late to figure out just who has done what with the rice.

[Thai at Heart]

...Badly stacked warehouse? Hahahaha. Most are in some way...

And you find that funny?

I have been in 100s of warehoused in thailand and all over the world. If you look at the pictures in the papers. Actually the warehouses look immaculate.

What would this bloke know about a badly stacked warehouse anyway. Please bear in mind they brought down a government over this issue, so if a badly kept warehouse is justification, my lord.

Have you seen the pictures. They are moaning about mould. What pray tell is anyone supposed to do about that in a country with 80% humidity and 40c heat? Seal it from the outside world?,

What with? Duct tape?

They are moaning about weevils. Do they know anything about the flight radius and reproductive cycles in the tropics?

They would need to fumigate maybe 7 times per year!

Doeehe know how much that costs. They are moaning about things that are completely and utterly beyond the power of any warehouse guy to control in thaikand.

Ooooh. Irregular stack of rice. Boohoo. Let's stick to finding the apparently as yet unmissing 3,000,000,000 kilograms.

One would presume that the rice scheme committee would be fully aware of the factors you point out before implementing the scheme.

I would doubt it very much but the agriculture ministry would.

The actual crime to pin on Thaksin would be to say that they should never have embarked on the system without sufficient storage to keep the quality.

That's why it had never been tried before. Storing this stuff for so long is largely impossibke without huge quality losses.

[Thai at Heart]

how much of these wrongs are scams and how much is pure incompetence. i would guess a fair mix of both

I think that there is a strong weighting towards the scam side.

Thailand didn't just learn the rice trade yesterday. The country has been one of the world's top rice exporters for 50 years; they know how to properly sort and store large quantities of rice.

That's 90% of the point they don't.

They have run this stockpile for 3 years now.

Rice is normally out of the country in 1 season. Why?

Because you can't story millions of tonnes of rice in the Thai climate without infestation and quality deterioration or mould. The private sector wouldn't be able to store 19mn Mt of product perfectly, let alone the govt.

I have seen old rice warehouses near Khon Kaen you wouldn't put pigs in let alone rice.

Goh, does that mean the Yingluck government was totally ignorant or acted even more criminally than I thought with their RPPS?

Possible answer: the Yingluck government was aware of problems with internationally prices of rice dropping. By not selling any rice bought via the RPPS but just storing it their tried to hide the growing losses expected.

That is the actual crime if it's a crime. Anyone would know that over a 3 year period the quality would drop a lot or go mouldy.

Maybe they deemed the losses acceptable.

Have you ever kept rice for 3 years under your stairs? The priced never went up far enough. The Indians and Vietnamese stole their market. That's business.

Arrogant stupid idea on the part of Thaksin.

Edited July 6, 2014 by Thai at Heart

[smedly]

so of the almost 1 trillion baht the government has put into this scheme - based on the rotting - swapped out - missing - bogus sales etc .....how much are they actually going to recover, estimates in the 800 billion range seem quite plausible now - there is no way that cannot be criminal

and these ex PTP and reds are in France claiming human rights violations to the UN - what about the hardship on the farming community driving some of them to commit suicide - and the cheers on a red stage when kids were blown up in Trat and the numerous grenade and gun attacks on innocent protestors in Bangkok - I hope they come clean and confess to their own misdeeds and abuse - and for the record - Thailand has never been better the last 5 weeks

I said this before and I'll say it again - I wish Prayuth would slow down and do this right instead of trying to rush things - Thailand needs to get out of this cycle of political failure and intervention once and for all

"how much are they actually going to recover, estimates in the 800 billion range seem quite plausible now"

You probably meant "800++ billion Baht left unrecovered, but luckily guaranteed by the Yingluck government" ?

yes correct - it was too late to edit the post but I left out the word "loss" estimates..............

[rubl]

That's 90% of the point they don't.

They have run this stockpile for 3 years now.

Rice is normally out of the country in 1 season. Why?

Because you can't story millions of tonnes of rice in the Thai climate without infestation and quality deterioration or mould. The private sector wouldn't be able to store 19mn Mt of product perfectly, let alone the govt.

I have seen old rice warehouses near Khon Kaen you wouldn't put pigs in let alone rice.

Goh, does that mean the Yingluck government was totally ignorant or acted even more criminally than I thought with their RPPS?

Possible answer: the Yingluck government was aware of problems with internationally prices of rice dropping. By not selling any rice bought via the RPPS but just storing it their tried to hide the growing losses expected.

That is the actual crime if it's a crime. Anyone would know that over a 3 year period the quality would drop a lot or go mouldy.

Maybe they deemed the losses acceptable.

Maybe they didn't provide many details and only various, contradictory figures in order to obfuscate and hide the real amount of losses incurred?

With BAAC having paid out nearly 1,000,000,000,000 Baht and possibly a few hundred billion having been recovered, there still seem to be a bit of a gap. Allegedly that is. Barely worthwhile to accuse Ms. Yingluck of negligence because of that.

[smedly]

Posted before but an interesting read and food for thought

The government once announced that the sale of stockpiled rice would be done under a G2G (government to government) arrangement via a Chinese company called GSSG Import & Export Corporation, whose sole appointed agent in Thailand is Mr. Natthanit Sojirakul, a.k.a. 'Palm' who is the personal assistant of Udonthani MP Rapheephan Phongrueangrong, wife of red shirt leader Arisman Phongrueangrong.

Mr. Natthanit in turn issued a formal letter appointing as his representative Mr. Nimol Rakdee, who is the right hand man of Sia Piang.

It was Mr. Nimol Rakdee's job purchase rice from the government under the G2G scheme via the Department of Foreign Trade. Sia Piang then takes the rice which was sold at a price below market rates due to the fact that there was no public auction as per G2G regulations, and sells them to the rice mills at market rates.

The government loses money once because Sia Piang pockets the difference between the G2G price and the market rates. The rice mills then sell the rice back to the government, causing the government to lose money the twice because the government is obliged to buy the rice at 40% above the market rate.

It is probably not negligence or coincidence that causes the government loses money in this way. More likely because Sia Piang is a close associate of Thaksin.

Selling the rice under a G2G scheme (to avoid a public tender) is actually a scheme to sell the rice to corporations belonging to people close to Thaksin Shinawatra.

Speculative scenario that I hope the military are aware of to be investigated

[Thai at Heart]

That's 90% of the point they don't.

They have run this stockpile for 3 years now.

Rice is normally out of the country in 1 season. Why?

Because you can't story millions of tonnes of rice in the Thai climate without infestation and quality deterioration or mould. The private sector wouldn't be able to store 19mn Mt of product perfectly, let alone the govt.

I have seen old rice warehouses near Khon Kaen you wouldn't put pigs in let alone rice.

Goh, does that mean the Yingluck government was totally ignorant or acted even more criminally than I thought with their RPPS?

Possible answer: the Yingluck government was aware of problems with internationally prices of rice dropping. By not selling any rice bought via the RPPS but just storing it their tried to hide the growing losses expected.

That is the actual crime if it's a crime. Anyone would know that over a 3 year period the quality would drop a lot or go mouldy.

Maybe they deemed the losses acceptable.

Maybe they didn't provide many details and only various, contradictory figures in order to obfuscate and hide the real amount of losses incurred?

With BAAC having paid out nearly 1,000,000,000,000 Baht and possibly a few hundred billion having been recovered, there still seem to be a bit of a gap. Allegedly that is. Barely worthwhile to accuse Ms. Yingluck of negligence because of that.

What they lost on the subsidy is one thing.

What they lose against the market vale for sale, god knows. But the maths isn't that hard.

Purchase price, yield for process. Various sundry costs,storage costs, - current sale price.

Of course if its mouldy it has zero value, etc. By now they will probably have 15% mould loss. I think to pin that on yingluck is unfair. These was no way to avoid it.

[Lite Beer]

Inspections Uncover Rot, Corruption At Thai Rice Warehouses (DPA)

By Khaosod Eng.

BANGKOK — An inspection ordered by Thailand's military junta of rice stored in warehouses under a failed multibillion-dollar subsidy scheme has revealed rot and corruption, reports said Sunday.
Inspectors found rotten and weevil-infested grain, along with evidence that large stocks were replaced with old or inferior grades.

Corruption under the previous government's rice-pledging scheme was one of the main reasons for the May 22 coup d'etat.

ML Panadda Diskul, chairman of a sub-committee reviewing the inventory, said a large quantity of rice was discovered to be missing in just the first two days of the inspection, the Bangkok Post reported.

He said military and police teams will visit about 1,800 warehouses nationwide to inspect registered stocks of 10 million tons.

Panadda said some rice sacks bore code numbers that did not match documents provided by the warehouse owners, raising suspicions that pledged rice had been replaced with old or inferior rice bought from mills at lower prices.

He said some of the warehouses were in a disorganized state, stacked with low-quality rice or rice mixed with other substances in an apparent effort to make inspections more difficult.

In a message on his Facebook page, Panadda expressed frustration that the shoddy management of the scheme had badly affected the country's farmers.

The Yingluck Shinawatra government launched the rice programme three years ago after promising to subsidize rural voters that helped her win the 2011 election.

But the scheme was plagued by corruption from the start, with billions of dollars in losses, unpaid farmers and Thailand losing its rank as the world's leading rice exporter.

Source: http://en.khaosod.co.th/detail.php?newsid=1404632692&section=11&typecate=06

-- Khaosod English 2014-07-06

[Thai at Heart]

Inspections Uncover Rot, Corruption At Thai Rice Warehouses (DPA)

By Khaosod Eng.

BANGKOK An inspection ordered by Thailand's military junta of rice stored in warehouses under a failed multibillion-dollar subsidy scheme has revealed rot and corruption, reports said Sunday.

Inspectors found rotten and weevil-infested grain, along with evidence that large stocks were replaced with old or inferior grades.

Corruption under the previous government's rice-pledging scheme was one of the main reasons for the May 22 coup d'etat.

ML Panadda Diskul, chairman of a sub-committee reviewing the inventory, said a large quantity of rice was discovered to be missing in just the first two days of the inspection, the Bangkok Post reported.

He said military and police teams will visit about 1,800 warehouses nationwide to inspect registered stocks of 10 million tons.

Panadda said some rice sacks bore code numbers that did not match documents provided by the warehouse owners, raising suspicions that pledged rice had been replaced with old or inferior rice bought from mills at lower prices.

He said some of the warehouses were in a disorganized state, stacked with low-quality rice or rice mixed with other substances in an apparent effort to make inspections more difficult.

In a message on his Facebook page, Panadda expressed frustration that the shoddy management of the scheme had badly affected the country's farmers.

The Yingluck Shinawatra government launched the rice programme three years ago after promising to subsidize rural voters that helped her win the 2011 election.

But the scheme was plagued by corruption from the start, with billions of dollars in losses, unpaid farmers and Thailand losing its rank as the world's leading rice exporter.

Source: http://en.khaosod.co.th/detail.php?newsid=1404632692&section=11&typecate=06

-- Khaosod English 2014-07-06

Now I am confused.

They claim it was replaced with inferior rice?

Where did this magic rice appear from to fill the apparent hole? Where did all the good rice go?

Or did they just put better grade marks on stuff in the storage. But the govt subsidised paddy not stored rice. I think replaced is not quite the right word.

[wealth]

Inspections Uncover Rot, Corruption At Thai Rice Warehouses (DPA)

By Khaosod Eng.

BANGKOK — An inspection ordered by Thailand's military junta of rice stored in warehouses under a failed multibillion-dollar subsidy scheme has revealed rot and corruption, reports said Sunday.

Inspectors found rotten and weevil-infested grain, along with evidence that large stocks were replaced with old or inferior grades.

Corruption under the previous government's rice-pledging scheme was one of the main reasons for the May 22 coup d'etat.

ML Panadda Diskul, chairman of a sub-committee reviewing the inventory, said a large quantity of rice was discovered to be missing in just the first two days of the inspection, the Bangkok Post reported.

He said military and police teams will visit about 1,800 warehouses nationwide to inspect registered stocks of 10 million tons.

Panadda said some rice sacks bore code numbers that did not match documents provided by the warehouse owners, raising suspicions that pledged rice had been replaced with old or inferior rice bought from mills at lower prices.

He said some of the warehouses were in a disorganized state, stacked with low-quality rice or rice mixed with other substances in an apparent effort to make inspections more difficult.

In a message on his Facebook page, Panadda expressed frustration that the shoddy management of the scheme had badly affected the country's farmers.

The Yingluck Shinawatra government launched the rice programme three years ago after promising to subsidize rural voters that helped her win the 2011 election.

But the scheme was plagued by corruption from the start, with billions of dollars in losses, unpaid farmers and Thailand losing its rank as the world's leading rice exporter.

Source: http://en.khaosod.co.th/detail.php?newsid=1404632692&section=11&typecate=06

-- Khaosod English 2014-07-06

what are "mixed with other substances"?

When I bought a 5kg of white rice pack for dog food months ago it turned hard after it went cold. Almost like concrete. It's still in the market. I was smiling to myself and thought I could make bricks out of that rice, maybe good for isolation.

I bought Jasmin rice and found it's taste and smell is very different from rice I bought years ago.

One can see the strange touch of colouring when not hidden by the package.

[Local Drunk]

The PTP should have paraphrased Van Halen in their campaign policy propaganda... Our love is rotten to the core!

[dru2]

Posted before but an interesting read and food for thought

The government once announced that the sale of stockpiled rice would be done under a G2G (government to government) arrangement via a Chinese company called GSSG Import & Export Corporation, whose sole appointed agent in Thailand is Mr. Natthanit Sojirakul, a.k.a. 'Palm' who is the personal assistant of Udonthani MP Rapheephan Phongrueangrong, wife of red shirt leader Arisman Phongrueangrong.

Mr. Natthanit in turn issued a formal letter appointing as his representative Mr. Nimol Rakdee, who is the right hand man of Sia Piang.

It was Mr. Nimol Rakdee's job purchase rice from the government under the G2G scheme via the Department of Foreign Trade. Sia Piang then takes the rice which was sold at a price below market rates due to the fact that there was no public auction as per G2G regulations, and sells them to the rice mills at market rates.

The government loses money once because Sia Piang pockets the difference between the G2G price and the market rates. The rice mills then sell the rice back to the government, causing the government to lose money the twice because the government is obliged to buy the rice at 40% above the market rate.

It is probably not negligence or coincidence that causes the government loses money in this way. More likely because Sia Piang is a close associate of Thaksin.

Selling the rice under a G2G scheme (to avoid a public tender) is actually a scheme to sell the rice to corporations belonging to people close to Thaksin Shinawatra.

Speculative scenario that I hope the military are aware of to be investigated

Informed and informative - thank you!

[Tatsujin]

That's 90% of the point they don't.

They have run this stockpile for 3 years now.

Rice is normally out of the country in 1 season. Why?

Because you can't story millions of tonnes of rice in the Thai climate without infestation and quality deterioration or mould. The private sector wouldn't be able to store 19mn Mt of product perfectly, let alone the govt.

I have seen old rice warehouses near Khon Kaen you wouldn't put pigs in let alone rice.

Goh, does that mean the Yingluck government was totally ignorant or acted even more criminally than I thought with their RPPS?

Possible answer: the Yingluck government was aware of problems with internationally prices of rice dropping. By not selling any rice bought via the RPPS but just storing it their tried to hide the growing losses expected.

That is the actual crime if it's a crime. Anyone would know that over a 3 year period the quality would drop a lot or go mouldy.

Maybe they deemed the losses acceptable.

Maybe they didn't provide many details and only various, contradictory figures in order to obfuscate and hide the real amount of losses incurred?

With BAAC having paid out nearly 1,000,000,000,000 Baht and possibly a few hundred billion having been recovered, there still seem to be a bit of a gap. Allegedly that is. Barely worthwhile to accuse Ms. Yingluck of negligence because of that.

What they lost on the subsidy is one thing.

What they lose against the market vale for sale, god knows. But the maths isn't that hard.

Purchase price, yield for process. Various sundry costs,storage costs, - current sale price.

Of course if its mouldy it has zero value, etc. By now they will probably have 15% mould loss. I think to pin that on yingluck is unfair. These was no way to avoid it.

Can't blame it on Yingluck and it was unavoidable. You're being far more generous than I would be in placing blame.

The scam was doomed to failure before it was ever implemented. With the purchase price compared to market price added to the knowledge that the prices would drop further and the immediate increase in rental costs of the land itself, I don't see how this was ever going to benefit ANYONE other than the millers, transport companies, storage companies and illegal/legal loan sharks and banks ... it certainly wasn't the farmers who it was supposedly aimed to help.

They should also be looking into who owns these businesses and their profits/losses since the scheme started to get a better idea of where all that cash disappeared to.

[Thai at Heart]

@tatsujin

The fact it went mouldy is not Yinglucks personal fault. I would love to know the standard practice for rotating stock, but I can easily believe that once the product is stacked, it is NEVER rotated and aired out.

Just too labour intensive and costs too much in breakage. The only thing to do is to stack it, and try to keep the storage as dry and clean and possible.

Yeah right. Its Thailand. 80% humidity and filled with bugs and critter. If someone gave me 1mn GBP salary to take care of a warehousein Thailand , but said I would go to jail if even 1% went mouldy or got bugs, I would want 10 forklifts and a permanent labour staff of 100 people.

Its just not practical.

The cumulative knowledge about rice in thailand is huge. Best practice is probably to keep packed production Thailand as little time as possible.

Edited July 6, 2014 by Thai at Heart

[lostsoul49]

That is the actual crime if it's a crime. Anyone would know that over a 3 year period the quality would drop a lot or go mouldy.

Maybe they deemed the losses acceptable.

Maybe they didn't provide many details and only various, contradictory figures in order to obfuscate and hide the real amount of losses incurred?

With BAAC having paid out nearly 1,000,000,000,000 Baht and possibly a few hundred billion having been recovered, there still seem to be a bit of a gap. Allegedly that is. Barely worthwhile to accuse Ms. Yingluck of negligence because of that.

What they lost on the subsidy is one thing.

What they lose against the market vale for sale, god knows. But the maths isn't that hard.

Purchase price, yield for process. Various sundry costs,storage costs, - current sale price.

Of course if its mouldy it has zero value, etc. By now they will probably have 15% mould loss. I think to pin that on yingluck is unfair. These was no way to avoid it.

It was a populist scheme initiated by Yingluck's administration to buy votes with a trillion baht of tax payer's money.

It was Yingluck who was head of the scheme as chairperson who NEVER attended any meetings.

It was Yingluck who denied any and all corruption in the scam even though the whole country (including the world bank and IMF) knew there was.

It was Yingluck who said the scheme was good, even at her NACC case hearing and that it will continue.

It was Yingluck steering the ship with the intention of stockpiling the rice to push up global prices, an idiotic strategy, that handed the Thai rice export industry over to the Indians and Vietnamese.

It was Yingluck who dissolved parliament without first queueing up the cash for the farmers even though apart from the protests the unpaid farmers were already on their 5th broken promise for payment and was just as hot news.

It was Yingluck and her constant denial of corruption that stopped investigations and thus allowed such corruption to continue to flourish.

Yingluck was at the head of the pile on two fronts... One as chairperson of the rice scheme and the other as PM presiding over the worst government scheme in the history of Thai politics.

If anyone is responsible for this mess, it is Yingluck Shinawatra, and in my opinion, due to the scale of her failings and she probably knew it was corrupt to the core and a pathetic excuse for one of HER policies... Then if anything it is Yingluck who deserves to get the largest prison sentence and I am talking 20 years at least. Personally I would give her life in prison as a warning to others.

I can't believe that many posters on here are saying she is innocent.... She is a monster. She stood by and watched people murdered in her brother's name and refused to acknowledge any of it, and sat happily by while HER police force refused to investigate any of it.

Dreadful woman.... I hate her with a passion.

[wealth]

I suspect they sprayed hardener in some places (that's used for plastics) to keep bugs away. These white bugs I saw people sorted out were dry and hard, - crispy

[Thai at Heart]

That is the actual crime if it's a crime. Anyone would know that over a 3 year period the quality would drop a lot or go mouldy.

Maybe they deemed the losses acceptable.

Maybe they didn't provide many details and only various, contradictory figures in order to obfuscate and hide the real amount of losses incurred?

With BAAC having paid out nearly 1,000,000,000,000 Baht and possibly a few hundred billion having been recovered, there still seem to be a bit of a gap. Allegedly that is. Barely worthwhile to accuse Ms. Yingluck of negligence because of that.

What they lost on the subsidy is one thing.

What they lose against the market vale for sale, god knows. But the maths isn't that hard.

Purchase price, yield for process. Various sundry costs,storage costs, - current sale price.

Of course if its mouldy it has zero value, etc. By now they will probably have 15% mould loss. I think to pin that on yingluck is unfair. These was no way to avoid it.

It was a populist scheme initiated by Yingluck's administration to buy votes with a trillion baht of tax payer's money.

It was Yingluck who was head of the scheme as chairperson who NEVER attended any meetings.

It was Yingluck who denied any and all corruption in the scam even though the whole country (including the world bank and IMF) knew there was.

It was Yingluck who said the scheme was good, even at her NACC case hearing and that it will continue.

It was Yingluck steering the ship with the intention of stockpiling the rice to push up global prices, an idiotic strategy, that handed the Thai rice export industry over to the Indians and Vietnamese.

It was Yingluck who dissolved parliament without first queueing up the cash for the farmers even though apart from the protests the unpaid farmers were already on their 5th broken promise for payment and was just as hot news.

It was Yingluck and her constant denial of corruption that stopped investigations and thus allowed such corruption to continue to flourish.

Yingluck was at the head of the pile on two fronts... One as chairperson of the rice scheme and the other as PM presiding over the worst government scheme in the history of Thai politics.

If anyone is responsible for this mess, it is Yingluck Shinawatra, and in my opinion, due to the scale of her failings and she probably knew it was corrupt to the core and a pathetic excuse for one of HER policies... Then if anything it is Yingluck who deserves to get the largest prison sentence and I am talking 20 years at least. Personally I would give her life in prison as a warning to others.

I can't believe that many posters on here are saying she is innocent.... She is a monster. She stood by and watched people murdered in her brother's name and refused to acknowledge any of it, and sat happily by while HER police force refused to investigate any of it.

Dreadful woman.... I hate her with a passion.

As a subsidy it was OK.

As a sales plan horrible

[rubl]

What they lose against the market vale for sale, god knows. But the maths isn't that hard.

Purchase price, yield for process. Various sundry costs,storage costs, - current sale price.

Of course if its mouldy it has zero value, etc. By now they will probably have 15% mould loss. I think to pin that on yingluck is unfair. These was no way to avoid it.

It was a populist scheme initiated by Yingluck's administration to buy votes with a trillion baht of tax payer's money.

It was Yingluck who was head of the scheme as chairperson who NEVER attended any meetings.

It was Yingluck who denied any and all corruption in the scam even though the whole country (including the world bank and IMF) knew there was.

It was Yingluck who said the scheme was good, even at her NACC case hearing and that it will continue.

It was Yingluck steering the ship with the intention of stockpiling the rice to push up global prices, an idiotic strategy, that handed the Thai rice export industry over to the Indians and Vietnamese.

It was Yingluck who dissolved parliament without first queueing up the cash for the farmers even though apart from the protests the unpaid farmers were already on their 5th broken promise for payment and was just as hot news.

It was Yingluck and her constant denial of corruption that stopped investigations and thus allowed such corruption to continue to flourish.

Yingluck was at the head of the pile on two fronts... One as chairperson of the rice scheme and the other as PM presiding over the worst government scheme in the history of Thai politics.

If anyone is responsible for this mess, it is Yingluck Shinawatra, and in my opinion, due to the scale of her failings and she probably knew it was corrupt to the core and a pathetic excuse for one of HER policies... Then if anything it is Yingluck who deserves to get the largest prison sentence and I am talking 20 years at least. Personally I would give her life in prison as a warning to others.

I can't believe that many posters on here are saying she is innocent.... She is a monster. She stood by and watched people murdered in her brother's name and refused to acknowledge any of it, and sat happily by while HER police force refused to investigate any of it.

Dreadful woman.... I hate her with a passion.

My dear lost soul, I think you're a bit too harsh on Ms. Yingluck. I for one would be perfectly willing to believe Ms. Yingluck is ignorant and therefor wrapped in the (children's) mantle of innocence.

Mind you, I think it's more a case of criminal negligence or just plain criminal. IMHO.

[rubl]

As a subsidy it was OK.

As a sales plan horrible

Subsidy?

The Yingluck administration was so confident about their profit making or at least break-even RPPS that they let the BAAC set-up a 500 billion Baht revolving funds. Paid from the fund, restore from rice sales. By now the losses may be 700++ billion Baht, but costs of the funds and interest don't seem to be paid, just like those farmer who had to wait

So, especially with poor farmers not helped or even more into debt, this RPPS can only be labeled a SCAM.

[apetley]

That is the actual crime if it's a crime. Anyone would know that over a 3 year period the quality would drop a lot or go mouldy.

Maybe they deemed the losses acceptable.

Maybe they didn't provide many details and only various, contradictory figures in order to obfuscate and hide the real amount of losses incurred?

With BAAC having paid out nearly 1,000,000,000,000 Baht and possibly a few hundred billion having been recovered, there still seem to be a bit of a gap. Allegedly that is. Barely worthwhile to accuse Ms. Yingluck of negligence because of that.

What they lost on the subsidy is one thing.

What they lose against the market vale for sale, god knows. But the maths isn't that hard.

Purchase price, yield for process. Various sundry costs,storage costs, - current sale price.

Of course if its mouldy it has zero value, etc. By now they will probably have 15% mould loss. I think to pin that on yingluck is unfair. These was no way to avoid it.

It was a populist scheme initiated by Yingluck's administration to buy votes with a trillion baht of tax payer's money.

It was Yingluck who was head of the scheme as chairperson who NEVER attended any meetings.

It was Yingluck who denied any and all corruption in the scam even though the whole country (including the world bank and IMF) knew there was.

It was Yingluck who said the scheme was good, even at her NACC case hearing and that it will continue.

It was Yingluck steering the ship with the intention of stockpiling the rice to push up global prices, an idiotic strategy, that handed the Thai rice export industry over to the Indians and Vietnamese.

It was Yingluck who dissolved parliament without first queueing up the cash for the farmers even though apart from the protests the unpaid farmers were already on their 5th broken promise for payment and was just as hot news.

It was Yingluck and her constant denial of corruption that stopped investigations and thus allowed such corruption to continue to flourish.

Yingluck was at the head of the pile on two fronts... One as chairperson of the rice scheme and the other as PM presiding over the worst government scheme in the history of Thai politics.

If anyone is responsible for this mess, it is Yingluck Shinawatra, and in my opinion, due to the scale of her failings and she probably knew it was corrupt to the core and a pathetic excuse for one of HER policies... Then if anything it is Yingluck who deserves to get the largest prison sentence and I am talking 20 years at least. Personally I would give her life in prison as a warning to others.

I can't believe that many posters on here are saying she is innocent.... She is a monster. She stood by and watched people murdered in her brother's name and refused to acknowledge any of it, and sat happily by while HER police force refused to investigate any of it.

Dreadful woman.... I hate her with a passion.

As a subsidy it was OK.

As a sales plan horrible

As a subsidy it was an appalling idea in that the middle man effectively paid out the subsidy to the farmer.

Much more rational and much less open to corruption is a subsidy scheme linked directly to land cultivated and paid direct.

[johnlandy]

And here's everyone that thinking that everything was on the table.

It will be years before all the guilty are flushed out 'TiT'

[Eric Loh]

Can't wait for the conclusion of this audit and how much is written off for accounting descranpancies & perishable write off. Any business who maintain an inventory know a certain portion will be spoil and will not be sold. All accountant will recognize this reality. The news only mentioned rice loss, rotten or replaced but no mention of fraud or corruption. So no conclusive statement yet but seem some posters here already made up their mind. It was a subsidy plan well intended that went weary and poorly implemented. An dereliction of duty but not a scam or fraud.

[philw]

That is the actual crime if it's a crime. Anyone would know that over a 3 year period the quality would drop a lot or go mouldy.

Maybe they deemed the losses acceptable.

Maybe they didn't provide many details and only various, contradictory figures in order to obfuscate and hide the real amount of losses incurred?

With BAAC having paid out nearly 1,000,000,000,000 Baht and possibly a few hundred billion having been recovered, there still seem to be a bit of a gap. Allegedly that is. Barely worthwhile to accuse Ms. Yingluck of negligence because of that.

What they lost on the subsidy is one thing.

What they lose against the market vale for sale, god knows. But the maths isn't that hard.

Purchase price, yield for process. Various sundry costs,storage costs, - current sale price.

Of course if its mouldy it has zero value, etc. By now they will probably have 15% mould loss. I think to pin that on yingluck is unfair. These was no way to avoid it.

It was a populist scheme initiated by Yingluck's administration to buy votes with a trillion baht of tax payer's money.

It was Yingluck who was head of the scheme as chairperson who NEVER attended any meetings.

It was Yingluck who denied any and all corruption in the scam even though the whole country (including the world bank and IMF) knew there was.

It was Yingluck who said the scheme was good, even at her NACC case hearing and that it will continue.

It was Yingluck steering the ship with the intention of stockpiling the rice to push up global prices, an idiotic strategy, that handed the Thai rice export industry over to the Indians and Vietnamese.

It was Yingluck who dissolved parliament without first queueing up the cash for the farmers even though apart from the protests the unpaid farmers were already on their 5th broken promise for payment and was just as hot news.

It was Yingluck and her constant denial of corruption that stopped investigations and thus allowed such corruption to continue to flourish.

Yingluck was at the head of the pile on two fronts... One as chairperson of the rice scheme and the other as PM presiding over the worst government scheme in the history of Thai politics.

If anyone is responsible for this mess, it is Yingluck Shinawatra, and in my opinion, due to the scale of her failings and she probably knew it was corrupt to the core and a pathetic excuse for one of HER policies... Then if anything it is Yingluck who deserves to get the largest prison sentence and I am talking 20 years at least. Personally I would give her life in prison as a warning to others.

I can't believe that many posters on here are saying she is innocent.... She is a monster. She stood by and watched people murdered in her brother's name and refused to acknowledge any of it, and sat happily by while HER police force refused to investigate any of it.

Dreadful woman.... I hate her with a passion.

You have an apt name and a visible risible hatred.

Have a cup of tea and get into the happiness quotients the military promote, whilst you are denied the right to criticise or comment.

I'm sure you feel much better already.

The good General will arrange the prosecution of the ex PM as soon as he possibly can, but what if nothing happens ??

[Valentine]

Can't wait for the conclusion of this audit and how much is written off for accounting descranpancies & perishable write off. Any business who maintain an inventory know a certain portion will be spoil and will not be sold. All accountant will recognize this reality. The news only mentioned rice loss, rotten or replaced but no mention of fraud or corruption. So no conclusive statement yet but seem some posters here already made up their mind. It was a subsidy plan well intended that went weary and poorly implemented. An dereliction of duty but not a scam or fraud.

A contradiction in terms as it seems you have made up your mind without final proof being presented, something you accuse others of doing.

[Benmart]

"The government will prosecute those involved." What we will read about in the future may be a few sack stuffers and stackers getting busted. No Thai warehouse property owners and bankers will be arrested or ever prosecuted. Thailand is a laugher.

I cannot tell the future and haven't met anyone that can. Conjecture, perhaps.

[Robby nz]

Can't wait for the conclusion of this audit and how much is written off for accounting descranpancies & perishable write off. Any business who maintain an inventory know a certain portion will be spoil and will not be sold. All accountant will recognize this reality. The news only mentioned rice loss, rotten or replaced but no mention of fraud or corruption. So no conclusive statement yet but seem some posters here already made up their mind. It was a subsidy plan well intended that went weary and poorly implemented. An dereliction of duty but not a scam or fraud.

ML Panadda Diskul, chairman of a sub-committee reviewing the inventory, said a large quantity of rice was discovered to be missing in just the first two days of the inspection,.

You seem to have forgotten the rice that is missing completely

along with evidence that large stocks were replaced with old or inferior grades

You have not explained where the rice went that was replaced with inferior grade, nor where the inferior rice came from.

He said some of the warehouses were in a disorganized state, stacked with low-quality rice or rice mixed with other substances in an apparent effort to make inspections more difficult.

Does that not suggest to you deliberate corruption in an attempt to deceive ?

And of course one of the headlines :

An inspection ordered by Thailand's military junta of rice stored in warehouses under a failed multibillion-dollar subsidy scheme has revealed rot and corruption, reports said Sunday.

Rot and corruption. Right ?

You also have to remember that this is only day two of the investigation.