Don't be a surrogate for money, Thai mother warns

[NongKhaiKid]

 

 

 

There might be more to this story as I posted somewhere else on TV.

 

http://www.9news.com.au/world/2014/08/04/07/34/australian-couple-accused-of-abandoning-baby-gammy-deny-claims?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

The surrogate has now received nearly 6 million baht (200K AUD) and rising. 

 

The Australian couple have been identified, the father Caucasian and the mother Thai in their 50's.  They deny there was a twin but the surrogate says there was and she is receiving more money than she could ever earn.

 

The only way to see who is lying is to do DNA tests on the two kids.  If the surrogate is lying then she should be charged.

 

Le's hope the agency has records to prove one way or another.

 

maybe with the brown stuff hitting the fan the records will have ' disappeared ' and the agency in 5th reverse gear.

 

If there were any records to start with.  Surrogacy for money is illegal and surrogacy with a non blood relative is illegal in Thailand. 

 

this is getting murkier by the day

[Zeegator]

Does anyone know if its medically possible to have one healthy baby and one down syndrome baby from the same egg?

 

Must be an eggspurt here somewhere.

 

Of course it is, that is what this thread is all about.
 

[culicine]

Were two eggs planted? How can a boy and girl be conceived from one egg? lol If two eggs were implanted, it was known apriori that two offspring could be produced. 

 

If indeed gammy was conceived from foreign eggs/sperm with a Thai surrogate, then what nationality is the child? This would surely affect here status for health care. 

[Zeegator]

This coming from a woman who was paid and is recieving 100,000s of thousands of baht in donations. Noone will help us my a---

Sent from my GT-S5310 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

 

She is not being paid the donations, they are being sent to a charity that will ensure that the money is used only for the benefit of the child.
 

[metisdead]

An inflammatory and provocative post has been removed as well as the replies.

[slipperylobster]

This strikes a personal note. If I would have walked out on my biological son at birth, he would have died a slow, painful death. He was born with Congenital Heart Disease with four defective functions in the heart, including a large hole. He was fixed up, and cared for...and his mom recently passed away. At the age of 15, he is now class president, and a good looking, healthy boy. (Philippines).

 

You don't just walk out on responsibilities. The baby has defects, and the possibility exists that they are genetic. Dad, and/or, mom are responsible. 

 

As an aside, birth defects could be caused by drug use during pregnancy, as well.  However, there is a possibility, because of the age of the biological mom, that it could be related to that. (Making babies for the mom over a certain age increases risks.. There are so many variables.... 

Edited August 4, 2014 by slipperylobster

[Zeegator]

 

There might be more to this story as I posted somewhere else on TV.

 

http://www.9news.com.au/world/2014/08/04/07/34/australian-couple-accused-of-abandoning-baby-gammy-deny-claims?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

The surrogate has now received nearly 6 million baht (200K AUD) and rising. 

 

The Australian couple have been identified, the father Caucasian and the mother Thai in their 50's.  They deny there was a twin but the surrogate says there was and she is receiving more money than she could ever earn.

 

The only way to see who is lying is to do DNA tests on the two kids.  If the surrogate is lying then she should be charged.

 

 

"The surrogate has now received nearly 6 million baht (200K AUD) and rising."   

 

No she hasn't, a charity is managing donations on her behalf ensuring that they are used only for the benefit of the disabled child.

 

[NongKhaiKid]

 

This coming from a woman who was paid and is recieving 100,000s of thousands of baht in donations. Noone will help us my a---

Sent from my GT-S5310 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

 

She is not being paid the donations, they are being sent to a charity that will ensure that the money is used only for the benefit of the child.
 

 

All you sure ALL money is going to a single charity that will account for all the cash and ensure it's spent correctly ?

[Zeegator]

 

 

This coming from a woman who was paid and is recieving 100,000s of thousands of baht in donations. Noone will help us my a---

Sent from my GT-S5310 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

 

She is not being paid the donations, they are being sent to a charity that will ensure that the money is used only for the benefit of the child.
 

 

All you sure ALL money is going to a single charity that will account for all the cash and ensure it's spent correctly ?

 

 

I'm sure it is, obviously because there is a Thai person involved you would not want that to be the case as that would mean you would be unable to Thai bash as usual.

 

[Levanter]

You don't just walk out on responsibilities. The baby has defects, and the possibility exists that they are genetic. Dad, and/or, mom are responsible. 

 

As an aside, birth defects could be caused by drug use during pregnancy, as well.  However, there is a possibility, because of the age of the biological mom, that it could be related to that. (Making babies for the mom over a certain age increases risks.. There are so many variables.... 

 

Indeed. Down syndrome is typically associated with increasing maternal age (increasing length of time that the egg has been in stasis), with risk increasing exponential after 35 or so. If an earlier post were true that the mother was in her 50's, the risk for Down syndrome must have been quite high (see the figure here).

 

The physician involved should have informed the biological parents, and an understanding between them and the surrogate mother should have been hammered out properly regarding what would happen in event of a fetus with birth defects. An event with such a known high risk for the biological mother should never have been left to chance.

[Krataiboy]

Pattaramon's mother, Pichaya Nathonchai, 53. . . 

 

Isn't 53 a little late in life to be any kind of mother? All parties concerned must have been pretty desperate.  Moralising apart, one cannot help but feel for the emotional hell they must all be going through. One can only hope little Gammy survives to receive all the love and joy he deserves.

[Camelot]

This whole tawdry affair smacks of human trafficking. The surrogacy enabled the Australian couple to "buy" a baby girl and whisk her off to another country. Isn't that the sort of thing that got Thailand into such trouble with the US and other western nations earlier this year, so much so that the country was downgraded and threatened with sanctions?

 

Our planet is sinking under the weight of 7 billion human beings, the vast majority in Asia. Why not adopt an already deserving child? To do otherwise is both selfish and irresponsible.

[Thai at Heart]

53 year old mother?

What is going on here?

[hellohello123]

This coming from a woman who was paid and is recieving 100,000s of thousands of baht in donations. Noone will help us my a---

Sent from my GT-S5310 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

 

Exactly!

 

it seems to thai people (and most asians) that credibility means nothing to them all for the sake of the almighty dollar (or baht in this case)

 

I wouldnt be surprised if so many people would be reading this thinking "ok, check, become a surrogate, check, get paid heaps, check, have a disabled baby, check, cry to the media about the poor baby, check, wait for more payments to come through, check, buy a house with the donations, check, pray to god the kid isnt adopted, check, cry for more donations, check!"

[thesetat2013]

This coming from a woman who was paid and is recieving 100,000s of thousands of baht in donations. Noone will help us my a---

Sent from my GT-S5310 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

 
She is not being paid the donations, they are being sent to a charity that will ensure that the money is used only for the benefit of the child.
 

Any twit knows you dont just walk into a agency and give your sperm to a woman and them you only pay when you get the baby. Firstly, she surely received a monthly stipend to ensure she ate healthy foods and took the right vitamins and for her regular checkups. Then, at time of birth the couple either would be in a hospital waiting the baby and bonus payment upon delivering the baby to the family. Also, i thought a condition of a surrogate was that the baby be taken from the mother immediately so there is NO bonding between the baby and the surrogate. So the hospital would havvle record of this.
So now this women has been paid monthly and received her bonus for delivery of the baby. If twins they would have known months ago.
She has now accumulated maybe millions of baht for support. And yet she is taking advantage of peoples ignorance by claiming noone will help her and she has gotten no money.
Think about it guys. You donate your sperm to be put in a woman. Are you going to trust some poor lady to eat correctly and take meds for healthy baby and see good doctors to confirm all for your baby? Something is wrong with all his woman quotes

Sent from my GT-S5310 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[iReason]

"I would like to tell Thai women, don't get into this business as a surrogate. Don't just think only about the money,"

 

Do as I say. Not as I do.

"If something goes wrong, no one will help us and the baby will be abandoned from society, then we have to take responsibility for that," the Thai mother said.

 

Yup.

 

"I am afraid of sinning," Pattaramon said."

 

Is it a sin to lie and break Thai Law?

 

[jpduggan]

    This story is boring me now. Woman has baby for Australian couple. Twins are born and they only take the healthy one naturally.Woman gets big money for having baby and even more now from donations. OK boring already.

     Why not put as much exposure into the story about the poor guy looking for his two daughters who have been kidnapped by their mother. Exposure might help him find his daughters. I wonder is it because the public prefer an Australian couple bashing story and a Thai money grabbing surrogate mothers story than a Thai mother kidnapper story.

[jpduggan]

    Is that Yingluck in the photo? I thought she was on holidays.

[billd766]

 

There might be more to this story as I posted somewhere else on TV.

 

http://www.9news.com.au/world/2014/08/04/07/34/australian-couple-accused-of-abandoning-baby-gammy-deny-claims?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

The surrogate has now received nearly 6 million baht (200K AUD) and rising. 

 

The Australian couple have been identified, the father Caucasian and the mother Thai in their 50's.  They deny there was a twin but the surrogate says there was and she is receiving more money than she could ever earn.

 

The only way to see who is lying is to do DNA tests on the two kids.  If the surrogate is lying then she should be charged.

 

 

And if she is telling the truth then what do YOU suggest. You always seem to think the worst about Thai people.

[Baerboxer]

 

I'm happy to read some of the comments here. This is being discussed in German papers as well and 90 percent of the comments are outright disgusting. In fact, not a few comments seem to suggest that euthanasia should be mandatory, and go as far as shaming parents who decided to carry a baby that had a disability diagnosed in utero.

Now I see these comments reflected in an international community. I'm happy because it's not just us Germans who are heartless, cruel and despicable creatures. It's everybody, and I suggest here that "everybody" is a male.

Who else would be so casually asking for an abortion?

Consider this:

Is abortion in Thailand legal for this case?
Is it always safe for the mother?
Can you abort only one of two twins?
How would an illegal abortion clinic deal with complications?
Should healthy baby girls be aborted if the contract stipulates "boy only"?
If the buyers change their minds (also death or divorce), should baby be aborted?
Why this hate for women?
Why this hate for Thais?
Why this hate for innocent life?

Humans are altruistic by nature, so you, sirs, are abominations.

 

Abortion is illegal but very common....almost openly promoted at some clinics

Made thousands of times per year...yes safe

Not sure if you can abort 1 safely, but you can abort both and start new

It is not about healthy baby girls, at 3 month it is about some clusters of cells not about babies.

 

It is pretty shocking to read something like that:
"They told me to have an abortion but I didn't agree because I am afraid of sinning," Pattaramon said, referring to her Buddhist beliefs."

 

There is no invisible friend who is judging you. But there is not this poor baby which will have a sad life. Specially think what happens if the mother dies.

Thinking for the living people and not about the phantasies of some lazy male monks. Punishment for sins anyway doesn't fit well with Buddhism, it is more a Christian concept.

 

 

Sometimes, I need to read posts like H90's to really appreciate the sacrifices so many made for freedom and humanity in two world wars.

 

Let's take all the charm and miracles of nature out of birth and reduce it to a production line with appropriate quality controls imposed by the state naturally. If you don't like the results of the tests abort and start again - right out the Mengele book of genetics.

 

Where do you get your "facts" from about abortions in Thailand? Which hospitals and clinics are openly promoting it?

 

Many millions of people have deeply held religious views - Buddhist, Christian, Hindu, Jew, Moslem, Shinto etc. That is up to them. Then we have the atheist who is just so sure they all are wrong he has to assert it. 

 

Many, many, people with physical and/or mental disabilities live wonderful satisfying lives and enrich the lives of their families. 

 

Sad life - look at your own and perhaps question the knowledge basis and balance of some of your views.

[Basil B]

Two points...

 

1. I was surprised to see downs syndrome in a child born of a 21 year old mother as this is a lot more common in older women, now we know the Biological mother is 50+...
2. Funds raised, I assume the money does not go direct to the mother, but is kept in trust for the the well being of Gammy, no doubt the actual terms of such a trust would normally have a lot a of conditions, and appointed trusties, one factor that has to be considered is if Gammy dies while there are monies still in trust I assume there are provisions to donate it to other good cause in line with the purpose for which the money was raised. 

Edited August 4, 2014 by Basil B

[billd766]

Pattaramon's mother, Pichaya Nathonchai, 53. . . 

 

Isn't 53 a little late in life to be any kind of mother? All parties concerned must have been pretty desperate.  Moralising apart, one cannot help but feel for the emotional hell they must all be going through. One can only hope little Gammy survives to receive all the love and joy he deserves.

 

As I read the story Pichaya Nathonchai, 53 is actually the mother of the surrogate mother and the grandmother of the baby boy  Gammy.

Edited August 4, 2014 by billd766

[chooka]

 

 

There might be more to this story as I posted somewhere else on TV.

 

http://www.9news.com.au/world/2014/08/04/07/34/australian-couple-accused-of-abandoning-baby-gammy-deny-claims?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

The surrogate has now received nearly 6 million baht (200K AUD) and rising. 

 

The Australian couple have been identified, the father Caucasian and the mother Thai in their 50's.  They deny there was a twin but the surrogate says there was and she is receiving more money than she could ever earn.

 

The only way to see who is lying is to do DNA tests on the two kids.  If the surrogate is lying then she should be charged.

 

 

And if she is telling the truth then what do YOU suggest. You always seem to think the worst about Thai people.

 

I definitely don't think the worse of her.  I actually believe that this Thai lady is honest.  Just because I say conduct a DNA why does that mean I am thinking the worst of people.  I am saying someone is lying, who I don't know and only suggested a DNA to totally clear up the matter.  At the moment I lean more towards the Aussies (of which I am one) being the lowlifes but if and a big "IF" the Thai is running a scam and I doubt it, then she should be charged.

Edited August 4, 2014 by chooka

[indothai]

I sure hope the funds raised will actually be given to the child and not the adults... that said... i'm pretty sure the majority of the funds will disappear.

 

I hope selfless-Thai individuals will come to the rescue of this child.

 

I'm not sure which hospital they went to get these proceedures, but no doubt, "speaking from experience", the doctors will inform the patients of potential and actual health problems.  In this case, it seams that the agency withheld the information from the surrogate.

 

Another reason why the "agency" would not tell the surrogate is that operating may increase the risk of loosing both children.  At which point, the parent's may have also colluded to withhold information from the surrogate.  Just thinking about the scenarios make me sick to the stomach. 

 

If this is actually a real "agency", they should be held accountable in Australia and Thailand, procescuted to the fullest extent of laws from both countries.

[orosee]

 

Pattaramon's mother, Pichaya Nathonchai, 53. . . 

 

Isn't 53 a little late in life to be any kind of mother? All parties concerned must have been pretty desperate.  Moralising apart, one cannot help but feel for the emotional hell they must all be going through. One can only hope little Gammy survives to receive all the love and joy he deserves.

 

As I read the story Pichaya Nathonchai, 53 is actually the mother of the surrogate mother and the grandmother of the baby boy  Gammy.

 

Thanks for clarifying this. I'm certain little Gammy will achieve higher reading & comprehension scores than a few of the commentators here. Not to mention a kinder and more considerate human being.

[orosee]

 

I'm happy to read some of the comments here. This is being discussed in German papers as well and 90 percent of the comments are outright disgusting. In fact, not a few comments seem to suggest that euthanasia should be mandatory, and go as far as shaming parents who decided to carry a baby that had a disability diagnosed in utero.

Now I see these comments reflected in an international community. I'm happy because it's not just us Germans who are heartless, cruel and despicable creatures. It's everybody, and I suggest here that "everybody" is a male.

Who else would be so casually asking for an abortion?

Consider this:

Is abortion in Thailand legal for this case?
Is it always safe for the mother?
Can you abort only one of two twins?
How would an illegal abortion clinic deal with complications?
Should healthy baby girls be aborted if the contract stipulates "boy only"?
If the buyers change their minds (also death or divorce), should baby be aborted?
Why this hate for women?
Why this hate for Thais?
Why this hate for innocent life?

Humans are altruistic by nature, so you, sirs, are abominations.

 

Abortion is illegal but very common....almost openly promoted at some clinics

Made thousands of times per year...yes safe

Not sure if you can abort 1 safely, but you can abort both and start new

It is not about healthy baby girls, at 3 month it is about some clusters of cells not about babies.

 

It is pretty shocking to read something like that:
"They told me to have an abortion but I didn't agree because I am afraid of sinning," Pattaramon said, referring to her Buddhist beliefs."

 

There is no invisible friend who is judging you. But there is not this poor baby which will have a sad life. Specially think what happens if the mother dies.

Thinking for the living people and not about the phantasies of some lazy male monks. Punishment for sins anyway doesn't fit well with Buddhism, it is more a Christian concept.

 

But it doesn't really matter whether there is "an invisible friend" or not. As a Buddhist, this concept doesn't even apply here for her. If anything then she's concerned about her next reincarnation status. Also I don't think that this woman has any concept of embryonic stages, in her mind after 3 months there was probably a fully formed child inside her. Anyway, what matters is what she believes, whether true or not.

 

(PS: My girlfriend had a miscarriage after 2-something months, I can assure you that there's more than just "a cluster of cells", even though at that stage there's nothing remotely human in it...)

[Thai at Heart]

Just on British radio, "family in Australia denies any knowledge that a twin was born". Family in Australia clamining they are very distressed at this story.

Lawyer on right now blaming lack of proper contract in Thailand. Edited August 4, 2014 by Thai at Heart

[Roadman]

The advice she should be giving is don't trust Thai's with money, and more so when you are an unequal lowly Thai woman and the money that those you trusted were going to get is suddenly put at risk. Thankfully another shocking thai unmanaged money making unethical practice that the Junta had jumped onto within a month of arse kicking the incompetent, lawless, corrupt excuse of governments out that allowed this sort of uncontrolled unethical practice to flourish. Currently there are now more than 200 Aussie couples alone who are now caught up in this mess with probably equally dodgy surrogate deals.

[NelsonHubbucks]

We in this forum should wait for the real truth 'FACT'S" to be published before making comments derogatory or otherwise against both parties involved. After reading three pages of "comments" it  is very obvious there are two many people jumping to a conclusion before the real truth is known.

[JoeLing]

Still don't quite understand, why would any woman
become a surrogate mother for a complete stranger,
if not for money?   

Just wonder, does anyone need a surrogate father?
Cheap, cheap, only want some 7/11 stamps for it  
 

Edited August 4, 2014 by JoeLing