Atheism - alive and well in Thailand?

[tingtongteesood]

I have been a devout practising aetheist, or rather anti theist for around 20 of my 34 years here so far. Never met up with other people about it though. Going to church to have that 'sense of community' is one of the myriad reasons man created ''god'' - I have no need for it or anything else that 'religion' brings with it....The truth can set you free people, open your eyes and see religion for the sham it is and everything becomes a lot clearer.

[AyG]

ironically Muslims, Christians and Jews all worship the same God.

Not really true. Living in polytheistic times, Mohammed chose a preexisting pagan moon god to be the god of the new, monotheistic religion he invented. He didn't chose the preexisting Jewish god, though he was perfectly happy to incorporate (badly distorted) Jewish history and beliefs into his new religion. Quite clearly the god of Moslems is different from that of the Judaeo-Christian tradition.

[nidieunimaitre]

ironically Muslims, Christians and Jews all worship the same God.

They're merely worshipping a concept, brainwashed by the dogma of their particular religion.

Christianity was started by a jewish cult leader, became the most successfull jewish sect ever, and at one point managed to blame the jews for killing the jewish founder. How Bizarre.

Hundreds of years later, Muslims dreamed up a sequel to this amazing story.

They all 3 share the same image of the devil, horns and goat legs, an image that originated in the lands of Tigris and Eufraat, presently known as Iraq / Isis.

[Emster23]

"Atheist is someone who doesn't believe in a God.

Agnostic is someone who "doesn't know" therefore isn't sure."

Ok, I got some stick for saying I am an agnostic atheist, so let me try to explain a bit. This is my view, and I'm sticking to it!

Atheist comes from A+theist, meaning "not" a "believer in god". Am I right so far? In my mind there is an implication there of belief and certainty that there is no god, which puts on same level as there is a god.

Agnostic means "not knowing". Seems a confirmed atheist is certain there is no god, but I am open to looking at evidence, which may make then go from "not knowing" to "knowing". So to semi sum up, I do not believe in god as I have seen no evidence, but I am willing to change IF there is. I do not see a conflict in using the words together. Or could coin a new word "agnostatheist" there you go!

[wilcopops]

"Atheist is someone who doesn't believe in a God.

Agnostic is someone who "doesn't know" therefore isn't sure."

Ok, I got some stick for saying I am an agnostic atheist, so let me try to explain a bit. This is my view, and I'm sticking to it!

Atheist comes from A+theist, meaning "not" a "believer in god". Am I right so far? In my mind there is an implication there of belief and certainty that there is no god, which puts on same level as there is a god.

Agnostic means "not knowing". Seems a confirmed atheist is certain there is no god, but I am open to looking at evidence, which may make then go from "not knowing" to "knowing". So to semi sum up, I do not believe in god as I have seen no evidence, but I am willing to change IF there is. I do not see a conflict in using the words together. Or could coin a new word "agnostatheist" there you go!

Not exactly - "meaning "not" a "believer in god" - it comes from the Greek "WITHOUT god" (the prefix "A" or "AB" tends to mean "without" or "away from" as in A-moral

Agnostic comes from "away from or with KNOWING" - "an agnostic is someone who neither believes nor disbelieves in the existence of a deity or deities"

So they are 2 different points of origin. and resulting meaning....BUT

​however language is determined by usage and no-one can deny that the usage of these words often overlaps these days.

[belg]

a lot seem to be in animalism ... they act like dog pack

[wilcopops]

a lot seem to be in animalism ... they act like dog pack

I take it you don't know what animism is then?

[pitrevie]

The fundamental difference between different religions and Buddism is that Buddism is not regarded as a religion, it is a philosofy.

But it still embraces a lot of magical thinking. That's just as bad in my opinion.

I think it was Krishnamurti who correctly said

' one only need look as far as Thailand ( he was in india) to see how far removed the teachings of Buhhda have become from their original meaning to that which suits others. Buhhdism in thailand barely resembles the trues teachings"

Most locals have trouble with this and do not feel comfortable being told that Buhhda apparently said " never bow to any image of me, or all my teachings are lost' ( yet, most of them will "wai" when they pass a statue). " never think that paying moneys or gifts can atone for a karmic debt' ( which is of course one of the major industry's here)

In Matthew just before the verses of the Lord's Prayer Jesus exorts his followers never to pray in public but always pray in private, however it does not deter those who want to see prayers said at every public forum just to show they are good Christians or as Christ described them, "hypocrites." Probably the most printed book of all time and also the most unread.

[wilcopops]

Well, no that's not true at all. I know plenty of muslims and none of them think or act that way. They're just normal folk- my best mate is a muslim and I'd struggle to name a smarter person I know, able to debate cheerfully and see both sides of the argument.

Dunno, maybe moslims are something different that I've never come across. Moslims who hate jews and catholics but hate intelligent people even more. Like intelligent people who spell good.

I would totally agree that on a whole Muslims are the one's who dislike atheists the most. I spend lot of time in middle-east.

Seems they take it very personally and would rather have a christian or even a Jew.

I would have a lot of trouble calling anyone smart who really believes totally in whatever religion they subscribe too.

Educated maybe-smart , no.

If for example a Muslim/Christian truly and utterly believes in what is written in the Qur'an/bible they cannot be called "smart'.

They have opted,usually because they have been brain washed at young age ( Muslims are very guilty of this) to suspend all forms of rational logic to belief in things we all know is absurdly wrong-and yet they cling to it.

Smart people do not cling like that.

They see the evidence and go where it leads. They do not cling using the weakest/lamest forms of excuses/logic/rational

They get angry quickly because that is all they can do.

As for locals, well, there is no religion here really,its a bare resemblance of what Buddhism is really all about.A philosophy that because a religion to suit the agenda of those who stil use it today to control the masses.

The virgin birth is the one that really throws me. How can anyone believe in that?

But I beg to differ that people that believe this nonsense are not smart. I know some brilliant people that swallow it all hook, line and sinker, and I am always amazed. But the answer is simple; these folks have been brainwashed at a young age, and most are simple incapable of throwing out that seed that has been planted so deep. Jerry Falwell once said, "Give me a child until he's seven years old, and I'll have him for life." Unfortunately, he's right. And of all the religions, who are more deeply brainwashed that the Muslims, who are forced to pray five times every day?

Virgin birth? - You obviously haven't been keeping up​ with the current surrogate mother scandal!

[Hermes100]

Atheists sometimes ike to meet not to convert anyone because that is not possible, but often more out of a keen interest to stop the dangers of faith-which you have perfectly demonstrated really do exist.

An anti-religion religion of sorts.

Each to their own, but why would you bother?

[csabo]

ironically Muslims, Christians and Jews all worship the same God.

They're merely worshipping a concept, brainwashed by the dogma of their particular religion.

Christianity was started by a jewish cult leader, became the most successfull jewish sect ever, and at one point managed to blame the jews for killing the jewish founder. How Bizarre.

Hundreds of years later, Muslims dreamed up a sequel to this amazing story.

They all 3 share the same image of the devil, horns and goat legs, an image that originated in the lands of Tigris and Eufraat, presently known as Iraq / Isis.

Actually the gospel or biblical books that chronicle the jewish cult leader you mention was a work of fiction created by the Flavian emperors of Rome. Knocking him down is the same as attacking the merits of Spiderman. Neither one existed so there is no point in critiquing them.

Edited August 16, 2014 by csabo

[DogNo1]

Ayg: You need to read The History of Buddhism in Vietnam. Buddhism entered Vietnam through at least two paths - from the Chinese in the north and from the Indians in the south. The concepts involved in Pure Land Buddhism didn't originate in Vietnam but were codified by one of the Nguyen kings and his minister of religion and Pure Land Buddhism was declared to be the national religion of Vietnam. During his reign a large number of temples were built throughout the country. Part of the king's purpose for doing this was to unify the country and put an end to the conflict between the many different sects of Buddhism in the country at the time.

Regarding Buddhism throughout the world, it has been adapted to fit each country's culture. I'm sure that there are variations in the type of Buddhism practiced by various Vietnamese. One of my best friends is a Vietnamese monk who has his own temple attended by hundreds weekly. I know that at his temple they believe in reincarnation and hence making merit. They also greet each other at the temple by saying A Yi Da Phat which translates into Merciful Buddha. It is a Vietnamese way of saying Amida Butsu (Japanese.) In their services, their chanting focuses on the nature of Buddha, the four noble truths, etc. They don't exactly believe that Buddha is a god but in Pure Land Buddhism, belief in Buddha is central, sort of similar to the belief of Hindus that Raja Yoga is the highest form of yoga since it emphasizes belief in Krishna. Krishna was also a product of virgin birth, by the way. Take a look at the book. It's quite lengthy but I think that you will enjoy it.

[Hermes100]

its not so much anti religion , but far more anti stupidity, lies, deceit, fairy tales,untruths, the promotion of racism,sexism,elitism-which is very self evident in every nation close by.

And why should I respect anyone who respects any God?.

God in the Abrahamic sense is a sexist, racist,genocide promoting,murderer ,torturer and a real sick fool when you think about it. So if you support God you also support that.Do you?

Religious people now often like to switch in cherry pick mode and whine ' well, that part of the holy book is what we believe ( love thy neighbour) , but not that part ( how to keep slaves, mark them , house them,etc)

Sorry, no can do. There is no sitting on the fence. If you choose not to believe/subscribe to, buy into one single part of your own holy book you are NOT one of them.But, you want what religion is really all about- your ego.

You want to feel special, loved, the feel good factor and you probably fear death too. So, its okay for you lot to cherry pick and forget your God is a cruel fool and still cling to that promise- pathetic excuses for human beings!

You/we are born because he ordains it,decides never to really show himself, then decides to torture you for all eternity if you decide not to accpet the drivel he spouts.

And I love that loop hole. You can be jack the ripper, but, hey, you can still be saved ! All one needs to do is accpet this drivel at the end and paradise awaits!

See, all those problems in the world?, war's,racism's,sexism, and specify here those young girls having to sell themselves on soi XYZ- this is a result of what blind faith gives one.

And people say we are weak- we do not need the backing of such a fool, we do not fear threats- you do.I

ts what rules over you.

[noahvail]

We are all atheists, for at least 99.9% of gods.

Some of us go one god further.

Hitchens, I think?

The actual quote is:

We are all atheists about most of the gods that humanity has ever believed in. Some of us just go one god further.

-Richard Dawkins

No, the actual Stephen F. Roberts' popular quotation is: "I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours."

Well done, I stand corrected. They are vaiations upon the same thing; sometimes the truncated versions can make the point more quickly. In reading it through several times, I feel the Roberts' statement makes the argument better.

[nithisa78]

I don't know of any in Thailand. However, the ones I know in the USA, it is just another faith or belief system. In my point of view. They are intelligent , tolerant and productive. God bless them.

[csabo]

its not so much anti religion , but far more anti stupidity, lies, deceit, fairy tales,untruths, the promotion of racism,sexism,elitism-which is very self evident in every nation close by.

And why should I respect anyone who respects any God?.

God in the Abrahamic sense is a sexist, racist,genocide promoting,murderer ,torturer and a real sick fool when you think about it. So if you support God you also support that.Do you?

Religious people now often like to switch in cherry pick mode and whine ' well, that part of the holy book is what we believe ( love thy neighbour) , but not that part ( how to keep slaves, mark them , house them,etc)

Sorry, no can do. There is no sitting on the fence. If you choose not to believe/subscribe to, buy into one single part of your own holy book you are NOT one of them.But, you want what religion is really all about- your ego.

You want to feel special, loved, the feel good factor and you probably fear death too. So, its okay for you lot to cherry pick and forget your God is a cruel fool and still cling to that promise- pathetic excuses for human beings!

You/we are born because he ordains it,decides never to really show himself, then decides to torture you for all eternity if you decide not to accpet the drivel he spouts.

And I love that loop hole. You can be jack the ripper, but, hey, you can still be saved ! All one needs to do is accpet this drivel at the end and paradise awaits!

See, all those problems in the world?, war's,racism's,sexism, and specify here those young girls having to sell themselves on soi XYZ- this is a result of what blind faith gives one.

And people say we are weak- we do not need the backing of such a fool, we do not fear threats- you do.I

ts what rules over you.

Your right about ego. Religion is merely used to fill gaps in the feeble minds of the masses who sadly cannot think for themselves or deal with unanswered questions or grief rationally. If I don't know what the sun and moon are they must be gods. If I don't know where the universe and I come from it must be god. If I feel bad that someone died, guess what, it's OK, god needed them for something more important. The weak and stupid must have answers and when they don't have one, they fill the gap with their catchall, god. The atheist asks the questions too but seeks the real answers to mysteries of the universe. I never said he has all the answers but at least he tries to find them instead of quitting easily like the feeble minded sheep who just follow blindly because their ego just can't handle it. It really speaks to the lack of advancement of the human mind. Even chimps are not stupid enough to believe in god but a so called superior human brain just cannot handle the truth and will bow down to a man in the sky.

[attrayant]

I don't know of any in Thailand. However, the ones I know in the USA, it is just another faith or belief system.

If atheism is a faith, then "off" is a TV channel.

Edited August 16, 2014 by attrayant

[tzar]

I respect those who say the truth " I believe ...there will be a place in heaven" is fine. I used to believe in father Christmas. Now I do not because we all know he does not exist.

We also all know that there is not a shred of real evidence of either God's ( all 2000 of them) nor heavens or hell's or vitually anything claimed by any of major relgions.

And yet, as adults we still seem to want to cling to these.

I think the word 'faith' ( accepting something without any evidence) very dangerous.

Would you book a hotel on faith?

Buy a car on faith?

Find the best doctor for your loved one on faith?

No, you would use a logic chain as you do in every other area of your life to decide.

It will be based upon rationality which would weed out who/what is viable.You would not hear '

I choose XXX just because it was written 2000 odd years ago in an old book which can be read 1001 ways, is devoid of substantial evidence, but I was told to just "have faith' so to hell with the logic I apply to everything else, i choose XXX anyway"

Religon exists because is appeals to ones ego ( you are special and loved), allays the fear of death and provides the 'feel good factor" .

Without that one could not expect to see something so utterly flawed still in existence.

A sad statement upon mankind.

Mr Hermes100.-

Statements beginning with 'we all know' encroach on the liberty, individuality,

and principles of people you know nothing about.

They also diminish your credibility.

May i suggest you be more genuine and a shred braver from now on by sticking

to the pronoun 'i' or 'myself' when giving an opinion.

In the second place, i must argue that while it is true that false religion does exist,

as you correctly point out, 'because it appeals to one's ego, allays the fear of death

& provides the "feel good" factor', true religion does the very opposite: it demands

you break away from your ego, it urges you to abide by a moral code (call of

conscience or whatever you wish to name it) with total disregard for feeling (and

indeed, more often than not, feeling and conscience do collide head on, yet true

Christianity bids you to follow the latter whatever your feelings), & it states in no

uncertain terms that should i fail to do so, death will be a pretty dreadful piece of

news for me, in fact, the worse possible news (and by this i don't mean the so-called

'hell', which is only a metaphorical term, but the actual end of my existence).

Finally, having been trained as an MD, i assure you that science operates exclusively

based on that which is observed.

Consequently, questions such as 'is there a God?', 'what was i born for?', 'what is

the purpose of the existence of the universe?' are NOT scientific questions at all.

A scientist may know all there is to know and yet he will remain utterly unable to

answer questions such as those.

A scientist's job is to try & explain that which he sees, not that which he does not

see.

And why should God be observable?

Listening to a song may tell you something about the composer ... yet the composer

is not the song itself, is not in the song either, but is the creator of the song.

Should you fancy meeting the composer, you'll have to find means other than merely

listening to the song he wrote or studying the song.

Should you wish to know whether or not there is God, the purpose for your existence,

the reasons for there being life on Earth and a universe round us, you'll have to look

for the answers in realms other than science.

Regards,

Tzar

[Mzungu]

It is good to see Atheism is alive and well in Thailand as it should be everywhere on the planet.

I have my doubts that Thais can openly embrace atheism since they have been brainwashed since birth. Almost the same as other religions. Not exactly sure how much can I say here without being bordered with legal issues.

Unlike Pakistan and similar countries where atheism is punishable by death, in Thailand what I understood showing disrespect to Buddhism is illegal.

An atheist can not and should not show respect to religion, any religion if he follows his ideas. So, how much an atheist can I be in Thailand?

[sandrabbit]

You can all make the claims God or no God but the thing that has frightened the shit out of me since I was able to think, below 10 yrs old, is why does any thing exist?. Please don't quote big bang or anything like that, that assumes there was mass before it was ejected. Where did the first hydrogen atom come from, in my opinion nothing should exist because something has to come from somewhere. Nothing should exist, where is the start point for anything - hydrogen has always existed?.

Some of you won't understand what I'm trying to say, it's not about belief but asking the question why does anything exist?.

[attrayant]

You're veering off into cosmology. While interesting, it's not really germane to a discussion about atheism in Thailand. Too bad we don't have a science forum here.

[sandrabbit]

It is good to see Atheism is alive and well in Thailand as it should be everywhere on the planet.

I have my doubts that Thais can openly embrace atheism since they have been brainwashed since birth. Almost the same as other religions. Not exactly sure how much can I say here without being bordered with legal issues.

Unlike Pakistan and similar countries where atheism is punishable by death, in Thailand what I understood showing disrespect to Buddhism is illegal.

An atheist can not and should not show respect to religion, any religion if he follows his ideas. So, how much an atheist can I be in Thailand?

absolute <deleted>, showing respect should by one of the highest goals of humane people, you might disagree with what they think and believe but you should still respect them. do you live in Thailand?. I am equal to every person on this planet, I am not better or lower than anyone. I might be better educated than most people in Thailand and I do criticize things in this country but I live here with my Thai wife and appreciate the life I have here, but I am equal ..........

be careful about standing on a pedestal and thinking you are above others, the world has a strange way of putting you on your arse.

[poweratradio]

Never really felt like atheism was the sort of thing where I'd want to meet up- for me it's not a belief in something, it's a lack of belief- like a default setting.

But yes, there are groups that meet up for this sort of thing. Next meeting is Aug 26th.

http://www.meetup.com/Bangkok-Skeptics-in-the-Pub/

I agree with your pessimism. What the heck do these groups do?? Bible bash each meeting which I dare say is a form of bible study and there surely is countless bible study groups around. Actually I would never call these agnostics and atheists as non-believers as they seem to be believing in the bible to bash it IE King James version has errors and Vatican is re-writing certains portions. New facts every day regarding creationism or darwinisms evolution. Lest we for get the martians ha ha ha.

Personally I keep the old time thinking of to never discuss religion or politics.

[sandrabbit]

You're veering off into cosmology. While interesting, it's not really germane to a discussion about atheism in Thailand. Too bad we don't have a science forum here.

sorry I disagree after seeing some of the comments of people posting on here I felt I had to post that because some of them really don't have a clue, I didn't make a post disparaging religion or atheism but many people have posted things which are personal to religious people and I wanted to make them think about their atheism and the reality of the science behind it.

[attrayant]

There is no science behind atheism. Atheism is simply a rejection of a belief in god(s).

[sandrabbit]

There is no science behind atheism. Atheism is simply a rejection of a belief in god(s).

correct and I wasn't trying to discredit what you posted, what I posted was for other people to think about.

[Hermes100]

It is good to see Atheism is alive and well in Thailand as it should be everywhere on the planet.

I have my doubts that Thais can openly embrace atheism since they have been brainwashed since birth. Almost the same as other religions. Not exactly sure how much can I say here without being bordered with legal issues.

Unlike Pakistan and similar countries where atheism is punishable by death, in Thailand what I understood showing disrespect to Buddhism is illegal.

An atheist can not and should not show respect to religion, any religion if he follows his ideas. So, how much an atheist can I be in Thailand?

absolute <deleted>, showing respect should by one of the highest goals of humane people, you might disagree with what they think and believe but you should still respect them. do you live in Thailand?. I am equal to every person on this planet, I am not better or lower than anyone. I might be better educated than most people in Thailand and I do criticize things in this country but I live here with my Thai wife and appreciate the life I have here, but I am equal ..........

be careful about standing on a pedestal and thinking you are above others, the world has a strange way of putting you on your arse.

[Christie Paul]

Atheism and Theism - different sides of the same crooked coin.

If you don't know, why take a position?

[Christie Paul]

It is good to see Atheism is alive and well in Thailand as it should be everywhere on the planet.

I have my doubts that Thais can openly embrace atheism since they have been brainwashed since birth. Almost the same as other religions. Not exactly sure how much can I say here without being bordered with legal issues.

Unlike Pakistan and similar countries where atheism is punishable by death, in Thailand what I understood showing disrespect to Buddhism is illegal.

An atheist can not and should not show respect to religion, any religion if he follows his ideas. So, how much an atheist can I be in Thailand?

I hope you're not in the habit of operating heavy equipment or having to make important decisions.

Being in conflict with reality is a dead end and leads to mental turbulence.

[Christie Paul]

I respect those who say the truth " I believe ...there will be a place in heaven" is fine. I used to believe in father Christmas. Now I do not because we all know he does not exist.

We also all know that there is not a shred of real evidence of either God's ( all 2000 of them) nor heavens or hell's or vitually anything claimed by any of major relgions.

And yet, as adults we still seem to want to cling to these.

I think the word 'faith' ( accepting something without any evidence) very dangerous.

Would you book a hotel on faith?

Buy a car on faith?

Find the best doctor for your loved one on faith?

No, you would use a logic chain as you do in every other area of your life to decide.

It will be based upon rationality which would weed out who/what is viable.You would not hear '

I choose XXX just because it was written 2000 odd years ago in an old book which can be read 1001 ways, is devoid of substantial evidence, but I was told to just "have faith' so to hell with the logic I apply to everything else, i choose XXX anyway"

Religon exists because is appeals to ones ego ( you are special and loved), allays the fear of death and provides the 'feel good factor" .

Without that one could not expect to see something so utterly flawed still in existence.

A sad statement upon mankind.

Mr Hermes100.-

Statements beginning with 'we all know' encroach on the liberty, individuality,

and principles of people you know nothing about.

They also diminish your credibility.

May i suggest you be more genuine and a shred braver from now on by sticking

to the pronoun 'i' or 'myself' when giving an opinion.

In the second place, i must argue that while it is true that false religion does exist,

as you correctly point out, 'because it appeals to one's ego, allays the fear of death

& provides the "feel good" factor', true religion does the very opposite: it demands

you break away from your ego, it urges you to abide by a moral code (call of

conscience or whatever you wish to name it) with total disregard for feeling (and

indeed, more often than not, feeling and conscience do collide head on, yet true

Christianity bids you to follow the latter whatever your feelings), & it states in no

uncertain terms that should i fail to do so, death will be a pretty dreadful piece of

news for me, in fact, the worse possible news (and by this i don't mean the so-called

'hell', which is only a metaphorical term, but the actual end of my existence).

Finally, having been trained as an MD, i assure you that science operates exclusively

based on that which is observed.

Consequently, questions such as 'is there a God?', 'what was i born for?', 'what is

the purpose of the existence of the universe?' are NOT scientific questions at all.

A scientist may know all there is to know and yet he will remain utterly unable to

answer questions such as those.

A scientist's job is to try & explain that which he sees, not that which he does not

see.

And why should God be observable?

Listening to a song may tell you something about the composer ... yet the composer

is not the song itself, is not in the song either, but is the creator of the song.

Should you fancy meeting the composer, you'll have to find means other than merely

listening to the song he wrote or studying the song.

Should you wish to know whether or not there is God, the purpose for your existence,

the reasons for there being life on Earth and a universe round us, you'll have to look

for the answers in realms other than science.

Regards,

Tzar

Don't expect intelligent answers from silly questions.