Thais and the culture of just dumping rubbish with no regards for others.

[farang000999]

take the express skytrain from airport and you will want to puke looking at all the garabge dumps around the city. where ever you see open lot - that means garbage dump. gross.

[cbluck58]

Until proper garbage management principals are taught from Primary school up, it is unlikely to change.

As with most things , education is a large part of the key....

Plastic Bags can easily be done away with in less than 3 months throughout the nation - Rwanda did it !

They just banned them and replaced them with paper ones, even exchanging visitors duty free shop plastic bags on arrival at the airport in Kigali.

Mind you they still sponsor cross border terrorism and state sponsored torture so probably not the best example , but they did get rid of plastic bag.....

[96tehtarp]

About 45 years ago there was a commercial on American Television. There would be an old Indian on a horse, and a car would drive by. The Indian looked very noble, but a tear would roll down his cheek as a bag of garbage was thrown out of the window of the car. That commercial, along with 500 dollar fines for littering, did wonders for the U.S. highway littering problem.

I was thinking...would this work on Thai Television? Just substitute a farang for the Indian. Not quite as noble, but the message may get across. Then again....Indians were the native people, whereas we are not.

This is what I mentioned in post #53. I remember that public service commercial well. It had me brainwashed not to litter before I was 6 years old. A Thai version of that commercial will only happen here when it is reinvented locally as a Thai idea by Thais.

[mutha289]

I lived in Okinawa twice (ten years apart), and prior to going there I had this image of the neat and immaculate Japanese living in harmony with each other and nature. The reality was far from that, I found that once outside their own home they seemed to care less where they tossed their garbage. As a result the streets were full of garbage and any beaches that did not belong to a hotel or some sort of resort were full of trash. In Korea I recall seeing a mother pull her toddler to the curb and drop his trousers as he needed to go #2, this in the middle of a fairly large city! The habit of tossing garbage where ever, is not just restricted to the LOS.

[balo]

Not even inside shopping malls you will find trash cans .

I always carry the garbage with me until I find a bag or something I can put it in outside in the soi , and hopefully it will be picked up by the garbage trucks.

Maybe they want to trash the sois down to keep rats and soidogs alive , who knows.

Edited August 19, 2014 by balo

[Maroon Watcher]

Education, education, education...

But when I was an intern - a stream outside the office factory window was dark orange.

And was it Michigan that had a flaming polluted lake...

[David48]

@ David48

No-one at the Farm dumps any rubbish.

They save what they can for re-cycling and then sell it.

As for general rubbish ... the Thai Family burn it.

All the Thais around here burn it.

We actually use the used toilet paper as the fire starter ... At the Farm, like most non-urban Thai Families, we can't flush toilet paper as it will overload the waste system. No Bum Guns here ... no reliable running water here to speak of.

I live in the reality that is Thailand. The Farm has many adults and many children living under the one roof or in adjacent housing.

As a Westerner, have you ever tried to change a Thai persons mind about a fundamental practice?


Do I try and do my bit ... sure.

I've bought the washable Modern Cloth Nappies which are used most of the time so the boys, MissFarmGirl, and myself are doing what we can to reduce the overall rubbish load.


It is what it is.

Do I like it ... No

Can I change it .. No


Pollution is like corruption ... when the Thais want to change their attitude, then things will change.
.

@ cornishcarlos

You have a defeatist attitude if you think you can't or aren't changing things.

Like I said, you start with your family and it expands from there.

Thailand is catching up, slowly, but it is...

@ David48

cornishcarlos ... I'm going to have to call you on this. Absolute Bullshit.

You almost paint me as an environmental vandal because I don't start a one man crusade to change the Thai attitude to that we have currently in the West.

As for "defeatist attitude" ... more like realist attitude.

So, before you go casting dispensations around like confetti ... please list how you personally, cornishcarlos have gone about educating the Thai population at large the evils of discarded rubbish.

What results have you had from these actions?

I do what I can to not to add to the Rubbish heap. Influence those who I can in my immediate sphere.


When the Thais want to change their attitude, then things will change.

I'm smart enough to know when I'm pissing into the wind.

@ cornishcarlos

Call bullshit all you like my friend, but you keep repeating that you can't change anything..!!

Are you raising a family or not..? Do you not have influence over your children's attitudes to the environment ?
Unless I am missing something here, the fact that we are in Thailand is irrelevant to how you raise your kids..!!

As for me, I don't educate the Thai population at large (that is for the government to do) but I try to have some positive affect on my local area. In this respect, my wife runs a school at our place and we are very pro active in educating about garbage and recycling etc. The kids also get the message quickly if they start littering in our area.

If you say that the Thais will only change when they want, that is defeatist. Things don't happen over night but it's going in the right direction. Quite a lot of Thais are wanting change already.

You really over reacted on this one my friend, just pointing out that we can all do something if we want.

@ David48

Mate, I rarely get into these slugging matches, but, on this instance, I'm happy to slug this one out with you. Why ... because I don't appreciate the mud you have thrown and are yet to apologise.

In every comment I have said that I do what I can with my immediate Thai Family.

You keep saying ... "but you keep repeating that you can't change anything" ... no ... I keep saying that I can't change the Thais attitude. My immediate Family does what it can already.

I have stated that the Farm recycles, we use a washable cloth nappy, where we can, we avoid the use of plastic bags.

Is that enough for you ... NO

Every time you drag out that classic pearl ... "You have a defeatist attitude" ... BULLSHIT

Thailand doesn't need the Farang equivalent of Don Quixote. Maybe that's you ... you can lead the good fight, right the wrongs you see in the Kingdom.

You say that ... "just pointing out that we can all do something if we want". Well, I asked you what personally you have done. You've stated what your wife, as a (presumably) Thai Teacher does, and for that she should be commended ... ... but that's your Wife.

You still haven't replied to the question ... What does cornishcarlos do? I would surmise SFA ... but happy to tell us to do as he says ... not as he does.

How will social change happen in Thailand?

It comes from the grass roots, from the Thais. Remember when the son of the Red Bull guy killed the Policeman? The social outcry from that was encouraging ... it was a start.

We are witnessing change now on an unprecedented scale in Thailand from the military management of Thailand.

So ... how about this result?

We will continue to re-use the nappies today and not the disposable ones ... we are doing out bit not to increase the garbage pile.

So armed with these words ringing in your head "we can all do something if we want" ... how about cornishcarlos ventures off his armchair and goes into the village/city and when he sees a Thai person dropping litter in the street, pick it up, put it back in the offenders hand and then give that person a lesson as to why that was a bad thing to do.

I maintain that when the Thais want to change their attitude, then things will change ... not when a Westerner tells them to. If that's defeatist in your eyes, then so be it.

.

[jacko45k]

I still don't fly tip, but I am not as ant-littering as I used to be. What is the point when the people of the country, who are forever telling us how much they love their country, have so little apparent respect for it.

I live near the sea so that is another dumping ground for them.

My pet hate is to see rubbish falling out of a vehicles windows when they park up, normally in-front of a 7-11, (where they should not park of course) and they throw it to the ground despite there being a trash can nearby, and another goes inside to get more trash!

Rant over.

[AYJAYDEE]

I still don't fly tip, but I am not as ant-littering as I used to be. What is the point when the people of the country, who are forever telling us how much they love their country, have so little apparent respect for it.

I live near the sea so that is another dumping ground for them.

My pet hate is to see rubbish falling out of a vehicles windows when they park up, normally in-front of a 7-11, (where they should not park of course) and they throw it to the ground despite there being a trash can nearby, and another goes inside to get more trash!

Rant over.

to set an example of course

[cornishcarlos]

David...

You tend to shout a lot, but I guess you can get away with it as 'poster of the year'...

Looks like me stating that you can change things has really rattled your cage. Well, now it will always be in your mind so that can only be good for the world.

As for me, read my post again. My wife 'runs' the school but 'we' educate the children. This involves regular field trips for beach clean ups and local picnic area clean ups, generally on public holidays so more people can see the results.

It's only a small thing but it's affecting lots of minds. I never claimed to be cleaning up Thailand, you are the one who has got all fired up

P.S I don't have an armchair...

[slipperylobster]

I was watching a documentary about how all this rubbish is collecting in the seas 1000s of miles away so this doesn't just affect Thailand but the rest of the world.

"...all this rubbish is collecting in the seas 1000s of miles away ..."

Yes, that's right. All the world's pollution originates here in Thailand. Well spotted.

And some people think there's never any original well thought out, analytically-inspired messages posted here at the hub of "duh." I guess this proves them wrong.

And apparently we should blame Thais and their culture because the number of Brits shooting blanks is related to rubbish-filled waterways in the UK because Thai culture makes people throw litter in the canals of Bangkok and no where else on the planet.

New research strengthens the link between water pollution and rising male fertility problems. The study, by Brunel University, the Universities of Exeter and Reading and the Centre for Ecology & Hydrology, shows for the first time how a group of testosterone-blocking chemicals is finding its way into UK rivers, affecting wildlife and potentially humans

.

I think it's now safe to assume all the world's problems originate in and/or are exclusively to be found in Thailand. Case closed.

Isn't that a tin of (obviously Thai) mushy peas floating lower center?

I never said anything about Thais being the only people in the world that dump rubbish in canals,

But this is Thailand and this is a Forum where they require you to post Topics related to Thailand.

Also in England and other western countries it only the minority that would act in this manner.

Its common here in Bangkok for the majority of people living along the canel to dump rubbish in the canal. So this is what this topic is about,

What are you talking about???

Off Topic post removed

Mushy peas deserve no better...

[Bernard Flint]

David...

You tend to shout a lot, but I guess you can get away with it as 'poster of the year'...

Looks like me stating that you can change things has really rattled your cage. Well, now it will always be in your mind so that can only be good for the world.

As for me, read my post again. My wife 'runs' the school but 'we' educate the children. This involves regular field trips for beach clean ups and local picnic area clean ups, generally on public holidays so more people can see the results.

It's only a small thing but it's affecting lots of minds. I never claimed to be cleaning up Thailand, you are the one who has got all fired up

P.S I don't have an armchair...

Forget the post, can i have that cornish pasty please

[moojar]

I agree, but be careful!

I once posted a thread about Thais use and abuse of plastic bags ( one for each item and drop it on the ground outside the store).

A very upset Thai responded to my thread and said that " If farangs did not invent plastic bags and make them available to Thais, there would be no problem.......It is all the farang's fault!"

Funny that, my wife says much the same thing about the very public Thailand sex industry - it's all the farang's fault. My standard response of "but it doesn't happen in Malaysia" is never well received.

[Fookhaht]

As far as I can tell, it's the reason they put back doors in Thai houses.

My neighbors all have trash cans out front. 20 baht per month. The dogs never tip them over like back home. But you can hear the snarling and fighting all night long behind people's houses.

My Thai neighbors also have trash cans in front. But they dump their trash right NEXT to the trashcan. Too exhausting to open the lid!

Of course, the dogs go at it at night and you can imagine the mess in the morning, which doesn't get picked up.

[Keesters]

Not that I would ever think of saying anything or getting involved in any way, I just have to say "Mai Phen Rai"

Of course you can say something, of course you can get involved. Never ever say Mai Phen Rai.

Just telling one person a day not to trash when you see them do it all counts. It maybe will make that person think twice before doing it again. People who trash know it is wrong but do it because nobody says anything. Start to say something and see the "loss of face". You maybe a Farang but you live here too. It may be your 'adopted' country but that doesn't mean you can't love it and want it to be kept clean.

[Keesters]

Not even inside shopping malls you will find trash cans .

Most of the shopping mall trash cans were done away with some years ago when it was feared, perhaps happened, that they could be used as containers for bombs. But if you look around you'll quickly find a cleaning lady that is happy to let you place your trash in her wheelie cart/bin, especially if it is recyclable like a drink can or bottle.

[96tehtarp]

Not that I would ever think of saying anything or getting involved in any way, I just have to say "Mai Phen Rai"

Of course you can say something, of course you can get involved. Never ever say Mai Phen Rai.

Just telling one person a day not to trash when you see them do it all counts. It maybe will make that person think twice before doing it again. People who trash know it is wrong but do it because nobody says anything. Start to say something and see the "loss of face". You maybe a Farang but you live here too. It may be your 'adopted' country but that doesn't mean you can't love it and want it to be kept clean.

I do my part to correct this littering. Everyday I buy something several times at various small shops, food, coffee, snacks, Pepsi, and other confections. The Thai people who run the shops all rush to put everything in a plastic bag which I nearly always refuse. They think I am nuts.

If I try to explain that in other countries in the outside-world we do not litter they look at me as if I am some sort of white ghost faced Alien creature from another planet. They politely explain that I am farang, this is Thailand "No same country you"! This always ends with a generous round of smiles all around.

[jacko45k]

I still don't fly tip, but I am not as ant-littering as I used to be. What is the point when the people of the country, who are forever telling us how much they love their country, have so little apparent respect for it.

I live near the sea so that is another dumping ground for them.

My pet hate is to see rubbish falling out of a vehicles windows when they park up, normally in-front of a 7-11, (where they should not park of course) and they throw it to the ground despite there being a trash can nearby, and another goes inside to get more trash!

Rant over.

to set an example of course

It is hard to set an example by not doing something though isn't it.

Oh look at that farang not dumping rubbish and not smoking!

Setting an example might be by clearing the rubbish up. There is a guy does that but there is always plenty more for him next time.

Shaming them into better behaviour maybe... there is an idea, berate a dumper in Thai and cause him to lose face, then I would be littering the area with my own blood and TV would be saying I brought it upon myself!

Edited August 20, 2014 by jacko45k

[David48]

David...

You tend to shout a lot, but I guess you can get away with it as 'poster of the year'...

Looks like me stating that you can change things has really rattled your cage. Well, now it will always be in your mind so that can only be good for the world.

As for me, read my post again. My wife 'runs' the school but 'we' educate the children. This involves regular field trips for beach clean ups and local picnic area clean ups, generally on public holidays so more people can see the results.

It's only a small thing but it's affecting lots of minds. I never claimed to be cleaning up Thailand, you are the one who has got all fired up

P.S I don't have an armchair...

Mate, that 'poster of the year' is a cheap shot ... I've never mentioned once an any of my postings.

Plus, I'm not shouting, but I am trying to clarify the points where we disagree.

And you are correct ... I did read your post incorrectly, and I apologise for that.

I presumed that your wife was a teacher .. but a re-reading now tells me that you run a school from your Home?

How on Earth does that work?

Are we talking a 5/6 day a week, 9-3 Government approved School?

Forget the Garbage debate ... tell us about the School ... this is much more interesting ...

.

[AYJAYDEE]

I still don't fly tip, but I am not as ant-littering as I used to be. What is the point when the people of the country, who are forever telling us how much they love their country, have so little apparent respect for it.

I live near the sea so that is another dumping ground for them.

My pet hate is to see rubbish falling out of a vehicles windows when they park up, normally in-front of a 7-11, (where they should not park of course) and they throw it to the ground despite there being a trash can nearby, and another goes inside to get more trash!

Rant over.

to set an example of course

It is hard to set an example by not doing something though isn't it.

Oh look at that farang not dumping rubbish and not smoking!

Setting an example might be by clearing the rubbish up. There is a guy does that but there is always plenty more for him next time.

Shaming them into better behaviour maybe... there is an idea, berate a dumper in Thai and cause him to lose face, then I would be littering the area with my own blood and TV would be saying I brought it upon myself!

we did it with our family and it gradually spread thru the most of the village

[Maroon Watcher]

This is the second time I have stated on Tv - YOU can make a difference

Even with words (said in the right way)

You are a ferang here but not in th world.

But OMG! Thailand is part of the real world too and should get used to that idea!

If YOU sit on your arse and say nothing YOU are just as guilty as knife wielding cowards...

NAME and SHAME

And to repeat myself again - there is no social Education here.

YOU can make a difference - keep smiling but keep trying...

It is what it is.

Do I like it ... No

Can I change it .. No

Move on ... nothing to see here ...

[iancnx]

As far as the Garbage goes, thank goodness I don't live on a poorly maintained gated moobahn. I understand some experiences are from hell!

[jacko45k]

I still don't fly tip, but I am not as ant-littering as I used to be. What is the point when the people of the country, who are forever telling us how much they love their country, have so little apparent respect for it.

I live near the sea so that is another dumping ground for them.

My pet hate is to see rubbish falling out of a vehicles windows when they park up, normally in-front of a 7-11, (where they should not park of course) and they throw it to the ground despite there being a trash can nearby, and another goes inside to get more trash!

Rant over.

to set an example of course

It is hard to set an example by not doing something though isn't it.

Oh look at that farang not dumping rubbish and not smoking!

Setting an example might be by clearing the rubbish up. There is a guy does that but there is always plenty more for him next time.

Shaming them into better behaviour maybe... there is an idea, berate a dumper in Thai and cause him to lose face, then I would be littering the area with my own blood and TV would be saying I brought it upon myself!

we did it with our family and it gradually spread thru the most of the village

Well done.... I have changed the attitude of my Mrs somewhat but it is like pushing custard up a hill.

[cornishcarlos]

David...

You tend to shout a lot, but I guess you can get away with it as 'poster of the year'...

Looks like me stating that you can change things has really rattled your cage. Well, now it will always be in your mind so that can only be good for the world.

As for me, read my post again. My wife 'runs' the school but 'we' educate the children. This involves regular field trips for beach clean ups and local picnic area clean ups, generally on public holidays so more people can see the results.

It's only a small thing but it's affecting lots of minds. I never claimed to be cleaning up Thailand, you are the one who has got all fired up

P.S I don't have an armchair...

Mate, that 'poster of the year' is a cheap shot ... I've never mentioned once an any of my postings.

Plus, I'm not shouting, but I am trying to clarify the points where we disagree.

And you are correct ... I did read your post incorrectly, and I apologise for that.

I presumed that your wife was a teacher .. but a re-reading now tells me that you run a school from your Home?

How on Earth does that work?

Are we talking a 5/6 day a week, 9-3 Government approved School?

Forget the Garbage debate ... tell us about the School ... this is much more interesting ...

.

No I'm not telling you about the school

I also apologies for the cheap shot, just made me giggle...

I wasn't slinging mud at you David, I was just suggesting that you particularly are in an enviable position. Parent of 2 half Thai children puts you in a perfect position to improve our environment. Not just your farm but the attitudes of people in your village too.

Your original reply to the OP just came across as defeatist, you had not elaborated at all yet

P.S a large % of Thai people recycle, though sadly not because of any concern for their surroundings but because they can make a few baht from it.

[Cpkt8]

The police are only visible where foreigners will be at, as that's the sign of $$$. The police know they can't get much from locals.

[Maroon Watcher]

How about a BRING back the BIN campaign...

Even the City of Boston (US) has Litter bins...

"Quality" tourism needs litter free streets...

(There are some camaign in schools for litter cleaning - education, education, ed U....)

[AYJAYDEE]

How about a BRING back the BIN campaign...

Even the City of Boston (US) has Litter bins...

"Quality" tourism needs litter free streets...

(There are some camaign in schools for litter cleaning - education, education, ed U....)

those bins are very desirable and would be liberated pretty quick

[AYJAYDEE]

Well done.... I have changed the attitude of my Mrs somewhat but it is like pushing custard up a hill.

mine lives in the west part time and learned the value of it

[mike324]

I've even seen young folks throw trash on bts platforms in bangkok while they walk around with no shame, apparently education is not getting any better. They should start charging 3-4 baht for the use of plastic bags like many developed asian countries.

[AYJAYDEE]

I've even seen young folks throw trash on bts platforms in bangkok while they walk around with no shame, apparently education is not getting any better. They should start charging 3-4 baht for the use of plastic bags like many developed asian countries.

when I was young, I did exactly the same thing. but it slowly changed in the west and it will in thailand too