Govt's Bt1,000 per rai scheme met with doubt

[webfact]

Govt's Bt1,000 per rai scheme met with doubt
The Nation

BANGKOK: -- A government measure to pay a maximum of Bt15,000 each to 1.8 million families in rural areas as part of an economic stimulus package was met with doubt and scepticism by some farmers and politicians yesterday.

They said that paying Bt1,000 per rai, for up to 15 rai, to rice farmers was not enough to improve their standard of living.

Pathum Thani farmer Somchok Pananil, 53, said he was unsure how this measure would help rice farmers, adding that only some families would benefit.

As for landless farmers, he pointed out that they usually had to rent land at Bt1,000 per rai for farming. He went on to say that the government should first clarify exactly who would benefit from this stimulus - land owners or poor farmers who rent land.

He said that if the government really wanted to help rice farmers, then they should control the rising price of fertiliser and pesticide.

Kanchanaburi farmer Pratin Onnom, 42, also did not think the proposed payment of Bt1,000 per rai would be enough, adding that the government could ensure there was water for irrigation instead.

Meanwhile, Pheu Thai member Pichai Naripthaphan said yesterday Bt1,000 per rai was "too little" compared to the price of rice. To help farmers, the price of rice should be raised to Bt10,000 per tonne.

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/politics/Govts-Bt1000-per-rai-scheme-met-with-doubt-30244674.html


-- The Nation 2014-10-03

[The stuttering parrot]

That comment is exactly why the Bangkok elite yellows will never win an election!

[halloween]

That comment is exactly why the Bangkok elite yellows will never win an election!

Economic rationalism is so distasteful for those who can't understand it.

How about we have a payment to everybody who declares he is a rice farmer, whether he actually grows any or not, equal to the minimum wage? I'm sure anybody that doesn't want to work would vote for it, and the party proposing it would win an election, and that would be democratic. Right?

[whybother]

That comment is exactly why the Bangkok elite yellows will never win an election!

The elites won't win an election because of a comment by a troll???

Maybe the problem is how gullible some people are?

[noitom]

Populist programs are back in Thailand.

[rickirs]

If the government is going to consider a subsidy, it should go all the way by paying rice farmers NOT TO GROW RICE. Then there are no issues with the cost to grow rice nor the market price and farmers can sustain themselves. This program would create by reduction of rice stocks pressure on the international market and eventually drive prices up.

[seajae]

some people will never be happy no matter what they are given/offered. The farmers do need help but not given money willy nilly , they need to improve what the do with the land and change the way they go about it, just giving them money isnt the answer as most will probably be p*ssed up against a wall in the end. Education is the answer, changes to their farming practices and what they grow. The sarcastic comments dont help either, Thailand needs farmers but they need them to grow "smart" not their current methods, the hi-so's/yellows in Bangkok also need to pull in their heads just as much as the reds do/have, the country needs to work together if it wants to improve and put aside their petty bickering.

[SoFarAndNear]

I think this country is too expenisive for rice farmers. They should been teached to farm something else.

[Chris Lawrence]

'Currently, 72 % of Thailand's general public expenditures are being spent in Bangkok, which is home to 17% of the country’s population and produces 26% of the GDP. In contrast, the Northeast, which holds 34 % of the country's population, receives 6% of the expenditures.' http://www.worldbank.org/en/news/feature/2012/05/10/thailand-public-finance-management-review-report

'Thailand’s Paddy Pledging Program also affected economic outcomes in 2013. While the program has helped raise incomes of participating farmers, it has been very expensive. The Program is estimated to cost the Government around Bt200 billion or almost 2% of GDP each harvest year since 2012. Many countries, including the EU, that have implemented large agricultural subsidy programs have found them to be costly and that they have reduced competitiveness of the agricultural sector, while the most successful programs that supported and strengthened the agricultural sector had focused on raising agricultural productivity and helping the poor.'http://www.worldbank.org/en/country/thailand/publication/thailand-economic-monitor-february-2014

At the end of the day, the Farmers are looking for some type of protection. Rice schemes have been around for a long time in one form or another. Maybe they can cut down on the 72% spent on Bangkok and provide a better social reforn package to the Farmers?

[Bob12345]

And the rice farmers growing just enough for their families might get smart, get a real job and buy their rice at the market. And still have money in their pocket for other things. Instead of expecting others to subsidise them.

Its kind of sad to see your train of thought...

Do you really think that there are so many jobs available in Thailand?

And do you really think that employers do not require some sort of education before hiring someone?

And do you really think that farming rice is not a "real job"?

[taff33]

I would like to thank all of Bangkokian tax payers,for the Bt10,000 that my wife will receive off the Thai government for her ten rai of rice land again I thank you from the bottom of my heart.

[Thai at Heart]

'Currently, 72 % of Thailand's general public expenditures are being spent in Bangkok, which is home to 17% of the countrys population and produces 26% of the GDP. In contrast, the Northeast, which holds 34 % of the country's population, receives 6% of the expenditures.' http://www.worldbank.org/en/news/feature/2012/05/10/thailand-public-finance-management-review-report

'Thailands Paddy Pledging Program also affected economic outcomes in 2013. While the program has helped raise incomes of participating farmers, it has been very expensive. The Program is estimated to cost the Government around Bt200 billion or almost 2% of GDP each harvest year since 2012. Many countries, including the EU, that have implemented large agricultural subsidy programs have found them to be costly and that they have reduced competitiveness of the agricultural sector, while the most successful programs that supported and strengthened the agricultural sector had focused on raising agricultural productivity and helping the poor.'http://www.worldbank.org/en/country/thailand/publication/thailand-economic-monitor-february-2014

At the end of the day, the Farmers are looking for some type of protection. Rice schemes have been around for a long time in one form or another. Maybe they can cut down on the 72% spent on Bangkok and provide a better social reforn package to the Farmers?

Exactly. The spread of money around the country is all wrong and the benefits for three rice business extend to the middle men, exporters and millers.

As I said up top, I still fail to see who exactly gains from producing any rice beyond what Thailand needs domestically.

Unless the farmers make a good living at it, switch to something else.

[halloween]

And the rice farmers growing just enough for their families might get smart, get a real job and buy their rice at the market. And still have money in their pocket for other things. Instead of expecting others to subsidise them.

Its kind of sad to see your train of thought...

Do you really think that there are so many jobs available in Thailand?

And do you really think that employers do not require some sort of education before hiring someone?

And do you really think that farming rice is not a "real job"?

It's even sadder to see your lack of thought.

Yes there are millions of jobs being given to imported labour from neighbouring countries.

Are Thais not as educated as those imported labourers? at least they speak the language.

Its an occupation.that takes quite a bit of time and effort for very little return due to inefficiency and the low value of the crop. A real job earns you enough money to live on.

[metisdead]

Inflammatory posts and replies have been removed.

A trolling nonsens post has been removed as well as the replies.

[naboo]

'Currently, 72 % of Thailand's general public expenditures are being spent in Bangkok, which is home to 17% of the countrys population and produces 26% of the GDP. In contrast, the Northeast, which holds 34 % of the country's population, receives 6% of the expenditures.' http://www.worldbank.org/en/news/feature/2012/05/10/thailand-public-finance-management-review-report

'Thailands Paddy Pledging Program also affected economic outcomes in 2013. While the program has helped raise incomes of participating farmers, it has been very expensive. The Program is estimated to cost the Government around Bt200 billion or almost 2% of GDP each harvest year since 2012. Many countries, including the EU, that have implemented large agricultural subsidy programs have found them to be costly and that they have reduced competitiveness of the agricultural sector, while the most successful programs that supported and strengthened the agricultural sector had focused on raising agricultural productivity and helping the poor.'http://www.worldbank.org/en/country/thailand/publication/thailand-economic-monitor-february-2014

At the end of the day, the Farmers are looking for some type of protection. Rice schemes have been around for a long time in one form or another. Maybe they can cut down on the 72% spent on Bangkok and provide a better social reforn package to the Farmers?

Don't you just hate it when facts destroy the argument of the vocal minority?

And whoever that Suriya is, I hope the rice farmers come together and refuse to produce more than their families need, and let you starve as you realise you know nothing about farming.

[Thai at Heart]

And the rice farmers growing just enough for their families might get smart, get a real job and buy their rice at the market. And still have money in their pocket for other things. Instead of expecting others to subsidise them.

Its kind of sad to see your train of thought...

Do you really think that there are so many jobs available in Thailand?

And do you really think that employers do not require some sort of education before hiring someone?

And do you really think that farming rice is not a "real job"?

There are hundreds of thousands of jobs being filled by imported labour at less than or equal to minimum wage.

The poor of Thailand have been undercut out of work and are then being forced to grow rice to export at no benefit to themselves.

Do u see a problem with this.

[Bob12345]

And the rice farmers growing just enough for their families might get smart, get a real job and buy their rice at the market. And still have money in their pocket for other things. Instead of expecting others to subsidise them.

Its kind of sad to see your train of thought...

Do you really think that there are so many jobs available in Thailand?

And do you really think that employers do not require some sort of education before hiring someone?

And do you really think that farming rice is not a "real job"?

It's even sadder to see your lack of thought.

Yes there are millions of jobs being given to imported labour from neighbouring countries.

Are Thais not as educated as those imported labourers? at least they speak the language.

Its an occupation.that takes quite a bit of time and effort for very little return due to inefficiency and the low value of the crop. A real job earns you enough money to live on.

Very valid points, i agree with you there.

It would help a lot, in my opinion, if you would try to give your complete reasoning in your first post instead of saying that they need to get "a real job" which sounds horribly arrogant.

[rubl]

If the government is going to consider a subsidy, it should go all the way by paying rice farmers NOT TO GROW RICE. Then there are no issues with the cost to grow rice nor the market price and farmers can sustain themselves. This program would create by reduction of rice stocks pressure on the international market and eventually drive prices up.

If only we had the money ...

2014-09-21

"Much of the blame for the nation's deteriorating fiscal health should be placed on the previous government of Yingluck Shinawatra, who engaged in a spending spree to finance a raft of measures to please voters. These actions included corporate tax cuts, purchases of rice from farmers at high prices and massive tax breaks for consumers buying automobiles and houses. The military government has ruled out any such giveaway of taxpayer money, but it has no choice but to increase public investment to restart the foundering economy."

http://asia.nikkei.com/Politics-Economy/Economy/Thai-military-junta-pushes-tax-hikes

[rubl]

And the rice farmers growing just enough for their families might get smart, get a real job and buy their rice at the market. And still have money in their pocket for other things. Instead of expecting others to subsidise them.

Its kind of sad to see your train of thought...

Do you really think that there are so many jobs available in Thailand?

And do you really think that employers do not require some sort of education before hiring someone?

And do you really think that farming rice is not a "real job"?

There are hundreds of thousands of jobs being filled by imported labour at less than or equal to minimum wage.

The poor of Thailand have been undercut out of work and are then being forced to grow rice to export at no benefit to themselves.

Do u see a problem with this.

One of our Thai posters tried to explain to me that all Thai companies pay minimum wage by law and many even more than required.

So I guess the solution you seem to incicate is to expel all the imported labour and give their jobs to Thai.

PS isn't that what some accused the NCPO of with the flight of the Cambodians ?

[kimamey]

And the rice farmers growing just enough for their families might get smart, get a real job and buy their rice at the market. And still have money in their pocket for other things. Instead of expecting others to subsidise them.

Its kind of sad to see your train of thought...

Do you really think that there are so many jobs available in Thailand?

And do you really think that employers do not require some sort of education before hiring someone?

And do you really think that farming rice is not a "real job"?

There are hundreds of thousands of jobs being filled by imported labour at less than or equal to minimum wage.

The poor of Thailand have been undercut out of work and are then being forced to grow rice to export at no benefit to themselves.

Do u see a problem with this.

One of our Thai posters tried to explain to me that all Thai companies pay minimum wage by law and many even more than required.

So I guess the solution you seem to incicate is to expel all the imported labour and give their jobs to Thai.

PS isn't that what some accused the NCPO of with the flight of the Cambodians ?

Isn't a better option to have a real minimum wage (preferably based on hours rather than a day) and make it apply to everyone. that way imigrants could still get a job but not by undercutting Thais. Oh and enforce it as well which I suspect wasn't done before.

[Thai at Heart]

And the rice farmers growing just enough for their families might get smart, get a real job and buy their rice at the market. And still have money in their pocket for other things. Instead of expecting others to subsidise them.

Its kind of sad to see your train of thought...

Do you really think that there are so many jobs available in Thailand?

And do you really think that employers do not require some sort of education before hiring someone?

And do you really think that farming rice is not a "real job"?

There are hundreds of thousands of jobs being filled by imported labour at less than or equal to minimum wage.

The poor of Thailand have been undercut out of work and are then being forced to grow rice to export at no benefit to themselves.

Do u see a problem with this.

One of our Thai posters tried to explain to me that all Thai companies pay minimum wage by law and many even more than required.

So I guess the solution you seem to incicate is to expel all the imported labour and give their jobs to Thai.

PS isn't that what some accused the NCPO of with the flight of the Cambodians ?

I am not sure expel is a practicality anymore. But, much like in the UK they are now moaning about youth unemployment but every catering industry job is filled with imported labour, they should insist that companies must advertise jobs locally first.

They should have to advertise for a period for domestic labour instead of importing the entire labour force from outside. It is giving the companies a way to cheat the labour market and screwing Thais at the bottom of the pile.

Lest we forget it really is only a few years that they have had to pay a real minimum wage and have had to pay proper social for ALL employees.

[rubl]

There are hundreds of thousands of jobs being filled by imported labour at less than or equal to minimum wage.

The poor of Thailand have been undercut out of work and are then being forced to grow rice to export at no benefit to themselves.

Do u see a problem with this.

One of our Thai posters tried to explain to me that all Thai companies pay minimum wage by law and many even more than required.

So I guess the solution you seem to incicate is to expel all the imported labour and give their jobs to Thai.

PS isn't that what some accused the NCPO of with the flight of the Cambodians ?

I am not sure expel is a practicality anymore. But, much like in the UK they are now moaning about youth unemployment but every catering industry job is filled with imported labour, they should insist that companies must advertise jobs locally first.

They should have to advertise for a period for domestic labour instead of importing the entire labour force from outside. It is giving the companies a way to cheat the labour market and screwing Thais at the bottom of the pile.

Lest we forget it really is only a few years that they have had to pay a real minimum wage and have had to pay proper social for ALL employees.

I'm sure to expel is not only not practical, it would be illegal as most foreign labourers now seem to have valid papers. Furthermore, companies which can 'prove' they cannot get Thai for vacancies can apply and be granted the right to 'import' some foreign labourers with the companies paying for all paperwork and permits. There is nothing by law to force companies to pay more than necessary, some jobs even have 'recommended' salary levels. Some companies may pay a little bit more than required, but companies are not philantropic institutions.

It would seem that at least at the lower end of the jobs (as in limited skill required) Thai are asking more than companies are willing to pay. With foreign labour available they don't even have to. The upcoming AEC will only make it more obvious that Thai labourers have to upgrade their skills or accept lower pay if they want to be employed.

Is this fair? Maybe not, but that's how things work and not only in Thailand.

[Thai at Heart]

Companies will never pay more than they have to in comparison to supply.

There is no limit to supply because the companies can import labour with impunity. They love paying minimum and not a baht more. I do know that they often don't advertise at all domestically

That has to stop. AEC doesn't effect daily labour. Thai companies will fill up with imported labour as long as they are free to do so.

Edited October 5, 2014 by Thai at Heart

[Dah fahrang]

Populist programs are back in Thailand.

Haven't noticed that they ever went away.

(Same cigars being sold in a different box)