Koh Tao: All three migrant workers confess to rape and murder of British tourists

[SteveFong]

if you still do not think this is an internationally followed incident

[NeverSure]

If we all think it is a set up, we could hire a lawyer between us for the 'Myanmar 3'. A good lawyer could get some light shed on things.

Would only be a few baht each.

I'm sad to say that I believe corruption runs farther than the police. If the police have swapped out the DNA that purportedly came from the victim's cavities, and have used some of that same DNA to match the accused, I don't think anyone can would force a real investigation.

I think the Thais are all too happy to "solve" this case to save face and what's more important, to keep from losing more tourism. As long as this is in the hands of the Thais, I have no hope for any transparency.

The only hope I have is that someone gets some saliva swabs from the accused and sends them to the UK which surely has real DNA samples from receiving the murdered woman's body back.

Even then, it could only be broadcast in the court of pubic opinion.

[SteveFong]

This must be sent to the Ambassador and the UK journalists following the case

http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/ngo-questions-two-myanmar-suspects-scapegoats/

Edited October 3, 2014 by SteveFong

[mauGR1]

This must be sent to the Ambassador and the UK journalists following the case

http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/ngo-questions-two-myanmar-suspects-scapegoats/

There is already a thread on TV.. Also i guess the journalists are reading Thaivisa Forum.

[Thai at Heart]

The first day brought all sorts of slight suggestion that this was a Farang act of passion , hence the stupid idea that she had cigarettes with the killers and that someone else had a gay lover. Etc etc.

I bet in the fullness of time, it will turn out that her DNA was not on the cigarettes. Any packs of cigarettes in the pics with her? Was she even a smoker..

That whole DNA on cigarettes was part of the original unsophisticated cover up.

The article in BKK Post gives another sickening (and almost unlikely) detail that might explain the presence of her DNA on the cigarette as well as the perpetrators. It raises questions as well, as I seem to remember that the cigarette-end was not found near the crime-scene?

"With her partner incapacitated, both men are accused of then setting upon Witheridge, taking turns raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette."

Yeah right. What a cock and bull theory that one is. Have u seen how much blood there was around? So they carried the cigarette away from the crime and dropped it on the beach with their and her DNA on it.

Snowballs in hell chance of that.

[mango66]

To be fair to thepolice report of blond hair were made on the first dayofthe investigation which made everybody. Think either plant or farang.

If the police can substantiate the claim of dyed hair they could have a very strong case.

The first day brought all sorts of slight suggestion that this was a Farang act of passion , hence the stupid idea that she had cigarettes with the killers and that someone else had a gay lover. Etc etc.

I bet in the fullness of time, it will turn out that her DNA was not on the cigarettes. Any packs of cigarettes in the pics with her? Was she even a smoker..

That whole DNA on cigarettes was part of the original unsophisticated cover up.

i think to remember, in the bar where they were sitting on the table,

she had a cigarett in her hand;

[Snookyville]

To be fair to thepolice report of blond hair were made on the first dayofthe investigation which made everybody. Think either plant or farang.

If the police can substantiate the claim of dyed hair they could have a very strong case.

The first day brought all sorts of slight suggestion that this was a Farang act of passion , hence the stupid idea that she had cigarettes with the killers and that someone else had a gay lover. Etc etc.

I bet in the fullness of time, it will turn out that her DNA was not on the cigarettes. Any packs of cigarettes in the pics with her? Was she even a smoker..

That whole DNA on cigarettes was part of the original unsophisticated cover up.

i think to remember, in the bar where they were sitting on the table,

she had a cigarett in her hand;

No in Choppers ("last picture") she is holding a glass with a straw, the guy across the table on the right of the picture is the only one smoking and has an ashtray in front of him.

[Thai at Heart]

To be fair to thepolice report of blond hair were made on the first dayofthe investigation which made everybody. Think either plant or farang.

If the police can substantiate the claim of dyed hair they could have a very strong case.

The first day brought all sorts of slight suggestion that this was a Farang act of passion , hence the stupid idea that she had cigarettes with the killers and that someone else had a gay lover. Etc etc.

I bet in the fullness of time, it will turn out that her DNA was not on the cigarettes. Any packs of cigarettes in the pics with her? Was she even a smoker..

That whole DNA on cigarettes was part of the original unsophisticated cover up.

i think to remember, in the bar where they were sitting on the table,

she had a cigarett in her hand;

In the BP they are claiming that somehow they lit an LM cigarette and smoked it while they raped her, but that it had her DNA on it also?

They made up one fib so badly they have had to make another to cover it.

What utter nonsense is this. She doesn't have the look of a smoker either. Anyone know if she was?

[Snookyville]

In the BP they are claiming that somehow they lit an LM cigarette and smoked it while they raped her, but that it had her DNA on it also?

They made up one fib so badly they have had to make another to cover it.

What utter nonsense is this. She doesn't have the look of a smoker either. Anyone know if she was?

Yes as in taking turns raping and smoking, all he while keeping her down and quiet? With her DNA then moving from their hands to the cigarette.

Seems rather unlikely and I thought that this infamous cigarette butt was found some distance from the crime-scene. Or are there more cigarettes with the DNA of both rapists/killers and Hannah around?

Maybe some translation error...

Edited October 3, 2014 by Snookyville

[heyexile]

Boiling water and beatings claim friends of accused Burmese workers.

http://twitter.com/pakhead

[Torrens54]

"Police officers then led the two to a safe-house where they were intensively interrogated."

I can imagine what that means. Beaten up intensively?

"Some blond strands of human hair were found at the scene and were kept as evidence."

Found or planted?

Only a DNA match by the brit police I will believe. Match the DNA of the semen with that of the suspects. There have been too many mess-ups to base it on a confession only.

Do you think the British Police are more advanced than the Royal Thai Police? As for your suggestion about "planting evidence" I suspect the members you are maligning, may have a very good defamation case against you.

[katana]

Mrs Retsdon tells me that almost nobody Thai believes these Burmese are guilty either.

Same doubts on Pantip.com from native Thais.

[SteveFong]

all Thai post boards must be shown what Hannah's friends have to say about the cell phone showing up in bushes by the Burmese kids place

[losgrad]

Justice sometimes means, socially acceptable consequences to save the face of a nation...

[crazygreg44]

I don't find it so inconceivable that these men would be capable of doing it: drunk, young, male, poor, illegally employed, drifter, sex deprived, cabin fever (island).

Do thaivisa naysayers accept that such people might commit murder?

I will if the evidence is scrutinized and approved by an outside source. Immigrant workers getting the blame for crimes they didn't commit are a dime a dozen here in LOS. These guys could be serial killers on the run for Burma for all we know. But at the moment I am just not buying it.

to commit such a murder, it is clear by the finds that some HATE was involved.

I seriously doubt that young burmese lads, even drunk ,male, poor , illegal, sexied and so on, etc, will buid up this level of HATE, if their aim is only to rape a woman.

Edited October 4, 2014 by crazygreg44

[losgrad]

Justice sometimes means, socially acceptable consequences to save the face of a nation...

And I am deeply saddened that the "truth" is once again being skewered.. The leaders in my home country also do this regularly.

[tracker1]

An update News Regarding Koh Tao Murders --- "SUSPICIOUS"

"The suspects have been kept "without legal representation". We still don't have lawyers observing the process directly,"
"So we are suspicious about the judicial process in terms of these alleged confessions."
(Pornpen Khongkachonkiet, a human rights activist.)

But, police chief Somyot said the suspects had made "no request for lawyers".
"They haven't asked for lawyers.

[losgrad]

I don't find it so inconceivable that these men would be capable of doing it: drunk, young, male, poor, illegally employed, drifter, sex deprived, cabin fever (island).

Do thaivisa naysayers accept that such people might commit murder?

I will if the evidence is scrutinized and approved by an outside source. Immigrant workers getting the blame for crimes they didn't commit are a dime a dozen here in LOS. These guys could be serial killers on the run for Burma for all we know. But at the moment I am just not buying it.

to commit such a murder, it is clear by the finds that some HATE was involved.

I seriously doubt that young burmese lads, even drunk ,male, poor , illegal, sexied and so on, etc, will buid up this level of HATE, if their aim is only to rape a woman.

Yes, more likely someone who was "publicly" shunned, who lost face when they attempted to make advances towards the young lady. This would be the prime suspects with motives, but that's just our armchair analysis from the keyboard so what do we know.....

The authorities will assume global memories fade as they have in other cases......

Edited October 4, 2014 by losgrad

[boomerangutang]

Hmm, so if they were tortured it doesn't show on them, no cuts, bruises, scratches, black eyes, scolded skin, etc. . .

Dude, you can come over to my house this afternoon, and I'll show you how torturing can be done without cuts, bruises, scratches, black eyes, scolded skin. Plus, we only see parts of their faces and their hands. Are you Clark Kent who can see through thick layers of clothes? Torture can also be psychological. Try this on for size: "We know where your family lives and we will send special agents out to kill all 26 members if you don't sign this piece of paper."

[metisdead]

A post containing content copy and pasted from Andrew Drummond's site has been removed. Please understand Thai Visa is not employed as a tool to obtain information for Andrew Drummond nor do we use material from his web site.

[boomerangutang]

A major Thai newspaper reported on the re-enactment: Saw showed how he allegedly grabbed a hoe from a nearby vegetable garden and brought it down on the back of Miller's head before dragging the young man into the sea.

I wonder then how David got the deep puncture wounds under his chin and under his right eye socket in addition to the wounds on the back of his head.

There are 1,000 things to wonder about the re-enactment because it was an orchestrated sham from start to finish.

We killed them over there...............No,no you killed them over there.

you forgot the question mark after the first "We killed them over there?"

The 're-enactment' was Farce City. The Burmese suspects movements were micro-managed. Shame on Thai cops. And when will we get DNA evidence (for victims and suspects) done by an independent non-Thai lab, including tests for all the Headman's family members? Answer: NEVER.

When the new police boss was brought in (a few days ago), his instructions from on high were: 'Get this case wrapped up as soon as possible. Frame some migrants, whatever, but this is awful for tourist numbers.'

[boomerangutang]

Do you think the British Police are more advanced than the Royal Thai Police?

Is that a joke question? It's like saying, 'do you think Jamaicans can run faster than Thais?'

[bruceybonus]

This is the knife evidence I was talking about!

[smotherb]

Do you think the British Police are more advanced than the Royal Thai Police?

Is that a joke question? It's like saying, 'do you think Jamaicans can run faster than Thais?'

Did you walk to work or bring your lunch?

[cloghead]

tell the British Ambassador how you feel

I have, and will do so every day until they get their own DNA tests done

https://twitter.com/KentBKK

In this pic he sorta looks like the ex lead-singer in Midnight Oil.

Didn't that dude become a member of the Ozzie government?

Whatever...

[dinooz]

A major Thai newspaper reported on the re-enactment: Saw showed how he allegedly grabbed a hoe from a nearby vegetable garden and brought it down on the back of Miller's head before dragging the young man into the sea.

I wonder then how David got the deep puncture wounds under his chin and under his right eye socket in addition to the wounds on the back of his head.

There are 1,000 things to wonder about the re-enactment because it was an orchestrated sham from start to finish.

We killed them over there...............No,no you killed them over there.

you forgot the question mark after the first "We killed them over there?"

The 're-enactment' was Farce City. The Burmese suspects movements were micro-managed. Shame on Thai cops. And when will we get DNA evidence (for victims and suspects) done by an independent non-Thai lab, including tests for all the Headman's family members? Answer: NEVER.

When the new police boss was brought in (a few days ago), his instructions from on high were: 'Get this case wrapped up as soon as possible. Frame some migrants, whatever, but this is awful for tourist numbers.'

I would hazard a guess and say they have already got DNA samples from the "Family",Unfortunately it went into specimen jars labelled Win and Maw.Bingo perfect match.

[pattayasnowman]

Must say the "Garden Hoe" caught my attention . Did not lnow these were readily available on the beach.

Guess they are there just in case someone facies doing a bit of gardening or clubing someone over the head.

[hiller]

This is clearly a cover up, and the primary reason I say this is that as long as there are individuals who are excluded from any DNA testing, and as long as anyone is incriminated based on DNA testing, then we will never know. Additionally, nothing adds up to make any sense out of these three individuals. The way they write the story of their involvement, were it a school assignment, would receive an F grade simply because the dots do not connect, and the factors involved in their "confession" come out of nowhere without any explanation as to how those factors came to be.

I have caught natives in the past red-handed and in the act of doing something I did not agree with. On each occasion, they lied and said they were not doing what I caught them doing, and either went silent, got angry at me, or made every endeavor to mitigate the matter with further lies.

This is an island with a history. The foreign workers should be very afraid of being there after this. The message is clear that any further cases like this will exact further tolls on any number of foreign workers who dare to work there and hence make themselves out to be living alibis for native criminal activity.

Not only should foreign tourists avoid these places, but foreign workers as well. After an incident like this, I truly must say that I will have no further sympathy to express for the victims; those who are harmed, maimed murdered or accused ...for no other reason than to be the objects of wrath, desire, vengeance, scandalous opportunity or whatever the case may be.

Do I believe that these three had anything to do with these murders? Emphatically No!

Three employees (waiters) in a restaurant on the island enter a 7-Eleven convenient store and purchase cigarettes and alcohol.

-Where's the guitar?

-No one mentions a guitar?

-Did they have it in their pocket?

-Was it outside leaning against the rubbish bin alongside the garden hoe?

Then they are proceeding to a long on the beach close to the actual crime scene.

-Says who?

-Were they carrying a guitar?

-How did they come across the guitar?

-Did they premeditate where they were going to hang out and decide to plant the guitar there in advance, hoping that no one would steal their guitar when they finally got to the place that they had no idea they were going to?

-Were any one of them carrying a garden hoe, by any chance?

Then they are sitting on said log and consuming alcohol and playing a guitar

-Again, where did the guitar come from?

-It is a notable piece of information that most would not leave out.

Now they are drinking, singing and playing the guitar approximately 65 meters from the murder scene.

-65 meters from the murder scene looks like what?

-Answer: empty beach with no garden shacks to store garden rakes, hoses or hoes.

-So, where did the garden hoe come from... 65 meters from the beach and hundreds of meters away from any garden supply storage unit?

-No mention of "He noticed a garden hoe lying in the sand and thought it odd"

Later on they had seen the two British tourists walking towards a cluster of rocky reefs and were romantically embracing and cuddling each other.

-It is evening... dark. From 65 meters or further away one cannot truly make out details drunk, let alone sober.

Here's where it gets even more fantastic:

A drunken restaurant waiter, who works on an island rife with crime and killings, and ran by powerful mafioso's, and that does not scare the beejeezus out of him... suddenly gets curious and grabs a garden hoe (magically lying within reach in this random spot on an island beach where they decided to sit at) and goes to sneak a peek of the couple making out.

He is leaving his accomplices behind, or they are following him. What is it? This is not mentioned as any normal guilty person would mention. It simply states that he grabbed a garden hoe and went to spy on the two people.

He is watching them now and he gets sexually aroused and... SUDDENLY his two friends are alongside him with their magical guitar and bag of cigarette butts that they will scatter around the scene.

And SUDDENLY, because they are sexually aroused, and only because they are sexually aroused, it awakens murder in the heart of not one... not two, but three drunken men, and without any conversation whatsoever, and through the wonders of mental telepathy they all agree to engaging in an act of murder and rape at that single moment in time... from singing... to curiosity... to sexual arousal... to murder all in one go!

Suddenly they all act at once and begin to murder the male and dump his body in the sea (where it will miraculously wash back to the crime scene if the tide is right... or they have to carry the body a few hundred meters to get to the sea due to the tide being out at that time... Anyone check the tide tables?)

They then proceed to rape the woman (who for some reason remained there to watch all of this until they could turn their attention to her and hit her over the head with the magic hoe and murder her as well, because they did confess to (all three) dumping the body of the male in the ocean and finally killing her by hitting her with the same garden hoe. Three little Asian men would be hard put to it to "dump" something, which implies carrying something, and not "dragging" something, and especially in a drunken state.

They then put the bloody garden hoe in the sand at the murder scene, and do not bother to say whether they had sense to wash off the massive amounts of arterial spray from their blood soaked clothing and on their skin, and walk... where?

Did they forget their magical guitar as well? Did anyone find a bloody guitar at the scene?

The more one reads this and applies even minor linear thinking to the equation presented, the more one is sickened by the heinous brutality and utter sociopath culture made evident by all this.

...and where were these eyewitnesses, who happened to be out on the beach and close enough to identify the race of these three, yet were nowhere near to spy on two foreigners having sex on the beach? Are you telling me that the former is more interesting to peeping toms than the latter?

...and how could eyewitnesses hear music on the beach when sound does not carry that far? Why would eyewitnesses not hear screaming coming from a woman who is being raped? Screaming is certainly a lot louder than quiet singing along with strumming on a guitar, yes?

Maybe the "eyewitness" had to get back to his father and tell him what had happened.

My sympathies to the living relatives and loved ones... not only that they have lost their own, but in the manner that they lost them and the sociopathic and brutal manner in which a culture tramples their memory.

You presented many common sense facts and they are much more believable than those presented by the BIB and Press. The physical evidence, weapons, phones, cigarette butts appeared to have legs and just moved to the area for the police. My opinion. We, neither Thai or Farang, will ever know the truth.

[Snookyville]

Must say the "Garden Hoe" caught my attention . Did not lnow these were readily available on the beach.

Guess they are there just in case someone facies doing a bit of gardening or clubing someone over the head.

This was extensively discussed in the days after the murder. Don't blame you for not going through thousands of posts though...

Such hoes are all-purpose tools used not only in Thailand but all around SEA for digging holes, agriculture, building. Not the type of hoe for fine English gardening. On the beach these are used for digging holes for/after bonfires, burying washed up seaweed etc. under the sand - things like that. And there is always some sort of construction going on nearby.

So It would not have been that hard to come by, though other posters pointed out that local workers would store their tools somewhere safe as these are too valuable to them to lose...

[mauGR1]

Btw, where is the 3rd man ? Maybe the interrogation is not finished ?

Personally i find hard to believe these 2 small guys did it themseves.