Reforms to be unbiased, except against 'people like Thaksin': NRC member

outsider · October 10, 2014

Then don't say it's unbiased, you dumb fool. It is biased from the start. Sheesh... And for the record, I am NOT a Shinawatra sympathiser. Nor a red supporter. Or any of the coloured gangs, for that matter.

NeutralVoice · October 10, 2014

Ah good news then. Going by your account we will soon rid ourselves not only of Thaksin's abuse of power, but that of all the other politicians before and after him. Not sure who will be left. May be you can offer yourself as a candidate.

To start with, bias is a subjective word. You are biased against Thaksin while others are biased against the current government. You think Thanksin was the most corrupt, and other things that a military institution is far more abusive and dangerous in the long run. That doesn't make you right or them right - in the end people make up their minds and the legacy of those in power will be defined.

Now imagine if a Thaksin government took the actions that the NLA and the junta have taken in the short months they have been in control? Wasn't this last chapter started all over an ill advised and poorly judged attempt at passing an amnesty bill while most people were sleeping? The current government doesn't even need to bother to try those shenanigans, they just do it in plain sight and with both a smirk and a strong warning against any widespread dissent. But hey, since they are on your side it is all right with you right?

And where is the evidence that they are any better? Nowhere. Just look at the murder investigation. The perfect investigation? Congratulations coming from the General himself? Journalists investigating labor abuse of immigrants by big Thai conglomerates still in jail without bail over on charges of criminal libel? Authorities are drinking their koolaid so fast that they now say they will arrest anybody that insults them over their performance? Who made them above the law? Did you? Did anybody else in this forum? People have the right to assemble as long as it is to sing Kumbaya songs? What's next, order TV stations to color ManU, Arsenal and Liverpool's kits into yellow to avoid any association of EPL teams with the red movement?

I can only hope that like minded people like you are not as righteousness as you are as this is the type of contempt that people that have no clue about the injustices that many of your fellow citizens endure on a consistent and systematic way in the hands of those that things they can do the thinking for them and the rest of us.

Edited October 10, 2014 by NeutralVoice

BirdsandBooze · October 10, 2014

A few members on here exhibit a neverending obsession with Thaksin. Trust me, that's not normal behaviour.

mike324 · October 10, 2014

Bias against Thaksin, just as those who bemoaned the sale of Shicorp, but didn't batter an eyelid when deals of similar magnitude were done by CP & others.

If the others were PM and did the same, I"m sure most people would cry foul as well.

See the bears · October 10, 2014

Bias against Thaksin, just as those who bemoaned the sale of Shicorp, but didn't batter an eyelid when deals of similar magnitude were done by CP & others.

If the others were PM and did the same, I"m sure most people would cry foul as well.

There is only one set of tax laws.

whybother · October 10, 2014

So not all men are equal.

And the law cannot be universally applied.

No wonder Thaksin is the only one in Thailand who have to pay capital gain tax from selling SHIN shares.

He deserves it.

I like laws that are biased against people who are corrupt, abuse of power, do vote buying and let kill 3000 people in his war against drugs....

You'll find out that most countries laws are biased against such people. Usually they even put them into jail....

Yes, we can't have laws applying equally to all.

Whatever next, democracy?

I would have thought the the law would be applied equally to all "people who are corrupt, abuse of power, do vote buying and let kill 3000 people in his war against drugs".

NeutralVoice · October 10, 2014

Preventing nepotistic kleptocrats from gaining power seems to be anathema to Democracy to some people. "Shows bias" they say, good grief.

Thaksin supporters are like political snake oil sellers, they'll cry you are against medicine and the well being of people as they try to sell their poison and pass it as a miracle cure to all ailments.

The next thing you know people will be defending a military coup as the only alternative to democracy.

Right on cue.

Who is defending a military coup as the only alternative to democracy?

How much history of this country do you know to pin abuse of power as a Thaksin exclusive? Ahem, have you been watching the news? What would you call the antics of the current regime if instead of General Prayut calling the shots it was the chief of police on behalf of Yinluck? You would be on the streets screaming your heart out right? And you have the guts to call the anti-coup people as Thaksin supporters selling snake oil? Look yourself in the mirror sir and you will see that you are the image of the oil snake salesman you speak about. You are endorsing the very same abuse of power by people that decided they have the right to remove an elected government from a political party that has persistently won elections. Call it populism or whatever you like, the opposition has only itself to blame for not being able to respond to the influence of this man. And of course they cannot, because they cannot see 10 kilometers past Bangkok. Yet they allegedly have the right and moral standing to take power in their hands, claim to be stirring the country in the right direction, telling us they will do the right decisions for us and at the same time squash any dissent from anybody that dares to disagree with them? Can you imagine Charlem being able to summon Abhisit or Suthep and be kept off the streets for a week or two or however long it took to quash the anti-government protesters? Is the right to protest an exclusive of people from Bangkok that also own a home and sacrifice their comfort for the streets? It shouting ultra-nationalist slogans and songs more patriotic or respectful than people that protest for better socio-economic opportunities?

How can this government make claims about cleaning house when they cannot even clean their own backyard? Why don't they start by conducting an investigation into their own abuses of power in decades past? Or how about current times, like stopping the Royal Thai Navy from continuing their prosecution of national and foreign journalists that are sitting in jail awaiting charges on criminal libel for doing nothing more than reprinting a report from an international news organization, AP, regarding alleged involvement in human trafficking? If that is not abuse of power, perhaps you can enlighten me and define that for me?

Two wrongs do not make a right. The anti-Thaksin rhetoric is actually getting quite old. Focus on the facts at hand. Distance yourself from names that start with T or P or Y and just think about what the people in power are doing to bring the country together. These people are so naive and so ill advised that they simply cannot consult a common history book to see how this kind of one-sided application of the law has not ended well for most that decide to give it a try?

In my opinion, all evidence points to yet another military coup by yet another General that saw opportunity and sized t. It was obvious from the day he was appointed anyway, and while he might be thinking that he has the right strategy and the right people to implement it, the complete neglect or interest in solving social and economic injustices will do nothing but relegate him as yet another bad and futile attempt at trying to keep the status quo. The longer and harder they try to keep onto power the bigger the fall will be. I am not saying that - history is.

Edited October 10, 2014 by NeutralVoice

Thaimaishoe · October 10, 2014

"'The drafting of the Constitution needs to produce long-term benefits without bias against any individual, but if the drafting is meant to prevent people who abuse their power - people like Thaksin - from entering politics, it can be done," Jermsak Pinthong said yesterday."

While I have nothing but contempt for thaksin and his acolytes who abused their time in power and were responsible for the extra judicial butchery that masqueraded as a war on drugs, likewise the economic ineptitude and criminal methods of rule that was PT, you can't bar "certain people" from power.

Make them responsible for their anise of power, gaol them for their criminal actions, strip them of their ill gained wealth, yes.

But you cannot bar people from standing for office because of their name or family.

I think what he is saying is not to ban just Shinawatras, but to make sure anyone who is a convicted criminal, no matter what colour their shirt is, will not only not be able to be in Government, but to also limit their influence on politics and the police.

eg Thailand should never again have a PM, Parliament & Heads of Police and DSI who are answerable to a convicted criminal living overseas

I think you are reading MUCH more into his statement than was said, or meant. I think he means only to bar Shinawatras and those he and the other yellow shirts can link to him. Forget barring criminals... that would eliminate EVERY politician EVER! No this coup, this process, is not an altruistic endeavour, this is intended to be a daggar in the heart of democracy. The article listed many leaders of the anti-gov protests that are now seated at this deciding table... how many pro-gov people are seated there? I honestly don't know the answer, but my money is on none. This is not an honest process, stop trying to dress it up as such.

You thought you had a fake democracy before... wait till you see what emerges from beind these doors.

You think wrong then.

He used Thaksin as an example of the corruption and nepotism that needs to be eliminated from politics and not just Thai politics.

Thaksin of course has been and still is a great example of all that is bad in politics, sure he did some things for the poor at the start while filling his own pockets.

The usual red apologists have chosen to ignore the important word LIKE in the statement, as in making a comparison. That one word changes the meaning completely.

You think wrong then.

Well that will be a nice change of pace! But regardless, right or wrong will be bourn out in a few months when we see what kind of reforms are proposed.

You are pinning your hopes on the reforms targeting corruption and criminality. That would be fine, but a coup was not required to sort those out, there is something more at work here.

One of the main complaints of the anti-gov protesters a few months back, was that Yingluck was being "controlled" by her brother. This is the true rally cry. So she was overthrown for taking advice from her brother, and or instituting policies inline with what her brother would have instituted. The problem is that anyone that THINKS like that will be subject to being overthrown as a puppet of Thaksin, indeed they are going to be the targets of these reforms, so they will be prevented from standing for office in the first place - that way we don't have to have another coup to replace them.

I think THAT is what the "like Thaksin" refers to, not corruption, but policies. Thought police are coming to your next election. This is the danger of the "reforms" I see emerging from this committee. It is not about corruption, it is not about barring criminals, it is about barring certain kinds of thinking. Why do you think the "reforms" were needed, but could never be articulated. Six months of rallies and speeches, never a detail of what "reforms" would consist of.

Maybe I'm wrong, maybe this committee and its members are just fine upstanding Thai's with no personal agenda, who only want a perfect, no corruption, no criminals democracy where all points of view are respected, and all walks of life have a say in government.

But I've never been THAT wrong.

SICHONSTEVE · October 10, 2014

So not all men are equal.

And the law cannot be universally applied.

No wonder Thaksin is the only one in Thailand who have to pay capital gain tax from selling SHIN shares.

He deserves it.

I like laws that are biased against people who are corrupt, abuse of power, do vote buying and let kill 3000 people in his war against drugs....

You'll find out that most countries laws are biased against such people. Usually they even put them into jail....

Yes, we can't have laws applying equally to all.

Whatever next, democracy?

The last thing that Thailand needs at the moment is democracy!!!

whybother · October 10, 2014

Preventing nepotistic kleptocrats from gaining power seems to be anathema to Democracy to some people. "Shows bias" they say, good grief.

Thaksin supporters are like political snake oil sellers, they'll cry you are against medicine and the well being of people as they try to sell their poison and pass it as a miracle cure to all ailments.

The next thing you know people will be defending a military coup as the only alternative to democracy.

Are there other alternatives to democracy?

SICHONSTEVE · October 10, 2014

Preventing nepotistic kleptocrats from gaining power seems to be anathema to Democracy to some people. "Shows bias" they say, good grief.

Thaksin supporters are like political snake oil sellers, they'll cry you are against medicine and the well being of people as they try to sell their poison and pass it as a miracle cure to all ailments.

The next thing you know people will be defending a military coup as the only alternative to democracy.

Are there other alternatives to democracy?

Of course there is. What we have now is precisely what I wanted before the coup rescued Thailand and that is benign dictatorship!!

Seems to be working perfectly to me, just as I predicted and hoped for.

I can laugh at those posters who called me crazy and stupid now that I have been completely vindicated!!

fab4 · October 10, 2014

Ask the General about the 3,000 drug war deaths.

People like to pin that one on Thaksin but for some reason....no investigation.

Actually there have been several investigations into the "War on Drugs", the latest being abhisits foray in June 2010. No conclusions have ever been made.

Oh and there weren't 3000 deaths, not even 2,500 deaths as widely reported and repeated ad nauseam on this forum and elsewhere.

Edited October 10, 2014 by fab4

ikke · October 10, 2014

Sutheps mates and backers really have got everything they wanted haven't they!

Sure, this was part of the deal, me thinks !

Maybe the even gonna ban the red color in Thailand, maybe the red banner in the flag should be changed to yellow....

This criminals who seized government buildings, common property, are now in charge of NRC.

NeutralVoice · October 10, 2014

Preventing nepotistic kleptocrats from gaining power seems to be anathema to Democracy to some people. "Shows bias" they say, good grief.

Thaksin supporters are like political snake oil sellers, they'll cry you are against medicine and the well being of people as they try to sell their poison and pass it as a miracle cure to all ailments.

The next thing you know people will be defending a military coup as the only alternative to democracy.

Are there other alternatives to democracy?

Of course there is. What we have now is precisely what I wanted before the coup rescued Thailand and that is benign dictatorship!!

Seems to be working perfectly to me, just as I predicted and hoped for.

I can laugh at those posters who called me crazy and stupid now that I have been completely vindicated!!

Exactly how have you vindicated? Benign dictatorship you say? Let me tell you what a benign dictatorship is all about - it is a one in which the dictator in charge uses the resources of the country to bring upon higher economic and social standards to people previously disenfranchised. It one in which positive actions write the news, rather than oratory statements. It is one in which the power of the ruler is wise enough, smart enough and confident enough to invite the participation of influential people in the opposite camp. It is one in which inclusion prevails over exclusion, even when the line in the sand is clear and straightforward. It is one in which feeling of support and sympathy come from all people from all sides in the political spectrum. It is one that force opposite views to engage in dialogue with each other, not one that rewards one group over the other. And most important of all, it is one that appeals to the majority rather than to the minority that is upset with the loss of status and influence.

One only needs to open a dictionary and look the word fascist to realize that Thailand is not without plenty of them. Many people are quick to call the USA imperialists, but there is one thing that is worse than a country that wields its power over that of a weaker opponent, and that is those that wield the power over their own people, dehumanizing opponents in order to convince themselves of the right to do so. And that is one thing that is prevalent and quite obvious in these forums when people like you are quick to call the reds as nothing but criminals and hooligans when in fact its core membership is made of people that are just discovering that the only power their have, their vote, is being suppressed and challenged by a minority that doesn't have the moral or intellectual capital to outmaneuver rather simple populist policies that propelled Thaksin to such status in the eyes of so many. You can convince yourself that you are morally correct and they are not, but at the end of the day you know nothing about injustice and they know everything about it.

SICHONSTEVE · October 10, 2014

I'm afraid that Thaksin, the PTP and UDD cannot be trusted as they cheat, lie, are corrupt and care only for themselves - whilst bankrupting the country in the process. As far as I'm concerned they don't deserve to have a say in anything as they are criminals/fugitives.

Far better off without them don't you agree!!!!

AleG · October 10, 2014

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Preventing nepotistic kleptocrats from gaining power seems to be anathema to Democracy to some people. "Shows bias" they say, good grief.

Thaksin supporters are like political snake oil sellers, they'll cry you are against medicine and the well being of people as they try to sell their poison and pass it as a miracle cure to all ailments.

The next thing you know people will be defending a military coup as the only alternative to democracy.

Right on cue.

Who is defending a military coup as the only alternative to democracy?

How much history of this country do you know to pin abuse of power as a Thaksin exclusive? Ahem, have you been watching the news? What would you call the antics of the current regime if instead of General Prayut calling the shots it was the chief of police on behalf of Yinluck? You would be on the streets screaming your heart out right? And you have the guts to call the anti-coup people as Thaksin supporters selling snake oil? Look yourself in the mirror sir and you will see that you are the image of the oil snake salesman you speak about. You are endorsing the very same abuse of power by people that decided they have the right to remove an elected government from a political party that has persistently won elections. Call it populism or whatever you like, the opposition has only itself to blame for not being able to respond to the influence of this man. And of course they cannot, because they cannot see 10 kilometers past Bangkok. Yet they allegedly have the right and moral standing to take power in their hands, claim to be stirring the country in the right direction, telling us they will do the right decisions for us and at the same time squash any dissent from anybody that dares to disagree with them? Can you imagine Charlem being able to summon Abhisit or Suthep and be kept off the streets for a week or two or however long it took to quash the anti-government protesters? Is the right to protest an exclusive of people from Bangkok that also own a home and sacrifice their comfort for the streets? It shouting ultra-nationalist slogans and songs more patriotic or respectful than people that protest for better socio-economic opportunities?

How can this government make claims about cleaning house when they cannot even clean their own backyard? Why don't they start by conducting an investigation into their own abuses of power in decades past? Or how about current times, like stopping the Royal Thai Navy from continuing their prosecution of national and foreign journalists that are sitting in jail awaiting charges on criminal libel for doing nothing more than reprinting a report from an international news organization, AP, regarding alleged involvement in human trafficking? If that is not abuse of power, perhaps you can enlighten me and define that for me?

Two wrongs do not make a right. The anti-Thaksin rhetoric is actually getting quite old. Focus on the facts at hand. Distance yourself from names that start with T or P or Y and just think about what the people in power are doing to bring the country together. These people are so naive and so ill advised that they simply cannot consult a common history book to see how this kind of one-sided application of the law has not ended well for most that decide to give it a try?

In my opinion, all evidence points to yet another military coup by yet another General that saw opportunity and sized t. It was obvious from the day he was appointed anyway, and while he might be thinking that he has the right strategy and the right people to implement it, the complete neglect or interest in solving social and economic injustices will do nothing but relegate him as yet another bad and futile attempt at trying to keep the status quo. The longer and harder they try to keep onto power the bigger the fall will be. I am not saying that - history is.

Are you talking to me or to the enormous chip on your shoulder? Because you are speaking of things I haven't said.

heybruce · October 10, 2014

A few members on here exhibit a neverending obsession with Thaksin. Trust me, that's not normal behaviour.

It's not socially acceptable to defend a dictatorship, so the only way the fans of the junta can respond to criticism is by going on a rant about the Shinawatra's.

maxme · October 10, 2014

Preventing nepotistic kleptocrats from gaining power seems to be anathema to Democracy to some people. "Shows bias" they say, good grief.

Thaksin supporters are like political snake oil sellers, they'll cry you are against medicine and the well being of people as they try to sell their poison and pass it as a miracle cure to all ailments.

The next thing you know people will be defending a military coup as the only alternative to democracy.

Are there other alternatives to democracy?

Of course there is. What we have now is precisely what I wanted before the coup rescued Thailand and that is benign dictatorship!!

Seems to be working perfectly to me, just as I predicted and hoped for.

I can laugh at those posters who called me crazy and stupid now that I have been completely vindicated!!

"Benign dictatorship" ROFL!

SICHONSTEVE · October 10, 2014

like Pakistan, where there was a military coup and the forces took over the country, but they did it largely for the good of the country and they are not maintaining control in order to personally enrich themselves, but in order to stabilize the country.

benign means not harmful. dictatorship means control.

Found this on a Yahoo forum and also heard it mentioned on a debate on the BBC discussing the merit and pitfalls of democracy by some professor.

heybruce · October 10, 2014

like Pakistan, where there was a military coup and the forces took over the country, but they did it largely for the good of the country and they are not maintaining control in order to personally enrich themselves, but in order to stabilize the country.

benign means not harmful. dictatorship means control.

Found this on a Yahoo forum and also heard it mentioned on a debate on the BBC discussing the merit and pitfalls of democracy by some professor.

I'd like to know what forum that was, and who stated that in the BBC debate. A great many people think the Pakistan military is primarily interested in protecting the Pakistan military.

tullynagardy · October 10, 2014

played no role, you've just failed that test.

It was Thaksin who ordered it and who also was proud of it. And it was the POLICE not the army who did it. The current power is not the police.

And his numerous cases of corruption were solely his responsibility.

Which means neither that the current government is good or bad. It means that Thaksin did many bad things.

His Royal Highness has always been explicit in his support on this war on drugs -

In his 2003 birthday speech he praised Thaksin and criticized those "who counted only dead drug dealers while ignoring deaths caused by drugs." He continued "Victory in the War on Drugs is good. They may blame the crackdown for more than 2,500 deaths, but this is a small price to pay. If the prime minister failed to curb [the drug trade], over the years the number of deaths would easily surpass this toll."

With the Lese Majeste laws that currently exist in Thailand I think it would be prudent of admin to remove these slanderous comments, at odds with his majesties wishes.

SICHONSTEVE · October 10, 2014

like Pakistan, where there was a military coup and the forces took over the country, but they did it largely for the good of the country and they are not maintaining control in order to personally enrich themselves, but in order to stabilize the country.

benign means not harmful. dictatorship means control.

Found this on a Yahoo forum and also heard it mentioned on a debate on the BBC discussing the merit and pitfalls of democracy by some professor.

I'd like to know what forum that was, and who stated that in the BBC debate. A great many people think the Pakistan military is primarily interested in protecting the Pakistan military.

It was the intelligence squared debate on the 14th May 2014 and 'benign democracy was mentioned as a good system for developing nations by professor Rosemary Hollis who is professor of Middle East policy studies at City University and author of No friend of Democratisation: Europe’s role in the genesis of the ‘Arab Spring’.

NeutralVoice · October 10, 2014

I'm afraid that Thaksin, the PTP and UDD cannot be trusted as they cheat, lie, are corrupt and care only for themselves - whilst bankrupting the country in the process. As far as I'm concerned they don't deserve to have a say in anything as they are criminals/fugitives.

Far better off without them don't you agree!!!!

Let me agree with you that many of them are a bunch of self serving corrupt politicians.

Now, let's take another well known Thai politician. Chuan Leekpai - elected in September of 1,992, as the 20th Prime Minister and the first to come to power without aristocratic or military backing. Stop for a second and ponder on that statement. A democratic country that not until 1992 elected a Prime Minister that was not directly hand picked by the elite.

He served two terms, the first ended in May of 1995, which consisted of a 5 party coalition that got defeated by Chavalit Yongchaiyut. However that government was short lived as it was held responsible for the economic crisis that beset Thailand and much of Asia in 1997. This allowed Leekpai to return for a second term. Criticized as a slow actor, he allowed numerous corruption scandals to take place during his time in office.

The following is reprinted for Wikipedia

Raluek Leekpai Scandal[edit]

In 1987, when Chuan was Parliament Speaker, his younger brother Raluek Leekpai (ระลึก หลีกภัย) was charged with embezzling 231.8 million THB (approx. 9 million USD in 1987) from Thai Farmers Bank.^[4] Raluek had been an executive at TFB. Responding to accusations in Parliament, Chuan publicly defended the innocence of his brother. Raluek fled the country, and only returned to Thailand in 2004 after the statute of limitations expired on his crime and he couldn't be prosecuted. He had been on the run as a fugitive in Taiwan. Raluek has said he might enter politics in order to restore his reputation, although he said he wanted to live a quiet life in his Trang hometown.^[5]

First Term (1992-1995)[edit]

In the aftermath of Bloody May, the Democrat Party won the majority of seats in the September 1992 elections, with 79 seats, compared to the Chart Thai Party with 77 seats. Chuan formed a coalition government with the Phalang Dharma and Ekkaparb parties.

Key policies of Chuan's first administration included:

Engagement with Burma. As with all previous administrations, the Chuan government employed a policy of constructive engagement with the military government of Burma, provoking much criticism.^[6]
Reforestation. A huge 5 million rai reforestation programme in honour of King Bhumibol's 50th anniversary of accession to the throne (1996) was initiated in 1994. The reforestation programme was officially declared a failure, with less than 40% of the target realized. The Director General of the RFD was suspended from his post for alleged corruption within the programme.^[7]
Emphasis on national economic stability, decentralization of the administrative powers to the rural provinces, fostering income, opportunity and economic development distribution to the regions.

The first Chuan administration fell when members of the cabinet were implicated in profiting from Sor Phor Kor 4-01 land project documents distributed in Phuket province. Fierce public and press criticism and dissolution of Parliament were the reasons for his administration's downfall.^[8]

Second Term (1997-2001)[edit]

Chuan became prime minister for the second time on November 9, 1997, replacing Chavalit Yongchaiyudh, with a shaky line-up of a six-party coalition and 12 independent defectors from a seventh party, Prachakorn Thai. The ruling coalition increased its 20-seat majority in October 1998, by including the Chart Pattana party.

Economic Reforms[edit]

Chuan's second government enacted several economic reforms for which it was severely criticised. Chuan's "bitter medicine" policies brought little economic relief in the years following the 1997 economic crisis, particularly at the grassroots level. Opinions emerged that the Democrats were only helping big financial institutions and making the country more dependent of foreign investors. Nevertheless, many of the reforms recommended by the IMF were in line with the policies of market economies such as Australia and New Zealand. Interestingly, the subsequent government's economic growth was based even more strongly on selling national assets and private organisations abroad such as the Shin corporation, while most of their economic gains were built on the frugality of the Democrat policy platform. Thai Rak Thai painted the Democrats as having "open contempt" for the plight of the common Thai which set off a revenge vote against the party during the 2001 election, which gave a landslide victory to Thaksin Shinawatra.^[9]

Human Rights[edit]

Chuan's second government came under fire for the violent arrest of 223 villagers protesting the Pak Mun dam. Respected historian Nidhi Iawsriwong noted that "the present situation is as worse as that of the May event (the bloody crackdown of anti-government protesters in 1992). We have a tyrannical government that is arrogant and not accountable to the public. This is dangerous because the government still sees itself as legitimate and claims that it is democratic. In fact, it is as brutal as the military government".^[10]

In March 1999, Chuan nominated Thanom Kittikachorn to the post of honorary royal guard to King Bhumibol Adulyadej, provoking widespread criticism. Thanom turned down his appointment^[11] Thanom was one of the "Three Tyrants" who ruled Thailand from 1963 to 1973 and ordered the massacre of pro-democracy students on 14 October 1973, after which he was ordered to step down and be exiled by HM Bhumibol Adulyadej.

In April 2000, the Editor in Chief of the Chiang Mai daily newspaper Pak Nua was shot and seriously wounded in an attempted murder, but recovered. The editor believed that his repeated critical reporting on the government led to the assault.^[12]

Corruption[edit]

Although generally regarded as relatively clean and honest when compared to other Thai administrations, Chuan's government found itself plagued with corruption scandals and rumors. Key cases of corruption included:

Rakkiat Sukhthana, Health Minister, was charged with taking a five million THB (125,000 USD) bribe from a drug firm and forcing state hospitals to buy medicine at exorbitant prices. After being found guilty, he jumped bail and went into hiding.
Suthep Thaugsuban, Minister of Transport and Communications, whose brokering of illegal land deals caused the fall of the Chuan 1 government, was linked to abuse of funds in setting up a co-operative in his southern province of Surat Thani.^[13]
The "edible fence" seed scandal, in which massive overpricing of seeds distributed to rural areas happened. The Deputy Minister of Agriculture was forced to resign.^[14]
The Salween logging scandal, where up to 20,000 logs were felled illegally in the Salween forest in Mae Hong Son. Some of them turned up in the compound of the Democrat party’s office in Phichit province.^[14]
Sanan Kajornprasart, Interior Minister, as well as 8 other cabinet ministers were found to have understated their declared assets. Sanan was later barred by the Constitution Court from politics for 5 years.^[15]
Chuan himself was found by the National Counter-Corruption Commission to have undeclared shareholdings in a rural cooperative.^[15]

Chuan stepped down as the head of the Democrat Party in 2003.

Criticisms[edit]

Chuan also got the nickname 'Chang Tha Si' (painter in Thai). When party members were accused of corruption, he was always known to protect them by telling the press they were clean although the court had not delivered its decision yet.

Quotes[edit]

"I haven't received any reports yet."– (in Thai "ผมยังไม่ได้รับรายงาน") Chuan Leekpai's classic phrase when he faced many Thai reporters about some important issues or urgent issues.

"The committee is still evaluating it."– (in Thai "ทางคณะกำลังพิจารณาอยู่ครับ") One of his most famous quotes.

--- END ---

Now, we can pick another profile if you like and let's see if it fares much better. Fact is that Thailand is besieged by a lack of sincere politicians. The reasons a re simple - the apple pie is not big enough to allow wealth to grow organically and through the fruits of labor, instead it is build through corruption and shortcuts that are only possible by wielding the accrued power.

By the way, the profile I chose is not even close to the most corrupt of Thaksin's predecessors. There is one I will not name who is believed to have embezzled the equivalent of 2% of Thailand GDP. Look up, I am sure you will find it and along with it you will find the world "military" all over the place as well.

Now, do yourself a favor and read just the first page of a book written by James Ockey at Cornell University - you can find it here. Once you are done you will find very eerie similarities to today's political climate, except that the government being talked about is none other than Khun Leekpai's first term. Funny how history just repeats itself and fools are those that thing they are witness to something unique and exclusive of one other politicians.

Edited October 10, 2014 by NeutralVoice

MAJIC · October 10, 2014

So not all men are equal.

And the law cannot be universally applied.

No wonder Thaksin is the only one in Thailand who have to pay capital gain tax from selling SHIN shares.

He deserves it.

What Capital Gains Tax? he didn't pay it! due to the fact that He and his Government passed a new law that exempted him from the 40% Tax on the sale of the Shin Corporation shares to Singapore,does that jog your memory???

SICHONSTEVE · October 10, 2014

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I'm afraid that Thaksin, the PTP and UDD cannot be trusted as they cheat, lie, are corrupt and care only for themselves - whilst bankrupting the country in the process. As far as I'm concerned they don't deserve to have a say in anything as they are criminals/fugitives.

Far better off without them don't you agree!!!!

Let me agree with you that many of them are a bunch of self serving corrupt politicians.

Now, let's take another well known Thai politician. Chuan Leekpai - elected in September of 1,992, as the 20th Prime Minister and the first to come to power without aristocratic or military backing. Stop for a second and ponder on that statement. A democratic country that not until 1992 elected a Prime Minister that was not directly hand picked by the elite.

He served two terms, the first ended in May of 1995, which consisted of a 5 party coalition that got defeated by Chavalit Yongchaiyut. However that government was short lived as it was held responsible for the economic crisis that beset Thailand and much of Asia in 1997. This allowed Leekpai to return for a second term. Criticized as a slow actor, he allowed numerous corruption scandals to take place during his time in office.

The following is reprinted for Wikipedia
Raluek Leekpai Scandal[edit]
In 1987, when Chuan was Parliament Speaker, his younger brother Raluek Leekpai (ระลึก หลีกภัย) was charged with embezzling 231.8 million THB (approx. 9 million USD in 1987) from Thai Farmers Bank.^[4] Raluek had been an executive at TFB. Responding to accusations in Parliament, Chuan publicly defended the innocence of his brother. Raluek fled the country, and only returned to Thailand in 2004 after the statute of limitations expired on his crime and he couldn't be prosecuted. He had been on the run as a fugitive in Taiwan. Raluek has said he might enter politics in order to restore his reputation, although he said he wanted to live a quiet life in his Trang hometown.^[5]
First Term (1992-1995)[edit]
In the aftermath of Bloody May, the Democrat Party won the majority of seats in the September 1992 elections, with 79 seats, compared to the Chart Thai Party with 77 seats. Chuan formed a coalition government with the Phalang Dharma and Ekkaparb parties.

Key policies of Chuan's first administration included:

Engagement with Burma. As with all previous administrations, the Chuan government employed a policy of constructive engagement with the military government of Burma, provoking much criticism.^[6]

Reforestation. A huge 5 million rai reforestation programme in honour of King Bhumibol's 50th anniversary of accession to the throne (1996) was initiated in 1994. The reforestation programme was officially declared a failure, with less than 40% of the target realized. The Director General of the RFD was suspended from his post for alleged corruption within the programme.^[7]

Emphasis on national economic stability, decentralization of the administrative powers to the rural provinces, fostering income, opportunity and economic development distribution to the regions.

The first Chuan administration fell when members of the cabinet were implicated in profiting from Sor Phor Kor 4-01 land project documents distributed in Phuket province. Fierce public and press criticism and dissolution of Parliament were the reasons for his administration's downfall.^[8]
Second Term (1997-2001)[edit]

With United States President Bill Clinton in Wellington, New Zealand at the APEC summit, 1999

Chuan became prime minister for the second time on November 9, 1997, replacing Chavalit Yongchaiyudh, with a shaky line-up of a six-party coalition and 12 independent defectors from a seventh party, Prachakorn Thai. The ruling coalition increased its 20-seat majority in October 1998, by including the Chart Pattana party.
Economic Reforms[edit]
Chuan's second government enacted several economic reforms for which it was severely criticised. Chuan's "bitter medicine" policies brought little economic relief in the years following the 1997 economic crisis, particularly at the grassroots level. Opinions emerged that the Democrats were only helping big financial institutions and making the country more dependent of foreign investors. Nevertheless, many of the reforms recommended by the IMF were in line with the policies of market economies such as Australia and New Zealand. Interestingly, the subsequent government's economic growth was based even more strongly on selling national assets and private organisations abroad such as the Shin corporation, while most of their economic gains were built on the frugality of the Democrat policy platform. Thai Rak Thai painted the Democrats as having "open contempt" for the plight of the common Thai which set off a revenge vote against the party during the 2001 election, which gave a landslide victory to Thaksin Shinawatra.^[9]
Human Rights[edit]
Chuan's second government came under fire for the violent arrest of 223 villagers protesting the Pak Mun dam. Respected historian Nidhi Iawsriwong noted that "the present situation is as worse as that of the May event (the bloody crackdown of anti-government protesters in 1992). We have a tyrannical government that is arrogant and not accountable to the public. This is dangerous because the government still sees itself as legitimate and claims that it is democratic. In fact, it is as brutal as the military government".^[10]

In March 1999, Chuan nominated Thanom Kittikachorn to the post of honorary royal guard to King Bhumibol Adulyadej, provoking widespread criticism. Thanom turned down his appointment^[11] Thanom was one of the "Three Tyrants" who ruled Thailand from 1963 to 1973 and ordered the massacre of pro-democracy students on 14 October 1973, after which he was ordered to step down and be exiled by HM Bhumibol Adulyadej.

In April 2000, the Editor in Chief of the Chiang Mai daily newspaper Pak Nua was shot and seriously wounded in an attempted murder, but recovered. The editor believed that his repeated critical reporting on the government led to the assault.^[12]
Corruption[edit]
Although generally regarded as relatively clean and honest when compared to other Thai administrations, Chuan's government found itself plagued with corruption scandals and rumors. Key cases of corruption included:

Rakkiat Sukhthana, Health Minister, was charged with taking a five million THB (125,000 USD) bribe from a drug firm and forcing state hospitals to buy medicine at exorbitant prices. After being found guilty, he jumped bail and went into hiding.

Suthep Thaugsuban, Minister of Transport and Communications, whose brokering of illegal land deals caused the fall of the Chuan 1 government, was linked to abuse of funds in setting up a co-operative in his southern province of Surat Thani.^[13]

The "edible fence" seed scandal, in which massive overpricing of seeds distributed to rural areas happened. The Deputy Minister of Agriculture was forced to resign.^[14]

The Salween logging scandal, where up to 20,000 logs were felled illegally in the Salween forest in Mae Hong Son. Some of them turned up in the compound of the Democrat party’s office in Phichit province.^[14]

Sanan Kajornprasart, Interior Minister, as well as 8 other cabinet ministers were found to have understated their declared assets. Sanan was later barred by the Constitution Court from politics for 5 years.^[15]

Chuan himself was found by the National Counter-Corruption Commission to have undeclared shareholdings in a rural cooperative.^[15]

Chuan stepped down as the head of the Democrat Party in 2003.
Criticisms[edit]
Chuan also got the nickname 'Chang Tha Si' (painter in Thai). When party members were accused of corruption, he was always known to protect them by telling the press they were clean although the court had not delivered its decision yet.
Quotes[edit]
"I haven't received any reports yet."– (in Thai "ผมยังไม่ได้รับรายงาน") Chuan Leekpai's classic phrase when he faced many Thai reporters about some important issues or urgent issues.
"The committee is still evaluating it."– (in Thai "ทางคณะกำลังพิจารณาอยู่ครับ") One of his most famous quotes.
Now, we can pick another profile if you like and let's see if it fares much better. Fact is that Thailand is besieged by a lack of sincere politicians. The reasons a re simple - the apple pie is not big enough to allow wealth to grow organically and through the fruits of labor, instead it is build through corruption and shortcuts that are only possible by wielding the accrued power.

By the way, the profile I chose is not even close to the most corrupt of Thaksin's predecessors. There is one I will not name who is believed to have embezzled the equivalent of 2% of Thailand GDP. Look up, I am sure you will find it and along with it you will find the world "military" all over the place as well.

That is in the distant past - all I am really saying is that Thaksinites in their varying forms and guises have shown themselves 'not to be trusted' and should not have any say in shaping the future of Thailand bearing in mind they nearly brought this proud nation to its knees until the good General stepped in to rescue matters.

NeutralVoice · October 10, 2014

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I'm afraid that Thaksin, the PTP and UDD cannot be trusted as they cheat, lie, are corrupt and care only for themselves - whilst bankrupting the country in the process. As far as I'm concerned they don't deserve to have a say in anything as they are criminals/fugitives.

Far better off without them don't you agree!!!!

Let me agree with you that many of them are a bunch of self serving corrupt politicians.

Now, let's take another well known Thai politician. Chuan Leekpai - elected in September of 1,992, as the 20th Prime Minister and the first to come to power without aristocratic or military backing. Stop for a second and ponder on that statement. A democratic country that not until 1992 elected a Prime Minister that was not directly hand picked by the elite.

He served two terms, the first ended in May of 1995, which consisted of a 5 party coalition that got defeated by Chavalit Yongchaiyut. However that government was short lived as it was held responsible for the economic crisis that beset Thailand and much of Asia in 1997. This allowed Leekpai to return for a second term. Criticized as a slow actor, he allowed numerous corruption scandals to take place during his time in office.

The following is reprinted for Wikipedia
Raluek Leekpai Scandal[edit]
In 1987, when Chuan was Parliament Speaker, his younger brother Raluek Leekpai (ระลึก หลีกภัย) was charged with embezzling 231.8 million THB (approx. 9 million USD in 1987) from Thai Farmers Bank.^[4] Raluek had been an executive at TFB. Responding to accusations in Parliament, Chuan publicly defended the innocence of his brother. Raluek fled the country, and only returned to Thailand in 2004 after the statute of limitations expired on his crime and he couldn't be prosecuted. He had been on the run as a fugitive in Taiwan. Raluek has said he might enter politics in order to restore his reputation, although he said he wanted to live a quiet life in his Trang hometown.^[5]
First Term (1992-1995)[edit]
In the aftermath of Bloody May, the Democrat Party won the majority of seats in the September 1992 elections, with 79 seats, compared to the Chart Thai Party with 77 seats. Chuan formed a coalition government with the Phalang Dharma and Ekkaparb parties.

Key policies of Chuan's first administration included:

Engagement with Burma. As with all previous administrations, the Chuan government employed a policy of constructive engagement with the military government of Burma, provoking much criticism.^[6]

Reforestation. A huge 5 million rai reforestation programme in honour of King Bhumibol's 50th anniversary of accession to the throne (1996) was initiated in 1994. The reforestation programme was officially declared a failure, with less than 40% of the target realized. The Director General of the RFD was suspended from his post for alleged corruption within the programme.^[7]

Emphasis on national economic stability, decentralization of the administrative powers to the rural provinces, fostering income, opportunity and economic development distribution to the regions.

The first Chuan administration fell when members of the cabinet were implicated in profiting from Sor Phor Kor 4-01 land project documents distributed in Phuket province. Fierce public and press criticism and dissolution of Parliament were the reasons for his administration's downfall.^[8]
Second Term (1997-2001)[edit]

With United States President Bill Clinton in Wellington, New Zealand at the APEC summit, 1999

Chuan became prime minister for the second time on November 9, 1997, replacing Chavalit Yongchaiyudh, with a shaky line-up of a six-party coalition and 12 independent defectors from a seventh party, Prachakorn Thai. The ruling coalition increased its 20-seat majority in October 1998, by including the Chart Pattana party.
Economic Reforms[edit]
Chuan's second government enacted several economic reforms for which it was severely criticised. Chuan's "bitter medicine" policies brought little economic relief in the years following the 1997 economic crisis, particularly at the grassroots level. Opinions emerged that the Democrats were only helping big financial institutions and making the country more dependent of foreign investors. Nevertheless, many of the reforms recommended by the IMF were in line with the policies of market economies such as Australia and New Zealand. Interestingly, the subsequent government's economic growth was based even more strongly on selling national assets and private organisations abroad such as the Shin corporation, while most of their economic gains were built on the frugality of the Democrat policy platform. Thai Rak Thai painted the Democrats as having "open contempt" for the plight of the common Thai which set off a revenge vote against the party during the 2001 election, which gave a landslide victory to Thaksin Shinawatra.^[9]
Human Rights[edit]
Chuan's second government came under fire for the violent arrest of 223 villagers protesting the Pak Mun dam. Respected historian Nidhi Iawsriwong noted that "the present situation is as worse as that of the May event (the bloody crackdown of anti-government protesters in 1992). We have a tyrannical government that is arrogant and not accountable to the public. This is dangerous because the government still sees itself as legitimate and claims that it is democratic. In fact, it is as brutal as the military government".^[10]

In March 1999, Chuan nominated Thanom Kittikachorn to the post of honorary royal guard to King Bhumibol Adulyadej, provoking widespread criticism. Thanom turned down his appointment^[11] Thanom was one of the "Three Tyrants" who ruled Thailand from 1963 to 1973 and ordered the massacre of pro-democracy students on 14 October 1973, after which he was ordered to step down and be exiled by HM Bhumibol Adulyadej.

In April 2000, the Editor in Chief of the Chiang Mai daily newspaper Pak Nua was shot and seriously wounded in an attempted murder, but recovered. The editor believed that his repeated critical reporting on the government led to the assault.^[12]
Corruption[edit]
Although generally regarded as relatively clean and honest when compared to other Thai administrations, Chuan's government found itself plagued with corruption scandals and rumors. Key cases of corruption included:

Rakkiat Sukhthana, Health Minister, was charged with taking a five million THB (125,000 USD) bribe from a drug firm and forcing state hospitals to buy medicine at exorbitant prices. After being found guilty, he jumped bail and went into hiding.

Suthep Thaugsuban, Minister of Transport and Communications, whose brokering of illegal land deals caused the fall of the Chuan 1 government, was linked to abuse of funds in setting up a co-operative in his southern province of Surat Thani.^[13]

The "edible fence" seed scandal, in which massive overpricing of seeds distributed to rural areas happened. The Deputy Minister of Agriculture was forced to resign.^[14]

The Salween logging scandal, where up to 20,000 logs were felled illegally in the Salween forest in Mae Hong Son. Some of them turned up in the compound of the Democrat party’s office in Phichit province.^[14]

Sanan Kajornprasart, Interior Minister, as well as 8 other cabinet ministers were found to have understated their declared assets. Sanan was later barred by the Constitution Court from politics for 5 years.^[15]

Chuan himself was found by the National Counter-Corruption Commission to have undeclared shareholdings in a rural cooperative.^[15]

Chuan stepped down as the head of the Democrat Party in 2003.
Criticisms[edit]
Chuan also got the nickname 'Chang Tha Si' (painter in Thai). When party members were accused of corruption, he was always known to protect them by telling the press they were clean although the court had not delivered its decision yet.
Quotes[edit]
"I haven't received any reports yet."– (in Thai "ผมยังไม่ได้รับรายงาน") Chuan Leekpai's classic phrase when he faced many Thai reporters about some important issues or urgent issues.
"The committee is still evaluating it."– (in Thai "ทางคณะกำลังพิจารณาอยู่ครับ") One of his most famous quotes.
Now, we can pick another profile if you like and let's see if it fares much better. Fact is that Thailand is besieged by a lack of sincere politicians. The reasons a re simple - the apple pie is not big enough to allow wealth to grow organically and through the fruits of labor, instead it is build through corruption and shortcuts that are only possible by wielding the accrued power.

By the way, the profile I chose is not even close to the most corrupt of Thaksin's predecessors. There is one I will not name who is believed to have embezzled the equivalent of 2% of Thailand GDP. Look up, I am sure you will find it and along with it you will find the world "military" all over the place as well.

That is in the distant past - all I am really saying is that Thaksinites in their varying forms and guises have shown themselves 'not to be trusted' and should not have any say in shaping the future of Thailand bearing in mind they nearly brought this proud nation to its knees until the good General stepped in to rescue matters.

ROFL - that is what I call a very weak retort! The distant past huh? I guess the massacre of students just before that is also the distant past. An edit I made invited you to take a read at this link:

If you have a minute do so. Don't need to buy the book as the first page alone is a perfect description of today's political climate. History keeps repeating itself and that is because people like you choose to ignore and realize that the past teaches us much about the present and the future. It can be avoided if lessons are learned, otherwise people are destined to relived it again and again for generations to come.

NeutralVoice · October 10, 2014

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I'm afraid that Thaksin, the PTP and UDD cannot be trusted as they cheat, lie, are corrupt and care only for themselves - whilst bankrupting the country in the process. As far as I'm concerned they don't deserve to have a say in anything as they are criminals/fugitives.

Far better off without them don't you agree!!!!

Let me agree with you that many of them are a bunch of self serving corrupt politicians.

Now, let's take another well known Thai politician. Chuan Leekpai - elected in September of 1,992, as the 20th Prime Minister and the first to come to power without aristocratic or military backing. Stop for a second and ponder on that statement. A democratic country that not until 1992 elected a Prime Minister that was not directly hand picked by the elite.

He served two terms, the first ended in May of 1995, which consisted of a 5 party coalition that got defeated by Chavalit Yongchaiyut. However that government was short lived as it was held responsible for the economic crisis that beset Thailand and much of Asia in 1997. This allowed Leekpai to return for a second term. Criticized as a slow actor, he allowed numerous corruption scandals to take place during his time in office.

The following is reprinted for Wikipedia
Raluek Leekpai Scandal[edit]
In 1987, when Chuan was Parliament Speaker, his younger brother Raluek Leekpai (ระลึก หลีกภัย) was charged with embezzling 231.8 million THB (approx. 9 million USD in 1987) from Thai Farmers Bank.^[4] Raluek had been an executive at TFB. Responding to accusations in Parliament, Chuan publicly defended the innocence of his brother. Raluek fled the country, and only returned to Thailand in 2004 after the statute of limitations expired on his crime and he couldn't be prosecuted. He had been on the run as a fugitive in Taiwan. Raluek has said he might enter politics in order to restore his reputation, although he said he wanted to live a quiet life in his Trang hometown.^[5]
First Term (1992-1995)[edit]
In the aftermath of Bloody May, the Democrat Party won the majority of seats in the September 1992 elections, with 79 seats, compared to the Chart Thai Party with 77 seats. Chuan formed a coalition government with the Phalang Dharma and Ekkaparb parties.

Key policies of Chuan's first administration included:

Engagement with Burma. As with all previous administrations, the Chuan government employed a policy of constructive engagement with the military government of Burma, provoking much criticism.^[6]

Reforestation. A huge 5 million rai reforestation programme in honour of King Bhumibol's 50th anniversary of accession to the throne (1996) was initiated in 1994. The reforestation programme was officially declared a failure, with less than 40% of the target realized. The Director General of the RFD was suspended from his post for alleged corruption within the programme.^[7]

Emphasis on national economic stability, decentralization of the administrative powers to the rural provinces, fostering income, opportunity and economic development distribution to the regions.

The first Chuan administration fell when members of the cabinet were implicated in profiting from Sor Phor Kor 4-01 land project documents distributed in Phuket province. Fierce public and press criticism and dissolution of Parliament were the reasons for his administration's downfall.^[8]
Second Term (1997-2001)[edit]

With United States President Bill Clinton in Wellington, New Zealand at the APEC summit, 1999

Chuan became prime minister for the second time on November 9, 1997, replacing Chavalit Yongchaiyudh, with a shaky line-up of a six-party coalition and 12 independent defectors from a seventh party, Prachakorn Thai. The ruling coalition increased its 20-seat majority in October 1998, by including the Chart Pattana party.
Economic Reforms[edit]
Chuan's second government enacted several economic reforms for which it was severely criticised. Chuan's "bitter medicine" policies brought little economic relief in the years following the 1997 economic crisis, particularly at the grassroots level. Opinions emerged that the Democrats were only helping big financial institutions and making the country more dependent of foreign investors. Nevertheless, many of the reforms recommended by the IMF were in line with the policies of market economies such as Australia and New Zealand. Interestingly, the subsequent government's economic growth was based even more strongly on selling national assets and private organisations abroad such as the Shin corporation, while most of their economic gains were built on the frugality of the Democrat policy platform. Thai Rak Thai painted the Democrats as having "open contempt" for the plight of the common Thai which set off a revenge vote against the party during the 2001 election, which gave a landslide victory to Thaksin Shinawatra.^[9]
Human Rights[edit]
Chuan's second government came under fire for the violent arrest of 223 villagers protesting the Pak Mun dam. Respected historian Nidhi Iawsriwong noted that "the present situation is as worse as that of the May event (the bloody crackdown of anti-government protesters in 1992). We have a tyrannical government that is arrogant and not accountable to the public. This is dangerous because the government still sees itself as legitimate and claims that it is democratic. In fact, it is as brutal as the military government".^[10]

In March 1999, Chuan nominated Thanom Kittikachorn to the post of honorary royal guard to King Bhumibol Adulyadej, provoking widespread criticism. Thanom turned down his appointment^[11] Thanom was one of the "Three Tyrants" who ruled Thailand from 1963 to 1973 and ordered the massacre of pro-democracy students on 14 October 1973, after which he was ordered to step down and be exiled by HM Bhumibol Adulyadej.

In April 2000, the Editor in Chief of the Chiang Mai daily newspaper Pak Nua was shot and seriously wounded in an attempted murder, but recovered. The editor believed that his repeated critical reporting on the government led to the assault.^[12]
Corruption[edit]
Although generally regarded as relatively clean and honest when compared to other Thai administrations, Chuan's government found itself plagued with corruption scandals and rumors. Key cases of corruption included:

Rakkiat Sukhthana, Health Minister, was charged with taking a five million THB (125,000 USD) bribe from a drug firm and forcing state hospitals to buy medicine at exorbitant prices. After being found guilty, he jumped bail and went into hiding.

Suthep Thaugsuban, Minister of Transport and Communications, whose brokering of illegal land deals caused the fall of the Chuan 1 government, was linked to abuse of funds in setting up a co-operative in his southern province of Surat Thani.^[13]

The "edible fence" seed scandal, in which massive overpricing of seeds distributed to rural areas happened. The Deputy Minister of Agriculture was forced to resign.^[14]

The Salween logging scandal, where up to 20,000 logs were felled illegally in the Salween forest in Mae Hong Son. Some of them turned up in the compound of the Democrat party’s office in Phichit province.^[14]

Sanan Kajornprasart, Interior Minister, as well as 8 other cabinet ministers were found to have understated their declared assets. Sanan was later barred by the Constitution Court from politics for 5 years.^[15]

Chuan himself was found by the National Counter-Corruption Commission to have undeclared shareholdings in a rural cooperative.^[15]

Chuan stepped down as the head of the Democrat Party in 2003.
Criticisms[edit]
Chuan also got the nickname 'Chang Tha Si' (painter in Thai). When party members were accused of corruption, he was always known to protect them by telling the press they were clean although the court had not delivered its decision yet.
Quotes[edit]
"I haven't received any reports yet."– (in Thai "ผมยังไม่ได้รับรายงาน") Chuan Leekpai's classic phrase when he faced many Thai reporters about some important issues or urgent issues.
"The committee is still evaluating it."– (in Thai "ทางคณะกำลังพิจารณาอยู่ครับ") One of his most famous quotes.
Now, we can pick another profile if you like and let's see if it fares much better. Fact is that Thailand is besieged by a lack of sincere politicians. The reasons a re simple - the apple pie is not big enough to allow wealth to grow organically and through the fruits of labor, instead it is build through corruption and shortcuts that are only possible by wielding the accrued power.

By the way, the profile I chose is not even close to the most corrupt of Thaksin's predecessors. There is one I will not name who is believed to have embezzled the equivalent of 2% of Thailand GDP. Look up, I am sure you will find it and along with it you will find the world "military" all over the place as well.

That is in the distant past - all I am really saying is that Thaksinites in their varying forms and guises have shown themselves 'not to be trusted' and should not have any say in shaping the future of Thailand bearing in mind they nearly brought this proud nation to its knees until the good General stepped in to rescue matters.

ROFL - that is what I call a very weak retort! The distant past huh? I guess the massacre of students just before that is also the distant past. An edit I made invited you to take a read at this link:

If you have a minute do so. Don't need to buy the book as the first page alone is a perfect description of today's political climate. History keeps repeating itself and that is because people like you choose to ignore and realize that the past teaches us much about the present and the future. It can be avoided if lessons are learned, otherwise people are destined to relived it again and again for generations to come.

By the way, am I to infer that in 10 years time Thaksin and his family can return to politics? After all the events of his term will be heralded as the "distant past" by you and like minded people right?

SICHONSTEVE · October 10, 2014

Ahhhhh!!

But lessons have been learned and steps taken so that the past misdemeanours perpetrated by Thaksin and his hangers on have been addressed and they have been unceremoniously banished from the scene. This is why anything/anyone related to Thaksin has been removed and they have been put out to pasture.

Prayuth knew exactly what had to be done and he has achieved that goal.

All Thaksin affiliated/sympathetic civil servants and political figures have been vanquished and the law makers and policy makers that make up these newly formed (and powerful) bodies are Thaksin critics and fair minded people that are intelligent and knowledgeable.

This is exactly why there will be no repeats of the cycle of corruption and self serving crooks that have pervaded Thai life over the last century or so ever making it back to rob and abuse the people again!!!

khunjamesjohnson · October 10, 2014

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I'm afraid that Thaksin, the PTP and UDD cannot be trusted as they cheat, lie, are corrupt and care only for themselves - whilst bankrupting the country in the process. As far as I'm concerned they don't deserve to have a say in anything as they are criminals/fugitives.

Far better off without them don't you agree!!!!

Let me agree with you that many of them are a bunch of self serving corrupt politicians.

Now, let's take another well known Thai politician. Chuan Leekpai - elected in September of 1,992, as the 20th Prime Minister and the first to come to power without aristocratic or military backing. Stop for a second and ponder on that statement. A democratic country that not until 1992 elected a Prime Minister that was not directly hand picked by the elite.

He served two terms, the first ended in May of 1995, which consisted of a 5 party coalition that got defeated by Chavalit Yongchaiyut. However that government was short lived as it was held responsible for the economic crisis that beset Thailand and much of Asia in 1997. This allowed Leekpai to return for a second term. Criticized as a slow actor, he allowed numerous corruption scandals to take place during his time in office.

The following is reprinted for Wikipedia
Raluek Leekpai Scandal[edit]
In 1987, when Chuan was Parliament Speaker, his younger brother Raluek Leekpai (ระลึก หลีกภัย) was charged with embezzling 231.8 million THB (approx. 9 million USD in 1987) from Thai Farmers Bank.^[4] Raluek had been an executive at TFB. Responding to accusations in Parliament, Chuan publicly defended the innocence of his brother. Raluek fled the country, and only returned to Thailand in 2004 after the statute of limitations expired on his crime and he couldn't be prosecuted. He had been on the run as a fugitive in Taiwan. Raluek has said he might enter politics in order to restore his reputation, although he said he wanted to live a quiet life in his Trang hometown.^[5]
First Term (1992-1995)[edit]
In the aftermath of Bloody May, the Democrat Party won the majority of seats in the September 1992 elections, with 79 seats, compared to the Chart Thai Party with 77 seats. Chuan formed a coalition government with the Phalang Dharma and Ekkaparb parties.

Key policies of Chuan's first administration included:

Engagement with Burma. As with all previous administrations, the Chuan government employed a policy of constructive engagement with the military government of Burma, provoking much criticism.^[6]

Reforestation. A huge 5 million rai reforestation programme in honour of King Bhumibol's 50th anniversary of accession to the throne (1996) was initiated in 1994. The reforestation programme was officially declared a failure, with less than 40% of the target realized. The Director General of the RFD was suspended from his post for alleged corruption within the programme.^[7]

Emphasis on national economic stability, decentralization of the administrative powers to the rural provinces, fostering income, opportunity and economic development distribution to the regions.

The first Chuan administration fell when members of the cabinet were implicated in profiting from Sor Phor Kor 4-01 land project documents distributed in Phuket province. Fierce public and press criticism and dissolution of Parliament were the reasons for his administration's downfall.^[8]
Second Term (1997-2001)[edit]

With United States President Bill Clinton in Wellington, New Zealand at the APEC summit, 1999

Chuan became prime minister for the second time on November 9, 1997, replacing Chavalit Yongchaiyudh, with a shaky line-up of a six-party coalition and 12 independent defectors from a seventh party, Prachakorn Thai. The ruling coalition increased its 20-seat majority in October 1998, by including the Chart Pattana party.
Economic Reforms[edit]
Chuan's second government enacted several economic reforms for which it was severely criticised. Chuan's "bitter medicine" policies brought little economic relief in the years following the 1997 economic crisis, particularly at the grassroots level. Opinions emerged that the Democrats were only helping big financial institutions and making the country more dependent of foreign investors. Nevertheless, many of the reforms recommended by the IMF were in line with the policies of market economies such as Australia and New Zealand. Interestingly, the subsequent government's economic growth was based even more strongly on selling national assets and private organisations abroad such as the Shin corporation, while most of their economic gains were built on the frugality of the Democrat policy platform. Thai Rak Thai painted the Democrats as having "open contempt" for the plight of the common Thai which set off a revenge vote against the party during the 2001 election, which gave a landslide victory to Thaksin Shinawatra.^[9]
Human Rights[edit]
Chuan's second government came under fire for the violent arrest of 223 villagers protesting the Pak Mun dam. Respected historian Nidhi Iawsriwong noted that "the present situation is as worse as that of the May event (the bloody crackdown of anti-government protesters in 1992). We have a tyrannical government that is arrogant and not accountable to the public. This is dangerous because the government still sees itself as legitimate and claims that it is democratic. In fact, it is as brutal as the military government".^[10]

In March 1999, Chuan nominated Thanom Kittikachorn to the post of honorary royal guard to King Bhumibol Adulyadej, provoking widespread criticism. Thanom turned down his appointment^[11] Thanom was one of the "Three Tyrants" who ruled Thailand from 1963 to 1973 and ordered the massacre of pro-democracy students on 14 October 1973, after which he was ordered to step down and be exiled by HM Bhumibol Adulyadej.

In April 2000, the Editor in Chief of the Chiang Mai daily newspaper Pak Nua was shot and seriously wounded in an attempted murder, but recovered. The editor believed that his repeated critical reporting on the government led to the assault.^[12]
Corruption[edit]
Although generally regarded as relatively clean and honest when compared to other Thai administrations, Chuan's government found itself plagued with corruption scandals and rumors. Key cases of corruption included:

Rakkiat Sukhthana, Health Minister, was charged with taking a five million THB (125,000 USD) bribe from a drug firm and forcing state hospitals to buy medicine at exorbitant prices. After being found guilty, he jumped bail and went into hiding.

Suthep Thaugsuban, Minister of Transport and Communications, whose brokering of illegal land deals caused the fall of the Chuan 1 government, was linked to abuse of funds in setting up a co-operative in his southern province of Surat Thani.^[13]

The "edible fence" seed scandal, in which massive overpricing of seeds distributed to rural areas happened. The Deputy Minister of Agriculture was forced to resign.^[14]

The Salween logging scandal, where up to 20,000 logs were felled illegally in the Salween forest in Mae Hong Son. Some of them turned up in the compound of the Democrat party’s office in Phichit province.^[14]

Sanan Kajornprasart, Interior Minister, as well as 8 other cabinet ministers were found to have understated their declared assets. Sanan was later barred by the Constitution Court from politics for 5 years.^[15]

Chuan himself was found by the National Counter-Corruption Commission to have undeclared shareholdings in a rural cooperative.^[15]

Chuan stepped down as the head of the Democrat Party in 2003.
Criticisms[edit]
Chuan also got the nickname 'Chang Tha Si' (painter in Thai). When party members were accused of corruption, he was always known to protect them by telling the press they were clean although the court had not delivered its decision yet.
Quotes[edit]
"I haven't received any reports yet."– (in Thai "ผมยังไม่ได้รับรายงาน") Chuan Leekpai's classic phrase when he faced many Thai reporters about some important issues or urgent issues.
"The committee is still evaluating it."– (in Thai "ทางคณะกำลังพิจารณาอยู่ครับ") One of his most famous quotes.
Now, we can pick another profile if you like and let's see if it fares much better. Fact is that Thailand is besieged by a lack of sincere politicians. The reasons a re simple - the apple pie is not big enough to allow wealth to grow organically and through the fruits of labor, instead it is build through corruption and shortcuts that are only possible by wielding the accrued power.

By the way, the profile I chose is not even close to the most corrupt of Thaksin's predecessors. There is one I will not name who is believed to have embezzled the equivalent of 2% of Thailand GDP. Look up, I am sure you will find it and along with it you will find the world "military" all over the place as well.

That is in the distant past - all I am really saying is that Thaksinites in their varying forms and guises have shown themselves 'not to be trusted' and should not have any say in shaping the future of Thailand bearing in mind they nearly brought this proud nation to its knees until the good General stepped in to rescue matters.

Thaksin brought this proud country to it's knees?

Was that in 2003 when the stock market went up 103% and he had a budget surplus over 200 billion?

Or the landslide election in 2004. Is that when he brought it to it's knees?

No, I don't remember Thaksin bringing the country to it's knees. Sorry.

The trouble started in 2006 when someone with a grudge ordered the Army takeover.

First, a mob with that crooked Sonthi leading the chaos. "A manufactured crisis that only the army could solve........"

Remember that PM the Army installed? Caught with a house in a national preserve!.

"Oooops. Sorry. Somehow I didn't know my house got built on the land was in a national reserve. I'll haul it away now and we can all just forget about it.OK?...". The Nation newspaper gave him a pass.

Can you imagine the outrage in The Nation if Thaksin did that?

heybruce · October 10, 2014

like Pakistan, where there was a military coup and the forces took over the country, but they did it largely for the good of the country and they are not maintaining control in order to personally enrich themselves, but in order to stabilize the country.

benign means not harmful. dictatorship means control.

Found this on a Yahoo forum and also heard it mentioned on a debate on the BBC discussing the merit and pitfalls of democracy by some professor.

I'd like to know what forum that was, and who stated that in the BBC debate. A great many people think the Pakistan military is primarily interested in protecting the Pakistan military.

It was the intelligence squared debate on the 14th May 2014 and 'benign democracy was mentioned as a good system for developing nations by professor Rosemary Hollis who is professor of Middle East policy studies at City University and author of No friend of Democratisation: Europe’s role in the genesis of the ‘Arab Spring’.

Thank you for the prompt reply. Do you know which coup she was referring to? Pakistan, like Thailand, has had many.

I don't watch the Intelligence Squared Debate but I get a lot of my news from the Economist. From the book review article "Nosebags" in the September 2014 issue of the Economist:

"MOST countries have armies, but in Pakistan the army has a country. Historians repeat that aphorism because Pakistan’s military men have always enjoyed disproportionate political clout. The men in khaki have ruled directly for 33 of the country’s 67 years and have meddled heavily in politics the rest of the time, right up to the present day.

The warriors in charge take the lion’s share of public spending. Figures are opaque, but Ayesha Jalal in a new history, “The Struggle for Pakistan”, offers some shocking ones. In 1973, she says, almost 90% of the federal budget went to military ends. By the late 1980s, around 80% of current spending either paid off debt or funded the army. Little has improved. Christine Fair, whose “Fighting to the End” is similarly sharp, suggests that the $30 billion of direct and indirect aid which America has given Pakistan in the past 11 years has done little but enrich the military men."

and:

"The army’s record is not one to be proud of. Wars launched against India in 1947, 1965 and 1999, won little or nothing beyond international opprobrium. Genocidal repression of Bengalis in East Pakistan led to the loss of that half of the country, after a humiliating defeat by India’s army in 1971. Pakistan’s army became a nuclear proliferator, supplying technology to North Korea, Iran and Libya. It also pushed Islamist extremist groups to export terror and instability, which now worries China, as well as India and Afghanistan."

From the November 30, 2013 issue in the article "Out of the Driver's Seat":

"The army sees itself as both embodiment and guarantor of the nation. Yet it has long been at the root of Pakistan’s deepest problems. By meddling in elections and mounting coups, it has weakened the political classes, whose consequent ineptitude and corruption gives it cause to meddle again. It has a history of disastrous military adventures. And it has made common cause with militant Islamists who it hoped would further its interests abroad—keeping India on edge to the south and sowing confusion in Afghanistan to the north in hopes of preventing anti-Pakistan forces growing there."

All this is somewhat off-topic, but I don't think Pakistan provides an example of a good coup or coups and a benign military. It has ruled the country directly for half of the last 67 years, and stayed in the shadows intimidating civilian governments the rest of time. In spite of all these interventions the country is still a mess.

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