Possible way to meet retirement visa financial requirements?

[malt25]

In Jomtien, the tray where you get the form to extend says "Retirement Visa". The form says "Retirement Visa" on its heading. The desks that deal with it has a 20 foot sign saying "Retirement Visa". The stamp they put in your passport says "Retirement Visa". I am gonna be very daring and call it a "Retirement Visa".

You're gunna get in trouble !!!!

[billd766]

You are a US citizen, all you need to do is go to the US Embassy and get a financial statement notarized. That is acceptable proof for any Thai Immigration office, Embassy, or Consulate.

You state what your income is on the affidavit (you can put any amount), and the US Embassy asks you if it is true, you say yes, and they notarize it. They do not ask you for proof of the stated income (unlike other country's embassies).

So don't worry about proving your income, just get the notarized affidavit and you are good to go.

The problem with that is that the Thai Immigration CAN ask for more proof than your word. If you cannot prove it they may not give you an extension and they may also go back to the US Embassy about you.

If you have not told the truth about your income then the US Embassy will not be very happy with you.

If you can prove the income then there is of course no problem.

[thailiketoo]

Always the same. Maybe there could be pinned topics. 1. The right name for a retirement visa. 2. Non Americans advising Americans that they might not believe the American Embassy. 3. Thai banks not wanting to give you a letter saying you have money in a Thai bank or the chicken little conspiracy.

[Jingthing]

As far as I'm concerned the Duke of Earl can call a can of beans a tin of caviar, in the comments I post here, I'm not going to be calling conversion to 0 visas done in Thailand retirement visas, or single entry O visas obtained outside Thailand retirement visas, or annual extensions to stay based on retirement retirement visas because they are not. The reason Thai immigration people and local visa agents call a bunch of DIFFERENT THINGS retirement visas for convenience is they aren't really interested in the big picture of all the global options, such as O-A visas from abroad because they don't issue them. Also commercial visa agents for their own profit motive would rather that you don't really understand the terminology and mechanics of this; otherwise why would you pay them money?

Similarly, a reason why embassies abroad sometimes give out false information that O-A visas are the only method for retirement in Thailand is because that's all they have got so why would they bother knowing about or advising about other options that have nothing to do with them.

So tunnel vision ... we here can see the bigger picture and correct labeling really helps giving more accurate advice and in asking more coherent questions. Calling a bunch of different things retirement visas while it may seem the lazy popular choice actually in the long run just serves to muddy the waters because people who really understand the different options can't possibly know exactly what you're asking about if all you say is retirement visa.

Edited October 15, 2014 by Jingthing

[pmarlin]

Reading this topic it seems that some of my fellow Americans think it is alright to put what ever income they want, even falsely, that is not the case. One guy here said he averaged out his income in baht and reported that and evidently he isn't American because the letter states income in dollars.

For those he think it is alright to falsely swear to an official US government letter check out this web site. I picked it because it is easy to understand.

Falsifying Documents

http://www.legalmatch.com/law-library/article/falsifying-documents.html

[thailiketoo]

Reading this topic it seems that some of my fellow Americans think it is alright to put what ever income they want, even falsely, that is not the case. One guy here said he averaged out his income in baht and reported that and evidently he isn't American because the letter states income in dollars.

For those he think it is alright to falsely swear to an official US government letter check out this web site. I picked it because it is easy to understand.

Falsifying Documents

http://www.legalmatch.com/law-library/article/falsifying-documents.html

Equally true for every document signed having to do with any government. So why would you think we all don't know this? Why would you post to remind people to tell the truth? I don't get it? It would be different if you posted some factual information about Americans going to jail for lying on forms written in Thailand. That would be topical. But why a generic warning don't lie on government forms? Isn't it obvious? Don't lie don't cheat everyone agrees with you. Americans never lie. Everyone knows that. Why belabor the issue?

[pmarlin]

Reading this topic it seems that some of my fellow Americans think it is alright to put what ever income they want, even falsely, that is not the case. One guy here said he averaged out his income in baht and reported that and evidently he isn't American because the letter states income in dollars.

For those he think it is alright to falsely swear to an official US government letter check out this web site. I picked it because it is easy to understand.

Falsifying Documents

http://www.legalmatch.com/law-library/article/falsifying-documents.html

Equally true for every document signed having to do with any government. So why would you think we all don't know this? Why would you post to remind people to tell the truth? I don't get it? It would be different if you posted some factual information about Americans going to jail for lying on forms written in Thailand. That would be topical. But why a generic warning don't lie on government forms? Isn't it obvious? Don't lie don't cheat everyone agrees with you. Americans never lie. Everyone knows that. Why belabor the issue?

Because those who don't play by the rules can and most likely make it hard on the rest of us who do. If this doesn't apply to you then why even reply to my post.

[jack19201]

Why is that If you bring your Thai wife to the UK, we have to show income, accommodation etc And If we want to settlement in thai wife's con try we/farang still have to show income so to get thai visa WHY?.

It is not fair at all is it.

[balo]

You can also talk to a visa agency in Bangkok and they will help you to get a retirement visa against a fee of 24000 baht. Its all legal except 800k will not be your money..... you're borrowing 800k for one day to meet the financial requirements.

It can't be legal if you only borrow the money for one day

So how long then , a month ? I know of retired people borrowing 800k to.meet the requirements and they will get their stamps from immigration.

[Jingthing]

You can also talk to a visa agency in Bangkok and they will help you to get a retirement visa against a fee of 24000 baht. Its all legal except 800k will not be your money..... you're borrowing 800k for one day to meet the financial requirements.

It can't be legal if you only borrow the money for one day

So how long then , a month ? I know of retired people borrowing 800k to.meet the requirements and they will get their stamps from immigration.

A LEGAL application using 800k method will be seasoned in the applicant's account for 2 months the first time and three for later times. Anything else is dodgy.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[balo]

You can also talk to a visa agency in Bangkok and they will help you to get a retirement visa against a fee of 24000 baht. Its all legal except 800k will not be your money..... you're borrowing 800k for one day to meet the financial requirements.

It can't be legal if you only borrow the money for one day

So how long then , a month ? I know of retired people borrowing 800k to.meet the requirements and they will get their stamps from immigration.

A LEGAL application using 800k method will be seasoned in the applicant's account for 2 months the first time and three for later times. Anything else is dodgy.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Dodgy or not, many people apply for retirement using this agency on a weekly basis. Never been a problem, not even after the crackdown.

[Jingthing]

A coincidence you think visa conversions have now been discontinued at Jomtien?

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[thailiketoo]

A coincidence you think visa conversions have now been discontinued at Jomtien?

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

So why did they not discontinue the extensions?

[NeverSure]

You might take a clue from the Immigration application form you have to submit when you apply for your extension of stay based on retirement.

PS3202.jpg

I can extend a visa which is a temporary stay.

[paz]

You might take a clue from the Immigration application form you have to submit when you apply for your extension of stay based on retirement.

PS3202.jpg

I can extend a visa which is a temporary stay.

You are not extending a visa. Visa are never extended. You are obtaining an extension of stay, for which having a visa may not even be a prerequisite.

[ubonjoe]

You can also talk to a visa agency in Bangkok and they will help you to get a retirement visa against a fee of 24000 baht. Its all legal except 800k will not be your money..... you're borrowing 800k for one day to meet the financial requirements.

It can't be legal if you only borrow the money for one day

So how long then , a month ? I know of retired people borrowing 800k to.meet the requirements and they will get their stamps from immigration.

A LEGAL application using 800k method will be seasoned in the applicant's account for 2 months the first time and three for later times. Anything else is dodgy.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Any extension that does not meet the financial requirements would be considered fraudulent. Presenting false documents that show the money has been in the bank for the required amount of time is fraud. It is as simple as that to explain.

[balo]

So how long then , a month ? I know of retired people borrowing 800k to.meet the requirements and they will get their stamps from immigration.

A LEGAL application using 800k method will be seasoned in the applicant's account for 2 months the first time and three for later times. Anything else is dodgy.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Any extension that does not meet the financial requirements would be considered fraudulent. Presenting false documents that show the money has been in the bank for the required amount of time is fraud. It is as simple as that to explain.

Its not a fake document since the money has been transfered into the account and then back. Just like you would borrow money from someone and eturn it after days or weeks. Its fully legal so please dont call it a fraud.

Edited October 16, 2014 by ubonjoe
removed 2 quotes to fix broken quote (4 is maximum number of quotes allowed)

[paz]

Its not a fake document since the money has been transfered into the account and then back. Just like you would borrow money from someone and eturn it after days or weeks. Its fully legal so please dont call it a fraud.

No. The regulations ask for the money to be left in the account for 3 months.

So what this people does is illegal and obtained with corruption.

[ubonjoe]

So how long then , a month ? I know of retired people borrowing 800k to.meet the requirements and they will get their stamps from immigration.

A LEGAL application using 800k method will be seasoned in the applicant's account for 2 months the first time and three for later times. Anything else is dodgy.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Any extension that does not meet the financial requirements would be considered fraudulent. Presenting false documents that show the money has been in the bank for the required amount of time is fraud. It is as simple as that to explain.

Its not a fake document since the money has been transfered into the account and then back. Just like you would borrow money from someone and eturn it after days or weeks. Its fully legal so please dont call it a fraud.

The funds have to be in bank for 2 or 3 months unless it is a conversion being done.

If not really in the bank that long and bank documents are presented stating it was it is fraudulent application.

[Evilbaz]

So - just because I'm in a peed-ant kinda mood:

1. when an OA holder leaves an re-enters the Kingdom they get an extension of stay

2. when a retirement extension holder renews they get an extension of stay

So what just is the difference of their rights within the Kingdom?

[Jingthing]

So - just because I'm in a peed-ant kinda mood:

1. when an OA holder leaves an re-enters the Kingdom they get an extension of stay

2. when a retirement extension holder renews they get an extension of stay

So what just is the difference of their rights within the Kingdom?

Not really sure what you're driving at but I think even your question might be flawed.

When I first entered Thailand with a single entry O visa I had permission to stay in Thailand based on the VISA, not based on later retirement extension to stays.

So I assume if you enter on an O-A your permission to stay is based on that visa. It changes to be based on your extension to stay if/when you LATER apply for an annual extension to stay at Thai immigration.

As far as "right" within Thailand if your stay is based on a visa or later an extension, I don't think there is any difference at all.

[slipperylobster]

Was successful with an Affidavit of Income from the US Embassy....along with six months of bank statements, showing sources and amounts of deposits each month, as well as withdrawals from the ATM here. No questions asked. This was in Savannakhet, just 3 days ago. The Affidavit will not stand by itself..at least not there. The bank statements were exactly what the officer was looking for.

By the way, anyone can swear they make 65,000 baht a month, and get an Affidavit of Income from the Embassy. Looks like now, you need something to support it.

This was for a 90 day non immigrant O visa based on retirement.

[thailiketoo]

Was successful with an Affidavit of Income from the US Embassy....along with six months of bank statements, showing sources and amounts of deposits each month, as well as withdrawals from the ATM here. No questions asked. This was in Savannakhet, just 3 days ago. The Affidavit will not stand by itself..at least not there. The bank statements were exactly what the officer was looking for.

By the way, anyone can swear they make 65,000 baht a month, and get an Affidavit of Income from the Embassy. Looks like now, you need something to support it.

This was for a 90 day non immigrant O visa based on retirement.

Did you get a retirement extension at Savannakhet? I thought that was in Laos. I thought we were talking about getting a retirement extension and for that purpose I have never heard of anyone being asked for anything but a letter from the embassy except if it is a combined method and then the bank letter and the difference made up by the embassy letter.

I think you are talking about something different. Yes? You didn't mention the most important fact. What kind of document were you getting?

It is very easy to confuse the issue by leaving out important details and by calling things by the wrong name.

A lot of people try to scare people by mentioning requirements that are not related to their particular situation.

Edited October 16, 2014 by thailiketoo

[jpeg]

Possible way to meet retirement visa financial requirements?

Yeah. Just pop along to your nearest Visa salesman and fork out whatever's the going rate in your particular area. They (Immigration) expect nothing less

[ubonjoe]

So - just because I'm in a peed-ant kinda mood:

1. when an OA holder leaves an re-enters the Kingdom they get an extension of stay

2. when a retirement extension holder renews they get an extension of stay

So what just is the difference of their rights within the Kingdom?

1. When you enter with a OA visa you get a one year permit to stay not an extension.

2. A person that has an extension has applied for an extension of a permit to stay from non immigrant visa entry. That entry could of been several years ago and a new extension of that permit to stay could of been granted several times.

There is no difference in rights other than when doing certain things that may require you to be on an extension stay.

For example some immigration offices might not issue a certificate of residence needed for a drivers license because you are not on sn extension granted by their office.

[Evilbaz]

So - just because I'm in a peed-ant kinda mood:

1. when an OA holder leaves an re-enters the Kingdom they get an extension of stay

2. when a retirement extension holder renews they get an extension of stay

So what just is the difference of their rights within the Kingdom?

1. When you enter with a OA visa you get a one year permit to stay not an extension.

2. A person that has an extension has applied for an extension of a permit to stay from non immigrant visa entry. That entry could of been several years ago and a new extension of that permit to stay could of been granted several times.

There is no difference in rights other than when doing certain things that may require you to be on an extension stay.

For example some immigration offices might not issue a certificate of residence needed for a drivers license because you are not on sn extension granted by their office.

You seem to have overlooked the leaves and re-enters part of (1)?

Edited October 16, 2014 by ubonjoe
moved reply from quoted text

[ubonjoe]

So - just because I'm in a peed-ant kinda mood:

1. when an OA holder leaves an re-enters the Kingdom they get an extension of stay

2. when a retirement extension holder renews they get an extension of stay

So what just is the difference of their rights within the Kingdom?

1. When you enter with a OA visa you get a one year permit to stay not an extension.

2. A person that has an extension has applied for an extension of a permit to stay from non immigrant visa entry. That entry could of been several years ago and a new extension of that permit to stay could of been granted several times.

There is no difference in rights other than when doing certain things that may require you to be on an extension stay.

For example some immigration offices might not issue a certificate of residence needed for a drivers license because you are not on sn extension granted by their office.

You seem to have overlooked the leaves and re-enters part of (1)?

When you leave and re-enter you get a new one year permit to stay until the visa expires.

After the visa expires you get and use a re-entry permit that gives you the same permit to stay date you had when you left.

[balo]

So how long then , a month ? I know of retired people borrowing 800k to.meet the requirements and they will get their stamps from immigration.

A LEGAL application using 800k method will be seasoned in the applicant's account for 2 months the first time and three for later times. Anything else is dodgy.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Any extension that does not meet the financial requirements would be considered fraudulent. Presenting false documents that show the money has been in the bank for the required amount of time is fraud. It is as simple as that to explain.

Its not a fake document since the money has been transfered into the account and then back. Just like you would borrow money from someone and eturn it after days or weeks. Its fully legal so please dont call it a fraud.

The funds have to be in bank for 2 or 3 months unless it is a conversion being done.

If not really in the bank that long and bank documents are presented stating it was it is fraudulent application.

So its not a fraud then , you can borrow money for 2 months and get a valid visa. That was my point. A lot of retired people borrow money to get this visa .

[Jingthing]

There is no rule that you can't borrow money per se.

Nobody has said that there was!

BUT if you pay a visa fixer to get an extension and the funds in a Thai bank account in your name have not been seasoned for the proper period (2 or 3 months depending)

then you OBVIOUSLY are paying money to avoid following the letter of the Thai law.

Intentionally or not.

I think a lot of people go to agents and basically don't ask/don't tell about the legalities/technical details about this ... maybe for the best from their POV.

We won't go into details on how this might happen; use your imagination.

So if you go in and the whole business is concluded in a few days ... and you haven't come in already with a seasoned bank account, then you know 100 percent the Thai law has not been followed.

Again, the Thai law does NOT prohibit borrowing money for this IF the money ends up being seasoned for the proscribed times under the law.

If the response to this is that such situations are standard in the "Thai way of life" or we "tink too mut" or "who cares, you can get away with it" then I think that is more of a philosophical subject for another thread in another forum. This forum here is about helping people deal with Thai immigration in a LEGAL way.

Edited October 16, 2014 by Jingthing

[thailiketoo]

Was successful with an Affidavit of Income from the US Embassy....along with six months of bank statements, showing sources and amounts of deposits each month, as well as withdrawals from the ATM here. No questions asked. This was in Savannakhet, just 3 days ago. The Affidavit will not stand by itself..at least not there. The bank statements were exactly what the officer was looking for.

By the way, anyone can swear they make 65,000 baht a month, and get an Affidavit of Income from the Embassy. Looks like now, you need something to support it.

This was for a 90 day non immigrant O visa based on retirement.

Sorry you lost me there. I entered with an OA visa good for a year and got extensions good for a year based on retirement and have never heard of anyone being asked to document the embassy letter.

You have not contradicted that because you didn't get a year extension in Thailand based on retirement.

So as far as anyone knows the embassy letter is sufficient for the yearly extension.