Thailand in WW2

[maps]

The USA bombed Bangkok with B-29 Super fortresses to practice for the fire bombing on Tokyo; why didn't Bangkok burn down like Tokyo?

Probably been raining and flooded

555

On 5 June 1944, B-29s raided Bangkok, in what is reported as a test before being deployed against the Japanese home islands. Sources do not report from where they launched, and vary as to the numbers involved—77, 98, and 114 being claimed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_B-29_Superfortress

During early 1944 the USAAF began deploying B-29s to India and China, with new airfields constructed to accommodate these huge aircraft.

As the B-29s were new to the war effort and many crews without mission experience, a number of 'shakedown' missions were planned for April and May but these never eventuated.

The first of these 'shakedown' missions was as mentioned on 5th June and purposely flown from bases in India to preserve limited fuel stocks in China.

The bases used in India were Chakulia, Dudkhundi, Piardoba and Khalagpur, all west of Calcutta.

All the B-29s were from the 58th Bomb Wing, comprising the 40th, 444th, 482nd and 468th Bomb Groups, the target being the Makasan Rail Yards in Bangkok.

112 aircraft were scheduled for the mission, but of the 98 that proceeded only 77 made it to the target area. Of that 77, only 48 bombed the target area and only 9 hit

the primary target. Bangkok weather was heavy overcast at the time and the B-29s were bombing from 23,000 feet.

This was the first B-29 bombing mission of Bangkok (previous missions being flown with B-24 Liberators)

The round trip was over 2.200 miles, the longest bombing mission to date in the war.

Although no aircraft were lost to enemy action, 5 were lost to mechanical problems. Others arrived back in India literally running on fumes and out of fuel.

Bombs used in this mission were 500lb General Purpose and not incendiary bombs as used in the later 'fire raids' on Tokyo.

The four Indian airfileds mentioned above although long abandoned still remain and are visible in Google Earth.

Just tried to attach the KMZ files but doesn't seem to wotk. Any clues ?

[hawker9000]

i love thailand but as far as WW2 is concerned, I dislike thailand for siding with Japan.

why would they have sided with countries practising asian colonialism?

Uhh, because the Japanese were conducting a brutal war of aggression, seeking to establish a colonial empire of their own?

Uhh, because Japanese methods were barbaric, with millions of innocent non-combatant civilians deliberately raped, murdered, interned, and enslaved?

The argument about the pragmatism of it is one thing, but the anti-colonial rant is totally absurd. The Japanese occupation ( yes, it was an occupation; just a very benign one, thanks to the "pragmatism" just mentioned) is probably the closest Thailand has ever been to a colonial relationship.

[thailiketoo]

i love thailand but as far as WW2 is concerned, I dislike thailand for siding with Japan.

why would they have sided with countries practising asian colonialism?

Uhh, because the Japanese were conducting a brutal war of aggression, seeking to establish a colonial empire of their own?

Uhh, because Japanese methods were barbaric, with millions of innocent non-combatant civilians deliberately raped, murdered, interned, and enslaved?

The argument about the pragmatism of it is one thing, but the anti-colonial rant is totally absurd. The Japanese occupation ( yes, it was an occupation; just a very benign one, thanks to the "pragmatism" just mentioned) is probably the closest Thailand has ever been to a colonial relationship.

Can you occupy an allied country. The evidence suggests Thailand made an agreement with Japan before Japan arrived in Thailand. Can you occupy an ally when the ally has an army and is fighting with you (invasion of Burma). Isn't it kind of like saying America occupied Australia in WWII?

"Thailand had a well-disciplined military, and in 1940–41 had invaded neighbouring French Indochina to recover provinces lost in the Sino-French War of 1884–85. The Japanese, who wanted to use the Indo-Chinese ports and air-bases, acted as negotiators to bring about a settlement between the French and Thais on 31 January 1941^. As part of the process, secret discussions were held with Thai Prime Minister Phibun Songkhram, in which the Japanese military sought free passage through Thailand. Phibun had responded positively....."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_invasion_of_Thailand

[AYJAYDEE]

i love thailand but as far as WW2 is concerned, I dislike thailand for siding with Japan.

why would they have sided with countries practising asian colonialism?

Uhh, because the Japanese were conducting a brutal war of aggression, seeking to establish a colonial empire of their own?

Uhh, because Japanese methods were barbaric, with millions of innocent non-combatant civilians deliberately raped, murdered, interned, and enslaved?

The argument about the pragmatism of it is one thing, but the anti-colonial rant is totally absurd. The Japanese occupation ( yes, it was an occupation; just a very benign one, thanks to the "pragmatism" just mentioned) is probably the closest Thailand has ever been to a colonial relationship.

they already saw what western colonialists behaved like and wanted none of that brutality. the west treated their conquered countries worse than the japanese treated the thais!! and they believed japans lure of the greater east asian co-prosperity sphere.

[thailiketoo]

why would they have sided with countries practising asian colonialism?

Uhh, because the Japanese were conducting a brutal war of aggression, seeking to establish a colonial empire of their own?

Uhh, because Japanese methods were barbaric, with millions of innocent non-combatant civilians deliberately raped, murdered, interned, and enslaved?

The argument about the pragmatism of it is one thing, but the anti-colonial rant is totally absurd. The Japanese occupation ( yes, it was an occupation; just a very benign one, thanks to the "pragmatism" just mentioned) is probably the closest Thailand has ever been to a colonial relationship.

they already saw what western colonialists behaved like and wanted none of that brutality. the west treated their conquered countries worse than the japanese treated the thais!! and they believed japans lure of the greater east asian co-prosperity sphere.

Japan paid them and the West did not. Let's not forget Thais are after all still Thais.

[AYJAYDEE]

why would they have sided with countries practising asian colonialism?

Uhh, because the Japanese were conducting a brutal war of aggression, seeking to establish a colonial empire of their own?

Uhh, because Japanese methods were barbaric, with millions of innocent non-combatant civilians deliberately raped, murdered, interned, and enslaved?

The argument about the pragmatism of it is one thing, but the anti-colonial rant is totally absurd. The Japanese occupation ( yes, it was an occupation; just a very benign one, thanks to the "pragmatism" just mentioned) is probably the closest Thailand has ever been to a colonial relationship.

they already saw what western colonialists behaved like and wanted none of that brutality. the west treated their conquered countries worse than the japanese treated the thais!! and they believed japans lure of the greater east asian co-prosperity sphere.

Japan paid them and the West did not. Let's not forget Thais are after all still Thais.

and america paid britain. whats your point? why would any asian country ally themselves with thugs like britain, france and the netherlands after watching how they had been behaving toward asians the last couple of hundred years?

[thailiketoo]

Uhh, because the Japanese were conducting a brutal war of aggression, seeking to establish a colonial empire of their own?

Uhh, because Japanese methods were barbaric, with millions of innocent non-combatant civilians deliberately raped, murdered, interned, and enslaved?

The argument about the pragmatism of it is one thing, but the anti-colonial rant is totally absurd. The Japanese occupation ( yes, it was an occupation; just a very benign one, thanks to the "pragmatism" just mentioned) is probably the closest Thailand has ever been to a colonial relationship.

they already saw what western colonialists behaved like and wanted none of that brutality. the west treated their conquered countries worse than the japanese treated the thais!! and they believed japans lure of the greater east asian co-prosperity sphere.

Japan paid them and the West did not. Let's not forget Thais are after all still Thais.

and america paid britain. whats your point? why would any asian country ally themselves with thugs like britain, france and the netherlands after watching how they had been behaving toward asians the last couple of hundred years?

Japan colonized Korea in 1910 and raped Nanjing 4 years before the Japan Thai alliance was signed. Thailand knew what it was getting into. Japan paid Thailand to be friends.

Thailand would have been the Western allies friend if they paid enough. They didn't.

[AYJAYDEE]

Japan colonized Korea in 1910 and raped Nanjing 4 years before the Japan Thai alliance was signed. Thailand knew what it was getting into. Japan paid Thailand to be friends.

Thailand would have been the Western allies friend if they paid enough. They didn't.

bullsh*t!

[hawker9000]

why would they have sided with countries practising asian colonialism?

Uhh, because the Japanese were conducting a brutal war of aggression, seeking to establish a colonial empire of their own?

Uhh, because Japanese methods were barbaric, with millions of innocent non-combatant civilians deliberately raped, murdered, interned, and enslaved?

The argument about the pragmatism of it is one thing, but the anti-colonial rant is totally absurd. The Japanese occupation ( yes, it was an occupation; just a very benign one, thanks to the "pragmatism" just mentioned) is probably the closest Thailand has ever been to a colonial relationship.

they already saw what western colonialists behaved like and wanted none of that brutality. the west treated their conquered countries worse than the japanese treated the thais!! and they believed japans lure of the greater east asian co-prosperity sphere.

Japan paid them and the West did not. Let's not forget Thais are after all still Thais.

and america paid britain. whats your point? why would any asian country ally themselves with thugs like britain, france and the netherlands after watching how they had been behaving toward asians the last couple of hundred years?

You compare WWII Japan with Britain, France and the Netherlands, and B/F/N comes off the "thug"??!!!!!

Sorry. 'Just can't take that kind of trash seriously.

[AYJAYDEE]

why would they have sided with countries practising asian colonialism?

Uhh, because the Japanese were conducting a brutal war of aggression, seeking to establish a colonial empire of their own?

Uhh, because Japanese methods were barbaric, with millions of innocent non-combatant civilians deliberately raped, murdered, interned, and enslaved?

The argument about the pragmatism of it is one thing, but the anti-colonial rant is totally absurd. The Japanese occupation ( yes, it was an occupation; just a very benign one, thanks to the "pragmatism" just mentioned) is probably the closest Thailand has ever been to a colonial relationship.

they already saw what western colonialists behaved like and wanted none of that brutality. the west treated their conquered countries worse than the japanese treated the thais!! and they believed japans lure of the greater east asian co-prosperity sphere.

Japan paid them and the West did not. Let's not forget Thais are after all still Thais.

and america paid britain. whats your point? why would any asian country ally themselves with thugs like britain, france and the netherlands after watching how they had been behaving toward asians the last couple of hundred years?

You compare WWII Japan with Britain, France and the Netherlands, and B/F/N comes off the "thug"??!!!!!

Sorry. 'Just can't take that kind of trash seriously.

i said they believed japans line. they KNEW what the euros were like! pigs!

[thailiketoo]

Japan colonized Korea in 1910 and raped Nanjing 4 years before the Japan Thai alliance was signed. Thailand knew what it was getting into. Japan paid Thailand to be friends.

Thailand would have been the Western allies friend if they paid enough. They didn't.

bullsh*t!

The Japanese gave Thailand through force or negotiation land taken at an earlier period of time from by The French and British. The Japanese provided Thailand with war supplies that had been cut off from The Americans, in fact the Americans froze Thai assets in the USA. The Japanese gave Thailand thousands of tons of Shan State opium (then legal).

The American companies Curtiss and Vought had taken over after the French, delivering Hawk II and III fighters and V.93S Corsair light attack aircraft to the Siamese Royal Aeronautical Service, while the British designed Avro 504N served as primary trainers. Both Curtiss Hawk III's and Corsairs were produced under licence in Siam, as was the Avro 504N.

During the Franco-Thai war in 1940-1941, Japan had supported Thailand, supplying bomber aircraft. A series of incidents between French colonial forces in Indochina and Thailand escalated into open war in late November, 1940. The war ended on January 28, 1941, after Japanese diplomatic intervention. France was forced to cede a considerable amount of territory to Thailand.

http://www.aeroflight.co.uk/waf/aa-eastasia/thailand/thai-jap-history.htm

[AYJAYDEE]

Japan colonized Korea in 1910 and raped Nanjing 4 years before the Japan Thai alliance was signed. Thailand knew what it was getting into. Japan paid Thailand to be friends.

Thailand would have been the Western allies friend if they paid enough. They didn't.

bullsh*t!

The Japanese gave Thailand through force or negotiation land taken at an earlier period of time from by The French and British. The Japanese provided Thailand with war supplies that had been cut off from The Americans, in fact the Americans froze Thai assets in the USA. The Japanese gave Thailand thousands of tons of Shan State opium (then legal).

The American companies Curtiss and Vought had taken over after the French, delivering Hawk II and III fighters and V.93S Corsair light attack aircraft to the Siamese Royal Aeronautical Service, while the British designed Avro 504N served as primary trainers. Both Curtiss Hawk III's and Corsairs were produced under licence in Siam, as was the Avro 504N.

During the Franco-Thai war in 1940-1941, Japan had supported Thailand, supplying bomber aircraft. A series of incidents between French colonial forces in Indochina and Thailand escalated into open war in late November, 1940. The war ended on January 28, 1941, after Japanese diplomatic intervention. France was forced to cede a considerable amount of territory to Thailand.

http://www.aeroflight.co.uk/waf/aa-eastasia/thailand/thai-jap-history.htm

so what? they wouldnt have let the westerners in any any case. they were not to be trusted. their methods were well known.

[thailiketoo]

bullsh*t!

The Japanese gave Thailand through force or negotiation land taken at an earlier period of time from by The French and British. The Japanese provided Thailand with war supplies that had been cut off from The Americans, in fact the Americans froze Thai assets in the USA. The Japanese gave Thailand thousands of tons of Shan State opium (then legal).

The American companies Curtiss and Vought had taken over after the French, delivering Hawk II and III fighters and V.93S Corsair light attack aircraft to the Siamese Royal Aeronautical Service, while the British designed Avro 504N served as primary trainers. Both Curtiss Hawk III's and Corsairs were produced under licence in Siam, as was the Avro 504N.

During the Franco-Thai war in 1940-1941, Japan had supported Thailand, supplying bomber aircraft. A series of incidents between French colonial forces in Indochina and Thailand escalated into open war in late November, 1940. The war ended on January 28, 1941, after Japanese diplomatic intervention. France was forced to cede a considerable amount of territory to Thailand.

http://www.aeroflight.co.uk/waf/aa-eastasia/thailand/thai-jap-history.htm

so what? they wouldnt have let the westerners in any any case. they were not to be trusted. their methods were well known.

They joined the Westerners in the SEATO treaty only 10 years later and fought with the West in Korea and Vietnam. I think you are mistaken.

[AYJAYDEE]

bullsh*t!

The Japanese gave Thailand through force or negotiation land taken at an earlier period of time from by The French and British. The Japanese provided Thailand with war supplies that had been cut off from The Americans, in fact the Americans froze Thai assets in the USA. The Japanese gave Thailand thousands of tons of Shan State opium (then legal).

The American companies Curtiss and Vought had taken over after the French, delivering Hawk II and III fighters and V.93S Corsair light attack aircraft to the Siamese Royal Aeronautical Service, while the British designed Avro 504N served as primary trainers. Both Curtiss Hawk III's and Corsairs were produced under licence in Siam, as was the Avro 504N.

During the Franco-Thai war in 1940-1941, Japan had supported Thailand, supplying bomber aircraft. A series of incidents between French colonial forces in Indochina and Thailand escalated into open war in late November, 1940. The war ended on January 28, 1941, after Japanese diplomatic intervention. France was forced to cede a considerable amount of territory to Thailand.

http://www.aeroflight.co.uk/waf/aa-eastasia/thailand/thai-jap-history.htm

so what? they wouldnt have let the westerners in any any case. they were not to be trusted. their methods were well known.

They joined the Westerners in the SEATO treaty only 10 years later and fought with the West in Korea and Vietnam. I think you are mistaken.

they didnt let the vile thugs into their country. and 10 years later it was obvious that the japanese were just as lying backstabbers as the west

[thailiketoo]

they didnt let the vile thugs into their country. and 10 years later it was obvious that the japanese were just as lying backstabbers as the west

They joined the Westerners in the SEATO treaty only 10 years later and fought with the West in Korea and Vietnam. I think you are mistaken.

1. The British occupied Thailand in 1946. 2. There were about 200,000 Americans stationed in Thailand during the Vietnam war. What do you mean they didn't let them in the country?

The Southeast Asia Treaty Organization (SEATO) was an international organization for collective defense in Southeast Asia created by the Southeast Asia Collective Defense Treaty, or Manila Pact, signed in September 1954 in Manila, Philippines. The formal institution of SEATO was established on 19 February 1955 at a meeting of treaty partners in Bangkok, Thailand. The organization's headquarters were also in Bangkok. Eight members joined the organization....Primarily created to block further communist gains in Southeast Asia,

Do you want the links or photos of the Thai Army fighting with Americans in Korea and Vietnam?

[AYJAYDEE]

they didnt let the vile thugs into their country. and 10 years later it was obvious that the japanese were just as lying backstabbers as the west

They joined the Westerners in the SEATO treaty only 10 years later and fought with the West in Korea and Vietnam. I think you are mistaken.

1. The British occupied Thailand in 1946. 2. There were about 200,000 Americans stationed in Thailand during the Vietnam war. What do you mean they didn't let them in the country?

The Southeast Asia Treaty Organization (SEATO) was an international organization for collective defense in Southeast Asia created by the Southeast Asia Collective Defense Treaty, or Manila Pact, signed in September 1954 in Manila, Philippines. The formal institution of SEATO was established on 19 February 1955 at a meeting of treaty partners in Bangkok, Thailand. The organization's headquarters were also in Bangkok. Eight members joined the organization....Primarily created to block further communist gains in Southeast Asia,

Do you want the links or photos of the Thai Army fighting with Americans in Korea and Vietnam?

before the war, like i said! they feared communists after the war.

[thailiketoo]

1. The British occupied Thailand in 1946. 2. There were about 200,000 Americans stationed in Thailand during the Vietnam war. What do you mean they didn't let them in the country?

The Southeast Asia Treaty Organization (SEATO) was an international organization for collective defense in Southeast Asia created by the Southeast Asia Collective Defense Treaty, or Manila Pact, signed in September 1954 in Manila, Philippines. The formal institution of SEATO was established on 19 February 1955 at a meeting of treaty partners in Bangkok, Thailand. The organization's headquarters were also in Bangkok. Eight members joined the organization....Primarily created to block further communist gains in Southeast Asia,

Do you want the links or photos of the Thai Army fighting with Americans in Korea and Vietnam?

before the war, like i said! they feared communists after the war.

Thailand was on the Allies side in the First WW, the Axis side Second WW, Allies side Korean and Vietnam war, Allies side Iraq war. Any more questions?

That's good guys (from my perspective) 4 and bad guys (from my perspective) 1.

[KevinB]

Come on guys before you drift off into a slanging match about Colonialism and hatred of European occupation. The truth is in the History - the Ruler at the Time was not a King (hope you can say that) but a Military Dictator who like history often repeats itself was in total control of the country and most of its subjects. His favorite person in the whole world was Bonito Mussolini - the fascist ruler of Italy at the time - El Duce. In fact he was proud to call himself a Fascist. He invited the Japanese to land. If fact the only resistance to the "invasion" was a bunch of Thai soldiers stationed near an airfield in the South who hadn't been told what to expect. After the Japanese commander of the expeditionary force had contacted Bangkok by radio - the resisting units quickly got the message, stopped fighting and helped the Japanese force to land succesfully. Just so you all understand a massive amount of equipment was landed in fact the whole Japanese invasion force that captured the Malay Penisula and finally marched into Singapore to accept the surrender of the British army - the City was large unprepared for a full scale invasion coming from the North (the reason why the Japanese made the deal with the Thais) - in fact most of it's defenses - their massive on-shore batteries all pointed out to sea.

You need to understand the situation in WWII at the time - in 1939 the Germans invaded France and the French surrendered - But in the agreement a big chuck of France was left unoccupied by the Germans and ruled by a compliant Government - Vichy France - which Britain declared an enemy. The moment this happened the Thais seized the opportunity to invade French Indo-China - unfortunately for them there was still a big contingent of French Naval Forces in Saigon - they promptly sailed around the corner and using a couple of cruisers with 10 and 12 inch guns and a couple of spotter planes which were launched by a catapult from a converted frigate and when they landed on the water they were hauled back on board - refuelled and shot off again.The French used aerial sighting and staying out of range of the much lighter armed Thai ships and managed to quickly sink most of the Thai navy. The Thai Government realizing that the French and their deadly accurate guns were a half day sailing from a now undefended Bangkok - decided to make peace - the Peace Accord and their withdrawal from Laos and Cambodia was negotiated for them by the Japanese who if you remember were not at war at the time. And who were still "friends" of the Vichy Government. That is where the relationship and military friendship was forged.

I'm not 100% sure but I think the Japanese actually landed and moved towards the Malaysian border before the infamous day in December 1941 when they launched simultaneous attacks on Pearl Harbour, Hong Kong, Singapore, Jakarta and Darwin - So the Thais were totally compliant with the very elaborate plans of the Japanese - as full Allies of the Japanese not as an innocent nation invaded.

[thailiketoo]

I have a question if you all don't mind. WWII started in 1939. France and Thailand were both combatants in WWII why is the Franco Thai war (1940) not considered part of WWII?

[Humberstone]

I have a question if you all don't mind. WWII started in 1939. France and Thailand were both combatants in WWII why is the Franco Thai war (1940) not considered part of WWII?

WWII kicked off when the Japanese invaded and occupied Chinese Manchuria in 1931. They got their <deleted> kicked by the Soviets and this made the Japanese command change their strategy to be more focused on China and SE Asia.

[thailiketoo]

I have a question if you all don't mind. WWII started in 1939. France and Thailand were both combatants in WWII why is the Franco Thai war (1940) not considered part of WWII?

WWII kicked off when the Japanese invaded and occupied Chinese Manchuria in 1931. They got their <deleted> kicked by the Soviets and this made the Japanese command change their strategy to be more focused on China and SE Asia.

That must be your own idea. I have been unable to find a different year that 1939. All the books and every expert I know of say it started in 1939. World War II (WWII or WW2), also known as the Second World War, was a global war that lasted from 1939 to 1945, though related conflicts began earlier. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II

[bentarm44]

Come on guys before you drift off into a slanging match about Colonialism and hatred of European occupation. The truth is in the History - the Ruler at the Time was not a King (hope you can say that) but a Military Dictator who like history often repeats itself was in total control of the country and most of its subjects. His favorite person in the whole world was Bonito Mussolini - the fascist ruler of Italy at the time - El Duce. In fact he was proud to call himself a Fascist. He invited the Japanese to land. If fact the only resistance to the "invasion" was a bunch of Thai soldiers stationed near an airfield in the South who hadn't been told what to expect. After the Japanese commander of the expeditionary force had contacted Bangkok by radio - the resisting units quickly got the message, stopped fighting and helped the Japanese force to land succesfully. Just so you all understand a massive amount of equipment was landed in fact the whole Japanese invasion force that captured the Malay Penisula and finally marched into Singapore to accept the surrender of the British army - the City was large unprepared for a full scale invasion coming from the North (the reason why the Japanese made the deal with the Thais) - in fact most of it's defenses - their massive on-shore batteries all pointed out to sea.

You need to understand the situation in WWII at the time - in 1939 the Germans invaded France and the French surrendered - But in the agreement a big chuck of France was left unoccupied by the Germans and ruled by a compliant Government - Vichy France - which Britain declared an enemy. The moment this happened the Thais seized the opportunity to invade French Indo-China - unfortunately for them there was still a big contingent of French Naval Forces in Saigon - they promptly sailed around the corner and using a couple of cruisers with 10 and 12 inch guns and a couple of spotter planes which were launched by a catapult from a converted frigate and when they landed on the water they were hauled back on board - refuelled and shot off again.The French used aerial sighting and staying out of range of the much lighter armed Thai ships and managed to quickly sink most of the Thai navy. The Thai Government realizing that the French and their deadly accurate guns were a half day sailing from a now undefended Bangkok - decided to make peace - the Peace Accord and their withdrawal from Laos and Cambodia was negotiated for them by the Japanese who if you remember were not at war at the time. And who were still "friends" of the Vichy Government. That is where the relationship and military friendship was forged.

I'm not 100% sure but I think the Japanese actually landed and moved towards the Malaysian border before the infamous day in December 1941 when they launched simultaneous attacks on Pearl Harbour, Hong Kong, Singapore, Jakarta and Darwin - So the Thais were totally compliant with the very elaborate plans of the Japanese - as full Allies of the Japanese not as an innocent nation invaded.

The first casualty of war is the truth, and history is written by the victors.

Most of the Japs who landed at Prachuap Khiri Khan were destined for the invasion of Burma.

The Japs who invaded Malaysia mostly came ashore on several locations on the east coast of Malaysia; once again with the "co-operation" of local people and forces.

The landings at PKK were farcical. The Jap forces had been told there would be no resistance, and there was no preliminary action by aircraft or naval guns.

I've been told that the first shots of the day were from Thai policemen, aiming towards the approaching Jap landing craft. After less than 4 hours peace broke out.

The high street in PKK, parallel to the beach road, is still known as "Battle Road"

[bentarm44]

Can anyone answer me this : 12 or 13 years ago I visited Kanchanaburi & did the whole war tour over 3 days ,now i've just been going through some photos from the time & one that stands out is at HellFire Pass(konyu cutting?) that has me pointing at the railway track ,that clearly has "Rainham (Steel)" cast on it !

I'm pretty sure rainham Steel is based in Bury England ,how or why is their track at Hellfire pass ,surely it's not the original,anyone know?

I quote from p. 112-113 of "The Burma Road" by Donovan Webster

.................there was virtually nothing in the way of new supplies; bridging materials, rail fittings or running rail; anywhere inside the Greater East Asian Co-Prosperity Sphere. Most of the railroad steel in south Asia, it turned out, had come by boat from Great Britain.

..............the Japanese had to get creative. First, to acquire materials, they ordered the ripping up of several rail spurs in Thailand and Burma......................

...............cannibalizing less crucial lines in Java, Singapore and Malaysia.............................

[bentarm44]

They also declared War on Britain and USA. They gave the Japs permission to land in far south of Thailand to invade Burma.

They should have paid the price after the war.

----------------

Technically Thailand did NOT declare war against the U.S., because the Thai ambassador never delivered the declaration of war from his government to the U.S. government.

Instead he resigned his post, and the declaration of war was never delivered.

And to be fair to the Thais, they never gave the Japanese permission to land in Thailand.

At that point, with the British being effectively out of the war as far as Thailand was concerned, the Then Prime Minister of Thailand ordered the stand down of all Thai military forces to the Japanese.

But look it up on Wikipedia for yourself.

What an incredible load of rubbish. I suppose it can be credited to your source - beware of Wiki.

There are no "technical" rules about having to actually hand over a written declaration of war. Yes, Thailand did declare war on all the Allied countries. Did an ambassador run about to get a piece of paper to the Dutch government, by that time, if I recall correctly, resident in Canada! No, absolutely not - as it wasn't necessary. No paper sent through post, Thai or otherwise, to Canberra, either, but war was declared.

The government of Thailand, through its Prime Minister, negotiated with the Japanese for several months in 1941 previous to the landing of the Japanese forces, and specifically gave permission for those landings.

The Japanese were pleased with that, but were actually surprised when Thailand joined them by declaring war.

The "stand down" of Thai forces did not come when the British were, as you so amusingly suggest, were out of the war (never happened, did it?) but Phibun issued the stand down order when there was some minor resistance against the landings, as the local police and military hadn't been forewarned about the permission having been granted.

But of course, rather than doing some real research, go look at Wikipedia again. Post some more foolishness.

The Japs thought they'd paid for a "long time".

[AYJAYDEE]

1. The British occupied Thailand in 1946. 2. There were about 200,000 Americans stationed in Thailand during the Vietnam war. What do you mean they didn't let them in the country?

The Southeast Asia Treaty Organization (SEATO) was an international organization for collective defense in Southeast Asia created by the Southeast Asia Collective Defense Treaty, or Manila Pact, signed in September 1954 in Manila, Philippines. The formal institution of SEATO was established on 19 February 1955 at a meeting of treaty partners in Bangkok, Thailand. The organization's headquarters were also in Bangkok. Eight members joined the organization....Primarily created to block further communist gains in Southeast Asia,

Do you want the links or photos of the Thai Army fighting with Americans in Korea and Vietnam?

before the war, like i said! they feared communists after the war.

Thailand was on the Allies side in the First WW, the Axis side Second WW, Allies side Korean and Vietnam war, Allies side Iraq war. Any more questions?

That's good guys (from my perspective) 4 and bad guys (from my perspective) 1.

nothing to do with occupation

[Humberstone]

I have a question if you all don't mind. WWII started in 1939. France and Thailand were both combatants in WWII why is the Franco Thai war (1940) not considered part of WWII?

WWII kicked off when the Japanese invaded and occupied Chinese Manchuria in 1931. They got their <deleted> kicked by the Soviets and this made the Japanese command change their strategy to be more focused on China and SE Asia.

That must be your own idea. I have been unable to find a different year that 1939. All the books and every expert I know of say it started in 1939. World War II (WWII or WW2), also known as the Second World War, was a global war that lasted from 1939 to 1945, though related conflicts began earlier. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II

No. It is a date put forward by Anthony Beevor, a historian, in his book on WWII. I've read it. Also, if you look at the wiki you kindly provided there is quite a lot of disagreement amongst historians about the actual start date of WWII.

[metisdead]

Posts that were a "tad" off topic as well as containing a link to another forum have been removed as well as the replies.

[thailiketoo]

I have a question if you all don't mind. WWII started in 1939. France and Thailand were both combatants in WWII why is the Franco Thai war (1940) not considered part of WWII?

WWII kicked off when the Japanese invaded and occupied Chinese Manchuria in 1931. They got their <deleted> kicked by the Soviets and this made the Japanese command change their strategy to be more focused on China and SE Asia.

That must be your own idea. I have been unable to find a different year that 1939. All the books and every expert I know of say it started in 1939. World War II (WWII or WW2), also known as the Second World War, was a global war that lasted from 1939 to 1945, though related conflicts began earlier. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II

No. It is a date put forward by Anthony Beevor, a historian, in his book on WWII. I've read it. Also, if you look at the wiki you kindly provided there is quite a lot of disagreement amongst historians about the actual start date of WWII.

I don't think so. Global war broke out around 1939. There were reasons for or battles before but not global war. 99% history books and historians agree 1939.

The Second World War, By Anthony Beevor ...... the real war started in June 1941 with the Nazi invasion of the Soviet Union.

Edited December 23, 2014 by thailiketoo

[smotherb]

GermanViking said, "As long I remember was in Alaska never a war, the USA bought in 1867 from the russians for 7.2 Mill $, good deal."

Don't say that to the Americans who died at Dutch Harbor in June of 1942. The Japanese did invade the Aleutians--Adak, Attu, and Kiska--and were there for about a year--we drove them out in 1943.

[smotherb]

The Vietnam posts are interesting but I don't really think about WWII (except in the way that WWII is an extension of WWI kind of thing. Vietnam is an extension of WWII in SEA)

I do have a few questions that I don't know the complete answers to. Thailand was invaded by whom on the Allies side? What happened during the invasion? Who did the Thais surrender to? How many Thais were tried for war crimes and what was the result? How long after the invasion of Thailand by the Allies did it take to release the prisoners on the Death Railway project?

It is my understanding that Thailand seized the assets of British teak companies during the war; did they give them back?

The USA bombed Bangkok with B-29 Super fortresses to practice for the fire bombing on Tokyo; why didn't Bangkok burn down like Tokyo?

an extension of ww ii in asia!! lol! good one!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decolonisation_of_Asia

Still using wiki?