2-year-old boy shoots mother dead in US

[sanuk711]

They have had recent car accidents and plane accidents. I move that we ban these vehicles of death also.

Any chance of nominating someone for the most nutty poster of the year,

Cars --Planes are pieces of machinery made for transporting people around the world,...& yes there are accidents.

Guns are pieces of machinery Just made for K_____

Lets see if if rotary can have a brain storm & fill the blank space in.

Edited December 31, 2014 by sanuk711

[notmyself]

A two year old will likely not even remember the event. I am sure those around him will keep reminding him, however.

What do you say when he asked why he has no Mom. Lie?

The mother of my niece (ex wife) shot herself. Kid was lied to for years and years and found out when she was 23-24. Threw herself under a train because she figured she had nobody to trust in the world.

[MrWorldwide]

@hjc, there's imperfect and there's Afghanistan - it's a continuum not an A-B distinction. Japan and Singapore may not be perfect societies, but I'd like to think their laws help differentiate them from a wartorn basketcase. Or a country with far more guns than people.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overview_of_gun_laws_by_nation#Singapore

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overview_of_gun_laws_by_nation#Japan

Where would you prefer to be at 3am on a Sunday morning - Tokyo or a large American city of your choice ? I'll take Tokyo, thanks.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

[bangon04]

Hayden, Idaho is ground zero of the American, heavily armed, white supremacist movement. Not enough information released yet, but my initial reaction is that some sort of natural (sic) selection may be going on here.

USA, the Land of the Free.... and the home of the Brave

Edited December 31, 2014 by bangon04

[NeverSure]

too sad to say som na na - but carrying a loaded gun with SAFETY OFF how dumb is that?

Revolvers and some modern semi-automatic handguns don't have a safety per se.

Who said the safety was off? Who said the gun had one? I haven't read that. Who said that by design it needed a safety?

The mother was stupid enough to leave the gun within reach of the child and she paid with her life.

[Yann55]

Be interesting to hear what the very vocal ThaiVisa Gun Lobby has to say about this, especially the clown who tried to tell me that 'the best way to stop a bad man with a knife is a good gal with a gun' after the Manoora tragedy. Imagine going through life knowing you shot your own mother dead before you were old enough to even understand the dangers of carrying a loaded firearm. RIP.

Regardless of your views (I'm pro gun control but not anti gun per se) I think what they'll say is that keeping a loaded gun within reach of a child is just plain dumb. Which it is.

This is just incredibly sad.

.. right. And we could add, couldn't we, that letting people carry guns in full knowledge that human beings can (and will) more than often act 'plain dumb' is ... what ? criminal ? insane ? cynical ? dangerous ? all of the above ?

It's not like countries don't politically have a choice, right ? Or perhaps, some of them don't because of this God called $$$ ....

Edited December 31, 2014 by Yann55

[CNXBKKMAN]

Tragic accident but the safety catch is an important part of the gun. You have to use it.

[NeverSure]

No safety catch on either? It doesnt really say that but it is implied.

It's not implied at all. People who know nothing about guns keep rattling on...

[NeverSure]

Tragic accident but the safety catch is an important part of the gun. You have to use it.

555. I just keep repeating that revolvers and some modern semi automatics don't have a safety. But those who need to post will post.

[IMA_FARANG]

Parent was a fool.

Sorry, but I can't say anything nice about gun owners who do not know the basic rules of gun safety. First of all, if you must carry a gun for "self defense" (usually they are not, but never mind that), you need to take the NRA gun safety course that is offered in most areas specifically to teach parents the rules of gun safety around children. You NEVER carry a loaded gun in your purse or bag. If you have n unloaded gun in your purse or bag, you NEVER leave that bag unattended ..... especially around children. Guns, especially handguns, are made to kill people.

It is a fact that every year more family members are "accidentally" killed by handguns legally owned by other members of the same family for "personal self defense" than are criminals the guns supposedly "protect" people against. Bottom line though...... as a gun user...... gins are made to kill people.

You

• Never carry or leave a loaded handgun in your purse or a bag
• And even an unloaded handgun should never be left where children can find it or get access to it.
• And, if you feel you need a handgun for personal protection. then you, as a responsible adult ALWAYS retain possession of that handgun unless it is locked and secured in a safe place.

As a responsible gun owner you never leave a gun where a child can find it or get it in his or her hands.

Not even for "just a second".

[NeverSure]

..What if you were standing in front of them and he shot you or a loved one ? We can play this game all day, but I find it hard to believe that things are really that bad in the Midwest that you need to carry a loaded firearm for a trip to the shops - saddened to hear otherwise.

Midwest? It happened in Idaho.

[zydeco]

Yeah, but the fault clearly lies with the mother! Why wasn't the safety on and why did the toddler have access to a purse that contained a handgun?! I hope the kid sees it the same way when he's old enough to understand!

Again, zero training or zero willingness to follow what she was presumably taught - these are the people that our gun-lovin' buddies want to arm. God Bless Ted Nugent, right fellas ?

.

She was stupid. Things worked out the way nature intended.

Now, if the kid had shot himself …..

What if you were standing in front of them and he shot you or a loved one ? We can play this game all day, but I find it hard to believe that things are really that bad in the Midwest that you need to carry a loaded firearm for a trip to the shops - saddened to hear otherwise.

Have you been to the US? If so, you would know that Idaho is not part of the Midwest; it is a part of the Far West. And if you don't know that, then you obviously have little experience with the culture of not only Idaho but Montana and other parts of that section of the country. It really isn't your place to tell people how they should live and what they should do to protect themselves. That is why the US has a federal system, so that people who live in Detroit can't make laws for people who live in the mountains or on the plains.

[notmyself]

Situations like this wouldn't happen or be very unlikely to happen if people were only allowed to have fully automatic assault rifles. The lady wouldn't have had one in her purse.

[CMNightRider]

@hjc, there's imperfect and there's Afghanistan - it's a continuum not an A-B distinction. Japan and Singapore may not be perfect societies, but I'd like to think their laws help differentiate them from a wartorn basketcase. Or a country with far more guns than people.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overview_of_gun_laws_by_nation#Singapore

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overview_of_gun_laws_by_nation#Japan

Where would you prefer to be at 3am on a Sunday morning - Tokyo or a large American city of your choice ? I'll take Tokyo, thanks.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-related_death_rate

I would choose Tokyo, because they aren't plagued with black and Mexican gangs roaming their streets at night.

Edited December 31, 2014 by CMNightRider

[NeverSure]

Situations like this wouldn't happen or be very unlikely to happen if people were only allowed to have fully automatic assault rifles. The lady wouldn't have had one in her purse.

Already lobbying for poster of the year award 555?

[CMNightRider]

Hayden, Idaho is ground zero of the American, heavily armed, white supremacist movement. Not enough information released yet, but my initial reaction is that some sort of natural (sic) selection may be going on here.

USA, the Land of the Free.... and the home of the Brave

"USA, the Land of the Free.... and the home of the Brave".................and your point is?????

[scorecard]

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Be interesting to hear what the very vocal ThaiVisa Gun Lobby has to say about this, especially the clown who tried to tell me that 'the best way to stop a bad man with a knife is a good gal with a gun' after the Manoora tragedy. Imagine going through life knowing you shot your own mother dead before you were old enough to even understand the dangers of carrying a loaded firearm. RIP.

Regardless of your views (I'm pro gun control but not anti gun per se) I think what they'll say is that keeping a loaded gun within reach of a child is just plain dumb. Which it is.T

This is just incredibly sad.

But surely that should be part of the training required for anyone applying for a concealed firearms licence ? Many will recall the old chestnut about the Winnebago owner who - delighted to find that his new motorhome had cruise control - left his land whale in drive at 55 mph on the freeway and went to the back of the Winnie to make a coffee : even if it's fictional, it illustrates that you cant make assumptions based on the notion of 'common sense'.

My assumption is that she had a round in the chamber and the safety off - exactly how much training anyone prepared to walk the streets with a live grenade in their purse can possibly have had is one I'll leave to our very own gun lobby.

Surely there is an ultimate point here - is crime etc., so bad in this town that people need to have a handgun in their purse in a supermarket and with a 2 yr old and other young children on the spot and playing etc?

If the answer is yes then the local police etc., officials are somewhat responsible for this death.

If the answer is no, then should there be laws or store policies that guns have to be surrendered on entry to the store?

Or put it another way, If you were shopping in this store with a couple of boisterous kids would you be happy to know that the lady next to you has a handgun in her purse and it's loaded and the safety catch is off and any of her kids could easily take the gun out of that purse?

Sorry, just can't understand this mentality.

[zydeco]

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Surely there is an ultimate point here - is crime etc., so bad in this town that people need to have a handgun in their purse in a supermarket and with a 2 yr old and other young children on the spot and playing etc?

If the answer is yes then the local police etc., officials are somewhat responsible for this death.

If the answer is no, then should there be laws or store policies that guns have to be surrendered on entry to the store?

Or put it another way, If you were shopping in this store with a couple of boisterous kids would you be happy to know that the lady next to you has a handgun in her purse and it's loaded and the safety catch is off and any of her kids could easily take the gun out of that purse?

Sorry, just can't understand this mentality.

Aside from the fact that a woman on her own, with a small child, might need protection (lots of illegals roam the rural areas of the West) and has the constitutional right to arm herself thusly, there could well be good reasons to carry a gun as a matter of habit--even in a Wal Mart. Parts of the US are open and vacant. And this happened, apparently, in a small town of 9,000--so I'm assuming the area is rural. Although quite unlikely this time of year, an encounter with an unfriendly or poisonous critter while changing a tire might make having a gun around a very good idea. All of the US is not Manhattan. In some places humans are still part of nature and sometimes nature carries a sting. A gun can be handy.

[NeverSure]

Or put it another way, If you were shopping in this store with a couple of boisterous kids would you be happy to know that the lady next to you has a handgun in her purse and it's loaded and the safety catch is off and any of her kids could easily take the gun out of that purse?

Sorry, just can't understand this mentality.

"...and the safety catch is off..." "Sorry, just can't understand this mentality."

I can't understand this mentality that reads into the OP that the gun even had a safety or needed one. I can't understand this mentality that posts without reading the thread where I have pointed out repeatedly that revolvers and many modern semi automatic handguns don't have a safety.

I can't understand mentality that reads an OP and finds that a safety was off when it didn't mention safety.

To answer your question, every time I go into a store I'm aware that some citizens may be carrying a gun. If they've been vetted, taken the course and passed the test to get a concealed handgun permit, I don't mind at all.

This woman made a huge error in judgement and left a gun where a child could get it. That's what went wrong. That's it.

[reptile91602]

The only error I see in this whole case is not to give guns to every 2 year old in the states and let them have at it.

[MrWorldwide]

Never been to the US and I stand corrected re my 'Midwest' comment - duly noted. I've also never needed a hunting rifle to protect myself from bears, wolves and mountain lions - I concede that these are all valid reasons for owning a firearm in certain parts of north America.

None of that changes the fact that this woman should never have been granted a licence to own a firearm, much less a licence to carry a concealed firearm. If thats telling people in other parts of the world how to live their lives, I'm sorry but that's precisely what we do on this and other forums every day of the year. Have a great NYE.

(neversure, FWIW, although we are on opposite sides of the fence on this issue, I appreciate the contributions you made to the AirAsia threads - you clearly know your stuff)

[sanuk711]

I would choose Tokyo, because they aren't plagued with black and Mexican gangs---CMNightRider

You have never heard the name Yakuza ..................

[zydeco]

Never been to the US and I stand corrected re my 'Midwest' comment - duly noted. I've also never needed a hunting rifle to protect myself from bears, wolves and mountain lions - I concede that these are all valid reasons for owning a firearm in certain parts of north America.

None of that changes the fact that this woman should never have been granted a licence to own a firearm, much less a licence to carry a concealed firearm. If thats telling people in other parts of the world how to live their lives, I'm sorry but that's precisely what we do on this and other forums every day of the year. Have a great NYE.

(neversure, FWIW, although we are on opposite sides of the fence on this issue, I appreciate the contributions you made to the AirAsia threads - you clearly know your stuff)

BTW, I wasn't referring to your right to have an opinion or post it on this or any other forum. I was referring to your "place" to do so. Literally. Neither you or I, for that matter, have the place or standing to tell people in Idaho how to live their lives--you, because you have no vote at all in the US and I because I don't have a vote in Idaho. That is why I followed up my post with the statement about the US being a federal system. The people in Idaho express their own thoughts on how they should live through their individual vote, which is based on the circumstances of their life in whatever part of Idaho they live in.

[OMGImInPattaya]

Be interesting to hear what the very vocal ThaiVisa Gun Lobby has to say about this, especially the clown who tried to tell me that 'the best way to stop a bad man with a knife is a good gal with a gun' after the Manoora tragedy. Imagine going through life knowing you shot your own mother dead before you were old enough to even understand the dangers of carrying a loaded firearm. RIP.

I'll take up your challeng. Maybe that stupid mother should have secured her purse/bag so that a child could not reach in and have access to her weapon. That's one of the cardinal rules of carrying a gun...KEEP IT SECURED!

Now unfortunately, she is dead and her child is without a mother.

[Scott]

Off-topic, inflammatory and posts in poor taste along with replies have been removed.

[notmyself]

According to NRA data, more guns result in less gun crime. Mandatory ownership of 2, 3 or 4 guns for every man, woman and child and there would be close to zero gun crime. Quite simple really.

[outsider]

She has a permit to carry concealed weapons - and I don't know anything about guns - but shouldn't a gun, carried (albeit concealed) in public, be unloaded and locked? I thought one was supposed to keep the bullets OUTSIDE the gun, no?

[zydeco]

She has a permit to carry concealed weapons - and I don't know anything about guns - but shouldn't a gun, carried (albeit concealed) in public, be unloaded and locked? I thought one was supposed to keep the bullets OUTSIDE the gun, no?

No.

[NeverSure]

She has a permit to carry concealed weapons - and I don't know anything about guns - but shouldn't a gun, carried (albeit concealed) in public, be unloaded and locked? I thought one was supposed to keep the bullets OUTSIDE the gun, no?

Not at all. If she needed the gun it would be instantly. She might walk out to her car and find a carjacker. She might come home, go inside to find a rapist. A large wild dog or other animal might attack her.

If you're going to need a gun, you'll need it "right now." The police don't walk around with unloaded guns.

The sad thing is that she might have been carrying the gun in case she needed to protect the child. She made a serious error in judgement and in action and it cost her her life.

[jayjayjayjay]

NRA New Year slogan. "Arm your 2 year old to protect your families"