Thai politics: Govt may drop cases against politicians for sake of peace

[brucec64]

The road to stability is not an easy one however there is it seems a little common sense appearing, of course it won't suit all from any of the sides however the child of reconciliation has in the past has often had a somewhat difficult and indeed painful birth.

The art of compromise is a difficult one to employ when rearing a child let alone a reconciliation process such as we seem to see currently emerging here in Thailand.

My suggestions are that all those tainted with suspicion irrespective of political hues should be barred from participating in public life and political matters for life, one accepts that they would no doubt have some influence on matters, but if like a poisonous snake they are ''defanged'' the visual affect might be somewhat daunting but reality dictates fangless wonders.

I agree with your reasoning, but I think it is a slippery slope to allow barring from public life based on suspicions only. Seems like a good way to complete the purge and eradicate any politicial enemies. I'm not saying any of these people are innocent, but any semblance of democracy requires due process.

A potential compromise would be to not go forward with prosecution based on a voluntary retirement from politics. This would have to be a back room deal (and may have already occured).

[ImmortalGod]

Smell the fear reeking from these yellow and green cowards. Viva la Yingluck, Viva la democracy,

You have no clue. Read the international press to get a background on what's going on.

I am aware that the Junta has two main aims, firstly to ensure that Thaksin never wins power again and secondly................

They are afraid if they proceed with this idiocy against Yingluck the people will rise up and take to the streets and toss them out thus preventing them from achieving their second aim.

Believe you me, they are terrified and that has led to the infighting amongst the upper levels of the coup factions. 2015 will be explosive, Thaksin has been wise to keep a low profile while these imbeciles self destruct.

They won't self destruct. They have heavy backing in more than one form. PTP are the ones, truly, who are good as gone. They won't be in the picture any further now. Some 'grassroots' groups may arise in the future, but hopefully more genuine and less violent than ones in the recent past.

There are competing factions within. Some believe getting rid of the Shinawatras is the number one priority, others believe it is the other unmentionable. Energy policy is another that will rip the apart from within. The Junta, long term, has just one option and that is to turn inward and become a hermit kingdom much like North Korea or, closer to home, Myanmar - the people won't accept this. The Juntas ideology has no place in the modern world it must either shut the nation off from the rest of humanity or cease to exist. There is no way for the junta to win the long game, what we are witnessing now are just the death throes of an antiquated social system, the end is nigh.

[WhizBang]

Junta may drop cases against politicians for sake of peace

That would be a huge mistake, as justice not only must be done; it must also be seen to be done.

Allowing elected officials to get off scott free would be a grave injustice and only serve as encouragement to others to be as corrupt as possible. Until these elected officials are actually held accountable for their (mis)deeds, nothing will ever change in Thailand.

The direction this thinking and the so called reform process seems headed, is only serving to set up Thailand for a complete repeat of the past 10 years. It is this kind of wishy washy thinking that got Thailand here in the first place.

Thailand is truely doomed with these sort of people leading it.

[Thai at Heart]

This is what happens when the system is usurped and changed just to punish one group instead of using the legal system to punish all

[smedly]

make them sign a declaration that they will never take public office again or be involved in politics and leave it

as for the Thai peoples money all 600bilion+ of it - not sure how that one can be dealt with

[toybits]

Why the change of heart by the Junta? Have they come to realize they have bitten off more than they could chew? Is it a sudden realization that there is a large enough portion of the population that could turn the table on them?

[gemini81]

Why the change of heart by the Junta? Have they come to realize they have bitten off more than they could chew? Is it a sudden realization that there is a large enough portion of the population that could turn the table on them?

They cleaned up the main ones they targeted.

Uh, kind of hard for civilian population to fight an army that is armed well. Ignorant mercenaries from Thaksin learned that pretty well! You're missing whats going on behind the scenes. Wish we were at more liberty to discuss it, but not at this time...

[binjalin]

Should follow South Africa's example to peace and reconciliation - witch-hunts will only end in further witch-hunts in future but Thais do love their vengeance and are a vindictive culture - to get over this NO witch-hunts and an election

[binjalin]

This is what happens when the system is usurped and changed just to punish one group instead of using the legal system to punish all

true but the legal system would have to be neutral not colour 'tinged'

[selftaopath]

Ya know with the Thailand merry go round in all areas of society I'm almost at the point of believing some country's gotta be the laughing stock of Asia.... might as well be Thailand. Hell they already have the "smile" thing down pat.

Hell maybe they can be "the hub" of last place.

[Thai at Heart]

This is what happens when the system is usurped and changed just to punish one group instead of using the legal system to punish all

true but the legal system would have to be neutral not colour 'tinged'

Absolutely. This is why they are worried about appearing neutral. Because they cant, no matter how much they say they would like to, they can't.

So, irrespective of the guilt or not of the accused, the process cannot pass independent muster.

[HiSoLowSoNoSo]

Assume that the Junta's new "Zero Corruption" campaign will be a hard sale after this "deal".

[rubl]

This is what happens when the system is usurped and changed just to punish one group instead of using the legal system to punish all

true but the legal system would have to be neutral not colour 'tinged'

Absolutely. This is why they are worried about appearing neutral. Because they cant, no matter how much they say they would like to, they can't.

So, irrespective of the guilt or not of the accused, the process cannot pass independent muster.

There is a difference between not being able to be seen as neutral and not being neutral.

The documentation, argumentation, reasoning and the verdict "yes/no" should be sufficient to judge whether justice is served independent of what people think or feel.

[Thai at Heart]

This is what happens when the system is usurped and changed just to punish one group instead of using the legal system to punish all

true but the legal system would have to be neutral not colour 'tinged'

Absolutely. This is why they are worried about appearing neutral. Because they cant, no matter how much they say they would like to, they can't.

So, irrespective of the guilt or not of the accused, the process cannot pass independent muster.

There is a difference between not being able to be seen as neutral and not being neutral.

The documentation, argumentation, reasoning and the verdict "yes/no" should be sufficient to judge whether justice is served independent of what people think or feel.

Should be. Could be. Would be.

It can't be. The appointed assembly isn't independent, and that is the issue.

Even when the courts were full of appointees, at least it was a court. But sadly, this impeachment won't be.

That said, even the judges over the years have been rabidly anti Thaksin, but as a court, at least it has the respect and perception of independence.

The NLA isn't independent. Simple.

Edited January 6, 2015 by Thai at Heart

[Ozziepat]

"Hope and change" is a powerful inducement, so long as you don't believe in reality. Money and raw power have always ruled human affairs. But hey, this time will be different. Trust me. I sell used cars.

[Baerboxer]

Even if you are right about Thaksin interference in Parliment and civil Adminstration, totally ignoring the law etc etc, you must be able to distinquish the difference in the severity of the outcomes. The NACC and EC interferences and I include the constitutional court, are aimed at selective banning and eradicating political opponents. I see no parties that the elites favored been banned or charged by the NACC. That is the prejudice in full view last 8 years.

Stop it Eric, it's getting pathetic to keep suggesting Thaksin might or might not have interfered in parliament. Anybody here over the last few years knows he ran PTP, made all the decisions, issued instructions, selected cabinet ministers, summoned members to overseas meetings, promoted and demoted at will and paid large sums out to supplement their civil salaries. He owns PTP, they are his employees and he runs it like the CEO of his own PLC.

His previously owned parties, that were banned for fraud, were managed in the same way. They all followed a plan of trying to remove checks and balances, circumventing accountability and relying on nepotism, cronyism and favoritism when making appointments or awarding contracts. Do you think his conviction for breaking a law, which he was aware of but thought unimportant, or all the other 15 outstanding charges are all minor transgressions? He's a crook, pure and simple, whose risen to become a multi-billionaire by whatever means necessary. His family wealth increased 450% during his sister's puppet regime. How much did the wealth of Thailand and the average Thai person increase in the same period?

Thaksin and his parties are arrogant in your face in the way they go about things - "trust us, don't ask questions, do as we say not as we do, we are in charge we can do what we like" and see nothing wrong in lying and threatening openly. The other parties are a little more subtle so draw less attention. All, sadly, are above the law and never pursue one another.

I will stop if you stop the excessive hyperboling. Talk about Parliment, you don't notice the shenanigans put up by the Dem? You really think foolishly that you can have your own way in Parliment without the oppositions in and outside Parliment kicking up a row? How naive to say such a thing.

He keep harping on the Shin's wealth. If the tax regulators have not seen anything illegal, there really nothing for you to base your retort on.

Everyone except you knows that PT is Thaksin party. It's on full display during election and nothing shady about it. Ultimately people decide and the people did decide.

Are you kidding when you said other parties are more subtle? Didn't the tyranny of the minority escape you mind. The Dem and their cahoots outside Parliment wre equally loud and vocal culminating with the PDRC shut Bangkok numerous times. They behave like they above the law and even the law allows them to continue. That's not law but abetting a cause.

Eric, your emotions are now causing contradictions and clouding clarity in your anxiousness to defend Thaksin. Chill out and read your post calmly.

I don't think you can easily cheat in any parliament and get away with it. Thaksin and PTP obviously do. Otherwise why would they tell the opposition to go home, promising the vote would be the next day, and then vote it through as soon as the opposition had gone. Why deny the opposition debating time on bills? Why did they illegally amend bills going through the house? Why did they allow their MPs to illegally vote for absent colleagues? All of this when they had a majority and could vote anything through by simply following process. Maybe they don't think rules apply to them or maybe they really do see the need to pretend to need a parliament when one man makes all the decisions. Or maybe they just can't be bothered to do things properly.

Tax regulators - the Thai revenue service is really well known for its aggressive enforcement of tax laws. Wake up Eric - multi billionaire families like the Shins can afford the best tax accountants. Don't you think it strange that one very wealthy family can increase its wealth 450%, and brag about it, whilst they are in government? Whilst billions of tax payers money is unaccounted for.

If you know PTP is Thaksin's party why do you question if someone may be right about Thaksin interfering in government and civil service. He was running the government, selecting people for all the key roles in government and civil service and telling them all what to do. All whilst a non elected criminal fugitive.

The largest minority voted for PTP, the second largest for the Dems at the last election. Many people I know voted PTP in 2011 but went out on the streets to protest against the amnesty bill, the way it whitewashed Thaksin, the attempted manipulation through parliament and the lies about its withdrawal. All those former PTP voters have now seen through Thaksin's BS. He won't get them back for 500 baht per head. I'm sure other politicians are corrupt too. It's a curse for Thailand that no one breaks this mold or pattern of behavior. But PTP would lie, get caught and tell the most ridiculous of lies to try and cover up. Even now, their new boiler room team on TVF try to rewrite history and ignore the truth when it suits.

[rubl]

Absolutely. This is why they are worried about appearing neutral. Because they cant, no matter how much they say they would like to, they can't.

So, irrespective of the guilt or not of the accused, the process cannot pass independent muster.

There is a difference between not being able to be seen as neutral and not being neutral.

The documentation, argumentation, reasoning and the verdict "yes/no" should be sufficient to judge whether justice is served independent of what people think or feel.

Should be. Could be. Would be.

It can't be. The appointed assembly isn't independent, and that is the issue.

Even when the courts were full of appointees, at least it was a court. But sadly, this impeachment won't be.

That said, even the judges over the years have been rabidly anti Thaksin, but as a court, at least it has the respect and perception of independence.

The NLA isn't independent. Simple.

Now don't move off too quickly and in the wrong direction.

In Thailand impeachment is decided upon and voted on by the Senate. The NLA represents both parliament and Senate. At least since 1997 and maybe before this procedure was such and defined.

A court may follow up if the case for which someone is impeached is deemed seriously enough to justify such.

Furthermore as I stated, the information which will be part of the impeachment process and conclusion will be the impartial proof independent of whether you just view the NLA dependent or whether it is. Certainly in the discussion here there's a lot of bias rather than proof the bias doesn't effect ones opinion.

[smedly]

if the abuse of power and corruption is generally one sided then it impossible for changes not to affect that group more than others, so I would expect any changes in law or the constitution to appear as though they are designed to curb Thaksin PTP and the redshirt movement even though in reality it affects everyone equally

Those that are seen to be showing the largest opposition to change with be those that have the most to lose

[rickirs]

The Junta's creditibility is on the line right now, mostly due to its own actions. No one is fooled by its creation of a "shadow" government and reform process

that there is any independence from the NCPO agenda. I doubt the military officers that make up 52% of the NLA are truly free to vote as "per their conscience;" it's about military chain of command. The Junta has failed the Thai economy in 2014 and likely to do so again in 2015. Regardless of the reasons, NCPO will not be able to hold elections in 2015 as it previously promised to the nation and to the world. Add in a mix of Gen. Prayuth's "odd" behavior as an unelected Head of Government and continued martial law, and you have a perceptibly disfunctional national leadership.

Gen. Prayuth's repeated excuse for the coup was for national security - to prevent a civil war. It was not driven, according to the lack of any public statements from the NCPO, by politics or any plan to reform corruption or impeach officials. In fact the military and "others" could have put considerable pressure on the NACC to investigate PTP officials for the purpose of impeachment without ever committing a coup. I believe that it was only after the coup that the Democrat and PDRC leadership who believed that they led the coup wanted political payback in the form of impeachments to get most of PTP banned from the next elections, as they did in the previous coup.

My point is that impeachments were not in NCPO's original agenda. NCPO loses nothing by delaying impeachment, ie., until after elections, and can re-establish some of its credibility to lead the nation with a nonpolitical agenda. When the NLA asked NCPO if it should begin an impeachment process against PTP officials, it replied with a "whatever." The Democrat/PDRC leadership will be obviously upset with any delay; they may have to run for election on a level political playing field next time. But remember it was the NCPO that arrested Suthep for possible insurgency charges after the coup and Gen. Prayuth disavowed that Suthep worked with the military for the coup. The NCPO owes the Demoracts/PDRC leadership nothing.

Edited January 7, 2015 by rickirs

[wabothai]

I am speechless !!!!!!! Adversaries? My behind.!!!