Driving in Thailand is NOT so bad

[WheresWaldo]

Deaths isn't the only thing one should consider.

Serious injury mvc's should be your concern too. For every death there's probably 10 people with a range of flecked up injuries, some that last for a lifetime.

My uncle lost his arm and he was a professional pianist. Pretty flecked up really.

My dad lost both of his legs to a guy that was driving too fast for conditions. He was standing behind his own vehicle when the other guy lost control and plowed into him, taking his legs between the bumpers. But that is in the US. Ƨhit happens everywhere.

[WheresWaldo]

There are a number of factors which still make driving in Thailand in a car risky, and I would caution against ever becoming complacent while driving here.

1. Poor enforcement of driving while intoxicated/inebriated laws.

2. Poor defensive driving training and education. Driver's education not taught in schools. Very limited number of driving schools.

3. Many drivers who should be wearing corrective lenses when driving don't.

4. Inadequate monitoring and testing of elderly/medically impaired drivers. (epilepsy, dementia, etc.)

5. Drivers who habitually drive hazardously (speeding, tailgating, multiple accidents) less likely to have their licenses suspended/revoked.

5. Underaged or unlicensed individuals operating motor vehicles.

6. Slow moving farm vehicles esp. sugar cane trucks.

7. Farm animals grazing on the side of the road.

8. High percentage of undivided two lane roads.

9. If right hand U-turn lane gets backed up into the right hand high speed lane you can easily rear-end someone.

10. Adequate liability insurance coverage is oftentimes not available. (maximum available limits are quite low)

11. Poor enforcement of vehicle road worthiness laws (missing headlights, tail lights, worn out tire tread, etc.)

Drivers should not become complacent ANYWHERE. That is the problem with US drivers. They are so reliant on people obeying every rule without regard to reason, that they become complacent. Then they come here . . . It is unlikely that many Thai automobile drivers ever become complacent.

Edited January 8, 2015 by WheresWaldo

[WheresWaldo]

I get the feeing from the op that just because motorcycles figure highly in accident statistics that every accident is the fault of a motorcyclist. That is untrue. IMO the bigger the vehicle the more stupid the driver. It's a size thing, "I'm bigger than you, you'd better get out of my way".

Your point is well taken. I have certainly witnessed this -- especially with big trucks/lorries and buses.

The point was not that motorcyclists are at fault, but that the fact of so disproportionately many more motorcyclists accounts for the high death rate. Motorcycles are not only more dangerous because they lack rider protection, but often other motorists simply don't see them. Add to that, that the poor can afford nothing else, and the poor scooterists are often victims of equipment failures.

But as a group, it is likely that scooterists also have a far greater share of fault than automobile drivers simply because of the economics. It is common knowledge that youthful drivers and very old drivers are at fault for collisions (I really do not like the word "accident" in this context) proportionately more often than those drivers of the middle years. Kids typically cannot afford automobiles (unless they are Red Bull heirs), so they drive scooters, and, here in Thailand, many of the old folks have never learned to drive a car. As a group, it seems ipso facto that automobile drivers as a group drive more safely that scooterists as a group, thereby compounding the statistics that arise from the previous paragraph.

[Keesters]

I get the feeing from the op that just because motorcycles figure highly in accident statistics that every accident is the fault of a motorcyclist. That is untrue. IMO the bigger the vehicle the more stupid the driver. It's a size thing, "I'm bigger than you, you'd better get out of my way".

Your point is well taken. I have certainly witnessed this -- especially with big trucks/lorries and buses.

The point was not that motorcyclists are at fault, but that the fact of so disproportionately many more motorcyclists accounts for the high death rate. Motorcycles are not only more dangerous because they lack rider protection, but often other motorists simply don't see them. Add to that, that the poor can afford nothing else, and the poor scooterists are often victims of equipment failures.

But as a group, it is likely that scooterists also have a far greater share of fault than automobile drivers simply because of the economics. It is common knowledge that youthful drivers and very old drivers are at fault for collisions (I really do not like the word "accident" in this context) proportionately more often than those drivers of the middle years. Kids typically cannot afford automobiles (unless they are Red Bull heirs), so they drive scooters, and, here in Thailand, many of the old folks have never learned to drive a car. As a group, it seems ipso facto that automobile drivers as a group drive more safely that scooterists as a group, thereby compounding the statistics that arise from the previous paragraph.

Sorry but you arguments/theories that automobile drivers as a group drive more safely will without statistics remain just a theory.

[WheresWaldo]

I congratulate the OP for an intelligent article on an important subject. His central thesis that the high rates of slaughter on Thai roads is connected with high motorcycle usage is worth noting, but several other observations and implications are in my view flawed.

The central statistical flaw is not introducing the concept of miles driven into cross border comparisons. This is very important. US average miles per year are some 50% greater than in many European countries, for example, and account for most of the difference in rates of accidents and even life expectancy. Any conclusions about relative safety of Thai versus US automobile driving need to take this into account.

Empirical observations comparing two places also has to be made with a certain humbleness when it comes to drawing conclusions. The author doenst live in Bangkok and finds drivers better wherever he does live in Thailand compared to where ever he does live in the USA. I do live in Bangkok, have lived in in five countries including the USA, and find drivers here the worst of them all by an order of measure. The OP is not wrong; nor am I. These are our differing opinions, based on differing life experiences. But neither observation, by itself, is terribly useful in drawing comparisons.

That's why the OP's main emphasis on hard stats is refreshing.

There is however the OP makes which is simply preposterous:

" I also find the joy of riding a motorcycle to be well worth the risk, since Im gonna die anyway. At the end of the day, I understand that I am responsible for keeping myself alive. Its not up to the other guy."

True in some circumstances, but in other circumstances this attitude may one day cost him his life. If he truly values his life less than the thrill of all those horses running thru his hands, then that is surely his business. But short of finding employment as a terrorist, it is about as stunning a denunciation of the value of human life that you could find anywhere.

I hope the OP comes to his senses. Good luck to him.

You make a very good point. Traffic fatality statistics reported per 100,000 of population or per 100,000 registered vehicle owners are pretty meaningless. All such statistics reported on a per 100,000 kilometers driven would be more meaningful.

As for the rest, all I can say is that everything in life carries risks. Everything you do involves a conscious or subconscious risk/reward analysis. I seldom feel more unadulterated freedom and joy than I do as I am cruising through the mountains on my motorcycle. Riding a motorcycle is not for everybody, but I wouldn't trade it for anything.

And it is quite possible that cruising through the mountains of Nan on a motorcycle is less dangerous than walking on a crowded Bangkok sidewalk. The last time I was down there, I was almost run over by motorcycles on the sidewalk several times and by a bicycle once. Granted I am not used to being there, but who would think you have to look over your shoulder for a motorcycle before stepping to the left or right around a piece of broken concrete? Whoa!

[bbbbooboo]

I can only surmise that there are 2 Thailands. The one that I have experienced in driving here, both car and on motorcycle is extremely dangerous(during holiday periods verging on lethal) and I don't need to be erudite to understand that

[WheresWaldo]

There are a number of factors which still make driving in Thailand in a car risky, and I would caution against ever becoming complacent while driving here.

1. Poor enforcement of driving while intoxicated/inebriated laws.

2. Poor defensive driving training and education. Driver's education not taught in schools. Very limited number of driving schools.

3. Many drivers who should be wearing corrective lenses when driving don't.

4. Inadequate monitoring and testing of elderly/medically impaired drivers. (epilepsy, dementia, etc.)

5. Drivers who habitually drive hazardously (speeding, tailgating, multiple accidents) less likely to have their licenses suspended/revoked.

5. Underaged or unlicensed individuals operating motor vehicles.

6. Slow moving farm vehicles esp. sugar cane trucks.

7. Farm animals grazing on the side of the road.

8. High percentage of undivided two lane roads.

9. If right hand U-turn lane gets backed up into the right hand high speed lane you can easily rear-end someone.

10. Adequate liability insurance coverage is oftentimes not available. (maximum available limits are quite low)

11. Poor enforcement of vehicle road worthiness laws (missing headlights, tail lights, worn out tire tread, etc.)

The problem will become if the Thais dont try to use some sense NOW then later they will be forced to do so by draconian laws like the Uk has, all it needs is a bit of decency and sense NOW...........I ain t holding my breath and dont want the UK'S over the top laws here.

well the Op says it aint so bad and to a point Id agree but yes, you really do have to be on guard and expect the unbelievably impossible to happen at ANY time.

I once saw a 6 foot by 3 foot steel cage in the road all cars swerving round it, then saw a Police car ( Highway Patrol) approach it and i thought good theyll stop and clear the road...................nope , swerved round it and carried on.absolute STUPIDITY on their part

Please describe some of the UK driving laws that you find draconian.

It is NOT the laws on the U.S. and U.K. that are draconian; it is the enforcement. It is black and white enforcement; no reason; no discretion. Enforcement should be to the spirit of the law; enforcement to the letter is draconian.

[Keesters]

There are a number of factors which still make driving in Thailand in a car risky, and I would caution against ever becoming complacent while driving here.

1. Poor enforcement of driving while intoxicated/inebriated laws.

2. Poor defensive driving training and education. Driver's education not taught in schools. Very limited number of driving schools.

3. Many drivers who should be wearing corrective lenses when driving don't.

4. Inadequate monitoring and testing of elderly/medically impaired drivers. (epilepsy, dementia, etc.)

5. Drivers who habitually drive hazardously (speeding, tailgating, multiple accidents) less likely to have their licenses suspended/revoked.

5. Underaged or unlicensed individuals operating motor vehicles.

6. Slow moving farm vehicles esp. sugar cane trucks.

7. Farm animals grazing on the side of the road.

8. High percentage of undivided two lane roads.

9. If right hand U-turn lane gets backed up into the right hand high speed lane you can easily rear-end someone.

10. Adequate liability insurance coverage is oftentimes not available. (maximum available limits are quite low)

11. Poor enforcement of vehicle road worthiness laws (missing headlights, tail lights, worn out tire tread, etc.)

The problem will become if the Thais dont try to use some sense NOW then later they will be forced to do so by draconian laws like the Uk has, all it needs is a bit of decency and sense NOW...........I ain t holding my breath and dont want the UK'S over the top laws here.

well the Op says it aint so bad and to a point Id agree but yes, you really do have to be on guard and expect the unbelievably impossible to happen at ANY time.

I once saw a 6 foot by 3 foot steel cage in the road all cars swerving round it, then saw a Police car ( Highway Patrol) approach it and i thought good theyll stop and clear the road...................nope , swerved round it and carried on.absolute STUPIDITY on their part

Please describe some of the UK driving laws that you find draconian.

It is NOT the laws on the U.S. and U.K. that are draconian; it is the enforcement. It is black and white enforcement; no reason; no discretion. Enforcement should be to the spirit of the law; enforcement to the letter is draconian.

It was @kannot that called UK driving laws draconian. Perhaps your comment would be better addressed to him/her.

[WheresWaldo]

Cars have seat belts, airbags and are engineered to absorb impact Force by crumpling, yet preserving an area surrounding the driver and/or passenger.

Motorbikes have nothing to protect you in an accident, except your helmet.

The "we're all going to die anyway" is a logical red herring. If you believe riding a moto is a justifiable risk, you should also take up base jumping, free style rock climbing, injecting heroin, changing all your online bank account passwords to "password" and playing Russian Roulette with your spouse to settle disagreements, leaving your door unlocked with a loaded gun on your table and always carry your life savings in your pocket when walking through crowded markets.

Hey, we're all going to die anyway...

Hey, great idea. Since I love riding motorcycles, I think I'll shoot up. Non sequitur extraordinaire. Your logic is impeccable. You should change your name to Socrates.

[neverdie]

Deaths isn't the only thing one should consider.

Serious injury mvc's should be your concern too. For every death there's probably 10 people with a range of flecked up injuries, some that last for a lifetime.

My uncle lost his arm and he was a professional pianist. Pretty flecked up really.

My dad lost both of his legs to a guy that was driving too fast for conditions. He was standing behind his own vehicle when the other guy lost control and plowed into him, taking his legs between the bumpers. But that is in the US. Ƨhit happens everywhere.

Sure it does. People tend to lose sight of the fact that series injuries sustained in mvc normally outstrip deaths, 10 to 1. There's certainly some people well and truely stuffed up with serious injuries sustained In prangs.

[WheresWaldo]

Deaths isn't the only thing one should consider.

Serious injury mvc's should be your concern too. For every death there's probably 10 people with a range of flecked up injuries, some that last for a lifetime.

My uncle lost his arm and he was a professional pianist. Pretty flecked up really.

My dad lost both of his legs to a guy that was driving too fast for conditions. He was standing behind his own vehicle when the other guy lost control and plowed into him, taking his legs between the bumpers. But that is in the US. Ƨhit happens everywhere.

Sure it does. People tend to lose sight of the fact that series injuries sustained in mvc normally outstrip deaths, 10 to 1. There's certainly some people well and truely stuffed up with serious injuries sustained In prangs.

And truth be known, that is my worst fear. Death can be a blessing. Just come over a look at my stroke ridden father-in-law lying helpless on the bed and you'll know. He may have had a stroke, but it could have just as well been a bump on the head, helmet or no.

[neverdie]

Deaths isn't the only thing one should consider.

Serious injury mvc's should be your concern too. For every death there's probably 10 people with a range of flecked up injuries, some that last for a lifetime.

My uncle lost his arm and he was a professional pianist. Pretty flecked up really.

My dad lost both of his legs to a guy that was driving too fast for conditions. He was standing behind his own vehicle when the other guy lost control and plowed into him, taking his legs between the bumpers. But that is in the US. Ƨhit happens everywhere.

Sure it does. People tend to lose sight of the fact that series injuries sustained in mvc normally outstrip deaths, 10 to 1. There's certainly some people well and truely stuffed up with serious injuries sustained In prangs.

And truth be known, that is my worst fear. Death can be a blessing. Just come over a look at my stroke ridden father-in-law lying helpless on the bed and you'll know. He may have had a stroke, but it could have just as well been a bump on the head, helmet or no.

Me too. Did your father lose below or above the knee? I always take great care around the road, between cars, like when getting something out of the trunk. Terrible injury to sustain. I had a friend that lost the leg below the knee on a bike in New Zealand, he was greatful it wasn't above the knee, nor an arm. Injuries like that change absolutely EVERYTHING.

Best luck to all your injured family for 2015.

[georgemandm]

A 3-week visit to India cured me of ever complaning about traffic and drivers in Thailand.

Yes good but you are in thailand not India you have to understand thai drives are the worst in the world go have a look at the driveing test and come back here and tell us what you think then, it is a f??king joke .

[Tomtomtom69]

I'm with the OP except for one thing - tailgating. I drive between Bangkok and Pattaya every week and an easy drive it is except for the tailgating lunatics.

I have discovered that New Zealand drivers are by far the worst tailgaters that I have ever encountered. Latest experience was when a moron driving a Mac truck tailgated me.

At least in Thailand, the fools are usually coming towards me, not up my backside.

Between Bkk and Pattaya at least you have double lanes to let them past, while in NZ most of the roads are single and the impatient cretins think that I am going to speed up if they get close enough to me. No way I'm exceeding the speed limit now, as the fuzz don't make any allowance for a few km over the limit. Even ONE km over and they'll book you.

Australia is similar but on a recent trip with my Thai fiancee out there, we were driving from Canberra to Melbourne and for some bizarre reason there is a 20km stretch of single lane carriageway between Canberra and Yass (why they couldn't turn the whole stretch into a freeway at once baffles me) and so I was stuck behind 3 vehicles, including a leading truck that were doing about 90-95km/h in a 100km/h zone so on a stretch of broken lines (where you are allowed to overtake/pass) I passed the whole line of vehicles but had to go up to 130km/h otherwise there's no way I could have made it back to my side of the road before a passing vehicle in the opposite direction came past me. But I know the fuzz would not have taken a liking to that, but hey, I was legally overtaking/passing, I didn't cross any unbroken lines.

However, I've noticed that Aussie drivers do not overtake/pass on broken lines anymore. They wait patiently until there is an overtaking/passing lane. Sure it's safer, but if it's a broken line you're allowed to pass anyway, if it's safe to do so. Strange that Aussie drivers just don't do so.

Edited January 8, 2015 by Tomtomtom69

[Banzai99]

A 3-week visit to India cured me of ever complaning about traffic and drivers in Thailand.

Yes good but you are in thailand not India you have to understand thai drives are the worst in the world go have a look at the driveing test and come back here and tell us what you think then, it is a f??king joke .

Many old Farangs get motorcycle licences taking a Thai driving test, then become a danger to themselves and every other road user, is that what you're saying ?

[gerry1011]

14 years in Thailand and had just one incident... with a cow crossing the road.

Oh, yes, I think I also run over a chicken once.

I like to drive in Thailand.

I like the way people drive here.

You just have to know where possible danger come from.

(girls on motobike, speaking on the phone and at the same time protecting their face from the sun with it, for example).

I don't like farangs who would like the Thai roads to become as boring as the US or west european roads...

Edited January 8, 2015 by gerry1011

[sandyf]

There are a number of factors which still make driving in Thailand in a car risky, and I would caution against ever becoming complacent while driving here.

1. Poor enforcement of driving while intoxicated/inebriated laws.

2. Poor defensive driving training and education. Driver's education not taught in schools. Very limited number of driving schools.

3. Many drivers who should be wearing corrective lenses when driving don't.

4. Inadequate monitoring and testing of elderly/medically impaired drivers. (epilepsy, dementia, etc.)

5. Drivers who habitually drive hazardously (speeding, tailgating, multiple accidents) less likely to have their licenses suspended/revoked.

5. Underaged or unlicensed individuals operating motor vehicles.

6. Slow moving farm vehicles esp. sugar cane trucks.

7. Farm animals grazing on the side of the road.

8. High percentage of undivided two lane roads.

9. If right hand U-turn lane gets backed up into the right hand high speed lane you can easily rear-end someone.

10. Adequate liability insurance coverage is oftentimes not available. (maximum available limits are quite low)

11. Poor enforcement of vehicle road worthiness laws (missing headlights, tail lights, worn out tire tread, etc.)

The problem will become if the Thais dont try to use some sense NOW then later they will be forced to do so by draconian laws like the Uk has, all it needs is a bit of decency and sense NOW...........I ain t holding my breath and dont want the UK'S over the top laws here.

well the Op says it aint so bad and to a point Id agree but yes, you really do have to be on guard and expect the unbelievably impossible to happen at ANY time.

I once saw a 6 foot by 3 foot steel cage in the road all cars swerving round it, then saw a Police car ( Highway Patrol) approach it and i thought good theyll stop and clear the road...................nope , swerved round it and carried on.absolute STUPIDITY on their part

Please describe some of the UK driving laws that you find draconian.

Speeding in general, at 3 am in the morning in the country on a 3 lane wideeeeeeee carriageway speeding at 70 mph mph on a 60mph road in the middle of nowhere ( Mid Wales) clear skies dry road no one else about, coppers dont use any common sense now its just "youre nicked"

Speed doesnt kill if used sensibly.

Speed cameras are there to generate income, many now being removed due to complaints or no more introduced, often put in certain positions to generate income even though govt will say there must be xyz amount of casualties before one can be erected.

Unfortunately laws are made for the absolute cretinous in society which then blight the majority.

I was stationed and driving around Germany when there were no speed limits, quite scary. Like most of Europe, speed limits were introduced during the fuel crisis in the early seventies. After the fuel crisis the limits were raised slightly but not removed, I wonder why?

[WheresWaldo]

14 years in Thailand and had just one incident... with a cow crossing the road.

Oh, yes, I think I also run over a chicken once.

I like to drive in Thailand.

I like the way people drive here.

You just have to know where possible danger come from.

(girls on motobike, speaking on the phone and at the same time protecting their face from the sun with it, for example).

I don't like farangs who would like the Thai roads to become as boring as the US or west european roads...

Yo brought to mind one thing that is dangerous as hell on Thai roads. That's these university girls on scooters with short skirts right up to the top of their crotches. I've had several close calls because of them. Gonna be the death of me.

[WheresWaldo]

My dad lost both of his legs to a guy that was driving too fast for conditions. He was standing behind his own vehicle when the other guy lost control and plowed into him, taking his legs between the bumpers. But that is in the US. Ƨhit happens everywhere.

Sure it does. People tend to lose sight of the fact that series injuries sustained in mvc normally outstrip deaths, 10 to 1. There's certainly some people well and truely stuffed up with serious injuries sustained In prangs.

And truth be known, that is my worst fear. Death can be a blessing. Just come over a look at my stroke ridden father-in-law lying helpless on the bed and you'll know. He may have had a stroke, but it could have just as well been a bump on the head, helmet or no.

Me too. Did your father lose below or above the knee? I always take great care around the road, between cars, like when getting something out of the trunk. Terrible injury to sustain. I had a friend that lost the leg below the knee on a bike in New Zealand, he was greatful it wasn't above the knee, nor an arm. Injuries like that change absolutely EVERYTHING.

Best luck to all your injured family for 2015.

It was above the knee, and, yes, it changed everything. The folks at the hospital said he was the worst case that ever came in and survived. There just happened to be an emergency room doc and a state trooper driving by when it happened. The doc tied up the severed femoral artery and they threw him into the back of the cop car and took off down the mountain to the hospital.

He used to joke that he would have sued, but when he went to see the lawyer the lawyer said he didn't have a leg to stand on. It happened in 1977; he died in 1997.

[bikerlou47]

If one is not afraid of putting their ass on a Thai road or highway , they should consider psychiatric help!

[NomadJoe]

If one is not afraid of putting their ass on a Thai road or highway , they should consider psychiatric help!

I disagree. It just takes a little time to learn the Thai traffic. It may not look like it to the experienced but there is a certain pragmatic order to it. Once you learn this it is easy to anticipate other drivers. Keep what good driving habits you learned back home and don't take chances like you see most other drivers doing and you'll be fine. I am more comfortable in Thai traffic now than traffic in the states. In Thailand at least everyone is paying attention. In the states everyone is distracted and drive with a sense of entitlement and ownership of lanes and right of way that is difficult to get used to again after years driving in Thailand.

[bikerlou47]

You could not be more wrong!

[thaibeachlovers]

I'm with the OP except for one thing - tailgating. I drive between Bangkok and Pattaya every week and an easy drive it is except for the tailgating lunatics.

I have discovered that New Zealand drivers are by far the worst tailgaters that I have ever encountered. Latest experience was when a moron driving a Mac truck tailgated me.

At least in Thailand, the fools are usually coming towards me, not up my backside.

Between Bkk and Pattaya at least you have double lanes to let them past, while in NZ most of the roads are single and the impatient cretins think that I am going to speed up if they get close enough to me. No way I'm exceeding the speed limit now, as the fuzz don't make any allowance for a few km over the limit. Even ONE km over and they'll book you.

Australia is similar but on a recent trip with my Thai fiancee out there, we were driving from Canberra to Melbourne and for some bizarre reason there is a 20km stretch of single lane carriageway between Canberra and Yass (why they couldn't turn the whole stretch into a freeway at once baffles me) and so I was stuck behind 3 vehicles, including a leading truck that were doing about 90-95km/h in a 100km/h zone so on a stretch of broken lines (where you are allowed to overtake/pass) I passed the whole line of vehicles but had to go up to 130km/h otherwise there's no way I could have made it back to my side of the road before a passing vehicle in the opposite direction came past me. But I know the fuzz would not have taken a liking to that, but hey, I was legally overtaking/passing, I didn't cross any unbroken lines.

However, I've noticed that Aussie drivers do not overtake/pass on broken lines anymore. They wait patiently until there is an overtaking/passing lane. Sure it's safer, but if it's a broken line you're allowed to pass anyway, if it's safe to do so. Strange that Aussie drivers just don't do so.

In New Zealand on the open road I drive a bit under the speed limit as the cops have no tolerance for speeding ( even ONE km over and it's a ticket ), hence I always have the maniacs up my backside. When it's safe for them to pass I pull well over to the left to allow them to pass safely, but it's amazing how many won't, even though it's a straight stretch of road with nothing coming and completely safe. I try slowing down, but they still won't pass till I put the left indicator on and slow down to about 30 km/hr, and sometimes I have to come to a halt to make them overtake. Either they don't know how to drive, or they are severely lacking in confidence. It could be that most usually only drive in town and don't know how to drive in the country.

However, when I get to the village that I live in I have to slow down for a sharp left turn off the main road, and invariably the maniacs will overtake me by crossing a double yellow line ( no passing ) .

[thaibeachlovers]

You could not be more wrong!

I concur. There is no "order" to Thai driving. They will even do a U turn where it is banned ( by a sign ) right beside a cop on traffic duty, and he lets them!!!!!!!!!!

[WheresWaldo]

You could not be more wrong!

Don't bother with the facts, just go straight for the ad hominem attack!

Have it your way: Flame broiled.

[WheresWaldo]

You could not be more wrong!

I concur. There is no "order" to Thai driving. They will even do a U turn where it is banned ( by a sign ) right beside a cop on traffic duty, and he lets them!!!!!!!!!!

"There is no "order" to Thai driving."

You have come right to the essence of the argument. This is the beauty of it. This is what I love. This is what creates the great divide between the loves and the hates in this thread.

​Order is the antipathy of freedom. Freedom always comes at a price, and there are many unwilling to pay it. To each his own. Carry on.

[stevenl]

You could not be more wrong!

I concur. There is no "order" to Thai driving. They will even do a U turn where it is banned ( by a sign ) right beside a cop on traffic duty, and he lets them!!!!!!!!!!

"There is no "order" to Thai driving."

You have come right to the essence of the argument. This is the beauty of it. This is what I love. This is what creates the great divide between the loves and the hates in this thread.

​Order is the antipathy of freedom. Freedom always comes at a price, and there are many unwilling to pay it. To each his own. Carry on.

And here I finally disagree with you. There is an order to Thai driving. Unwritten and quite often not according to the law, but there is order and predictability.

[WheresWaldo]

You could not be more wrong!

I concur. There is no "order" to Thai driving. They will even do a U turn where it is banned ( by a sign ) right beside a cop on traffic duty, and he lets them!!!!!!!!!!

"There is no "order" to Thai driving."

You have come right to the essence of the argument. This is the beauty of it. This is what I love. This is what creates the great divide between the loves and the hates in this thread.

​Order is the antipathy of freedom. Freedom always comes at a price, and there are many unwilling to pay it. To each his own. Carry on.

And here I finally disagree with you. There is an order to Thai driving. Unwritten and quite often not according to the law, but there is order and predictability.

I completely agree with you. My acquiescence to "no order" was misplaced. What I was thinking was no order based on a body of rules strictly enforced to the letter.

[SiSePuede419]

Whenever I see a couple of Farang riding on a moto with no helmets, my only hope is that they are American Nutters here on a Mission, doing the "Lord's work".

And I pray that the Lord works in "mysterious ways".

Amen, 555

Edited January 9, 2015 by SiSePuede419

[richard_smith237]

The dangers and risks of driving in Thailand are greater than back in the UK - I don't think there is any argument against that.

However, being more dangerous shouldn't prevent careful people from driving in Thailand, although it does prevent me from riding (a motorbike) - As the Op suggests, Driving in Thailand is not so bad.... I'll add a caveat - When using careful consideration and observation.

With an understanding that the Driving Law in Thailand is not followed so merely as its treated as a general guideline which invariably is not understood or followed. The key to driving safely in Thailand is observation and the understanding that anything can happen.

I'll also add that installation of a DashCam could at some point protect you from taking the blame when something unavoidable happens on the road.

Another Point: I don't know any British people who have been involved in a Drunk Driving related accident, I don't know any Thai's who haven't.....

But for the most part I don't have any serious issues with driving in Thailand... I do however worry about the lorries etc with unsecured heavy loads, I worry about the MiniVans driving like idiots... For the most part the general motorist is quite safe (given the exception of the 2% of idiots who think they are in a race).