Abhisit urges govt to consider underlying causes of political unrest

[tbthailand]

"Abhisit said amnesty should only be promulgated at the right time and after agreeing on the root causes of conflicts."

Root causes? Here's a few

1: corruption.

2. The perception that might is right.

3. Incompetent police and judicial systems.

4. Giving amnesties to criminals.

1. agreed

2. agreed

3. agreed

4. agreed but should be even handed and I don't include present witchhunt in this

5. ruling class treat the country like their own fiefdom

6. cool down nationalism and remove LM and encourage freedom of speech - the country is for ALL Thais not just the 1% elite

your point to remove LM is the most important.

[tonbridgebrit]

Abhisit, do you want the following to happen ??

1) Thaksin to be given a life-time ban on politics.
2) Any party that has red as their colour or main colour must be banned from any election.
3) Any party that gets the bulk of it's support from Isaan and/or rural Thailand must not be allowed to take part in an election.
4) Only parties that represent the interests of Thailand's richest 5% (these people are mainly a bunch of Chinese in Thailand) will be allowed to take part.

Yes Abhisit, when or if Thailand brings in the above points, you will then win an election. If Thailand doesn't bring in the above points, you, Mr Abhisit, are very unlikely to win an election. We all know that.

[djjamie]

I see there is mention of the "amnesty bill" and the "red army" as proximate causes necessitating the coup.

I was under the impression the amnesty bill was struck down by the court. If so, it was no longer a factor (other than being source of outrage to be stoked).

And the so-called red army? Was that the 23 sad sacks in Khon Kaen? I must have missed all the news reports of an actual armed threat.

The amnesty bill WAS struck down by the courts. The Right Honorable Abhisit never mentioned this amnesty bill as necessitating the coup? He did say….Nah, I won't bother explaining it. Just re-read the article. Explaining it makes me feel like a primary school teacher.

So called red army? Democracy Protection Volunteers' (DPV) would be what is being referred too. Run by "Rambo Isan" a violent hardline man. They aimed to mobilise 10,000 members per province across the country. "Rambo Isan" said they are mustering recruits to be sent for military-style training in order to protect their own protesters. This happened around the same time the NACC had grenades lobbed at them because of a decision that went against the UDD.

Below is the red army in training in Nakhon Ratchasima.

This photo was in the same location of the "Beating of the War Drum" meetings. Remember them? That is where the UDD supporters cheered terrorist attacks and the loss of life all relayed to them by a police chief none the less.

Also around the same time when the UDD threatened succession, but then found out it was illegal so denied they said it.

Seems like you did miss the news on the armed threats then. No worries. Now you know…This happened last year, yet you can remember a perceived wrong done in a thaksin land case years ago if the argument arose..

Selective memory methinks.

Edited February 19, 2015 by djjamie

[heybruce]

I see there is mention of the "amnesty bill" and the "red army" as proximate causes necessitating the coup.

I was under the impression the amnesty bill was struck down by the court. If so, it was no longer a factor (other than being source of outrage to be stoked).

And the so-called red army? Was that the 23 sad sacks in Khon Kaen? I must have missed all the news reports of an actual armed threat.

The amnesty bill WAS struck down by the courts. The Right Honorable Abhisit never mentioned this amnesty bill as necessitating the coup? He did say….Nah, I won't bother explaining it. Just re-read the article. Explaining it makes me feel like a primary school teacher.

So called red army? Democracy Protection Volunteers' (DPV) would be what is being referred too. Run by "Rambo Isan" a violent hardline man. They aimed to mobilise 10,000 members per province across the country. "Rambo Isan" said they are mustering recruits to be sent for military-style training in order to protect their own protesters. This happened around the same time the NACC had grenades lobbed at them because of a decision that went against the UDD.

Below is the red army in training in Nakhon Ratchasima.

This photo was in the same location of the "Beating of the War Drum" meetings. Remember them? That is where the UDD supporters cheered terrorist attacks and the loss of life all relayed to them by a police chief none the less.

Also around the same time when the UDD threatened succession, but then found out it was illegal so denied they said it.

Seems like you did miss the news on the armed threats then. No worries. Now you know…This happened last year, yet you can remember a perceived wrong done in a thaksin land case years ago if the argument arose..

Selective memory methinks.

"So called red army? Democracy Protection Volunteers' (DPV) would be what is being referred too. Run by "Rambo Isan" a violent hardline man. They aimed to mobilise 10,000 members per province across the country. "Rambo Isan" said they are mustering recruits to be sent for military-style training in order to protect their own protesters. This happened around the same time the NACC had grenades lobbed at them because of a decision that went against the UDD. "

Why don't you give us your sources for your claims? It's not that we don't trust...well, actually, it is that we don't trust you. You have a history of distorting facts.

Nice picture. Is it some kind of boyscout jamboree?

Edited February 19, 2015 by heybruce

[djjamie]

A lovely pick of a man that is trying to ensure that unelected criminals are not running the country.

Red suits him too. Although it is more associated with violent terrorism in Thailand.

[djjamie]

I see there is mention of the "amnesty bill" and the "red army" as proximate causes necessitating the coup.

I was under the impression the amnesty bill was struck down by the court. If so, it was no longer a factor (other than being source of outrage to be stoked).

And the so-called red army? Was that the 23 sad sacks in Khon Kaen? I must have missed all the news reports of an actual armed threat.

The amnesty bill WAS struck down by the courts. The Right Honorable Abhisit never mentioned this amnesty bill as necessitating the coup? He did say….Nah, I won't bother explaining it. Just re-read the article. Explaining it makes me feel like a primary school teacher.

So called red army? Democracy Protection Volunteers' (DPV) would be what is being referred too. Run by "Rambo Isan" a violent hardline man. They aimed to mobilise 10,000 members per province across the country. "Rambo Isan" said they are mustering recruits to be sent for military-style training in order to protect their own protesters. This happened around the same time the NACC had grenades lobbed at them because of a decision that went against the UDD.

Below is the red army in training in Nakhon Ratchasima.

This photo was in the same location of the "Beating of the War Drum" meetings. Remember them? That is where the UDD supporters cheered terrorist attacks and the loss of life all relayed to them by a police chief none the less.

Also around the same time when the UDD threatened succession, but then found out it was illegal so denied they said it.

Seems like you did miss the news on the armed threats then. No worries. Now you know…This happened last year, yet you can remember a perceived wrong done in a thaksin land case years ago if the argument arose..

Selective memory methinks.

"So called red army? Democracy Protection Volunteers' (DPV) would be what is being referred too. Run by "Rambo Isan" a violent hardline man. They aimed to mobilise 10,000 members per province across the country. "Rambo Isan" said they are mustering recruits to be sent for military-style training in order to protect their own protesters. This happened around the same time the NACC had grenades lobbed at them because of a decision that went against the UDD. "

Why don't you give us your sources for your claims? It's not that we don't trust...well, actually, it is that we don't trust you. You have a history of distorting facts.

Nice picture. Is it some kind of boyscout jamboree?

Seriously? You cannot google it? Your doing the PTP defense of needing 20 links now because the truth does not suit the agenda? When the truth hurts too much the link is fake? Is the photo I posted fake as well? Maybe photo shopped by me?

Distorting facts? It is because I DONT distort facts that your peers simply ignore them and belittle me instead. It is easier for them to do that.

Do I ask you for a link for the winner of the 2011 elections? Of course not…I don't have a selective memory.

So you have only indicated with your post that you actually DO have selective memory because you asked for links...

So I assume you will dodge the issue by stating "You should not say your, but say you're" in reference to my first sentence.

That is the typical reply I get when I state truths.

No DPV heay? Photo fake heay?

Goodness me...

[baboon]

I see there is mention of the "amnesty bill" and the "red army" as proximate causes necessitating the coup.

I was under the impression the amnesty bill was struck down by the court. If so, it was no longer a factor (other than being source of outrage to be stoked).

And the so-called red army? Was that the 23 sad sacks in Khon Kaen? I must have missed all the news reports of an actual armed threat.

The amnesty bill WAS struck down by the courts. The Right Honorable Abhisit never mentioned this amnesty bill as necessitating the coup? He did say.Nah, I won't bother explaining it. Just re-read the article. Explaining it makes me feel like a primary school teacher.

So called red army? Democracy Protection Volunteers' (DPV) would be what is being referred too. Run by "Rambo Isan" a violent hardline man. They aimed to mobilise 10,000 members per province across the country. "Rambo Isan" said they are mustering recruits to be sent for military-style training in order to protect their own protesters. This happened around the same time the NACC had grenades lobbed at them because of a decision that went against the UDD.

Below is the red army in training in Nakhon Ratchasima.

This photo was in the same location of the "Beating of the War Drum" meetings. Remember them? That is where the UDD supporters cheered terrorist attacks and the loss of life all relayed to them by a police chief none the less.

Also around the same time when the UDD threatened succession, but then found out it was illegal so denied they said it.

Seems like you did miss the news on the armed threats then. No worries. Now you knowThis happened last year, yet you can remember a perceived wrong done in a thaksin land case years ago if the argument arose..

Selective memory methinks.

"So called red army? Democracy Protection Volunteers' (DPV) would be what is being referred too. Run by "Rambo Isan" a violent hardline man. They aimed to mobilise 10,000 members per province across the country. "Rambo Isan" said they are mustering recruits to be sent for military-style training in order to protect their own protesters. This happened around the same time the NACC had grenades lobbed at them because of a decision that went against the UDD. "

Why don't you give us your sources for your claims? It's not that we don't trust...well, actually, it is that we don't trust you. You have a history of distorting facts.

Not to mention being frequently exposed copy and pasting the work of others without acknowledging the author. Give me ginjag or northernjohn any day.

[heybruce]

I see there is mention of the "amnesty bill" and the "red army" as proximate causes necessitating the coup.

I was under the impression the amnesty bill was struck down by the court. If so, it was no longer a factor (other than being source of outrage to be stoked).

And the so-called red army? Was that the 23 sad sacks in Khon Kaen? I must have missed all the news reports of an actual armed threat.

The amnesty bill WAS struck down by the courts. The Right Honorable Abhisit never mentioned this amnesty bill as necessitating the coup? He did say….Nah, I won't bother explaining it. Just re-read the article. Explaining it makes me feel like a primary school teacher.

So called red army? Democracy Protection Volunteers' (DPV) would be what is being referred too. Run by "Rambo Isan" a violent hardline man. They aimed to mobilise 10,000 members per province across the country. "Rambo Isan" said they are mustering recruits to be sent for military-style training in order to protect their own protesters. This happened around the same time the NACC had grenades lobbed at them because of a decision that went against the UDD.

Below is the red army in training in Nakhon Ratchasima.

This photo was in the same location of the "Beating of the War Drum" meetings. Remember them? That is where the UDD supporters cheered terrorist attacks and the loss of life all relayed to them by a police chief none the less.

Also around the same time when the UDD threatened succession, but then found out it was illegal so denied they said it.

Seems like you did miss the news on the armed threats then. No worries. Now you know…This happened last year, yet you can remember a perceived wrong done in a thaksin land case years ago if the argument arose..

Selective memory methinks.

"So called red army? Democracy Protection Volunteers' (DPV) would be what is being referred too. Run by "Rambo Isan" a violent hardline man. They aimed to mobilise 10,000 members per province across the country. "Rambo Isan" said they are mustering recruits to be sent for military-style training in order to protect their own protesters. This happened around the same time the NACC had grenades lobbed at them because of a decision that went against the UDD. "

Why don't you give us your sources for your claims? It's not that we don't trust...well, actually, it is that we don't trust you. You have a history of distorting facts.

Nice picture. Is it some kind of boyscout jamboree?

Seriously? You cannot google it? Your doing the PTP defense of needing 20 links now because the truth does not suit the agenda? When the truth hurts too much the link is fake? Is the photo I posted fake as well? Maybe photo shopped by me?

Distorting facts? It is because I DONT distort facts that your peers simply ignore them and belittle me instead. It is easier for them to do that.

Do I ask you for a link for the winner of the 2011 elections? Of course not…I don't have a selective memory.

So you have only indicated with your post that you actually DO have selective memory because you asked for links...

So I assume you will dodge the issue by stating "You should not say your, but say you're" in reference to my first sentence.

That is the typical reply I get when I state truths.

No DPV heay? Photo fake heay?

Goodness me...

"Seriously? You cannot google it? Your doing the PTP defense of needing 20 links now because the truth does not suit the agenda?"

Seriously? You can not provide sources to support your own posts? Not 20, one or two from credible sources would be nice. It's no wonder that people have stopped taking your posts seriously; it has nothing to do with verifiable facts, it has to do with your reluctance to post verifiable facts.

[djjamie]

The amnesty bill WAS struck down by the courts. The Right Honorable Abhisit never mentioned this amnesty bill as necessitating the coup? He did say….Nah, I won't bother explaining it. Just re-read the article. Explaining it makes me feel like a primary school teacher.

So called red army? Democracy Protection Volunteers' (DPV) would be what is being referred too. Run by "Rambo Isan" a violent hardline man. They aimed to mobilise 10,000 members per province across the country. "Rambo Isan" said they are mustering recruits to be sent for military-style training in order to protect their own protesters. This happened around the same time the NACC had grenades lobbed at them because of a decision that went against the UDD.

Below is the red army in training in Nakhon Ratchasima.

This photo was in the same location of the "Beating of the War Drum" meetings. Remember them? That is where the UDD supporters cheered terrorist attacks and the loss of life all relayed to them by a police chief none the less.

Also around the same time when the UDD threatened succession, but then found out it was illegal so denied they said it.

Seems like you did miss the news on the armed threats then. No worries. Now you know…This happened last year, yet you can remember a perceived wrong done in a thaksin land case years ago if the argument arose..

Selective memory methinks.

"So called red army? Democracy Protection Volunteers' (DPV) would be what is being referred too. Run by "Rambo Isan" a violent hardline man. They aimed to mobilise 10,000 members per province across the country. "Rambo Isan" said they are mustering recruits to be sent for military-style training in order to protect their own protesters. This happened around the same time the NACC had grenades lobbed at them because of a decision that went against the UDD. "

Why don't you give us your sources for your claims? It's not that we don't trust...well, actually, it is that we don't trust you. You have a history of distorting facts.

Nice picture. Is it some kind of boyscout jamboree?

Seriously? You cannot google it? Your doing the PTP defense of needing 20 links now because the truth does not suit the agenda? When the truth hurts too much the link is fake? Is the photo I posted fake as well? Maybe photo shopped by me?

Distorting facts? It is because I DONT distort facts that your peers simply ignore them and belittle me instead. It is easier for them to do that.

Do I ask you for a link for the winner of the 2011 elections? Of course not…I don't have a selective memory.

So you have only indicated with your post that you actually DO have selective memory because you asked for links...

So I assume you will dodge the issue by stating "You should not say your, but say you're" in reference to my first sentence.

That is the typical reply I get when I state truths.

No DPV heay? Photo fake heay?

Goodness me...

"Seriously? You cannot google it? Your doing the PTP defense of needing 20 links now because the truth does not suit the agenda?"

Seriously? You can not provide sources to support your own posts? Not 20, one or two from credible sources would be nice. It's no wonder that people have stopped taking your posts seriously; it has nothing to do with verifiable facts, it has to do with your reluctance to post verifiable facts.

Ok show me a link of the PTP winning the 2011 election. Until you do I can see why people have stopped taking your posts seriously..(Of course I cannot back up this claim up just as you can't either)

Here is a link. www.google.com.au

So to reiterate you think the DPV did not exist? They never existed? Was there a "Beat the War Drum" meeting in Nahkon? Did UDD supporters cheer the deaths at hands of terrorists or is this history wiped from your memory like Prayuths wiping of thaksin history is because it does not suit an agenda. I assume you dislike thakisn being wiped from the history books? Your ignorance and stubborn approach to refuse to accept history until I provide links is the same.

Seems the burden of proof is on you because history shows there was a DPV and there were "Beat the War Drum" meetings mate. And just like I don't need a link to the 2011 election results because history did show the PTP won that election (and I know how to use google to look it up as it is quicker than getting into an argumentative back and forth to ask for links). If I think the PTP did not win the election I should provide the links right if you don't believe me.

Why even argue this case mate…History has shown I am right.

Show me a link that proves me wrong. Burden of proof is on you. history is on my side.

Amazing (falangs in) Thailand.

EDIT - Google "rambo isan training in Nakhon Ratchasima" in images.

I am still waiting on 2 links to prove the PTP won the 2011 elections though and until you do I will refuse to believe they did because it does not suit my agenda!!!

Edited February 19, 2015 by djjamie

[baboon]

^^

History only proves one right until the new victors redraft it. Your response is a cop out and you know it - you would be only too delighted to post links if you could.

[heybruce]

"So called red army? Democracy Protection Volunteers' (DPV) would be what is being referred too. Run by "Rambo Isan" a violent hardline man. They aimed to mobilise 10,000 members per province across the country. "Rambo Isan" said they are mustering recruits to be sent for military-style training in order to protect their own protesters. This happened around the same time the NACC had grenades lobbed at them because of a decision that went against the UDD. "

Why don't you give us your sources for your claims? It's not that we don't trust...well, actually, it is that we don't trust you. You have a history of distorting facts.

Nice picture. Is it some kind of boyscout jamboree?

Seriously? You cannot google it? Your doing the PTP defense of needing 20 links now because the truth does not suit the agenda? When the truth hurts too much the link is fake? Is the photo I posted fake as well? Maybe photo shopped by me?

Distorting facts? It is because I DONT distort facts that your peers simply ignore them and belittle me instead. It is easier for them to do that.

Do I ask you for a link for the winner of the 2011 elections? Of course not…I don't have a selective memory.

So you have only indicated with your post that you actually DO have selective memory because you asked for links...

So I assume you will dodge the issue by stating "You should not say your, but say you're" in reference to my first sentence.

That is the typical reply I get when I state truths.

No DPV heay? Photo fake heay?

Goodness me...

"Seriously? You cannot google it? Your doing the PTP defense of needing 20 links now because the truth does not suit the agenda?"

Seriously? You can not provide sources to support your own posts? Not 20, one or two from credible sources would be nice. It's no wonder that people have stopped taking your posts seriously; it has nothing to do with verifiable facts, it has to do with your reluctance to post verifiable facts.

Ok show me a link of the PTP winning the 2011 election. Until you do I can see why people have stopped taking your posts seriously..(Of course I cannot back up this claim up just as you can't either)

Here is a link. www.google.com.au

So to reiterate you think the DPV did not exist? They never existed? Was there a "Beat the War Drum" meeting in Nahkon? Did UDD supporters cheer the deaths at hands of terrorists or is this history wiped from your memory like Prayuths wiping of thaksin history is because it does not suit an agenda. I assume you dislike thakisn being wiped from the history books? Your ignorance and stubborn approach to refuse to accept history until I provide links is the same.

Seems the burden of proof is on you because history shows there was a DPV and there were "Beat the War Drum" meetings mate. And just like I don't need a link to the 2011 election results because history did show the PTP won that election (and I know how to use google to look it up as it is quicker than getting into an argumentative back and forth to ask for links). If I think the PTP did not win the election I should provide the links right if you don't believe me.

Why even argue this case mate…History has shown I am right.

Show me a link that proves me wrong. Burden of proof is on you. history is on my side.

Amazing (falangs in) Thailand.

EDIT - Google "rambo isan training in Nakhon Ratchasima" in images.

I am still waiting on 2 links to prove the PTP won the 2011 elections though and until you do I will refuse to believe they did because it does not suit my agenda!!!

Now I see why you did not want to provide a link, reality is not as interesting as your excited post:

<<<< Content from Bangkok Post and linking to Bangkok Post removed >>>>

So we have protesters who learned unarmed self-defense who said they would go to Bangkok to protest, but didn't. That's what you described as "the red army in training".

Now here's your 2011 election result sources:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/07/03/us-thailand-election-idUSTRE76013T20110703

http://www.voanews.com/content/asian-observer-group-commends-thai-election-cites-minor-flaws--125003034/141777.html

If you're one of those who think the election results were not legitimate, here's some fun reading for you:

http://anfrel.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/ThaiEOMReport_Edit_4-final_edit.pdf

You see, it's not that difficult to back up your statements with credible sources. You should try it more often.

Edited February 21, 2015 by metisdead

[halloween]

Do you think the majority of people in Thailand wanted a mob illegally occupying downtown Bangkok and and obstructing government?

Do you have any evidence that the majority in Thailand wanted government handed over to an unnamed, unelected committee for unspecified reforms?

Which year are you referring to in your 1st question?

[Mot Dang]

Prime Minister General Prayut Chan-o-cha is being urged to wield his absolute power under the interim charter to bring national reconciliation efforts to fruition.

Since when does the PM have absolute power ? I thought this was abandoned in 1938. This is one of the most dangerous statements I have heard yet. Has Abhisit been correctly quoted here ? Because the PM will never have absolute power under the current constitution. That phrase should only be used to describe the likes of the fat North Korean kid with the bad hair cut, or possibly a ISIS nut job.

Where have you been for the last 8 months?

The appointed PM is also the self-appointed head of the NCPO. Section 44 gives the NCPO leader absolute power.

Section 44 empowers the NCPO leader to issue any order "for the sake of the reforms in any field, the promotion of love and harmony amongst the people in the nation, or the prevention, abatement or suppression of any act detrimental to national order or security, royal throne, national economy or public administration, whether the act occurs inside or outside the kingdom". The orders so issued are all deemed "lawful, constitutional and final".^[14]

^{http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_interim_constitution_of_Thailand}

Thanks for that, very informative. I knew they gave him some wide-ranging authority, but absolute power. Damn. It's not that I have been under a rock lately, I am just totally bored with it all and sometimes switch off.

[chooka]

The elite upper classes can't win an election and this really pissed them off.

[boomerangutang]

If I was an advisor to Abhisit's, here's what I'd suggest:

Do's: Stand above the fray. Take more of a campaigning strategy (granted, there's not an election campaign going on now), ...and speak firmly about the direction you'd like the country to go.

Don'ts: Don't splash around in the muddy waters of trying to get the self-appointed military brass to do the right things. They'll do what they want, regardless, with a 'father-knows-best' attitude (or, dare I say: 'Do as I say, not as I do').

I like Abhisit, but think he needs to be a bit less wishy-washy, and more 'bang-fist-on-table' dynamic. Thailand needs a dynamic leader to take it out of the doldrums. The first Shinawatre was, and our current PM is (somewhat) dynamic, but too much China-acquiescers for the good of the Thai peoples' future.

[greenchair]

There is only one root cause.

When a party is voted in,and the election has been deemed legal and binding by the election commission and foreign observers.

All opposing parties must accept their loss and support the winning party for 4 years.

If at the time of election, such election is deemed false, said parties should intervene,prosecute wrongdoers and hold fresh elections immediately.

It really used to be that simple. 51% wins.

Now it is a complicated mess.

One does wonder if the new constitution will stand the test of time or create more conflict.

I suspect the latter.

5 years from now they might be fighting to write a new one.

[chainarong]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

"Abhisit said amnesty should only be promulgated at the right time and after agreeing on the root causes of conflicts."

Root causes? Here's a few

1: corruption.
2. The perception that might is right.
3. Incompetent police and judicial systems.
4. Giving amnesties to criminals.

1. agreed

2. agreed

3. agreed

4. agreed but should be even handed and I don't include present witchhunt in this

5. ruling class treat the country like their own fiefdom

6. cool down nationalism and remove LM and encourage freedom of speech - the country is for ALL Thais not just the 1% elite

I full y support Number 6, like winning lotto that one

[Thai at Heart]

Did Mark just say something? Is he relevant anymore to anything?

[metisdead]

Some inflammatory posts have been removed.

[Robby nz]

P!ss weak leaders of political parties repeatedly opting to boycott elections to explicitly deny the Thai people the right to select their own government. Abhisit's gutlessness sits near the top of the list of reasons why Thailand finds itself in such a sad and sorry state right now. Luckily for Thailand, Abhisiv's treason will not be forgotten and his time will come, till then, he can spout off all he wants - he is redundant and will be forever more.

When you compare Abhisit to the leader (owner) of PTP then he is far from gutless for he has never run away from anything.

He has stood up to all the lies and innuendo without caving in to the pressure applied by Tarit and Chalerm who went to extraordinary lengths to get him to fold, and is still there commenting and criticizing while Thaksin sits overseas in his luxury of billions using others to do his dirty work.

Sure he and the Dems boycotted elections which they knew would be a sham for they wanted no part in them., That would have taken more courage than going along with them.

Have you seen one constructive comment from any of the red leaders let alone an Ex PT politician ? I cant remember one everything they have said is what they want and what must be done before they will participate, but of course they have to take orders from a convicted criminal on the run and aren't allowed to think for themselves.

Your post is an excellent example of the lies that Abhisit carries as baggage, lies which have been specifically concocted to inspire hate, something which Thaksin and his proxy parties desperately needs to divert from their own shortcomings.

[waitforusalso]

P!ss weak leaders of political parties repeatedly opting to boycott elections to explicitly deny the Thai people the right to select their own government. Abhisit's gutlessness sits near the top of the list of reasons why Thailand finds itself in such a sad and sorry state right now. Luckily for Thailand, Abhisiv's treason will not be forgotten and his time will come, till then, he can spout off all he wants - he is redundant and will be forever more.

When you compare Abhisit to the leader (owner) of PTP then he is far from gutless for he has never run away from anything.

He has stood up to all the lies and innuendo without caving in to the pressure applied by Tarit and Chalerm who went to extraordinary lengths to get him to fold, and is still there commenting and criticizing while Thaksin sits overseas in his luxury of billions using others to do his dirty work.

Sure he and the Dems boycotted elections which they knew would be a sham for they wanted no part in them., That would have taken more courage than going along with them.

Have you seen one constructive comment from any of the red leaders let alone an Ex PT politician ? I cant remember one everything they have said is what they want and what must be done before they will participate, but of course they have to take orders from a convicted criminal on the run and aren't allowed to think for themselves.

Your post is an excellent example of the lies that Abhisit carries as baggage, lies which have been specifically concocted to inspire hate, something which Thaksin and his proxy parties desperately needs to divert from their own shortcomings.

And how courageous would he be if the courts & army were out to get him at any cost? Your comparisons are childish & ignorant.

Unlike Thaksin he has done nothing to endear himself to the Thai electorate, which has been proven by his ongoing embarrassment at the polls.

[rubl]

P!ss weak leaders of political parties repeatedly opting to boycott elections to explicitly deny the Thai people the right to select their own government. Abhisit's gutlessness sits near the top of the list of reasons why Thailand finds itself in such a sad and sorry state right now. Luckily for Thailand, Abhisiv's treason will not be forgotten and his time will come, till then, he can spout off all he wants - he is redundant and will be forever more.

When you compare Abhisit to the leader (owner) of PTP then he is far from gutless for he has never run away from anything.

He has stood up to all the lies and innuendo without caving in to the pressure applied by Tarit and Chalerm who went to extraordinary lengths to get him to fold, and is still there commenting and criticizing while Thaksin sits overseas in his luxury of billions using others to do his dirty work.

Sure he and the Dems boycotted elections which they knew would be a sham for they wanted no part in them., That would have taken more courage than going along with them.

Have you seen one constructive comment from any of the red leaders let alone an Ex PT politician ? I cant remember one everything they have said is what they want and what must be done before they will participate, but of course they have to take orders from a convicted criminal on the run and aren't allowed to think for themselves.

Your post is an excellent example of the lies that Abhisit carries as baggage, lies which have been specifically concocted to inspire hate, something which Thaksin and his proxy parties desperately needs to divert from their own shortcomings.

And how courageous would he be if the courts & army were out to get him at any cost? Your comparisons are childish & ignorant.

Unlike Thaksin he has done nothing to endear himself to the Thai electorate, which has been proven by his ongoing embarrassment at the polls.

Absolutely, a master of deception. Even let the tax payers foot the bill while being praised for the hand-outs. It took the Italians ten years to get rid of Silvio Berlusconi, but that chap was only half as good I guess, or the Italian population is a wee bit more into 'democracy' and limitations on what power 'election' bestows on someone.

Now if only he dared to come back to face the cases awaiting him. I'm sure the Criminal Court will consider placing him in the prison specially build for political prisoners. It's near empty, but his sister had it build. He might like that. Being a bail jumper I'm afraid a new bail would seem unlikely. Sorry about that, but the Bejiing Olympic Games finished 6-1/2 years ago.

AS for 'get at any cost', it would seem some prefer Thaksin to stay away, no real effort made, almost embarrasing for Thaksin.

So, what did Abhisit mean with underlaying causes? Elite and politicians of any flavour maybe?

[djjamie]

Seriously? You cannot google it? Your doing the PTP defense of needing 20 links now because the truth does not suit the agenda? When the truth hurts too much the link is fake? Is the photo I posted fake as well? Maybe photo shopped by me?

Distorting facts? It is because I DONT distort facts that your peers simply ignore them and belittle me instead. It is easier for them to do that.

Do I ask you for a link for the winner of the 2011 elections? Of course not…I don't have a selective memory.

So you have only indicated with your post that you actually DO have selective memory because you asked for links...

So I assume you will dodge the issue by stating "You should not say your, but say you're" in reference to my first sentence.

That is the typical reply I get when I state truths.

No DPV heay? Photo fake heay?

Goodness me...

"Seriously? You cannot google it? Your doing the PTP defense of needing 20 links now because the truth does not suit the agenda?"

Seriously? You can not provide sources to support your own posts? Not 20, one or two from credible sources would be nice. It's no wonder that people have stopped taking your posts seriously; it has nothing to do with verifiable facts, it has to do with your reluctance to post verifiable facts.

Ok show me a link of the PTP winning the 2011 election. Until you do I can see why people have stopped taking your posts seriously..(Of course I cannot back up this claim up just as you can't either)

Here is a link. www.google.com.au

So to reiterate you think the DPV did not exist? They never existed? Was there a "Beat the War Drum" meeting in Nahkon? Did UDD supporters cheer the deaths at hands of terrorists or is this history wiped from your memory like Prayuths wiping of thaksin history is because it does not suit an agenda. I assume you dislike thakisn being wiped from the history books? Your ignorance and stubborn approach to refuse to accept history until I provide links is the same.

Seems the burden of proof is on you because history shows there was a DPV and there were "Beat the War Drum" meetings mate. And just like I don't need a link to the 2011 election results because history did show the PTP won that election (and I know how to use google to look it up as it is quicker than getting into an argumentative back and forth to ask for links). If I think the PTP did not win the election I should provide the links right if you don't believe me.

Why even argue this case mate…History has shown I am right.

Show me a link that proves me wrong. Burden of proof is on you. history is on my side.

Amazing (falangs in) Thailand.

EDIT - Google "rambo isan training in Nakhon Ratchasima" in images.

I am still waiting on 2 links to prove the PTP won the 2011 elections though and until you do I will refuse to believe they did because it does not suit my agenda!!!

Now I see why you did not want to provide a link, reality is not as interesting as your excited post:

<<<< Content from Bangkok Post and linking to Bangkok Post removed >>>>

So we have protesters who learned unarmed self-defense who said they would go to Bangkok to protest, but didn't. That's what you described as "the red army in training".

Now here's your 2011 election result sources:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/07/03/us-thailand-election-idUSTRE76013T20110703

http://www.voanews.com/content/asian-observer-group-commends-thai-election-cites-minor-flaws--125003034/141777.html

If you're one of those who think the election results were not legitimate, here's some fun reading for you:

http://anfrel.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/ThaiEOMReport_Edit_4-final_edit.pdf

You see, it's not that difficult to back up your statements with credible sources. You should try it more often.

The original guy said there was no army being formed.

The photo I supplied showed there was. They were not a boys jamboree as you described. They were guys that "Rambo Isan" said were mustered as recruits to be sent for military-style training in order to protect their own protesters.

Weather they were sent or not, trained in weapons or not is beside the point. They were a threat that innocent people, voters and tax payers felt as a threat. Would you feel comfortable having your government supporting a "Rambo" building a rebel, unofficial army up north?

The original poster said there was no army. There was, but you said they were boy jamoboree scouts because you refused to face the truth.. And when you had no rebuttal to that you changed the goal posts. You do know they were red shirt armies being trained, but you changed the goal posts now.

The UDD state they were not trained in weapons yet you seem to believe that in the same breath as when they state UDD principle #6 stating they will use non violent means to achieve their objectives and you believe it!!!

And then you harp on about election results again from 4 years ago..

I have shown ad nauseam for 2 years that election results from 4 years ago do not gauge a parties popularity now.

Do you honestly live 4 years ago or in here and now…This is 2015 mate…Not 2011.

[heybruce]

"Seriously? You cannot google it? Your doing the PTP defense of needing 20 links now because the truth does not suit the agenda?"

Seriously? You can not provide sources to support your own posts? Not 20, one or two from credible sources would be nice. It's no wonder that people have stopped taking your posts seriously; it has nothing to do with verifiable facts, it has to do with your reluctance to post verifiable facts.

Ok show me a link of the PTP winning the 2011 election. Until you do I can see why people have stopped taking your posts seriously..(Of course I cannot back up this claim up just as you can't either)

Here is a link. www.google.com.au

So to reiterate you think the DPV did not exist? They never existed? Was there a "Beat the War Drum" meeting in Nahkon? Did UDD supporters cheer the deaths at hands of terrorists or is this history wiped from your memory like Prayuths wiping of thaksin history is because it does not suit an agenda. I assume you dislike thakisn being wiped from the history books? Your ignorance and stubborn approach to refuse to accept history until I provide links is the same.

Seems the burden of proof is on you because history shows there was a DPV and there were "Beat the War Drum" meetings mate. And just like I don't need a link to the 2011 election results because history did show the PTP won that election (and I know how to use google to look it up as it is quicker than getting into an argumentative back and forth to ask for links). If I think the PTP did not win the election I should provide the links right if you don't believe me.

Why even argue this case mate…History has shown I am right.

Show me a link that proves me wrong. Burden of proof is on you. history is on my side.

Amazing (falangs in) Thailand.

EDIT - Google "rambo isan training in Nakhon Ratchasima" in images.

I am still waiting on 2 links to prove the PTP won the 2011 elections though and until you do I will refuse to believe they did because it does not suit my agenda!!!

Now I see why you did not want to provide a link, reality is not as interesting as your excited post:

<<<< Content from Bangkok Post and linking to Bangkok Post removed >>>>

So we have protesters who learned unarmed self-defense who said they would go to Bangkok to protest, but didn't. That's what you described as "the red army in training".

Now here's your 2011 election result sources:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/07/03/us-thailand-election-idUSTRE76013T20110703

http://www.voanews.com/content/asian-observer-group-commends-thai-election-cites-minor-flaws--125003034/141777.html

If you're one of those who think the election results were not legitimate, here's some fun reading for you:

http://anfrel.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/ThaiEOMReport_Edit_4-final_edit.pdf

You see, it's not that difficult to back up your statements with credible sources. You should try it more often.

The original guy said there was no army being formed.

The photo I supplied showed there was. They were not a boys jamboree as you described. They were guys that "Rambo Isan" said were mustered as recruits to be sent for military-style training in order to protect their own protesters.

Weather they were sent or not, trained in weapons or not is beside the point. They were a threat that innocent people, voters and tax payers felt as a threat. Would you feel comfortable having your government supporting a "Rambo" building a rebel, unofficial army up north?

The original poster said there was no army. There was, but you said they were boy jamoboree scouts because you refused to face the truth.. And when you had no rebuttal to that you changed the goal posts. You do know they were red shirt armies being trained, but you changed the goal posts now.

The UDD state they were not trained in weapons yet you seem to believe that in the same breath as when they state UDD principle #6 stating they will use non violent means to achieve their objectives and you believe it!!!

And then you harp on about election results again from 4 years ago..

I have shown ad nauseam for 2 years that election results from 4 years ago do not gauge a parties popularity now.

Do you honestly live 4 years ago or in here and now…This is 2015 mate…Not 2011.

"Weather they were sent or not, trained in weapons or not is beside the point."

First, it's "whether", not "weather". Second, you're the one who pretends to be concerned with facts, at least until facts don't support your claims. Your "red army" was an unarmed army.

The point is that you described them as "the red army in training". When you finally provided enough information to check your sources I found an old man who calls himself "Rambo Isaan" who organized volunteers to go to Bangkok to counter-protest for the elected government and gave these volunteers training in unarmed self-defense. Your "red army in training" was a group of unarmed red protesters who never protested. Regarding the name "Rambo Isaan", I know a Thai guy who calls himself "Bank", but he's not rich. Nicknames mean very little.

"...you said they were boy jamoboree scouts because you refused to face the truth."

I didn't state anything. I asked:

"Is it some kind of boyscout jamboree?"

That's what it looks like. Unarmed "armies" do look somewhat like boyscout jamborees.

"They were a threat that innocent people, voters and tax payers felt as a threat."

Not all people felt threatened by them. People trying to vote in the February 2014 election were worried about a different threat.

"The UDD state they were not trained in weapons yet you seem to believe that in the same breath as when they state UDD principle #6 stating they will use non violent means to achieve their objectives and you believe it!!!"

I take with some skepticism everything people with a political agenda say, including your posts, Suthep's claims to speak for the majority, and Prayuth's promise to bring about "real democracy".

"And then you harp on about election results again from 4 years ago."

Did you forget that you insisted that I provide two references confirming the 2011 election results? I provided the two links, and a third to give you some confidence the results were legitimate.

"I have shown ad nauseam for 2 years that election results from 4 years ago do not gauge a parties popularity now."

And the proper means to determine a parties current popularity is through an election.

"Do you honestly live 4 years ago or in here and now…This is 2015 mate…Not 2011."

Well I've been consistently objecting to a military junta, martial law, and stating the need for a return to elections and democracy. I can see your confusion, while the situation I object to is the present in Thailand, it also describes many times in Thailand's past.

[tbthailand]

Ok show me a link of the PTP winning the 2011 election. Until you do I can see why people have stopped taking your posts seriously..(Of course I cannot back up this claim up just as you can't either)

Here is a link. www.google.com.au

So to reiterate you think the DPV did not exist? They never existed? Was there a "Beat the War Drum" meeting in Nahkon? Did UDD supporters cheer the deaths at hands of terrorists or is this history wiped from your memory like Prayuths wiping of thaksin history is because it does not suit an agenda. I assume you dislike thakisn being wiped from the history books? Your ignorance and stubborn approach to refuse to accept history until I provide links is the same.

Seems the burden of proof is on you because history shows there was a DPV and there were "Beat the War Drum" meetings mate. And just like I don't need a link to the 2011 election results because history did show the PTP won that election (and I know how to use google to look it up as it is quicker than getting into an argumentative back and forth to ask for links). If I think the PTP did not win the election I should provide the links right if you don't believe me.

Why even argue this case mate…History has shown I am right.

Show me a link that proves me wrong. Burden of proof is on you. history is on my side.

Amazing (falangs in) Thailand.

EDIT - Google "rambo isan training in Nakhon Ratchasima" in images.

I am still waiting on 2 links to prove the PTP won the 2011 elections though and until you do I will refuse to believe they did because it does not suit my agenda!!!

Now I see why you did not want to provide a link, reality is not as interesting as your excited post:

<<<< Content from Bangkok Post and linking to Bangkok Post removed >>>>

So we have protesters who learned unarmed self-defense who said they would go to Bangkok to protest, but didn't. That's what you described as "the red army in training".

Now here's your 2011 election result sources:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/07/03/us-thailand-election-idUSTRE76013T20110703

http://www.voanews.com/content/asian-observer-group-commends-thai-election-cites-minor-flaws--125003034/141777.html

If you're one of those who think the election results were not legitimate, here's some fun reading for you:

http://anfrel.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/ThaiEOMReport_Edit_4-final_edit.pdf

You see, it's not that difficult to back up your statements with credible sources. You should try it more often.

The original guy said there was no army being formed.

The photo I supplied showed there was. They were not a boys jamboree as you described. They were guys that "Rambo Isan" said were mustered as recruits to be sent for military-style training in order to protect their own protesters.

Weather they were sent or not, trained in weapons or not is beside the point. They were a threat that innocent people, voters and tax payers felt as a threat. Would you feel comfortable having your government supporting a "Rambo" building a rebel, unofficial army up north?

The original poster said there was no army. There was, but you said they were boy jamoboree scouts because you refused to face the truth.. And when you had no rebuttal to that you changed the goal posts. You do know they were red shirt armies being trained, but you changed the goal posts now.

The UDD state they were not trained in weapons yet you seem to believe that in the same breath as when they state UDD principle #6 stating they will use non violent means to achieve their objectives and you believe it!!!

And then you harp on about election results again from 4 years ago..

I have shown ad nauseam for 2 years that election results from 4 years ago do not gauge a parties popularity now.

Do you honestly live 4 years ago or in here and now…This is 2015 mate…Not 2011.

"Weather they were sent or not, trained in weapons or not is beside the point."

First, it's "whether", not "weather". Second, you're the one who pretends to be concerned with facts, at least until facts don't support your claims. Your "red army" was an unarmed army.

The point is that you described them as "the red army in training". When you finally provided enough information to check your sources I found an old man who calls himself "Rambo Isaan" who organized volunteers to go to Bangkok to counter-protest for the elected government and gave these volunteers training in unarmed self-defense. Your "red army in training" was a group of unarmed red protesters who never protested. Regarding the name "Rambo Isaan", I know a Thai guy who calls himself "Bank", but he's not rich. Nicknames mean very little.

"...you said they were boy jamoboree scouts because you refused to face the truth."

I didn't state anything. I asked:

"Is it some kind of boyscout jamboree?"

That's what it looks like. Unarmed "armies" do look somewhat like boyscout jamborees.

"They were a threat that innocent people, voters and tax payers felt as a threat."

Not all people felt threatened by them. People trying to vote in the February 2014 election were worried about a different threat.

"The UDD state they were not trained in weapons yet you seem to believe that in the same breath as when they state UDD principle #6 stating they will use non violent means to achieve their objectives and you believe it!!!"

I take with some skepticism everything people with a political agenda say, including your posts, Suthep's claims to speak for the majority, and Prayuth's promise to bring about "real democracy".

"And then you harp on about election results again from 4 years ago."

Did you forget that you insisted that I provide two references confirming the 2011 election results? I provided the two links, and a third to give you some confidence the results were legitimate.

"I have shown ad nauseam for 2 years that election results from 4 years ago do not gauge a parties popularity now."

And the proper means to determine a parties current popularity is through an election.

"Do you honestly live 4 years ago or in here and now…This is 2015 mate…Not 2011."

Well I've been consistently objecting to a military junta, martial law, and stating the need for a return to elections and democracy. I can see your confusion, while the situation I object to is the present in Thailand, it also describes many times in Thailand's past.

the "militia" seemed like a really dangerous thing...

At the camp, around 500 mainly middle-aged men and women gamely rehearsed Muay Thai boxing moves and parade drills despite the sapping heat.

[rubl]

the "militia" seemed like a really dangerous thing...

At the camp, around 500 mainly middle-aged men and women gamely rehearsed Muay Thai boxing moves and parade drills despite the sapping heat.

and begin of April 2014 the BP mentioned that more than 100 grenades had been lobbed on the anti-government protesters.

By peaceful democracy lovers of course.

[tbthailand]

the "militia" seemed like a really dangerous thing...

At the camp, around 500 mainly middle-aged men and women gamely rehearsed Muay Thai boxing moves and parade drills despite the sapping heat.

and begin of April 2014 the BP mentioned that more than 100 grenades had been lobbed on the anti-government protesters.

By peaceful democracy lovers of course.

you connect the dots even when there aren't any....

because you are a....

(say it with me rubl...)