Crackdown On Anti-Thaksin Movement

[Ricardo]

"Some senior people are out of sync with the world even before getting old and becoming senile with advancing age," he said.

Wouah ! Guns are getting loaded...

Do you think Dr.T. believes in involuntary euthenasia ? !

"Anand assumed the prime ministership twice under dictatorial rule, not democratic rule," he said. "Thaksin is an elected PM, so Anand should respect the incumbent premier," he said.

Or he was, if you count votes purchased from the peasantry, until he resigned.

Here it is : that's the perfect rethorical trap.

Thaksin has the legimaticy, given by voters. He is a democrat.

All the "charismatic persons" are not.

Push a little bit further, and you start to foresee the "republic" idea...

Even if he has no respect, for an elder statesman like General Prem, or other former holders of his own acting caretaker job, he really ought to remember who the General takes his lead from.

He might also recall that the General helped reunite the country, at an even worse time of division, and that his opinion in this troubled time might therefore be worth listening to.

[Arsenal]

"Some senior people are out of sync with the world even before getting old and becoming senile with advancing age," he said.

Wouah ! Guns are getting loaded...

Do you think Dr.T. believes in involuntary euthenasia ? !

"Anand assumed the prime ministership twice under dictatorial rule, not democratic rule," he said. "Thaksin is an elected PM, so Anand should respect the incumbent premier," he said.

Or he was, if you count votes purchased from the peasantry, until he resigned.

Here it is : that's the perfect rethorical trap.

Thaksin has the legimaticy, given by voters. He is a democrat.

All the "charismatic persons" are not.

Push a little bit further, and you start to foresee the "republic" idea...

Even if he has no respect, for an elder statesman like General Prem, or other former holders of his own acting caretaker job, he really ought to remember who the General takes his lead from.

He might also recall that the General helped reunite the country, at an even worse time of division, and that his opinion in this troubled time might therefore be worth listening to.

In my opinion a very naive view of Prem who ,although I believe a decent and distinguished statesman, is nevertheless another politician with all the weaknesses and strengths that implies.He is not some kind of omniscient oracle.

[Plus]

He has grown out of his "politician" shell. Mistakes have been made but it's all over now.

I personally don't agree with his response to NRC's proposal regarding South but it doesn't make Thaksin right or blemishes Prem.

I thought Thaksin has learned a lesson after his "charismatic" remarks, apparently not. He just wants to see the full wrath. Heading this way will end him before military tribunal and treason charges. Forget happy retirement like Suchinda.

[John K]

The point here is Thaksin will attack anyone who does not agree with him. He is not even humbled by someone who is 30 years older. Showing respect to someone who is senior is the norm in Thai culture. His completer disregard and disrespect for everyone will cost him. How much and how fast is anyone’s guess but I would suspect sooner than later being this out of control and egotistic. Pushing this close to royalty does suggest some basis for the Finland plan. Attacking Prem is like knocking on the gates of the forbidden city. It also suggest a high level of panic in Thaksin.

Thaksin is playing the guilt by association game with his bomb game.That game goes both ways. I wonder how many TRT will jump ship because Thaksin is attacking Prem.

This AP story from last year has remarkable story for the remaining TRT to think about.

First one sheep jumped to its death. Then stunned Turkish shepherds, who had left the herd to graze while they had breakfast, watched as nearly 1,500 others followed, each leaping off the same cliff, Turkish media reported.

In the end, 450 dead animals lay on top of one another in a billowy white pile, the Aksam newspaper said. Those who jumped later were saved as the pile got higher and the fall more cushioned, Aksam reported.

"There's nothing we can do. They're all wasted," Nevzat Bayhan, a member of one of 26 families whose sheep were grazing together in the herd, was quoted as saying by Aksam.

The estimated loss to families in the town of Gevas, located in Van province in eastern Turkey, tops $100,000, a significant amount of money in a country where average GDP per head is around $2,700.

"Every family had an average of 20 sheep," Aksam quoted another villager, Abdullah Hazar as saying. "But now only a few families have sheep left. It's going to be hard for us."

Edited September 2, 2006 by John K

[cclub75]

Even if he has no respect, for an elder statesman like General Prem, or other former holders of his own acting caretaker job, he really ought to remember who the General takes his lead from.

Indeed. He's not stupid enough to not remember that.

And, it's not the first time he launches such an attack (remember the "charismatic person").

So it means that he's perfectly aware, consciencious, and that he's following a plan.

This plan is not a fantasmagoria : just the cynical view that the political situation in Thailand will evolve, when some "charismatic person" will diseapear because of their very grand age.

Lot of people think about it. It will come one day. And sooner than expected. Thaksin is playing on it, and with it. He has the time with him...

This is why I believe that the "Thaksin issue" will have a much broader impact on the future of Thailand, than just to know who is going to win the next elections.

[bulmercke]

Thaksin is cornered and wounded. Expect him to do something extreme anytime soon. I cannot remember a "leader" so derided in Bangkok, and so dependant on up-country simpletons for support. I can't see him stepping down. - Its not in his nature. After he has gone though; you have got to hope Thailand gets serious about the supposed checks and balances that prevent rich; egomaniac lunatics like him from amassing such power. Shame on the people in his government that support his lies and tantrums. How much money do they need?

Spot-on.

Dark days lie ahead for Thailand and it's people as long as Thaksin hangs onto power and his ill-gotten wealth.

General Prem spoke the TRUTH - good on him!

[John K]

The key question I have is does Thaksin’s voter base see an attack on Prem as an attack on Royalty? If the answer is yes then Thaksin is done, if no they he has further divided the country.

[Netfan]

I'm old enough to remember when Richard Nixon was president of the United States. Now here was a democratically twice-elected (the 2nd time overwhelmingly) president who mis-used his power and the state police, had paranoid tendencies and surrounded himself with petty crooks. Should the American press and people have just said "oh, he's elected, so we better leave him alone to do whatever he wants"?

Nixon's fall started out with charges no one would believe. Popular sentiment and the justice system in the US was able to force him to resign. It's very very good news that the justice system here is going less and less Dr. Pol Col T's way, and the elder statesmen are trying to send him a not so subtle message. (I have the feeling that a wise someone is watching, letting him tighten his own noose). But if he had any decency, for the good of this wonderful country, he would walk away with his billions and let democracy move forward.

Edited September 2, 2006 by Netfan

[John K]

Academic coalition calls on Thaksin to quit

More than 40 academic groups yesterday called for the prime minister's resignation and warned existing discord could lead to civil war.

"Thaksin Shinawatra must halt all political activities immediately and allow an investigation into alleged abuses of power," Anan Laolertworakul, a leader of a network of 43 academic groups, said.

Anan urged civil servants to ignore "unjustified instructions" from the Thaksin administration.

The academics will organise peaceful rallies at their universities to highlight Thaksin's flawed leadership, he said.

Prawit Listapornwongsa, a representative of rural doctors, said Thaksin should listen to medical opinion suggesting his mental health was questionable, rather than trying to punish the state psychiatrist who offered it.

Judging from his sagging popularity, the prime minister should relinquish office before he has only his closest family as supporters, Rangsit Univer-sity lecturer Thaweekiart Prasertcharoen-suk said.

Thaweekiart said academics and university officials would wear black on Wednesdays in a gesture of opposition.

Anti-Thaksin campaigner Sangsit Piriyarangsan urged government opponents around the country to put on yellow shirts on September 9 to coincide with an opposition rally in Bangkok.

"Yellow is the colour of the anti-Thaksin campaign," he said.

Government opponents plan to gather at the offices of GMM Grammy on Wednesday to demand a boycott of its products because the company's largest shareholder is a Thaksin ally, Sangsit said.

Meanwhile, Privy Council president General Prem Tinsulanonda said yesterday government officials should heed Royal advice encouraging unity and empathy for the plight of the people.

"If you are to eradicate poverty, you have to empathise with the poor. Likewise, you have to understand terrorists in order to fight terrorism," said Prem.

Yesterday, senior military, police and officials from 19 northeastern provinces visited Prem at his Nakhon Ratchasima home where they offered birthday wishes.

Prem has made a series of recent remarks seen as critical of the government and its leadership. He called for support for the monarchy to overcome the political crisis.

Piyanuch Thamnukasetchai,

Budsarakham Sinlapalavan

The Nation

[John K]

Netfan,

This is not the same with Nixon and Thaksin. Nixon made a deal to get a presidential pardon from Ford. Thaksin has no such deal as far as I know, and if he did he may have simply blown that away by running his mouth and attacking Prem.

After Thaksin attacked Prem I doubt there would be many wanting to stand by Thaksin. Guilt by association apparently is alive and well in Thailand.

I am curious as to what the state psychiatrist said. If anyone has that can you please post it.

[sriracha john]

Netfan,

This is not the same with Nixon and Thaksin. Nixon made a deal to get a presidential pardon from Ford. Thaksin has no such deal as far as I know, and if he did he may have simply blown that away by running his mouth and attacking Prem.

After Thaksin attacked Prem I doubt there would be many wanting to stand by Thaksin. Guilt by association apparently is alive and well in Thailand.

I am curious as to what the state psychiatrist said. If anyone has that can you please post it.

Psychiatrist faces probe

A psychiatrist working for the government is being investigated for allegedly saying the prime minister has lost his mind.

The Mental Health Department has ordered an enquiry into comments allegedly made by Dr Kasem Tantiplacheewa, a psychiatrist at Somdej Chao Phraya Hospital.

He reportedly described caretaker premier Thaksin Shinawatra as mentally unstable during a recent debate organised by Chulalongkorn University. Dr Kasem was also quoted as saying the prime minister's mental state posed a problem for the country.

Department director-general ML Dr Somchai Chakrabhand warned that if the probe confirmed what was attributed to Kasem in news reports, the doctor would face further action.

Somchai denied Thaksin, Public Health Minister Pinij Charusombat or his deputy Anutin Charnveerakul were behind the order. ... yeah, right...

Chulalongkorn University lecturer Anan Lao-lertworakul, who invited Kasem to last week's debate, slammed the investigation. "It's abuse of power. It's unacceptable. This shows how unethical this leader is," Anan said, without using names.

- The Nation

28 August 2006

-------------------------------------------------

and shows that the Truth can be quite painful/unsettling

[John K]

Thanks for the post SJ.

The amazing part about this is you don’t need to be a doctor to make the same diagnosis with Thaksin as his actions are so overt. Most anyone with average intelligence and knowledge of Thaksin’s personality traits can conclude the same just by sense.

The interesting part about this is the doctor presented his professional opinion and not his personal one. If they go after the doctor it only solidifies the doctors professional opinion as being correct.

[Netfan]

Of course many of the details are not the same, but Nixon did go after his enemies with the same vengence - Daniel Ellsworth, for example- where he used the FBI to do everything he could to discredit him. Even brought charges against him as I recall. The main point is they were both elected officials who abused their power, were / are paranoid, individuals who thought the state was there to serve them, not the other way around.

I'm just hoping (futile, probably) that the outcome is the same- judicial rulings and popular opinion force a change......

[John K]

Of course many of the details are not the same, but Nixon did go after his enemies with the same vengence - Daniel Ellsworth, for example- where he used the FBI to do everything he could to discredit him. Even brought charges against him as I recall. The main point is they were both elected officials who abused their power, were / are paranoid, individuals who thought the state was there to serve them, not the other way around.

I'm just hoping (futile, probably) that the outcome is the same- judicial rulings and popular opinion force a change......

Yes you are right in that respect. Thaksin is and Nixon did start to use more and more of the government resources to cover their wrong doings and punish those who pursued them. Ultimately the outcomes will be the same in the end... crash and burn.

[Netfan]

Right... and the argument that just because someone is a popularly elected official doesn't mean that deomocratic means can't be used to remove one from office if it turns out they are abusing the the trust given them by the people.

Edited September 3, 2006 by Netfan

[Ricardo]

Even if he has no respect, for an elder statesman like General Prem, or other former holders of his own acting caretaker job, he really ought to remember who the General takes his lead from.

He might also recall that the General helped reunite the country, at an even worse time of division, and that his opinion in this troubled time might therefore be worth listening to.

In my opinion a very naive view of Prem who ,although I believe a decent and distinguished statesman, is nevertheless another politician with all the weaknesses and strengths that implies.He is not some kind of omniscient oracle.

Sorry but I think you are underestimating the reverence with which Prem's boss is held here, and I believe any attack on Prem is widely seen as an attack also on the source of his authority. Which is very dangerous indeed, and a sign of desperation, on behalf of Thaksin.

Prem at 84 can hardly be seen as an active politician - with any personal agenda.

[John K]

If Nixon acted like Thaksin is now I think he would have been already removed from office by force by big men wearing white and taken to a hospital.

I am curious as to how many people will be foolish enough to stay with Thaksin now as the consider their own future both in and out of politics.

[sriracha john]

Prem at 84 86 can hardly be seen as an active politician - with any personal agenda.

please excuse my correction...

[Khun Jean]

86 means it is a question of time, time Thaksin is trying to win.

[John K]

Good point here, Thaksin was still making regular deposits in his diapers when Prem was well on his way making a name for himself.... so who do you think the public respects more.

sorry about the visual.

[OldAsiaHand]

Dark days lie ahead for Thailand and it's people as long as Thaksin hangs onto power and his ill-gotten wealth.

General Prem spoke the TRUTH - good on him!

Where do you people get this garbage? The man sold stock he owned in a public company and complied exactly with the Thai tax code just as the people who are attacking him have complied with it when they have sold stock in a public company. How in the world does that make his wealth 'ill-gotten'?

As for General Prem strutting around in his soldier suit attacking the legitimacy of civil government...well, coup's come in all shapes and sizes, don't they?

[womble]

Dark days lie ahead for Thailand and it's people as long as Thaksin hangs onto power and his ill-gotten wealth.

General Prem spoke the TRUTH - good on him!

Where do you people get this garbage? The man sold stock he owned in a public company and complied exactly with the Thai tax code just as the people who are attacking him have complied with it when they have sold stock in a public company. How in the world does that make his wealth 'ill-gotten'?

As for General Prem strutting around in his soldier suit attacking the legitimacy of civil government...well, coup's come in all shapes and sizes, don't they?

His wealth is ill-gotten because of what he did to ensure outrageous rises in the value of the Shin share price.

Does the phrase policy corruption mean anything to you?

Do you think it's acceptable for Prime Ministers to form government policy specifically to raise the stock price of ones own company? There are numerous examples that are so obvious it beggars belief.

And you said it all, the guy isn't supposed to be selling stock, he's not supposed to be conducting business, he's supposed to be running a country for the good of the people, not himself and his shareholders.

There's a whole lot more here than just tax avoidance. The biggest issues relate to the methods he has employed to raise the stock price. They range from questionable to down right illegal. The non payment of tax may or may not be illegal, it's certainly highly unethical, and there are some obvious questionable practises such a 'forgetting to fill in parts of very important documents'.

You don't forget to fill in parts of documents on billion $ deals. Not unless your blind and seek no legal advise.

Really, to try to imply that the sale of Shin was completly above board insults the intelligence of everyone who frequents this bored!

Edited September 3, 2006 by womble

[John K]

Dark days lie ahead for Thailand and it's people as long as Thaksin hangs onto power and his ill-gotten wealth.

General Prem spoke the TRUTH - good on him!

Where do you people get this garbage? The man sold stock he owned in a public company and complied exactly with the Thai tax code just as the people who are attacking him have complied with it when they have sold stock in a public company. How in the world does that make his wealth 'ill-gotten'?

As for General Prem strutting around in his soldier suit attacking the legitimacy of civil government...well, coup's come in all shapes and sizes, don't they?

To answer your question, Thaksin changed the laws that got in is way. He changed this law just minutes before the transactions so what does that tell you. Go back into the news clippings and it is easy to show a pattern. To answer your question on ill gotten wealth, see how much money he would have not made had he not changed any laws that got in his way. I suspect you will find several zeros between the decimal and integers.

[^_^]

Dark days lie ahead for Thailand and it's people as long as Thaksin hangs onto power and his ill-gotten wealth.

General Prem spoke the TRUTH - good on him!

Where do you people get this garbage? The man sold stock he owned in a public company and complied exactly with the Thai tax code just as the people who are attacking him have complied with it when they have sold stock in a public company. How in the world does that make his wealth 'ill-gotten'?

As for General Prem strutting around in his soldier suit attacking the legitimacy of civil government...well, coup's come in all shapes and sizes, don't they?

And...you call yourself oldAsiahand?

What is it about politics in any Asia country that one could be CERTAINLY sure of whatever one is talking about and that even goes to one whom is in the game!?

And you call yourself what? OldAsiaHand? Maybe time for you to retire Mr. Old

Have a fruitful and fullfilling life...don't get involve in any politics in any country; but would be good to stay in the know of whatever's going on.

Cheers.

[bulmercke]

Dark days lie ahead for Thailand and it's people as long as Thaksin hangs onto power and his ill-gotten wealth.

General Prem spoke the TRUTH - good on him!

Where do you people get this garbage? The man sold stock he owned in a public company and complied exactly with the Thai tax code just as the people who are attacking him have complied with it when they have sold stock in a public company. How in the world does that make his wealth 'ill-gotten'?

As for General Prem strutting around in his soldier suit attacking the legitimacy of civil government...well, coup's come in all shapes and sizes, don't they?

The facts speak for themselves.

In the telecommunications sector regulations were deliberately changed to limit the foreign ownership of telecommunicaion companies here - who were in the main - Thaksin's competitors; this gave an important advantage to Thaksin's companies....and then again......a few years later...........when Thaksin decided to off-load this telecommunications stock.....those same industry regulations limiting the foreign ownership of telecommunication companies were changed again to the advantage of Thaksin's companies.....this time allowing Temasek - the purchasers of Shin to purchase a much greater stake in Shin than had previously been allowed under the existing regulations.

Thaksin - Thais - and the government - were basically making the rules as they went along - to their own exclusive advantage!

CORRUPTION............IN OTHER WORDS.........

[cclub75]

86 means it is a question of time, time Thaksin is trying to win.

Exactly.

I don't share the view that Thaksin is loosing his temper, being cornered, panicking.

Beyond the struggle between ideas or parties, basically it's a struggle between generations.

And therefore : the younger will eventually win.

But it's still possible to stop Thaksin. But they need to do it quickly. Another "democratic" victory for TRT at the next elections, and it will be almost impossible.

[bulmercke]

86 means it is a question of time, time Thaksin is trying to win.

Exactly.

I don't share the view that Thaksin is loosing his temper, being cornered, panicking.

Beyond the struggle between ideas or parties, basically it's a struggle between generations.

And therefore : the younger will eventually win.

But it's still possible to stop Thaksin. But they need to do it quickly. Another "democratic" victory for TRT at the next elections, and it will be almost impossible.

I agree.

Watch out for a very emphatic and assertive PAD rally in the next few weeks.....which will be seen as a 'direct' challenge to Thaksin before the up-coming elections.

Will Thaksin and the police take the bait - particularly in view of the fact that anti-Thaksin protests have been efectively outlawed in this 'great' country!

The criminal court refused to accept petitions from the police for the issuance of arrest warrants against 'secondary' PAD members last week AND Prem has spoken particularly boldly against Thaksin in the last week.....

The fake car bomb episode has back-fired for - all intent and purpose - a woefully inadequate black-ops exercise -

Thaksin's only hope......the north east..........

[sriracha john]

Moving toward a bloody showdown?

The ongoing political crisis which has plunged Thailand into its worst political polarisation in years has caused widespread concern among caring citizens that the volatile situation, if allowed to continue unchecked, could degenerate into violence similar to the bloody October 6 incident three decades ago. Former prime minister Anand Panyarachun was the latest conscientious public figure to come out last week to sound a warning. He said Thailand could become what the UN calls ''a failed state'' because of the great political divide which has fuelled so much hate in society. Worse, he said, the environment was conducive to prolonging this hatred. Mr Anand also said that throughout his life he had never been neutral when it came to choosing between right and wrong, good and bad, democratic and undemocratic. Although Mr Anand did not name names when he made the comment, it was widely understood the individual he referred to was the Thai Rak Thai paramount leader Thaksin Shinawatra. However, it was Mr Anand's pointed remark about choosing sides that seemed to irk Mr Thaksin and his faithful foot soldiers. They quickly hit back at the former prime minister without any regard to the positive side of his comments. How ironic that Mr Thaksin, who regularly blames certain media of not being objective in their reporting, himself brushes off all dissenting views, no matter how well intended or how constructive. In what was seen as a snipe against Mr Anand and Pa Prem, chairman of the Privy Council, the Thai Rak Thai dear leader said the reason Thailand was still backward and beset with seemingly endless conflicts was because there were senile people who were out of sync with the changing circumstances and who misled others about the positive changes he tried to introduce.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/04Sep2006_news15.php

[hammered]

86 means it is a question of time, time Thaksin is trying to win.

Exactly.

I don't share the view that Thaksin is loosing his temper, being cornered, panicking.

Beyond the struggle between ideas or parties, basically it's a struggle between generations.

And therefore : the younger will eventually win.

But it's still possible to stop Thaksin. But they need to do it quickly. Another "democratic" victory for TRT at the next elections, and it will be almost impossible.

In the long run the biggest threat to Thaksin is the generation younger than him. In this generation lies a lot of the anti-Thaksin support. That a large element of this also includes the kids of the northern and north eastern farmers also shows an interesting development of an urban working class who may not share the same views as the more "peasant" class that their parents hail from. It will be interesting to see how this urban working class develops politically. It will certainly at some point become a dominant politcal force as less and less stay on the farms and seek higher remuneration and in their eyes a better lifestyle elsewhere fueled by rapid Asian development. Maybe in the future Mr. Thaksin will be bypassed by a new generation of politicians. Change is a strange thing.

[sriracha john]

Prime Minister Thaksin keeping low profile again today

Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra and his family are keeping a low profile inside the Charansanitwong residence, amidst tight security.

Since morning the premier's family has remained within the residence in Soi Charansanitwong 69 in Bangphlad. Policemen are deployed at several points along the soi and around the residence.

This tightened security measure came in result of the August 24 interception of a car carrying explosives that was parked at the base of Krungthon bridge, believed to be an attempt on the life of Mr. Thaksin, whose convoy was scheduled to pass through the bridge.

No disclosure has been made regarding Prime Minister Thaksin's schedules for the day, but reporters are still waiting outside his house as usual.

- ThaiNews