Thai editorial: Are we being railroaded by China?

[Chris Lawrence]

Every Government has a rice deal. Sounds like the Generals rice deal.

It doesn't matter how much, as he is right up to his neck in it?

[boomerangutang]

What ever happened to a military take-over, and then back, as soon as possible to a elected officials? Ooops, sorry, almost forgot, this is Thailand, and democracy is flawed here. Oh, well, another military take-over, obligatory re-writing of Constitution, appointing headman's buddies to dozens of top positions, .....and then some major infrastructure deals, like the fast train - which will take decades to pay off, if it's paid off.

For 1/4 the investment a solid train system could be built which wouldn't go quite as fast as the one being planned with China, but would work well and require less involvement with China.

Today: Thailand. Tomorrow: The Autonomous Region Formerly Known as Thailand.

[EnglishJohn]

As much as I admire Prayuth far having the courage to stop that last bunch of disgusting cronies, he should concentrate on getting reform in place to stop it happening again then hold elections as soon as possible.

The Junta should not be taking economic decisions which will affect the country for years to come. That is the job of elected representatives.

His biggest flaw is overconfidence in his abilities : his statements on the GT200 bomb detectors are an excellent example. Even if he was superman, I doubt there are many more like him in the Junta rank-and-file who will be deciding these matters.

[Jonmarleesco]

'More important ... is the advantage to China of using standard-gauge tracks ...' While, as I understand it, a different gauge is in use on other lines. Very bright.

[natway09]

You raise a very good point in that does "a caretaker" government have the right to spend these billions while crying that a land tax is needed as

the coffers are nearly empty (or at least we are working on ensuring they will be empty for the next real government in power)

Speaking of land tax, take a small landowner farming in say Mukda Han scratching out a living, I bet he is very happy to contribute to a high speed rail between A & B. Lets walk before we can run. Good dual track.... YES & if the SRT had done their job over the last 50 years we would have already

[ExPratt]

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It may be true that thailand us getting a poor deal, but this article is so vague in its critisms. Is it really not in thailand's interest to use standard gauge rail tracks? What would be <deleted> disastorous is if it tried to use its current narrow gauge on a high speed train network, and what would be the point of using non standard gauge anyway?

The "High speed rail network " will stop on the Malaysian Border if indeed it happens. Malaysia have just built 350km of 1 metre gauge railway with line speed of 160 kph, it is all they need and in my opinion all Thailand needs

Are you sure a quick google only shows an hst using standard gauge currently.

Yes I'm quite sure , we just spent 5 years building it Pedang Basar to Ipon , 350 k, Ipoh to Rawang was the prior 1m gauge project. Malaysia do not want Chinese high speed , so they are keeping 1 m gauge , They may be building a KL to Singapore high speed themselves ,

Edited March 18, 2015 by ExPratt

[ExPratt]

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Double post

Edited March 18, 2015 by ExPratt

[mikiea]

Good chance the old saying " You ain't seen nothing yet " will apply.

Thailant will truly become China's little bitch. That is the way they roll :-)

[Ricardo]

Are we being railroaded by China?

No, but they are attempting to train Thailand, to do their bidding !

[boomerangutang]

Are we being railroaded by China?

No, but they are attempting to train Thailand, to do their bidding !

The train will get shafted up Thailand's back-side.....

[Strangebrew]

Mr. PM I would honestly back out of this deal with China Gracefully as it is bad deal all around for Thailand Instead I would seek to get together three countries to float loan for project under better terms. With the understanding that Material would be purchased from said countries this would insure greater ties and cooperation from said countries. I will mention the countries Japan, The UK, and The US. all three are Democracies it would insure stronger ties the loan terms could be over longer period so as not a burden to Thailand. And the biggie China needs this rail system more than Thailand to reach the world so you could charge a fair market price for them to reach the ports they need to reach.Thus over the long term greatly reducing the countries costs. besides that you help the US by buying the track and cement railroad ties from US, engineering and management setup from the UK The train system from Japan. WIN WIN all around. You gain favor from US they get closer due to major investment. Japan is already interested and with backing from the other two this works to the benefit of all.

[boomerangutang]

Mr. PM I would honestly back out of this deal with China Gracefully as it is bad deal all around for Thailand Instead I would seek to get together three countries to float loan for project under better terms. With the understanding that Material would be purchased from said countries this would insure greater ties and cooperation from said countries. I will mention the countries Japan, The UK, and The US. all three are Democracies it would insure stronger ties the loan terms could be over longer period so as not a burden to Thailand. And the biggie China needs this rail system more than Thailand to reach the world so you could charge a fair market price for them to reach the ports they need to reach.Thus over the long term greatly reducing the countries costs. besides that you help the US by buying the track and cement railroad ties from US, engineering and management setup from the UK The train system from Japan. WIN WIN all around. You gain favor from US they get closer due to major investment. Japan is already interested and with backing from the other two this works to the benefit of all.

Hear hear! Post of the Day. It's not too late to pull out (that's what Chairman Mao's dad should have done 100 years ago, but I digress). I suspect the self-appointed Thai PM will keep pushing back the time for new elections, because he might be spooked that a new elected group of leaders may see the folly of jumping quickly into a giant infrastructure deal with China - could spell trouble down the tracks, on several levels. Sorry if I sound like a cynic, but I can foresee problems galore (for Thailand) if the deal continues to ratchet up.

[paddyjenkins]

Well, i hate to say i told you so....but....

Edited March 19, 2015 by paddyjenkins

[ExPratt]

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Mr. PM I would honestly back out of this deal with China Gracefully as it is bad deal all around for Thailand Instead I would seek to get together three countries to float loan for project under better terms. With the understanding that Material would be purchased from said countries this would insure greater ties and cooperation from said countries. I will mention the countries Japan, The UK, and The US. all three are Democracies it would insure stronger ties the loan terms could be over longer period so as not a burden to Thailand. And the biggie China needs this rail system more than Thailand to reach the world so you could charge a fair market price for them to reach the ports they need to reach.Thus over the long term greatly reducing the countries costs. besides that you help the US by buying the track and cement railroad ties from US, engineering and management setup from the UK The train system from Japan. WIN WIN all around. You gain favor from US they get closer due to major investment. Japan is already interested and with backing from the other two this works to the benefit of all.

Yep , how many passenger trains a day serving how many people ? . The Railway will make its money from Freight , Chinese freight. If for at anytime or any reason the Chinese cease that freight Thailand are left with a 350 Billion baht Railway, serving very few people. Gives the Chinese massive bargaining power you would imagine

[MaxLee]

Are we being railroaded by China?

If our dear PM and former General says so and wishes so,.......

[boomerangutang]

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Mr. PM I would honestly back out of this deal with China Gracefully as it is bad deal all around for Thailand Instead I would seek to get together three countries to float loan for project under better terms. With the understanding that Material would be purchased from said countries this would insure greater ties and cooperation from said countries. I will mention the countries Japan, The UK, and The US. all three are Democracies it would insure stronger ties the loan terms could be over longer period so as not a burden to Thailand. And the biggie China needs this rail system more than Thailand to reach the world so you could charge a fair market price for them to reach the ports they need to reach.Thus over the long term greatly reducing the countries costs. besides that you help the US by buying the track and cement railroad ties from US, engineering and management setup from the UK The train system from Japan. WIN WIN all around. You gain favor from US they get closer due to major investment. Japan is already interested and with backing from the other two this works to the benefit of all.

Yep , how many passenger trains a day serving how many people ? . The Railway will make its money from Freight , Chinese freight. If for at anytime or any reason the Chinese cease that freight Thailand are left with a 350 Billion baht Railway, serving very few people. Gives the Chinese massive bargaining power you would imagine

If it's cheaper for the Chinese to move their plastic stuff to Thailand by trucks, they'll do it that way. Poof, reduced revenue for the RR. Currently, roads are being built through Laos from China to Thailand, and to some degree, through Burma as well. I've looked closely at the road construction, including connecting North/South hwys in Thailand. They all seem to adhere to the same (Chinese funded & Chinese mandated?) specs: Concrete, 8" thick, 3/4" re-bar, 16" o.c., width; same throughout. If the Chinese weren't so much into controlling smaller countries and amassing money/raw materials, I'd think it' wa somewhat ok that they're spreading infrastructure throughout SE Asia. However, looking at how they manifest (and their zeal in spreading gargantuan near-empty concrete cities everywhere), it should give Bangkok power-brokers pause.

Here's a farang saying, which Prayut and the rest of the self-appointed Thai leaders should study:

. . . . . . . . .'Wise Men Tread Softly, Where Fools Rush In.'

Possible headline for 2025: Hordes of young Chinese men arrive in Thailand every week, looking for Thai wives. Reason: there are less women their age in China, and the cost to secure a Thai bride is less.

[soalbundy]

Mr. PM I would honestly back out of this deal with China Gracefully as it is bad deal all around for Thailand Instead I would seek to get together three countries to float loan for project under better terms. With the understanding that Material would be purchased from said countries this would insure greater ties and cooperation from said countries. I will mention the countries Japan, The UK, and The US. all three are Democracies it would insure stronger ties the loan terms could be over longer period so as not a burden to Thailand. And the biggie China needs this rail system more than Thailand to reach the world so you could charge a fair market price for them to reach the ports they need to reach.Thus over the long term greatly reducing the countries costs. besides that you help the US by buying the track and cement railroad ties from US, engineering and management setup from the UK The train system from Japan. WIN WIN all around. You gain favor from US they get closer due to major investment. Japan is already interested and with backing from the other two this works to the benefit of all.

The only thing wrong with this idea is that the kick backs wont be there from countries like these, the government officials and contractors already have their tongues hanging out, the saliva trail can be seen from Bangkok to the boarder.