AP Analysis: Is Israel democratic? Not so clear

[Linky]

Please! show to me one Arab, Muslim or Islamic country which has any kind of Jewish Party - Legal, Registered, participating in elections and still alive!

Please! Put up or shut up!

Genuine political parties in established democracies rarely organise on a strictly religious basis.

Sounds like spin to deflect from what we all know already.There ISN'T one and would not be one, no matter what, but Israel is expected to be perfect. What hypocrisy.

Please UG, show me The Jewish Party or The Islamic Party in the USA... ABCer's request was to produce a straw man.

The GOP fits the bill?

[pbay]

Knesset raises threshold to four seats, putting Arab parties at risk of not entering parliament

The new legislation will benefit medium-sized parties like the settlers’ Jewish Home and Yair Lapid’s Yesh Atid, while increasing the influence of big money on politics.

The Knesset approved today (Tuesday) several changes in its elections and governance laws. Among other things, the changes will make it more difficult to challenge the government in a vote of non-confidence, and set the threshold for entering the Knesset at 3.25 percent, or roughly four Knesset seats.

The legislation is a joint initiative by Yair Lapid’s Yesh Atid party and Avigdor Liberman’s Israel Beitenu (which united with Netanyahu’s Likud party prior to the last elections). The final vote in the Knesset passed by a 67-0 majority, with the entire opposition boycotting the vote to protest the coalition’s implementation of special procedural measures earlier this week.

The new law will mostly affect the three Palestinian parties, which usually win between 3-4 seats each. Hadash, the joint Arab-Jewish party, currently has four seats; the same goes for the United Arab List (a unification of three parties, including the Islamic Ta’al party). The secular Balad party, which currently has three seats, would not have made it into the Knesset under the new law. Prior to the last elections, Knesset members banned Balad MK Hanin Zoabi from participating in the elections, a decision that was later overruled by the Supreme Court.

http://972mag.com/knesset-raises-threshold-to-four-seats-putting-arab-parties-at-risk-of-not-entering-parliament/88305/

Trying to drive Arab Israeli parties out of the election, very democratic eh??????

Please! show to me one Arab, Muslim or Islamic country which has any kind of Jewish Party - Legal, Registered, participating in elections and still alive!

Please! Put up or shut up!

So you could not actually come up with any argument against what I posted, so instead you tried the old deflection tactic, the one all pro Israeli BS artists try when confronted with a fact based argument that they have no answer to.Yawn......

Don't damage your jaw when yawning.

Personally I do not give a hood about Israelis, or their Arabs.

Within any Democracy in political games any legal trick is good and is used in any country.

Blaming Jews for using such tricks speaks more of your yawn than anything else.

Nobody was beheaded? Incarcerated? Expelled? Sent to Gaza? - so it is a kind of Democracy!

Are you sure your country has a better one? Show me.

Your options were - put up or shut up! But you can only yawn.

So you decided to come back yet again with no argument and just more deflection. I thought as much going on your first attempt. LMAO..Better luck next time.

[Ulysses G.]

Moreh Sedgh is a Jewish MP, who represents the Jewish community in Iran.

ONE guy.

Since when is ONE ​Jewish MP a Jewish political party? Arabs in Israel have NUMEROUS political parties with numerous members under their control.

[Scott]

Some posters are getting a little nasty and some posts off-topic and inflammatory. I suggest you get back on the topic and keep it civil.

[BKKBobby]

I wonder if 'Israel' would be democratic if the Philistines were ruling it...

..and how many rights (if any) Jews would have in it.

So..overall I would say Israel is very democratic in a totalitarian neighborhood.

Very thourough analysis *cough*

Yes, certainly its one of the better 'democracies' in the neighbourhood.

Cheers.

[zydeco]

Is AP a news organization or a propaganda outlet? Not so clear.

[BKKBobby]

Is AP a news organization or a propaganda outlet? Not so clear.

Is it too Pro-Israeli to be reliable?

[Ulysses G.]

There might be a few Jews working there!

[Johpa]

Is Israel a democracy? The answer is not so straightforward

Yes Mr. AP writer, and all you shallow thinkers who think the question is a simple yes/no question, democracy is rarely a black and white issue; more a continuum from bad to best. Here in the US, the birthplace of the modern democratic movement, we have progressed along that continuum from a mediocre democracy with restricted voting towards more enlightened and more universal suffrage. And now the US is taking a steps backwards by limiting voting as demographics now place one influential party in a quandary and whose response has been to (1) limit voting and (2) subvert voting mechanistically (read investigative reporter Greg Palast for details). So Israel is located pretty close to that spot on the continuum as is the US. And as for you Aussies, do you remember how your democracy was subverted back in 1975?

[hard124get]

Moreh Sedgh is a Jewish MP, who represents the Jewish community in Iran.

ONE guy.

Since when is ONE ​Jewish MP a Jewish political party? Arabs in Israel have NUMEROUS political parties with numerous members under their control.

the Jewish population of Iran is only 8,756..but Iran gives them a voice anyway.

[BKKBobby]

Moreh Sedgh is a Jewish MP, who represents the Jewish community in Iran.

ONE guy.

Since when is ONE ​Jewish MP a Jewish political party? Arabs in Israel have NUMEROUS political parties with numerous members under their control.

the Jewish population of Iran is only 8,756..but Iran gives them a voice anyway.

Iran has a theochratic dictatorship. They see christians and jews as people of 'the books' which is why they do give those representatives a seat. Edited March 24, 2015 by BKKBobby

[Ulysses G.]

Moreh Sedgh is a Jewish MP, who represents the Jewish community in Iran.

ONE guy.

Since when is ONE ​Jewish MP a Jewish political party? Arabs in Israel have NUMEROUS political parties with numerous members under their control.

the Jewish population of Iran is only 8,756..but Iran gives them a voice anyway.

Not them. Stop the ridiculous spin. HIM! One guy.

Edited March 25, 2015 by Ulysses G.

[Linky]

Moreh Sedgh is a Jewish MP, who represents the Jewish community in Iran.

ONE guy.

Since when is ONE ​Jewish MP a Jewish political party? Arabs in Israel have NUMEROUS political parties with numerous members under their control.

the Jewish population of Iran is only 8,756..but Iran gives them a voice anyway.

Not them. Stop the ridiculous spin. HIM! One guy.

He is the voice for 'them' but not surprised you don't understand this.

[Ulysses G.]

I understand that Arabs in Israel have numerous political parties that represent them and the Arab minority are full citizens with the vote and you are trying to compare ONE Jewish MP in Iran to that. Arabs are represented in the Knesset, and have served in the Cabinet, high-level foreign ministry posts and on the Supreme Court. Israel is democratic. Iran is NOT.

Edited March 25, 2015 by Ulysses G.

[Srikcir]

Yes. Israel is a democracy but as Prayut so frequently points out, there is no "one size fits all for democracy."

All democratic societies are not created equal. That is not to say democracy in Israel couldn't be improved.

As a nation, Israelis discriminate against Palestinians in the Gaza strip. But they are not citizens of Israel. The benefits of goverance of any State excludes noncitizens. That is not even an issue of the type of governance used.

A majority of Israeli's electorate discriminates against Palestinians who are Israel citizens ("P-I citizens"). In some ways, Israel follows a "purity" of religion model similar to Australia's early "purity" of race model in its formation of a democratic society. More needs to be done to provide equality under the law. Israel does not have a constitution and maybe it should to formalize protection of the minority under the law. The US didn't allow American women's suffrage, nor equality for American blacks. But it was still a democracy. Those faults have been corrected by an enlightened and educated majority through Constitutional Amendments, laws, and the courts under the umbrella of a democratic society.

If the majority of Israeli's do not want change, the country will continue its path of violence and destruction with Palestinians and P-I citizens. Deterence of that path requires a change in attitude of the majority. How that attitude is changed may require more virulent democratic participation by the minority and by foreign democratic suporters of Israel. The US as a permanent member of the UN Security Council is rethinking its rigid support for Israel in UN resolutions; it may move towards more moderate solutions against the position of the Israeli majority to support apartheid in Palestine and in Isreal.

Israel can lead itself to a better democracy or its can be pushed into a bitter democracy.

[Ulysses G.]

Yes. Israel is a democracy but as Prayut so frequently points out, there is no "one size fits all for democracy."

All democratic societies are not created equal. That is not to say democracy in Israel couldn't be improved.

Of course, but that could be said of every democracy on the planet and is said. Trying to single Israel out as not being democratic is nothing but a LIE used by people who want to destroy it.

[Linky]

I understand that Arabs in Israel have numerous political parties that represent them and the Arab minority are full citizens with the vote and you are trying to compare ONE Jewish MP in Iran to that. Arabs are represented in the Knesset, and have served in the Cabinet, high-level foreign ministry posts and on the Supreme Court. Israel is democratic. Iran is NOT.

Still waiting for the number of Jewish political parties in the US.

[Ulysses G.]

No one feels the need for Jewish political parties in America or there would be some. They are not forbidden. The United States has never had an important religious party of any type.

Edited March 25, 2015 by Ulysses G.

[BKKBobby]

http://www.daysofpalestine.com/news/israeli-forces-arrest-10-palestinian-children/

[NeverSure]

Don't you just love democracy (American style).

You do know that the US isn't a democracy, don't you? Americans don't like democracy and never did. America never had a democracy. How many ways do I have to tell you?

Sometimes negotiating this part of TVF is.....................

[dexterm]

Right wing elements some bordering on fanatics have been allowed to push Israel's Jewishness at the expense of its democracy. They have become the norm over the last 10 years, because the US has allowed them to think their behavior is acceptable. Google Israeli settler violence to see examples.

At last the world is beginning to say enough.

Israel could have it both in a 2 state solution...democracy and its Jewish character.

If the rabid elements such as Lieberman, Bennett, and Feiglin prevail, democracy will be the casualty, and possibly the state of Israel itself.

[Steely Dan]

No one feels the need for Jewish political parties in America or there would be some. They are not forbidden. The United States has never had an important religious party of any type.

Quite a funny question really, seeing as some of our esteemed members seem to think the Jews run the U.S.

[BKKBobby]

No one feels the need for Jewish political parties in America or there would be some. They are not forbidden. The United States has never had an important religious party of any type.

Quite a funny question really, seeing as some of our esteemed members seem to think the Jews run the U.S.

You dont need to hold political office to have a big influence on US politics. Money is one of the keys in US politics. Edited March 25, 2015 by BKKBobby

[Steely Dan]

Yes. Israel is a democracy but as Prayut so frequently points out, there is no "one size fits all for democracy."

All democratic societies are not created equal. That is not to say democracy in Israel couldn't be improved.

Of course, but that could be said of every democracy on the planet and is said. Trying to single Israel out as not being democratic is nothing but a LIE used by people who want to destroy it.

One thing that is certain, a future Palestinian state would be Judenrein and the few remaining Christians would be driven out, as demonstrated by their decline in. Bethlehem and Nazareth. In other words it would be an apartheid state and hardly a democracy either, if the Palestinian election record is any guide.

The most bizarre thing about the O.P is it seems to confuse the Arabs living in Israel with those living in the West Bank and Gaza, who are obviously not Israel's responsibility, and just because they can't get their shit together does not have any bearing on Israel being a democracy or not.

[Steely Dan]

No one feels the need for Jewish political parties in America or there would be some. They are not forbidden. The United States has never had an important religious party of any type.

Quite a funny question really, seeing as some of our esteemed members seem to think the Jews run the U.S.

You dont need to hold political office to have a big influence on US politics. Money is one of the keys in US politics.

And the Arab oil states have no money? Whilst we are on the subject the first Obama election campaign received donations from the Gaza Strip, boy does that show.

[ggold]

Knesset raises threshold to four seats, putting Arab parties at risk of not entering parliament

The new legislation will benefit medium-sized parties like the settlers’ Jewish Home and Yair Lapid’s Yesh Atid, while increasing the influence of big money on politics.

The Knesset approved today (Tuesday) several changes in its elections and governance laws. Among other things, the changes will make it more difficult to challenge the government in a vote of non-confidence, and set the threshold for entering the Knesset at 3.25 percent, or roughly four Knesset seats.

The legislation is a joint initiative by Yair Lapid’s Yesh Atid party and Avigdor Liberman’s Israel Beitenu (which united with Netanyahu’s Likud party prior to the last elections). The final vote in the Knesset passed by a 67-0 majority, with the entire opposition boycotting the vote to protest the coalition’s implementation of special procedural measures earlier this week.

The new law will mostly affect the three Palestinian parties, which usually win between 3-4 seats each. Hadash, the joint Arab-Jewish party, currently has four seats; the same goes for the United Arab List (a unification of three parties, including the Islamic Ta’al party). The secular Balad party, which currently has three seats, would not have made it into the Knesset under the new law. Prior to the last elections, Knesset members banned Balad MK Hanin Zoabi from participating in the elections, a decision that was later overruled by the Supreme Court.

http://972mag.com/knesset-raises-threshold-to-four-seats-putting-arab-parties-at-risk-of-not-entering-parliament/88305/

Trying to drive Arab Israeli parties out of the election, very democratic eh??????

http://www.ibtimes.com/israel-election-results-2015-what-does-future-hold-arab-political-power-1851294

Despite unprecedented gains in Israel’s election Tuesday, the historic rise of the Arab Israeli coalition to become the third-largest bloc in the parliament will not necessarily translate into immediate influence. The alliance of four small Arab parties was made for political survival and could fracture when a new government is formed in the coming weeks.

“They’re not really unified in any way,” Elliot Abrams, a former U.S. official and senior fellow for Middle Eastern studies at the Council on Foreign Relations, said in a conference call with reporters Wednesday. He described the Joint Arab List as “an umbrella that represent a plethora of views … so they hung together to get into the Knesset and will now scatter ideologically. Their political power is not going to be all that great as a bloc except on some national security issues.”

[dexterm]

Yes. Israel is a democracy but as Prayut so frequently points out, there is no "one size fits all for democracy."

All democratic societies are not created equal. That is not to say democracy in Israel couldn't be improved.

Of course, but that could be said of every democracy on the planet and is said. Trying to single Israel out as not being democratic is nothing but a LIE used by people who want to destroy it.

One thing that is certain, a future Palestinian state would be Judenrein and the few remaining Christians would be driven out, as demonstrated by their decline in. Bethlehem and Nazareth. In other words it would be an apartheid state and hardly a democracy either, if the Palestinian election record is any guide.

The most bizarre thing about the O.P is it seems to confuse the Arabs living in Israel with those living in the West Bank and Gaza, who are obviously not Israel's responsibility, and just because they can't get their <deleted> together does not have any bearing on Israel being a democracy or not.

As the occupying power under the Geneva Convention, Israel has extensive duty of care responsibilities.that cover health, hospitals, safety, nutrition, education, besides non transfer of Israeli population into Occupied Territories or collective punishments

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_Geneva_Convention#Section_III._Occupied_territories

Israel signed the Geneva Conventions on 12.08.1949 and ratified it on 06.07.1951

https://www.icrc.org/applic/ihl/ihl.nsf/vwTreatiesByCountrySelected.xsp?xp_countrySelected=IL

If Israel goes ahead and actually annexes the West Bank it will have a duty to make 2.5 million Palestinians equal citizens also.

[ggold]

Is all citizens in Israel equally equal? No. Is some citizens in Israel more equal than others? Yes. Was the first 'democracy' in the world democratic (equally equal rights for all inhabitants)? No. Is Israel a democracy? No.

sounds like communism, equality of the masses etc. even then there is no equality. it doesn't exist and never will, but by your analysis that would make China and N Korea democracies!

[ggold]

Yes. Israel is a democracy but as Prayut so frequently points out, there is no "one size fits all for democracy."

All democratic societies are not created equal. That is not to say democracy in Israel couldn't be improved.

Of course, but that could be said of every democracy on the planet and is said. Trying to single Israel out as not being democratic is nothing but a LIE used by people who want to destroy it.

One thing that is certain, a future Palestinian state would be Judenrein and the few remaining Christians would be driven out, as demonstrated by their decline in. Bethlehem and Nazareth. In other words it would be an apartheid state and hardly a democracy either, if the Palestinian election record is any guide.

The most bizarre thing about the O.P is it seems to confuse the Arabs living in Israel with those living in the West Bank and Gaza, who are obviously not Israel's responsibility, and just because they can't get their <deleted> together does not have any bearing on Israel being a democracy or not.

As the occupying power under the Geneva Convention, Israel has extensive duty of care responsibilities.that cover health, hospitals, safety, nutrition, education, besides non transfer of Israeli population into Occupied Territories or collective punishments

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourth_Geneva_Convention#Section_III._Occupied_territories

Israel signed the Geneva Conventions on 12.08.1949 and ratified it on 06.07.1951

https://www.icrc.org/applic/ihl/ihl.nsf/vwTreatiesByCountrySelected.xsp?xp_countrySelected=IL

If Israel goes ahead and actually annexes the West Bank it will have a duty to make 2.5 million Palestinians equal citizens also.

They have Schools. They have Hospitals, They have nutrition, Education is coverd by the schools. They even have safety. The IDF protect Abbas and his cohorts from Hamas terroists. They even have their own police.

So what's your point Dex?

I don't think they want to become Israeli citizens, they could go to Jordan, the country that relinquishes the west bank! Indeed Abbas is Jordanian so what is he doing in the west bank, Jordan don't control that area any more he shouldn't be there

Edited March 25, 2015 by ggold

[Steely Dan]

Yes. Israel is a democracy but as Prayut so frequently points out, there is no "one size fits all for democracy."

All democratic societies are not created equal. That is not to say democracy in Israel couldn't be improved.

Of course, but that could be said of every democracy on the planet and is said. Trying to single Israel out as not being democratic is nothing but a LIE used by people who want to destroy it.

One thing that is certain, a future Palestinian state would be Judenrein and the few remaining Christians would be driven out, as demonstrated by their decline in. Bethlehem and Nazareth. In other words it would be an apartheid state and hardly a democracy either, if the Palestinian election record is any guide.

The most bizarre thing about the O.P is it seems to confuse the Arabs living in Israel with those living in the West Bank and Gaza, who are obviously not Israel's responsibility, and just because they can't get their <deleted> together does not have any bearing on Israel being a democracy or not.

If Israel goes ahead and actually annexes the West Bank it will have a duty to make 2.5 million Palestinians equal citizens also.

And if my uncle had tits he'd be my auntie. Wake me up if and when Israel annexes the West Bank. Though I guess neither you nor the yet to be named Palestinians had any problem when Jordan occupied the West Bank between 1948 and 1967. Edited March 25, 2015 by Steely Dan