Thai agencies to conduct DNA tests on stateless people

[webfact]

Agencies to conduct DNA tests on stateless people
Piyanut Tumnukasetchai
The Nation

BANGKOK: -- The Provincial Administration Department and the Central Institute of Forensic Science (CIFS) will join forces to carry out DNA tests on 200,000 stateless people, including 79,000 school-age youths, to prove their ethnicity and ensure their right to healthcare and education.

CIFS director Khunying Porntip Rojanasunan and department director-general Krissada Boonrat yesterday signed a memorandum of understanding for DNA tests to support the department's census registration.

Krissada expressed the hope that this co-operation would boost the speed and effectiveness of the nationality identification process. He said the Justice Ministry would cover the expense of the DNA tests, which cost about Bt10,000 per pair.

Porntip urged people wishing to apply for national identification to file a request with the CIFS or the Provincial Administration Department, which would screen the applicants before submitting the cases to the CIFS to carry out the free DNA testing.

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/national/Agencies-to-conduct-DNA-tests-on-stateless-people-30260149.html

-- The Nation 2015-05-15

[canuckamuck]

I might be mistaken, but I understood that it is quite difficult to ascertain detailed ethnicity based on DNA. Sure they can determine that they are Asian, but will they be able to determine that they are from Thailand? I doubt it.

[oneday]

Agreed. If a child is born to one Thai parent, doesn't that child get citizenship automatically, but what is a DNA test going to show for this child/person. At least it seems to be a good faith effort to reach out to homeless Thai people, but they need to do better.

As another person on the thread about homeless people yesterday said; start using the system Singapore uses. Collect fingerprints from children when they are born and issue an ID card based solely on proven ethnicity at the time of birth then these people won't fall through the cracks.

Wake up Thailand and get smart if you REALLY care about your people.

[lungmi]

Right. May be it's posssible to detect some subgroups; for medical treatment useful. Ethnicity cannot be proven by DNA, the nazis tried it in another way.

[Always18]

Racial profiling by using DNA sampling? - I'm sure certain influential Thai figures would like to think there is such a thing as "Thai" DNA but that's only because their own DNA is missing the intelligent gene...............

[timmyp]

Using DNA to prove Thai ethnicity is so totally bizarre. I wonder what genes they are specifically looking for. Is there a "Thai gene" we haven't heard about? Haplogroup T? I wonder how the population at large would size up with their testing criteria.

Perhaps they have already decided they will reject the vast majority of those they are testing, and this is just a way to make it look like they are being thoroughly scientific.

[Jeffreyake]

it's possible to determine ethnicity by DNA, if you know ethnicity patterns.

Edited May 15, 2015 by Jeffreyake

[canuckamuck]

What will freak them out is realizing they have the same DNA as all the national neighbors they like to mock.

[Oziex1]

I believe the RTP will demonstrate how to get DNA results in less than 24Hrs.

Once the have all the samples they then have a data bank of scapegoats to be known as "The Institute of no Thai would Ever do This"

[partington]

Another example of Khunying Porntip's corruption, now enforcing scientifically incredible ethnicity tests at the behest of her Army supporters.

Perhaps they'll do the tests by putting a new chip in the fake bomb detectors she validated, which will convert them into ethnicity detectors.

[Balance]

I might be mistaken, but I understood that it is quite difficult to ascertain detailed ethnicity based on DNA. Sure they can determine that they are Asian, but will they be able to determine that they are from Thailand? I doubt it.

This is the most absurd thing I have read in at least three years. Just exactly where are the genetic markers for "Thai" located in the human genome? The expertise and equipment needed to differentiate between sub-Saharan Africans and northern Europeans does not exist here. You have to go very deep into the genome to find the genetic difference between racial types. There is no discernible difference between between ethnic types.

For that matter, Thai people came from the Tai speaking areas of northern Vietnam/southern China early in the first century A.D. Much later this gene pool was mixed with Khmer who had occupied the lower Chaopraya floodplain for centuries along with Mon Shan people. Later you had influxes of Lao people who were brought to Thailand as labor.

But the larger question is what difference does it make? Is the idea that "Thainess" will be defined by government made up of mostly Chinese/Thai heritage to arbitrarily exclude refugees who need help. Is this how the teachings of Buddha are now interpreted? I am just one old farang, but when I moved here I expected better than this.

[lungmi]

Thaksin had this perverted idea already. Check his DNA too, he is Montenegrian ethnic.

[lungmi]

Oh, and Taksin, the first Chinese King of Thailand.

[orange31]

Is that 10,000 Baht per person, or for 2 people. Either way for 200,000 people it's going to cost either 1 billion Baht or 2 billion Baht. There really is no end to the creativity of Thai officials and politicians to squander public funds is there?

[tonbridgebrit]

So, Khunying Porntip is in on this ?

Thai ethnicity ?? A lot of the Thais themselves will have the same DNA as Chinese people, this is because these people are actually a bunch of Chinese living in Thailand. The indigenous Thais will probably have DNA similar to people who are from Cambodia, Laos and Burma.

What is this all about ? Maybe a load of Chinese are taking the first steps to remove the indigenous people of Thailand, and replace them with people of Chinese blood. I really do think that anything to do with looking at DNA to see if certain people belong to whatever place is a bad idea.

[EmptyHead]

It is impossible to find a person's ethnicity from a DNA test becuase ethnicity is the culture we learn. Ethnicity refers to social identity, not biological identity.

They mean to say race, which most experts will say technically doesn't exist, since there is such a tiny different in DNA between all the people in the world anyway and the biggest differences are often found between people living on the same continent, rather than different continents. So, therefor, biologically, there is no such thing as race.

Even what little they can tell is subject to conjecture.

But, since Thainess is the most unique and special thing in the universe, they will have totallty different DNA, of course. That, I assume, is what they are trying to look for, or is it a reason not to help these people? Thainess at it's best, I'm afraid.

[tonbridgebrit]

It is impossible to find a person's ethnicity from a DNA test becuase ethnicity is the culture we learn. Ethnicity refers to social identity, not biological identity.

They mean to say race, which most experts will say technically doesn't exist, since there is such a tiny different in DNA between all the people in the world anyway and the biggest differences are often found between people living on the same continent, rather than different continents. So, therefor, biologically, there is no such thing as race.

Even what little they can tell is subject to conjecture.

But, since Thainess is the most unique and special thing in the universe, they will have totallty different DNA, of course. That, I assume, is what they are trying to look for, or is it a reason not to help these people? Thainess at it's best, I'm afraid.

Hello there. Yes, being racist is wrong, mistreating and abusing people on the grounds of race is wrong.

But, it's a bit silly to say that race doesn't exist. Even if 'race' only exists in peoples' minds, well, it certainly is something that is 'real'.

Yes, some Thais are racist. Some of them look down on those from neighbouring countries, Thais are conscious of the fact that they look more Chinese than people from neighbouring countries. The strange thing being, some of the Thais who look down on the non-Chinese Burmese and Cambodians are actually Thais who are not Chinese !

How absurd would it be if : blondes and brunettes live in Britain, brunettes from Spain and Greece turn up in Britain, and oh look, it's the brunettes in Britain who look down on the brunettes from Spain and Greece !!

[EmptyHead]

I believe i said biologically there is no such thing as race, not that people don't believe in it.

[Sayonarax]

Sounds like a money grab.

[ExPratt]

I might be mistaken, but I understood that it is quite difficult to ascertain detailed ethnicity based on DNA. Sure they can determine that they are Asian, but will they be able to determine that they are from Thailand? I doubt it.

Spot on ,Even if it worked it would be impossible to tell someones true Ethnicity, My kids look 100% Farang but are half Thai, but race isn't what they are ultimately trying to establish. I think someone has told them DNA testing can detect" Nationality"

"Krissada expressed the hope that this co-operation would boost the speed and effectiveness of the nationality identification process. He said the Justice Ministry would cover the expense of the DNA tests, which cost about Bt10,000 per pair."

Edited May 17, 2015 by ExPratt

[tonbridgebrit]

Thaksin had this perverted idea already. Check his DNA too, he is Montenegrian ethnic.

Oh, and Taksin, the first Chinese King of Thailand.

You want to talk about Thaksin's DNA ??

Yes, he is Chinese. But you do realise, Abhisit is also Chinese ? And look at the Thais who are the Yellow shirts. You will notice that they look Chinese, that's because they have Chinese DNA in their blood.

And we don't actually need DNA tests to see if they are Chinese or not. It's in the eyes. The eyes reveal whether the person is Chinese is not. And if those stateless people had Chinese type eyes (slitty eyes), well, I don't think Thailand would be having a problem in accepting them.

[tonbridgebrit]

I might be mistaken, but I understood that it is quite difficult to ascertain detailed ethnicity based on DNA. Sure they can determine that they are Asian, but will they be able to determine that they are from Thailand? I doubt it.

Spot on ,Even if it worked it would be impossible to tell someones true Ethnicity, My kids look 100% Farang but are half Thai, but race isn't what they are ultimately trying to establish. I think someone has told them DNA testing can detect" Nationality"

"Krissada expressed the hope that this co-operation would boost the speed and effectiveness of the nationality identification process. He said the Justice Ministry would cover the expense of the DNA tests, which cost about Bt10,000 per pair."

Okay, if Thailand was being honest, they would be saying "forget this expensive DNA testing, if you're stateless, and your hair is straight, and your skin isn't so dark, your eyes are slitty, fine, we let you".

But, "if your hair is curly or wavy, and you're a bit dark, your eyes are more round than slitty, well, we don't want you in Thailand".

But Thailand will never announce this, so that's why they've come up with this DNA testing !!

[chilli42]

It's a pleasant surprise that there is so concrete action being taken. The problem, as pointed out by others is that DNA testing is not going to tell them anything they don't already know .... other than perhaps if a few farang or African genes slipped into the pool. So goo news is that for some people it will open the door to citizenship but sadly it will close the door for others that may in fact have deserved it. I really don't understand why they simply font just found a one time exception and grant it to all this group. Its not that many people involved. It's not like a Thai passport is such an asset ... unless you have no passport at all.

[chilli42]

It's a pleasant surprise that there is so concrete action being taken. The problem, as pointed out by others is that DNA testing is not going to tell them anything they don't already know .... other than perhaps if a few farang or African genes slipped into the pool. So goo news is that for some people it will open the door to citizenship but sadly it will close the door for others that may in fact have deserved it. I really don't understand why they simply font just found a one time exception and grant it to all this group. Its not that many people involved. It's not like a Thai passport is such an asset ... unless you have no passport at all.

[tonbridgebrit]

Right, has this person got Thai DNA ? This person looks like the lady who owns my local Chinese Take-away, I really do think we're talking Chinese DNA here rather than Thai.

[NickJ]

Money grab....what does the Justice Dept have to do with it anyway.....You can have DNA tested in the US now with a kit, all by mail.....and its way way cheaper than 10,000b and I do t know what per pair means......

[lostoday]

Something funny about this story. Seems to me the headline does not match the story. Has it occurred to anyone to check the story? I can't believe the lady thinks DNA testing can determine ethnicity. I have run into a dead end trying to check the story further. Something this dumb would have to make international headlines if true.