Call for 'reforms before elections' forces a detour in PM's road map

[dageurreotype]

Why posters continue to delude themselves that there was/is any 'road map' defies logic. It surely must be obvious by now the true motives for this power seizure, particularly given the prosecution of certain 'non aligned' individuals only, continuing land grabs by the very wealthy (today's BP), opaque high speed train deals, covert plans for destroying the Andaman area of Pak Bara, topped off by the cherry that is haha, the legalising of casinos. How can any of the aforementioned be described as 'reforms'?

Off you go back to your squabbling over sweet s0d all

[lostoday]

That is the point. Without knowing what the reforms are the people maybe very intelligent or very not intelligent depending on what is to be reformed.

I'm reminded of the captain of the ship giving the command to abandon ship without knowing if the ship is sinking. One would think the first item on the agenda would be to discover the danger of ship sinking.

In this case the first thing on the agenda is to examine the reforms to know if they are indeed significant enough to delay the elections.

So again I ask what reforms do you think are important enough to delay the election?

Since I think the country needs to be build up from scratch to ever reach something resembling a democratic state, or at least work on educating the population for a generation or two, delay of election has no meaning to me. That's even without me being unable to vote.

Who should build the country up? How should Thailand find the person to lead the country being built up? Who should make the reforms to the education system? Are any of those reforms mentioned in the reforms that this thread is about?

You are talking like a two year old. You wrote, "I think the country needs to be build up from scratch" By whom? What is his/her mandate? What does build up from scratch mean?

Gibberish again. Build up = ?????

I keep asking and you keep avoiding answering any of my questions. I don't know why.

I can make it as simple as one two three.

1. What is your definition of build up as it refers to Thailand?

2. Whom should lead this build up?

3. How should that person be chosen?

[rubl]

That is the point. Without knowing what the reforms are the people maybe very intelligent or very not intelligent depending on what is to be reformed.

I'm reminded of the captain of the ship giving the command to abandon ship without knowing if the ship is sinking. One would think the first item on the agenda would be to discover the danger of ship sinking.

In this case the first thing on the agenda is to examine the reforms to know if they are indeed significant enough to delay the elections.

So again I ask what reforms do you think are important enough to delay the election?

Since I think the country needs to be build up from scratch to ever reach something resembling a democratic state, or at least work on educating the population for a generation or two, delay of election has no meaning to me. That's even without me being unable to vote.

Who should build the country up? How should Thailand find the person to lead the country being built up? Who should make the reforms to the education system? Are any of those reforms mentioned in the reforms that this thread is about?

You are talking like a two year old. You wrote, "I think the country needs to be build up from scratch" By whom? What is his/her mandate? What does build up from scratch mean?

Gibberish again. Build up = ?????

I keep asking and you keep avoiding answering any of my questions. I don't know why.

I can make it as simple as one two three.

1. What is your definition of build up as it refers to Thailand?

2. Whom should lead this build up?

3. How should that person be chosen?

I guess this means you don't like my answer.

[lostoday]

That is the point. Without knowing what the reforms are the people maybe very intelligent or very not intelligent depending on what is to be reformed.

I'm reminded of the captain of the ship giving the command to abandon ship without knowing if the ship is sinking. One would think the first item on the agenda would be to discover the danger of ship sinking.

In this case the first thing on the agenda is to examine the reforms to know if they are indeed significant enough to delay the elections.

So again I ask what reforms do you think are important enough to delay the election?

Since I think the country needs to be build up from scratch to ever reach something resembling a democratic state, or at least work on educating the population for a generation or two, delay of election has no meaning to me. That's even without me being unable to vote.

Who should build the country up? How should Thailand find the person to lead the country being built up? Who should make the reforms to the education system? Are any of those reforms mentioned in the reforms that this thread is about?

You are talking like a two year old. You wrote, "I think the country needs to be build up from scratch" By whom? What is his/her mandate? What does build up from scratch mean?

Gibberish again. Build up = ?????

I keep asking and you keep avoiding answering any of my questions. I don't know why.

I can make it as simple as one two three.

1. What is your definition of build up as it refers to Thailand?

2. Whom should lead this build up?

3. How should that person be chosen?

I guess this means you don't like my answer.

What answer? You answered nothing I asked. But being a nice guy I wrote it off to ADS and modified my question to suite your last statement,

1. What is your definition of build up as it refers to Thailand?

2. Whom should lead this build up?

3. How should that person be chosen?

[rubl]

Since I think the country needs to be build up from scratch to ever reach something resembling a democratic state, or at least work on educating the population for a generation or two, delay of election has no meaning to me. That's even without me being unable to vote.

Who should build the country up? How should Thailand find the person to lead the country being built up? Who should make the reforms to the education system? Are any of those reforms mentioned in the reforms that this thread is about?

You are talking like a two year old. You wrote, "I think the country needs to be build up from scratch" By whom? What is his/her mandate? What does build up from scratch mean?

Gibberish again. Build up = ?????

I keep asking and you keep avoiding answering any of my questions. I don't know why.

I can make it as simple as one two three.

1. What is your definition of build up as it refers to Thailand?

2. Whom should lead this build up?

3. How should that person be chosen?

I guess this means you don't like my answer.

What answer? You answered nothing I asked. But being a nice guy I wrote it off to ADS and modified my question to suite your last statement,

1. What is your definition of build up as it refers to Thailand?

2. Whom should lead this build up?

3. How should that person be chosen?

May I assume you're not holding your breath? I mean even after lots of hard work by many people neither CDC nor NRC seem to have been able to come with sufficient details. Had they you would not be so near desperate asking for information.

I'm afraid that my proposal "build up from scratch" will need at least the same effort. I'm willing to ask my dear friend PM Prayut to borrow his NRC/CDC organisation lock, stock and barrel, but since my proposal may be deemed too pragmatic, I doubt he'll be obliging.

If I had to do the work myself, well, don't call me, I'll let you you when I'm ready. Could be somewhere in the next decade already.

Now for a very quick reply

ad.1. build up from scratch as in start again. Take over and redraft all laws. Start with an educational system which teaches kids to think for themselves while not being afraid to ask questions. things like that.

ad.2. I decline, but if you want to twist my arm ...

ad.3. conflict with Q2. When you ask who should lead that implies there is a choice made already.

Concluding, my proposal is unlikely to be taken up. As such asking more questions is a waste of time of both you and me.

Almost Sunday, think of your father. Or you could watch Channel7, John Carter learning to walk on Mars.

Edited June 20, 2015 by rubl

[lostoday]

May I assume you're not holding your breath? I mean even after lots of hard work by many people neither CDC nor NRC seem to have been able to come with sufficient details. Had they you would not be so near desperate asking for information.

I'm afraid that my proposal "build up from scratch" will need at least the same effort. I'm willing to ask my dear friend PM Prayut to borrow his NRC/CDC organisation lock, stock and barrel, but since my proposal may be deemed too pragmatic, I doubt he'll be obliging.

If I had to do the work myself, well, don't call me, I'll let you you when I'm ready. Could be somewhere in the next decade already.

Now for a very quick reply

ad.1. build up from scratch as in start again. Take over and redraft all laws. Start with an educational system which teaches kids to think for themselves while not being afraid to ask questions. things like that.

ad.2. I decline, but if you want to twist my arm ...

ad.3. conflict with Q2. When you ask who should lead that implies there is a choice made already.

Concluding, my proposal is unlikely to be taken up. As such asking more questions is a waste of time of both you and me.

Almost Sunday, think of your father.

Do you mind if I edit for clarity?

I wrote

"1. What is your definition of build up as it refers to Thailand?

Your answer, "1. build up from scratch as in start again. Take over and redraft all laws. Start with an educational system which teaches kids to think for themselves while not being afraid to ask questions. things like that."

My answer. The system is fine. Almost 100 % employment. Universal health care. No one starving and one of the lowest suicide rates in the world. So what if they believe in ghosts and fairies? Not everyone can be as educated as GW.

I wrote

"2. Whom should lead this build up?"

Your answer, "I decline, but if you want to twist my arm ..."

I wrote

"3. How should that person be chosen?"

Your answer, " conflict with Q2. When you ask who should lead that implies there is a choice made already."

My answer, "What? No it doesn't.

You wrote, "May I assume you're not holding your breath? I mean even after lots of hard work by many people neither CDC nor NRC seem to have been able to come with sufficient details. Had they you would not be so near desperate asking for information."

My answer, "There is a draft constitution with a gazillion words and a million reforms, what are you talking about?"

So lets pretend I'm going to start by upgrading the education system. How did you do? Question #1 F. Silly answer Redraft all the laws? Why, some of them are fine. Kids already think for themselves, you have never been involved with the Thai education system and are repeating the oft quoted TV negative stereotypes. Kids ask questions of good teachers as you would know if you had a clue about the educational system.

Question #2. F. Didn't answer.

Question #3. F Didn't answer.

We don't have an everybody pass rule here and you really failed big time.

Edited June 20, 2015 by lostoday

[rubl]

May I assume you're not holding your breath? I mean even after lots of hard work by many people neither CDC nor NRC seem to have been able to come with sufficient details. Had they you would not be so near desperate asking for information.

I'm afraid that my proposal "build up from scratch" will need at least the same effort. I'm willing to ask my dear friend PM Prayut to borrow his NRC/CDC organisation lock, stock and barrel, but since my proposal may be deemed too pragmatic, I doubt he'll be obliging.

If I had to do the work myself, well, don't call me, I'll let you you when I'm ready. Could be somewhere in the next decade already.

Now for a very quick reply

ad.1. build up from scratch as in start again. Take over and redraft all laws. Start with an educational system which teaches kids to think for themselves while not being afraid to ask questions. things like that.

ad.2. I decline, but if you want to twist my arm ...

ad.3. conflict with Q2. When you ask who should lead that implies there is a choice made already.

Concluding, my proposal is unlikely to be taken up. As such asking more questions is a waste of time of both you and me.

Almost Sunday, think of your father.

Do you mind if I edit for clarity?

I wrote

"1. What is your definition of build up as it refers to Thailand?

Your answer, "1. build up from scratch as in start again. Take over and redraft all laws. Start with an educational system which teaches kids to think for themselves while not being afraid to ask questions. things like that."

My answer. The system is fine. Almost 100 % employment. Universal health care. No one starving and one of the lowest suicide rates in the world. So what if they believe in ghosts and fairies? Not everyone can be as educated as GW.

I wrote

"2. Whom should lead this build up?"

Your answer, "I decline, but if you want to twist my arm ..."

I wrote

"3. How should that person be chosen?"

Your answer, " conflict with Q2. When you ask who should lead that implies there is a choice made already."

My answer, "What? No it doesn't.

You wrote, "May I assume you're not holding your breath? I mean even after lots of hard work by many people neither CDC nor NRC seem to have been able to come with sufficient details. Had they you would not be so near desperate asking for information."

My answer, "There is a draft constitution with a gazillion words and a million reforms, what are you talking about?"

So lets pretend I'm going to start by upgrading the education system. How did you do? Question #1 F. Silly answer Redraft all the laws? Why, some of them are fine. Kids already think for themselves, you have never been involved with the Thai education system and are repeating the oft quoted TV negative stereotypes. Kids ask questions of good teachers as you would know if you had a clue about the educational system.

Question #2. F. Didn't answer.

Question #3. F Didn't answer.

We don't have an everybody pass rule here and you really failed big time.

Interesting I fail. Maybe it did escape you that a build up from scratch excludes a democratic process of building up the scratching and rebuilding team. May I assume even you would like to end all this before the end of the century? So, I'm just requesting the UN to give be some manpower to do the work and assuming they say yes (Thailand is a basket case as many posters here suggest) I have all the authority I need.

BTW good teachers are also a product of a good educational system.

Failing to greet you,

uncle rubl

[rubl]

I (think I) found a like minded soul who may just be the right man to drive through my 'build-up from scratch' program, The current Greek Minister of Finance Yanis Varoufakis. In an interesting opinion piece he stated

"No, what Greece now needs desperately is serious, proper reforms. We need a new tax system that helps defeat evasion and curtail political or corporate interference, a corruption-free procurement system, business-friendly licensing procedures, judicial reforms, elimination of scandalous early retirement practices, proper regulation of the media and of political party finances, etc."

http://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/yanis-varoufakis-a-pressing-question-for-ireland-before-monday-s-meeting-on-greece-1.2256339

Mind you, some may wonder what he means when he mentions reforms

Edited June 21, 2015 by rubl

[baboon]

I (think I) found a like minded soul who may just be the right man to drive through my 'build-up from scratch' program, The current Greek Minister of Finance Yanis Varoufakis. In an interesting opinion piece he stated

"No, what Greece now needs desperately is serious, proper reforms. We need a new tax system that helps defeat evasion and curtail political or corporate interference, a corruption-free procurement system, business-friendly licensing procedures, judicial reforms, elimination of scandalous early retirement practices, proper regulation of the media and of political party finances, etc."

http://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/yanis-varoufakis-a-pressing-question-for-ireland-before-monday-s-meeting-on-greece-1.2256339

Mind you, some may wonder what he means when he mentions reforms

Wasn't he democratically elected? Oh yes, he was.

Lostoday was asking you about what you meant by reform, not the Greek minister of finance, unless I misread his post...

[rubl]

I (think I) found a like minded soul who may just be the right man to drive through my 'build-up from scratch' program, The current Greek Minister of Finance Yanis Varoufakis. In an interesting opinion piece he stated

"No, what Greece now needs desperately is serious, proper reforms. We need a new tax system that helps defeat evasion and curtail political or corporate interference, a corruption-free procurement system, business-friendly licensing procedures, judicial reforms, elimination of scandalous early retirement practices, proper regulation of the media and of political party finances, etc."

http://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/yanis-varoufakis-a-pressing-question-for-ireland-before-monday-s-meeting-on-greece-1.2256339

Mind you, some may wonder what he means when he mentions reforms

Wasn't he democratically elected? Oh yes, he was.

Lostoday was asking you about what you meant by reform, not the Greek minister of finance, unless I misread his post...

I'm truly feeling honoured that so many want to know what I mean by reform.

BTW as the lost one asked about reforms and I mention that Yanis seems to think the same about reforms I think the answer is given.

Oh, about that democratically elected part, it would seem the Greek population was sold the idea of becoming rich (again) with the richer part of Europe footing the bill. Of course when Greece goes bankrupt they may wonder about their democratic choice of castles in the sky.

So, Yanis answered for me. Reforms should be clear now.

[baboon]

I (think I) found a like minded soul who may just be the right man to drive through my 'build-up from scratch' program, The current Greek Minister of Finance Yanis Varoufakis. In an interesting opinion piece he stated

"No, what Greece now needs desperately is serious, proper reforms. We need a new tax system that helps defeat evasion and curtail political or corporate interference, a corruption-free procurement system, business-friendly licensing procedures, judicial reforms, elimination of scandalous early retirement practices, proper regulation of the media and of political party finances, etc."

http://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/yanis-varoufakis-a-pressing-question-for-ireland-before-monday-s-meeting-on-greece-1.2256339

Mind you, some may wonder what he means when he mentions reforms

Wasn't he democratically elected? Oh yes, he was.

Lostoday was asking you about what you meant by reform, not the Greek minister of finance, unless I misread his post...

I'm truly feeling honoured that so many want to know what I mean by reform.

BTW as the lost one asked about reforms and I mention that Yanis seems to think the same about reforms I think the answer is given.

Oh, about that democratically elected part, it would seem the Greek population was sold the idea of becoming rich (again) with the richer part of Europe footing the bill. Of course when Greece goes bankrupt they may wonder about their democratic choice of castles in the sky.

So, Yanis answered for me. Reforms should be clear now.

What is clear is your answering the question by pointing at someone else and saying 'What he said'. You couldn't or wouldn't answer the question yourself, nor will you ever in case you need to weasel yourself out of a tricky situation in the future when someone calls you out again. Edited June 21, 2015 by baboon

[GinBoy2]

I (think I) found a like minded soul who may just be the right man to drive through my 'build-up from scratch' program, The current Greek Minister of Finance Yanis Varoufakis. In an interesting opinion piece he stated

"No, what Greece now needs desperately is serious, proper reforms. We need a new tax system that helps defeat evasion and curtail political or corporate interference, a corruption-free procurement system, business-friendly licensing procedures, judicial reforms, elimination of scandalous early retirement practices, proper regulation of the media and of political party finances, etc."

http://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/yanis-varoufakis-a-pressing-question-for-ireland-before-monday-s-meeting-on-greece-1.2256339

Mind you, some may wonder what he means when he mentions reforms

Wasn't he democratically elected? Oh yes, he was.

Lostoday was asking you about what you meant by reform, not the Greek minister of finance, unless I misread his post...

I'm truly feeling honoured that so many want to know what I mean by reform.

BTW as the lost one asked about reforms and I mention that Yanis seems to think the same about reforms I think the answer is given.

Oh, about that democratically elected part, it would seem the Greek population was sold the idea of becoming rich (again) with the richer part of Europe footing the bill. Of course when Greece goes bankrupt they may wonder about their democratic choice of castles in the sky.

So, Yanis answered for me. Reforms should be clear now.

They may well ponder the foolishness of their electoral choices.

I also wonder however if you would deem them suitable for a coup and a return to military rule, they have a history after all, and clearly the electorate are buffoons incapable of making the correct decisions?

Maybe a good military regime in the midst of EU would be a good idea to focus the opinions of some of the more 'forceful' commentators to this forum.

Whats good for the goose after all.....

[heybruce]

I (think I) found a like minded soul who may just be the right man to drive through my 'build-up from scratch' program, The current Greek Minister of Finance Yanis Varoufakis. In an interesting opinion piece he stated

"No, what Greece now needs desperately is serious, proper reforms. We need a new tax system that helps defeat evasion and curtail political or corporate interference, a corruption-free procurement system, business-friendly licensing procedures, judicial reforms, elimination of scandalous early retirement practices, proper regulation of the media and of political party finances, etc."

http://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/yanis-varoufakis-a-pressing-question-for-ireland-before-monday-s-meeting-on-greece-1.2256339

Mind you, some may wonder what he means when he mentions reforms

I think Thailand's media needs less regulation, not more, and I can't comment on Thailand's retirement system since I don't know anyone who benefits from it. I think all the other reforms above benefit Thailand, however I don't see the junta implementing any of them. I also don't see the reform enthusiasts specifying the reforms they want--Suthep called for unspecified reforms and TV trolls have been parroting the call ever since.

[city]

Why posters continue to delude themselves that there was/is any 'road map' defies logic. It surely must be obvious by now the true motives for this power seizure, particularly given the prosecution of certain 'non aligned' individuals only, continuing land grabs by the very wealthy (today's BP), opaque high speed train deals, covert plans for destroying the Andaman area of Pak Bara, topped off by the cherry that is haha, the legalising of casinos. How can any of the aforementioned be described as 'reforms'?

Off you go back to your squabbling over sweet s0d all

In full support of this. We will still be completing reforms in 5 years. Remember that odius little man Suthep spouting about 10 years and a few good men. Well the supporters of that anarchist will be glad to know that this junta has still got 9 more years. Prayuth cannot let go of power and return to the barracks because there is no measures he can put in place that could even stop a pig, with lipstick and a red shirt romping the next election. Even if he curtailed most of the power of a populist government with the Senate, eventually thais will stand up and be counted. Welcome to the future of Thailand.....The future is Khaki.

I understand the forum rules but at what point, if my prediction is correct, is it acceptable to refer to him as d.......

Edited June 21, 2015 by city

[city]

Who are they kidding. The new "Charter" is a blatant attempt at a power grab by the elite whereby key positions wouldn't be directly elected by the people.

Okay, so give all the Thai peoples a vote , and, What will they do..... Sell it to the highest bidder... Are you going to tell me that you believe Thai peoples who blatantly sell their very valuable vote, Are you going to tell me that those same peoples deserve a vote..? They have exactly what they deserve... A Military Junta... and luckily for them , what seems to be a caring one.... Lucky for us Farangs if we don't like it we can close the door behind us... But, as I see the countries infrastructure functioning better now than ever in my thirteen years of living in Thailand, I see happy peoples still working and still smiling, I see happy children still getting to school.... I see trains running, busses running, I see internal investment up and up... What I don't see are corrupt politicians with their noses deep in the trough of taxpayers moneys.... What did John Lennon say...."Give peace a chance"....... Stupid Farangs should keep their noses out of Thai business... and ...Give peace a chance...!! Pass a Chang please...

Your honor ! this person is a male chicken....ban coming

[djjamie]

Why posters continue to delude themselves that there was/is any 'road map' defies logic. It surely must be obvious by now the true motives for this power seizure, particularly given the prosecution of certain 'non aligned' individuals only, continuing land grabs by the very wealthy (today's BP), opaque high speed train deals, covert plans for destroying the Andaman area of Pak Bara, topped off by the cherry that is haha, the legalising of casinos. How can any of the aforementioned be described as 'reforms'?

Off you go back to your squabbling over sweet s0d all

In full support of this. We will still be completing reforms in 5 years. Remember that odius little man Suthep spouting about 10 years and a few good men. Well the supporters of that anarchist will be glad to know that this junta has still got 9 more years. Prayuth cannot let go of power and return to the barracks because there is no measures he can put in place that could even stop a pig, with lipstick and a red shirt romping the next election. Even if he curtailed most of the power of a populist government with the Senate, eventually thais will stand up and be counted. Welcome to the future of Thailand.....The future is Khaki.

I understand the forum rules but at what point, if my prediction is correct, is it acceptable to refer to him as d.......

I understand the forum rules but at what point, if my prediction is correct, is it acceptable to refer to him as d.......

As a dedicated leader? Straight away if you like.

With the backing of the majority (not the 7% majority you refer too using beliefs)

Bitter and twisted my friend.

​Helping the poor is seen as populism yet he won't win a single vote from it, yet when the PTP did it it was defended as sustainable policy by you and your ilk.

I understand forum rules too and you are free to express your opinion. An opinion which is free to be expressed against the very grain that you argue.

I bet in North Korea you would not be allowed to express your opinion. Under the previous govt people that expressed there opinion where murdered yet under this one they are only arrested and you complain while ignoring the deaths of 30 and 700 injured.

Sounds like a few good men is required because a few bad ones didn't achieve anything expect murder, death, not a single arrest and a free fall economy.

BTW - I have facts and graphs to back this up. You have beliefs and inevitably excuses.

[heybruce]

Why posters continue to delude themselves that there was/is any 'road map' defies logic. It surely must be obvious by now the true motives for this power seizure, particularly given the prosecution of certain 'non aligned' individuals only, continuing land grabs by the very wealthy (today's BP), opaque high speed train deals, covert plans for destroying the Andaman area of Pak Bara, topped off by the cherry that is haha, the legalising of casinos. How can any of the aforementioned be described as 'reforms'?

Off you go back to your squabbling over sweet s0d all

In full support of this. We will still be completing reforms in 5 years. Remember that odius little man Suthep spouting about 10 years and a few good men. Well the supporters of that anarchist will be glad to know that this junta has still got 9 more years. Prayuth cannot let go of power and return to the barracks because there is no measures he can put in place that could even stop a pig, with lipstick and a red shirt romping the next election. Even if he curtailed most of the power of a populist government with the Senate, eventually thais will stand up and be counted. Welcome to the future of Thailand.....The future is Khaki.

I understand the forum rules but at what point, if my prediction is correct, is it acceptable to refer to him as d.......

I understand the forum rules but at what point, if my prediction is correct, is it acceptable to refer to him as d.......

As a dedicated leader? Straight away if you like.

With the backing of the majority (not the 7% majority you refer too using beliefs)

Bitter and twisted my friend.

​Helping the poor is seen as populism yet he won't win a single vote from it, yet when the PTP did it it was defended as sustainable policy by you and your ilk.

I understand forum rules too and you are free to express your opinion. An opinion which is free to be expressed against the very grain that you argue.

I bet in North Korea you would not be allowed to express your opinion. Under the previous govt people that expressed there opinion where murdered yet under this one they are only arrested and you complain while ignoring the deaths of 30 and 700 injured.

Sounds like a few good men is required because a few bad ones didn't achieve anything expect murder, death, not a single arrest and a free fall economy.

BTW - I have facts and graphs to back this up. You have beliefs and inevitably excuses.

Do show us your facts and graphs. I especially want to see the facts that support your often posted but never explained 7% number. This should be fun.

Edited June 21, 2015 by heybruce

[rubl]

The interesting aspect with post here is that some keep on asking for details on reforms only to reject or denigrate whatever is provided.

In the mean time to most detailed part (in the draft charter) is rejected as being Suthep's or the PDRC's ideas.

All in all even Thai can't agree on much. I'm afraid my suggestion of "build up from scratch" may still come to fruit, bring in the UN.

[rubl]

I (think I) found a like minded soul who may just be the right man to drive through my 'build-up from scratch' program, The current Greek Minister of Finance Yanis Varoufakis. In an interesting opinion piece he stated

"No, what Greece now needs desperately is serious, proper reforms. We need a new tax system that helps defeat evasion and curtail political or corporate interference, a corruption-free procurement system, business-friendly licensing procedures, judicial reforms, elimination of scandalous early retirement practices, proper regulation of the media and of political party finances, etc."

http://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/yanis-varoufakis-a-pressing-question-for-ireland-before-monday-s-meeting-on-greece-1.2256339

Mind you, some may wonder what he means when he mentions reforms

Wasn't he democratically elected? Oh yes, he was.

Lostoday was asking you about what you meant by reform, not the Greek minister of finance, unless I misread his post...

I'm truly feeling honoured that so many want to know what I mean by reform.

BTW as the lost one asked about reforms and I mention that Yanis seems to think the same about reforms I think the answer is given.

Oh, about that democratically elected part, it would seem the Greek population was sold the idea of becoming rich (again) with the richer part of Europe footing the bill. Of course when Greece goes bankrupt they may wonder about their democratic choice of castles in the sky.

So, Yanis answered for me. Reforms should be clear now.

They may well ponder the foolishness of their electoral choices.

I also wonder however if you would deem them suitable for a coup and a return to military rule, they have a history after all, and clearly the electorate are buffoons incapable of making the correct decisions?

Maybe a good military regime in the midst of EU would be a good idea to focus the opinions of some of the more 'forceful' commentators to this forum.

Whats good for the goose after all.....

Tjeez, I must disagree.

Since when is Greece in the midst of Europe ?

[lostoday]

The interesting aspect with post here is that some keep on asking for details on reforms only to reject or denigrate whatever is provided.

In the mean time to most detailed part (in the draft charter) is rejected as being Suthep's or the PDRC's ideas.

All in all even Thai can't agree on much. I'm afraid my suggestion of "build up from scratch" may still come to fruit, bring in the UN.

I've posted 5 or 6 reforms from the draft charter asking for your opinion on them with no success. A couple of posters gave their opinion but you were significant by your absence.

Thailand would never accept the UN writing a constitution; the UN does not have that big an Army.

[djjamie]

Why posters continue to delude themselves that there was/is any 'road map' defies logic. It surely must be obvious by now the true motives for this power seizure, particularly given the prosecution of certain 'non aligned' individuals only, continuing land grabs by the very wealthy (today's BP), opaque high speed train deals, covert plans for destroying the Andaman area of Pak Bara, topped off by the cherry that is haha, the legalising of casinos. How can any of the aforementioned be described as 'reforms'?

Off you go back to your squabbling over sweet s0d all

In full support of this. We will still be completing reforms in 5 years. Remember that odius little man Suthep spouting about 10 years and a few good men. Well the supporters of that anarchist will be glad to know that this junta has still got 9 more years. Prayuth cannot let go of power and return to the barracks because there is no measures he can put in place that could even stop a pig, with lipstick and a red shirt romping the next election. Even if he curtailed most of the power of a populist government with the Senate, eventually thais will stand up and be counted. Welcome to the future of Thailand.....The future is Khaki.

I understand the forum rules but at what point, if my prediction is correct, is it acceptable to refer to him as d.......

I understand the forum rules but at what point, if my prediction is correct, is it acceptable to refer to him as d.......

As a dedicated leader? Straight away if you like.

With the backing of the majority (not the 7% majority you refer too using beliefs)

Bitter and twisted my friend.

​Helping the poor is seen as populism yet he won't win a single vote from it, yet when the PTP did it it was defended as sustainable policy by you and your ilk.

I understand forum rules too and you are free to express your opinion. An opinion which is free to be expressed against the very grain that you argue.

I bet in North Korea you would not be allowed to express your opinion. Under the previous govt people that expressed there opinion where murdered yet under this one they are only arrested and you complain while ignoring the deaths of 30 and 700 injured.

Sounds like a few good men is required because a few bad ones didn't achieve anything expect murder, death, not a single arrest and a free fall economy.

BTW - I have facts and graphs to back this up. You have beliefs and inevitably excuses.

Do show us your facts and graphs. I especially want to see the facts that support your often posted but never explained 7% number. This should be fun.

I have shown graphs, facts, tourist statistics, links (not blogs or opinions) and all have been denounced with me being attacked and belittled followed with a rebuttal that "My mate stayed at a hotel and the room next door was empty so tourist numbers are down despite your facts"

I could prove to you the sky was blue and if it did not suit the red agenda you would argue otherwise.

You cannot argue with idiots mate especially the 7% radical fundamentalists.

Facts been nothing to you and what ever I show will be dismissed yet your beliefs have to be respected apparently.

EDIT- I have not given this award out recently, but you deserve it.

Congratulations my dear friend.

Edited June 21, 2015 by djjamie

[rubl]

The interesting aspect with post here is that some keep on asking for details on reforms only to reject or denigrate whatever is provided.

In the mean time to most detailed part (in the draft charter) is rejected as being Suthep's or the PDRC's ideas.

All in all even Thai can't agree on much. I'm afraid my suggestion of "build up from scratch" may still come to fruit, bring in the UN.

I've posted 5 or 6 reforms from the draft charter asking for your opinion on them with no success. A couple of posters gave their opinion but you were significant by your absence.

Thailand would never accept the UN writing a constitution; the UN does not have that big an Army.

I have mentioned a few reforms which come to my mind, but they keep being cut down, ridiculed, treated as a failure.

It has been suggested that confidential source gossiped about me regarding the reforms.

And suddenly you want me to get serious?

[lostoday]

The interesting aspect with post here is that some keep on asking for details on reforms only to reject or denigrate whatever is provided.

In the mean time to most detailed part (in the draft charter) is rejected as being Suthep's or the PDRC's ideas.

All in all even Thai can't agree on much. I'm afraid my suggestion of "build up from scratch" may still come to fruit, bring in the UN.

I've posted 5 or 6 reforms from the draft charter asking for your opinion on them with no success. A couple of posters gave their opinion but you were significant by your absence.

Thailand would never accept the UN writing a constitution; the UN does not have that big an Army.

I have mentioned a few reforms which come to my mind, but they keep being cut down, ridiculed, treated as a failure.

It has been suggested that confidential source gossiped about me regarding the reforms.

And suddenly you want me to get serious?

You have not mentioned or discussed any reforms proposed in the draft constitution. Get real. Serious? I don't care. Real? Of course this not a fantasy discussion.

You wrote, "The interesting aspect with post here is that some keep on asking for details on reforms only to reject or denigrate whatever is provided."

That is an absolute falsehood. The only person denigrating posters, posting reforms is you.

​You think it is humorous to tell Thailand everything they have done for the past 70 years is worthless and they have to start over from scratch?

Edited June 21, 2015 by lostoday

[rubl]

The interesting aspect with post here is that some keep on asking for details on reforms only to reject or denigrate whatever is provided.

In the mean time to most detailed part (in the draft charter) is rejected as being Suthep's or the PDRC's ideas.

All in all even Thai can't agree on much. I'm afraid my suggestion of "build up from scratch" may still come to fruit, bring in the UN.

I've posted 5 or 6 reforms from the draft charter asking for your opinion on them with no success. A couple of posters gave their opinion but you were significant by your absence.

Thailand would never accept the UN writing a constitution; the UN does not have that big an Army.

I have mentioned a fe reforms which come to my mind, but they keep being cut down, ridiculed, treated as a failure.

It has been suggested that confidential source gossiped about me regarding the reforms.

And suddenly you want me to get serious?

You have not mentioned or discussed any reforms proposed in the draft constitution. Get real. Serious? I don't care. Real? Of course this not a fantasy discussion.

You wrote, "The interesting aspect with post here is that some keep on asking for details on reforms only to reject or denigrate whatever is provided."

That is an absolute falsehood. The only person denigrating posters, posting reforms is you.

​You think it is humorous to tell Thailand everything they have done for the past 70 years is worthless and they have to start over from scratch?

Report me to the mods. Tell them about your confidential sources on me. I'm sure they'll be interested.

[lostoday]

I've posted 5 or 6 reforms from the draft charter asking for your opinion on them with no success. A couple of posters gave their opinion but you were significant by your absence.

Thailand would never accept the UN writing a constitution; the UN does not have that big an Army.

I have mentioned a fe reforms which come to my mind, but they keep being cut down, ridiculed, treated as a failure.

It has been suggested that confidential source gossiped about me regarding the reforms.

And suddenly you want me to get serious?

You have not mentioned or discussed any reforms proposed in the draft constitution. Get real. Serious? I don't care. Real? Of course this not a fantasy discussion.

You wrote, "The interesting aspect with post here is that some keep on asking for details on reforms only to reject or denigrate whatever is provided."

That is an absolute falsehood. The only person denigrating posters, posting reforms is you.

​You think it is humorous to tell Thailand everything they have done for the past 70 years is worthless and they have to start over from scratch?

Report me to the mods. Tell them about your confidential sources on me. I'm sure they'll be interested.

Most posters have no problems discussing the reforms as suggested in the draft constitution and that is an important part of this thread if not the most important part of the thread. Your contribution so far as I can remember is to start all Thai law over from scratch and reform education. Both ideas off topic and impossible to discuss

[heybruce]

In full support of this. We will still be completing reforms in 5 years. Remember that odius little man Suthep spouting about 10 years and a few good men. Well the supporters of that anarchist will be glad to know that this junta has still got 9 more years. Prayuth cannot let go of power and return to the barracks because there is no measures he can put in place that could even stop a pig, with lipstick and a red shirt romping the next election. Even if he curtailed most of the power of a populist government with the Senate, eventually thais will stand up and be counted. Welcome to the future of Thailand.....The future is Khaki.

I understand the forum rules but at what point, if my prediction is correct, is it acceptable to refer to him as d.......

I understand the forum rules but at what point, if my prediction is correct, is it acceptable to refer to him as d.......

As a dedicated leader? Straight away if you like.

With the backing of the majority (not the 7% majority you refer too using beliefs)

Bitter and twisted my friend.

​Helping the poor is seen as populism yet he won't win a single vote from it, yet when the PTP did it it was defended as sustainable policy by you and your ilk.

I understand forum rules too and you are free to express your opinion. An opinion which is free to be expressed against the very grain that you argue.

I bet in North Korea you would not be allowed to express your opinion. Under the previous govt people that expressed there opinion where murdered yet under this one they are only arrested and you complain while ignoring the deaths of 30 and 700 injured.

Sounds like a few good men is required because a few bad ones didn't achieve anything expect murder, death, not a single arrest and a free fall economy.

BTW - I have facts and graphs to back this up. You have beliefs and inevitably excuses.

Do show us your facts and graphs. I especially want to see the facts that support your often posted but never explained 7% number. This should be fun.

I have shown graphs, facts, tourist statistics, links (not blogs or opinions) and all have been denounced with me being attacked and belittled followed with a rebuttal that "My mate stayed at a hotel and the room next door was empty so tourist numbers are down despite your facts"

I could prove to you the sky was blue and if it did not suit the red agenda you would argue otherwise.

You cannot argue with idiots mate especially the 7% radical fundamentalists.

Facts been nothing to you and what ever I show will be dismissed yet your beliefs have to be respected apparently.

EDIT- I have not given this award out recently, but you deserve it.

Congratulations my dear friend.

As I recall, your "facts" are typically off-topic quotes from years past, made in an attempt to divert attention from the topic at hand. Now you are attempting to divert a topic about reforms before elections by claiming to have facts you won't provide. Are these facts about reforms or elections? If so, please provide them.

I couldn't resist challenging you to provide the facts since I, and many others, would love to learn where the 7% figure that comes up in all your posts comes from. As expected, you've provided nothing.

[djjamie]

I understand the forum rules but at what point, if my prediction is correct, is it acceptable to refer to him as d.......

As a dedicated leader? Straight away if you like.

With the backing of the majority (not the 7% majority you refer too using beliefs)

Bitter and twisted my friend.

​Helping the poor is seen as populism yet he won't win a single vote from it, yet when the PTP did it it was defended as sustainable policy by you and your ilk.

I understand forum rules too and you are free to express your opinion. An opinion which is free to be expressed against the very grain that you argue.

I bet in North Korea you would not be allowed to express your opinion. Under the previous govt people that expressed there opinion where murdered yet under this one they are only arrested and you complain while ignoring the deaths of 30 and 700 injured.

Sounds like a few good men is required because a few bad ones didn't achieve anything expect murder, death, not a single arrest and a free fall economy.

BTW - I have facts and graphs to back this up. You have beliefs and inevitably excuses.

Do show us your facts and graphs. I especially want to see the facts that support your often posted but never explained 7% number. This should be fun.

I have shown graphs, facts, tourist statistics, links (not blogs or opinions) and all have been denounced with me being attacked and belittled followed with a rebuttal that "My mate stayed at a hotel and the room next door was empty so tourist numbers are down despite your facts"

I could prove to you the sky was blue and if it did not suit the red agenda you would argue otherwise.

You cannot argue with idiots mate especially the 7% radical fundamentalists.

Facts been nothing to you and what ever I show will be dismissed yet your beliefs have to be respected apparently.

EDIT- I have not given this award out recently, but you deserve it.

Congratulations my dear friend.

As I recall, your "facts" are typically off-topic quotes from years past, made in an attempt to divert attention from the topic at hand. Now you are attempting to divert a topic about reforms before elections by claiming to have facts you won't provide. Are these facts about reforms or elections? If so, please provide them.

I couldn't resist challenging you to provide the facts since I, and many others, would love to learn where the 7% figure that comes up in all your posts comes from. As expected, you've provided nothing.

Can't really grasp what I said hey? Do you understand what I said at least about the tourist numbers example or will you ignore that as well to try to look good in front of your peers? You know, the hotel room example? that one can't be rebutted so ignore that and try another approach hey.

I will try again.

I have shown graphs, facts, tourist statistics, links (not blogs or opinions) and all have been denounced with me being attacked and belittled followed with a rebuttal that "My mate stayed at a hotel and the room next door was empty so tourist numbers are down despite your facts"

If you don't know the 7% figure due to a lack of memory recall I pity you.

I could say the sky was blue, but if Jatuporn said it was green you would ague it.

I said the 2007 referendum was legitimate and your ilk stated it was a forced vote. I had facts to prove my case. Your ilk denounced them, threw in a little condescension against me and stated beliefs.

Welcome to the award that not many get.

Congrats.

[heybruce]

Do show us your facts and graphs. I especially want to see the facts that support your often posted but never explained 7% number. This should be fun.

I have shown graphs, facts, tourist statistics, links (not blogs or opinions) and all have been denounced with me being attacked and belittled followed with a rebuttal that "My mate stayed at a hotel and the room next door was empty so tourist numbers are down despite your facts"

I could prove to you the sky was blue and if it did not suit the red agenda you would argue otherwise.

You cannot argue with idiots mate especially the 7% radical fundamentalists.

Facts been nothing to you and what ever I show will be dismissed yet your beliefs have to be respected apparently.

EDIT- I have not given this award out recently, but you deserve it.

Congratulations my dear friend.

As I recall, your "facts" are typically off-topic quotes from years past, made in an attempt to divert attention from the topic at hand. Now you are attempting to divert a topic about reforms before elections by claiming to have facts you won't provide. Are these facts about reforms or elections? If so, please provide them.

I couldn't resist challenging you to provide the facts since I, and many others, would love to learn where the 7% figure that comes up in all your posts comes from. As expected, you've provided nothing.

Can't really grasp what I said hey? Do you understand what I said at least about the tourist numbers example or will you ignore that as well to try to look good in front of your peers? You know, the hotel room example? that one can't be rebutted so ignore that and try another approach hey.

I will try again.

I have shown graphs, facts, tourist statistics, links (not blogs or opinions) and all have been denounced with me being attacked and belittled followed with a rebuttal that "My mate stayed at a hotel and the room next door was empty so tourist numbers are down despite your facts"

If you don't know the 7% figure due to a lack of memory recall I pity you.

I could say the sky was blue, but if Jatuporn said it was green you would ague it.

I said the 2007 referendum was legitimate and your ilk stated it was a forced vote. I had facts to prove my case. Your ilk denounced them, threw in a little condescension against me and stated beliefs.

Welcome to the award that not many get.

Congrats.

Can't really grasp this one, can you?

"As I recall, your "facts" are typically off-topic quotes from years past, made in an attempt to divert attention from the topic at hand. Now you are attempting to divert a topic about reforms before elections by claiming to have facts you won't provide. Are these facts about reforms or elections? If so, please provide them."

My facts to support this claim are in your post above; what do your tourism numbers have to do with this topic about reforms and elections?

BTW, if I remember correctly your 7% number was some of the BS put out by the Thai Researchers in Community Happiness Association, a propaganda organization so obvious even the junta abandoned it. http://asiancorrespondent.com/126917/why-are-some-opinion-poll-results-so-positive-of-the-thai-junta/

If that is incorrect, please provide the correct source. Don't claim to have facts if you won't or can't provide them.

[djjamie]

As I recall, your "facts" are typically off-topic quotes from years past, made in an attempt to divert attention from the topic at hand. Now you are attempting to divert a topic about reforms before elections by claiming to have facts you won't provide. Are these facts about reforms or elections? If so, please provide them.

I couldn't resist challenging you to provide the facts since I, and many others, would love to learn where the 7% figure that comes up in all your posts comes from. As expected, you've provided nothing.

Can't really grasp what I said hey? Do you understand what I said at least about the tourist numbers example or will you ignore that as well to try to look good in front of your peers? You know, the hotel room example? that one can't be rebutted so ignore that and try another approach hey.

I will try again.

I have shown graphs, facts, tourist statistics, links (not blogs or opinions) and all have been denounced with me being attacked and belittled followed with a rebuttal that "My mate stayed at a hotel and the room next door was empty so tourist numbers are down despite your facts"

If you don't know the 7% figure due to a lack of memory recall I pity you.

I could say the sky was blue, but if Jatuporn said it was green you would ague it.

I said the 2007 referendum was legitimate and your ilk stated it was a forced vote. I had facts to prove my case. Your ilk denounced them, threw in a little condescension against me and stated beliefs.

Welcome to the award that not many get.

Congrats.

Can't really grasp this one, can you?

"As I recall, your "facts" are typically off-topic quotes from years past, made in an attempt to divert attention from the topic at hand. Now you are attempting to divert a topic about reforms before elections by claiming to have facts you won't provide. Are these facts about reforms or elections? If so, please provide them."

My facts to support this claim are in your post above; what do your tourism numbers have to do with this topic about reforms and elections?

BTW, if I remember correctly your 7% number was some of the BS put out by the Thai Researchers in Community Happiness Association, a propaganda organization so obvious even the junta abandoned it. http://asiancorrespondent.com/126917/why-are-some-opinion-poll-results-so-positive-of-the-thai-junta/

If that is incorrect, please provide the correct source. Don't claim to have facts if you won't or can't provide them.

This is like dejavu!

Can't really grasp what I said hey? Do you understand what I said at least about the tourist numbers example or will you ignore that as well to try to look good in front of your peers? You know, the hotel room example? that one can't be rebutted so ignore that and try another approach hey.

I will try again.

I have shown graphs, facts, tourist statistics, links (not blogs or opinions) and all have been denounced with me being attacked and belittled followed with a rebuttal that "My mate stayed at a hotel and the room next door was empty so tourist numbers are down despite your facts"

If you don't know the 7% figure due to a lack of memory recall I pity you.

[ExPratt]

As I recall, your "facts" are typically off-topic quotes from years past, made in an attempt to divert attention from the topic at hand. Now you are attempting to divert a topic about reforms before elections by claiming to have facts you won't provide. Are these facts about reforms or elections? If so, please provide them.

I couldn't resist challenging you to provide the facts since I, and many others, would love to learn where the 7% figure that comes up in all your posts comes from. As expected, you've provided nothing.

Can't really grasp what I said hey? Do you understand what I said at least about the tourist numbers example or will you ignore that as well to try to look good in front of your peers? You know, the hotel room example? that one can't be rebutted so ignore that and try another approach hey.

I will try again.

I have shown graphs, facts, tourist statistics, links (not blogs or opinions) and all have been denounced with me being attacked and belittled followed with a rebuttal that "My mate stayed at a hotel and the room next door was empty so tourist numbers are down despite your facts"

If you don't know the 7% figure due to a lack of memory recall I pity you.

I could say the sky was blue, but if Jatuporn said it was green you would ague it.

I said the 2007 referendum was legitimate and your ilk stated it was a forced vote. I had facts to prove my case. Your ilk denounced them, threw in a little condescension against me and stated beliefs.

Welcome to the award that not many get.

Congrats.

Can't really grasp this one, can you?

"As I recall, your "facts" are typically off-topic quotes from years past, made in an attempt to divert attention from the topic at hand. Now you are attempting to divert a topic about reforms before elections by claiming to have facts you won't provide. Are these facts about reforms or elections? If so, please provide them."

My facts to support this claim are in your post above; what do your tourism numbers have to do with this topic about reforms and elections?

BTW, if I remember correctly your 7% number was some of the BS put out by the Thai Researchers in Community Happiness Association, a propaganda organization so obvious even the junta abandoned it. http://asiancorrespondent.com/126917/why-are-some-opinion-poll-results-so-positive-of-the-thai-junta/

If that is incorrect, please provide the correct source. Don't claim to have facts if you won't or can't provide them.

This is like dejavu!

Can't really grasp what I said hey? Do you understand what I said at least about the tourist numbers example or will you ignore that as well to try to look good in front of your peers? You know, the hotel room example? that one can't be rebutted so ignore that and try another approach hey.

I will try again.

I have shown graphs, facts, tourist statistics, links (not blogs or opinions) and all have been denounced with me being attacked and belittled followed with a rebuttal that "My mate stayed at a hotel and the room next door was empty so tourist numbers are down despite your facts"

If you don't know the 7% figure due to a lack of memory recall I pity you.

Lying again are we Big Boy ?a few of us said the Resorts were empty back in April which Many were. The stuff you keep making up and churning out regardless of reasoned argument leads me to believe you should seriously consider being checked out for Tourettes Syndrome