Beef Cattle Feed Options

[Walter Riley]

Hello everyone. This is my first post on TV. I have started my own beef cattle feedlot operation in Khorat Province, Amphur Si kiew, Nong Bua Noi. Currently we have 12 cattle. They are Thai x Brahman Bulls in both white and red. They all weight about 200kgs each. My Thai wife and I are living in Sydney, Australia and we are running this from here. So far my wife’s family have been great. It was a bit difficult at the start for them to let me make all of the decisions but they are more relaxed now. The cattle are happy and putting on weight with the current feeding schedule.

Currently our feed is comprised of Lucerne (Gatin) which we turn into chaff, this is harvested from random locations in the area. It’s not exactly free due to the fuel needed for the chopping machine and the pickup but it’s by far my most cost effective feed .We have a large crop of Napier grass . The only feed we buy in is Hominy meal from the corn chopping process. We pay 2.5 baht per kilo, we buy it unbagged in the back of the pickup; it has 11% protein and 14.0% energy. We also have a few bags of cattle pellet feed which is 16% protein at 7 baht per kg is very expensive but we only use 1 kg per day total, it’s just to attract the cattle to feed. We have tried using dried cassava peel for 0.7 baht per kg , but when I did the research on the nutritional composition is just wasn’t worth it .

I would like to reduce the workload on my wife’s parents or if they become ill I am not stuck without feed. We have access to a pickup and a 10 tonne truck .Is there anybody that could suggest some alternative feeds that are available in this area or surrounding provinces? Current prices and nutrient contents such as protein and energy content would be great. Contact details of the seller would be even better. Any information would be most appreciated.

Cheers

[kickstart]

Hi

And welcomb, I rear a few beef cattle, beef cows rearing calves,we sell on the calves at about 1 year old.

We feed Gratin and have done for some years and we make silage out of Napier grass,being short of land we like napier as we can get 3 cuts a year we make silage in bags.

We live in a big dairy area and have brewers grains ,which i like ,but with a DM of 28% they is a lot of water but with22% protine and a ME of 10.2, at 2 bart a kg I think thay are worth I feed a home mix conentrart it says 14 % ,on the bag but i have my doubts at 7 bart kg it dose us.

So far our cows have calved 2- 4 months come on heat so far got a 75% conception rate so must be doing some thing right.

Your diaet is not so far from mine,our gratin ,we cut ,do not chop it , and just feed it whole, and collect the brantches after ,our feed barriers aer not very good and we do get some puulled though onto the ground and trampled on but not a lot wasted ,I collect the eaten brantches and take them up the field and burn them,a lot of farmers think we chop the gratin,we colud, but time is the big factor for us you could try it would save you a big job,that is ,if you can dispose of the brantches afterwards.

Cattle pellets at 7 bart /kg for 16 % protine is not dear,round here they go up to 10-11 bart a kg,and meney years ago I got some tested protin was 16 % but the ME was only 11 -11.5 not a great quolity concentraty.

Wh

[kickstart]

Having a bad hair day, again,hit the wrong button ,again,not checked the spelling/gramer ,again,well >delighted<.,again.

What is hominy meal ? at 2.5 bart / kg 11% protein 14 % energy,that sound too good to be true, if it is what I think it is about 7% protein ,and the energy 10%?

You are right about cassava peel not a good feed same as cassava waste, protein 1.9% with a low DM,Thai's like it as it is cheap

.

It is all right buying in feeds, but that is a cost,how much land do you have, can you put down some grazing grass and graze the cattle,some good quality grass will be cheaper to produce than buying in feed.

Napier grass is good, but a lot of work,as we know ,do some costings on making silage you are halfway there ,as you already have a chopper get some local labour in to do it,guy near here had a gang in and payed them perrie ,no extras, good for working out a budget.for the best quality silage, cut the grass every 60 days,no more.

You live in a big dairy area,Si kiew, Pachong, can you get hold of some brewers grains? most come from Bkk or Ayutare, Heineken have a brewery in Kon Ken,(Gut-Bier) in Thai

A diet of !4% concentrate, brewers grains, napier grass silage, especially for the dry season, and Gratin ,at 22% protein it is a good feed, and some grazed grass, the cattle should put on weight.

Yours .

KS

[farmerjo]

Hi Walter,

How many kilo's of food per cow per day you feeding?

Could you give a little molasses and baled rice straw with your high protien food to ease the families workload.

When i used to hand cut luceed and guniea,as fast as i could cut it and throw into the yard they would eat it.

[Michael Hare]

There are better grasses than Napier grass available in Thailand and they can be grown from seed. Grasses like Mulato II and Mombasa guinea have good protein levels (11-15% depending on management), are perennial and can be cut 6-7 times per year. They make better silage than stemmy Napier grass. Depending on how much land is available one can grow a tropical legume, Ubon stylo, which has protein levels of 15-18%. This must be feed fresh.

Leucaena (kratin) is a superior tree legume but surprisingly, while it seems to grow well in waste areas, up hillsides and along roadsides, it invariably fails to grow well in northeast Thailand when planted in a field.

[Jotham79]

Could you give me the contact info of the place where you get your hominy meal? I am getting corn sweepings from a place near here (Petchabun) and it costs 5 baht a kg and probably only has about 7% protein.

thanks

5

[Walter Riley]

Kickstart

Thanks for the info about your own operation. Maybe the pellets we are buying are cheaper because the owner is a relative. Are there such things a dried brewer’s grain available? because I don’t think we have the storage available for wet products. Hominy Meal is a blend of corn bran, floury endosperm, produced during corn milling. It looks similar to cracked corn, but its missing the germ .I think we get it from some type of small operator that goes to a farmers crop and cuts their corn from the cobb on site and its screened and separated . But I am only telling you what they tell me , I have never actually been there .I am only using the data from internet searches of similar products in Australia, but your data is probably more accurate than mine .Currently there is no extra land to plant anymore crops for our own use. Do you have any data of your own on prices of grass straw, king grass, and cassava chips? Because I have seen them mentioned on other threads but I don’t have any current nutritional data or prices to work with. Once I know of some different feed options I can tell the family to purchase it and see if it works for us.

Farmerjo

Each animal currently eats 12kg per day (as fed) total ration. 4 kg of corn and 8kg of Lucerne chaff and some Napier grass on top .Half in the morning and half in the afternoon. They have access to unlimited fresh water and have a salt/mineral lick .My target daily weight gain is 1.8kg per animal. The molasses sounds like a reasonable idea. How do you purchase and store molasses? In a plastic drum or some type of container?

Jotham79

I will attempt to gain some contact details for you, but no promises. From what I know is that the people don’t sell the product from a shop of any kind. My wife’s cousin puts the word around to see if anybody is processing corn in the area and goes to them directly.

[farmerjo]

Kickstart

Thanks for the info about your own operation. Maybe the pellets we are buying are cheaper because the owner is a relative. Are there such things a dried brewer’s grain available? because I don’t think we have the storage available for wet products. Hominy Meal is a blend of corn bran, floury endosperm, produced during corn milling. It looks similar to cracked corn, but its missing the germ .I think we get it from some type of small operator that goes to a farmers crop and cuts their corn from the cobb on site and its screened and separated . But I am only telling you what they tell me , I have never actually been there .I am only using the data from internet searches of similar products in Australia, but your data is probably more accurate than mine .Currently there is no extra land to plant anymore crops for our own use. Do you have any data of your own on prices of grass straw, king grass, and cassava chips? Because I have seen them mentioned on other threads but I don’t have any current nutritional data or prices to work with. Once I know of some different feed options I can tell the family to purchase it and see if it works for us.

Farmerjo

Each animal currently eats 12kg per day (as fed) total ration. 4 kg of corn and 8kg of Lucerne chaff and some Napier grass on top .Half in the morning and half in the afternoon. They have access to unlimited fresh water and have a salt/mineral lick .My target daily weight gain is 1.8kg per animal. The molasses sounds like a reasonable idea. How do you purchase and store molasses? In a plastic drum or some type of container?

Jotham79

I will attempt to gain some contact details for you, but no promises. From what I know is that the people don’t sell the product from a shop of any kind. My wife’s cousin puts the word around to see if anybody is processing corn in the area and goes to them directly.

12kg,ok i wasn't far out,i used to give 10kg but that was guniea and luceed with a lick of molasses first and if they were still hungry got rice straw.

I was lucky to put a kilo a day on them.

Molasses can be purchased from the sugar factories if you have one close by,we used to buy in 20 litre drums,dont know the current price.

Hope this helps.

[Jotham79]

OK, What you are probably getting are corn screenings available almost everywhere they buy and sell corn wholesale. Here is a link:

http://msue.anr.msu.edu/uploads/236/58572/Feeding_Corn_Screenings_to_Cattle.pdf

I have seen several other places that the CP content is lower at about 7-8%. I use 7 % in my calculations because I doubt the quality here is as good. The price here is 5 baht a kg if you go to the mill and pick it up. 2 baht a kg is amazing.

Somewhere near your farm there will be a dairy coop where the dairy farmers can go to sell their milk. That's where I get soybean meal that is 44% protein in 70 kg bags for 1540 baht. I was there today and they had cassava chips for 400+ baht (I couldn't get a good price) a bag (30 kg?) and they had molasses in 20 liter jugs, but I don't know the price.

[Walter Riley]

OK, What you are probably getting are corn screenings available almost everywhere they buy and sell corn wholesale. Here is a link:

http://msue.anr.msu.edu/uploads/236/58572/Feeding_Corn_Screenings_to_Cattle.pdf

I have seen several other places that the CP content is lower at about 7-8%. I use 7 % in my calculations because I doubt the quality here is as good. The price here is 5 baht a kg if you go to the mill and pick it up. 2 baht a kg is amazing.

Somewhere near your farm there will be a dairy coop where the dairy farmers can go to sell their milk. That's where I get soybean meal that is 44% protein in 70 kg bags for 1540 baht. I was there today and they had cassava chips for 400+ baht (I couldn't get a good price) a bag (30 kg?) and they had molasses in 20 liter jugs, but I don't know the price.

Thanks for the advice , this is the type of info i'm looking for

[kickstart]

OK, What you are probably getting are corn screenings available almost everywhere they buy and sell corn wholesale. Here is a link:

http://msue.anr.msu.edu/uploads/236/58572/Feeding_Corn_Screenings_to_Cattle.pdf

I have seen several other places that the CP content is lower at about 7-8%. I use 7 % in my calculations because I doubt the quality here is as good. The price here is 5 baht a kg if you go to the mill and pick it up. 2 baht a kg is amazing.

Somewhere near your farm there will be a dairy coop where the dairy farmers can go to sell their milk. That's where I get soybean meal that is 44% protein in 70 kg bags for 1540 baht. I was there today and they had cassava chips for 400+ baht (I couldn't get a good price) a bag (30 kg?) and they had molasses in 20 liter jugs, but I don't know the price.

Thanks for the advice , this is the type of info i'm looking for

Corn screenings or what you call it ,was popular round here one guy selling it sent some to one of our feed mills for analyses ,found it was 7% protein,the energy valve or ME, I would put at 9-10 if that, for cattle I would not give it shead space, the small grains pass through cattle undigested,the rest is bealey gut fill round here I think it is 2,50 bart ?kg ,if it was 5 bart Kg ,no one would buy it for the OP I would stop feeding it .

Molosses round here is 7-8 bart /kg ,but we do have a sugar mill near here, so transport would not be high ,but at only 4% protein 75%DM 12,5 ME,I think it is expensive for what it is,

Cassava round here about 9 bart kg ,but again we do produce a lot but at 1.9% protein,low,but the starch /energy value is good,.

Brewers grains,most sellers buy it in bulk and bag it up fresh in to 40 kg bags ,one place near here does it in 50 kg bags we buy it ourselves at 84 bart bag he will deliver at 86 bart /bag 40 kg. it will keep for a few weeks unopened.ask where you are they should be a seller

As for dried brewers grains they are about 9 -10 bart kg not easy to find , have been told that CP likes them for their feed , one local guy, when he has a lot of fresh grains will dry some .

In Si Kiew you are not far from Mortlek,there is a feed mill there,they also sell the raw ingredients to mix your own ration ,I am 50 KM from Mortlec and 3 dairy farmers near to me have the raw ingredients sent and mixed on the farm from them ,they say a 16% ration? costs 10 baht Kg I think the mill is Ra-Char, will check in the morning, they should sell dried brewers grains.

I am going to sell 2 of my bulls ,asking cattle dealers for a price, the price for beef is dropping,they has been a rumor for some time, now it seems true,the OP brought his cattle at the peak of the market , to make any money he will have to do some homework ,which will mean a forage based diet ,I know you are feeding Gratin and Napier ,which does help a lot but, to make any money, even more homework .

Also rice straw is getting expensive now, 30-35 bart/ bale,with the drought on ,it will hit 45 bart/bale.still not a good feed, best as a bit long fiber to help gut digestion.

I think getting a weight gain of 1.8 kg on your ration is a bit optimistic,the breed, is not a Charolais or Angus, the Brahman is a good breed for the tropics,but slower growing, and slower maturing,if they is any Indo Brazil in the breed ,likely,they will not get fat, as in a Charolais,also the confirmation will not be the same.

[teletiger]

The old standby when grass and silage is short...straw bales stacked up with a sprinkling of urea (46-0-0) between each layer and soaked in watery molassas. Cover it up for a couple of weeks and the cattle will let you know when it's done from their bawling.

[Walter Riley]

kickstart

Thanks for the detailed information. I can use all this data for my feed calculator .The cattle industry is a real learning experience for me.

If you were in my position and had 12 of Brahman x Thai bulls weighing 200kgs, what do you see as being the most economical feeding ration for maximum weight gain?

The Nong Bua Noi Cattle market is 700m from my wife’s family home. Their neighbour and personal family friend is the village headman, local cattleman and also the owner of the market and land the market is on. He has personally been with my wife’s parents when each of our cattle has been purchased. So we are very lucky to have him on our side. They just walk the cattle home after the purchase. Our most recent purchase 3 weeks ago was 5 cattle; each animal was 22,600 Baht and approximate live weight of 200kgs.Does that seem reasonable to you?

This is the link to the SEA beef report that I get each month; it details some of the reasons of the current price conditions.

http://seabeefreport.com/2015/06/12/may-market-report-s-e-asia-beef-industry/

cheers

[farmerjo]

Walter,do they or you have scales to weigh the beasts or do you sell and buy on a physical apprasial.

Probably more professional down your way but in the north-east backyard markets it can be a gamble.

[Walter Riley]

Walter,do they or you have scales to weigh the beasts or do you sell and buy on a physical apprasial.

Probably more professional down your way but in the north-east backyard markets it can be a gamble.

Just on physical appearance, of course they all say the cattle is heavier than it is . That's to be expected at a cattle market . They don't have a scale at the market but we have access to one if needed away from the market .

[Walter Riley]

Not my photos , but this is the market .

[farmerjo]

I might be out of turn here,but would it make sense to buy a set of scales and take to market.

Charge those wishing to confirm a weight on purchase a 100 baht a cow,if you get 20 a week thats 8000 a month.

Left field i know.

You buy the cow by the kilo,feed by the kilo and sell by the kilo.

Not for you in particular Walter but all breeders and fatterners.

Good idea or not.

[kickstart]

1.jpg2.jpg4.jpgNot my photos , but this is the market .

In Thai, Dalat-Nut -Woar, cattle market ,dodge places , especially if you do not speak Thai,you must be lucky in having someone to help you.

What would I do? one go with Michael Hare ,and grow some of his grass seed ,contact him at Ubon Forage seeds,he will advice you on the best seed is for you ie,does your land flood,or sit in water after rain,Michael will give you some good advice,you have got the grass are you going to cut and and cart,or do a strip grazing system,or a paddock system.

The grass must be well looked after use 46 0 0 fertilizer about 300 units a year ,if it looks dry put on some water ,.yes ,yet another expense ,do you have any facilities for irrigation .

This year has been a bad year for rain,trying to start a new sward now ,could be difficult, but we must get some rain soon,I would keep up with the gratin,at 22% protein for the leaves it is a good feed.

As for the expensive part ,concentrate ration ( pood Yark,in Thai), difficult, to ,make a ration that will give you the weight gain,at a cost that makes the job feasible,I did a ration once using soya, maize meal, barley/wheat ,it was a good ration high protein and ME,so was the cost bealey feasible ,

I think to get your weight gains,it has to be soya ,and maize meal,maize with a ME of 13.5 it is a good feed ,but at 10-12 bart kg not cheap,again if you can find them brewers grains,and get a bag of minerals do not rely on the blocks they are 99% salt in Si Keiw is a dairy co-op ask for a bag of Or-Sor Kor , อ ส ค, minerals I have been using them for some years without any problems.I will pm you the phone numbers of the place in Mortlec that sell cattle feed raw ingredients,they should sell most feeds ,but the feed analyses might not be the same as your Oz feed calculator, ie in maize sweepings. see whtat they have got and make your ration.

As for fermented rice straw ,I think it was 100 kg of straw 100 kg + molasses 5 kg of urea cover and ferment for 21 days,it is ok pushes the rice straw protein up to about 7% from 4% ok for what it is not cheap and labour intensive.

[Windhorse]

Get a tape measure ... ..(while u in Europe)there quiet good and handy to have

[Walter Riley]

Thanks to everybody that helped with obtaining some feed suggestions and nutritional data . Now I just need to find the ratio that works best for me .Below is some photos of the data from the feed calculator that I am using .It maybe useful to others. I learned that I could scroll to the bottom of the feed options and add my own values and not rely on the preloaded nutritional data . The prices are in Thai Baht not $AUD .

http://www.dpi.nsw.gov.au/agriculture/livestock/nutrition/values/feed-cost-calculator

[Walter Riley]

[kickstart]

You beat me to it,I was going to write the calculation to work out the protein and ME,energy values and DM (dry matter) ,on a cost of the value of a feed ,and not the cost per kg of a food,when I first did it, I found that concentrate and berwers grains where almost the same cost on a ,ME and DM basis quite an eye opener.
Your Lucerne,22% protein,not here,we do not have Lucerne over here,even the best grasses are no more than 14-15 % protein.
91% DM,is that cut and dryed ,no way cut fresh, young Lucerne at say 12% protien would be 25% DM.
You can buy tape mesures for cattle,not over accurate,but not a bad,Giss marketing in bkk sell them ,for the op drive down the freindship highway to Mortlec, Salarburi,shops they sell them. my local shop sells them to.
Op any chances of some photos of the cattle ,when are next over here.
Farmerjo your idea of scales a good idea as cattle bound for chop are sold on weight, and condition.
But, the cattle in the photo are all in truck and pick ups where, they are sold, to weigh them ,would mean unloading them no mean task for some seim- wild Brahmans,then load them back up again ,they will be no cattle races to help load ,just a long lenth of rope, and half a dozon Thai's, pulling on the said rope.

[Walter Riley]

We have been able to find a local supply of dried Brewers Grains for 9 baht per/kg and we are buying whole cassava from a local farm for 5 baht per/kg. Should we cut the cassava up with the chopping machine or just break it into pieces with a knife? Or maybe it doesn’t matter a great deal how it’s presented. We will purchase the cattle vitamin mix for 40 baht per/kg from the farmers co-op in Si kiew.

Also with regards to breeding cattle. What the most cost effective strategy to start a breeding herd? .At what age is best for us to purchase a Brahman heifer and from what I have been reading from the other post we would be best to cross it with an angus making what we call in Australia a “Brangus”.

Do you just call a local vet to supply the bull semen and inseminate it for us or is there another process because surely that’s cheaper than buying an Angus bull.

[streamer]

Lucerne does not grow in Northeast THailand. Family-cut lucerne? I think this means leucaena. Family cut leucaena.

[Walter Riley]

Lucerne does not grow in Northeast THailand. Family-cut lucerne? I think this means leucaena. Family cut leucaena.

Thanks Streamer . Spot on . "Gratin " or Leuceana Leucocephala is correct.

[kickstart]

Glad you have found some dried brewers grains,9 bart kg not a bad price.

The cassava is that fresh? if it is 5 baht /kg that is dear,the season is almost done round here,the bulk buyers where buyit at about 2.30 bart /kg,but if that is delivered, not to bad ,fresh cassava can be poisonous to cattle,but one farm near me feeds it fresh without any problems ,google feeding fresh cassava. best to chop it and dry it for a few days ,then feed it .

It should be chopped into small pieces,cattle when they eat ,do not think ,just eat ,they will eat any large piece of cassava ,try and chew it ,then swallow a big piece ,it gets stuck in they throat, and they choke,my mixed feed I am always finding large pieces of cassava ,I take them out ,and break them down.

The vittem mix I think is unnecessary,the cattle should get all the vitamins from the green feed ,it is minerals they could be short of,as I said a bag of minerals from the Thai/Denmark ,cattle rearing arm ,Or-Sor-Kor,in Thai, 25 kg bag 350 bart,the local co-op will sell it

Cattle breeding,how long is a piece of string?,you could do it the easy way ,just go and buy some in calf heifers,job done,but the beef market prices are still high,but it is dropping( beef imports from India and Australia,coming in to LOS at a prices lower than Thai market prices).,or buy in say year old heifers feed them up and then serve them,a longer , process,you will have to do some calculations as what works out cheaper, rearing your way, and the cost of rearing,labour cost included.

Buying in calf heifers ,where from .do you what pedige , with all the paperwork , expensive ,or Mr Somchai's in calf heifer from down the road ,with no known breeding.,a lot cheaper

We brought in some year old heifers fed them up and severed them ourselves, but, it suits our system.

I agree with Angus bulls being put on heifers ,thay are a small breed ,and easy calving,good for heifers ,and they do well in Thailand,you still will not get your LWG,live weight gain of 1.8 kg/day ,but getting close ,better than only Thai native cattle breeds.

If you brought your local cattle and put an Angus bull on them , that would give you a Brangus .But for you finding Angus semen your local DLD office ,Thai Department of Livestock Development, might have some ,speaking to a local AI man to day ,he has some Angus semen,4 of my cows are in calf to Angus bulls,the semen comes from the USA,Thai farming magazines sell semen ,one we phoned up was up in Chiang Rai ,no good for me in Lopburi,you could do as I did ,buy semen from a cattle breeding company ,then what ,if you can find a local AI man you can trust, to keep the semen ,and pay him for service charges . Or buy a flask keep it on the farm get the local AI man to serve the animal from your own flask, ok but the investment of a flask upwards, of 14 000 bart then keeping it filled with liquid nitrogen ,say a 5 lt flask would need filling once a week ,for you a trip down to the DPO at Mortlec ,Saraburi to fill up,would it be worth it for ,say 10- 15 cows,buying a bull could be an option ,as you said cost of reaing would it be cost effective,and the breeding might not be up to much.

[Walter Riley]

5 Baht per /kg is the price at our farm, and I will get them to put it through the chopper so it’s smaller for our cattle. The Or-Sor –kor is out of stock of the minerals at the moment so we will purchase it next week. What is the feeding rate of the minerals?

Thanks for the advice about the cattle breeding process, it seems there are many ways to go about it. So do you just get someone to call the local DLD and ask for the AI department? Make a booking and they come out to your property and do the AI for you. Or are they just the supplier of the semen straws.

[NeverSure]

Hi guys. I have looked at raising cattle in Thailand and all I can say is good luck.

In countries that raise a lot of good beef such as Australia, Canada, Argentina, the USA etc. they have an abundance of land and some of that land is good for cattle but not for crops. This might be rocky or steep land which is fertile but inaccessible by machinery and the cattle become the harvesters of last resort. I've never seen anyone raise cattle commercially on real farm land except for private use.

In those areas there are two stages and not everyone does both. There is the breeding and raising for about a year or less, and then there is the feeding and finishing and butchering. The latter is often done in feed lots to confine the animals so they won't get tough muscles, or burn too much fat with exercise.

I can get a ton of money for a good beef in one of the countries mentioned above because people know the difference and will pay for quality. Some of the beef in Thailand makes me wonder why it wasn't ground into ground beef. In these beef raising countries that's just what they'd do.

If someone could develop a market and actually sell good beef and get paid for it, it might be worthwhile. Maybe sell directly to quality restaurants in cities but that's a lot of work and expense.

You guys have fun and be sure to raise some for your friends and family so they can finally see what good beef tastes like. 555. I haven't a clue how to make any money doing it in LOS. Let us know how you do and especially if you find a market which will pay a premium for truly good beef. I'm a quitter, 555.

Cheers.

[kickstart]

5 Baht per /kg is the price at our farm, and I will get them to put it through the chopper so it’s smaller for our cattle. The Or-Sor –kor is out of stock of the minerals at the moment so we will purchase it next week. What is the feeding rate of the minerals?

Thanks for the advice about the cattle breeding process, it seems there are many ways to go about it. So do you just get someone to call the local DLD and ask for the AI department? Make a booking and they come out to your property and do the AI for you. Or are they just the supplier of the semen straws.

Feeding minerals,most dairy farmers use a spoon, one that you eat rice with ,twice a day .I use a small handfull ,for 6 cattle ,the way I mix the ration,works out about the same.

Booking an AI man,one time of day, pre- mobie phones,you had to go to the the local DLD office,and write your booking on a form,now it is all done with mobile phones,go to your local office and ask for the phone numbers of the local AI men,but they are cilval servents do not allways work weekends,and a lot of Thai public hoildays,ask when they work,but they should have a wider choice of semen ,ask them.

Your best way go to your local dairy co-op as the farmers bring they milk in ,and ask the farmers for phone numbers of local AI men and vets ,most vets do AI as well,find the ones that are self employed,Mor-Is-Sar-lat, in Thai,they will work weekends and some hoildays,most but not all do ,allso some dairy co-ops have they own vets and AI men, being employed by the co-op,again ask at your local dairy co-op , for phone numbers. You will end up with a long list of phone numbers.

They will come out to you,hopefully with the semen you want,most work with dairy farmsers ,but they should have some beef semen,mainly Brahman,as I said finding one with Angus semen will not be easy .when you phone them ask what semen they have.

Phone at say 7.30 am thay should ? be with you by 10 am, can also phone in the afternoon, normally ariveing after pm milking ,we had one local AI man who had a habit of "finding" a bottal of whisky on his afternoon rounds,oftern the last farms got missed,you will soon find out who are the reliable ones are.

As I said if you are going to AI beef cattle you need a good holding race,made from eucalyptus polls will do, get holding race/crush measurements from the net ,remember Thais are scarred of cattle ,they do not understand the ways of cattle or cattle sociology,especially if it is beef cattle,as they can kick hard.if the AI man thinks he will get kicked,he will not server the cow properly ,and the animal will not get in calf.take the money and run.

As for when to serve a heifer it is not the age ,more size of the heifer ,in the uk a dairy heifer will be 15 month old weighing 300 kg,here in LOS beef callte will not achive those figures,look at 260 kg or 280 kg for a big fit heifer,if is is a small Thai native 230kg .

[kickstart]

Hi guys. I have looked at raising cattle in Thailand and all I can say is good luck.

In countries that raise a lot of good beef such as Australia, Canada, Argentina, the USA etc. they have an abundance of land and some of that land is good for cattle but not for crops. This might be rocky or steep land which is fertile but inaccessible by machinery and the cattle become the harvesters of last resort. I've never seen anyone raise cattle commercially on real farm land except for private use.

In those areas there are two stages and not everyone does both. There is the breeding and raising for about a year or less, and then there is the feeding and finishing and butchering. The latter is often done in feed lots to confine the animals so they won't get tough muscles, or burn too much fat with exercise.

I can get a ton of money for a good beef in one of the countries mentioned above because people know the difference and will pay for quality. Some of the beef in Thailand makes me wonder why it wasn't ground into ground beef. In these beef raising countries that's just what they'd do.

If someone could develop a market and actually sell good beef and get paid for it, it might be worthwhile. Maybe sell directly to quality restaurants in cities but that's a lot of work and expense.

You guys have fun and be sure to raise some for your friends and family so they can finally see what good beef tastes like. 555. I haven't a clue how to make any money doing it in LOS. Let us know how you do and especially if you find a market which will pay a premium for truly good beef. I'm a quitter, 555.

Cheers.

You can get good beef in Thailand,they is Thai /French in Yasothon part farang owned company,they is a co-op with a shop in Ragsit, bkk being try to find the link,but tv's "my containt" has gone pear shaped will try againe, a tv member recomened they beef . What they had in comon was the breed ,Kangpanpet,or Tark,which are Charalies x Brahman about 65% Charolies 35% Brahman,fed well and more importaint slautered properly and hung for a long time.

You can get Wague beef at a price ,tv had a thread on it 18 monthes ago( what happened to the op. they. ),but not easy, to get the price you must be member of a co-op,certain doner breed with paper work, regular inspections, a lot of work.

You can get Beefmaster cattle in Thailand now,a guy in Kangpanpet has a herd of 300 ,I would suspect mainy cross breeds but a high persetage of Beefmaster,he will make his money ,selling his bulls as stock bulls ,and the heifers as bulling heiffers, or in calf heiffers

That is a very small persentage of Thai beef,I have ,as i have said reaed some Angus x cattle bulls ,some Thai's have said "Angus you can get a premum price for them",I said where,they did not Know,so we sold them to a local guy , who said he was going to sell them as stock bulls,we did ok