Confederate flag sets off debate in 2016 Republican class

[Merzik]

[sgtsabai]

M, and your point is? Oh, a southern rock band with a symbol of hatred, racism, oppression and slavery? Got it.

[NickJ]

Wow Making up history

now....figures.

Edited June 27, 2015 by NickJ

[lostoday]

Wow Making up history

now....figures.

The idea is to link a post so we know who you are talking to. Or you might want to google top 5 causes of the Civil war.

Edited June 27, 2015 by lostoday

[Chicog]

In the UK, Black Face minstrel shows were going strong until the 1970's. The argument given at the time was that they were harmless fun. People today recoil at such activity.

Actually the tide was starting to turn even back then. There was Warren Mitchell's poisonous comedy Til Death Us Do Part, which satirised racism in a manner that was often too subtle. Then there was a popular comedy program called Love Thy Neighbour in which a black and a white couple lived next door to each other and hilarity ensued as the racist white husband always ended up in the mire. it ran for a large chunk of the 70's.

It included words I haven't heard for decades but which were commonplace when I was a kid, like "sambo" and "nig nog" (although the black protagonist was prone to using words like "honky" and "snowflake").

Both programmes went a long way to show how ridiculous racism was.

The Black and White Minstrel show (it was the only one I know of) ran for 30 years, and actually carried on as a stage show until the late eighties, presumably on the back of audiences that had grown up with it.

[Merzik]

M, and your point is? Oh, a southern rock band with a symbol of hatred, racism, oppression and slavery? Got it.

A lot of people obviously don't see it as such. I am not from the South myself but don't think this use of the rebel flag by them is meant to express their "hatred, racism , (or support for) oppression ,slavery" They are proud of their rich Southern culture and heritage. A lot of Americans ( especially in the middle class) are moving out of my state of California ( which voted for Reagan as recently as 1984) to the great state of Texas and other Dixieland states as liberals have ruined California with all their progress.

Edited June 27, 2015 by Merzik

[Publicus]

Go East Old Man.

(Apologies to Horace Greeley.)

[Publicus]

After the Civil War ended, President Lincoln appeared in the nation’s capital with one simple request. He requested the military band to play “Dixie,” the unofficial anthem of the Confederacy.

​It's hard to understand the liberal thought process behind immediately attacking a flag, rich with our nation's history, in the wake of a tragic shooting that left nine people dead in South Carolina.

Instead of banning flags and guns, why isn't Obama addressing mental health issues that cause people to comment such heinous crimes?

Obama claimed Abraham Lincoln is one of his favourite presidents. If he were to emulate him, this country would be in better shape.

The article should stimulate some thought so it is recommended.

The source will stimulate the right's ire which is commendable.

5 reasons “white pride” is always racist

History tells us "whiteness" has always been a construct used to exclude certain groups from equal rights

4) In terms of where “white pride” is still alive and well, it is in the American prison community. The Aryan Brotherhood and other outright white supremacist gangs remain an ongoing menace in America

http://www.salon.com/2015/01/09/5_reasons_white_pride_is_always_racist_partner/

Someone posted not too long ago he'd been a prison guard over a long period, so maybe this piece might be of a particular interest. I'd bet there are a presence of Confederate frags and items in a given prison.

Republicans running for president are anyway running away from the vast majority of the American people and society who want this flag down and gone forever. Anyone is free to hammer it onto a wall over their fireplace at home and I remain free to throw the flag into my own fireplace, but the flag must be excluded from official government recognition or sanction.

The national Republican party in fact wants the flag fight settled, done and over with before the debates begin. The flag issue will come up in the debates but the R party would like to keep it as a passing reference to a done deal rather than to have the issue still kicking and screaming at the time of the debates.

Edited June 27, 2015 by Publicus

[sgtsabai]

"the flag must be excluded from official government recognition or sanction". Exactly. I am from the south, born and raised. My parents were from the south, my mother was born in Mississippi in either 1897 or 1898, birth records aren't clear. She came to Texass in a wagon, my granddad born in Mississippi in 1865. Please don't try to explain to me that the south isn't racist, it is to the core except for those that still have more than one working brain cell. Thankfully my family did. There are more of us than you think. As the bumper stickers said in New Mexico way back in the 80's "don't Californicate New Mexico". Ahem, maybe they are "Californicating" the south because they voted for the person that started the slide into the soon to be 3rd world country of the "Corporate Police State of Amerika". The woodwork is crawling but it doesn't matter, in the end justice and truth will triumph and yes we, the good guys, have a long way to go still, but the right wing racist wackos will not turn back the tide this time.

[F430murci]

"the flag must be excluded from official government recognition or sanction". Exactly. I am from the south, born and raised. My parents were from the south, my mother was born in Mississippi in either 1897 or 1898, birth records aren't clear. She came to Texass in a wagon, my granddad born in Mississippi in 1865. Please don't try to explain to me that the south isn't racist, it is to the core except for those that still have more than one working brain cell. Thankfully my family did. There are more of us than you think. As the bumper stickers said in New Mexico way back in the 80's "don't Californicate New Mexico". Ahem, maybe they are "Californicating" the south because they voted for the person that started the slide into the soon to be 3rd world country of the "Corporate Police State of Amerika". The woodwork is crawling but it doesn't matter, in the end justice and truth will triumph and yes we, the good guys, have a long way to go still, but the right wing racist wackos will not turn back the tide this time.

Lol, you mother was born in the 1800s and came to Texas on a wagon.. I love.

Mississippi in the butt hole of the US and to try to say that Mississippi is indicative or reflective of the US in general is just plan ignorant. Then again, those who could only afford to travel on a wagon probably did not get much education.

[Usernames]

I'm not entirely sure why flying the Confederate flag isn't considered an act of treason. This was the flag of traitors to the United States, and many soldiers serving in the United States armed forces died trying to keep the Union intact. The fact that this flag flies over a state capitol is mind boggling. I can't think of another country that would allow something similar to occur. Governor Romney is correct, South Carolina needs to take that flag down immediately.

Then, I suppose you support the removal of the Mexican flag from public events, school assemblies, and protests? After all, it is the flag of a country which was at war with the US and lost. Anyone flying that flag is, therefore, a traitor, yes? Might be a good idea to strip any sign of the UK flag as well, according to your logic.

[KarenBravo]

Might be a good idea to strip any sign of the UK flag as well, according to your logic.

If you're going to do that, you'll have to change the Hawaiian state flag.........

[CMNightRider]

After the Civil War ended, President Lincoln appeared in the nation’s capital with one simple request. He requested the military band to play “Dixie,” the unofficial anthem of the Confederacy.

​It's hard to understand the liberal thought process behind immediately attacking a flag, rich with our nation's history, in the wake of a tragic shooting that left nine people dead in South Carolina.

Instead of banning flags and guns, why isn't Obama addressing mental health issues that cause people to comment such heinous crimes?

Obama claimed Abraham Lincoln is one of his favourite presidents. If he were to emulate him, this country would be in better shape.

The article should stimulate some thought so it is recommended.

The source will stimulate the right's ire which is commendable.

5 reasons “white pride” is always racist

History tells us "whiteness" has always been a construct used to exclude certain groups from equal rights

4) In terms of where “white pride” is still alive and well, it is in the American prison community. The Aryan Brotherhood and other outright white supremacist gangs remain an ongoing menace in America

Someone posted not too long ago he'd been a prison guard over a long period, so maybe this piece might be of a particular interest. I'd bet there are a presence of Confederate frags and items in a given prison.

Republicans running for president are anyway running away from the vast majority of the American people and society who want this flag down and gone forever. Anyone is free to hammer it onto a wall over their fireplace at home and I remain free to throw the flag into my own fireplace, but the flag must be excluded from official government recognition or sanction.

The national Republican party in fact wants the flag fight settled, done and over with before the debates begin. The flag issue will come up in the debates but the R party would like to keep it as a passing reference to a done deal rather than to have the issue still kicking and screaming at the time of the debates.

I believe the term "White Pride" is nothing more than being proud of ones European heritage, just like "Black Pride" is being proud of ones African heritage. Did you ever hear the terms "Brown Pride," Black Pride," or "Asian Pride?"

Since you mentioned the "Aryan Brotherhood" being an ongoing menace in America, gang culture in general is a menace. You ever hear of the "Black Guerrilla Family, or the"Mexican Mafia," to name a few? Whites do not have a monopoly on gangs.

Edited June 28, 2015 by Scott

[sdanielmcev]

"the flag must be excluded from official government recognition or sanction". Exactly. I am from the south, born and raised. My parents were from the south, my mother was born in Mississippi in either 1897 or 1898, birth records aren't clear. She came to Texass in a wagon, my granddad born in Mississippi in 1865. Please don't try to explain to me that the south isn't racist, it is to the core except for those that still have more than one working brain cell. Thankfully my family did. There are more of us than you think. As the bumper stickers said in New Mexico way back in the 80's "don't Californicate New Mexico". Ahem, maybe they are "Californicating" the south because they voted for the person that started the slide into the soon to be 3rd world country of the "Corporate Police State of Amerika". The woodwork is crawling but it doesn't matter, in the end justice and truth will triumph and yes we, the good guys, have a long way to go still, but the right wing racist wackos will not turn back the tide this time.

Says more about your upbringing than the rest of the South. I've been all across America, and saw much more racism in the North than I ever did in the South. Particularly the northeast/east. You don't like what the you perceive the flag to mean, fine. But painting those that respect that flag for their fight against Northern tyranny as racist is the same hatred you purport to despise in those that use that same flag as a desecration against humanity. It is the feeble-minded that believe that their hatred is going to foster anything except more hatred.

[Usernames]

Might be a good idea to strip any sign of the UK flag as well, according to your logic.

If you're going to do that, you'll have to change the Hawaiian state flag.........

Indeed, they will. A symbol of treason if there ever was one. Out it goes. And, come to think of it, the French flag is a symbol of continental wide conquest, enslavement, and massacre. Away with it. Oh, and even more ironic, how about the Buffalo soldiers and their banner of genocide against Native Americans. No more stars and stripes and all references, monuments, and statues to Buffalo soldiers must go. This list could go on for a long timie, I bet.

[Merzik]

Looks like some of us are eventually going to end up in a Soviet reeducation camp where we learn that there is no such thing as race ; but that white people are the sourse of all the world's problems. Looks like we just haven't learned yet how intrinsically evil and vile European people, history and culture really are. Slavery, oppression, hatred, wars, and anything else negative they can think up will be attributed to the evil white man. All our contributions to science, art, literature will be erased from history and slip down an Orweliian dark hole. We will be taught by a teacher like Publicus and listen to endless nonsensical lectures until we commit suicide and a new utopia will emerge. If you think I'm joking; you're wrong. It was done in the first decades of the Soviet Union; and Hollywood, the MSM and much of academia have been giving us pretty much the same crap since the 1960's.

Edited June 28, 2015 by Merzik

[chuckd]

Just curiouos, what are those idiots saying they are "sorry" about?

Looks like they are apologizing for being alive...and probably deservedly so.

[lostoday]

Might be a good idea to strip any sign of the UK flag as well, according to your logic.

If you're going to do that, you'll have to change the Hawaiian state flag.........

Indeed, they will. A symbol of treason if there ever was one. Out it goes. And, come to think of it, the French flag is a symbol of continental wide conquest, enslavement, and massacre. Away with it. Oh, and even more ironic, how about the Buffalo soldiers and their banner of genocide against Native Americans. No more stars and stripes and all references, monuments, and statues to Buffalo soldiers must go. This list could go on for a long timie, I bet.

Oh no not the Buffalo soldiers too! What would Sgt Sabai say?

[Publicus]

Looks like some of us are eventually going to end up in a Soviet reeducation camp where we learn that there is no such thing as race ; but that white people are the sourse of all the world's problems. Looks like we just haven't learned yet how intrinsically evil and vile European people, history and culture really are. Slavery, oppression, hatred, wars, and anything else negative they can think up will be attributed to the evil white man. All our contributions to science, art, literature will be erased from history and slip down an Orweliian dark hole. We will be taught by a teacher like Publicus and listen to endless nonsensical lectures until we commit suicide and a new utopia will emerge. If you think I'm joking; you're wrong. It was done in the first decades of the Soviet Union; and Hollywood, the MSM and much of academia have been giving us pretty much the same crap since the 1960's.

image.jpg

We will be taught by a teacher like Publicus

I'd been told before and repeatedly I embody all evil but then I got rid of the bich and even though it was expensive I finally became a free man. The pointed mention in the OTT post sort of reminds me of it all and about how gloriously free I became and I am.

It is old hat to say each of us is an ambassador abroad of our respective country but it is effectively the case. I have never had any difficulty representing my country and its history, culture, society, language, civilisation to any one abroad to include fahlang especially, some of whom assert the United States has no civilization and that civilisation in the United States is impossible.

I haven't any need to apologise to any foreigner on or from any continent, whether it be the 1997 financial disaster in the former LOS or my opposition to dictatorship whenever it disposed of the messy inconvenience of democracy.

I am critical abroad of the right sector of American society and of fascist dictatorships wherever they exist or aspire to transmogrify. Indeed, the FDR-era politician, down-home US Senator Huey Long of Louisiana, famously said, "When fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in the flag and waving a cross."

It's a loaded and controversial quote, but someone said it.

Edited June 28, 2015 by Publicus

[chuckd]

[Usernames]

@publicus. Sorry, but Huey used the so-called N-word quite often. So, no more Huey allowed either. In fact, I'm wondering about you, since you see fit to endorse Huey's quote. You might look up some night and see a howling mob pounding your door for your guilt by association.

[Publicus]

@publicus. Sorry, but Huey used the so-called N-word quite often. So, no more Huey allowed either. In fact, I'm wondering about you, since you see fit to endorse Huey's quote. You might look up some night and see a howling mob pounding your door for your guilt by association.

Don't concern your little self about me cause I grew up a long time ago and that happened in the first place because I'm able to take care of myself.

The right anyway has a lot of wishful imaginings in these things and consistently so.

Huey Long was in fact a racist and being from the FDR-era American South he knew a lot about racism, the KKK, fascism, American society, politics, culture and the like. I quote him critically of course same as I do in respect of youse guyz over there on the far right.

Let's in fact get back to the thread topic thx....

Edited June 28, 2015 by Publicus

[Merzik]

Just curiouos, what are those idiots saying they are "sorry" about?

Looks like they are apologizing for being alive...and probably deservedly so.

They are brain-dead liberal trendies apologizing for slavery. American universities are beginning to resemble insane asylums. I had more than a few Marxist professors in my uni days in the 70's; but it has gotten even worse since then. America is having its PC cultural revolution such as the Maoists did in their day in China. Little red books with obama/ sharpton quotes to wave about are all we are lacking now.

They could put this one on the cover:

Edited June 28, 2015 by Merzik

[Merzik]

Commissar Publicus; the author of your " when fascism comes to America" quote was Sinclair Lewis; not Huey Long. If you are opposed to fascism you should be in favor of the restoration of constitutional government in the United States and a dramatic down sizing of the federal government to its assigned tasks and roles as expressed by our Founding Fathers. The federal government has its hands into everything now; and always manages to screw things up royally that it tries to manage. Fascism is the crony-capitialism system and Nanny-state we have today; not the free enterprise system. Voting for virtually all of today's Democrats or any big-government Republicans is a vote for fascism.

Edited June 28, 2015 by Merzik

[Chicog]

Just curiouos, what are those idiots saying they are "sorry" about?

Looks like they are apologizing for being alive...and probably deservedly so.

They are brain-dead liberal trendies apologizing for slavery. American universities are beginning to resemble insane asylums. I had more than a few Marxist professors in my uni days in the 70's; but it has gotten even worse since then. America is having its PC cultural revolution such as the Maoists did in their day in China. Little red books with obama/ sharpton quotes to wave about are all we are lacking now.

They could put this one on the cover:

image.jpg

What is that, Jedi?

[Publicus]

Commissar Publicus; the author of your " when fascism comes to America" quote was Sinclair Lewis; not Huey Long. If you are opposed to fascism you should be in favor of the restoration of constitutional government in the United States and a dramatic down sizing of the federal government to its assigned tasks and roles as expressed by our Founding Fathers. The federal government has its hands into everything now; and always manages to screw things up royally that it tries to manage. Fascism is the crony-capitialism system and Nanny-state we have today; not the free enterprise system. Voting for virtually all of today's Democrats or any big-government Republicans is a vote for fascism.

Trump and Huckabee come across as particularly marginal or perhaps as simply personally driven, while Santorum presents the emotional and hard driven American version of the political theocrat as in Cardinal Richelieu.

Cruz has a gun fighter's nasty personal edge to his tinny Texas voice and temper while Louisiana Governor Bobby Jindal is so overly pious his appeal is limited only to the heart of Dixie. Rick Perry is the guy who while governor of Texas of all states openly talked up secession in clear and precise terms so he is going to jail.

John Ellis "Jeb" Bush would have to put up to half these barking political dogs in his cabinet and probably would have to choose one of 'em as his vp, perhaps Ron Paul but he might get stuck with Scott Walker the Wisconsin governor who would not help the ticket with Independent voters and who himself might not be conservative enough for the marginal right wing voters such as the tea party.

As to the quote you reference, I'd said in my post the quote is "controversial" and that "someone said it," so Sinclair Lewis is indeed one of the several that the various quote doctors identify as its source, to include the late Huey Long, Winston Churchill of all people, to include the late Rev Halford Luccock of the Yale Divinity School who preached in a 1938 sermon at the famous Riverside Church in NYC, "When and if fascism comes to America, it will not be labeled 'Made in Germany'; it will not be marked with a swastika; it will not even be called fascism, it will be called of course Americanism."

The post btw presumes to lecture me in some specifics of what I should or need to believe, which of course happens to coincide exactly with everything you think and believe. Anyone can say what he believes, however, they need to stay away from dictating to me what they believe I need to believe. The Constitution says each of us is entitled to his beliefs, so kindly respect that vital pillar of belief.

Edited June 28, 2015 by Publicus

[Publicus]

Just curiouos, what are those idiots saying they are "sorry" about?

Looks like they are apologizing for being alive...and probably deservedly so.

They are brain-dead liberal trendies apologizing for slavery. American universities are beginning to resemble insane asylums. I had more than a few Marxist professors in my uni days in the 70's; but it has gotten even worse since then. America is having its PC cultural revolution such as the Maoists did in their day in China. Little red books with obama/ sharpton quotes to wave about are all we are lacking now.

They could put this one on the cover:

image.jpg

There's a lot of that spoof stuff on Al Sharpton at the following link which is where the poster got it.

Enter in search : al sharpton resist we much

The complicated Google search link is

https://www.google.co.jp/search?tbs=simg:CAESqwEaqAELEKjU2AQaBAgACD0MCxCwjKcIGmAKXggDEiiPGeUWkBmjDv0YjRmmDvwY2BynDuYt0S2APZol1STnLeku0i3WJOItGjBW_1UN664siH91UBDh8HxvvNuSX85jk1-4_1Do9IQYis7x6SCE2IpZRKUm2ixLLUL-oMCxCOrv4IGgoKCAgBEgSUtilGDAsQne3BCRoWCggKBnNwZWVjaAoKCghvZmZpY2lhbAw&q=al+sharpton+resist+we+much&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=E_CPVaPlNouZ8QW5lIHADQ&ved=0CC8Qsw4&biw=1424&bih=747

[sdanielmcev]

Commissar Publicus; the author of your " when fascism comes to America" quote was Sinclair Lewis; not Huey Long. If you are opposed to fascism you should be in favor of the restoration of constitutional government in the United States and a dramatic down sizing of the federal government to its assigned tasks and roles as expressed by our Founding Fathers. The federal government has its hands into everything now; and always manages to screw things up royally that it tries to manage. Fascism is the crony-capitialism system and Nanny-state we have today; not the free enterprise system. Voting for virtually all of today's Democrats or any big-government Republicans is a vote for fascism.

Trump and Huckabee come across as particularly marginal or perhaps as simply personally driven, while Santorum presents the emotional and hard driven American version of the political theocrat as in Cardinal Richelieu.

Cruz has a gun fighter's nasty personal edge to his tinny Texas voice and temper while Louisiana Governor Bobby Jindal is so overly pious his appeal is limited only to the heart of Dixie. Rick Perry is the guy who while governor of Texas of all states openly talked up secession in clear and precise terms so he is going to jail.

John Ellis "Jeb" Bush would have to put up to half these barking political dogs in his cabinet and probably would have to choose one of 'em as his vp, perhaps Ron Paul but he might get stuck with Scott Walker the Wisconsin governor who would not help the ticket with Independent voters and who himself might not be conservative enough for the marginal right wing voters such as the tea party.

As to the quote you reference, I'd said in my post the quote is "controversial" and that "someone said it," so Sinclair Lewis is indeed one of the several that the various quote doctors identify as its source, to include the late Huey Long, Winston Churchill of all people, to include the late Rev Halford Luccock of the Yale Divinity School who preached in a 1938 sermon at the famous Riverside Church in NYC, "When and if fascism comes to America, it will not be labeled 'Made in Germany'; it will not be marked with a swastika; it will not even be called fascism, it will be called of course Americanism."

The post btw presumes to lecture me in some specifics of what I should or need to believe, which of course happens to coincide exactly with everything you think and believe. Anyone can say what he believes, however, they need to stay away from dictating to me what they believe I need to believe. The Constitution says each of us is entitled to his beliefs, so kindly respect that vital pillar of belief.

More hypocritical ramblings, and nothing to do with the flag. "Each is entitled to his beliefs," right after writing how bad some people are. Stalin couldn't have said it better. On one hand denigrating the opposition all the while crying out for respect. You've shoved so much hate speech into this thread that you made Hitler smile. Your effete snobbery is showing, relegating anyone who did try to banish slavery into the dust bin of history as irrelevant. Hatred breeds hatred. Nothing more.

[sgtsabai]

"Lol, you mother was born in the 1800s and came to Texas on a wagon.. I love.

Mississippi in the butt hole of the US and to try to say that Mississippi is indicative or reflective of the US in general is just plan ignorant. Then again, those who could only afford to travel on a wagon probably did not get much education".

And the personal attacks on me continue, now with added attacks on my family. How many of your family members owned an automobile in oh say 1900 or even knew how to spell?. My mother was born in 1897 or 1898, birth records are not clear. My grandfather, born 1865, was a farmer, teacher and judge. My mother had a masters degree in education and taught school from the 1920's until I went in the USMC in 1964. My uncles, 2 of which served in WWI, were quite successful. Some of my cousins were teachers and one cousin was married to the president of Stephen F. Austin University. Somebody really, really does need to come and party down. That is if they can get off their little row boat and stop counting the money they have ripped off.

Not once did I ever see a member of my family, all well educated, display a Confederate flag, nor did I ever hear "nigger". Ahem, they did not like yankees very much though.

The display of that flag on government property is wrong and didn't occur until the racists in the south starting trying to stop civil rights, you know like human rights. Crawl back in your troglodyte holes.

[Publicus]

"the flag must be excluded from official government recognition or sanction". Exactly. I am from the south, born and raised. My parents were from the south, my mother was born in Mississippi in either 1897 or 1898, birth records aren't clear. She came to Texass in a wagon, my granddad born in Mississippi in 1865. Please don't try to explain to me that the south isn't racist, it is to the core except for those that still have more than one working brain cell. Thankfully my family did. There are more of us than you think. As the bumper stickers said in New Mexico way back in the 80's "don't Californicate New Mexico". Ahem, maybe they are "Californicating" the south because they voted for the person that started the slide into the soon to be 3rd world country of the "Corporate Police State of Amerika". The woodwork is crawling but it doesn't matter, in the end justice and truth will triumph and yes we, the good guys, have a long way to go still, but the right wing racist wackos will not turn back the tide this time.

Lol, you mother was born in the 1800s and came to Texas on a wagon.. I love.

Mississippi in the butt hole of the US and to try to say that Mississippi is indicative or reflective of the US in general is just plan ignorant. Then again, those who could only afford to travel on a wagon probably did not get much education.

Some as we have seen have a heritage worth presenting while others as indicated in the post lol have only redneck theory and bubba lives to live.