Virgin Coconut Oil

[sabaijai]

I too am puzzled by [...] the high incidence of heart disease among people who consume a great deal of coconut, e.g. not only Thais but Pacific Islanders.

Where is that evidence again? I'm sceptical of any correlation that doesn't control for other factors linked to heart disease, eg, obesity, smoking, stress, diabetes, genetics, hypertension, excercise/lifestyle, other dietary factors (eg, consumption of processed foods), socioeconomic status, etc.

from http://www.faqs.org/nutrition/Ome-Pop/Paci...ns-Diet-of.html

Pacific Islander Americans have a high rate of obesity, and Native Hawaiians and Samoans are among the most obese people in the world. Dietary and lifestyle changes, as well as a likely genetic predisposition to store fat, are possible causes for this high rate. Lifestyles have changed from an active farming- and fishing-based subsistence economy to a more sedentary lifestyle. Pacific Islanders may be genetically predisposed to store fat for times of scarcity (the "thrifty gene" phenotype), and there is evidence that prenatal undernutrition modifies fetal development, predisposing individuals to adult obesity and chronic diseases.

Besides obesity, Pacific Islander Americans have high rate of diabetes, hypertension, cardiovascular disease, and stroke. Data collected from 1996 to 2000 suggest that Native Hawaiians are 2.5 times more likely to have diagnosed diabetes than white residents of Hawaii of similar age. Guam's death rate from diabetes is five times higher than that of the U.S. mainland, and diabetes is one of the leading causes of death in American Samoa. Overall, Pacific Islander Americans have much lower rates of heart disease than other minority groups in the United States, but it is still the leading cause of death within this population. Risk factors for and mortality from heart disease are high partly because of higher rates of obesity, diabetes, and high blood pressure. The poor health status of Pacific Islander Americans is also linked to socioeconomic indicators—Native Hawaiians have the worst socioeconomic indicators, the lowest health status, and the most diet-related maladies of all American minorities.

from http://www.apccsec.org/document/Rethinam.pdf

sland populations that eat very high amounts of saturated fat coconut oil showed no sign of heart disease. But when they migrate to New Zealand and began eating less coconut oil and less saturated fat but more poly unsaturated fats, the incidence of heart disease and other illness greatly increased (Prior et al, 1981). Numerous studies clearly demonstrated that coconut oil has a neutral effect on cholesterol levels (Hashim et al, 1959; Bray et al, 1980; Geliebter, 1983; Baba, 1982; Greenberger and Skillman, 1969 and Fino, 1963).

from 'Coconut & Health,' on the Secretariat of the Pacific Community website:

The diets of many Pacific Islanders are now high in fat and their lives have become increasingly sedentary. The fat comes not just from the traditional sources such as coconut and fish, but increasingly from imported foods such as fatty meats, baked goods, margarines, cooking oils and baking fats. The combination of fat from these imported and local foods is resulting in relatively high fat diets.

The bulk of the evidence indicates that eating a diet that includes coconut fat would increase the risk of heart disease, and yet the studies in traditional communities do not show this.

I might be going out on a limb here, but it seems to me there is more research touting the positives of coconut than the negatives. The U.S. National Library of Medicine , for example, archives over 2000 articles on coconut, and judging from a quick scan of the titles/abstracts it seems most of them record benefits of the consumption of coconut or its use as a traditional medicine.

Much of the research, admittedly, seems to have been paid for by the coconut industry. However where the methodology is sound, that's irrelevant, in judging the validity and reliability of research outcomes.

Also see Abstracts from Peer Reviewed Literature (from coconutoil.com)

Beneficial effects of virgin coconut oil on lipid parameters and in vitro LDL oxidation.

Clin Biochem. 2004 Sep;37(9):830-5.

A diet rich in coconut oil reduces diurnal postprandial variations in circulating tissue plasminogen activator antigen and fasting lipoprotein (a) compared with a diet rich in unsaturated fat in women.

J Nutr. 2003 Nov;133(11):3422-7.

Dietary coconut oil increases conjugated linoleic acid-induced body fat loss in mice independent of essential fatty acid deficiency.

Biochim Biophys Acta. 2005 Oct 15;1737(1):52-60. Epub 2005 Sep 13.

Cholesterol, coconuts, and diet on Polynesian atolls: a natural experiment: the Pukapuka and Tokelau island studies.

Am J Clin Nutr 1981 Aug;34(8):1552-61

Choice of cooking oils--myths and realities.

J Indian Med Assoc 1998 Oct;96(10):304-7

The role of coconut and coconut oil in coronary heart disease in Kerala, south India.

Trop Doct. 1997 Oct;27(4):215-7.

Energy restriction with high-fat diet enriched with coconut oil gives higher UCP1 and lower white fat in rats.

Int J Obes Relat Metab Disord. 1998 Oct;22(10):974-9.

Saturated fat prevents coronary artery disease? An American paradox

American Journal of Clinical Nutrition, Vol. 80, No. 5, 1102-1103, November 2004

Medium-chain triglycerides increase energy expenditure and decrease adiposity in overweight men.

Obes Res. 2003 Mar;11(3):395-402.

Physiological effects of medium-chain triglycerides: potential agents in the prevention of obesity.

J Nutr 2002 Mar;132(3):329-32

[Trevor]

In nature there are no 'bad fats'; all unheated, uncooked, non-hydrogenated fats and oils are beneficial, particularly animal fats and the saturated plant oils coconut and palm. Face up to it folks, we've all been brainwashed by the fast food and seed oil industries for a century; they just 'sponsor' research which turns up 'results' that suit their convenience and profits. Governments, supposedly protectors of the people, just sit back and take the lobby kickbacks. Fast food and the faux-medical drug-treatment paradigm have become major economic drivers in Western, and emerging, economies. Can you imagine the chaos and economic collapse which would occur if fast/cooked food, Big Pharma and the medical mafia were exposed as frauds? No one in power is going to let this happen. Citizens have to take their own responsibility for health, and have a great ally now in the Internet.

As for Phangan Islanders, it is fatuous to blame heart disease or blood pressure on coconut consumption. Most men smoke, drink alcohol, eat 95% of their diet cooked (raw is best), and consume too many carbohydrates in the form of nutritionally-bankrupt white rice, and sugary sweets. Recipe for disaster! The key to living without disease is frequent consumption of raw fats and protein (both vegetable and animal), raw eggs, organic vegetables and their juices, and raw dairy where available.

Thanks for the coconut oil links above. But benefit can be enjoyed simply by eating the raw flesh, young (juice) coconuts, and fresh coconut milk (ga-ti) from the market (NOT Chao Koh!).

Edited May 20, 2007 by Trevor

[sbk]

You ignored my point, Trevor. They are not eating UNCOOKED coconut and palm oils. They are cooking nearly all of it. And the one man I can think of that had a heart attack at 62 did not smoke, did not drink and was fitter than most men half his age.

So, perhaps raw coconut is good for you, but it is fatuous to ignore the fact that most people in Thailand are eating cooked coconut.

[Trevor]

You ignored my point, Trevor. They are not eating UNCOOKED coconut and palm oils. They are cooking nearly all of it. And the one man I can think of that had a heart attack at 62 did not smoke, did not drink and was fitter than most men half his age.

So, perhaps raw coconut is good for you, but it is fatuous to ignore the fact that most people in Thailand are eating cooked coconut.

Well said! So have you exorcised your coconut / saturated fat demons now?

As for raw vs. cooked, well the good Dr Mercola (www.mercola.com) recommends, and sells, coconut oil for cooking (if you absolutely have to); also advises us to eat 75% of our diet raw -- a fair compromise for most. The thing about saturated fats is they are much more stable under heat than other types, and people would still derive some of their benefits even when cooked. Coconut meat contains 10% fat -- makes a great dessert shredded, with a little raw honey for flavour.

If your local friend had eaten raw-fish sashimi his whole life, instead of fish deep-fried in toxic processed seed oils, he would have fared better in old age -- like the long-lived Japanese. See also www.westonaprice.org/index.html .

[sabaijai]

You ignored my point, Trevor. They are not eating UNCOOKED coconut and palm oils. They are cooking nearly all of it. And the one man I can think of that had a heart attack at 62 did not smoke, did not drink and was fitter than most men half his age.

We see no obvious correlation. Plus this is a sample of one, so an empirical conclusion isn't exactly jumping out at us.

Most research on hypertension and heart disease rates non-diet-related risk factors (including time urgency/impatience (TUI), achievement striving/competitiveness (ASC), hostility, depression, and anxiety) higher than the consumption of saturated fats or other dietary habits. High cholesterol is a risk factor but coconut fat contains none (and high cholesterol levels are also partially genetic).

The latest research concludes that the majority of hypertension cases are unrelated to lifestyle or other known factor, suggesting it's mainly a genetic condition. Which is how a man who did not smoke, did not drink and was fitter than most men half his age could die at age 62. My mother died of a heart attack at age 68 and she was slender, fit, ate a low-fat diet and did not smoke (and drank only wine).

[sainarm]

I've been reading about the wonders of eating virgin coconut oil which is supposed to be even better for one than olive oil.

Where in the Kingdom can one buy excellent quality virgin coconut oil for a reasonable price?

http://www.thaisabaibytalaypu.com/ here is the place you can buy virgin coconut oil. please take a look the website.

[sbk]

You ignored my point, Trevor. They are not eating UNCOOKED coconut and palm oils. They are cooking nearly all of it. And the one man I can think of that had a heart attack at 62 did not smoke, did not drink and was fitter than most men half his age.

We see no obvious correlation. Plus this is a sample of one, so an empirical conclusion isn't exactly jumping out at us.

Most research on hypertension and heart disease rates non-diet-related risk factors (including time urgency/impatience (TUI), achievement striving/competitiveness (ASC), hostility, depression, and anxiety) higher than the consumption of saturated fats or other dietary habits. High cholesterol is a risk factor but coconut fat contains none (and high cholesterol levels are also partially genetic).

The latest research concludes that the majority of hypertension cases are unrelated to lifestyle or other known factor, suggesting it's mainly a genetic condition. Which is how a man who did not smoke, did not drink and was fitter than most men half his age could die at age 62. My mother died of a heart attack at age 68 and she was slender, fit, ate a low-fat diet and did not smoke (and drank only wine).

I said he had a heart attack, I didn't say he died Also, my empirical study factors in every Thai person I know. Almost all of whom, over the age of 35, have high blood pressure. Father-in-law, mother-in-law, both brothers-in-law, my sister-in-law died of a stroke at the age 47, aunt & uncle-in-laws and the numerous cousins, second cousins and third cousins that make up my husband's huge extended family.

As for the genetic factor, well that could make sense as the local families are fairly interrelated, not closely but to the 3rd and 4th degree. My step-mom ate vegan for 15 years and still had a heart attack. Her doctor told her that she delayed her heart attack by eating vegan (and she was strict) but that it was inevitable as her body produces more plaque and faster than most people. Her mother, and both uncles had hypertension and all 3 had some sort of heart surgery in their lives; bypass, valve replacement etc

I'll still watch the coconut consumption tho

[sabaijai]

Also, my empirical study factors in every Thai person I know.

Cum hoc, ergo propter hoc*

*Correlation does not imply causation is a phrase used in the sciences and statistics to emphasize that correlation between two variables does not imply there is a cause-and-effect relationship between the two. Its converse, correlation proves causation, is a logical fallacy by which two events that occur together are claimed to have a cause-and-effect relationship. It is also known as cum hoc ergo propter hoc (Latin for "with this, therefore because of this") and false cause.

[bigmove]

The real problem here is trying to find virgin coconuts from which to extract the oil.

I don't know how virgin coconut oil is made here in Thailand but from the philippines I know that it comes from pressed coconut and set aside until the oil comes out.The oil from heating coconut is use usually for massage in the Philippines. For a bottle of virigin coconut oil cost around THB75. In the Philippines it also comes in different flavor jackfruit & corn so you will find it easier to drink it.

[Luckydog]

Claims that it will make the Fat fall off are grossly exaggerated.

My wife took it for ages without losing weight.

Her hair looked good though!

[sbk]

Luckydog, I tend not to believe in any of the newest "miracle cures" whether natural or not. In my experience, the only thing that makes "fat fall off" is exercise and eating right. But then, that is an empirical study of one, never mind that it is what doctors have been suggesting for some time now

[nightbird]

Hi!

Yes me and hubby have a (newly built) huge export factory for organic virgin coconut oil, the only centrifugaly seperated oil in the country! Ahem ok product placement over with!

We generally sell wholesale but I can certainly hook you up with a few liters.

It would be 400B per liter.

BTW fermented coconut oil is basicly rancid and oil extracted with heat has lost all its valuable properties.

We use a patented cold pressed centrifugal technic so you get the highest levels of anti-oxidents and MCFA (medium chain fatty acids)

You can eat it, cook with it, apply it topicly or style your hair with it!

PM me if your interested!

Sho

I'm interested in buying some litres of Organic Virgin Coco Oil. I am in Bkk. How do I buy, please?

[Trevor]

Send a private mail through the private messages link top-right of this page and let us know how you got on.

In the West there is plenty of genuine VCO on sale in shops or via mail order. When in Thailand I don't bother because my main source of liquids is those young coconuts hacked into a white, conical shape for 10-15 baht each. Then I eat the flesh which is 10% fat anyway. Also buy freshly-grated (mature) coconut meat from local markets (don't go too late: they stop to clean up the machinery early afternoon) and eat it with honey. Stores in the fridge for a couple of days.

Keywords: ma-prao on -- young coconut

ma-prao sarm look -- 3 coconuts

neu-uh ma-prao koot -- grated coconut flesh

song keet -- 200 grams (plenty to start with)

[Head Snake]

Perivously, I had bought some small bottles of the stuff from GNC.