Drought crisis worsens in various parts of Thailand

[nauseus]

Last post was pretty good but the majority just show a high level of ignorance w.r.t. geology and meteorology and particularly hydrology.

Trouble is the blind seem to continue to be led by the blinder!

Have a good night and I hope it rains soon.

[iainiain101]

MIL says the snakes are laying eggs. Apparently not usual for this time of year and used by hill farmers as a sign that rain is not coming for a while.

[moojar]

My wife's Bangkok mob-cheering friend blames "the previous government" for letting too much water out of the dams after the floods a few years ago. I'm just stunned that no-one on here has taken the opportunity to blame Mr T.

[BSJ]

Yesterday the wife and I watered the mango trees in the orchard. The BIL helped from mid afternoon. I used 3000L from the tanks on the shed and 6000L from the dam. The BIL was using a pump and 2 x 200L barrels. Not sure how much water he got from the dam. We were using the airbus tank to store the water in.

750 trees approx 11.000L water. Counting the seconds to get estimated litres gets boring! The juvenile trees got less (10L), the medium trees got more (15L) and the big trees got 20 -25L give or take.

That's no where near enough. Will need to do follow up soon.

Doing nothing is not an option. These trees take 4 years to be productive....and my wifes income depends on them.

[cumgranosalum]

Ware consumption in Thailand has grown exponentially. Population and private consumption, agriculture and Industry. Thailand has little or no zoning or planning to speak of and farms and industry can set up anywhere. This not only affects the price of land, decreasing the viability of farming in some areas but also makes unsustainable demands on the local water supplies.

Without a thorough national survey of water supplies it is impossible to tell whether a proposed industry can be supported by the available water.....but they still go on....

The problem is that in agriculture there is little or no training for farmers to understand and manage water......farms are popping up in places that really don't have the water to supply them and so farmers look around for where they can find the water they need - this is often in amounts that are unsustainable either from ground water or local reservoirs.

There's no point in just trying to get more and more water; as part of a national water conservation campaign, there needs to be much more education for farmers on how to manage water and a review of water reservation and then distribution.

Edited July 3, 2015 by cumgranosalum

[alanrchase]

Ware consumption in Thailand has grown exponentially. Population and private consumption, agriculture and Industry. Thailand has little or no zoning or planning to speak of and farms and industry can set up anywhere. This not only affects the price of land, decreasing the viability of farming in some areas but also makes unsustainable demands on the local water supplies.

Without a thorough national survey of water supplies it is impossible to tell whether a proposed industry can be supported by the available water.....but they still go on....

The problem is that in agriculture there is little or no training for farmers to understand and manage water......farms are popping up in places that really don't have the water to supply them and so farmers look around for where they can find the water they need - this is often in amounts that are unsustainable either from ground water or local reservoirs.

There's no point in just trying to get more and more water; as part of a national water conservation campaign, there needs to be much more education for farmers on how to manage water and a review of water reservation and then distribution.

Agree with most of what you have said. Locally the method of watering all the various crops grown seems to be to flood the field once a day. I am no expert but am pretty sure they are using many times more water than is necessary. Suppose it is a case of "it has always been done like that".

[shaurene]

...and how many billion cubic meters were lost during Songkran?...

Wouldn't that be zero since the water returned to earth?

A lot that ended up on the roads would have been evaporated away by the heat and more down the drains into the sea or where ever.

[cumgranosalum]

Yes, - " "it has always been done like that".

Rice farming especially (and fruit) requires a lot of water, so if you simply transpose your wasteful practises from one area to another even if it has less water, then you get problems but the thing is most local farmers have no way of knowing what water is available to them. Rice farming takes about 70% of the nations water and it is increasingly carried out in areas where the water needs to be "imported" by man-made means.

The RID's solution is just to keep building dams as they always have which doesn't really help, it just perpetuates wasteful water habits.

The amount of water available in Thailand - groundwater/rain - is pretty much a constant. Demand on the other hand has increased dramatically and this is then followed by "interference" by man to save and direct water to where it is wanted..... Unfortunately this has knock-on effects...dams may supply irrigation, but they lose to evaporation and leakage and then restrict water to regions below.

Deforestation has caused soil erosion and flash flooding, which leads in turn to loss of water that would otherwise be retained in the land.

A lot of this is just general rules that apply to the whole planet, but it is the Thai interpretation or ignorance and resulting lack of appropriate action of this that exacerbates the problems for the country (and the region - water doesn't have a passport). For instance,it was or maybe still is the belief of the RID that forests cause rain,completely ignoring the science. There have been reports to put them straight on this, but whether or not they were accepted i don't know.

Edited July 3, 2015 by cumgranosalum

[boomerangutang]

Simple solution: spend 36 billion baht, plus interest, on 3 subs. There, problem solved.

A remotely related issue: In southwestern US, there's widespread drought, and the region continues to have mega problems with allocating water from the Colorado river. One weird aspect: farmers in the headwater region, foothills of the Rocky Mnts, are compelled to use as much water as possible. There's a program known colloquially as 'Use It Or Lose It.' Decades-old immense allocations of water for old farm familes - are only continued, if indivicual farmers use the large amounts of water. So farmers wind up flooding their fields for no other reason - than maintaining their allocation.

Edited July 3, 2015 by boomerangutang

[cumgranosalum]

...and how many billion cubic meters were lost during Songkran?...

Wouldn't that be zero since the water returned to earth?

A lot that ended up on the roads would have been evaporated away by the heat and more down the drains into the sea or where ever.

I think you really need to get a grasp on the amount of water used at Song Khran relative to the amount used by agriculture and industry. (see my post above - #26

)

Edited July 3, 2015 by cumgranosalum

[cumgranosalum]

Ware consumption in Thailand has grown exponentially. Population and private consumption, agriculture and Industry. Thailand has little or no zoning or planning to speak of and farms and industry can set up anywhere. This not only affects the price of land, decreasing the viability of farming in some areas but also makes unsustainable demands on the local water supplies.

Without a thorough national survey of water supplies it is impossible to tell whether a proposed industry can be supported by the available water.....but they still go on....

The problem is that in agriculture there is little or no training for farmers to understand and manage water......farms are popping up in places that really don't have the water to supply them and so farmers look around for where they can find the water they need - this is often in amounts that are unsustainable either from ground water or local reservoirs.

There's no point in just trying to get more and more water; as part of a national water conservation campaign, there needs to be much more education for farmers on how to manage water and a review of water reservation and then distribution.

Agree with most of what you have said. Locally the method of watering all the various crops grown seems to be to flood the field once a day. I am no expert but am pretty sure they are using many times more water than is necessary. Suppose it is a case of "it has always been done like that".

I don't know rice farming either, but the kind of rice farmed in Thailand stems from the local topography - i.e. FLOOD PLAINS - the crop requires substantial amounts of water and the transplanting occurs in flooded fields.

Thailand's reason for existence as a country could be put down to the fact that the land is flat and the various rivers naturally flood the land around them, enabling rice farming. It is the subsequent untrammelled "development" outside the flood plains and consumption by other interests of diverted water that forms a substantial part of the problem.

[MESmith]

I think its unbelievable in a country that has so much ground water to be suffering drought conditions and to put it bluntly it shouldn't happen I will state again boreholes and wells are the answer something which should have been done a long time ago but there again this is Thailand its all about money, i feel sorry for the growers but not the orchard owners they shouldn't have any problems fruit trees take moisture from the ground they don't need water every day .

Boreholes are not cost effective for 6 baht a kilo rice. Agree with you 100% that they sure could make a difference on other crops, but other than talk their is not many options in the country yet for "other crops".

Tell that to all the rice farmers where I live. Flood their rice fields with water from boreholes in dry season, and now due to lack of irrigation water from canals,

[alanrchase]

Ware consumption in Thailand has grown exponentially. Population and private consumption, agriculture and Industry. Thailand has little or no zoning or planning to speak of and farms and industry can set up anywhere. This not only affects the price of land, decreasing the viability of farming in some areas but also makes unsustainable demands on the local water supplies.

Without a thorough national survey of water supplies it is impossible to tell whether a proposed industry can be supported by the available water.....but they still go on....

The problem is that in agriculture there is little or no training for farmers to understand and manage water......farms are popping up in places that really don't have the water to supply them and so farmers look around for where they can find the water they need - this is often in amounts that are unsustainable either from ground water or local reservoirs.

There's no point in just trying to get more and more water; as part of a national water conservation campaign, there needs to be much more education for farmers on how to manage water and a review of water reservation and then distribution.

Agree with most of what you have said. Locally the method of watering all the various crops grown seems to be to flood the field once a day. I am no expert but am pretty sure they are using many times more water than is necessary. Suppose it is a case of "it has always been done like that".

I don't know rice farming either, but the kind of rice farmed in Thailand stems from the local topography - i.e. FLOOD PLAINS - the crop requires substantial amounts of water and the transplanting occurs in flooded fields.

Thailand's reason for existence as a country could be put down to the fact that the land is flat and the various rivers naturally flood the land around them, enabling rice farming. It is the subsequent untrammelled "development" outside the flood plains and consumption by other interests of diverted water that forms a substantial part of the problem.

Sorry, was not talking about rice. As far as I know rice needs flooded fields. Talking about corn, sugar cane, bananas etc. Water is pumped in one end of the field untill the ground is saturated enough for it to flow to the other end of the field. Easiest and cheapest way to do it but very wasteful.

[cumgranosalum]

Ware consumption in Thailand has grown exponentially. Population and private consumption, agriculture and Industry. Thailand has little or no zoning or planning to speak of and farms and industry can set up anywhere. This not only affects the price of land, decreasing the viability of farming in some areas but also makes unsustainable demands on the local water supplies.

Without a thorough national survey of water supplies it is impossible to tell whether a proposed industry can be supported by the available water.....but they still go on....

The problem is that in agriculture there is little or no training for farmers to understand and manage water......farms are popping up in places that really don't have the water to supply them and so farmers look around for where they can find the water they need - this is often in amounts that are unsustainable either from ground water or local reservoirs.

There's no point in just trying to get more and more water; as part of a national water conservation campaign, there needs to be much more education for farmers on how to manage water and a review of water reservation and then distribution.

Agree with most of what you have said. Locally the method of watering all the various crops grown seems to be to flood the field once a day. I am no expert but am pretty sure they are using many times more water than is necessary. Suppose it is a case of "it has always been done like that".

I don't know rice farming either, but the kind of rice farmed in Thailand stems from the local topography - i.e. FLOOD PLAINS - the crop requires substantial amounts of water and the transplanting occurs in flooded fields.

Thailand's reason for existence as a country could be put down to the fact that the land is flat and the various rivers naturally flood the land around them, enabling rice farming. It is the subsequent untrammelled "development" outside the flood plains and consumption by other interests of diverted water that forms a substantial part of the problem.

Sorry, was not talking about rice. As far as I know rice needs flooded fields. Talking about corn, sugar cane, bananas etc. Water is pumped in one end of the field untill the ground is saturated enough for it to flow to the other end of the field. Easiest and cheapest way to do it but very wasteful.

Of course if you over water it will damage those crops. They need the right amount at the right time to ensure fruit of the right size etc....but I'm sure that farm by farm the water delivery and management is not very good and a bit of a govt education program would help no end.

[Daniel Boon]

what about strains of rice that grow in dry conditions?

yeah "Rice Krispies" just add milk

time to start whipping your arse Kannot ... strains of dry rice is grown in OZ

[cumgranosalum]

what about strains of rice that grow in dry conditions?

i'm not au fait with the various aspects and strains of rice farming, but Thailand is set up to grow and export a particular kind or range of rice......their may be strains that grow in drier conditions but one has to assume that that would require a re-training of the farmers, re-organisation of land usage and then there would be a different kind of rice that Thailand would then have to re-market...it is also likely that Thailand as a newcomer to that strain would not be able to compete with countries that have been growing it for generations.

[cumgranosalum]

On top of all these issues Thailand's weather patterns are also changing.

Edited July 3, 2015 by cumgranosalum

[spidermike007]

Am I the only one to notice, or has there been less fruit in Thailand this year, than in any other years in distant memory? I see fruit stands that used to be overbrimming with fruit, and they are like a ghost shop, with just a few different kinds of fruits, and very few of them. Even at Tesco, and Makro, there is a lot less than normal. If you took away the melons, and the imported fruits, very little remains, of locally grown fruit. I was wondering what was going on, but realized most of these fruit orchards do not use irrigation, and the production of fruit is way down due to the lack of rainfall. What a shame. How many families are losing their incomes this year? What is being done to assist them? Why does the big man not call in the Navajo rainmakers? LOL.

Edited July 3, 2015 by spidermike007

[balford]

If I remember correctly, about four or five years ago a scientific team from Australia actually provided information regarding the growing of rice in damp conditions as opposed to flooding the paddy fields and thus saving a lot of water and becoming more productive.

It seems that the farmers, the irrigation department, the agricultural ministry and the relevant ministers were much smarter than these scientists and failed to heed the advice - or was it the middlemen in the seed, fertiliser and related businesses and political persuasions who put the pressure on farmers to ignore it? Now everyone is crying poor bugger me when they've been shown how to be more productive and warned time and again of drought conditions.

Bob A. Relaxed in Lampang

[SunsetT]

The told us there will be lots off rain , when the pless the baffalo one or 2 month ago , so don't worry .

I belive in that 100% .

Mark my words , the rail will come the baffalo,s know . This tradition is thousand off year old .

Now onley July 2 by July 15 all is full off water. Maybe even to much . I start planting my bananas now .

The need a lot off water too.

.....................5555555555555555555555555555555555555555555555555....................

[SunsetT]

Wow Thai meteorologist must be psychic they can do forecasts months in advance

The meteorologists are all psychic buffaloes........The most common breed in Thailand...........They can instantly predict if they can run a red light without killing someone!

Edited July 3, 2015 by SunsetT

[TPI]

...and how many billion cubic meters were lost during Songkran?...

A better question might be......How many 12mm hoses does it take to empty a megalitre dam?? One province's rice farms use much much more than Soncran! Go back to bed!

[cumgranosalum]

...and how many billion cubic meters were lost during Songkran?...

Don't attack tourism it is sacred regardless. We must reach 28 million tourist regardless it is cast in stone. I often wonder how much water 28 million tourists use?

that is a very good point - resorts especially on islands do untold damage with their reckless use of water supplies which are particularly restricted on islands.

Not only do they consume huge amounts - showers/laundry etc etc but the waste from resorts if not treated correctly is discharged into the sea where is blankets coral, pollutes the sea, changes water temp and visibility and in general ruins the beaches.

For example Koh Chang which had a population of about 5000 until the late 80s now has to support 500,000 - that's a big water bill.

Edited July 3, 2015 by cumgranosalum