Thai farmer commits suicide due to withered crop

[halloween]

Have you even looked at the link? I did and it goes back 22 YEARS. Not just 3 years or even 10 years but 22 years. There is NO political spin in it at all, simply facts and figures.

YOU are putting the political spin in there.

Have you looked at the rainfall data over the last 10 or 20 years? That is far more important than politics.

Did you take into account how much extra water was used when the PTP bought every grain of rice compared to the 10 or 20 years before that?

Water consumption. and usage is very important as well on a year by year basis. What was the increase in population over those 10 years as more people use more water? If the population increases by 10% then water consumption will increase bt at least 10% and perhaps more.

Yes, I looked at the link. I even went back 10 years. I am the one pointing out that one can not take 2.5 years and use the data for the month of July as an indication other than the water in the reservoirs in July. I had a good laugh when you told me to go back 20 years. Know what? There isn't complete data from 20 years ago. The take away conclusion is that you didn't go and look. Nice. Don't criticize me if you don't do the legwork.

I am not putting a political spin on this. I don't blame any PM for the lower amounts of water in peak dry season. I have however, pointed out that wonder boy's logic would have one blaming the current government for the current low reserves because the military was running things in July 2015 and July 2014.

In respect to your claim that the PTP was buying every grain of rice compared to 10 or 20 years before that is not supported by the data. You are telling me to go and look at the amount of water in the reservoirs. I did just that for 10 years. I even posted the numbers for the past 10 years.

The water in the reservoirs at peak drought period during the 2 years of rice pledging wasn't much different than the two prior years under the Democrat government. Had it not been for an unusually heavy monsoon season in 2011, the water levels would have been lower.

You claim the water consumption would have increased 10% or more. Well, if that was the case, why doesn't the water in the reservoir show a difference of 10% or more? Have fun fudging the data to try and support your spurious argument.

07-2013 46% PT

07- 2012 52% PT

07 -2011 59% Demo

07- 2010 46% Demo

Instead of telling me to go and look at the numbers from 10 years ago, follow your own advice. The data does not support your claim. Show me how your claim is supported. If you had a valid point, we should see significantly lower water in the reservoirs in dry season during the rice pledging program period. The data does not show that.

Why do you insist at quoting the water levels in July? What has this to do with your false claim that after the last monsoon the dams were at capacity?

The graphs show that after the 2011 floods Yingluk dumped capacity from the 2 largest storage dams, making their priority flood prevention rather than storage. Since then el Nino has moved in, and these dams have never been able to recover levels to the new low operating curve.

There is no argument who installed the new lower operating curve, or who dumped the water for fear of being blamed for another flood, just before a new low rainfall period started.

[Jay Sata]

In other words poor water management?

The numbers being bandied around suggest those in charge were not keeping their eye on the game.

What period of rain is required to get the dam levels back to normal and can it be achieved over the next few months?

[halloween]

In other words poor water management?

The numbers being bandied around suggest those in charge were not keeping their eye on the game.

What period of rain is required to get the dam levels back to normal and can it be achieved over the next few months?

from the latest figures to capacity for Bhumipol 9000MCM, for Sirikit almost 6000MCM.

18 billion cubic metres is lot of water, not this year, not next, unless we get a rainfall event like 2011.

[seahorse]

Farmers, worldwide, have the highest rate of suicide of any profession, allegedly... Just saying !

Wrong. Doctors have the highest suicide rate,

.

http://www.therichest.com/rich-list/the-biggest/the-10-professions-with-the-highest-suicide-rates/?view=all

http://mentalhealthdaily.com/2015/01/06/top-11-professions-with-highest-suicide-rates/

http://www.newhealthguide.org/Highest-Suicide-Rate-By-Profession.html

Farmers are 1.32 times more likely to commit suicide than the average person. Depending which link you want to believe, farmers are 8th or 9th.

[tbthailand]

In 2014 a few farmer suicides were reported. The usual group of frothers were fast to blame the PTP and Yingluck.

Using their twisted deficient logic at the time, the Military rulers are to blame for this suicide.

Just as I didn't play the blame game with the government in 2014, it shouldn't be done now.

Oh kid.. facts you don't like them

Farmers killed themselves because YL did not pay for the rice. She stepped down without making the necessary arrangements (stupidity .. negligence.. criminal.. take your pick) So yes there is blame there

Blaming the government for drought.. no way you can pin that on the government. (unless they mismanaged the drought just like you can mismanage a flood.. guess who did that)

She stepped down without making the necessary arrangements (stupidity .. negligence.. criminal.. take your pick)

let's try "democracy" - what else can a PM do when ...

the main opposition party resigned from parliament en masse, in advance of what they called a "final showdown" against the government.

as for blame about "not paying" it wasn't for a lack of trying that the government could not pay the rice farmers... That was one of the key activities of the PDRC

[djjamie]

Farmers, worldwide, have the highest rate of suicide of any profession, allegedly... Just saying !

Completely agree. Doesn't help much though when the previous govt promised 6 times to pay them (before the PDRC started protesting) only for their to be 6 broken promises with the families saying the suicide was attributed to non payment..

JUST SAYING!!!

[Thai at Heart]

You could have saved yourself a lot of time, trouble and BS by opening the link. The figures quoted were MAX for the year, and well below the upper limit curves for each dam. In fact Bhumipol has been below the lower curve rule for the last 2.5 years.

BTW why didn't you show me when the dams were "at capacity" which is the claim disputed?

The reservoirs will never be at full capacity in July. July is smack dab in the middle of drought season.

The reservoirs will be in their normal operating capacity in monsoon season.

Using an extreme period in an attempt to illustrate a point is misleading and will always give a false conclusion.

You are using a power generating dam to illustrate your point in respect to irrigation capacity.

The current 46% total water in reservoir is in line with historic use over the past 10 years although it is on the low side, and illustrates only that the military and the Democrats when in power have lower water levels in the reservoirs. If anything, your point would argue that the Democrats and Military are poor water resource managers. I have enough common sense to understand that it is a bit drier than usual, but more importantly, the water flowing into Thailand is reduced. However, the water did not disappear because of the former government. The military has been running the show for 2 dry seasons.

The level curves don't lie. From Jan 2012 there was a huge reduction in the levels of Bhumipol and Sirikit to the lower curve levels. Since Oct 2012, both dams dropped below the lower level curve and have been unable to reach it again since, slowly dropping away as outflows exceeded inflows.

The difference in level curves for Bhumipol is 4500 MCM, for Sirikit 3000MCM, water that could have come in quite handy now if Yingluk and co. hadn't panicked and allowed it to run out to sea. Don't open the link, the truth will hurt.

These damns cannot be run for both flood managment and irrigation. Fill up the damns for irrigation and risk floods, or empty them to save floods and risk not having enough for food. But to have both is virtually impossible over a period of many years. One way or another there will either be flood or famine.

[billd766]

In other words poor water management?

The numbers being bandied around suggest those in charge were not keeping their eye on the game.

What period of rain is required to get the dam levels back to normal and can it be achieved over the next few months?

It will take literally years to bring the water levels back up to normal because as soon as the dams start to fill they will be emptied as the country needs to recover from this drought.

I feel that it will take at least 3 years of the annual rainfall of 2011 to bring things back to something like normal.

The RID and the dam operators were keeping their eyes on the game but were over-ridden by some stupid politicians whose eyes were firmly fixed on making money from the rice crops.

[billd766]

In 2014 a few farmer suicides were reported. The usual group of frothers were fast to blame the PTP and Yingluck.

Using their twisted deficient logic at the time, the Military rulers are to blame for this suicide.

Just as I didn't play the blame game with the government in 2014, it shouldn't be done now.

Oh kid.. facts you don't like them

Farmers killed themselves because YL did not pay for the rice. She stepped down without making the necessary arrangements (stupidity .. negligence.. criminal.. take your pick) So yes there is blame there

Blaming the government for drought.. no way you can pin that on the government. (unless they mismanaged the drought just like you can mismanage a flood.. guess who did that)

She stepped down without making the necessary arrangements (stupidity .. negligence.. criminal.. take your pick)

let's try "democracy" - what else can a PM do when ...

the main opposition party resigned from parliament en masse, in advance of what they called a "final showdown" against the government.

as for blame about "not paying" it wasn't for a lack of trying that the government could not pay the rice farmers... That was one of the key activities of the PDRC

quote "as for blame about "not paying" it wasn't for a lack of trying that the government could not pay the rice farmers... That was one of the key activities of the PDRC "

Actually it WAS the fault of the government as they have many high priced lawyers whose job it should be to keep the government on the straight and narrow path.

The law in Thailand has been for many years and long before the PTP that when parliament is dissolved and a cretaker government is running the nation, the caretakers cannot bring into effect ANY large spending projects simply because they will be burdening the next government with huge amounts of debt and they may lose the election meaning the debt is inherited by the next government.

In addition the farmers had not been paid in September or October as the government had not sold the rice and put the money into the revolving fund. Effectively the rice fund was "broke". They could and should have found funds elewhere to pay the farmers BEFORE dissolving the government. If they had been able to do that they could have survived.

That they didn't do that was the fault of whoever was running the government at the time.

The rest is history.

[halloween]

The level curves don't lie. From Jan 2012 there was a huge reduction in the levels of Bhumipol and Sirikit to the lower curve levels. Since Oct 2012, both dams dropped below the lower level curve and have been unable to reach it again since, slowly dropping away as outflows exceeded inflows.

The difference in level curves for Bhumipol is 4500 MCM, for Sirikit 3000MCM, water that could have come in quite handy now if Yingluk and co. hadn't panicked and allowed it to run out to sea. Don't open the link, the truth will hurt.

These damns cannot be run for both flood managment and irrigation. Fill up the damns for irrigation and risk floods, or empty them to save floods and risk not having enough for food. But to have both is virtually impossible over a period of many years. One way or another there will either be flood or famine.

They can and are, and electricity generation as well. Most dams are multi-function, with priority given to one or the other. The trick is to let the experts decide which is a priority, and allowing that to vary with the weather predictions for each year. Yingluk's government was rightfully vilified for not dropping dam levels when they KNEW a flood peak was coming, and made the POLITICAL decision which is now biting to not be blamed again.

If the dam operation curves hadn't been dropped, those 2 dams alone would have had 7.5 billion cubic metres of water more in storage.