Afraid to go back home

[Craig krup]

Being an ex serviceman I have friends I've not spoken to for over 30 years...... What's changed? They are still my mates, I've just not spoke to them. If I bumped into them in the street tomorrow, we would go out of our way to make the reunion something to remember. I recently have made contact with a lot of my old service mates on Facebook, one came out to Thailand, he came and stayed at mine for a week.... We had a blast, it was as if we had not seen each other for only a weekend.

I only have one friend who was not an ex-service man, (would have made a good one)

No disrespect to anyone here,........... I have found most civvies just don't get this concept of still being a friend

How many people ever see anyone they know under really severe stress? People spend their whole lives with folk and you could bust that relationship to pieces with 36 hours lack of sleep and four missed meals. I was in the Officers' Training Corps at uni, and quite a few of the blokes married women they'd met there. It was a blindingly good move. it's easy to hide an essentially selfish nature but people in the military find out who the real pack animals are. If you've been awake for days you've few defences left. Let's face it we're all selected by evolution over tens of thousands of generations for our characteristics. Not being absolutely pro-social at a cellular level is a recent trick. Go back a few years and if you'd done anything for yourself and against the group you'd almost certainly be found out and then kicked out: a death sentence. They did a big analysis of the people who won the Victoria Cross. Overwhelmingly they came from large families where they'd had lots of responsibilities from an early age. All of that set them up for their big, "Don't you dare shoot at my friends" moment.

Most middle class people don't have any friends. They don't even have a sane and transparent relationship with their partners. They don't get married they undertake a merger.

[JB300]

Rubbish. as I already pointed out, I had a friend of 30 years went psychotic from too much MJ and another that I "thought" was a real friend of 20 years that turned out to be a backstabber. Not everything is "my" fault.

As you get older you have more and more questions about the actual nature of identity. Hobbes said that unchecked thoughts are mainly madness, and if people knew the vain thoughts that fly through your mind they would know that you were mad. Hume thought that learning to see yourself as a single person is learned behaviour. It's only familiarity that means you know yourself better than you know other people. You'd have to be pretty strange (or unobservant) not to have caught yourself doing something and then later thinking of a good reason why you did it, which is plausible, but which you weren't conscious of at the time. Everyone's weirder than you think they are, and so are you

If you're interested specifically in the notion of friendship you should read what Aristotle has to say in the Nicomachean Ethics. If you accept his account hardly anyone has any friends. Friends are people who admire one another's good qualities. It's got nothing to do with passing the time, enjoying their company, being useful or anything else.

As you head into the grave you begin to realise that you're on your own, and then you realise that maybe you were never a "you" at all!

Wow that was deep [emoji106]

And mildly depressing [emoji17]

[ravip]

Another big fault of Asia!

Bash 'em to smithereens!

[micmichd]

Rubbish. as I already pointed out, I had a friend of 30 years went psychotic from too much MJ and another that I "thought" was a real friend of 20 years that turned out to be a backstabber. Not everything is "my" fault.

As you get older you have more and more questions about the actual nature of identity. Hobbes said that unchecked thoughts are mainly madness, and if people knew the vain thoughts that fly through your mind they would know that you were mad. Hume thought that learning to see yourself as a single person is learned behaviour. It's only familiarity that means you know yourself better than you know other people. You'd have to be pretty strange (or unobservant) not to have caught yourself doing something and then later thinking of a good reason why you did it, which is plausible, but which you weren't conscious of at the time. Everyone's weirder than you think they are, and so are you

If you're interested specifically in the notion of friendship you should read what Aristotle has to say in the Nicomachean Ethics. If you accept his account hardly anyone has any friends. Friends are people who admire one another's good qualities. It's got nothing to do with passing the time, enjoying their company, being useful or anything else.

As you head into the grave you begin to realise that you're on your own, and then you realise that maybe you were never a "you" at all!

Wow that was deep [emoji106]

And mildly depressing [emoji17]

But true.

You are not born with an identity, you make it by using a cognitive frame (a religion, a family's view, anything)

If you can't sort things by a cognitive frame, you're deemed to run mad from overstimulation.

Thai and Farang cognitive frames are different, there's even different cognitive frames within one society (eg subcultures)

After some years in Thailand, you see things "with different eyes", and now you go back to from where you came from and are afraid people back at home won't understand you anymore. But curious they are, so why worry?

[Craig krup]

Rubbish. as I already pointed out, I had a friend of 30 years went psychotic from too much MJ and another that I "thought" was a real friend of 20 years that turned out to be a backstabber. Not everything is "my" fault.

As you get older you have more and more questions about the actual nature of identity. Hobbes said that unchecked thoughts are mainly madness, and if people knew the vain thoughts that fly through your mind they would know that you were mad. Hume thought that learning to see yourself as a single person is learned behaviour. It's only familiarity that means you know yourself better than you know other people. You'd have to be pretty strange (or unobservant) not to have caught yourself doing something and then later thinking of a good reason why you did it, which is plausible, but which you weren't conscious of at the time. Everyone's weirder than you think they are, and so are you

If you're interested specifically in the notion of friendship you should read what Aristotle has to say in the Nicomachean Ethics. If you accept his account hardly anyone has any friends. Friends are people who admire one another's good qualities. It's got nothing to do with passing the time, enjoying their company, being useful or anything else.

As you head into the grave you begin to realise that you're on your own, and then you realise that maybe you were never a "you" at all!

Wow that was deep [emoji106]

And mildly depressing [emoji17]

Ah, but then once that happens you realise that there isn't a specific you, there is only "thinking going on". You're part of universal thought. You're the universe aware of itself in thought. If you can hold that understanding in your mind a lightsaber strike will pass right through you

Edited July 14, 2015 by Craig krup

[ALFREDO]

I have been back 2 times in 31 years. Once when my mother died and second when I took my now Thai wife to get married in Hawaii. Believe me relatives including children do not like you coming back and interrupting their lives. I came back to visit old NASA buddies and say goodby. I shall never go back again as I have no business there. Previously I have offered free tickets to my sons to visit and they have declined. They are too busy with little league baseball and their mother in law's birthday and other nonsense to visit.

Hy Don, a long way

from NASA to STEAKS and RIBS in RAWAI-Phuket and then to the North in Chiang Mai.

Still in the meats, Good.

[Straight8]

Sad to say.....but I guess your "so-called" friends weren't really your friends then

I went back to australia 3 years ago,i asked my oldest son if i could possibly stay with him and his wife.Was asked for "how long"...i said 1 week.The response i got was 3 days would be ok!

That's about as low as it gets.

Your own flesh and blood. Geeee!! Quite hard to imagine.

[JB300]

Rubbish. as I already pointed out, I had a friend of 30 years went psychotic from too much MJ and another that I "thought" was a real friend of 20 years that turned out to be a backstabber. Not everything is "my" fault.

As you get older you have more and more questions about the actual nature of identity. Hobbes said that unchecked thoughts are mainly madness, and if people knew the vain thoughts that fly through your mind they would know that you were mad. Hume thought that learning to see yourself as a single person is learned behaviour. It's only familiarity that means you know yourself better than you know other people. You'd have to be pretty strange (or unobservant) not to have caught yourself doing something and then later thinking of a good reason why you did it, which is plausible, but which you weren't conscious of at the time. Everyone's weirder than you think they are, and so are you

If you're interested specifically in the notion of friendship you should read what Aristotle has to say in the Nicomachean Ethics. If you accept his account hardly anyone has any friends. Friends are people who admire one another's good qualities. It's got nothing to do with passing the time, enjoying their company, being useful or anything else.

As you head into the grave you begin to realise that you're on your own, and then you realise that maybe you were never a "you" at all!

Wow that was deep [emoji106]

And mildly depressing [emoji17]

Ah, but then once that happens you realise that there isn't a specific you, there is only "thinking going on". You're part of universal thought. You're the universe aware of itself in thought. If you can hold that understanding in your mind a lightsaber strike will pass right through you

You're scaring me now! Because as Nietzsche said...

"If you stare into the abyss, the abyss stares back at you"!

Edited July 15, 2015 by JB300

[Chicken George]

<deleted> to it all. Go somewhere else for a holiday. Unless you have to go why put yourself through it all . I feel the same although I have two wonderful children back there its just a hardship. Flight staying with someone else difficult to use any transport. No friendly bars. Weather crap. This is my home. Have a few sad moments but life here is good. Easy to think of the past and think you are missing out but your not.

[farang000999]

Huge shocker to see that all the failed family relationships are not the fault of anyone here in Thailand but instead everyone back home.

[rexpotter]

Thanks for most of the comforting replies, very nice. Nothing to solve really. Things change.

[harrry]

I once returned to live in Australia after 6 years away. I have never had culture shock (or at least had been able to adapt easily) in any other country. I think it is worse there as you expect everything to stay as you left. It has not. I know my home is now here and if I have to move it will not be back to Australia the changes now will be much too much.

[thaibeachlovers]

Rubbish. as I already pointed out, I had a friend of 30 years went psychotic from too much MJ and another that I "thought" was a real friend of 20 years that turned out to be a backstabber. Not everything is "my" fault.

As you get older you have more and more questions about the actual nature of identity. Hobbes said that unchecked thoughts are mainly madness, and if people knew the vain thoughts that fly through your mind they would know that you were mad. Hume thought that learning to see yourself as a single person is learned behaviour. It's only familiarity that means you know yourself better than you know other people. You'd have to be pretty strange (or unobservant) not to have caught yourself doing something and then later thinking of a good reason why you did it, which is plausible, but which you weren't conscious of at the time. Everyone's weirder than you think they are, and so are you

If you're interested specifically in the notion of friendship you should read what Aristotle has to say in the Nicomachean Ethics. If you accept his account hardly anyone has any friends. Friends are people who admire one another's good qualities. It's got nothing to do with passing the time, enjoying their company, being useful or anything else.

As you head into the grave you begin to realise that you're on your own, and then you realise that maybe you were never a "you" at all!

As I get old and have too much time to think, I sometimes wonder if I am in fact in the Matrix- sometimes it's the only explanation for what happens to me.

[thaibeachlovers]

I have been back 2 times in 31 years. Once when my mother died and second when I took my now Thai wife to get married in Hawaii. Believe me relatives including children do not like you coming back and interrupting their lives. I came back to visit old NASA buddies and say goodby. I shall never go back again as I have no business there. Previously I have offered free tickets to my sons to visit and they have declined. They are too busy with little league baseball and their mother in law's birthday and other nonsense to visit.

I feel for you. My father was a terrible dad, but I still went to visit him in his last days. Actually I wished I hadn't as it upset me immensly seeing him in such a bad state.

I was terribly upset when someone I thought a very good friend told me he was flying to Taiwan to see his daughter, but nothing about a stop off in Thailand to see me ( he could have done so easily- self employed and loads of dosh ). However, he later turned out to be completely bonkers anyway and a real backstabber- fooled me for 30 years though.

[Sharp]

Reading this thread got me thinking I haven't spoken to my mom for 8 years due to various reasons, not all bad I might add anyway I said sod it just call as she's 73 now and I'm happy to report within 15 mins it was if I had spoken too her last month...I made the suggestion I may well make a trip to see her early next year to which she replied 'give me enough notice so I can make the bed up', although I would of made the call to stay at a hotel so thanks for the nudge OP...

[elliss]

Sad to say.....but I guess your "so-called" friends weren't really your friends then

I went back to australia 3 years ago,i asked my oldest son if i could possibly stay with him and his wife.Was asked for "how long"...i said 1 week.The response i got was 3 days would be ok!

That's about as low as it gets.

Your own flesh and blood. Geeee!! Quite hard to imagine.

[arunsakda]

I respect a person because of their individual qualities, actions, and responsibilities. The fact that I happened to to tumble out of their vagina, is unimportant in the overall scheme of things.

[elliss]

Huge shocker to see that all the failed family relationships are not the fault of anyone here in Thailand but instead everyone back home.

Those, farlangs , who walked away from their homeland family ,

and now they expect a welcome , from kin folk back home.

Your not welcome , anymore.

Lots of love , from a distance .

Edited July 15, 2015 by elliss

[harrry]

Maybe we have been away too long, but for how many years did we go without to provide a home, food and love.. How much overtime did we work to provide the best education that we could so that our offspring can now have succesful lives and live in fine houses.

Is it really expecting too much to get a bed for a week or even two. If we had not gone without all that I think we could all stay at the Marriot for our holidays on the invested procedes of what went for their upkeep and education.

[MAJIC]

Rubbish. as I already pointed out, I had a friend of 30 years went psychotic from too much MJ and another that I "thought" was a real friend of 20 years that turned out to be a backstabber. Not everything is "my" fault.

As you get older you have more and more questions about the actual nature of identity. Hobbes said that unchecked thoughts are mainly madness, and if people knew the vain thoughts that fly through your mind they would know that you were mad. Hume thought that learning to see yourself as a single person is learned behaviour. It's only familiarity that means you know yourself better than you know other people. You'd have to be pretty strange (or unobservant) not to have caught yourself doing something and then later thinking of a good reason why you did it, which is plausible, but which you weren't conscious of at the time. Everyone's weirder than you think they are, and so are you

If you're interested specifically in the notion of friendship you should read what Aristotle has to say in the Nicomachean Ethics. If you accept his account hardly anyone has any friends. Friends are people who admire one another's good qualities. It's got nothing to do with passing the time, enjoying their company, being useful or anything else.

As you head into the grave you begin to realise that you're on your own, and then you realise that maybe you were never a "you" at all!

Wow that was deep [emoji106]

And mildly depressing [emoji17]

Ah, but then once that happens you realise that there isn't a specific you, there is only "thinking going on". You're part of universal thought. You're the universe aware of itself in thought. If you can hold that understanding in your mind a lightsaber strike will pass right through you

That's pretty strong you got there!

[Kitsune]

Sad to say.....but I guess your "so-called" friends weren't really your friends then

I went back to australia 3 years ago,i asked my oldest son if i could possibly stay with him and his wife.Was asked for "how long"...i said 1 week.The response i got was 3 days would be ok!

You know what to do with your will

[lostoday]

A war does funny stuff to your brain. I came over here a long time ago. I went back to the West after the war and never really felt at home. I came back here and felt strangely at home. I'm not a psychologist so I can't tell you exactly why my home country changed as a result of being involved in an armed conflict but it did. So, by coming here I came home. To answer the question, no I was not afraid to come back to Thailand because I considered it my home.

[longstebe]

Sad to say.....but I guess your "so-called" friends weren't really your friends then

I went back to australia 3 years ago,i asked my oldest son if i could possibly stay with him and his wife.Was asked for "how long"...i said 1 week.The response i got was 3 days would be ok!

That is very sad.

[MAJIC]

This is a good thread. I too have reached the point where, after being here for 8 years, there is very little to go back to Canada for. I have a brother who refuses to make any effort to stay in touch which really upsets me but I have slowly come to realize that Thailand is my home now and that there is no "returning home" any more.

My brother disappeared to Canada and dropped of the face of the earth. Haven't seen or heard from him in about 24 years. Don't even know if he is still alive. I tried to keep in touch but he couldn't be bothered and all contact was lost. We had not argued and were on good terms. Some people are just like that. My father hasn't heard from him in 20 years either. Absolutely no reason. They used to get on well.

Uncaring, Unfeeling,Unforgiving,Unnatural,Unmoved, ,Undesireable,Unhealthy,Ununited,Unpleasant!

[MAJIC]

I admit this is the cynical me coming out,but just say you won the Lottery,wouldn't this thread become obsolete ?and we would all be inundated with long lost family, friends clammering to enquire as to our health and whereabouts!

[redandyellow]

Becoming a perceived alien in your own country is just that - a perception.

Change your perception - and change your life.

Up to you

[MAJIC]

Friendships, like marriage need input. If not, they slowly fade away.

Frankly, if someone contacted me after being away seven years and asked me to put them up, I'd make excuses, too.

It rather depends on your mutual memories, I remember conversations from ten years ago! call it living in the past,if you like,but I can be in a conversation with a friend of 5-7-10 years and I can still have a good conversation.

Edited July 16, 2015 by MAJIC

[Whyamiandwhatamidoinghere]

For those kind of relatives and friends you have to waive some dead presidents in their faces the same you have to sometimes waive baht to stay in Thailand sometimes. With the slow economy it should be hard to find someone you can pay a hundred bucks each month to have a place your mail can go to and who will let you stay a month when you have to go back once a year. This is a must that you have some sort of residency for getting your driver's license and even state id which requires two statements from your bank, credit card, utilities or telephone bill showing you have an address in your state. If you stay outside the USA over ten years you may have problems clearing immigration especially in the present climate.

Edited July 16, 2015 by Whyamiandwhatamidoinghere

[thaibeachlovers]

This is a good thread. I too have reached the point where, after being here for 8 years, there is very little to go back to Canada for. I have a brother who refuses to make any effort to stay in touch which really upsets me but I have slowly come to realize that Thailand is my home now and that there is no "returning home" any more.

My brother disappeared to Canada and dropped of the face of the earth. Haven't seen or heard from him in about 24 years. Don't even know if he is still alive. I tried to keep in touch but he couldn't be bothered and all contact was lost. We had not argued and were on good terms. Some people are just like that. My father hasn't heard from him in 20 years either. Absolutely no reason. They used to get on well.

Sorry to hear that, but you don't really know if it was just that he "couldn't be bothered" or some deeper psychological reason. The human mind is a strange organ at the best of times.

[The Usual Suspect]

I've lived in Thailand only a few years. I used to return once a year to the U.S. to visit relatives. Every year I returned it became more and more uncomfortable. More drama, more laying on of guilt and blame for my "selfish" decision to live on the other side of the planet, (even though I'm retired and on a meager income that would make it nearly impossible to live in America). Quite frankly, although I love my family, I don't see a return to the U.S. in my future unless someone dies, maybe not even then.