Foreigners Feeling No Long Welcome In Thailand

[jamman]

I agree with the OP somewhat, the laws here do seem strange sometimes.

If my wife and i moved back to the US she could apply for a green card and then go apply to work at any company she wanted. (Or start a business with no financial requirements)

Or even no doubt be happily collecting a wellfare check within 5 years.

But for me i've got to have money every year, i cant work without getting a work permit tied to a specific company and location.

Unfortunately that is why the US is in such dire straights with their 'entitlement' programs such as govt pension budgets, medicare, and social security. Too many people have been granted 'rights' too easily at the expense of everyone else. Thailand's monetary requirement for immigrants keeps it from becoming a socialist welfare state and a magnet for free loaders.

Social services spent on lazy people are a recognizable face for a part of how money moves in the US. Is this face the main cause of budget deficits? The numbers for debt payments invoke less immediate outrage, and numbers for military spending, or corporate tax breaks are also faceless.

People taking more than giving do cause social problems, but the numbers explain the story in less human terms.

[jdinasia]

pssssssssssssssssssst <Think Thailand >

[thohts]

I agree with the OP somewhat, the laws here do seem strange sometimes.

If my wife and i moved back to the US she could apply for a green card and then go apply to work at any company she wanted. (Or start a business with no financial requirements)

Or even no doubt be happily collecting a wellfare check within 5 years.

But for me i've got to have money every year, i cant work without getting a work permit tied to a specific company and location.

Unfortunately that is why the US is in such dire straights with their 'entitlement' programs such as govt pension budgets, medicare, and social security. Too many people have been granted 'rights' too easily at the expense of everyone else. Thailand's monetary requirement for immigrants keeps it from becoming a socialist welfare state and a magnet for free loaders.

I doubt it.

I think it's mostly due to corruption in the highest and an overzealous military budget, not social spending.

[thohts]

Our societies frown on racism.

As a whole, perhaps. But it is not the Ideal that walks down the street. Many (most?) of the population of these enlightened Western socieities still participate in some form of racism whether they realize it or not. My goodness, it's just like in the rest of the world!

Which method is better... blatant or subtle and masked? Who knows...

[the swagman]

Our societies frown on racism.

As a whole, perhaps. But it is not the Ideal that walks down the street. Many (most?) of the population of these enlightened Western socieities still participate in some form of racism whether they realize it or not. My goodness, it's just like in the rest of the world!

Which method is better... blatant or subtle and masked? Who knows...

Racism may be frowned upon in polite circles but hey it's alive and kicking in the West. It may not be in your face but it is there.

[Maizefarmer]

Are we welcome in Thailand?

For every one bad experiance a person has, there are 10 000 who have had a good time.

You take yourself wherever you go - its what you make of it, and if you have had a bad experiance ditto ditto - again I say - its what you make of it.

Comparing those who live here to those who are just vsiting is like comparing apples and oranges. I know guys who have been here years and don't read, write or speak the language properly. If you are going to live here its important that you do. You will find life and the way Thais treat you very different. As I said - its what you make of it.

Tim

[jamman]

Our societies frown on racism.

As a whole, perhaps. But it is not the Ideal that walks down the street. Many (most?) of the population of these enlightened Western socieities still participate in some form of racism whether they realize it or not. My goodness, it's just like in the rest of the world!

Which method is better... blatant or subtle and masked? Who knows...

So you are saying that racism is ubiquitous, the only difference between countries is how hidden it is.

I disagree. I think there is a difference in degree. Some cultures are not only more obviously racist, but simply more racist.

I do agree that most people in all countries are somewhat racist. But I also think that one person can be more racist than another person, and one culture can have more of these more racist people than another culture.

We have to careful about reverse racism also. If there is really nothing wrong with Thais, then there is also nothing wrong with us. But that would be very arrogant, to think there is nothing wrong with us. So there must also be things wrong with Thais. And if you respect that they have a unique and different culture, you should respect that what might be wrong with them may be different than what is wrong with us.

Logic.

Edited September 26, 2006 by jamman

[Donz]

Our societies frown on racism.

As a whole, perhaps. But it is not the Ideal that walks down the street. Many (most?) of the population of these enlightened Western socieities still participate in some form of racism whether they realize it or not. My goodness, it's just like in the rest of the world!

Which method is better... blatant or subtle and masked? Who knows...

So you are saying that racism is ubiquitous, the only difference between countries is how hidden it is.

I disagree. I think there is a difference in degree. Some cultures are not only more obviously racist, but simply more racist.

And its easy for a white person to say asian/black countries are racist, but they will never know How a black/asian are treated in white countried=s.

My point is that each race will say the other race is racist. And Thailand is not even that racist compared to many other western countries

[jamman]

I just spent 10 minutes waiting for the crashed computer to reboot. Killer instincts that reach back millions of years became modernized as I imagined picking up the PC and hurling into the center of the internet cafe, splintering the CPU into pieces, and then splintering the dead pieces even more.

Kill it until even the dead is dead. Phew.

Ok. Through the creative art of the above paragraph, perhaps I reclaimed some of the time the PC stole from me - many of you read the above (all of you?), and so I have multiplied.

More simple irrefutable logic - just a repeat - if any one person can be different than any one other, and if people are at least slightly affected by their fellows, it follows that there will be societies, cultures, that are different.

If societies and cultures are different, they are not the same but different, they are different. Different means different.

All over this forum are the weak pimply pox presentations that a person should not generalize. A TV screen generalizes, from pixels, to form a picture. Pictures are different. Societies are different. Each pixel is different, and each pixel beside a contrasting pixel forms a picture.

Edited September 26, 2006 by jamman

[Little_Buddy]

For those of you who can't see the deepseated resentment, hatred and racism towards Farang in Thailand I suggest you're either blind, ignorant or you just haven't been here long enough.

The question is whether you can look past all that to the upside, of which there is a considerable one, and enjoy it.

Farang who think like that are racist themselves IMO

I'm not sure I understand. Are you saying that recognizing racism makes one a racist?

[Little_Buddy]

Our societies frown on racism.

As a whole, perhaps. But it is not the Ideal that walks down the street. Many (most?) of the population of these enlightened Western socieities still participate in some form of racism whether they realize it or not. My goodness, it's just like in the rest of the world!

Which method is better... blatant or subtle and masked? Who knows...

So you are saying that racism is ubiquitous, the only difference between countries is how hidden it is.

I disagree. I think there is a difference in degree. Some cultures are not only more obviously racist, but simply more racist.

I do agree that most people in all countries are somewhat racist. But I also think that one person can be more racist than another person, and one culture can have more of these more racist people than another culture.

We have to careful about reverse racism also. If there is really nothing wrong with Thais, then there is also nothing wrong with us. But that would be very arrogant, to think there is nothing wrong with us. So there must also be things wrong with Thais. And if you respect that they have a unique and different culture, you should respect that what might be wrong with them may be different than what is wrong with us.

Logic.

Bravo jamman!

[Little_Buddy]

And its easy for a white person to say asian/black countries are racist, but they will never know How a black/asian are treated in white countried=s.

My point is that each race will say the other race is racist. And Thailand is not even that racist compared to many other western countries

So you admit that some countries are more racist than others.

It seems to me that at least the LAWS of various countries can be used to see very real differences.

As someone mentioned, the US is pretty darn color-blind when it comes to immigration and naturalization - in fact, it is harder for Europeans to immigrate to the US than for people from "non-white" countries.

Then you go to Japan, and you try to take your girl to a club, and are told flat out "Japanese only". That kind of crap is unthinkable in the US. But do the Japanese care? Not a bit. They think it's only natural to be racist and look down on everyone else - but boy do they resent any perceived anti-Japanese bias, and they remember history, in a highly distorted manner, where they are always the victims, never the aggressors.

Back in the day I was a student in Japan. I went with two Japanese friends to see an American film about the Vietnam war (every one of which made the US look bad; this one was no exception). After the movie, there was an awkward silence as we walked away from the theater. Finally, one of them asked me in a sullen, accusatory "so, are you proud to be an American?"

At the time, I meekly answered "not always!", and let it go. Back then I had been mostly influenced by the mainstream US media, which is itself extremely anti-American.

But today, I would answer this way: "Hey, at least in America we're free to make movies criticizing our own country. I'd like to see a Japanese movie criticizing Japanese conduct in WWII - it would be unthinkable. Are you proud to be Japanese? You have no idea what Japanese soldiers did all over Asia - if you did, you wouldn't dare ask me such a question in regard to the Vietnam war. If we'd won in Vietnam, the people of Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia would be at least as well-off as the Thai people are today. If Japan had beat the US - can you imagine that the US would today be as stable and prosperous a place as Japan is under Pax Americana? Again, unthinkable".

[Donz]

And its easy for a white person to say asian/black countries are racist, but they will never know How a black/asian are treated in white countried=s.

My point is that each race will say the other race is racist. And Thailand is not even that racist compared to many other western countries

So you admit that some countries are more racist than others.

It seems to me that at least the LAWS of various countries can be used to see very real differences.

As someone mentioned, the US is pretty darn color-blind when it comes to immigration and naturalization - in fact, it is harder for Europeans to immigrate to the US than for people from "non-white" countries.

Then you go to Japan, and you try to take your girl to a club, and are told flat out "Japanese only". That kind of crap is unthinkable in the US. But do the Japanese care? Not a bit. They think it's only natural to be racist and look down on everyone else - but boy do they resent any perceived anti-Japanese bias, and they remember history, in a highly distorted manner, where they are always the victims, never the aggressors.

Back in the day I was a student in Japan. I went with two Japanese friends to see an American film about the Vietnam war (every one of which made the US look bad; this one was no exception). After the movie, there was an awkward silence as we walked away from the theater. Finally, one of them asked me in a sullen, accusatory "so, are you proud to be an American?"

At the time, I meekly answered "not always!", and let it go. Back then I had been mostly influenced by the mainstream US media, which is itself extremely anti-American.

But today, I would answer this way: "Hey, at least in America we're free to make movies criticizing our own country. I'd like to see a Japanese movie criticizing Japanese conduct in WWII - it would be unthinkable. Are you proud to be Japanese? You have no idea what Japanese soldiers did all over Asia - if you did, you wouldn't dare ask me such a question in regard to the Vietnam war. If we'd won in Vietnam, the people of Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia would be at least as well-off as the Thai people are today. If Japan had beat the US - can you imagine that the US would today be as stable and prosperous a place as Japan is under Pax Americana? Again, unthinkable".

Well that was just an opinion. Its very easy to say one country is more racist then another but who really knows. Well some clubs in sydney dont allow asians in unless they are wilth white people. They dont flat out say it but make up stories why you cant get in. There is also organisations that are flat out racists too. KKK is an example also many simulars going around.

There is also different types, some are nothing and they may just look at them differently some will want to harm them etc.

[Sing_Sling]

But today, I would answer this way: "Hey, at least in America we're free to make movies criticizing our own country. I'd like to see a Japanese movie criticizing Japanese conduct in WWII - it would be unthinkable.

Actually, there are. In the last decade several Japanese film makers and writers have approached the subject with an almost self-destructive zeal. Possibly you could do a very simple google search to save you some embarassment.

Having said this, there is no doubt that Japanese are fairly racist, at least openly so - I was once blocked from going into a club in Kyoto - - - reason was acceptable - - - they had previously had quite a few problems with US soldiers getting drunk and starting fights. Now the customers were uncomfortable with gaijin there, and no, I am not fat out of shape looking . . .

Sometimes it pays to look beyond the obvious.

I have , aside from that one instance, NEVER felt ill-treated in Japan - quite the contrary, and I have been there close to 50 times in the last ten years.

If we'd won in Vietnam, the people of Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia would be at least as well-off as the Thai people are today.

Umm, you're joking, right? To follow this logic, Thailand is only properous because the US won a war here? Vietnam war debate, perhaps? reasons as pure as Iraq . . .

If Japan had beat the US - can you imagine that the US would today be as stable and prosperous a place as Japan is under Pax Americana? Again, unthinkable".

Unthinkable? I am amazed at the self-importance you attach to the US 'guiding' the world on the oath of the righteous, as if before the Us there was this big empty void where people lived in caves and ate roots and berries.

I'm sure you mean well, but a bit less of the rah-rah rhetoric might do you some good and win you some friends, as at the moment you sound as friendly as the guy who asked where other people's countries were in 1944 and as sweet as the &lt;deleted&gt; who referred to the Thai muslims as mo-fo's, anoteyr compratriot of yours . . .

As for racism occuring everywhere . . . of course it does, but there are at least three kinds:

Government-sponsored and supported racism - eg. Malaysia

Government accepted racism - eg. Thailand

Government outlawed racism - eg. most countries

Edited September 27, 2006 by Sing_Sling

[Donz]

But today, I would answer this way: "Hey, at least in America we're free to make movies criticizing our own country. I'd like to see a Japanese movie criticizing Japanese conduct in WWII - it would be unthinkable.

Actually, there are. In the last decade several Japanese film makers and writers have approached the subject with an almost self-destructive zeal. Possibly you could do a very simple google search to save you some embarassment.

Having said this, there is no doubt that Japanese are fairly racist, at least openly so - I was once blocked from going into a club in Kyoto - - - reason was acceptable - - - they had previously had quite a few problems with US soldiers getting drunk and starting fights. Now the customers were uncomfortable with gaijin there, and no, I am not fat out of shape looking . . .

Sometimes it pays to look beyond the obvious.

I have , aside from that one instance, NEVER felt ill-treated in Japan - quite the contrary, and I have been there close to 50 times in the last ten years.

If we'd won in Vietnam, the people of Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia would be at least as well-off as the Thai people are today.

Umm, you're joking, right? To follow this logic, Thailand is only properous because the US won a war here? Vietnam war debate, perhaps? reasons as pure as Iraq . . .

If Japan had beat the US - can you imagine that the US would today be as stable and prosperous a place as Japan is under Pax Americana? Again, unthinkable".

Unthinkable? I am amazed at the self-importance you attach to the US 'guiding' the world on the oath of the righteous, as if before the Us there was this big empty void where people lived in caves and ate roots and berries.

I'm sure you mean well, but a bit less of the rah-rah rhetoric might do you some good and win you some friends, as at the moment you sound as friendly as the guy who asked where other people's countries were in 1944 and as sweet as the &lt;deleted&gt; who referred to the Thai muslims as mo-fo's, anoteyr compratriot of yours . . .

As for racism occuring everywhere . . . of course it does, but there are at least three kinds:

Government-sponsored and supported racism - eg. Malaysia

Government accepted racism - eg. Thailand

Government outlawed racism - eg. most countries

Come on Sing sling, now your just being anti american

[the swagman]

I'm sure you mean well, but a bit less of the rah-rah rhetoric might do you some good and win you some friends,

Come on Sing sling, now your just being anti american

I agree with Sing Sling.

America has some of the biggest red necks in the world and you tell me they are not racist.

[Donz]

I'm sure you mean well, but a bit less of the rah-rah rhetoric might do you some good and win you some friends,

Come on Sing sling, now your just being anti american

I agree with Sing Sling.

America has some of the biggest red necks in the world and you tell me they are not racist.

I was being sarcastic

[Ulysses G.]

I agree with Sing Sling.

America has some of the biggest red necks in the world and you tell me they are not racist.

Sorry, but English yobs are right up there with our rednecks and they travel to other countries and bother people there.

Good ole' boys prefer to stay home in Alabamy and lynch folks of color in front of the police station where they get some sympathy.

Edited September 27, 2006 by Ulysses G.

[meadish_sweetball]

...it would be nice if we could try to steer this topic back to Thailand again. And perhaps go a little easy on the sarcasms, as a lot of people don't get them.

[Sing_Sling]

Sorry Meadish . . .

No, Donz, honest. I'm not.

I just don't like the way some smug self-satisfying people get off spinning half-truths and associated nonsense while turning a blind eye to reality while singing their national anthem.

I've lived in the US a few times and I did my MBA there - nothing against them at all . . . I guess that changes when you had up into the Appalachian region where they have just been told the a man has landed on the moon . . .and he be 'Mercan!

I think that, generally, 'invaders' are not welcome anywhere, whether they are the waves of immigrants that swept into Australia and the US from Italy, Greece, Vietnam etc . . . or into the UK, France and Germany from the West Indies, India, Africa and Turkey.

I believe the difference between those immigrants and the oens we are talking about in Thailand is that these people did not think they are going to be indispensable or that they were of such importance to their new host country.

Having said that, however, there were no laws that actively exceluded them from certain parts of the economy, as it is the case in Thaland

Edited September 27, 2006 by Sing_Sling

[Maizefarmer]

Do you feel wlecom in Thailand - or used and ripped off.

In the case of visitors for every 1 that has a bad experaince there are 10 000 others who conclude they had a good experiance - but its always th ebad one you here about.

In the case of ex-pats who live here, other than for the fact that you take yourself where ever you go and there is no getting away from yourself, what remains is to make the best of the enviorment you have decided to settled in. Sure, they are going to bumps along the way, but speaking for myself, just as in the case of tourists - for every 1 bad experiance I have had, I have had a 1000 good experiances.

As for racisim in Thailand - no more so against Europeans than I have seen it practised against Asians in Europe - in fact if there is a kernel of truth in what the media reports, at times blatant racisim is practised against Asian immigrants in European countries.

And where ever we (other than our own home countries) if it is so bad that we can't stomach it - then we are always free to leave.

Thats my take on the subject.

Tim

[Little_Buddy]

If we'd won in Vietnam, the people of Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia would be at least as well-off as the Thai people are today.

Umm, you're joking, right? To follow this logic, Thailand is only properous because the US won a war here? Vietnam war debate, perhaps? reasons as pure as Iraq . . .

Umm, no - not joking. You have a strange logic to come up with what you did. How did you get that? That can only come from your own anti-Americanism. What I meant was that if the US had won the Vietnam war - Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia wouldn't have been plunged into a decades-long nightmare of communist economics, poverty and starvation, not to mention brutal repression, torture, murder and genocide in which MILLIONS died. They would've had capitalist economies integrated into the global economy, like Thailand, and could've/would've exported their way to relative prosperity, like Thailand.

Reasons as pure? Yeah - it's called "geopolitics". It doesn't get any purer than that. It was never just about Vietnam or Iraq. The world is a deadly serious chess-game, played by big powers with small powers. Then, as now, we were really playing against the Russians & Chinese. If we don't counter our enemies from time to time, they will continue to gain strength and eventually defeat the West and impose a radically different way of life that you apparently have no idea about. Imagine living under a fascist or communist regime or under Islamic law. You think Pax Americana is so bad? Think again. If we still had Pax Britannica the situation would be the same, and I'd be supporting Britain as defender of the West, instead of bitching and sniping at you guys and wishing for your downfall like you do to us.

If Japan had beat the US - can you imagine that the US would today be as stable and prosperous a place as Japan is under Pax Americana? Again, unthinkable".

Unthinkable? I am amazed at the self-importance you attach to the US 'guiding' the world on the oath of the righteous, as if before the Us there was this big empty void where people lived in caves and ate roots and berries.

Yet another ridiculous conclusion you jump to about where I'm coming from. (Maybe if you knew history better you'd understand what I was saying?) What I meant was that after the US defeated Japan in 1945 (in a war THEY started), we helped them get back on their feet, provided protection from Russia and China, and allowed them open-access to our market, allowing them to become the 2nd biggest economy in the world, with a top-notch standard of living. We know what Japan had planned for North America (and Australia) in the event they were victorious - we were to become a slave race - beasts of burden, much like our soldiers they worked to death in Burma.

I'm sure you mean well, but a bit less of the rah-rah rhetoric might do you some good and win you some friends, as at the moment you sound as friendly as the guy who asked where other people's countries were in 1944 and as sweet as the &lt;deleted&gt; who referred to the Thai muslims as mo-fo's, anoteyr compratriot of yours . . .

Don't know about the first reference, but I think in the second case the "&lt;deleted&gt;" was referring to Thai Muslim TERRORISTS, not Muslims in general. I don't see any problem whatsoever with referring to terrorists as mo-fos, and I don't know why you would.

I do mean well - thanks for giving me the benefit of the doubt. I'm not some old-fashioned, knee-jerk, "my country right or wrong" America-firster. I want one big peaceful, prosperous, united and happy world. But I'm realistic enough to know that Pax Americana is the best chance of that happening. THAT is why I'm pro-American. And I'm just tired of all the knee-jerk America-bashing. No - tired isn't the right word - I'm appalled, shocked, exasperated, incredulous.

Americans are rednecks? Really!? Every country is full of rednecks! Go outside any major city anywhere in the world and you're gonna see mostly poorly educated, ignorant, ethnocentric, bigoted people. Who's better than Americans? Seriously! Think about it sometime. Who would you rather lead the world - Americans, Russians, Japanese, Chinese or Muslims? You think the typical Russian, Chinese or Muslim isn't an ignorant, brutal "redneck"?

And frankly, Europeans aren't all that enlightened either. If they were, maybe the Muslim youth of Europe wouldn't be so completely unemployed, alienated, and pissed off, even though they were born in Europe, grew up there, speak the languages like natives, etc. Muslim-Americans are MUCH better integrated and assimilated. You don't see American-born Muslims blowing up our commuter trains, stabbing intellectuals to death in broad daylight, or rampaging through the city for days on end torching cars like you do in Europe.

That's because you can BECOME an American, in a way that Europeans just don't accept foreigners as English, French, Dutch or Spanish. That's because we Americans are much more accepting, much more tolerant. It doesn't matter if you're white, black, Latino, East Asian, South Asian or Middle Eastern - if you simply behave like a decent human being, you'll be accepted here as a full human being and treated as an equal by the vast majority of the population. That's simply not the case in most countries I know of. Again, to clarify - what I'm saying is that no matter how assimilated a Turk, Arab or Pakistani is, he's not going to be accepted as a real German, Frenchman or Brit, and will suffer from different treatment and the resulting alienation. But any of them would be accepted as a real American (or Canadian, I think).

Another example - my Hong Kong Chinese roomate (in college) told me he was glad to be in America after hearing about his Chinese friends' experiences of racism in Britain and Australia.

Edited September 30, 2006 by Little_Buddy

[MarkBKK]

That's because you can BECOME an American, in a way that Europeans just don't accept foreigners as English, French, Dutch or Spanish. That's because we Americans are much more accepting, much more tolerant. It doesn't matter if you're white, black, Latino, East Asian, South Asian or Middle Eastern - if you simply behave like a decent human being, you'll be accepted here as a full human being and treated as an equal by the vast majority of the population.

Is this meant to be a joke? It certainly reads like one.

[Little_Buddy]

That's because you can BECOME an American, in a way that Europeans just don't accept foreigners as English, French, Dutch or Spanish. That's because we Americans are much more accepting, much more tolerant. It doesn't matter if you're white, black, Latino, East Asian, South Asian or Middle Eastern - if you simply behave like a decent human being, you'll be accepted here as a full human being and treated as an equal by the vast majority of the population.

Is this meant to be a joke? It certainly reads like one.

If it reads like a joke, where's the punchline?

[Indifferent]

I think it's an interesting dichotomy (if thats how you spell it).

On the one hand, I'm treated with contempt, looked down on and attempts to be ripped off.

Why?

Because I am a farang. I am a white westerner who only comes over for a couple of weeks as a sex tourist, shouts and hollars like I own the place and treats Thais like peasants.

On the other hand.

Thai people that know that I am not the above actually give me due respect and sometimes preferrential treatment.

They tell me about special promotions to save me money, give me better seats in restaurants, invite me to sit and drink form THEIR bottle of whisky, invite me round for dinner and on trips out and the only arguements we have is who should pay the bill (and by that I mean we all want to pay).

Why?

Because I'm a farang. I'm a nice bloke that gets drunk a bit to often but is still funny and respectful. I always pay my way and if someone needs help now and again then theres no problem (as long as it isn't money )

The dichotomy is this.....

The first category is what the new visa regulations and the authorities generally are encouraging. But this is the sort of person they neither want or need.

Edited September 30, 2006 by Indifferent

[robitusson]

So Sad now about Thailand.

extensions and visa fees gone up by 400%. no long 3 million investment enough. no lon 400,000 in a thai bank for them to keep when we die enough.

Then the 30 day visa kickout.

Next more bad news, more unwelcome messages.

I'm not really welcome here.

They're very afraid of us foreigners, poor dears.

With our strange big noses, big bulky bodies and hair that looks like straw we frighten them.

Our different way of speaking and behaving is unfamiliar and different to them therefore it must be feared and controlled.

They do like our shiny toys and gadgets and our lovely, lovely, sweet money though so they need some of us to stay here, but under strict control!

[El Taco Loco]

Give the OP a break. We all have our bad days. I understand where he comes from and I am sure most of you do as well.

Should he have completely gone off the deep end in the post? Nope, but I understood what he said.

5 years here and I sometimes get fed up of being treated like a nigger (sorry for the french). My local Burmese street sweeper has a one year id card and I have to do visa runs or show 400k in the bank to have a 1 year. I am jealous (of her id card, not her standard of living).

I leave the house never knowing if I will have an accident. I hate it.

But all in all, beats the hel_l outtova 1.5 hour commute anywhere in LA or 2 hour commute in London. All in all, with all the bad points, there are far more positives and at the end of the day, I am comfortable here, sorta.

[Sing_Sling]

Little Buddy, nice post - I disagree with quite a bit of it, however,first and foremost your contention that I am anti-American . . . this is such rot . . . particularly as you have no idea who I am, none at all, and this is the problem with what comes after.

You seem to be boxing out of a corner, a corner you put yourself in, very similar to the position the US put themselves in during their isolationist period. History? Yes, my speciality.

Not agreeing or liking a viewpoint expressed does not make one anti-american, but this is what the american psyche has sadly turned into - based on the crap heaped on americans due to the moronic policies of Bush. What is particularly silly about this is that most expat americans are actually more in the Dems camp. So, I guess I would also get paranoid and defensive.

I'm not going to write a tome here about this issue and the only quote I will use is the following and I use it to illustrate and amplify the idea that you have where the world begins and ends with yourselves:

Who's better than Americans?

This quote is not even worth discussing as it simply blooms of arrogance, self-importance and general ignorance and smacks of McCarthyism's 'Reds under the Beds' rhetoric.

And this is what many, many people find difficult to digest.

The days of the Cold War are over and unfortunately the US has lost the moral highground we were led to believe they had. Realpolitik sets in where polemics departs.

Again, though, nice post and you do argue your points eloquently, sadly the content doesn't go past simple self-important and self-righteous nationalistic and xenophobic rhetoric.

Now, to get back to thailand and the OP's topic . . .perhaps he would have phrased it better somehwhere along the lines of the Thai legal framework not being foreigner-friendly.

[Ulysses G.]

Little Buddy, nice post - I disagree with quite a bit of it, however,first and foremost your contention that I am anti-American . . .

You seem to be boxing out of a corner, a corner you put yourself in, very similar to the position the US put themselves in during their isolationist period. History? Yes, my speciality... Blah, blah blah....

[Sing_Sling]

Little Buddy, nice post - I disagree with quite a bit of it, however,first and foremost your contention that I am anti-American . . .

You seem to be boxing out of a corner, a corner you put yourself in, very similar to the position the US put themselves in during their isolationist period. History? Yes, my speciality... Blah, blah blah....

Ah, Ulysses . . . eloquent as ever!