Airport, PM's Deals Face Probes

[fruittbatt]

Let us hope that, when this current crisis resolves itself, there are a few more women in the highest political positions.

Despite what many Thais might think, there are an amazing number of Thai women holding all sorts of professional positions throughout the country. Who will be enlightened enough to give politics a go?

Perhaps then there will be a greater sense of balance, fairness, and equity for all of Thailand's peoples, whether in the country or the city.

Laulen

Khunying Jaruvan is a truly outstanding and courageous woman as is the forensic-pathologist Khunying Porntip. And for that matter so are all the Thai women with less public profiles who have conducted their family businesses and controlled the domestic purse-strings and maintained their families through their enterprising commercial spirit over many centuries in all of South East Asia.

I don't see a political career as a pinnacle of women's success any more than I think male politicians are worthy of great respect. Nor do I think that because a politician is a woman she is likely to bring elevated qualities to the job. (Angela Merckel, Condi Rice eg).

What I would hope for women and girls under a new government is sex-education (for boys and girls), including AIDS awareness and contraception advice, and classroom-based examination of the implications of the Thai "beauty myth" (skin whitening, excessive slimming, subservient "femininity") for teenage Thai girls. Addressing these issues would begin to help young women build self-esteem and see through western advertising ploys and self-limiting "romantic" notions of feminine "roles".

[Plus]

I think Martin's view of rural-urban divide is overly simplistic. Middle class didn't even exist some fifty years ago and now it's comprised of mostly sons and daughters of rural folks who "made it" in Bangkok.

They don't have any prejudice against their fathers. In fact I don't know anyone who'd look down at farmers or threat them as inferiors as a matter of principle. It's their local, upcountry honchos who abuse them in any possible way, not middle class, not urbanites.

Another point, if those farmers are indeed so happy tilling the land, let them be. Why should they vote at all? They have no interest nor understanding of big time politics, they don't see the implications of their irresponsible voting.

Thaksin was a bit like Abramovich who quickly bought shares in recently privatised Soviet companies from individual shareholders for pittance and became the richest man in the UK. From those workers point of view they got a good deal on their "stock options", from maroeconomic point of view it was a disaster. Some of those oligarchs are now in exile in the UK, some are in jail. Russian experiment with democracy is considered a flop judging by editorials.

Democracy WILL NOT work without responsible, knowledgable population, without strong middle class. Perhaps Thailand should roll back to ancient Greece and strip the farmers of their voting rights. Let them pass an exam of sorts first. In fact let everybody pass a test on politics before having a go at elections.

[Martin]

Thank you for your good wishes 'fruitbatt'.

I should explain that I don't like Thaksin, nor do I defend him. (And, some weeks ago, I used to preface my postings by saying that. I think I should get back in that habit!!)

What I do is to look for an explanation of why there is no majority anti-Thaksin feeling 'up here'.

It might help people 'down there' not to be surprised if Thaksin makes a come-back.

The reason that Thaksin's 'ripping-off' of 1% of GDP is not something that agitates my neighbours can, I think, be explained by the fact that tax collectors used to be sent out from the capital and their remuneration was that they could keep part of what they collected for themselves.

It was only if that was seen to be grossly more than about 10% of what they collected that they were being wrongfully greedy.

So a mere 1% sticking to Thaksin's fingers isn't going to raise eyebrows.

We western-centrics were brought up in a society where professional people (including politicians) were paid an adequate salary and were supposed to handle all financial matters with complete probity. But that is "orgware" that hasn't yet been adopted into general thinking here (yet).

Another reason why there is not the condemnation of Dr T. 'up here' may be (to quote a US diplomat who was asked how America could have supported an opprobrious foreign dictator) "Yes, he was a basstarrd. But he was OUR basstarrd".

(Dr T. was from the North, not Isaan, but we know that Bangkok sneers at both equally.)

There may have been a bit of feeling that, if Dr T. was 'getting up the noses' of our traditional oppressors, he must have been doing something right!

As I said, I am not defending him, nor condoning his actions, but I am looking for explanations of why he isn't disliked 'up here'.

And I am pointing out that (to quote Winston Churchill): "Any outgoing government is judged by the electorate on the state of trade and employment at the end of their term of office."

Whatever government is installed shortly in Bangkok had better keep its eye on the economic ball, and not be totally mesmerised by drawing up a new Constitutional blueprint.

Otherwise the next election could be a re-run of 2001, when Thailand looked for a CEO, with a track record of making his firm profitable, to come in and run Thailand Inc.

[Plus]

(Dr T. was from the North, not Isaan, but we know that Bangkok sneers at both equally.)

NO, we don't.

Bangkok appreciates and respects them for what they do - farming. Politics is not their strong point, they don't get any brownies for that, and it's only fair.

And why is that South dislikes thaksin as much as Bangkokians if not more? I don't mean deep South, I mean from Prachuap to Surat, to Phuket to Nakhon Si Thammarat and farther down.

If you theory is good, it should be applicable to the South, too.

[jdinasia]

and Bangkok rather respects Chiang Mai ... for many reasons

[desmond]

Even if gets protection from extradition on some legal grounds, they would protect him only while in the UK. If he travels to France and Thailand requests extradition, he's in hot water again.

I bet the UK government has its fingers crossed that he won't apply for asylum and cause them all sorts of legal problems.

It's just an unfair game. Shame on you, Jaruwan. You did everything for country or your position.

"I come from Mars", beware of what you say ! If you have nothing to say, then SHUT UP your bloody mouth

[lannarebirth]

and Bangkok rather respects Chiang Mai ... for many reasons

I agree. I get Thai visitors from Bangkok every few weeks, and every one of them wants to either re-locate or take a second home up north. They seem to all harbor forest and mountain homestead dreams . I will say they tend to look down on some of the local people, believing they are somewhat unsophisticated.

[Maizefarmer]

Thaksin enjoys no special priviledges in the UK.

He arrived from New York and cleared through UK customs using the diplomatic procedure - as would any other foreign head of state. Such does not allow him to stay in the UK with indefinite leave.

He will be treated as any other diplomate will be treated. That status will expire if a new Thai PM is put in place (elected or not) and the FO choices to recognise the new PM. He will then be subject the same visa rules & regs as any other Thai citizen staying in Thailand.

Should he wish to stay in the UK indefinitely he will have to apply for indefinate leave to stay, and the only real grounds he has for that currently would be "extra-ordinary" e.g. fear of persecution here in Thailand. Very difficult in his case, because if legal process commenses against him the FO does not see Thailand as one of those places where you get your head chopped off unfairly i.e. he will have to fight it out in the UK court should he wish to stay and the FO/Immigration do not like the UK to be used as a shelter for anyone seeking to avoid due legal process. Ask Gen, Pinochet - and was an FO friend which the UK owed far more favours to (re: his help in the Falklands war) than Thaksin!

If Thaksin has to leave the UK, and is not destined for Thailand what will he do - run for another European country and again apply for assylum(?).

Nope, if the Thai courts want him back and its a genuine case aginst him, then back he will be sent.

On balance though he appears to have things in his favour at the moment. He was a democraticaly elected PM who was overthrown in an illegal coup. The odd thing was, that as much as Western leaders commented that "democracy" needed to be re-instituted to Thailand asap", not one has said Thaksin should be put back as PM.

Lets hope this does not turn out to be a case of better the devil you know than the devil you don't, because quite frankly as questionable as many of Thaksins decisions were, I cant help but wonder just how much progress towards democracy has Thailand actually made since the last time the military flexed its political muscle (1991 - i.e. the fact that it still can do this).

To the average visitor/long term stayer - I dont think its going to make a dot bit of differance to us (and its all way above the visa policy changes taking place).

Tim

[jdinasia]

Thaksin is not <and has never been> the Head of State of the Kingdom of Thailand

[Richard W]

Thaksin is not <and has never been> the Head of State of the Kingdom of Thailand

... and never should be!

[animatic]

Iron lady, yeah that fits well.

They had been trying to get her axed for ages,

And hamstring her actions if she still was functioning.

I am sure that many people appreciated her efforts.

And now they will likely bear ripe fruit.

I wish her well, she has grit.

[penzman]

Would Thaksin have the nerve to leave his family members here and see them investigated and probably prosecuted while he lives the good life abroad? If he does seek and gets exile abroad, protesters were right in calling him "heeaa" ( low life, sub-human), if he doesn't, protesters were still right.

[Tony Clifton]

So does the mean TV will be doing a bye bye Thaksin Party at Sin?

That's an idea! I last got pickled at the Blues Factory's 5th anniversary.

Back to the airport probe, does anyone kow where is Mr. CTX , Suryia ? My favorite incompetent Thai politician, next to Thaksin since Thaksin did not shove him aside when the CTX scandal popped up. I just can't wait to see that idiotic smile smeared all over his face again when he'll be machinegunned with questions like Abhisit once did to him.

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Edited September 22, 2006 by Tony Clifton

[cclub75]

Back to the airport probe, does anyone kow where is Mr. CTX , Suryia ? My favorite incompetent Thai politician, next to Thaksin since Thaksin did not shove him aside when the CTX scandal popped up. I just can't wait to see that idiotic smile smeared all over his face again when he'll be machinegunned with questions like Abhisit once did to him.

Hum... yes... you're right. This guy is a real winner. And a total jerk.

But... but... my "préféré" remains... Mister Khun Pongsak.... Transport Minister. Sorry : ex Transport Minister.

Ah Pongsak ! He's himself like a poetry, an "ode". A rainbow in the sky.

He is (the queue of) the Comet Hale-Bopp, rushing in the sideral black sky of human stupidity.

He's the Danube River of Meanness.

He's the Mike Tyson of Inaptitude.

But at the end of the day : I will miss him. No more free entertainement.

So long Pongsak. We will think about you, when you'll be in jail.

[Canadian-Jesse]

There will always be corruption.

It's human nature to want more as easy as possible.

Why do people play the lottery or go to casinos?

Someone might go into office with the best intentions but end up with "opportunities" he/she never had before to gain, be it political or financial. I am in no way justifying anything about Thaksin's alleged wrong doings because I don't have nearly enough information from all sides to base any kind of non-biased opinion.

I'm saying that this seems a bit lame... especially the whole "ZOMG Ms.Auditor is my heeeero!!!!"

You got yur protagonist and antagonist already!

<snip>

Edited September 23, 2006 by Totster