lildragon Posted September 1, 2015 Share Posted September 1, 2015 I think there being so much scrutiny in this case a long with current events helped in the defendants favor, good though! As it has been proven how many humans rights abuses have been going on under the Thai authorities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonmarleesco Posted September 1, 2015 Share Posted September 1, 2015 Well, perhaps the navy will get its Chinese subs as a consolation prize. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axact Posted September 1, 2015 Share Posted September 1, 2015 Good, I hope there are no appeals against the ruling. Great news! While this looks surprisingly like justice, the fact that the charges were laid in the first place proves this government is as bad as all others before it. The charges were laid during the previous government... But the present Government could have stopped this case a long time ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Langsuan Man Posted September 1, 2015 Share Posted September 1, 2015 (edited) Yes, but this government could always have withdrawn the complaint / charge I am still trying to figure out the legitimacy of a local military commander laying charges in a civilian court in the first place. Where is it written that a local Admiral has the right to sue in the name of the Royal Thai Navy !!!!! Captain, actually - about three ranks lower. That makes it even worse, You don't even need to be a flag officer to file a complaint in a Thai court Edited September 1, 2015 by Langsuan Man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetsetBkk Posted September 1, 2015 Share Posted September 1, 2015 Yes, but this government could always have withdrawn the complaint / charge I am still trying to figure out the legitimacy of a local military commander laying charges in a civilian court in the first place. Where is it written that a local Admiral has the right to sue in the name of the Royal Thai Navy !!!!! Captain, actually - about three ranks lower. That makes it even worse, You don't even need to be a flag officer can file a complaint in a Thai court Just the fall guy, in case it all goes pear shaped. Somebody must've put him up to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thai at Heart Posted September 1, 2015 Share Posted September 1, 2015 Good, I hope there are no appeals against the ruling. Great news! While this looks surprisingly like justice, the fact that the charges were laid in the first place proves this government is as bad as all others before it. The charges were laid during the previous government... But the present Government could have stopped this case a long time ago. How can they do that without completely breaking the system. It's criminal defamation. The accusation is made, the police accept it, a prosecutor decides it had merit and goes forward to prosecute. Once it's gone past this stage, the plaintiff cannot stop it because it is a criminal offence, not different from murder. You can't have governments intervening to dismiss criminal cases, that is for the prosecutor to do at the beginning. Otherwise, it ends up being a political minefield. Of course, few prosecutors are going to tell the Navy or a pooyai up front that they should grow a skin and drop the case because that would cause someone to lose and face and it's probably not good for ones career. The navy was offended because they got caught out publicly and so struck back abusing the system.. And so, the solution is not to get govt to intervene to dismiss the case but to reform the whole law to stop frivolous law suits. It would also be great if prosecutors weren't so beholden to their paymasters and had the balls to tell plaintiffs in this context to grow a pair. Explaining this to a Thai brought up I hierarchy and face is as though you are speaking Martian. They don't see why the law really is an ass in this context. Many really believe that pooyai and the powerful are above public disgrace and ridicule, true or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elgordo38 Posted September 1, 2015 Share Posted September 1, 2015 Loss of face for the navy today. Likely the navy will appeal the result and then if they lose the second court, they'll appeal to the supreme court. Sadly I think your right. Kudo's to the judge. The navy will not let go of this bone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BestBitterPhuket Posted September 1, 2015 Share Posted September 1, 2015 Great news! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mausbiber Posted September 1, 2015 Share Posted September 1, 2015 Why is everybody so happy with this decision of the court? Because you only know the American way of justice? Here in Thailand also the prosecutor can appeal so there are two more court levels possible to change the verdict. As long as the ruling is not final I would refrain from praising the judical system of Thailand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cumgranosalum Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 I disagree very much with most of the comments in this story. The case shows only 1. the stupidity of the Thai Navy and the prosecutor (was this the police's prosecution service?) 2. the inordinate deference of the court officials to the wishes of the Thai Navy and 3. the incapacity of the staff within the court office to do what was screamingly obvious the right thing to do, namely not allow this case to be commenced and 4. the independence and good sense of the Judges (at least, those in this case. This is a case which should never have gone to court. I think that it shows the woeful inability of so many Thais to think (poor education?) but that there are most decidedly some who can, just as well as the nationals of any other country. Agreed, just because the ruling in this instance seems to be a fair it doesn't mean by a long chalk, that the system is working. In fact it rather shows up the inherent shortcomings within the Thai legal system ...especially that this case ever could have come to court. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Srikcir Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 Good, I hope there are no appeals against the ruling. Great news! While this looks surprisingly like justice, the fact that the charges were laid in the first place proves this government is as bad as all others before it. The charges were laid during the previous government... The charges were laid by the CURRENT navy. The military establishment operates independently of any elected government. It is only when the military usurps an elected government, ie., through an overthrow, that the military is accountable to the "government" for its actions. The CURRENT junta government had an opportunity to withdraw the lawsuit but chose not to do so. The junta stood behind the navy in its defamation suit even after it had arrested a naval officer for human trafficking. It's about the military maintaining its intimidation of the public to quell opposition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geriatrickid Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/690370-australian-journalist-alan-morison-accused-of-defaming-thailands-navy/ Great news! While this looks surprisingly like justice, the fact that the charges were laid in the first place proves this government is as bad as all others before it. The charges were started under the auspices of a previous government not the current one. So the article stating that "The complaint related to an article published by on the Phuketwan website in July last year" is wrong? Yes! Check the date on this thread. http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/690370-australian-journalist-alan-morison-accused-of-defaming-thailands-navy/http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/690370-australian-journalist-alan-morison-accused-of-defaming-thailands-navy/http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/690370-australian-journalist-alan-morison-accused-of-defaming-thailands-navy/ Can you read? A navy captain has bought the charges against Morison and one of his colleagues, accusing them of defamation and breaching the Computer Crimes Act. Using the cute term "auspices" obfuscates and intentionally misleads. The charges were brought by the RTN Captain. They had to be approved by the RTN and then by the military command. This was not a govenment initiated action, but it was a military initiated action. Are you oblivious to the military's position? It has repeatedly stated, that it does not answer to the civilian government. No civilian government could have forced the RTN to drop the charges. However, once the military took power in its coup, the military administration had the power to drop the charges. It did not. Please do not make further attempts to blame the former popularly democratically elected government of Thailand for this fiasco, because it is an accepted fact fact that this was a RTN action. That is how it is recorded by the court. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geriatrickid Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 Great news! While this looks surprisingly like justice, the fact that the charges were laid in the first place proves this government is as bad as all others before it. But the charges were laid before this government took power.... And as stated multiple times, the military rulers had the option of asking their subordinates at the Royal Thai Navy to drop the charges. The current "government" and the military are one and the same. The previous government was civilian and had no control or say over the conduct of the military. If it had, there would not be a General in the position as head of government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onelasttime Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 You little RIPPER.. huge congrats and ... in a perverse sort of way congrats to the judges who threw it out. Now lets see what the Navy does..if they had a collective IQ above room temperature they would apologise, shut up and just hope that their stupidity and petulant vindictiveness will just go away and not lose them more face ...DRONGOS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Langsuan Man Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 By de facto the Thai government did drop the case when the prosecutors failed to show up for the trial on July 15th to cross examine defense witnesses The Thai judge in the defamation case against an Australian journalist has had to take on the job of cross-examining the defendants and witnesses after the prosecutors failed to appear at the court in Phuket. The prosecutors acting on behalf of the Royal Thai Navy were present on Tuesday, the first day of the three days of hearings, but failed to attend on Wednesday, bringing fresh uncertainty to the case. source: http://www.9news.com.au/world/2015/07/15/22/07/thai-prosecutors-a-no-show-in-morison-case Note the "acting on behalf of the Royal Thai Navy ", not on behalf of the complainant Captain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joebrown Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 Hey people, maybe some of you are missing the point regarding the charges. Yes, charges were laid during previous government. But current government did not drop the suit, so continuing with this farce gives them ownership, responsibility, etc. They had no problem dropping other actions of previous government, such as holding elections. This could have been easily done & part of happiness campaign. Don't let the guard down just because won at this level. Unlike the west, navy can appeal the loss (probably on any grounds they wish, such as "we didn't win!). What you are advocating is for the Executive branch of government meddle in the workings of the Judicial branch. That would be bad enough in the context of an elected government, asking for it with a military one is, well, let's say just say misguided. So you can say then, with 100% certainty that the PM didn't invoke Article 44 to bring about a situation whereby the country avoided being pilloried in the 'free media' world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipperx Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 The case was brought by the navy and not through the normal process. In Thailand you can bring a personal criminal prosecution and bypass the police entirely. You can bet the reason for this if they the police are so corrupt that citizens need a way to bring criminals to court that the police refuse to bring. You can bet that the system is entirely abused by individuals who want to bring pressure to bear on innocent people. Often where a case is brought against s criminal, that criminal will sue right back to intimidate. As for criminal defamation - it is a nonsense that a private person can bring such a case since criminal law is enacted to enable the functioning of society and crimes which affect society as a whole. Unfortunately the people who write the law and the judges who interpret the law do not seem to have the first clue about principles of law but have just copied bits of law from various other countries and then butchered them to suit the corrupt society here. Much like the Chinese of the 80's who simply copied everything badly because they did not really gave a good understanding of why certain materials were used in the copied products and used cheap materials which could not last. This is the Asian way - acting without any understanding of principles which is promoted in school as well. As a Thai kid to explain an underlying theory to an experiment and you will get blank looks because it simply is not taught - primarily because the teachers do not know how themselves. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thai at Heart Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 Why is everybody so happy with this decision of the court? Because you only know the American way of justice? Here in Thailand also the prosecutor can appeal so there are two more court levels possible to change the verdict. As long as the ruling is not final I would refrain from praising the judical system of Thailand The prosecutor can appeal. Is that commonplace elsewhere in the world? Or is that akin for asking for a remark on your exams? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cumgranosalum Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 Good, I hope there are no appeals against the ruling. Great news! While this looks surprisingly like justice, the fact that the charges were laid in the first place proves this government is as bad as all others before it. The charges were laid during the previous government... The charges were laid by the CURRENT navy. The military establishment operates independently of any elected government. It is only when the military usurps an elected government, ie., through an overthrow, that the military is accountable to the "government" for its actions. The CURRENT junta government had an opportunity to withdraw the lawsuit but chose not to do so. The junta stood behind the navy in its defamation suit even after it had arrested a naval officer for human trafficking. It's about the military maintaining its intimidation of the public to quell opposition. the "military" is not a single entity.... the navy and army are not united and in fact even the army is very factionalised itself.....Prayuth may not rely on the total and undivided support of the army, let alone the navy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seastallion Posted September 3, 2015 Share Posted September 3, 2015 (edited) I think it would be very helpful if the offending article was re-published. I'm sure a lot of people want to read it. Edited September 3, 2015 by Seastallion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cumgranosalum Posted September 4, 2015 Share Posted September 4, 2015 I think it would be very helpful if the offending article was re-published. I'm sure a lot of people want to read it. pAs it was A Reuters article I presume it is available online? As Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldsailor35 Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 Just hope and pray that the judges on Koh Samui are as interested in justice as those on Phuket. And can stand up to the government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldsailor35 Posted September 25, 2015 Share Posted September 25, 2015 The case was brought by the navy and not through the normal process. In Thailand you can bring a personal criminal prosecution and bypass the police entirely. You can bet the reason for this if they the police are so corrupt that citizens need a way to bring criminals to court that the police refuse to bring. You can bet that the system is entirely abused by individuals who want to bring pressure to bear on innocent people. Often where a case is brought against s criminal, that criminal will sue right back to intimidate. As for criminal defamation - it is a nonsense that a private person can bring such a case since criminal law is enacted to enable the functioning of society and crimes which affect society as a whole. Unfortunately the people who write the law and the judges who interpret the law do not seem to have the first clue about principles of law but have just copied bits of law from various other countries and then butchered them to suit the corrupt society here. Much like the Chinese of the 80's who simply copied everything badly because they did not really gave a good understanding of why certain materials were used in the copied products and used cheap materials which could not last. This is the Asian way - acting without any understanding of principles which is promoted in school as well. As a Thai kid to explain an underlying theory to an experiment and you will get blank looks because it simply is not taught - primarily because the teachers do not know how themselves. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Was it brought by "the Navy" or one "sailor" in particular. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetsetBkk Posted September 26, 2015 Share Posted September 26, 2015 So, Phuket Wan is closing on December 31st. I can't believe it. So sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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